DUO Q Makes the game at LB levels unfair

[magickthief.6492]

Because the matchmaker considers every player individually when making teams regardless of duo or solo, it makes the idea of duo unfair. Players have alts which they tank, and keep a low rating on so when they duo q with their buddy they can make the average enemy team rating lower by having one teammate at their normal rating, and the alt duo partner at the lowest rating possible. I don't understand why this is still being allowed.

[Mne Malo Tebya.2965]

The people who do this kind of stuff to get titles would still get the titles even if it gets removed.

[Sahne.6950]

1 hour ago, Mne Malo Tebya.2965 said:

The people who do this kind of stuff to get titles would still get the titles even if it gets removed.

I beg to differ.

Edited May 23 by Sahne.6950

[porkchopMCgee.6193]

9 hours ago, magickthief.6492 said:

Because the matchmaker considers every player individually when making teams regardless of duo or solo, it makes the idea of duo unfair. Players have alts which they tank, and keep a low rating on so when they duo q with their buddy they can make the average enemy team rating lower by having one teammate at their normal rating, and the alt duo partner at the lowest rating possible. I don't understand why this is still being allowed.

Sheesh, when will people learn 

1)don't take the game serious

2)don't take the leaderboard serious

3)stop worrying about what other people do

4) if you can't do any of that, I recommend not playing spvp.

[Khalisto.5780]

1 hour ago, porkchopMCgee.6193 said:

Sheesh, when will people learn 

1)don't take the game serious

2)don't take the leaderboard serious

3)stop worrying about what other people do

4) if you can't do any of that, I recommend not playing spvp.

it still sucks duel a top 5 spellbreaker and he's not able to move my gold 2 core ele from node lol

[porkchopMCgee.6193]

14 minutes ago, Khalisto.5780 said:

it still sucks duel a top 5 spellbreaker and he's not able to move my gold 2 core ele from node lol

No idea what you mean exactly sucks for who?

I use a meme d/d paladin reaper build and contest spell breakers on nodes

[Multicolorhipster.9751]

duoq makes the game unfair at every level
2v1 is unfair, all the cheaters are in there 

[porkchopMCgee.6193]

19 hours ago, Multicolorhipster.9751 said:

duoq makes the game unfair at every level
2v1 is unfair, all the cheaters are in there 

Not all duoq is tryhard sweaty cheaters.

But yeah playing with friends is Sooo unfair. When you have the option to duoq as well. I don't understand your logic.

 

Edited May 24 by porkchopMCgee.6193

[Dickinson.7368]

People who support duo-Q to "play with friends" would be ok if ranked was solo-Q only while casual would allow any premade type?
That way, people can play with their friends, since thats what they want and not an unfair advantage while ranked is as fair as possible. :)

[magickthief.6492]

On 5/23/2024 at 6:51 AM, porkchopMCgee.6193 said:

Sheesh, when will people learn 

1)don't take the game serious

2)don't take the leaderboard serious

3)stop worrying about what other people do

4) if you can't do any of that, I recommend not playing spvp.

Not everyone has already bought and paid for their title. Don't promote the idea of players leaving. Promote a fair competitive environment.

[Saiyan.1704]

On 5/23/2024 at 7:51 AM, porkchopMCgee.6193 said:

Sheesh, when will people learn 

1)don't take the game serious

2)don't take the leaderboard serious

3)stop worrying about what other people do

4) if you can't do any of that, I recommend not playing spvp.

I feel there's a level of disconnection that borderlines autism when you give these type of replies. And I don't mean that as an insult, unless you really aren't on the spectrum.

1) Players don't like the feeling of being cheated, especially knowing Anet can do something about it.
2) Leaderboards are quite literally the only measurement we have for a "skill" amongst random players.
3) Other players, screwing over other players, for their own personal gain on a leaderboard that "no one should care about"... yeah, this isn't an issue at all. What were we thinking?
4) We shouldn't be promoting oppression here. You've been preaching this nonsense since 2023 on that account.

[Multicolorhipster.9751]

On 5/24/2024 at 7:05 AM, porkchopMCgee.6193 said:

Not all duoq is tryhard sweaty cheaters

Sure, but most of them are and the exception proves the rule. Even counting the cheaters duoq represents a percentage of players already in the single digits and the overwhelming majority of people shouldn't be arbitrarily burned to satisfy a tiny minority. There's got to be some kind of compromise and mixed solo/duo is not it because it's weighted in the favor of duoq and for no good reason.

On 5/24/2024 at 7:05 AM, porkchopMCgee.6193 said:

But yeah playing with friends is Sooo unfair.

Which objectively nobody in ranked is doing. Friends with an s implies more than 1, but duoq allows someone to queue with exactly 1 other booster friend
If you wanted to play with 'friends' you would go to unranked, ATs, or wait until 3v3 starts since you can play with up to 4 friends in those.
2 against 1 is objectively unfair as well

On 5/24/2024 at 7:05 AM, porkchopMCgee.6193 said:

When you have the option to duoq as well. I don't understand your logic.

Well the game is 5v5 so if everyone duoq'd to solve the duoq issue, then nobody would be playing at all. There has to be at least 1 solo on each team.
Could decrease team size to 4 or increase to 6 and have everyone be duoq, but then the question becomes why let people soloq at all? 
Because barely anyone duoqs consistently. Without solos, they would hardly play at all, and when they finally did they might not win 90% of their games played.

[porkchopMCgee.6193]

1 hour ago, Multicolorhipster.9751 said:

Sure, but most of them are and the exception proves the rule. Even counting the cheaters duoq represents a percentage of players already in the single digits and the overwhelming majority of people shouldn't be arbitrarily burned to satisfy a tiny minority. There's got to be some kind of compromise and mixed solo/duo is not it because it's weighted in the favor of duoq and for no good reason.

Which objectively nobody in ranked is doing. Friends with an s implies more than 1, but duoq allows someone to queue with exactly 1 other booster friend
If you wanted to play with 'friends' you would go to unranked, ATs, or wait until 3v3 starts since you can play with up to 4 friends in those.
2 against 1 is objectively unfair as well

Well the game is 5v5 so if everyone duoq'd to solve the duoq issue, then nobody would be playing at all. There has to be at least 1 solo on each team.
Could decrease team size to 4 or increase to 6 and have everyone be duoq, but then the question becomes why let people soloq at all? 
Because barely anyone duoqs consistently. Without solos, they would hardly play at all, and when they finally did they might not win 90% of their games played.

or stop caring an taking rank serious to begin with, ngl I didnt read half of that.

mmmm y'all just complain to complain at this point. its unfair blah blah, you literally have the option to duo with a friend as well, but you choose not to, an rather complain non stop on the forums for months end like everyone else I see up here. cheese and rice, man its a video game. stop letting it run your life.

[porkchopMCgee.6193]

10 hours ago, Saiyan.1704 said:

I feel there's a level of disconnection that borderlines autism when you give these type of replies. And I don't mean that as an insult, unless you really aren't on the spectrum.

1) Players don't like the feeling of being cheated, especially knowing Anet can do something about it.
2) Leaderboards are quite literally the only measurement we have for a "skill" amongst random players.
3) Other players, screwing over other players, for their own personal gain on a leaderboard that "no one should care about"... yeah, this isn't an issue at all. What were we thinking?
4) We shouldn't be promoting oppression here. You've been preaching this nonsense since 2023 on that account.

1) then que with someone stop crying.

2) leaderboards don't mean squat. there is no skill in this game. its whoever plays cheeseburst first wins.

3)I mean if you are taking the leaderboard that serious. surely there's some disconnect within one self about how to not care about it, since it means nothing. and that caring what other people do that doesn't impact you any personally.

4)and you been preaching dumb crap. that literally only a handful of people have a problem with. I see the same 8-11 people here on the forums crying about it, that includes you. if it was a problem at all,  anyone who pvps would be posting about it nonstop. but the difference is, Alot, and I mean Alot of people do not simply care about a leaderboard and what others do.

[porkchopMCgee.6193]

17 hours ago, magickthief.6492 said:

Not everyone has already bought and paid for their title. Don't promote the idea of players leaving. Promote a fair competitive environment.

the game isn't competitive at all lmao.

[porkchopMCgee.6193]

22 hours ago, Dickinson.7368 said:

People who support duo-Q to "play with friends" would be ok if ranked was solo-Q only while casual would allow any premade type?
That way, people can play with their friends, since thats what they want and not an unfair advantage while ranked is as fair as possible. :)

people who support solo-q only should be okay with unranked being solo's only and ranked being duo/ restored 5mans. see how it can go both ways 

[Dickinson.7368]

7 hours ago, porkchopMCgee.6193 said:

people who support solo-q only should be okay with unranked being solo's only and ranked being duo/ restored 5mans. see how it can go both ways 

Actually,  those who are asking for solo-Q already suggested mutliple times that we can have a solo-Q & 5 man premade ladder.
The only ones who's against that are druo-Q's, that for some reason want to play vs solo-Q no matter what. :)

Tho at this point, they would be better off focusing on GW3 and not repeating the same mistakes.

LE: I'm not a mathematician, but i don't think you can make a team of 5 with just duo's.

Edited May 26 by Dickinson.7368

[porkchopMCgee.6193]

On 5/25/2024 at 3:52 PM, Multicolorhipster.9751 said:

Sure, but most of them are and the exception proves the rule. Even counting the cheaters duoq represents a percentage of players already in the single digits and the overwhelming majority of people shouldn't be arbitrarily burned to satisfy a tiny minority. There's got to be some kind of compromise and mixed solo/duo is not it because it's weighted in the favor of duoq and for no good reason.

Which objectively nobody in ranked is doing. Friends with an s implies more than 1, but duoq allows someone to queue with exactly 1 other booster friend
If you wanted to play with 'friends' you would go to unranked, ATs, or wait until 3v3 starts since you can play with up to 4 friends in those.
2 against 1 is objectively unfair as well

Well the game is 5v5 so if everyone duoq'd to solve the duoq issue, then nobody would be playing at all. There has to be at least 1 solo on each team.
Could decrease team size to 4 or increase to 6 and have everyone be duoq, but then the question becomes why let people soloq at all? 
Because barely anyone duoqs consistently. Without solos, they would hardly play at all, and when they finally did they might not win 90% of their games played.

You literally took everything out of context to help your narrative lmao.

while you can only que with 1 other friend, the implemention of the words friends that I used, meaning to have more than 1, so if 1 friend isn't online or does t want to do it then you ask another friend. Hence the word friends.

This delusional thinking of removing solo-q will fix things need to stop. The same 8 people or so on the forums constantly with these posts, doesn't make up the playerbase. You all just repeating to try and get your way for a, you ready for this, a game you shouldn't be taking serious at all.

"Weighted in the favor of the duo" theres plenty of duo teams that lose. Not all duo teams use voice chat like disc. Lol. So now your bunching everyone together under a false impression that duo-qs are are one sided.

The time you all spend posting these topics, you all should be advocating for balance. Lmao.

 

The game is 5v5 just bring back 5 man teams. And there problem of duo-q is solved. 

And how do you know for a fact barely anyone duo -qs constantly, you have statistics backing up this claim?

 

[Master Ketsu.4569]

On 5/22/2024 at 11:41 PM, Mne Malo Tebya.2965 said:

The people who do this kind of stuff to get titles would still get the titles even if it gets removed.

True, but the real problem is they are making matches worse when they do this. People complain about lopsided games all the time, and this is one of the matchmaking exploits that will create a lopsided game. When you have a 1600+ rated player being matched as a 1200 rated player, the algorithm will think it needs to put more platinum players on their team to compensate. It also messes with the amount of rating gained/lossed since when you beat exploiters it rewards you the points for beating a 1200 rated player when you actually beat someone in the top 10, which further messes with matchmaking due to granting everyone involved in exploited matches ratings which are inaccurate, making it harder and harder for the matchmaker to properly balance the teams meaning you get additional bad lopsided games even without the exploiters present. 

The problem isn't who is winning. The problem is that this exploit makes the game less fun. 

 

Edited May 29 by Master Ketsu.4569

[Multicolorhipster.9751]

12 hours ago, porkchopMCgee.6193 said:

You literally took everything out of context to help your narrative lmao.

while you can only que with 1 other friend, the implemention of the words friends that I used, meaning to have more than 1, so if 1 friend isn't online or does t want to do it then you ask another friend. Hence the word friends.

Be more concise then if you have a point to make. You're doing a good job so far, as this is something I can actually reply to and not just an insult. 👍

12 hours ago, porkchopMCgee.6193 said:

This delusional thinking of removing solo-q will fix things need to stop. The same 8 people or so on the forums constantly with these posts, doesn't make up the playerbase. You all just repeating to try and get your way for a, you ready for this, a game you shouldn't be taking serious at all.

 

I'm not for removing soloq or even duoq. I'm for removed mixed solo/duoq not just in this game, but every ranked mode for every game because it isn't competitive. It's boring no matter what side you fall on, either getting rolled 2v1 or winning up to 100% of games 2v1ing. I'm not bothered if they don't lol I just won't play. There's better games that have split queues in the same genre. Would appreciate it if they did, but if not 🤷‍♂️games in rapid decline anyway.

12 hours ago, porkchopMCgee.6193 said:

"Weighted in the favor of the duo" theres plenty of duo teams that lose. Not all duo teams use voice chat like disc. Lol. So now your bunching everyone together under a false impression that duo-qs are are one sided.

Again, the exception proves the rule. Just because some duoqs are bad enough to lose 2v1 doesn't change the fact that 2v1 is objectively imbalanced. When we had soloq only past plat2, everyone was closer together in rating after top 250, and top 10 had 60-70% winrates because that's above average for soloq. It's no coincidence that immediately after duoq came back, there was a huge jump between who duos and who doesn't and top 10 were sometimes finishing seasons without losing a single game. 

12 hours ago, porkchopMCgee.6193 said:

The time you all spend posting these topics, you all should be advocating for balance. Lmao.

Yes that's what we're doing. Team balance not profession balance.

12 hours ago, porkchopMCgee.6193 said:

The game is 5v5 just bring back 5 man teams. And there problem of duo-q is solved. 

I agree. 5 man teams only. Enjoy the 40 minute queues 😂

12 hours ago, porkchopMCgee.6193 said:

And how do you know for a fact barely anyone duo -qs constantly, you have statistics backing up this claim?

Yes 🗿 the following post comes from former competitive lead Ben P back in 2019 when asked about the potential for 2 separate ranked arenas; one for teams, and one for solos

Quote

@"Ben Phongluangtham.1065" said: The problem with splitting the queue is that our data doesn't show that 2 separate queues for ranked would work. To put things in perspective, 92% someone queues it's queuing solo. The team queue would have horrendous wait times. And when a match finally popped, difference in team skill would likely be rage inducing.

Back in 2019; even with the option to duoq, 92% of ranked players were almost if not always only soloqing. As the population has declined even more since then and people have had friends leave the game, it stands to reason that figure has only increased or remained close to what it was originally. Even still, 92% is an overwhelming majority and there's a 2 major reasons why that is:
1. The average ranked pvp player only plays for rewards and does not want to make the time investment to duo they just want quick yoloq to grind reward chests as fast as possible. This is also why a good chunk of them don't even play the game once they consider a match to be lost.
2. ATs and Unranked exist as ways to play with friends already and more than just 1 friend at a time and if they really want to play with them and they aren't just making an excuse, that's where they'll go.

Forgive long reply forum mods are watching and reading in detail and I want to make them work so they can stay sharp. 😇

[Mne Malo Tebya.2965]

13 hours ago, Master Ketsu.4569 said:

True, but the real problem is they are making matches worse when they do this. People complain about lopsided games all the time, and this is one of the matchmaking exploits that will create a lopsided game. When you have a 1600+ rated player being matched as a 1200 rated player, the algorithm will think it needs to put more platinum players on their team to compensate. It also messes with the amount of rating gained/lossed since when you beat exploiters it rewards you the points for beating a 1200 rated player when you actually beat someone in the top 10, which further messes with matchmaking due to granting everyone involved in exploited matches ratings which are inaccurate, making it harder and harder for the matchmaker to properly balance the teams meaning you get additional bad lopsided games even without the exploiters present. 

The problem isn't who is winning. The problem is that this exploit makes the game less fun. 

I dont disagree with your points but thats not really the problem for bad matchmaking in this game. Its not like that 100 people abuse silver q'ing every season. Its rather 1-2 players  every now and then. That does in indeed make the matches they are in feel terrible for other players but thats only .00001 % of matches played during a season. The real problem for bad matchmaking in ranked is the low population and the way the matchmaking algorithm works. Basically once you reach 5+ mins as a plat player it will just throw any player into your match to finally give you a qpop.

Edited May 30 by Mne Malo Tebya.2965

[Endo.1652]

There definitely is a world of difference in between solo quing and duo quing. The only time solo quing at a higher level will ever benefit you is when 2 different plat duo q teams are quing at the same time.

I found in solo q, if there is only one good plat duo playing. You'll probably lose once they are put against you. If they know who you are as a player they can have more choices of counter swapping to keep you in check and still have breathing room to farm your randoms. 

Sometimes you win if both team composition and your players are just overall better than theirs are. But if either if these are not the case, you are most likely just going to lose.

I am not entirely sure what the right solution to this would be because the pvp population is already so low at the higher levels. I feel like if something were to be done, it should've been done a long time ago.

I personally wouldnt mind separating to have a ranked team q and a ranked solo q mode. I just dont know how theyd do the team q only other than revamping the game completely and/or introduce different game types.

[shion.2084]

4 minutes ago, Endorphin.9147 said:

There definitely is a world of difference in between solo quing and duo quing. The only time solo quing at a higher level will ever benefit you is when 2 different plat duo q teams are quing at the same time.

I found in solo q, if there is only one good plat duo playing. You'll probably lose once they are put against you. If they know who you are as a player they can have more choices of counter swapping to keep you in check and still have breathing room to farm your randoms. 

Sometimes you win if both team composition and your players are just overall better than theirs are. But if either if these are not the case, you are most likely just going to lose.

I am not entirely sure what the right solution to this would be because the pvp population is already so low at the higher levels. I feel like if something were to be done, it should've been done a long time ago.

I personally wouldnt mind separating to have a ranked team q and a ranked solo q mode. I just dont know how theyd do the team q only other than revamping the game completely and/or introduce different game types.

I'd start by doing match making with an MMR for both players in the duo at the higher players rank +50.    That would stop the most hated bronze alt phenomenon.

[ccccc.4963]

On 5/30/2024 at 5:33 AM, Mne Malo Tebya.2965 said:

Its not like that 100 people abuse silver q'ing every season.

Abuse alts though 

[Mne Malo Tebya.2965]

2 hours ago, ccccc.4963 said:

Abuse alts though 

wdym?