Hellbound.5610 Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 With World Restructuring fast approaching and there being a lot of discussions about "where to park my alt account", it has finally become necessary to point out that you are actually in violation of the Code of Conduct by hopping from server to server to server chasing after "content" like a young child who have not taken their Ritalin. What am I referring to? Rule #23 of the Code of Conduct is as follows: Quote While participating in Player-vs-Player (PvP) gameplay in the Services, you will not participate in any form of match manipulation. Match manipulation is defined as any action taken to fix or manipulate the outcome of a match or alter or manipulate the rankings or ratings of the ladder. This also includes disrupting other users’ experiences in the Services by not actively participating in good faith (e.g., “griefing” or “leeching”). Following clarification from customer support it has been confirmed that this rule also applies to World vs World as it is large scale PvP. Some of you may not understand why alt account hopping is an issue in WvW... WvW is a game mode that is based on numbers and having reasonably even numbers is very important for balanced matchups and encounters. If it is not balanced then it becomes a senseless waste of time which will only cause people to quit and not bother with it. WvW is an incredible game mode and deserves way more respect than that. ArenaNet makes a tremendous effort to keep track of server populations and have been performing regular relinks to ensure that worlds/teams remain balanced, but with players hopping from server to server this all becomes futile. These players who do this over-inflate server populations as they are now counted as several across servers instead of just being individual on one server. We have all experienced while roaming around on home border with things being fairly under control only for this big 60 player blob to suddenly show up out of nowhere to easily break into your T3 Garri and farm the few players available that desperately try and defend and no matter how much you call for help, the players are just not there to support the fight. Why? Because the players that are suppose to be on your team is in that opposing blob! The usual response: "Waa, I am doing nothing wrong, I paid for all my accounts, I want to play with my friends!" Sure, but your selfish and inconsiderate behavior ruins this unique and amazing game mode for every one else. Also, if your "friends" cared enough they would be playing where your main account is based or you all can decide which specific low population server to move to to play on together. ACTION: We are encouraged to report the players that alt account hop and violate the Code of Conduct! Submit a ticket to customer support for them to investigate the matter and take the needed actions. Why? These players manipulate match results by causing unbalanced encounters and as a result disrupts your experience. 4 3 10 7 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zok.4956 Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 14 minutes ago, Hellbound.5610 said: but with players hopping from server to server this all becomes futile Server hopping already happens all the time. Even big guilds switch servers to overstack. Do you have any information, that those where sanctioned? At least once? I'm not saying that server/alt hopping is right. Quite the opposite. But no matter what support told you, Anet doesn't seem to really care about it. 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawdler.8521 Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 Rule 23 can also be read that playing WvW period is a violation of the ToS and everyone need to be banned. If you are roaming and prevent some random enemy capping a camp, aren’t you actively trying to manipulate the outcome of matchup in favour of your side? Let’s not even begin to go down the “leeching” rabbit hole. 10 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zok.4956 Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 27 minutes ago, Hellbound.5610 said: WvW is a game mode that is based on numbers and having reasonably even numbers is very important for balanced matchups and encounters. If it is not balanced then it becomes a senseless waste of time which will only cause people to quit and not bother with it. You do know that WvW is actually WvWvW? And that two sides team together against the third team, which is part of the fun and normal drama of WvW, is a form of match manipulation and would then violate that rule #23? 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hellbound.5610 Posted June 3 Author Share Posted June 3 10 minutes ago, Zok.4956 said: You do know that WvW is actually WvWvW? And that two sides team together against the third team, which is part of the fun and normal drama of WvW, is a form of match manipulation and would then violate that rule #23? Splitting 3 teams into 6 parts actually makes it even - 1+1 v 1+1 v 1+1. The issue goes way beyond game design. For long WvW(vW) has suffered with players hopping from server to server. ArenaNet has been putting in a lot of time and effort with World Restructuring to resolve matchup imbalances and all of this work will be pointless when these players continue this behavior. 1 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dayra.7405 Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 (edited) It depends a bit how you are using your different accounts in wvw. Assume you have 2 accounts a and b: If you play only a during a link-period 1 (and all further uneven periods) and if you only play b during link period 2 (and all further even periods) you game the team-linking (your game hour statistics are manipulated by intend, resulting in bad linkings). If there are 2 whole guilds A and B consisting of 500 players accounts with all a's in A and all b's in B, then the result will manipulate the matches massively. I think such behaviour should be punnished. If on the other-sside you have 2 (or more accounts) and play them in similar frequencies all the time, then there is no real manipulation. Edited June 3 by Dayra.7405 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vardy.3592 Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 So transferring server is also then match manipulation? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dayra.7405 Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 1 minute ago, Vardy.3592 said: So transferring server is also then match manipulation? Shortly after linking it is, shortly before linking it is not. How strong the maipulation is of course depends how many are doing such a transfer. But this will end with WR, there will be no transfers anymore. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vardy.3592 Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 3 minutes ago, Dayra.7405 said: Shortly after linking it is, shortly before linking it is not. How strong the maipulation is of course depends how many are doing such a transfer. But this will end with WR, there will be no transfers anymore. Someone should tell ANET about this, as if it was not allowed, why did they allow it? 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dayra.7405 Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 (edited) 9 minutes ago, Vardy.3592 said: Someone should tell ANET about this, as if it was not allowed, why did they allow it? We told them and now they stop it 😉 As usual it takes a while, as ANet is looking to improve the system such that such manipulations aren't possible instead of punishing people that use the system as it is. Of course a single person or small guild transferring isn't a manipulation, but the undestandable wish to play with friends, only an arranged transfer of many people/guilds is, but that is hard to distinguish. Edited June 3 by Dayra.7405 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zok.4956 Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 42 minutes ago, Hellbound.5610 said: Splitting 3 teams into 6 parts actually makes it even - 1+1 v 1+1 v 1+1. The issue goes way beyond game design. What you wrote has nothing to do with the fact that every WvW matchup is a three-way fight and any decision when two of them ally against the third (directly or indirectly) would be a form of match manipulation under rule 23. If this rule 23 were to apply to WvW as you wrote, the game design of WvW, and thus the entire WvW, would be a violation of rule 23. 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arctic.3549 Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 Good thing about this feature is that you can login on winning team as wvw is very competitive games with competitive rewards system. Some even login just to check if those tactics are working or not, thank you for your service with those alt accounts. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hellbound.5610 Posted June 3 Author Share Posted June 3 19 minutes ago, Zok.4956 said: What you wrote has nothing to do with the fact that every WvW matchup is a three-way fight and any decision when two of them ally against the third (directly or indirectly) would be a form of match manipulation under rule 23. If this rule 23 were to apply to WvW as you wrote, the game design of WvW, and thus the entire WvW, would be a violation of rule 23. You are 100% correct! 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
urd.8306 Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 2 hours ago, Hellbound.5610 said: With World Restructuring fast approaching and there being a lot of discussions about "where to park my alt account", it has finally become necessary to point out that you are actually in violation of the Code of Conduct by hopping from server to server to server chasing after "content" like a young child who have not taken their Ritalin. What am I referring to? Rule #23 of the Code of Conduct is as follows: Following clarification from customer support it has been confirmed that this rule also applies to World vs World as it is large scale PvP. Some of you may not understand why alt account hopping is an issue in WvW... WvW is a game mode that is based on numbers and having reasonably even numbers is very important for balanced matchups and encounters. If it is not balanced then it becomes a senseless waste of time which will only cause people to quit and not bother with it. WvW is an incredible game mode and deserves way more respect than that. ArenaNet makes a tremendous effort to keep track of server populations and have been performing regular relinks to ensure that worlds/teams remain balanced, but with players hopping from server to server this all becomes futile. These players who do this over-inflate server populations as they are now counted as several across servers instead of just being individual on one server. We have all experienced while roaming around on home border with things being fairly under control only for this big 60 player blob to suddenly show up out of nowhere to easily break into your T3 Garri and farm the few players available that desperately try and defend and no matter how much you call for help, the players are just not there to support the fight. Why? Because the players that are suppose to be on your team is in that opposing blob! The usual response: "Waa, I am doing nothing wrong, I paid for all my accounts, I want to play with my friends!" Sure, but your selfish and inconsiderate behavior ruins this unique and amazing game mode for every one else. Also, if your "friends" cared enough they would be playing where your main account is based or you all can decide which specific low population server to move to to play on together. ACTION: We are encouraged to report the players that alt account hop and violate the Code of Conduct! Submit a ticket to customer support for them to investigate the matter and take the needed actions. Why? These players manipulate match results by causing unbalanced encounters and as a result disrupts your experience. So many words due to a misinterpreted Code of Conduct. WvW doesn't equal PvP and in that case the CoC doesn't apply to WvW. 5 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hellbound.5610 Posted June 3 Author Share Posted June 3 8 minutes ago, urd.8306 said: So many words due to a misinterpreted Code of Conduct. WvW doesn't equal PvP and in that case the CoC doesn't apply to WvW. The rule in the Code of Conduct was confirmed by customer support to also apply to WvW as was stated. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
urd.8306 Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 You mean the same Customer Support that encourages you to report people for cheating? Yeah, I guess.. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hellbound.5610 Posted June 3 Author Share Posted June 3 58 minutes ago, urd.8306 said: You mean the same Customer Support that encourages you to report people for cheating? Yeah, I guess.. Check the EU Alliance discord I you want to be a skeptic, I already linked the snippets there. 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
One more for the road.8950 Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 So when not logging in to play against WSR you should be banned for match manipulation. Got it. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dayra.7405 Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 1 minute ago, One more for the road.8950 said: So when not logging in to play against WSR you should be banned for match manipulation. Got it. Only if you login to your WSR account instead 😇 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
One more for the road.8950 Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 1 minute ago, Dayra.7405 said: Only if you login to your WSR account instead 😇 Think someone forgot that accounts aren't necessarily in the same match up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaba.5410 Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 (edited) 4 hours ago, Hellbound.5610 said: in violation of the Code of Conduct by hopping from server to server to server chasing after "content" No where does that text you quoted say anything about hopping from server to server to play the game for "chasing after content". That section clearly defines what match manipulation is and chasing content is not mentioned at all. Players are not hopping servers to affect the outcome of a match, but to get content. At worse you are most likely misrepresenting to Support your description of the intent of a player on an alt. Edited June 3 by Chaba.5410 3 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaba.5410 Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 (edited) 3 hours ago, Dayra.7405 said: It depends a bit how you are using your different accounts in wvw It's not that it "depends a bit". It "depends entirely". The OP doesn't seem to understand the Code of Conduct's clear definition of match manipulation in relation to intent and is making broad sweeping statements about players with alt accounts to suit his own personal narrative. He's trying to re-interpret what "match manipulation" means. Just logging into another account to play the game with a different set of friends is not match manipulation. Next he'll be posting here about how logging out of a single account to go spend time in real life is match manipulation because it causes imbalance. Quote Match manipulation is defined as any action taken to fix or manipulate the outcome of a match or alter or manipulate the rankings or ratings of the ladder. Edited June 3 by Chaba.5410 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaba.5410 Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 (edited) 2 hours ago, Arctic.3549 said: Good thing about this feature is that you can login on winning team as wvw is very competitive games with competitive rewards system. Some even login just to check if those tactics are working or not, thank you for your service with those alt accounts. Good point. I bet this post wouldn't exist if those alt accounts were all logging into the OP's team. Cynicism is fun! Edited June 3 by Chaba.5410 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apraxis.4803 Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 "incredible game mode" LOL, lmfao even Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dinas Dragonbane.2978 Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 Just like when fairweathering was a problem, then large transfers during and after tournaments, then more transfers when links started up, and then multiple accounts for more options when people don't want to play on their main server, or second server. We have seen and weathered these issues, but even with WR almost here it is unlikely to be able to fully balance in its goal as too many have multiple accounts. Where anet wanted more and smaller pieces to balance matchups there are too many "artificial" accounts now, but we will see very soon! Cross those fingers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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