Could we get a Reveal Relic?

[calva.2914]

Any chance a Reveal Relic could come out Anet.

I feel like there should be a few more sources of Reveal in this game. It seems extremely hard to get. Would be cool if we could get one in a relic.

Edited August 11 by calva.2914

[Daenxi.4530]

No there are already *more* than enough sources of reveal, we don't need it in a relic. If you add too many sources of reveal it will takes away the point of stealthing in the first place.

[maxwelgm.4315]

Kinda agree with that, if they improve QoL of more stealth skills like they are about to do with the Ranger spear. Being able to stealth with particular combos involving traps and other delayed activation skills would make it fair and introduce a fun mind game to have additional on trigger reveal mechanics as well - but in the current state I think it wouldn't make as much sense because it would be a counterplay that already exists in other forms.

[Zekent.3652]

Relic name: gotchu in 4k Relic of Exposure

On Elite Skill use, reveals targets around and inflicts vulnerability on them.

And now that we're talking about reveals, it could be nice that they also lets u reveal traps with AoE reveals such as Sight Beyond Sight and Gaze of Darkness.

[calva.2914]

1 hour ago, Daenxi.4530 said:

No there are already *more* than enough sources of reveal, we don't need it in a relic. If you add too many sources of reveal it will takes away the point of stealthing in the first place.

There defiantly isn’t enough sources for it. Necro…you can only have Reveal if you are a core necro. Not 1 elite spec can get it.
 

I’d be fine if there was a way I could get it. Like for example engineer can get it. It may be in a trait line not many use for pvp but at least there is an option to take it.

Stealth is to easy to be in constantly for there to be as few options for reveal as there is. 

[thief.7429]

4 hours ago, Daenxi.4530 said:

No there are already *more* than enough sources of reveal, we don't need it in a relic. If you add too many sources of reveal it will takes away the point of stealthing in the first place.

please take a guess to how many sources of reveal are in the game.

[Terrorhuz.4695]

6 hours ago, Daenxi.4530 said:

No there are already *more* than enough sources of reveal, we don't need it in a relic. If you add too many sources of reveal it will takes away the point of stealthing in the first place.

It depends. Some classes have reasonable or actually good access to reveal. Mesmer and elementalists actually have 0.

[Flowki.7194]

I personally feel they should make all stealth cost initiative on thief, so that they have to commit to a fight, and die if they choose the wrong fight, not "Ill have 3 attempts to kill you, then leave, and then U-turn 15 seconds later becuase +1 became available".

 

All other classes with stealth should have been defensive only, they can't attack until it has ended. I know kitten well that will get mass confusions.. but you guys are acclimitsed way to much to this kitten. A target drop and inability to be directly attacked is already a massive +.. and then you get a >8k jump attempt out of it? gtfo.

[Last Crab.6054]

5 hours ago, thief.7429 said:

please take a guess to how many sources of reveal are in the game.

he said "more than enough"

[Last Crab.6054]

3 minutes ago, Flowki.7194 said:

I personally feel they should make all stealth cost initiative on thief, so that they have to commit to a fight, and die if they choose the wrong fight, not "Ill have 3 attempts to kill you, then leave, and then U-turn 15 seconds later becuase +1 became available".

 

All other classes with stealth should have been defensive only, they can't attack until it has ended. I know kitten well that will get mass confusions.. but you guys are acclimitsed way to much to this kitten. A target drop and inability to be directly attacked is already a massive +.. and then you get a >8k jump attempt out of it? gtfo.

ok, but all aoe skills should be drastically reduced in damage, like 1/10 the damage they do now including condi application

[calva.2914]

16 minutes ago, Flowki.7194 said:

I personally feel they should make all stealth cost initiative on thief, so that they have to commit to a fight, and die if they choose the wrong fight, not "Ill have 3 attempts to kill you, then leave, and then U-turn 15 seconds later becuase +1 became available".

 

All other classes with stealth should have been defensive only, they can't attack until it has ended. I know kitten well that will get mass confusions.. but you guys are acclimitsed way to much to this kitten. A target drop and inability to be directly attacked is already a massive +.. and then you get a >8k jump attempt out of it? gtfo.

I still have no idea what this whole kitten thing means. It seems to be everywhere

[Jobber.6348]

The only caveat here is a Stealth counter specifically hurts Thief because of how stripping them out of Stealth removes their Stealth attack mechanic. 

That's why I have been trying to push and encourage alternative ways to combat Stealth that doesn't simply strip the effect from them. I think True Sight, the ability to see Stealthed foes, would be a much more targeted counter but not outright countering Thief. 

Remember, Stealth isn't a Thief-only mechanic. Engi, Mesmer and Ranger can all Stealth as well, and it's equally annoying. Thief specifically gets shafted harder when Stealth is stripped from them. 

I have suggested something like this instead:

Relic of the Mursaat

30s Cooldown

Casting your Elite skill grants you the Eye of Janthir effect for 7 seconds.

Eye of Janthir

Gain True Sight, allowing you to see Stealthed enemies in a 600 radius for the duration

Gain 100% Critical Chance for the duration

Edited August 12 by Jobber.6348

[Arheundel.6451]

We need a sigil against block and evasion, so that projectiles and normal attacks can go through the block spam chain of some classes and evasion spam of others. Against projectile hate spam, block/evasion rotations

We need a sigil to remove 3 x boons on weapon swap and unblockable against busted boon bunkers

We need a sigil that send 4 condis back on a 10s CD on next crit and unblockable against busted condi bunkers

[Last Crab.6054]

1 minute ago, Arheundel.6451 said:

We need a sigil against block and evasion, so that projectiles and normal attacks can go through the block spam chain of some classes and evasion spam of others. Against projectile hate spam, block/evasion rotations

We need a sigil to remove 3 x boons on weapon swap and unblockable against busted boon bunkers

We need a sigil that send 4 condis back on a 10s CD on next crit and unblockable against busted condi bunkers

i dont think you want that, but the thieves in the room are rubbing their hands

[Arheundel.6451]

24 minutes ago, Last Crab.6054 said:

i dont think you want that, but the thieves in the room are rubbing their hands

Equal rights and Equal fights. If stealth classes can't stealth...boon bunkers can't bunker

[Trevor Boyer.6524]

I actually agree that with rising levels of stealth, there needs to be a LITTLE BIT more reveal in the game, but putting it on relic is not the answer.

This would create a plethora of insane balance issues concerning certain classes stacking reveal relic on top of their natural reveal effects, which would result in particular builds being able to completely and I do mean completely shut down certain things like say a DP Daredevil. You'd be getting DHs and Sic Em Soulbeasts that would automatically win vs. builds that rely on stealth usage.

The more "balanced" implementation of extra reveal would be to just add some reveal to things that don't already have reveal. We don't need a lot of it, just a little bit.

Edited August 12 by Trevor Boyer.6524

[calva.2914]

5 hours ago, Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

I actually agree that with rising levels of stealth, there needs to be a LITTLE BIT more reveal in the game, but putting it on sigils is not the answer.

This would create a plethora of insane balance issues concerning certain classes stacking reveal sigils on top of their natural reveal effects, which would result in particular builds being able to completely and I do mean completely shut down certain things like say a DP Daredevil. You'd be getting DHs and Sic Em Soulbeasts that would automatically win vs. builds that rely on stealth usage.

The more "balanced" implementation of extra reveal would be to just add some reveal to things that don't already have reveal. We don't need a lot of it, just a little bit.

I would just be happy if they gave classes that have 0 access to it some sort of access. 

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

13 hours ago, Jobber.6348 said:

The only caveat here is a Stealth counter specifically hurts Thief because of how stripping them out of Stealth removes their Stealth attack mechanic. 

That's why I have been trying to push and encourage alternative ways to combat Stealth that doesn't simply strip the effect from them. I think True Sight, the ability to see Stealthed foes, would be a much more targeted counter but not outright countering Thief. 

Remember, Stealth isn't a Thief-only mechanic. Engi, Mesmer and Ranger can all Stealth as well, and it's equally annoying. Thief specifically gets shafted harder when Stealth is stripped from them. 

I have suggested something like this instead:

Relic of the Mursaat

30s Cooldown

Casting your Elite skill grants you the Eye of Janthir effect for 7 seconds.

Eye of Janthir

Gain True Sight, allowing you to see Stealthed enemies in a 600 radius for the duration

Gain 100% Critical Chance for the duration

7 seconds 100% crit is wild, but treating thieves like treasure mushrooms would be fine if they could implement it. I don't have a problem with people seeing me if they gear for it, but as mentioned revealed affects my damage AND sustain, so respecting that is paramount.

Either cut the crit rate or the duration though. The mechanic is fine.  7 seconds 100% crit every 30 seconds is probably worth the relic alone.  Maybe trade that for like 20 vuln on the thief or stealthed class it affects. 

Edited August 12 by Azure The Heartless.3261

[calva.2914]

1 hour ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

7 seconds 100% crit is wild, but treating thieves like treasure mushrooms would be fine if they could implement it. I don't have a problem with people seeing me if they gear for it, but as mentioned revealed affects my damage AND sustain, so respecting that is paramount.

Either cut the crit rate or the duration though. The mechanic is fine.  7 seconds 100% crit every 30 seconds is probably worth the relic alone.  Maybe trade that for like 20 vuln on the thief or stealthed class it affects. 

I agree the 100% crit for 7 seconds is overkill. 
 

id be fine with no extra effect, just the reveal. Or maybe 1 second of quickness to help you get a skill off quicker when you pull them out of stealth. 
 

also 6 seconds for reveal is quite a bit. Maybe more like 3 or 4 seconds

Edited August 12 by calva.2914

[calva.2914]

2 minutes ago, calva.2914 said:

 

Don’t know how to delete this comment. Sorry

Edited August 12 by calva.2914

[calva.2914]

10 hours ago, Arheundel.6451 said:

Equal rights and Equal fights. If stealth classes can't stealth...boon bunkers can't bunker

You can still stealth…just not permanently any more. 

[Kuya.6495]

I liked the suggestion about a relic that gives you true sight. Still lets thieves do their stealth attack and be invisible to anyone isn't who isn't affected by true sight.

[bethekey.8314]

On 8/11/2024 at 5:34 AM, Daenxi.4530 said:

No there are already *more* than enough sources of reveal

11 hours ago, Arheundel.6451 said:

Equal rights and Equal fights

Idk why you all are giving these two the time of day. The suggestion of a Reveal relic is ok and in general there should be more innate sources of Revealed.

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Revealed

In case anyone was wondering how many sources of reveal are in the game. Ignoring the self-reveal traits/skills, there are 10.

  Tainted Shackles — Death Shroud

  Light's Judgment — Trap

  Gaze of Darkness — Legendary Dragon Stance, Consume

  "On My Mark!" — Shout

  Sight beyond Sight — Meditation

  "Sic 'Em!" — Command

  Spear of Justice — Virtue

  Detection Pulse — Tool belt, Utility Goggles

  Magebane Tether (Magebane Tether) — Tether yourself to your target. If they move beyond the range threshold, pull them to you. Grants might and reveals your target every second.

  Controlled Analysis (Lock On) + Invisible Analysis (Lock On)  — Analyze a disabled foe, applying vulnerability. Analyze a stealthed foe, applying vulnerability.

Of these 10, and being generous, I've only seen 5 in PvP lately on 4/9 classes: "On My Mark", "Sic 'Em", Spear, Tether, and Lock On. Seems like a lot Thieves!

Personally, I'd like to see a meta where 4/10 classes in a match apply Revealed on every attack for 10 of every 16 seconds. Y'know, like Condi Reaper with blocks 😛

Edited August 12 by bethekey.8314

[JosephKatz.9375]

19 hours ago, Jobber.6348 said:

The only caveat here is a Stealth counter specifically hurts Thief because of how stripping them out of Stealth removes their Stealth attack mechanic. 

That's why I have been trying to push and encourage alternative ways to combat Stealth that doesn't simply strip the effect from them. I think True Sight, the ability to see Stealthed foes, would be a much more targeted counter but not outright countering Thief. 

Remember, Stealth isn't a Thief-only mechanic. Engi, Mesmer and Ranger can all Stealth as well, and it's equally annoying. Thief specifically gets shafted harder when Stealth is stripped from them. 

I have suggested something like this instead:

Relic of the Mursaat

30s Cooldown

Casting your Elite skill grants you the Eye of Janthir effect for 7 seconds.

Eye of Janthir

Gain True Sight, allowing you to see Stealthed enemies in a 600 radius for the duration

Gain 100% Critical Chance for the duration

I like this. I don’t think they need the 100% critical chance though, because that alone would be nuts. Never mind the ability to see stealthed foes. I say we just spend all of our forum nerfing time to nerf whatever the guy above me is playing at the time. Seeing the seething makes it all worth it anyway.
 

Nerf Engi, too stronk.

Edited August 12 by JosephKatz.9375

[Jobber.6348]

10 hours ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

Either cut the crit rate or the duration though. The mechanic is fine.  7 seconds 100% crit every 30 seconds is probably worth the relic alone.  Maybe trade that for like 20 vuln on the thief or stealthed class it affects. 

Yeaaa I guess that's fair and all. Or maybe immunity to Blinds and stuff. That'll be welcome too.