You need to increase map capacity if the meta event DPS checks will stay this tight.

[Radiancee.6537]

35 minutes ago, Maienstern.2154 said:

Do you know what a strawman argument is?

Yes. But opening your answer with "you seem to be halfway there" isn't optimal either. You started the whole discussion and you are very negative against "raiders", what did you expect? But let me answer your questions anyway. 

 

35 minutes ago, Maienstern.2154 said:

If you play open world with the same play style as you do raids, you're still a raider in the open world.

Doesn't matter.

35 minutes ago, Maienstern.2154 said:

Do you turn off your add-ons when you play open world?

Yes. I personally don't like the clutter when exploring or playing open world content. I might open arcdps for 3-4 seconds at some boss fights (where dps is relevant like Eparch) if the health of the boss goes down slowly while the clock is ticking when inside a squad to check our group dps. Especially when I'm the commander, since I'm kinda responsible for the success or failure. Finding out errors (mechanics, dps or whatever) is important when tagging up, since you have to communicate to your players as commander. 

35 minutes ago, Maienstern.2154 said:

Do you shut off the part of your brain, that cares about and knows the proper rotations?

No and that doesn't matter. My rotations are muscle memory and I don't think about them, so it doesn't block me from enjoying story and other content. 

35 minutes ago, Maienstern.2154 said:

You weren't even able to make your point earlier, because you neglected to give necessary context.

I didn't think about that you might need more context to get what I was trying to say. My whole statement in a nutshell was: Hey there, I am a hardcore raider but I'm also exploring the open world, playing the story, listen to NPCs and so on. Does it really matter that much to you tho? A open world explorer can also raid, a raider can also do open world content. Every player does content he or she likes to play. Why even start such a discussion? The playerbase in Guild Wars 2 is on a very wide spectrum.

35 minutes ago, Maienstern.2154 said:

Proving my point, that raiders lack understanding for open worlders.

This pigeonhole thinking ain't nice and you can't expect a solid discussion. Thats why I didn't want to engage that much with your statements especially when I read something like "You are demonstrating a complete unwillingness to communicate". In the end, it's your opinion and my opinion. They can be different and thats fine for me.

Edited August 28 by Radiancee.6537

[HanYanrou.8629]

1 hour ago, Radiancee.6537 said:

Yes. But opening your answer with "you seem to be halfway there" isn't optimal either. You started the whole discussion and you are very negative against "raiders", what did you expect? But let me answer your questions anyway. 

 

Doesn't matter.

Yes. I personally don't like the clutter when exploring or playing open world content. I might open arcdps for 3-4 seconds at some boss fights (where dps is relevant like Eparch) if the health of the boss goes down slowly while the clock is ticking when inside a squad to check our group dps. Especially when I'm the commander, since I'm kinda responsible for the success or failure. Finding out errors (mechanics, dps or whatever) is important when tagging up, since you have to communicate to your players as commander. 

No and that doesn't matter. My rotations are muscle memory and I don't think about them, so it doesn't block me from enjoying story and other content. 

I didn't think about that you might need more context to get what I was trying to say. My whole statement in a nutshell was: Hey there, I am a hardcore raider but I'm also exploring the open world, playing the story, listen to NPCs and so on. Does it really matter that much to you tho? A open world explorer can also raid, a raider can also do open world content. Every player does content he or she likes to play. Why even start such a discussion? The playerbase in Guild Wars 2 is on a very wide spectrum.

This pigeonhole thinking ain't nice and you can't expect a solid discussion. Thats why I didn't want to engage that much with your statements especially when I read something like "You are demonstrating a complete unwillingness to communicate". In the end, it's your opinion and my opinion. They can be different and thats fine for me.

don't bother. he will not understand simple strategic movements, even for public convergences or private ones... let's say you;re quick dps, it's handy swap into qheal or aheal mechanist/scourge just for the islands to have the champions killed quicker to pass into first phase for the main boss of the convergence run. my friend does this, and specifically for some metas swaps into healer while signs as dps/or boon dps in order to complete it safer, quicker and without unexpected downstates-the tanky celestial build tends to not always be the only case or solution there. boonrip is also wonderful in such encounters situations.  sorry, english's writing in longer texts isnt my strongest point. 

As much as you'd like to help him-i dont think there is a way. you can not just hammer some things into his head.

Edited August 28 by HanYanrou.8629

[Maienstern.2154]

@QueenKeriti.5176 Yeah. I do realize that I let myself get to emotional and get baited to much. I was not starting out shooting against raiders though. (I know that term is reductive, but if I type out pages long definitions for the words I am using no one is going to read it anyway.) Originally I was just trying to draw attention to the fact that the majority of players have absolutely no clue, that they are playing in a way that makes boss fights unnecessarily hard for them and everyone. ArenaNet has said in interviews that they intended Janthir help improve player skill. And I think in a lot of ways it's working. (Like that harvest dance event, that teaches you to trust green circles.) It would be great to have a discussion about how well it's working. 

It frustrates me to no end that someone complaining about the difficulty level of the bosses is told to just git gud. To just stop using sub optimal pets, up their DPS, etc. The average player has no idea what their DPS is and how much of a difference boons make. We don't care, because the game doesn't tell us why we should. And it's not helpful to call for gate keeping of open world content to give "incompetent" players a wake up call. That won't solve any problems. People still won't know that and how they can do something about it on their end. 

I admit, I made my points poorly. I was working under the assumption that people would understand, why I was pointing out that most players don't even know about most add ones. I misjudged how strongly raiders integrate third party content into their playstyle. I am realizing, I just don't know how to communicate to players who use kill proof so naturally, that they forget, that others don't understand the full context when they throw "check my kp" into an argument, how much extra homework they have done to get to the skill level they are at and that you can't expect that from the average player. Especially not one who care more about the fact that their pet is the first one they charmed, than how much damage or utility it offers. I am at the end of my rope here. I don't know what to say beyond: guys please remember, that most players play vanilla and that effects their playstyle and perception of the game difficulty.

[Maienstern.2154]

13 minutes ago, HanYanrou.8629 said:

don't bother. he will not understand simple strategic movements, even for public convergences or private ones... let's say you;re quick dps, it's handy swap into qheal or aheal mechanist/scourge just for the islands to have the champions killed quicker to pass into first phase for the main boss of the convergence run. my friend does this, and specifically for some metas swaps into healer while signs as dps/or boon dps in order to complete it safer, quicker and without unexpected downstates-the tanky celestial build tends to not always be the only case or solution there. boonrip is also wonderful in such encounters situations.  sorry, english's writing in longer texts isnt my strongest point. 

As much as you'd like to help him-i dont think there is a way. you can not just hammer some things into his head.

Dude, that so besides the point. I am currently learning all that stuff. I am trying out different builds, to learn what they can do and when I should use them. Which is why I realize that that's much more effort than you can expect from casual players. But it wouldn't have to be so much extra homework, if Anet implemented a few changes (building on the special forces training area) to teach people how to play properly.

Edited August 28 by Maienstern.2154
Typos

[HanYanrou.8629]

52 minutes ago, Maienstern.2154 said:

Dude, that so besides the point. I am currently learning all that stuff. I am trying out different builds, to learn what they can do and when I should use them. Which is why I realize that that's much more effort than you can expect from casual players. But it wouldn't have to be so much extra homework, if Anet implemented a few changes (building on the special forces training area) to teach people how to play properly.

okay, then i'd advice you try public or private dragonstorm, and dont ask for stability there. try to perform dodges yourself :) also mesmer's virtu is first start how to dps(dueling build-immediately go not for chaos LI but dueling high intensity since it's much easier optimise towards exotic gears-i may give u exotic gear sample for you later on) =cleave the adds in the encounter on two primordus bosses. one of ways is raptor for making it easier. i'd say dragonstorm or chaak gerenth bosses are one of the first borderlines where you can efficiently practise those builds. zen daijun in end of dragons with the color bosses in mini dungeon are also great place since you need dodges there aswell as learn to perform bursty cc and move alot into safe spots to avoid explosion mechanics-as the one in kaineng overlook with telegraphs during enforcer-ritualist and mindblade phase. ofc if u  time it right-u can dodge that telegraph  by beeing inside it :)

all the three of encounters-locations i mentioned you are literal living micro mechanic golems. some more, some less.

Edited August 28 by HanYanrou.8629

[Maienstern.2154]

21 hours ago, HanYanrou.8629 said:

 i honestly do not understand why are you afraid of that people would know how much your account value is in terms of liquid gold lol.

It's about data safety. The same reason I don't want strangers to be able to look at my bank account or health records and why I block cookies when ever possible.

And believe it or not, but dodging is actually something I can do. Utilizing stability, is what I need to learn. 

[HanYanrou.8629]

3 minutes ago, Maienstern.2154 said:

It's about data safety. The same reason I don't want strangers to be able to look at my bank account or health records and why I block cookies when ever possible.

And believe it or not, but dodging is actually something I can do. Utilizing stability, is what I need to learn. 

umm  i think fractals especially t4 fractals, such as swampland should be a good playground for you then. for the boss that jumps into your group wheres u can either block his first attack or dodge it-and yes do not try get away from the next upcoming hits. perform one block/dodge and then cc burst and cleave it till the end-safer the dodge out and move to a safe distance since it phases the boss. for less experience groups the guide stats dodge it and move out or the range the boss mechanic can hit you, but my personal advice would be with bloomhunger boss, do block that jump attack before he starts smashing the group or dodge it and burst cc-which is much quicker and more reliable than try get away to safe zone.

Edited August 28 by HanYanrou.8629

[Maienstern.2154]

2 hours ago, Radiancee.6537 said:

But opening your answer with "you seem to be halfway there" isn't optimal either. You started the whole discussion and you are very negative against "raiders", what did you expect?

I am sorry about that, I didn't realize you had answered to a question I had addressed to someone else. Fair enough, it's a public forum. But I didn't open with that. I opened with pointing out that you clearly didn't get the point I was trying to make (that not an attack here, it's an observation). You're playstyle differs significantly from most people in the open world. I am not saying it's bad, but I am saying that it's necessary for people with that type of playstyle to realize, that they have a lot of knowledge about the ins and outs of the game mechanics, that the game itself does not give you, if we want to have a productive discussion. I had expressed my frustration at people forgetting, that others don't use or even know about third party content for GW2. I had expected people to take that into account from that point on. I wasn't originally negative towards raiders. But I admit I let myself become quite negative with every "25k is casual" and "inadequate players need a wake up call". "Check my kp" just happened to be the straw that broke the camels back. You didn't realize you needed to give more context, after I repeatedly said most players don't have that kind of information. That's exactly where der Hase im Pfeffer liegt (German idiom, meaning "the root of the problem"). For you it's second nature to have that kind of info. For most of us it's not. I think there would be value in discussing why people find some parts of the open world so difficult, they feel the need to come here and complain. That way we could give some constructive feedback. I personally think that Janthir is a step in the right direction, but I also think the golem room is under utilized. 

[HanYanrou.8629]

ok so i realistically given a shot of building condi virtu in mostly full exotic gears. couldnt kitten myself to find exotic earing with selectable stats for rampagers so said screw it. ill just do this way :D got with messy rotation to easily 34-35k or even 36k DPS. 

giving the optimised stat's with 1% CR overcap for dsw and dfocus build. 

and the pictures how it realistically looks like in terms of statistics.

https://imgur.com/a/bEqDzBT

@Logos.5603 this should prove the point that you do not need alot of gold to build solid character, even do not need full exotics/legendary-pay attention that i used some legendary items, thats just for versatility and for on the fly swappable CR cap for certain stats gears.(equal for ascended). yet this was only3trinlets ascended into which means the build is more than achieveable for a new player.

 

Edited August 30 by HanYanrou.8629

[Journi.7094]

What’s worst then failing a meta is carrying leechers. Leechers have been rampant in the game for who knows how long  and adding coordination helps with this issue.

Ever done a meta and see 5 bodies not willing to waypoint or people just afk not willing to assist with other lanes etc.

Go Drakkar get to the last phase, turn around and look at the cliff behind you and look at all the leechers there.

Go do drizzlewood north and take a look at all of the dead bodies that are not willing to take the parachute that takes 5 seconds to get back to the boss.

Without power creep, metas would fail more often because it’s allowing the 20-30 players from all ranges of experience to do more dps and carry the other half of players on the map.

These range from 5k-20k DPS hell just providing boons to players who are doing decent dps will be a significant increase.

Im not the best player and im generally around like 10-12k dps on metas but I try to engage with my peers and see how I can help. This is after all a MMO… I also ask what boons can I provide or how can I help with mechanics etc. if it’s not organized then I auto default to providing a boon. It’s not that hard to change a utility or trait.

No one is asking anyone to do benchmarks and there seems to be an exaggeration of asking for benchmark results when this is clearly ridiculous. People are willing to spread this misinformation to keep metas as easy as possible even with how rampant leeching is. 
 

I have not failed this meta unless it was bugged due to our amazing pug commanders that are willing to go that extra step to take 5-10mins to organize.

[Luthan.5236]

Was there like 3 times. First time it failed. A lot of people seemed to event - where it was obvious from the chat already. (Crab event I have not done yet seems popular and close to the meta and rarely spawning outside of it? Also expedition event and other stuff gets calls during meta in chat I think.)

Other two it worked with 5 mins left. One I was in map early. Other one I joined a squad to really focus on it - joining the map (in queue a bit).

Tbh the rewards are not tooo interesting (easy to get on TP - no bound hard to farm currency in big quantities like the items in SotO that require 250 of base currency) and the bosses feel ... boring again. It even misses interesting phases or pre-meta. Just a grindy boss with a bit of mechanics that seem raid-like + the annoying requirement for Warclaw skill 3.

It is a "do it to get the achievement(s) then be done with it" thing. Can't see people wanting to do this regularly or even enjoying it. Eparch feels a lot more grindy but at least has more stuff - other mobs spawning. You being teleported. And pre-events. They are missing stuff like that. I mean also Drakkar for example has the stuff where you port to the other bosses at certain phases.

If you make mainly 1 big boss give us more/other things to do. Requirement to run away a bit killing something (maybe requiring spear 4 even - from warclaw nobody wants the boring chain lol ... I could play WvW for that).

[HanYanrou.8629]

21 hours ago, Journi.7094 said:

What’s worst then failing a meta is carrying leechers. Leechers have been rampant in the game for who knows how long  and adding coordination helps with this issue.

Ever done a meta and see 5 bodies not willing to waypoint or people just afk not willing to assist with other lanes etc.

Go Drakkar get to the last phase, turn around and look at the cliff behind you and look at all the leechers there.

Go do drizzlewood north and take a look at all of the dead bodies that are not willing to take the parachute that takes 5 seconds to get back to the boss.

Without power creep, metas would fail more often because it’s allowing the 20-30 players from all ranges of experience to do more dps and carry the other half of players on the map.

These range from 5k-20k DPS hell just providing boons to players who are doing decent dps will be a significant increase.

Im not the best player and im generally around like 10-12k dps on metas but I try to engage with my peers and see how I can help. This is after all a MMO… I also ask what boons can I provide or how can I help with mechanics etc. if it’s not organized then I auto default to providing a boon. It’s not that hard to change a utility or trait.

No one is asking anyone to do benchmarks and there seems to be an exaggeration of asking for benchmark results when this is clearly ridiculous. People are willing to spread this misinformation to keep metas as easy as possible even with how rampant leeching is. 
 

I have not failed this meta unless it was bugged due to our amazing pug commanders that are willing to go that extra step to take 5-10mins to organize.

https://imgur.com/a/dQsX9e2

yesterday's umbriel CM that was broadcasted by one of twitch streamers, won't mention  names but i was told by another player to not give calls(on healing zojja) while her HP was below 60% and we were in phase 1. ended we failed-the player who told me that and then the one acted like "who cares if fails-not our gold" got insta kicked midrun from private convergence.

for multiple reasons:
-"dps" doing 8k entire time or less damage

-constantly dying

-refusing heal zojja and hoarding spirits stacks

-giving wrong calls to not heal when heals were needed

-zero CC.

-foul language.

Edited August 31 by HanYanrou.8629

[nobleboivin.4102]

First couple times I was able to complete the meta but whatever happened, the only maps that can complete the metas are ones that are full completely while those that aren't full always fail due to the population being too low for the meta.  The population needs to get looked at

[Manasa Devi.7958]

In my experience of the last few days, it either succeeds easily because people are participating, or it fails miserable because no one shows up. It definitely not a DPS check.

[Gop.8713]

I focused on first map first so I didn't get to the second map with the meta for a few days, but I have done the meta daily since and haven't seen it fail yet. The secret of my success . . :

1) Show up around xx:35 . . .

2) Join lfg . . .

3) swap to map . . .

4) profit . . .

[Tren.5120]

On 8/26/2024 at 2:49 PM, Gaiawolf.8261 said:

I only really have 3 issues with the bosses so far: 

1. Difficult to learn the mechanics with so many other players running around screwing it up anyway.
2. Can't even see the red and green circles with 50 other players bunched on me.
3. FPS

😅

Other than those, not so bad once you figure things out. Proper health scaling for the number of active players would solve the first issue. LOD would solve the last two.

There really should be a global client option to hide Minis and Backpacks, IMO.

[Astralporing.1957]

7 hours ago, Manasa Devi.7958 said:

In my experience of the last few days, it either succeeds easily because people are participating, or it fails miserable because no one shows up. It definitely not a DPS check.

My experience shows, that if there's no big zerg present at the very start of the event, it will fail even if the people show up with only slight delay. Which is made even worse now, as people started realizing this, so less and less people bother joining the event after it started, with the assumption that if they can get onto the map, it 100% means it will be a fail anyway.

[Gehenna.3625]

On 8/30/2024 at 2:11 PM, Luthan.5236 said:

Was there like 3 times. First time it failed. A lot of people seemed to event - where it was obvious from the chat already. (Crab event I have not done yet seems popular and close to the meta and rarely spawning outside of it? Also expedition event and other stuff gets calls during meta in chat I think.)

Other two it worked with 5 mins left. One I was in map early. Other one I joined a squad to really focus on it - joining the map (in queue a bit).

Tbh the rewards are not tooo interesting (easy to get on TP - no bound hard to farm currency in big quantities like the items in SotO that require 250 of base currency) and the bosses feel ... boring again. It even misses interesting phases or pre-meta. Just a grindy boss with a bit of mechanics that seem raid-like + the annoying requirement for Warclaw skill 3.

It is a "do it to get the achievement(s) then be done with it" thing. Can't see people wanting to do this regularly or even enjoying it. Eparch feels a lot more grindy but at least has more stuff - other mobs spawning. You being teleported. And pre-events. They are missing stuff like that. I mean also Drakkar for example has the stuff where you port to the other bosses at certain phases.

If you make mainly 1 big boss give us more/other things to do. Requirement to run away a bit killing something (maybe requiring spear 4 even - from warclaw nobody wants the boring chain lol ... I could play WvW for that).

This is the issue for me. A lot of people are there on the map but they're not motivated for whatever reason to join in the WB fight. Personally I find it's not rewarding enough to participate. But there are other reasons like people having different main goals like completing achievements for mastery points, people trying to complete their daily hearts, people running around on the Warclaws sniffing for treasure and all of this is happening still during the WB fight.

And then there's the issue that Greer is a lot trickier than the Decima fight. So you can see Decima's health bar going down solidly but the Greer one not so much and yeah, there are leechers still but I suspect they are a lot fewer than the people just doing other stuff in that map. And they really need to optimize that map. I've been cut out of the game various times and not in Kodan Lowlands.

But I feel that either they need to make it easier/faster to kill them or they need to motivate more people to actually join the boss fight. What comes out of the chests at the end is really disappointing.

[Gop.8713]

If only there was some way for the ppls who wanted to do the boss fight to get together on the same map . . .