How to beat a Mesmer in SPvP?

[Dreams.3128]

I play with my perms duo partner and we simply chain CC them.

Ranger/Holo combo is fun.

If you are by yourself and you are a decent you can make them panic press buttons. Often goading mesmers into team fights or simply fights with multiple people is how you win.

Their strength is obviously 1v1s so don't give them that strength. That's like running around on a class that is weak against thief. Don't give thief that opening and they just end up running around with their heads cut off.

You dominate their situation, don't let them dominate you. I am so confused as to why people think they need to 1v1 a class that is GOOD at their job. The whole purpose of winning is to put the other team in an unfavorable situation by any means necessary.

People need to stop giving fair duels and shit, and start utilizing numbers and people when appropriate.

[Legatus.3608]

Basically you beat a mesmer by playing another mesmer and being better at it

[Kako.1930]

@Legatus.3608 said:

@ezd.6359 said:You can beat mesmer with decent skill. When i play mesmer:

• i dont like: necro, warrior, i try to kill them but when fail i run away
• i dont really fear but leave them if it takes too much time: druid, firebrand (when they use tanky builds)
• i try to kill fast: necro, ele, thief
• i fear good thieves
• i fear good warriors
• i very dislike good holos

Wuuuuuuuttt? But forums say teef COUNTERS meesmeer, how can lost??????Teef op pls nerf

And buff mes more :)

[Crab Fear.1624]

@Lilyanna.9361 said:

You dominate their situation, don't let them dominate you. I am so confused as to why people think they need to 1v1 a class that is GOOD at their job. The whole purpose of winning is to put the other team in an unfavorable situation by any means necessary.

You know this line was of great value to me. I have made a build based on this advice that I find to be fun, and effective.

[Arlette.9684]

Play S/D thief, reset the fight 6-12 times and win on lucky crits alone.Does that settle it?

[Simonoly.4352]

Very much beatable, although I will admit there is quite a large L2P component for the community to deal with when it comes to Mirage due to how Mirage Cloak affords the Mesmer a huge amount of control over how a fight plays out. You simply cannot expect a rote skill rotation or wild skill spam to actually work against a thoughtful Mirage - they can react to these things with ease because of Mirage Cloak and disrupt everything you do. The less predictable you are the easier the fight becomes. It doesn't really matter how many nerfs you put onto Mirage because the main spec mechanic (Mirage Cloak) has to be played around if you're actually going to succeed. Or just be a Thief wherein the inherent unpredictability of the class due to steal makes it a perfect Mirage wrecker.

All of this is irrelevant on someone who is new to Mirage - just count dodges (and the inevitable weapon swap sigil proc) and then whack them a little to force Distortion then count another dodge and finally whack them harder! A lot of inexperienced Mirages actually expend their evades randomly for superspeed or to do an ambush attack and I think maybe the skill effects and clone clutter just throw people. Inexperienced Mirage are often quite vulnerable.

[Math.5123]

@ezd.6359 said:

@"jbondo.9817" said:just beat a plat mes 1v1 and then he ported away to decap so did I really beat him 1v1? no I don't think so, but I think they should definitely give mesmer another leap or another portal, or another blink or another invuln or another random blind proc or more invis or even more random aegis's or maybe they should just change the class to where players can use 1-2 buttons and get all of that at once just to really simplify the class and give mesmer players an even larger advantage than the one they have :)

This is how it works. You take bull charge to catch him, he takes another skill to run away. BALANCED! (no jokes). And yes, if he left you on a point - you won! Captured points give +5 in every 10 seconds, while dead enemy only 5. So you just need to control the point for 10 seconds. This is why many players create USEFUL builds instead of "I MUST KILL THEM ALL" builds, feel the difference.

Only, the Mesmer doesn't need to take a "skill" to run away. There's this fantastic trait called Elusive Mind which invalidates every single stun in the game.And that's if they somehow manage to not keep permanent stability in them from that other fantastic trait (which also offers a lot of counter-play) Bountiful Disillusionment.

[Shirlias.8104]

@Arlette.9684 said:Play S/D thief, reset the fight 6-12 times and win on lucky crits alone.Does that settle it?

More than 1 minute to bring down a class, and you have to reset 12 times because the class you are against is facetardroll.It's a good way to explain how memser works and the skill needed in order to play it.

[Math.5123]

@Shirlias.8104 said:

@Arlette.9684 said:Play S/D thief, reset the fight 6-12 times and win on lucky crits alone.Does that settle it?

More than 1 minute to bring down a class, and you have to reset 12 times because the class you are against is facetardroll.It's a good way to explain how memser works and the skill needed in order to play it.

Get off your high horse. S/D thief ain't the most complicated class either. It's about at faceroll as it gets when it comes to thieves.

I'm not saying Mesmer isn't faceroll however, but there are very few classes that require some semblance of skill these days.

[Shirlias.8104]

@"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

@Shirlias.8104 said:

@Arlette.9684 said:Play S/D thief, reset the fight 6-12 times and win on lucky crits alone.Does that settle it?

More than 1 minute to bring down a class, and you have to reset 12 times because the class you are against is facetardroll.It's a good way to explain how memser works and the skill needed in order to play it.

Get off your high horse. S/D thief ain't the most complicated class either. It's about at faceroll as it gets when it comes to thieves.

I'm not saying Mesmer isn't faceroll however, but there are very few classes that require some semblance of skill these days.

You said that thief need to disengage from 6-12 times in order to beat 1 class.You said everything dude, i just underlined in a different way how it is the current situation ( go and spam with thief then feel free to go back and spam with mesmer ).

[Math.5123]

@Shirlias.8104 said:

@"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

@Shirlias.8104 said:

@Arlette.9684 said:Play S/D thief, reset the fight 6-12 times and win on lucky crits alone.Does that settle it?

More than 1 minute to bring down a class, and you have to reset 12 times because the class you are against is facetardroll.It's a good way to explain how memser works and the skill needed in order to play it.

Get off your high horse. S/D thief ain't the most complicated class either. It's about at faceroll as it gets when it comes to thieves.

I'm not saying Mesmer isn't faceroll however, but there are very few classes that require some semblance of skill these days.

You said that thief need to disengage from 6-12 times in order to beat 1 class.You said everything dude, i just underlined in a different way how it is the current situation ( go and spam with thief then feel free to go back and spam with mesmer ).

No, I didn't say that. Some other person did. I do not play Mesmer and I do not play thief. I'm merely stating that s/d thief doesn't require 300iq to be decent at.

[Shirlias.8104]

@"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

@Shirlias.8104 said:

@"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

@Shirlias.8104 said:

@Arlette.9684 said:Play S/D thief, reset the fight 6-12 times and win on lucky crits alone.Does that settle it?

More than 1 minute to bring down a class, and you have to reset 12 times because the class you are against is facetardroll.It's a good way to explain how memser works and the skill needed in order to play it.

Get off your high horse. S/D thief ain't the most complicated class either. It's about at faceroll as it gets when it comes to thieves.

I'm not saying Mesmer isn't faceroll however, but there are very few classes that require some semblance of skill these days.

You said that thief need to disengage from 6-12 times in order to beat 1 class.You said everything dude, i just underlined in a different way how it is the current situation ( go and spam with thief then feel free to go back and spam with mesmer ).

No, I didn't say that. Some other person did. I do not play Mesmer and I do not play thief. I'm merely stating that s/d thief doesn't require 300iq to be decent at.

Then why did you quote me when i was answering to another person?

[Math.5123]

@Shirlias.8104 said:

@"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

@Shirlias.8104 said:

@"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

@Shirlias.8104 said:

@Arlette.9684 said:Play S/D thief, reset the fight 6-12 times and win on lucky crits alone.Does that settle it?

More than 1 minute to bring down a class, and you have to reset 12 times because the class you are against is facetardroll.It's a good way to explain how memser works and the skill needed in order to play it.

Get off your high horse. S/D thief ain't the most complicated class either. It's about at faceroll as it gets when it comes to thieves.

I'm not saying Mesmer isn't faceroll however, but there are very few classes that require some semblance of skill these days.

You said that thief need to disengage from 6-12 times in order to beat 1 class.You said everything dude, i just underlined in a different way how it is the current situation ( go and spam with thief then feel free to go back and spam with mesmer ).

No, I didn't say that. Some other person did. I do not play Mesmer and I do not play thief. I'm merely stating that s/d thief doesn't require 300iq to be decent at.

Then why you quoted me when i was answering to another person?

Because, what you were saying was wrong. S/D thieves strength are their reset ability coupled with high, unblockable burst damage. They should not be able to stay in a 1v1 head on while having the potential to reset on a button press.So, to answer your question. Yes, an S/D thief should have to reset and bait cooldowns in order to beat the strongest 1v1 class currently in the game.

[Shirlias.8104]

@"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

@Shirlias.8104 said:

@"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

@Shirlias.8104 said:

@"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

@Shirlias.8104 said:

@"Arlette.9684" said:Play S/D thief, reset the fight 6-12 times and win on lucky crits alone.Does that settle it?

More than 1 minute to bring down a class, and you have to reset 12 times because the class you are against is facetardroll.It's a good way to explain how memser works and the skill needed in order to play it.

Get off your high horse. S/D thief ain't the most complicated class either. It's about at faceroll as it gets when it comes to thieves.

I'm not saying Mesmer isn't faceroll however, but there are very few classes that require some semblance of skill these days.

You said that thief need to disengage from 6-12 times in order to beat 1 class.You said everything dude, i just underlined in a different way how it is the current situation ( go and spam with thief then feel free to go back and spam with mesmer ).

No, I didn't say that. Some other person did. I do not play Mesmer and I do not play thief. I'm merely stating that s/d thief doesn't require 300iq to be decent at.

Then why you quoted me when i was answering to another person?

Because, what you were saying was wrong. S/D thieves strength are their reset ability coupled with high, unblockable burst damage. They should not be able to stay in a 1v1 head on while having the potential to reset on a button press.So, to answer your question. Yes, an S/D thief should have to reset and bait cooldowns in order to beat the strongest 1v1 class currently in the game.

Then after 8 minutes the match is over and you have disengaged 8 people playing 1v1.Definitely balanced as explanation.

Thief will continue to do his +1 decap and no 1v1.Nobody will waste 6-12 ooc rec + return in order to kill a class "1v1 mid dude".

[Applesauce.5271]

I'd say just play mesmer but honestly the sounds/visuals alone make me want to puke, and this is coming from a guy who's favourite color is purple

[MikeL.8260]

You CAN beat all variations of Mesmer at 1v1 except Condi Mirage (Assuming that you have equal knowledge and skill). Condi Mirage is the best 1v1 class but there are actually not that many around, everyone and their mother play the cookie cutter power shatter Chrono which is far from the best 1v1 and has a lot of bad match ups. It's just an extra Thief with more survivability and far less mobility.

[Felipe.1807]

I guess you just cant beat a Mesmer who knows what he is doing...last night on WvW(i know this is sPvP, but the skills work the same) a Chrono charged against our group(15~20 people) and tried to burst down some players, he failed to kill anyone but the fun part is that when I(and all of the other players as well) tried to retaliete, all I saw was evade, evade, evade lol when his stuff was on cooldown and would allow counter play from other player, he just teleported away back to his group...honestly I have no idea how Anet even allow this profession to be played, is beyond broken.

[Math.5123]

@Shirlias.8104 said:

@"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

@Shirlias.8104 said:

@"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

@Shirlias.8104 said:

@"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

@Shirlias.8104 said:

@"Arlette.9684" said:Play S/D thief, reset the fight 6-12 times and win on lucky crits alone.Does that settle it?

More than 1 minute to bring down a class, and you have to reset 12 times because the class you are against is facetardroll.It's a good way to explain how memser works and the skill needed in order to play it.

Get off your high horse. S/D thief ain't the most complicated class either. It's about at faceroll as it gets when it comes to thieves.

I'm not saying Mesmer isn't faceroll however, but there are very few classes that require some semblance of skill these days.

You said that thief need to disengage from 6-12 times in order to beat 1 class.You said everything dude, i just underlined in a different way how it is the current situation ( go and spam with thief then feel free to go back and spam with mesmer ).

No, I didn't say that. Some other person did. I do not play Mesmer and I do not play thief. I'm merely stating that s/d thief doesn't require 300iq to be decent at.

Then why you quoted me when i was answering to another person?

Because, what you were saying was wrong. S/D thieves strength are their reset ability coupled with high, unblockable burst damage. They should not be able to stay in a 1v1 head on while having the potential to reset on a button press.So, to answer your question. Yes, an S/D thief should have to reset and bait cooldowns in order to beat the strongest 1v1 class currently in the game.

Then after 8 minutes the match is over and you have disengaged 8 people playing 1v1.Definitely balanced as explanation.

Thief will continue to do his +1 decap and no 1v1.Nobody will waste 6-12 ooc rec + return in order to kill a class "1v1 mid dude".

Resetting and going ooc are not the same thing. Resetting in a thieves perspective might be wait for initiative to recharge, while in a guardians prospective might be to get your healing skill or tomes back up.

S/D thieves have advantageous 1v1s, vs core guard, spellbreakers, and to some extent, holos. Just not vs mesmers. But hey, no class had the upper hand vs Mesmer atm.

[ezd.6359]

@"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

@ezd.6359 said:

@"jbondo.9817" said:just beat a plat mes 1v1 and then he ported away to decap so did I really beat him 1v1? no I don't think so, but I think they should definitely give mesmer another leap or another portal, or another blink or another invuln or another random blind proc or more invis or even more random aegis's or maybe they should just change the class to where players can use 1-2 buttons and get all of that at once just to really simplify the class and give mesmer players an even larger advantage than the one they have :)

This is how it works. You take bull charge to catch him, he takes another skill to run away. BALANCED! (no jokes). And yes, if he left you on a point - you won! Captured points give +5 in every 10 seconds, while dead enemy only 5. So you just need to control the point for 10 seconds. This is why many players create USEFUL builds instead of "I MUST KILL THEM ALL" builds, feel the difference.

Only, the Mesmer doesn't need to take a "skill" to run away. There's this fantastic trait called Elusive Mind which invalidates every single stun in the game.And that's if they somehow manage to not keep permanent stability in them from that other fantastic trait (which also offers a lot of counter-play) Bountiful Disillusionment.

Elusive Mind - just stun break ability, every class has similar skills (not always traits, but skills). Also, if you check wiki, it has negative effect "Exhaustion (3s): -100% Endurance Regeneration". Btw i don't use this trait but take stun break signet. I think waste best profession slot for it is not a good idea, but may be someone don't use stun break util skills i don't know. I don't think it is best trait in game at all.

Bountiful Disillusionment - i don't use it either :) (and chaos trait line as whole). All classes have access to boons. But mesmer in my opinion, has hardest access to boon spam, he must use many traits and sacrifice clones, while other classes just press 1 button to get tons of them. Also, keep in mind, stability does not work like stun breaker, it only prevents future effects.

P.S. Funny, just like other classes have problems with retreats :) Warrior can pop invulnerabilities and use charge skills s/gs, thieves and engi invis, druids - 3 from staff etc. All classes have theirs mechanics. More likely the playes have "Elusive Mind" in theirs heads :)

[Arcaedus.7290]

From experience I find that classes with decent long-duration damage negation techniques (Shield of Courage on guard, Endure Pain on warr, signet of stone on ranger) are good for at least putting up a decent fight against power mirage 1v1, sometimes beating them. It's essentially about bleeding them out of their sustain since they do have a decent amount of sustain but generally a bit less than other roamer/1v1 builds (but make up for it with WAY more mobility and damage).

Fact is, a good power mirage will beat you if you eat their burst even a couple times. Power mirage doesn't really have any hard counters as far as I can tell so imo if you're really concerned about dealing with them, you should absolutely "fight dirty" if you can. Use the terrain to stop the pathing of clones/LoS them/shut down blink + burst.

[Rufo.3716]

It can be done. They just have to not be playing the boring old cookie cutter spec and actually want to have fun. I play mesmer and can't stand what it has become. They seriously need to revert it back to the way it was before. It may have been a bit OP but with the condi nerfs it wasn't as bad as it had been.

[mayogirl.4160]

A tip, as a mesmer myself, is to pay attention to the illusions. The illusions themselves usually stay in one place, whereas the player will be moving around, and casting several different spells. Attack the player themselves and ignore the illusions. If they are mirage specialization, use ranged attacks.

[Julius Seizure.4985]

Mesmer is completely overturned, and was ironically the least or second-least nerfed profession during the recent balance pass.

With that said, I am going to go against what many players have said. You need to cleave/focus their clones while simultaneously applying pressure to the Mesmer. If you just focus the Mesmer it will fail, as the class simply has too many invulns, escapes, and stun breaks. If you just focus clones, then the Mesmer also has too much personal damage and can spam Phantasms for top tier DPS without even needing the clones.

You pretty much need to have massive cleave, kill clones, CC Phantasms, while simultaneously applying pressure to the real Mesmer. This is why the class is currently broken, and it is the key to actually beating a good Mesmer. You can only do this on a handful of professions/builds, and these professions/builds have serious drawbacks (either low sustain, low mobility, low disengage, NO stunbreaks, etc). Mesmer has no drawbacks.

[aDemoNnDisguisE.8576]

Agree with OP.

Mes is unbeatable unless the opponent is slow... really, really slow.

[Ario.8964]

None of the listed responses were sufficient so I took the potato cause potato=happy bellyHow to beat a mesmer:This can be done on any class (some will be exponentially more difficult than others but that's life)Beating a mesmer is about properly kiting and punishing between their invulnerability (or blocks, evades, etc.) frames. You want to bait out their important cd's by setting up potential engagements (use of cc to prep for an opening or other poke skills that could set up larger combos) but not commiting until the mesmer fails to answer your cc or your poke. They will control the point for most of the fight as their sustain and damage on a point is obscene, but in the end you will have it so if the mesmer 1v1 is the only good rotation then the time invested can be worth it. What mesmer lacks in the chronophantasma build and the mirage chaos build is ranged pressure. The builds thrive on point which is what makes them so devastating in pvp but their weaknesses are easy to exploit in fights. Their damage can be havily mitigated through kiting, los, and terrain use to impair clone/phantasm pathing. Take waterfall for instance, if you play something like holo you will want to start by moving in very aggressively using cc in high amounts and utilizing your aoe to make it as hard as possible for the mesmer in question to get their cd's cycled correctly. Once they start generating phantasms and such you will want to start using the small fences and the cliffs by the tent and the back of the point to stop their phatasms from reaching you while you keep up ranged pressure. Keep forcing their cd's and pushing in hard whenever their pressure drops (if you know all their phantasms are on cd push hard af) then pulling back just enough to survive and repeat until the mesmer messes up their cd rotations or panics and then win. Again, this is easier for some classes to achieve as they are better suited to those styles (thief is a great example because it's heavy mobility and ability to spike targets allows it to hit and run off the mesmer before they can get their cd's cycling and their skills are fast enough to consistently and reliably punish the mesmer during their vuln frames) give this a try. It'll take lots of trial and error because mes is hard af to fight and it depends heavily on the experience of the mesmer (good mesmers are incredibly difficult to force cds off of) but its a strat that should work if you put in the time.