[Discussion] What should we change about DH to improve it, but not make it OP?

[RUNICBLACK.7630]

Good point on the Wings of Resolve and giving it an evade and in all honesty the same should happen for Great Sword Leap of Faith(getting an evade), the point being the Guardian class and All of it's Elites is the only class that doesn't have access to an evade and of cause the counter point to this is that we have so many blocks well that is flawed because the majority of our blocks are Aegis which to my knoeledge will only block the first attack in multiple strike skill and the player has no control or very little of when it triggers leaving more control of it's usefulness in hands of his opponents added to the increased number of skills that have become or can become unblockable(but can still be evaded).

[Martimus.6027]

@"mrauls.6519" said:

@Etterwyn.5263 said:Signet of iPhone 7

That cracked me up

I don't get it. Can you explain to me? :D

[Orangensaft.7139]

Make Renewed Focus a StunbreakIts a real problem that guard cant escape any stuns except with judges intervention which you usually already use offensively for burst or as gap closer...

And it just feels wrong that you can die while having an invul elite up that you just cant use ...

And tbh i think they should buff Shield of Courage to 4s block again .... its not even enough for a secured finisher atm...

[otto.5684]

@Darknicrofia.2604 said:

@Yannir.4132 said:

Both of these past nerfs were deserved

No it wasn't, it turned a B tier spec into useless. It was an overreaction to WvW zerglings getting CC'd. It was dropped on the same patch as the stability change, aka it double nerfed LB5 and made it even worse than barrage, aka the worst skill in the game.

While surely some of the nerfs were overboard, removing the CC from traps was a good change. Ironically Anet added CC to spamable skills like SB CS and holo SW. hopefully these gets removed as well.

[Darknicrofia.2604]

Giving ToF unblockable daze was stupid, but double nerfing LB5, nerfing LB2 and even to an extent F1 spear cast time, was equally stupid.

You don't see anyone clamoring that Steal needs a .5 sec cast time when its a much much much stronger F1 ability than anything the Spear was responsible for.

[Etterwyn.5263]

@Martimus.6027 said:

@"mrauls.6519" said:

@"Etterwyn.5263" said:Signet of iPhone 7

That cracked me up

I don't get it. Can you explain to me? :D

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KeNILrYX6fI

[mrauls.6519]

TRAITED meditations should apply 1-1/2 seconds of resistance

[otto.5684]

@"mrauls.6519" said:TRAITED meditations should apply 1-1/2 seconds of resistance

Why? This has zero value for guardian.

[crazyhusky.2985]

@"Assic.2746" said:Dragonhunter definitely needs to be tuned to have a place in the current meta.

This elite specs introduces first and only 1200 long range weapon for Guardian which is currently useless. Scepter has very high damage and the Might pumping utility on #2 is great, but it's not a long range weapon. It's hard to hit anyone from 900 range due to low projectile speed. I would really like to see improvements to longbow so we could finally counter shade spamming Scourges via range pressure.

Heavy LightDeflecting Shot knocks back enemies on each hit. Gain stability when knocking back, launching, or pulling an enemy.Puncture Shot becomes a guaranteed combo finisher.

Dulled SensesEnemies you knock back are crippled. Enemies you cripple are also inflicted with vulnerability.Striking crippled enemies inflicts Vulnerbility (2 stacks, 1s ICD). Striking enemies with Vulnerbility over the threshold (5) inflicts Torment INSTEAD (1 stack 1s ICD).

Longbow also I said above the longbow really does need a increase of firing speed it is slow as hell, just compare to the ranger's LB and it is a lot slower.DH Longbow needs 20% speed increase or some speed to match the dps of the scepter, because thats all DH can use when it comes to raids, i would like to use other weapons while still give decent DPS.

As I said Above I think Heavy light is pointless for a trait and i think its Knockback needs to be on the Longbow as standard meaning you dont need a trait for it, but not the stability. Which would give way for a new grandmaster trait that could have quickness and stability. Something actually new for DH since its been over a year and they have not done anything to DH, the only changes they've have to base guardian which was nerfed to meet Firebrand standards, well the staff was nerfed. and Firebrand when it got released. Most updates to the class involve FB but nothing for DH.The fact that made the said few times the ammo system "was made for guardian" yet.. nothing DH related actually uses it. Only Firebrand and Base do. How about changing our DH Virtues to an ammo system that refreshes on a global timer allowing us to multiple virtures in bursts. It just an idea... probaley a bad one.

However if Heavy light isnt replaced then at least give it quickness on knockback (on hit for bosses), this would allow a DH use to Hunter's ward while the foe is being knocked back.With the quickness buff a player wouldn't be able to escape being trapped as they are being knockback and will be trapped allowing for some ranged combat, also if i quickness were to be on hit, rather than knockback it'll work on large foes and bosses too, allowing for it to be in Builds for Fractals and Raids.

I feel the way they could improve Dulled senses, is to give Quickness on knockback as well. Also they could add Pull to it to that trait. (basically changing it to any form of launch, pull, knockdown etc. so long as it moves the foe)This way Heavy light could become useful if using LB, secondly if pull is added to the trait too, the pull from GS5 and Hunter Vendict would give DH quickness buffs allowing for clean way to quickly finish foes off that get pulled close ranged.

With Dulled Senses and Heavy light giving quickness I feel the LB would see a bit of love.Basically making the middle of DH's trait Tree more about speed/quickness and controlled focused.

[crazyhusky.2985]

@"RUNICBLACK.7630" said:Good point on the Wings of Resolve and giving it an evade and in all honesty the same should happen for Great Sword Leap of Faith(getting an evade), the point being the Guardian class and All of it's Elites is the only class that doesn't have access to an evade and of cause the counter point to this is that we have so many blocks well that is flawed because the majority of our blocks are Aegis which to my knoeledge will only block the first attack in multiple strike skill and the player has no control or very little of when it triggers leaving more control of it's usefulness in hands of his opponents added to the increased number of skills that have become or can become unblockable(but can still be evaded).

This is a problem I've been think about. I find it annoying. The aegis doesn't do much.Only blocking one attack is rather bad and limited for the triats we get.I feel as the "defensive" class of the game that Guardian we need something more like a Barrier, which is odd because guardian doesn't get barrier but yet Elementalist does...We SHOULD BE to be the tanky class.

So give Dragon Hunter a unique form of aegis and barrier an "Aegis Barrier" or "Greater Aegis" whatever works.This would come from Shield of Courage and if DH use the Virtue it applies this aegis barrier instead of normal aegis to itself, the allies only get normal aegis.This would work both like Aegis and Barrier fused together. Rather expire after a few seconds like barrier normally does, the barrier stays until the foes get thru to your HP.It always gives a barrier you 33% of you Max HP (or 25% if you feel that 33% is to much). Meaning that foes simply can't smack you with a multi-hit move and get thru your aegis, allowing you to react and have the aegis effect not triggering.When the aegis barrier is broken it acts like a normal aegis meaning that any effect or traits that happen when aegis breaks it does so.

also Bulwark trait should passively allow the Aegis Barrier to block unblockable attacks,"If you have Aegis barrier it'll block unblockable attacks"I know it might sound stupid BUT with DH not having any evade moves or dodge skills and the other classes having access to unblockables and stuff that works around aegis, Giving DH a trade off instead sounds more reasonable and fits with the class. Because you are slow, you dont get access to a special evade or dodges skills BUT you have unique barrier that block literally anything in exchange. This way DH will feel very unique and will have something to protect from traits and skills that make attacks unblockable such as Basilisk VenomSo when that Thief does try to stab you in the back with basilisk vemon, it ONLY damages the aegis barrier's HP and DOESN'T stun you at all.Think of it like as Greater form of Aegis. (because it should be)

[Doomdesire.9365]

Aside from the class changes already listed, adding a movement speed rune that doesn't have wasted stats would help quite a bit. No one likes running lynx or travelers because the useless stats but it's a necessary evil for that 25% movement speed...

[Yannir.4132]

@Darknicrofia.2604 said:Giving ToF unblockable daze was stupid, but double nerfing LB5, nerfing LB2 and even to an extent F1 spear cast time, was equally stupid.

You don't see anyone clamoring that Steal needs a .5 sec cast time when its a much much much stronger F1 ability than anything the Spear was responsible for.

But you can also argue that that DH F3 is much stronger than anything thief has access to so it's even game IMO.

Honestly I wouldn't mind having a CC of some kind in Light's Judgment. This trap is underwhelming at best, I believe I've never used it.Most DH problems IMO boil down to how weak the longbow is. Both the auto and true shot need damage buffs, maybe LB5 as well.While I don't think rolling back to previous functionality with LB5 is needed, it does occur to me now that DH needs some of way locking people down into that field. So I would like to see them adding a 2-3 s Immobilize on the first pulse of Hunter's Ward.And indeed, WoR needs an evade frame. Maybe not the whole way through, so opponents have a chance to interrupt it but it would be a lot smaller frame.

[Etterwyn.5263]

@"Doomdesire.9365" said:Aside from the class changes already listed, adding a movement speed rune that doesn't have wasted stats would help quite a bit. No one likes running lynx or travelers because the useless stats but it's a necessary evil for that 25% movement speed...

Im sure you meant "speed" or traveler because putting Rune of the Lynx in PVE is every guardian's dream... =)

[Darknicrofia.2604]

I'd pay 100g per rune to slot Lynx into my armor without a single question asked.

[Arcaedus.7290]

@crazyhusky.2985 said:

However if Heavy light isnt replaced then at least give it quickness on knockback (on hit for bosses), this would allow a DH use to Hunter's ward while the foe is being knocked back.

I would LOVE this. Honestly the stability on knockback doesn't synergize well at all and using HL for the stability is so situational that I don't think anyone would miss it. Quickness on knockback on the otherhand would have amazing synergy and would boost both offence and sustain, with the balance point being that it's another corruptible boon for guardian. 10/10, would recommend this change.

[Doomdesire.9365]

@Etterwyn.5263 said:

@"Doomdesire.9365" said:Aside from the class changes already listed, adding a movement speed rune that doesn't have wasted stats would help quite a bit. No one likes running lynx or travelers because the useless stats but it's a necessary evil for that 25% movement speed...

Im sure you meant "speed" or traveler because putting Rune of the Lynx in PVE is every guardian's dream... =)

That was obviously a pvp oriented post. No dragonhunter likes having condition damage unless they are a meme.

[crazyhusky.2985]

@Arcaedus.7290 said:

@"crazyhusky.2985" said:

However if Heavy light isnt replaced then at least give it quickness on knockback (on hit for bosses), this would allow a DH use to Hunter's ward while the foe is being knocked back.

I would LOVE this. Honestly the stability on knockback doesn't synergize well at all and using HL for the stability is so situational that I don't think anyone would miss it. Quickness on knockback on the otherhand would have amazing synergy and would boost both offence and sustain, with the balance point being that it's another corruptible boon for guardian. 10/10, would recommend this change.

I was thinking that. Stability isn't needed for a long-range move, since by the time knockback happens and foe gets close that Stability buff has worn off making it useless.Quickness would be miles better allowing guardian to up on the offensive.

Dragonhunter NEEDS quickness for longbow. I feel like the middle trait line for dragonhunter should focus on the quickness buff.The Dulled senses trait, should have Quickness on knockback as well, This way DH's Dragon Maw can give it quickness too. but I also feel "Pulling" should be added to the trait as well. So you can Pull and Push to control foes, using Hunter Vendict to pull foes gaining quickness, pulling them into a Dragon Maw to gain more quickness, then using deflecting shot to knock them back and gain even more quickness. Also Greatsword 5 pulling would give quickness too due to this, you can use that if they try to escape.With these changes the longbow would be a decent choice of weapon since there would be multiple ways for you to gain quickness, without it impacting other weapons as much.

what do you think?

[Arcaedus.7290]

@crazyhusky.2985 said:

@Arcaedus.7290 said:

@crazyhusky.2985 said:

However if Heavy light isnt replaced then at least give it quickness on knockback (on hit for bosses), this would allow a DH use to Hunter's ward while the foe is being knocked back.

I would LOVE this. Honestly the stability on knockback doesn't synergize well at all and using HL for the stability is so situational that I don't think anyone would miss it. Quickness on knockback on the otherhand would have amazing synergy and would boost both offence and sustain, with the balance point being that it's another corruptible boon for guardian. 10/10, would recommend this change.

I was thinking that. Stability isn't needed for a long-range move, since by the time knockback happens and foe gets close that Stability buff has worn off making it useless.Quickness would be miles better allowing guardian to up on the offensive.

Dragonhunter NEEDS quickness for longbow. I feel like the middle trait line for dragonhunter should focus on the quickness buff.The Dulled senses trait, should have Quickness on knockback as well, This way DH's Dragon Maw can give it quickness too. but I also feel "Pulling" should be added to the trait as well. So you can Pull and Push to control foes, using Hunter Vendict to pull foes gaining quickness, pulling them into a Dragon Maw to gain more quickness, then using deflecting shot to knock them back and gain even more quickness. Also Greatsword 5 pulling would give quickness too due to this, you can use that if they try to escape.With these changes the longbow would be a decent choice of weapon since there would be multiple ways for you to gain quickness, without it impacting other weapons as much.

what do you think?

Not sure more overall quickness is the solution since high quickness uptime is in the domain of firebrand. I do like quickness in place of or in addition to stab on HL though. If you earn a skill-based knockback, you should get rewarded, and being able to choose your reward (do you want a faster burst, faster heal skill, faster cast time for better setups?) is just the kind of buff DH needs, compared to what we have now (receiving a reward that isn't particularly useful).

[otto.5684]

@Darknicrofia.2604 said:I'd pay 100g per rune to slot Lynx into my armor without a single question asked.

Why? You know mounts exist, right?

[phokus.8934]

@otto.5684 said:

@Darknicrofia.2604 said:I'd pay 100g per rune to slot Lynx into my armor without a single question asked.

Why? You know mounts exist, right?

WvW...

[otto.5684]

@phokus.8934 said:

@otto.5684 said:

@Darknicrofia.2604 said:I'd pay 100g per rune to slot Lynx into my armor without a single question asked.

Why? You know mounts exist, right?

WvW...

Oh. I do not WvW, so it was not o my radar. All sPvP none-support builds use it. I totally understand.

[mrauls.6519]

@otto.5684 said:

@"mrauls.6519" said:TRAITED meditations should apply 1-1/2 seconds of resistance

Why? This has zero value for guardian.

It would give us a little bit more survivability