Balance Patch Discussion Thread

[Devilman.1532]

what a trainwreck

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

Objectively, it is not a bad patch. Credit where credit is due. The areas that were problematic in the thief and mesmer areas were largely addressed, and smokescale even got a hit too. I was hoping berserker would get some love, but there's bigger issues than that atm.

The glaring issue is that Elusive Mind is still running free, but I think what they were going for is allowing more attrition in battles involving mirages to increase the potential that their dodge spamming ends up burning them with exhaustion if they do not use it mindfully. Hence the Adventure rune nerf, etc.

That's not the direction I was hoping they would go, and I don't think they have gone far enough but I am willing to try it. Like I've said before, I'm fine with annoying classes as long as they can eventually be locked down. The forum salt will continue as long as the mes train goes, though. and I'm still going to be avoiding ranked.

@"Specialka.7290" said:P/p deserved a nerf, that kind of gamepaly should not be rewarded.

Special "yes" to this. Thief is my secondary but they need to try harder than that.

@Devs: Its better. There's still some things, but its better.Be careful with Reaper. It's fine now, don't keep pushing it. Thanks for the smokescale nerf.

[Mbelch.9028]

@Azure The Heartless.3261 said:Objectively, it is not a bad patch. Credit where credit is due. The areas that were problematic in the thief and mesmer areas were largely addressed, and smokescale even got a hit too. I was hoping berserker would get some love, but there's bigger issues than that atm.

The glaring issue is that Elusive Mind is still running free, but I think what they were going for is allowing more attrition in battles involving mirages to increase the potential that their dodge spamming ends up burning them with exhaustion if they do not use it mindfully. Hence the Adventure rune nerf, etc.

That's not the direction I was hoping they would go, and I don't think they have gone far enough but I am willing to try it. Like I've said before, I'm fine with annoying classes as long as they can eventually be locked down. The forum salt will continue as long as the mes train goes, though. and I'm still going to be avoiding ranked.

@"Specialka.7290" said:P/p deserved a nerf, that kind of gamepaly should not be rewarded.

Special "yes" to this. Thief is my secondary but they need to try harder than that.

@Devs: Its better. There's still some things, but its better.Be careful with Reaper. It's fine now, don't keep pushing it. Thanks for the smokescale nerf.

Overall I agree. The P/P thief teat clingers are funny, though.

Reflecting on what I'd LIKE to see in the patch.... or a future patch.... is a total rework of how core elementalist trait lines work. They presently are out of date, making base specs like Fresh Air, Dagger Dagger bruiser/roamer, or even Staff zerk, out of the realm of consideration. I'd also like to see some baseline buffs to other healing specs other than Firebrand to make them all equal.

The biggest threat to the game's balance as I see it is the host of people who are complaining about burst damage and instant skills. I know instant skills don't allow for great counterplay, but somehow skilled folks anticipate and dodge when it matters most. And burst specs are valuable to the game, when they're not braindead "I spam a button" specs.

I got 1-shot several times yesterday by a burst GS mirage, and I'm not mad about it. My team countered him in the right way, but if we didn't, we deserved to have lost.

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

@"Mbelch.9028" said:

The biggest threat to the game's balance as I see it is the host of people who are complaining about burst damage and instant skills. I know instant skills don't allow for great counterplay, but somehow skilled folks anticipate and dodge when it matters most. And burst specs are valuable to the game, when they're not braindead "I spam a button" specs.

I got 1-shot several times yesterday by a burst GS mirage, and I'm not mad about it. My team countered him in the right way, but if we didn't, we deserved to have lost.

Largely agreed as well. I'm generally fine with the burst that exists in the game from all spheres. What bothers me are the classes that can do lethal burst while still easily escaping after anticipation is executed properly and damage is returned, or any build that approaches it. Whether the damage comes all at once or not is fine, as long as there is a way to pressure the current damage dealer to either reset, leave, or make mistakes and die.

[Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497]

@AegisFLCL.7623 said:

• Direct buff to Holosmith and Spellbreaker thanks to invuls.
• Elusive Mind still exists, and no reduction to confusion/torment stacks from mirage
• Adding an F# based stealth to only Deadeye when it should exist as a classwide skill for Thief
• Making power Rev even stronger

....slow claps....

Along with the terrible LS patch (imo), the balance team once again did nothing to address the real problems (I guess the healing reduction from FB is the one positive thing that came from this patch).

Thief already has a. Stealth on function class wide. You need to spec for it, which is fair given how many ways thief can enter stealth.

My problem is how they severely hurt their 1v1 potential instead of restoring it or give them some means of tearing through specs passive defenses. As they nerfed our tools that were the response to that is in the past...

[AegisFLCL.7623]

@Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497 said:

@AegisFLCL.7623 said:

• Direct buff to Holosmith and Spellbreaker thanks to invuls.
• Elusive Mind still exists, and no reduction to confusion/torment stacks from mirage
• Adding an F# based stealth to only Deadeye when it should exist as a classwide skill for Thief
• Making power Rev even stronger

....

slow claps

....

Along with the terrible LS patch (imo), the balance team once again did nothing to address the real problems (I guess the healing reduction from FB is the one positive thing that came from this patch).

Thief already has a. Stealth on function class wide. You need to spec for it, which is fair given how many ways thief can enter stealth.

My problem is how they severely hurt their 1v1 potential instead of restoring it or give them some means of tearing through specs passive defenses. As they nerfed our tools that were the response to that is in the past...

My point is it should exist as a F# skill always accessible to the thief on X cooldown, and or require hitting with steal/gaze to activate. Tying it to stolen skill was a bad implementation; for instance the stolen skills that grant prot, might, and healing all force you to wait for malice stacks if you'd want to use stealth, it's clunky design.

[Undertaker.4368]

They kill warrior. Nothing new for this class

[Jack Redline.5379]

As far as i saw, condi Mirage is still preatty damn strong . I mean we were engi, warior, necro, thief and ranger. And one single (i guess master) condi Mirage wiped us out. he just stood in front of our spawn and every time we came he wiped us white. We didnt score a single point in that match. It was a tournament we were all gold rank lvls from 34-40 and he simply washed the floor with us like 5 times then we just gave up. It was today fyi

[Hot Boy.7138]

Current fights against mirage, 36k damage from torment, 9k from bleeding, 8k from confusion, 3k from burning. The issue with mirage is that it's not damage over time. Dozens of stacks are applied all at once with each combo, really insane burst that is easily repeatable, over and over again. Axe needed a nerf, not sword.

[lLobo.7960]

@Sariel.2143 said:Sayonara d/p shortbow Thief.Infiltrator's arrow nerfed or bugged? Can not use it on anything but flat surface right now.

Its a bug with all teleports and its being fixed (dev post somewhere).

[maxwelgm.4315]

After playing for a bit more, I can say more surely that Necro has gotten a huge buff from the new boon removal in scepter 3 and corrupt boon. In fact, it's probably now too good of a utility to even consider well of corruption in most scenarios. I get what they were trying to do to necro, but scepter 3 is now basically a kill if you can land it and your team is focusing. We're nothing on PvE but blood necros on PvP have just gotten a huge buff.

[aswedishtiger.7320]

@Hot Boy.7138 said:Current fights against mirage, 36k damage from torment, 9k from bleeding, 8k from confusion, 3k from burning. The issue with mirage is that it's not damage over time. Dozens of stacks are applied all at once with each combo, really insane burst that is easily repeatable, over and over again. Axe needed a nerf, not sword.

Axe did get nerfed though

[Hot Boy.7138]

@aswedishtiger.7320 said:

@"Hot Boy.7138" said:Current fights against mirage, 36k damage from torment, 9k from bleeding, 8k from confusion, 3k from burning. The issue with mirage is that it's not damage over time. Dozens of stacks are applied all at once with each combo, really insane burst that is easily repeatable, over and over again. Axe needed a nerf, not sword.

Axe did get nerfed though

"Imaginary Axes: Inflicted torment duration has been reduced from 5 seconds to 4 seconds."That's not enough, evidently.

[storm.3120]

@Hot Boy.7138 said:

@aswedishtiger.7320 said:

@Hot Boy.7138 said:Current fights against mirage, 36k damage from torment, 9k from bleeding, 8k from confusion, 3k from burning. The issue with mirage is that it's not damage over time. Dozens of stacks are applied all at once with each combo, really insane burst that is easily repeatable, over and over again. Axe needed a nerf, not sword.

Axe did get nerfed though

"Imaginary Axes: Inflicted torment duration has been reduced from 5 seconds to 4 seconds."That's not enough, evidently.

I can help you with choices . Axe ambush . Ppl running IH will reapply 10-15 torments easly (i said axe need a nerf ,but mostly meant ambush) .

[xp eke xp.6724]

Thief:

• Deadeye got a strong buff, maybe the always trolling P/P got nerfed, but who cares... You can finally oneshot all 20 seconds (without stacking malice), or all 5-8 seconds (with stacking malice). (depents how much evade the enermie has)
• Another strange buff: if you kill someone all utility skills on the right side get a 33% cd reduction at pvp. On low tiers this means: "yey let´s use thiefguild and get a tripplekill to get it again!" on high thier: "yey i can finally get my op cc, combo and troll everyone". And all good players, say: "yey i got a free 33% cd reduction if i finish/ the mesmer shatters an illusion/ clone" xD
• oh and thief got finally stabillity, for one second... x)

Ranger:

• the important pets got nerfed and for that his dmg buffed. For me its fair, not more that hard carried by having an npc that plays bether, then the owner.

Engie:

• yeah the condi-engie isn´t completely terrible anymore... means "trash"builds get buffed!

Warri:

• Hi we have a new option for WvW! Imo a shout-warrior get closer to his best option. means "trash"builds get buffed!

Rev:

• We got here the same, if you use the worser traits/ skills you get a buff, but they aren´t still a good option^^.

Guard:

• .... what? they change something?

Ele:

• Huge nerf... it has less live so he can easyer get oneshotted
• Arenanet test some new Mechanicals, with the dmg reduction after time. Maybe they will follow some other classes on next patch ;)
• Finally the ele has to watch to his enermie, if he want to hit him. <= a good change!

Mesmer:

• Some over-resourses get smaller

Necro:

• has to corrupt now more with timing, instead of spamming
• Dagger hurts now more, so its more viable if you want to hurt single-targets stronger!
• and at all they fix some resourses ( corruption, dmg, epidemic...)

Most changes, doesnt affect PvP that much, only deadeye got some huge buffs! Let´s see what they can fix on the next patches, like less dmg from aoes over time, or to have a view to hit with some skills.

[ZeteCommander.4937]

Deadeye one shot everywhere .What's the fun of this? Excess power damage must turned into condi damage