1v1 for 400 Gold ! Cellofrag Vs. Shorts - Weaver Vs. Mirage.

[EremiteAngel.9765]

@Curunen.8729 said:

@EremiteAngel.9765 said:

@Curunen.8729 said:Nice, fun watch and to be fair props to shorts for using focus in a duel (as well as landing a lot of pulls).

Hey Curunen, was wondering if you can explain more on what's wrong with using focus in a duel?I meet focus mirages often in WvW roaming/duels too.Is it an inferior offhand to use?Like in this video at the 5 min and 30 secs mark.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ctt6piLXQ0Y

Regarding iWarden - anything more than a 1v1 or if there are npcs around results in those thrown axes randomly going to different targets, which overall are negligable in terms of damage especially compared with our other more reliable sources of damage. It's a very bad phantasm since it got changed, that needs some further mechanic changes for reliability and scalability.The projectile destruction bubble is kind of redundant when we have traits like Evasive Mirror which provide more than enough reflect. Also the iWarden is entirely useless against melee cleave - eg if fighting a warrior etc right in your face. It becomes a dead skill in those situations.

Regarding Curtain - the swiftness is useful but can be used by swapping focus out of the inventory for roaming. The cripple is almost entirely negligable. And the pull provides plenty of time to react with the 1s cooldown of into the void - either by outranging the pull or anticipating with an evade etc. Then you can go in and burst forcing a weapon swap or simply putting on back foot, knowing how long its cooldown is.Also against builds with high stabilty or other anti-cc access it becomes useless. So eg vs good engineers, warriors... Even vs good thieves you'll have a hard time landing the pull and then be stuck with an offhand with no offense or defence potential.

The cooldowns of both these skills are fairly prohibitive for their effects in solo roaming when untraited, and the trait Warden's Feedback directly competes with one of the best core mesmer traits of Restorative Illusions in Inspiration - ie anyone roaming taking Inspiration is going to get a lot more out of RI.

Necro is one of the things most susceptible to focus however that curtain at 5:32 they should have dodged away and moved out of range to avoid the pull, that was just bad play and asking for it. I don't understand necro well enough to comment in detail on ways they can deal with cc in general (it's like my least played class even for the purpose of learning), but focus curtain gives you plenty of time to react and do something about it.

Personally I can't recall ever losing to a focus using mesmer in wvw since they nerfed into the void from instant to having the 1s icd. Torch stealth allows you to get the upper hand for kiting or burst, pistol has more effective single target damage and reasonable cc in magic bullet (I won't talk about offhand sword because in my opinion that's also not a great weapon in general).

As Cello says he was not used to fighting focus mesmer, and I think an issue is a lot of players have forgotten how to deal with focus as it has been very rare to see a focus mesmer running around solo for years compared with torch. Sure in group play focus pull is very dangerous in combination with other skills to secure wins, and in certain very specific 1v1 scenarios focus can be useful. But for general use in solo play I'd put money on a torch mesmer any day.

Thanks! That was very helpful.The necro was me actually and I learn something new =)

[Curunen.8729]

@EremiteAngel.9765 said:

@Curunen.8729 said:

@EremiteAngel.9765 said:

@Curunen.8729 said:Nice, fun watch and to be fair props to shorts for using focus in a duel (as well as landing a lot of pulls).

Hey Curunen, was wondering if you can explain more on what's wrong with using focus in a duel?I meet focus mirages often in WvW roaming/duels too.Is it an inferior offhand to use?Like in this video at the 5 min and 30 secs mark.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ctt6piLXQ0Y

Regarding iWarden - anything more than a 1v1 or if there are npcs around results in those thrown axes randomly going to different targets, which overall are negligable in terms of damage especially compared with our other more reliable sources of damage. It's a very bad phantasm since it got changed, that needs some further mechanic changes for reliability and scalability.The projectile destruction bubble is kind of redundant when we have traits like Evasive Mirror which provide more than enough reflect. Also the iWarden is entirely useless against melee cleave - eg if fighting a warrior etc right in your face. It becomes a dead skill in those situations.

Regarding Curtain - the swiftness is useful but can be used by swapping focus out of the inventory for roaming. The cripple is almost entirely negligable. And the pull provides plenty of time to react with the 1s cooldown of into the void - either by outranging the pull or anticipating with an evade etc. Then you can go in and burst forcing a weapon swap or simply putting on back foot, knowing how long its cooldown is.Also against builds with high stabilty or other anti-cc access it becomes useless. So eg vs good engineers, warriors... Even vs good thieves you'll have a hard time landing the pull and then be stuck with an offhand with no offense or defence potential.

The cooldowns of both these skills are fairly prohibitive for their effects in solo roaming when untraited, and the trait Warden's Feedback directly competes with one of the best core mesmer traits of Restorative Illusions in Inspiration - ie anyone roaming taking Inspiration is going to get a lot more out of RI.

Necro is one of the things most susceptible to focus however that curtain at 5:32 they should have dodged away and moved out of range to avoid the pull, that was just bad play and asking for it. I don't understand necro well enough to comment in detail on ways they can deal with cc in general (it's like my least played class even for the purpose of learning), but focus curtain gives you plenty of time to react and do something about it.

Personally I can't recall ever losing to a focus using mesmer in wvw since they nerfed into the void from instant to having the 1s icd. Torch stealth allows you to get the upper hand for kiting or burst, pistol has more effective single target damage and reasonable cc in magic bullet (I won't talk about offhand sword because in my opinion that's also not a great weapon in general).

As Cello says he was not used to fighting focus mesmer, and I think an issue is a lot of players have forgotten how to deal with focus as it has been very rare to see a focus mesmer running around solo for years compared with torch. Sure in group play focus pull is very dangerous in combination with other skills to secure wins, and in certain very specific 1v1 scenarios focus can be useful. But for general use in solo play I'd put money on a torch mesmer any day.

Thanks! That was very helpful.The necro was me actually and I learn something new =)

No problem, thanks for taking it well. :)

In general with Curtain, know you've got 1 second to do something about it, and then a window of about 4 seconds until the curtain disappears - options being get out of range, prepare defenses (dodge, stab, block, etc), or alternatively go super offensive and burst in the mesmer's face - can force them to panic pull and fail (eg in the past maybe I'd go in with a blurred frenzy shatter combo where they miss the pull). Sorry I don't properly know your options as necro - maybe someone who dual mains necro and mesmer could offer better insight.

Also bear in mind untraited curtain does nothing to projectiles, so it's literally only the pull to worry about.

Personally I'd feel at a significant disadvantage using focus vs warrior, engineer, thief, mesmer and guardian due to the high likelyhood of the pull being completely negated. vs Ele and Rev it's a mixed bag, vs ranger likely also at disadvantage now (but then everything kind of is...) - so it's really only vs necro where it can take advantage of more limited mobility and anti-cc.

[Solori.6025]

@Don Vega Van Kain.9842 said:

@"Solori.6025" said:search would tell you whom I was or if I had ever had a discussion with you prior.Click on my name, go to comments- Tells you everything you need to know as far as if I have ever complained about weaver. Really simple function you need to learn >how to use.Context is something else you need to read up on. As taking things out of context ( which you did frequently) leads to a conversation not rooted in the original intent.Home work was for you. LOLLook in my history-Read about "git gud" as that is an insult. An old one, but an insult none the less.

Also apology accepted.

Everytime you talk, you want me to search in your discussion history, dude i don't have time, i make mistake maybe (i'm not even sure, i won't do the search nah :p ) but you inflate the misunderstanding and exaggerated cause you too salty, too touchy i don't even know why.

Umm...and yeah, if you really accepted my explanation, you will not answer like that, I revoke my apologies =)

..... You don't take critisicm well, or you took what I wrote as aggressive.. either way..

you too salty, too touchy i don't even know why.

...^ ah the inevitable projectionPS : you have a thumb up !!! have you create a new free account ??? :3

. . . Who does that? Who needs validation that much they would create a free account to thumb themselves up on the forums......Actually....nevermind.....I see 8 examples on one post

[Don Vega Van Kain.9842]

@Solori.6025 said:

@Don Vega Van Kain.9842 said:

@Solori.6025 said:search would tell you whom I was or if I had ever had a discussion with you prior.Click on my name, go to comments- Tells you everything you need to know as far as if I have ever complained about weaver. Really simple function you need to learn >how to use.Context is something else you need to read up on. As taking things out of context ( which you did frequently) leads to a conversation not rooted in the original intent.Home work was for you. LOLLook in my history-Read about "git gud" as that is an insult. An old one, but an insult none the less.

Also apology accepted.

Everytime you talk, you want me to search in your discussion history, dude i don't have time, i make mistake maybe (i'm not even sure, i won't do the search nah :p ) but you inflate the misunderstanding and exaggerated cause you too salty, too touchy i don't even know why.

Umm...and yeah, if you really accepted my explanation, you will not answer like that, I revoke my apologies =)

..... You don't take critisicm well, or you took what I wrote as aggressive.. either way..

you too salty, too touchy i don't even know why.

...^PS : you have a thumb up !!! have you create a new free account ??? :3

. . . Who does that? Who needs validation that much they would create a free account to thumb themselves up on the forums......Actually....nevermind.....

All this just to say nothing..ummm.... you have too much time to waste.

I can handle it, you're here, in a comfortable place, you gave your advise right and left annnnd i came and "distrub" you....yeahh who i think i am !!

I don't say any once of critism just someone too angry..... you just blow hot air for nothing.

The discussion go far away from the game and become a cock fight.

Good luck to you IRL, sincerely.

[apharma.3741]

Saw the first fight. You tank most shatters, you get hit by every CC, you keep trying for the churning earth memes. It's fine because you just heal it all back up quicker than s/he can get his/her damage back.

I don't know if it gets better but watching a 5 minute fight where you do so much wrong then win through attrition isn't compelling me to watch more. I know it's scathing but it's the truth. I'm glad you're still carrying the ele torch and I know ele is kinda meh atm but this isn't fun to watch and I've played ele for 5 years now.

[Lasiurus.4067]

@"apharma.3741" said:Saw the first fight. You tank most shatters, you get hit by every CC, you keep trying for the churning earth memes. It's fine because you just heal it all back up quicker than s/he can get his/her damage back.

I don't know if it gets better but watching a 5 minute fight where you do so much wrong then win through attrition isn't compelling me to watch more. I know it's scathing but it's the truth. I'm glad you're still carrying the ele torch and I know ele is kinda meh atm but this isn't fun to watch and I've played ele for 5 years now.

"you keep trying for the churning earth memes"

And I Won first fight thanks to the "churning earth memes" It's still very powerful.

"you get hit by every CC,"

It's very difficult to avoid the focus CC because of the range + unpredictable timer.

[djoun.3425]

U can stop intentionally waiting a very long time to reply to bump up ur thread and ur vid with it over and over now

[sephiroth.4217]

Anyone else hitting thumbs up now?

Edit: no fun, old thread.

[Curennos.9307]

@Lasiurus.4067 said:

@"apharma.3741" said:Saw the first fight. You tank most shatters, you get hit by every CC, you keep trying for the churning earth memes. It's fine because you just heal it all back up quicker than s/he can get his/her damage back.

I don't know if it gets better but watching a 5 minute fight where you do so much wrong then win through attrition isn't compelling me to watch more. I know it's scathing but it's the truth. I'm glad you're still carrying the ele torch and I know ele is kinda meh atm but this isn't fun to watch and I've played ele for 5 years now.

"you keep trying for the churning earth memes"

And I Won first fight thanks to the "churning earth memes" It's still very powerful.

"you get hit by every CC,"

It's very difficult to avoid the focus CC because of the range + unpredictable timer.

You won the first fight with it and then, insofar as I recall from watching (sorta was stop/go a little there due to multitasking) never hit him with it again. Just curious, but please go into why you use it as much as you do. You seem to dedicate a not-insignificant amount of time to that combo and it seems so inefficient. Massive cast time and blowing a 40 sec CD to....force them to dodge? Surely more constant pressure is the better option there.

Especially considering the cast time leaves you extremely vulnerable. ~18:00 you use it and blow Flash despite being very close to him already. I also notice they started to try and mostly use sword 2 against it, meaning you blew a long CD utility skill + long cast time on a much lower CD weapon skill.

[Megametzler.5729]

This is why noone wants to have a bunker meta.

[Brendan.1309]

@Lasiurus.4067 I want to duel you!

[thijsken.5031]

@Brendan.1309 DW, he'll respond in a few weeks.

[Xstein.2187]

Wow! those power mes one shot KOs everyone has been talking about were amazing!