The problem with high end infusions

[phs.6089]

@Zaklex.6308 said:

@Blood Red Arachnid.2493 said:

@Zaklex.6308 said:

Some of the math is incorrect, but lets do it simply...if you have a .1% chance of a drop and 100 people attempt it, that's still a .1% chance for of the item possibly dropping for each of those 100 people, if you increase the amount of people 10 fold to 1000, now you have 1000 people that have that same .1% chance of the item possibly dropping(it is still a chance after all, it's not guaranteed)...this is where fuzzy math comes in, though the percentage chance per person doesn't change and the chance that amongst those 900 additional people the .1% is unchanged...between all of them the chance is still .1% but now you have 1000 people instead of just 100 with the same chance for the chance at something to drop...I love fuzzy math.

P.S. - This whole thing is a load of BS, just trying to get people to stop worrying about the darn drop rates and play...if you want it that bad, buy it, you won't die without it.

When I say rate, I don't mean individual drop chance. I mean that total sum coming into the market. Also, the point that I am bring up is that the number is so low that multiplying it by 1000 doesn't matter much.

For example, lets say that the drop rate is 1/1,000,000,000. If there are 1,000 people doing it, the chances are 1,000/1,000,000,000. That comes to one out of a million, which means there still won't be any being added to the market. It was effectively zero before the increase, and it is effectively zero after. Likewise, your last sentence doesn't make sense:

we can't buy it

because there are none available.

Personally, I'm of the mind that there should never be an item worth more than the market cap. Ever. An item is mechanically broken if it is worth more than what the game can handle. If the infusions and minis are so rare that they have to be traded on the black market, then the drop rate for these items needs to be increased significantly. The only people who would lose out on this are the obscenely rich black market traders, and I'm certain they can eat the losses.

The only reason they're on the black market and not the TP is because the sellers are greedy bastards...there is no other reason what so ever, if you can't live with a 10k cap on an items price then you're just plain greedy in this case.

Right, so an item that can get you more then 10k, should be listed on TP for 10k and as a result you will be fine to get 8.5k? You basically agree to flash the price for a legendary weapon? And those that don't are greedy.

[Lonecap.4105]

GUYS. WHAT is this topic seriously?

I am honestly not sure what this topic is asking for. Why should you roll up to queensdale, trash shadow behemoth and loot a confetti infusion? Of course it isn't dropping for you. These are "chase items" (that's what the devs call them). They're good for the game. It's exciting to see an extremely rare item, and people whisper me all the time asking if my aura is indeed chak egg sac - and I tell them it is, and they're excited! They just saw a really rare item in-game and they're excited to be playing.

Exclusivity is exciting. It's boring when nothing is special, and there's hardly anything in-game that is actually special.

[Blood Red Arachnid.2493]

@Zaklex.6308 said:

The only reason they're on the black market and not the TP is because the sellers are greedy bastards...there is no other reason what so ever, if you can't live with a 10k cap on an items price then you're just plain greedy in this case.

The principles of economics apply no matter who you are. It doesn't matter how greedy these people are: an item will only sell for as much as somebody else is willing to pay. Otherwise the item will just sit around doing nothing. These items are sold on the black market precisely because other players are willing to pay far more than the money cap for said item. If they weren't, then the seller would be forced to do one of two tings: lower their price, or not sell the item. A significant increase in supply will drive the prices down due to competition. If supply is increased enough, the item will fall below the 8k gold mark, and it will be traded on the market again.

The flow of these items into the economy is completely random. You're asserting that, by sheer coincidence, everybody who happens to get one is also greedy.. I find that hard to swallow.

[Blood Red Arachnid.2493]

@"ProverbsofHell.2307" said:GUYS. WHAT is this topic seriously?

I am honestly not sure what this topic is asking for. Why should you roll up to queensdale, trash shadow behemoth and loot a confetti infusion? Of course it isn't dropping for you. These are "chase items" (that's what the devs call them). They're good for the game. It's exciting to see an extremely rare item, and people whisper me all the time asking if my aura is indeed chak egg sac - and I tell them it is, and they're excited! They just saw a really rare item in-game and they're excited to be playing.

Exclusivity is exciting. It's boring when nothing is special, and there's hardly anything in-game that is actually special.

To quote Aristotle: "moderation in all things." There's a point when exclusivity becomes ridiculous. When there's dozens of resting 10k gold bids on the market for these items, then we're past that point. Hell, I get whispers about my invisible shoes, and I bought my pair for 2.5k gold. You can have something be special and amazing without making it 10 times rarer than my boots.

[Lonecap.4105]

@Blood Red Arachnid.2493 said:

@"ProverbsofHell.2307" said:GUYS. WHAT is this topic seriously?

I am honestly not sure what this topic is asking for. Why should you roll up to queensdale, trash shadow behemoth and loot a confetti infusion? Of course it isn't dropping for you. These are "chase items" (that's what the devs call them). They're good for the game. It's exciting to see an extremely rare item, and people whisper me all the time asking if my aura is indeed chak egg sac - and I tell them it is, and they're excited! They just saw a really rare item in-game and they're excited to be playing.

Exclusivity is exciting. It's boring when nothing is special, and there's hardly anything in-game that is actually special.

To quote Aristotle: "moderation in all things." There's a point when exclusivity becomes ridiculous. When there's dozens of resting 10k gold bids on the market for these items, then we're past that point. Hell, I get whispers about my invisible shoes, and I bought my pair for 2.5k gold. You can have something be special and amazing without making it 10 times rarer than my boots.

Actually, the invisible shoes have a similar drop rate to chak egg sac (0.001%). It's just because the shoes aren't flashy, and chak infusion is, and everyone in this game beelines for the christmas lights.

So it's more just that there's a lot of demand to be a glowy person. But people have other options. You don't NEED a super rare infusion. People need to stop being entitled. Be happy for those that won the RNG lottery or those who flipped and farmed their life away to buy one.

[Blood Red Arachnid.2493]

@ProverbsofHell.2307 said:

@Blood Red Arachnid.2493 said:

@ProverbsofHell.2307 said:GUYS. WHAT is this topic seriously?

I am honestly not sure what this topic is asking for. Why should you roll up to queensdale, trash shadow behemoth and loot a confetti infusion? Of course it isn't dropping for you. These are "chase items" (that's what the devs call them). They're good for the game. It's exciting to see an extremely rare item, and people whisper me all the time asking if my aura is indeed chak egg sac - and I tell them it is, and they're excited! They just saw a really rare item in-game and they're excited to be playing.

Exclusivity is exciting. It's boring when nothing is special, and there's hardly anything in-game that is actually special.

To quote Aristotle: "moderation in all things." There's a point when exclusivity becomes ridiculous. When there's dozens of resting 10k gold bids on the market for these items, then we're past that point. Hell, I get whispers about my invisible shoes, and I bought my pair for 2.5k gold. You can have something be special and amazing without making it 10 times rarer than my boots.

Actually, the invisible shoes have a similar drop rate to chak egg sac (0.001%). It's just because the shoes aren't flashy, and chak infusion is, and everyone in this game beelines for the christmas lights.

So it's more just that there's a lot of demand to be a glowy person. But people have other options. You don't NEED a super rare infusion. People need to stop being entitled. Be happy for those that won the RNG lottery or those who flipped and farmed their life away to buy one.

Where is the source for these drop rates? I'm going to throw doubt on this, because invisible shoes have their market split 3 ways between different armor weights. In theory, they would be 1/3rd the price if buying one skin unblocked the others.

[Tails.9372]

To quote Aristotle: "moderation in all things." There's a point when exclusivity becomes ridiculous.

Yes and that's when their rarity disincentives people from farming the associated content. The place where an item originally drops from should always be the go-to method for those who want to farm for the item in question, everything else should just be complementary. The fact that the main way of obtaining pretty much anything that doesn't have special conditions is to go to the farm with the highest gold to time ratio is just a sign of bad game design and then they complain about players not "diversifying their farming routine" enough...

[Zaklex.6308]

@Blood Red Arachnid.2493 said:

@Zaklex.6308 said:

The only reason they're on the black market and not the TP is because the sellers are greedy bastards...there is no other reason what so ever, if you can't live with a 10k cap on an items price then you're just plain greedy in this case.

The principles of economics apply no matter who you are. It doesn't matter how greedy these people are: an item will only sell for as much as somebody else is willing to pay. Otherwise the item will just sit around doing nothing. These items are sold on the black market precisely because other players are willing to pay far more than the money cap for said item. If they weren't, then the seller would be forced to do one of two tings: lower their price, or not sell the item. A significant increase in supply will drive the prices down due to competition. If supply is increased enough, the item will fall below the 8k gold mark, and it will be traded on the market again.

The flow of these items into the economy is completely random. You're asserting that, by sheer coincidence, everybody who happens to get one is also greedy.. I find that hard to swallow.

Actually it proves that everyone who gets one that sells it is greedy, and I can explain it simply this way. You already said there are standing orders on the TP from people willing to pay the max price, if that is so, and someone gets one that they don't want, they could just turn around and sell it on the TP to the first available offer, but they don't because they know that there are other people willing to pay a lot more on the black market...hence they are greedy and just want the most gold they can get. If buyers were smart(and they aren't) all they would do is post the max offer on the TP...and never go to the black market...there's two results from that process. Either the sellers start selling to the highest legal bidders, or they hold to an item knowing no one wants to pay more than max and make zero gold.

[Blood Red Arachnid.2493]

@Zaklex.6308 said:

@Blood Red Arachnid.2493 said:

@Zaklex.6308 said:

The only reason they're on the black market and not the TP is because the sellers are greedy bastards...there is no other reason what so ever, if you can't live with a 10k cap on an items price then you're just plain greedy in this case.

The principles of economics apply no matter who you are. It doesn't matter how greedy these people are: an item will only sell for as much as somebody else is willing to pay. Otherwise the item will just sit around doing nothing. These items are sold on the black market precisely because other players are willing to pay far more than the money cap for said item. If they weren't, then the seller would be forced to do one of two tings: lower their price, or not sell the item. A significant increase in supply will drive the prices down due to competition. If supply is increased enough, the item will fall below the 8k gold mark, and it will be traded on the market again.

The flow of these items into the economy is completely random. You're asserting that, by sheer coincidence, everybody who happens to get one is also greedy.. I find that hard to swallow.

Actually it proves that everyone who gets one that sells it is greedy, and I can explain it simply this way. You already said there are standing orders on the TP from people willing to pay the max price, if that is so, and someone gets one that they don't want, they could just turn around and sell it on the TP to the first available offer, but they don't because they know that there are other people willing to pay a lot more on the black market...hence they are greedy and just want the most gold they can get. If buyers were smart(and they aren't) all they would do is post the max offer on the TP...and never go to the black market...there's two results from that process. Either the sellers start selling to the highest legal bidders, or they hold to an item knowing no one wants to pay more than max and make zero gold.

So if somebody came to your house and offered $100,000 for your computer, you would turn them down because you don't want to be greedy?

What you are describing isn't some sin. It's common sense. If someone wants to pay an inordinate amount of cash for an item that I don't want, of course I'm going to sell it to them. Why not? The cash they're giving me is worth more than the item anyway. Likewise, the reason they don't put maximum orders on the TP (until now) is because it won't work. Other buyers are willing to pay more through outside means, and sellers are going to sell to the highest buyers.

[Dreams.3128]

So my thing is.

I can go to another MMO and get bare feet for free. Without having to grind. Who grinds for a pair of invisible shoes??? Why did Anet make invisible shoes 'exclusive?'. That makes absolutely no sense.

If I have to grind for a feature I can toggle off and on in literally ANY OTHER GAME without losing stats than something is strange. Really strange. Same goes for auras. I can. Understand weapons and weapons skins being really rare or in that percentile, but auras and bare feet?????

What's next? Bare arms? Invisible hat??? Do you understand how funny and ridiculous it sounds when you tell your other MMOs you just grinded or broke your virtual or real wallet for a skin that gives you bare feet??? Lmao. Come on now.

[Lonecap.4105]

@Lilyanna.9361 said:So my thing is.

I can go to another MMO and get bare feet for free. Without having to grind. Who grinds for a pair of invisible shoes??? Why did Anet make invisible shoes 'exclusive?'. That makes absolutely no sense.

If I have to grind for a feature I can toggle off and on in literally ANY OTHER GAME without losing stats than something is strange. Really strange. Same goes for auras. I can. Understand weapons and weapons skins being really rare or in that percentile, but auras and bare feet?????

What's next? Bare arms? Invisible hat??? Do you understand how funny and ridiculous it sounds when you tell your other MMOs you just grinded or broke your virtual or real wallet for a skin that gives you bare feet??? Lmao. Come on now.

Bare feet are a pricey status symbol in GW2, its likely a nod to Queen Jennah and her invisible shoes. Which are surely expensive.

[Zaklex.6308]

@ProverbsofHell.2307 said:

@Lilyanna.9361 said:So my thing is.

I can go to another MMO and get bare feet for free. Without having to grind. Who grinds for a pair of invisible shoes??? Why did Anet make invisible shoes 'exclusive?'. That makes absolutely no sense.

If I have to grind for a feature I can toggle off and on in literally ANY OTHER GAME without losing stats than something is strange. Really strange. Same goes for auras. I can. Understand weapons and weapons skins being really rare or in that percentile, but auras and bare feet?????

What's next? Bare arms? Invisible hat??? Do you understand how funny and ridiculous it sounds when you tell your other MMOs you just grinded or broke your virtual or real wallet for a skin that gives you bare feet??? Lmao. Come on now.

Bare feet are a pricey status symbol in GW2, its likely a nod to Queen Jennah and her invisible shoes. Which are surely expensive.

Actually, it's a nod to Matthew Medina(former dev) who likes to play all of his characters barefoot(besides always being barefoot himself, if you ever noticed when he was on Guild Chat)...one of his original characters was Barefoot Contessa(in GW1 as well if I recollect).

@Blood Red Arachnid.2493 said:

@Zaklex.6308 said:

@Blood Red Arachnid.2493 said:

@Zaklex.6308 said:

The only reason they're on the black market and not the TP is because the sellers are greedy bastards...there is no other reason what so ever, if you can't live with a 10k cap on an items price then you're just plain greedy in this case.

The principles of economics apply no matter who you are. It doesn't matter how greedy these people are: an item will only sell for as much as somebody else is willing to pay. Otherwise the item will just sit around doing nothing. These items are sold on the black market precisely because other players are willing to pay far more than the money cap for said item. If they weren't, then the seller would be forced to do one of two tings: lower their price, or not sell the item. A significant increase in supply will drive the prices down due to competition. If supply is increased enough, the item will fall below the 8k gold mark, and it will be traded on the market again.

The flow of these items into the economy is completely random. You're asserting that, by sheer coincidence, everybody who happens to get one is also greedy.. I find that hard to swallow.

Actually it proves that everyone who gets one that sells it is greedy, and I can explain it simply this way. You already said there are standing orders on the TP from people willing to pay the max price, if that is so, and someone gets one that they don't want, they could just turn around and sell it on the TP to the first available offer, but they don't because they know that there are other people willing to pay a lot more on the black market...hence they are greedy and just want the most gold they can get. If buyers were smart(and they aren't) all they would do is post the max offer on the TP...and never go to the black market...there's two results from that process. Either the sellers start selling to the highest legal bidders, or they hold to an item knowing no one wants to pay more than max and make zero gold.

So if somebody came to your house and offered $100,000 for your computer, you would turn them down because you don't want to be greedy?

What you are describing isn't some sin. It's common sense. If someone wants to pay an inordinate amount of cash for an item that I don't want, of course I'm going to sell it to them. Why not? The cash they're giving me is worth more than the item anyway. Likewise, the reason they don't put maximum orders on the TP (until now) is because it won't work. Other buyers are willing to pay more through outside means, and sellers are going to sell to the highest buyers.

You probably really don't want me to answer that question, but I will...yes, I would turn down the $100k for my computer, but in this case not because of lack of greed, but because for one, it's not worth that much and I don't rip people off, and two...what's on the computer is worth a lot more than practically any amount of money(throw another 6 zeros on there and maybe we can talk)...

I'm one of those people that always just sold something I didn't want to the highest bidder on the TP, though I kept some things I might not ever use, not because I wanted it, but because just maybe I might use it some day...so it sits in storage doing nothing, it's just a virtual item though, so it's not harming anything.

[Blood Red Arachnid.2493]

@"Zaklex.6308" said:You probably really don't want me to answer that question, but I will...yes, I would turn down the $100k for my computer, but in this case not because of lack of greed, but because for one, it's not worth that much and I don't rip people off, and two...what's on the computer is worth a lot more than practically any amount of money(throw another 6 zeros on there and maybe we can talk)...

I'm one of those people that always just sold something I didn't want to the highest bidder on the TP, though I kept some things I might not ever use, not because I wanted it, but because just maybe I might use it some day...so it sits in storage doing nothing, it's just a virtual item though, so it's not harming anything.

The secret to the success of market economies is that trade is not a zero sum game. If I buy a cheeseburger for a dollar, it means that burger is worth more than a dollar to me. Likewise, to the joint selling the burgers, my dollar is worth more than the burger that they are selling. Both parties benefit in the end.

Make no mistake, you are morally condemning people for receiving a rare drop, and your "proof" is that the people... sell it to the highest bidder. Any moral grandstanding isn't going to fix how nonsensical this conclusion is.

[Zaklex.6308]

@Blood Red Arachnid.2493 said:

@"Zaklex.6308" said:You probably really don't want me to answer that question, but I will...yes, I would turn down the $100k for my computer, but in this case not because of lack of greed, but because for one, it's not worth that much and I don't rip people off, and two...what's on the computer is worth a lot more than practically any amount of money(throw another 6 zeros on there and maybe we can talk)...

I'm one of those people that always just sold something I didn't want to the highest bidder on the TP, though I kept some things I might not ever use, not because I wanted it, but because just maybe I might use it some day...so it sits in storage doing nothing, it's just a virtual item though, so it's not harming anything.

The secret to the success of market economies is that trade is not a zero sum game. If I buy a cheeseburger for a dollar, it means that burger is worth more than a dollar to me. Likewise, to the joint selling the burgers, my dollar is worth more than the burger that they are selling. Both parties benefit in the end.

Make no mistake, you are morally condemning people for receiving a rare drop, and your "proof" is that the people... sell it to the highest bidder. Any moral grandstanding isn't going to fix how nonsensical this conclusion is.

I don't care whether someone gets a rare drop or not, good for them, doesn't affect me(this isn't about me personally I know) one way or the other, but if they don't want it, why not just sell it to the person that wants to pay the highest authorized in game amount instead of going outside the game and just taking the highest amount you can get? Is not the highest amount that someone can pay on the TP(which is the authorized legal way to trade in GW2) not good enough for you? Do you see my point, if taking the highest amount someone is willing to pay via the authorized legal method within the game isn't good enough, then using outside sources to make the most you can from your rare drop makes you greedy...getting the most for what you can is greed. The biggest problem with these infusions though is there is no price basis for them, so the TP as set up has basically made it so the market has a ceiling, even if the item can/could/would exceed that ceiling...perhaps that creates artificial greed from the sellers, maybe they aren't greedy people under normal circumstances, but the circumstances make them look like greedy people.

Hell, there's dozens of different angles you can look at this from, and I personally don't think anyone is right or wrong, it's a market, an artificial market, but still a market, and whether the sellers are being greedy(loosely) because they can, or they're just doing it because they're forced to can only be answered by them, but I think there are a lot more of these rare items out there than we're led to believe, it's just that some people have multiples and hold on to them like the items are their own personal Fort Knox.

I mean the OP thinks the drop rates should be increased, yet ArenaNet doesn't agree(by not increasing the percentage), so that tells me enough have dropped to satisfy what ever statistics they needed to satisfy for ArenaNet's purposes. No amount of complaining about the price or availability is going to change the drop rate, since it obviously meets what ever metric it's supposed to meet.

[Blood Red Arachnid.2493]

@Zaklex.6308 said:

I don't care whether someone gets a rare drop or not, good for them, doesn't affect me(this isn't about me personally I know) one way or the other, but if they don't want it, why not just sell it to the person that wants to pay the highest authorized in game amount instead of going outside the game and just taking the highest amount you can get?

Because you get several thousand gold more through alternative channels. Players are given massive incentive to go through the black market because of this. Both buyers and sellers. See, the dangers inherent in black market trading is less (roughly half) the potential gain of using the black market. So... people use the black market.

@Zaklex.6308 said:Is not the highest amount that someone can pay on the TP(which is the authorized legal way to trade in GW2) not good enough for you? Do you see my point, if taking the highest amount someone is willing to pay via the authorized legal method within the game isn't good enough, then using outside sources to make the most you can from your rare drop makes you greedy...getting the most for what you can is greed.

No, I don't see your point. "Getting the most for what you can get" is common sense. Dare I say, it is perfectly normal. Not only is it common sense, but it is sound financial advice, and sound advice for life in general. You don't want to be ripped off, taken advantage of, or wasting your time. You want to negotiate the lowest prices, the best wages, get the best deals, the highest quality goods and the highest quality services. There is no reason to put yourself at risk, financially or otherwise, to combat some vague notion that you're being greedy.

Likewise, there is no such thing as "enough gold." There is always things to buy in GW2. More power, more aesthetics, more convenience. There is no correct or incorrect amount of gold to possess, either.

@Zaklex.6308 said:The biggest problem with these infusions though is there is no price basis for them, so the TP as set up has basically made it so the market has a ceiling, even if the item can/could/would exceed that ceiling...perhaps that creates artificial greed from the sellers, maybe they aren't greedy people under normal circumstances, but the circumstances make them look like greedy people.

There is no such thing as a correct price. Supply and demand are fickle mistresses, and money is a human invention. The "price" of an item is whatever the buyer and seller agree to. There's a really simple solution to the black market issue: raise the supply. Anet can do it easily. They just change a digit. Likewise, these people don't look greedy at all.

@Zaklex.6308 said:Hell, there's dozens of different angles you can look at this from, and I personally don't think anyone is right or wrong,

You are calling people greedy. Being greedy is a "wrong". If you mean something else, then use a different word.

@Zaklex.6308 said:I mean the OP thinks the drop rates should be increased, yet ArenaNet doesn't agree(by not increasing the percentage), so that tells me enough have dropped to satisfy what ever statistics they needed to satisfy for ArenaNet's purposes. No amount of complaining about the price or availability is going to change the drop rate, since it obviously meets what ever metric it's supposed to meet.

That, or Anet is fine with the black market. Or Anet hasn't yet been convinced that the drop rate is too low. If enough people complain, then Anet will change things just to suit them. PVP balance is enough proof of that. Remember: Anet hasn't done something... right up until they do it.

[Ashen.2907]

@Blood Red Arachnid.2493 said:

@"ProverbsofHell.2307" said:GUYS. WHAT is this topic seriously?

I am honestly not sure what this topic is asking for. Why should you roll up to queensdale, trash shadow behemoth and loot a confetti infusion? Of course it isn't dropping for you. These are "chase items" (that's what the devs call them). They're good for the game. It's exciting to see an extremely rare item, and people whisper me all the time asking if my aura is indeed chak egg sac - and I tell them it is, and they're excited! They just saw a really rare item in-game and they're excited to be playing.

Exclusivity is exciting. It's boring when nothing is special, and there's hardly anything in-game that is actually special.

To quote Aristotle: "moderation in all things." There's a point when exclusivity becomes ridiculous. When there's dozens of resting 10k gold bids on the market for these items, then we're past that point. Hell, I get whispers about my invisible shoes, and I bought my pair for 2.5k gold. You can have something be special and amazing without making it 10 times rarer than my boots.

Moderation in all things, if applied here, would mean increasing exclusivity in the game as there is very little of it currently present.

[devious.4605]

@Danikat.8537 said:With the Chak and Festive Infusions it looks like some people are artificially inflating the prices. All of them have bids at 10,000g exactly and then the next highest is 6,000g or less.

Almost any other high-end item has a fairly even increase in buy offers (and sell offers, if there are any) and even 'big' jumps are less than 1,000g. I realise this will sound like a conspiracy theory (and I guess in a sense it is) but to me that looks like some people put in buy orders at the maximum price specifically to block any other sales going through...possibly because they have infusions to sell and want to push buyers to purchase them outside the TP so they can maximise their profit. (And honestly this is a win-win for them because if someone sells one to them they can resell it for a profit, and if not they can cancel the bid and get 100% of their gold back.)

I hope that's the case, the other possibility I can think of is some people are trying to push buyers outside the TP because they don't have one to sell and want to scam them into sending some/all the gold for nothing in return.

Considering people are willing to pay upward of 20k for the Chak infusion, I don't think listing at 10k is artificially inflating the price.The fact that a subreddit was setup for people willing to pay above the TP cap, shows Anet should reevaluate the current TP listing cap.

[Nandor The Stampede.1593]

Some people are too lazy to read properly and just skim over things so they simply assume and give their uneducated point of view. I felt better to re-address the issue, specially after talking to a dev.There is a problem with high end infusions. Even if you have the means (20k gold in goodies for the chak one) you cannot get one unless you use the black market. Here lies the problem.

1. Should drop rate be increased? I like their rarity. I don't want 1 in 10 ppl to be walking around with one. I don't think increasing drop rate is the right solution, although it is a solution.
2. Should tp bid cap be increased? It will certainly get rid of most of the black market, and people can bid accordingly to how much they think is worth. I think this is the right approach.
3. Should anet come out and say that it wont ban accounts who use the black market? well I talked to a dev about it.

[Hello,Thank you for contacting the Guild Wars 2 Support Team about a third-party program or service. At present, ArenaNet and the Guild Wars 2 Support Team does not review, approve, or officially endorse any third-party programs, services, or applications, nor are we able to provide support if they have caused issues with your game. Please contact the individual or organization that created the program for assistance.If you are interested about using a third-party modification, we recommend that you review the policy documents regarding third-party programs, multi-boxing, and macros posted on the support site:Policy: Unattended GameplayPolicy: Third-Party ProgramsPolicy: Macros and Macro UsePolicy: Dual or Multi-BoxingBeyond that, we cannot provide any further response aside from what is outlined in the articles above.Regards,]Cool Dev.

That's the response I got. I looked then into 3rd party programs.

[The best way for you to assess whether a specific third-party program could have any impact on another player is to ask:"Does this program allow someone to play faster, better, longer, or more accurately than someone who doesn't use the program?" Not a all"Does this program allow someone to 'play' when he/she is not at the computer?" Not at all"Does this program allow the user to gain unnatural or undeserved rewards?" Maybe? is not clearIf the answer to any of these questions is "yes" or even "maybe," then we strongly recommend that you do not use the program. Doing so not only raises the risk that your Guild Wars or Guild Wars 2 account may be accessed by a malicious third party, but it can lead to the suspension or termination of your account for violating the Guild Wars 2 Rules of Conduct.]

It certainly allows you to bypass people who have been in the waiting list in the tp for months if not more looking for an infusion. I personally don't think anet is gonna go hardcore against people who use the "black market" but there is certainly a gray area, where they could ban an account and legally not be wrong. That's my beef. My account is rated fairly high and taking a risk seems kind of dumb, at the same time, I really really want a festive or chak infusions, I have the means to buy them, but I know I wont get one through the tp anytime soon. So... what would then be my next move? How do u guys interpret the "Does this program allow the user to gain unnatural or undeserved rewards?"?? Can we all agree that there is at least somewhat of a gray area there? That, is the problem with high end infusions.

[Gop.8713]

Account binding the infusions would also fix the problem . . .

[Inculpatus cedo.9234]

I think you may be confused. Player-to-player trading isn't against the EULA, it's just not supported by ArenaNet (you can read the official posts regarding player-to-player trading in this very forum). In other words, should something go wrong, it's on you.The EULA doesn't mandate that the trade be brokered in-game, either. Nothing against discussing a trade outside the game. The only mandate is that the goods exchanged must be in-game content; e.g. Gold for Infusion.There's nothing 3rd-party about it (as referenced by the Knowledge Base articles or official forum posts).

[phs.6089]

If Arena wanted to fix this they would put queen bee on more meta rewards long ago, at least as soon as AB got several chances on Aulirium. You think they don't know what is going on?

[Hyper Cutter.9376]

Raising the cap won't do jack, the price would just increase to match it because people are greedy, then that's the new normal and now you'll want it raised again.

If you want to fix the issue, significantly raise the drop rate to bring the infusions into line with other high-end rare items (invisible boots, permanent black lion contracts, etc).

[Blood Red Arachnid.2493]

@"Hyper Cutter.9376" said:Raising the cap won't do jack, the price would just increase to match it because people are greedy, then that's the new normal and now you'll want it raised again.

If you want to fix the issue, significantly raise the drop rate to bring the infusions into line with other high-end rare items (invisible boots, permanent black lion contracts, etc).

The black market is completely unrestrained. Traders are free to be as "greedy" as they want already. There's no reason why the price would increase if the trade cap was raised.

[zealex.9410]

@"Excursion.9752" said:Love the idea of the event but random drops seem hopeless and inspires me not to participate. There should have also been an overall achievement tied to the event like kill "X" amount of world bosses and get to choose one item from a loot box which were account bound and still have the chance to get an unbound version from a random drop.

If I'm going to sit around and waste my gaming hours standing for 10 or so min each new spawn make it worth it please. The proverbial carrot needs to somewhat be in reach to make this event interesting.

Sure, if it was like kill 500 or so world bosses

[Nandor The Stampede.1593]

@"Inculpatus cedo.9234" said:I think you may be confused. Player-to-player trading isn't against the EULA, it's just not supported by ArenaNet (you can read the official posts regarding player-to-player trading in this very forum). In other words, should something go wrong, it's on you.The EULA doesn't mandate that the trade be brokered in-game, either. Nothing against discussing a trade outside the game. The only mandate is that the goods exchanged must be in-game content; e.g. Gold for Infusion.There's nothing 3rd-party about it (as referenced by the Knowledge Base articles or official forum posts).

Finally, somebody cared to read. Ok, so it's safe to assume, we can trade all we want, even using such "markets" as long as we don't expect anet to do anything if we get ripped off. Thanks for the reply