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Warscythes.9307

Warscythes.9307

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@zionophir.6845 said:

@neven.3785 said:In the past it was possible with one of the common DPS meters used. Also range check that told.you how many enemies are nearby. I left a guild I was a long time member of because they started interrogating members over specific slotted gear pieces or a minor trait choice. I wasn't the target but I'm of firm opinion that it was not how to run a guild especially since it violated terms of service. Other ways to git gud without such tools.

There is a reason those tools where banned and Arc was not. Not sure how that's relevant now.

@zionophir.6845 said:so does arcdps dictate your "Rotation"?

of course you don't just 1111111 the Violet Boss Right? assuming that you've played a single class for how many, 7 years, you don't just 111111 right? there are 9 other skills, right?

and you can even not copy a build using a website and discover by yourselves that there are higher damage build customizations other than the meta builds in the website..

i can just bring a warrior without banners and still damage is still high... its called "traits for weapon/skill cooldown reduction.."

right?

I'm not quite sure what your point here is.Arc doesn't dictate rotations, it simply let's you check if you or others are performing them up to standard and assists in the creation of them by providing feedback.

Plenty of skills reduce DPS due to cast times or aftercasts. It's not just not pressing 1. Additionally a lot of DPS builds utilize combos/burst windows, aka creating damage modifiers and then using as many of the highest damage skills available as possible in them.If you don't know the rotation, there is plenty you can do wrong.

The builds and rotations that are on those sites are there because they are the highest DPS achievable to current knowledge.If you came up with something higher, feel free to let the rest of us know.

Bringing Banners is a DPS sacrifice Warriors make to increase Squad DPS, which is all that matters.So yes, not taking Banners should not only result in "still" high personal DPS, but higher.Personal DPS isn't strictly what you take a Banner Warrior for though.

Again, not sure what the point is you are trying to make.

k.

assuming that you bring the Strength and Discipline banners

4 attributes gets to +100..

ok

compare that to berserker stance, which when used will make your adren full (try to know if how many times) and balanced stance (coz if you got CCed by the boss equals no damage). and traits that lengthen the stances (so more fast adrenaline recharge). Berserker Stance will make any conditions on you useless too. (Blind, Weakness, anything that can kitten or prevent damage)

now go to the weapons = reduced recharge means weapon skill is almost being used everytime, yes? make your main weapons (GS/whatever) have reduced recharge

and tactics - 3 - 3 -3

and since your weapon is GS and you slotted the GS cooldown reduction, you have access to Might Makes Right?

Right?

so now compare Berserker Stance + Balanced Stance (on a stance duration increase) versus Str and Disc Banners

and yeah, if the boss is condi heavy inflicting damage gimping/prevention, +400 on the attributes, even when it's shared, is almost incomparable/useless coz your constant uninterrupted damage became 0 with the Bosses condis..

You genuinely have no idea what the role of the Banner Warrior is.

4000 Squad wide Attributes with Banners + 500 from EA, in part needed to crit cap all your DPS's, as well as the CC from Mace/Mace is the main reason to bring pBS to Raids.

If you get constantly CC'ed or are afflicted with Weakness for a substantial amount of time, I a) am not sure what boss that is supposed to be and b) your supports suck.

In terms of Squad DPS and Utility, yes, your suggested build pales in comparison.Making a build that has higher personal DPS as a Banner Warrior is a no brainer, since Banner Warrior isn't strictly a DPS...

k.

you're talking about raids.

im talking about fractals/dungeons.

big difference.

I don't think you know what you are talking about.In Fractals your group even more so relies on you as Warrior to play Mace/Mace as primary CC together with the Renegade, with Axe/Axe being superior for DPS.You won't use that GS unless you know there won't be any Breakbars in the upcoming encounters.For Stab and condi cleanse, again, run a supFB. Together with the Rev being able to swap to Jalis, you will have more Stab than you'll ever need, freeing you to take Banners, which still are a valuable stat increase in 5 man content.

@zionophir.6845 said:and pugging/joining on the fly in raids is fake news. raid guilds sell them.

The fact that there are some raid sellers doesn't mean people aren't pugging Raids, what's your point?

@zionophir.6845 said:and if raid guilds say you must bring banner, you have no choice..

while banner on 5 people is almost negligible.. if all of you have skills that do not kitten your damage, IN ANY WAY...

It's less negligible than everything else you could bring.If you are neither bringing Banners nor Mace/Mace, then there is little reason to bring a pWarrior.

the max damage that i inflict to a Gold Champion boss with GS skill 2 alone, with all the skill boosters (no item booster) like might and vulnerability maxed is 30,000++

so you now know why i am advocating traiting Weapon Cooldown Reduction..

And Axe 5 can do over 100k damage.Not sure what that has to do with anything though...

Considering Hundred Blades has a cast time of 3.5 seconds without quickness and you are doing 30k damage with it, then congratulations, you are contributing less than 9k DPS.

@zionophir.6845 said:in a fractals party, if you spec your character to do 30,000 damage just using 1 skill and self-sustaining, and the other 4 do the same, sharing might and constant @ 25, resistance, stab, inflicting vulnerability, etc.. what do you think will happen?

i asked an oracle about this and she said, "Done in 5 minutes.." she speaks metaphors..

anyway, this is different from rAIDS, where damage is scaled coz you're so many there..

Again, not how DPS works.Your party of 5 would do less DPS at peak times than 1 1/2 DPS of a META group.

There is this program I can highly recommend called ArcDPS, which can greatly help you check your actual performance in terms of DPS, assisting you in improving as player.

This.

The question though is: is it really worth arguing with someone who does not even understand how damage is displayed in this game? I mean that's even below understanding game mechanics. Just let him be Asum. Some people are to far out to reach.

yeah, coz you only base it on numbers right? (thus you use this so called crappy arc dps and it only shows you numbers). you don't even consider how the boss attacks you and how that boss lessens/mitigates your damage..

yeah, and im pretty sure youll say "i played in GW2 beta so all i say is true.."

and ill just lel at you..

Yes we consider dps in regards to boss attacks in mind. That is why we use arcdps, so we can record the damage each member deal while performing mechanics in real time. Nobody actually thinks every class can do their benchmark numbers in every boss fight. Why do you think people use damage meters if not to track it while fighting?

Also we are going way off topic from the starting point, your claim was that as long as you have the highest damage build. You will do max damage. This is fundamentally wrong because a properly executed rotation brings considerably better damage. This does not mean you treat everything on a guide like snowcrow as the gospel because as you said yes, every group is different. I play power reaper, sometimes I bring spectral grasp even though is not max dps, sometimes I take a stunbreak if the situation calls for it, sometimes I take a condi clear if I know there is a lot of condis and our healer can't clear it in time. However none of this invalidates the fact that the importance of rotation. You start with the build and just change 1 or 2 skills at most when the situation calls for it. The core is the same, always.

If you really disagree with this, you have a very fundamental misunderstanding of how this game works.

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knite.1542
knite.1542

Very selfish mentality in my opinion. This isn't personal information we are talking here, it is your contribution to the group. DPS does matter a lot and it is not unreasonable to expect others to p

VDAC.2137
VDAC.2137

It’s not just in raids. I joined a fractal group via LFG already in the middle of a boss fight and several people down. I tried to simultaneously clear adds and work on getting people up but was not a

ChillyKoti.1928
ChillyKoti.1928

Very selfish mentality in my opinion. This isn't personal information we are talking here, it is your contribution to the group. DPS does matter a lot and it is not unreasonable to expect others to p

zionophir.6845

zionophir.6845

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@Warscythes.9307 said:

@neven.3785 said:In the past it was possible with one of the common DPS meters used. Also range check that told.you how many enemies are nearby. I left a guild I was a long time member of because they started interrogating members over specific slotted gear pieces or a minor trait choice. I wasn't the target but I'm of firm opinion that it was not how to run a guild especially since it violated terms of service. Other ways to git gud without such tools.

There is a reason those tools where banned and Arc was not. Not sure how that's relevant now.

@zionophir.6845 said:so does arcdps dictate your "Rotation"?

of course you don't just 1111111 the Violet Boss Right? assuming that you've played a single class for how many, 7 years, you don't just 111111 right? there are 9 other skills, right?

and you can even not copy a build using a website and discover by yourselves that there are higher damage build customizations other than the meta builds in the website..

i can just bring a warrior without banners and still damage is still high... its called "traits for weapon/skill cooldown reduction.."

right?

I'm not quite sure what your point here is.Arc doesn't dictate rotations, it simply let's you check if you or others are performing them up to standard and assists in the creation of them by providing feedback.

Plenty of skills reduce DPS due to cast times or aftercasts. It's not just not pressing 1. Additionally a lot of DPS builds utilize combos/burst windows, aka creating damage modifiers and then using as many of the highest damage skills available as possible in them.If you don't know the rotation, there is plenty you can do wrong.

The builds and rotations that are on those sites are there because they are the highest DPS achievable to current knowledge.If you came up with something higher, feel free to let the rest of us know.

Bringing Banners is a DPS sacrifice Warriors make to increase Squad DPS, which is all that matters.So yes, not taking Banners should not only result in "still" high personal DPS, but higher.Personal DPS isn't strictly what you take a Banner Warrior for though.

Again, not sure what the point is you are trying to make.

k.

assuming that you bring the Strength and Discipline banners

4 attributes gets to +100..

ok

compare that to berserker stance, which when used will make your adren full (try to know if how many times) and balanced stance (coz if you got CCed by the boss equals no damage). and traits that lengthen the stances (so more fast adrenaline recharge). Berserker Stance will make any conditions on you useless too. (Blind, Weakness, anything that can kitten or prevent damage)

now go to the weapons = reduced recharge means weapon skill is almost being used everytime, yes? make your main weapons (GS/whatever) have reduced recharge

and tactics - 3 - 3 -3

and since your weapon is GS and you slotted the GS cooldown reduction, you have access to Might Makes Right?

Right?

so now compare Berserker Stance + Balanced Stance (on a stance duration increase) versus Str and Disc Banners

and yeah, if the boss is condi heavy inflicting damage gimping/prevention, +400 on the attributes, even when it's shared, is almost incomparable/useless coz your constant uninterrupted damage became 0 with the Bosses condis..

You genuinely have no idea what the role of the Banner Warrior is.

4000 Squad wide Attributes with Banners + 500 from EA, in part needed to crit cap all your DPS's, as well as the CC from Mace/Mace is the main reason to bring pBS to Raids.

If you get constantly CC'ed or are afflicted with Weakness for a substantial amount of time, I a) am not sure what boss that is supposed to be and b) your supports suck.

In terms of Squad DPS and Utility, yes, your suggested build pales in comparison.Making a build that has higher personal DPS as a Banner Warrior is a no brainer, since Banner Warrior isn't strictly a DPS...

k.

you're talking about raids.

im talking about fractals/dungeons.

big difference.

I don't think you know what you are talking about.In Fractals your group even more so relies on you as Warrior to play Mace/Mace as primary CC together with the Renegade, with Axe/Axe being superior for DPS.You won't use that GS unless you know there won't be any Breakbars in the upcoming encounters.For Stab and condi cleanse, again, run a supFB. Together with the Rev being able to swap to Jalis, you will have more Stab than you'll ever need, freeing you to take Banners, which still are a valuable stat increase in 5 man content.

@zionophir.6845 said:and pugging/joining on the fly in raids is fake news. raid guilds sell them.

The fact that there are some raid sellers doesn't mean people aren't pugging Raids, what's your point?

@zionophir.6845 said:and if raid guilds say you must bring banner, you have no choice..

while banner on 5 people is almost negligible.. if all of you have skills that do not kitten your damage, IN ANY WAY...

It's less negligible than everything else you could bring.If you are neither bringing Banners nor Mace/Mace, then there is little reason to bring a pWarrior.

the max damage that i inflict to a Gold Champion boss with GS skill 2 alone, with all the skill boosters (no item booster) like might and vulnerability maxed is 30,000++

so you now know why i am advocating traiting Weapon Cooldown Reduction..

And Axe 5 can do over 100k damage.Not sure what that has to do with anything though...

Considering Hundred Blades has a cast time of 3.5 seconds without quickness and you are doing 30k damage with it, then congratulations, you are contributing less than 9k DPS.

@zionophir.6845 said:in a fractals party, if you spec your character to do 30,000 damage just using 1 skill and self-sustaining, and the other 4 do the same, sharing might and constant @ 25, resistance, stab, inflicting vulnerability, etc.. what do you think will happen?

i asked an oracle about this and she said, "Done in 5 minutes.." she speaks metaphors..

anyway, this is different from rAIDS, where damage is scaled coz you're so many there..

Again, not how DPS works.Your party of 5 would do less DPS at peak times than 1 1/2 DPS of a META group.

There is this program I can highly recommend called ArcDPS, which can greatly help you check your actual performance in terms of DPS, assisting you in improving as player.

This.

The question though is: is it really worth arguing with someone who does not even understand how damage is displayed in this game? I mean that's even below understanding game mechanics. Just let him be Asum. Some people are to far out to reach.

yeah, coz you only base it on numbers right? (thus you use this so called crappy arc dps and it only shows you numbers). you don't even consider how the boss attacks you and how that boss lessens/mitigates your damage..

yeah, and im pretty sure youll say "i played in GW2 beta so all i say is true.."

and ill just lel at you..

Yes we consider dps in regards to boss attacks in mind. That is why we use arcdps, so we can record the damage each member deal while performing mechanics in real time. Nobody actually thinks every class can do their benchmark numbers in every boss fight. Why do you think people use damage meters if not to track it while fighting?

Also we are going way off topic from the starting point, your claim was that as long as you have the highest damage build. You will do max damage. This is fundamentally wrong because a properly executed rotation brings considerably better damage. This does not mean you treat everything on a guide like snowcrow as the gospel because as you said yes, every group is different. I play power reaper, sometimes I bring spectral grasp even though is not max dps, sometimes I take a stunbreak if the situation calls for it, sometimes I take a condi clear if I know there is a lot of condis and our healer can't clear it in time. However none of this invalidates the fact that the importance of rotation.

If you really disagree with this, you have a very fundamental misunderstanding of how this game works.

what wins, highest maxed damage with rotation equal to the one with some weakened damage coz it's not about the maxed damage but i use arcdps?

easy methamatics..

and go apply in a comedy bar..

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Carcharoth Lucian.1378

Carcharoth Lucian.1378

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@zionophir.6845 said:

@neven.3785 said:In the past it was possible with one of the common DPS meters used. Also range check that told.you how many enemies are nearby. I left a guild I was a long time member of because they started interrogating members over specific slotted gear pieces or a minor trait choice. I wasn't the target but I'm of firm opinion that it was not how to run a guild especially since it violated terms of service. Other ways to git gud without such tools.

There is a reason those tools where banned and Arc was not. Not sure how that's relevant now.

@zionophir.6845 said:so does arcdps dictate your "Rotation"?

of course you don't just 1111111 the Violet Boss Right? assuming that you've played a single class for how many, 7 years, you don't just 111111 right? there are 9 other skills, right?

and you can even not copy a build using a website and discover by yourselves that there are higher damage build customizations other than the meta builds in the website..

i can just bring a warrior without banners and still damage is still high... its called "traits for weapon/skill cooldown reduction.."

right?

I'm not quite sure what your point here is.Arc doesn't dictate rotations, it simply let's you check if you or others are performing them up to standard and assists in the creation of them by providing feedback.

Plenty of skills reduce DPS due to cast times or aftercasts. It's not just not pressing 1. Additionally a lot of DPS builds utilize combos/burst windows, aka creating damage modifiers and then using as many of the highest damage skills available as possible in them.If you don't know the rotation, there is plenty you can do wrong.

The builds and rotations that are on those sites are there because they are the highest DPS achievable to current knowledge.If you came up with something higher, feel free to let the rest of us know.

Bringing Banners is a DPS sacrifice Warriors make to increase Squad DPS, which is all that matters.So yes, not taking Banners should not only result in "still" high personal DPS, but higher.Personal DPS isn't strictly what you take a Banner Warrior for though.

Again, not sure what the point is you are trying to make.

k.

assuming that you bring the Strength and Discipline banners

4 attributes gets to +100..

ok

compare that to berserker stance, which when used will make your adren full (try to know if how many times) and balanced stance (coz if you got CCed by the boss equals no damage). and traits that lengthen the stances (so more fast adrenaline recharge). Berserker Stance will make any conditions on you useless too. (Blind, Weakness, anything that can kitten or prevent damage)

now go to the weapons = reduced recharge means weapon skill is almost being used everytime, yes? make your main weapons (GS/whatever) have reduced recharge

and tactics - 3 - 3 -3

and since your weapon is GS and you slotted the GS cooldown reduction, you have access to Might Makes Right?

Right?

so now compare Berserker Stance + Balanced Stance (on a stance duration increase) versus Str and Disc Banners

and yeah, if the boss is condi heavy inflicting damage gimping/prevention, +400 on the attributes, even when it's shared, is almost incomparable/useless coz your constant uninterrupted damage became 0 with the Bosses condis..

You genuinely have no idea what the role of the Banner Warrior is.

4000 Squad wide Attributes with Banners + 500 from EA, in part needed to crit cap all your DPS's, as well as the CC from Mace/Mace is the main reason to bring pBS to Raids.

If you get constantly CC'ed or are afflicted with Weakness for a substantial amount of time, I a) am not sure what boss that is supposed to be and b) your supports suck.

In terms of Squad DPS and Utility, yes, your suggested build pales in comparison.Making a build that has higher personal DPS as a Banner Warrior is a no brainer, since Banner Warrior isn't strictly a DPS...

k.

you're talking about raids.

im talking about fractals/dungeons.

big difference.

I don't think you know what you are talking about.In Fractals your group even more so relies on you as Warrior to play Mace/Mace as primary CC together with the Renegade, with Axe/Axe being superior for DPS.You won't use that GS unless you know there won't be any Breakbars in the upcoming encounters.For Stab and condi cleanse, again, run a supFB. Together with the Rev being able to swap to Jalis, you will have more Stab than you'll ever need, freeing you to take Banners, which still are a valuable stat increase in 5 man content.

@zionophir.6845 said:and pugging/joining on the fly in raids is fake news. raid guilds sell them.

The fact that there are some raid sellers doesn't mean people aren't pugging Raids, what's your point?

@zionophir.6845 said:and if raid guilds say you must bring banner, you have no choice..

while banner on 5 people is almost negligible.. if all of you have skills that do not kitten your damage, IN ANY WAY...

It's less negligible than everything else you could bring.If you are neither bringing Banners nor Mace/Mace, then there is little reason to bring a pWarrior.

the max damage that i inflict to a Gold Champion boss with GS skill 2 alone, with all the skill boosters (no item booster) like might and vulnerability maxed is 30,000++

so you now know why i am advocating traiting Weapon Cooldown Reduction..

And Axe 5 can do over 100k damage.Not sure what that has to do with anything though...

Considering Hundred Blades has a cast time of 3.5 seconds without quickness and you are doing 30k damage with it, then congratulations, you are contributing less than 9k DPS.

@zionophir.6845 said:in a fractals party, if you spec your character to do 30,000 damage just using 1 skill and self-sustaining, and the other 4 do the same, sharing might and constant @ 25, resistance, stab, inflicting vulnerability, etc.. what do you think will happen?

i asked an oracle about this and she said, "Done in 5 minutes.." she speaks metaphors..

anyway, this is different from rAIDS, where damage is scaled coz you're so many there..

Again, not how DPS works.Your party of 5 would do less DPS at peak times than 1 1/2 DPS of a META group.

There is this program I can highly recommend called ArcDPS, which can greatly help you check your actual performance in terms of DPS, assisting you in improving as player.

last hit skill 2, on a copper Veteran mob, in WvWvW in 9 might

yfvAivM.jpg

SCALE THAT TO A GOLD BOSS WITH 4 PLAYERS 25 MIGHT MAX VULNERABILITY..

so what's the moral lesson? don't assume that someone is always inventing stuff up..

right, as
um[e]?

and arcdps will make you a pro player? it's akin to cheats that makes a noob feel supremely pro.. sadly, just a feeling..

you're a comedian man. go apply in some comedy bar..

ahahAnd it's still bad^^ (and it will still be bad with 25 mights and vulne^^)Thanks you for the laughter :)

But you know, you're right : we are all noobs and you are the only one here that is good :)

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maddoctor.2738

maddoctor.2738

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@zionophir.6845 said:so what's the moral lesson? don't assume that someone is always inventing stuff up..

Do you know what dps means?It's Damage Per Second, not how much damage you are doing with an attack but how much damage you are doing over a longer period of time.Arcdps will show you how much damage you did over 1 minute or 10 minutes, which is what is important. Otherwise you'd see Thieves showing their Backstab damage and call it a day (spoiler: even though Backstab gets insane high numbers, Dagger/X Thief isn't the top DPS)

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Warscythes.9307

Warscythes.9307

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@zionophir.6845 said:

@neven.3785 said:In the past it was possible with one of the common DPS meters used. Also range check that told.you how many enemies are nearby. I left a guild I was a long time member of because they started interrogating members over specific slotted gear pieces or a minor trait choice. I wasn't the target but I'm of firm opinion that it was not how to run a guild especially since it violated terms of service. Other ways to git gud without such tools.

There is a reason those tools where banned and Arc was not. Not sure how that's relevant now.

@zionophir.6845 said:so does arcdps dictate your "Rotation"?

of course you don't just 1111111 the Violet Boss Right? assuming that you've played a single class for how many, 7 years, you don't just 111111 right? there are 9 other skills, right?

and you can even not copy a build using a website and discover by yourselves that there are higher damage build customizations other than the meta builds in the website..

i can just bring a warrior without banners and still damage is still high... its called "traits for weapon/skill cooldown reduction.."

right?

I'm not quite sure what your point here is.Arc doesn't dictate rotations, it simply let's you check if you or others are performing them up to standard and assists in the creation of them by providing feedback.

Plenty of skills reduce DPS due to cast times or aftercasts. It's not just not pressing 1. Additionally a lot of DPS builds utilize combos/burst windows, aka creating damage modifiers and then using as many of the highest damage skills available as possible in them.If you don't know the rotation, there is plenty you can do wrong.

The builds and rotations that are on those sites are there because they are the highest DPS achievable to current knowledge.If you came up with something higher, feel free to let the rest of us know.

Bringing Banners is a DPS sacrifice Warriors make to increase Squad DPS, which is all that matters.So yes, not taking Banners should not only result in "still" high personal DPS, but higher.Personal DPS isn't strictly what you take a Banner Warrior for though.

Again, not sure what the point is you are trying to make.

k.

assuming that you bring the Strength and Discipline banners

4 attributes gets to +100..

ok

compare that to berserker stance, which when used will make your adren full (try to know if how many times) and balanced stance (coz if you got CCed by the boss equals no damage). and traits that lengthen the stances (so more fast adrenaline recharge). Berserker Stance will make any conditions on you useless too. (Blind, Weakness, anything that can kitten or prevent damage)

now go to the weapons = reduced recharge means weapon skill is almost being used everytime, yes? make your main weapons (GS/whatever) have reduced recharge

and tactics - 3 - 3 -3

and since your weapon is GS and you slotted the GS cooldown reduction, you have access to Might Makes Right?

Right?

so now compare Berserker Stance + Balanced Stance (on a stance duration increase) versus Str and Disc Banners

and yeah, if the boss is condi heavy inflicting damage gimping/prevention, +400 on the attributes, even when it's shared, is almost incomparable/useless coz your constant uninterrupted damage became 0 with the Bosses condis..

You genuinely have no idea what the role of the Banner Warrior is.

4000 Squad wide Attributes with Banners + 500 from EA, in part needed to crit cap all your DPS's, as well as the CC from Mace/Mace is the main reason to bring pBS to Raids.

If you get constantly CC'ed or are afflicted with Weakness for a substantial amount of time, I a) am not sure what boss that is supposed to be and b) your supports suck.

In terms of Squad DPS and Utility, yes, your suggested build pales in comparison.Making a build that has higher personal DPS as a Banner Warrior is a no brainer, since Banner Warrior isn't strictly a DPS...

k.

you're talking about raids.

im talking about fractals/dungeons.

big difference.

I don't think you know what you are talking about.In Fractals your group even more so relies on you as Warrior to play Mace/Mace as primary CC together with the Renegade, with Axe/Axe being superior for DPS.You won't use that GS unless you know there won't be any Breakbars in the upcoming encounters.For Stab and condi cleanse, again, run a supFB. Together with the Rev being able to swap to Jalis, you will have more Stab than you'll ever need, freeing you to take Banners, which still are a valuable stat increase in 5 man content.

@zionophir.6845 said:and pugging/joining on the fly in raids is fake news. raid guilds sell them.

The fact that there are some raid sellers doesn't mean people aren't pugging Raids, what's your point?

@zionophir.6845 said:and if raid guilds say you must bring banner, you have no choice..

while banner on 5 people is almost negligible.. if all of you have skills that do not kitten your damage, IN ANY WAY...

It's less negligible than everything else you could bring.If you are neither bringing Banners nor Mace/Mace, then there is little reason to bring a pWarrior.

the max damage that i inflict to a Gold Champion boss with GS skill 2 alone, with all the skill boosters (no item booster) like might and vulnerability maxed is 30,000++

so you now know why i am advocating traiting Weapon Cooldown Reduction..

And Axe 5 can do over 100k damage.Not sure what that has to do with anything though...

Considering Hundred Blades has a cast time of 3.5 seconds without quickness and you are doing 30k damage with it, then congratulations, you are contributing less than 9k DPS.

@zionophir.6845 said:in a fractals party, if you spec your character to do 30,000 damage just using 1 skill and self-sustaining, and the other 4 do the same, sharing might and constant @ 25, resistance, stab, inflicting vulnerability, etc.. what do you think will happen?

i asked an oracle about this and she said, "Done in 5 minutes.." she speaks metaphors..

anyway, this is different from rAIDS, where damage is scaled coz you're so many there..

Again, not how DPS works.Your party of 5 would do less DPS at peak times than 1 1/2 DPS of a META group.

There is this program I can highly recommend called ArcDPS, which can greatly help you check your actual performance in terms of DPS, assisting you in improving as player.

This.

The question though is: is it really worth arguing with someone who does not even understand how damage is displayed in this game? I mean that's even below understanding game mechanics. Just let him be Asum. Some people are to far out to reach.

yeah, coz you only base it on numbers right? (thus you use this so called crappy arc dps and it only shows you numbers). you don't even consider how the boss attacks you and how that boss lessens/mitigates your damage..

yeah, and im pretty sure youll say "i played in GW2 beta so all i say is true.."

and ill just lel at you..

Yes we consider dps in regards to boss attacks in mind. That is why we use arcdps, so we can record the damage each member deal while performing mechanics in real time. Nobody actually thinks every class can do their benchmark numbers in every boss fight. Why do you think people use damage meters if not to track it while fighting?

Also we are going way off topic from the starting point, your claim was that as long as you have the highest damage build. You will do max damage. This is fundamentally wrong because a properly executed rotation brings considerably better damage. This does not mean you treat everything on a guide like snowcrow as the gospel because as you said yes, every group is different. I play power reaper, sometimes I bring spectral grasp even though is not max dps, sometimes I take a stunbreak if the situation calls for it, sometimes I take a condi clear if I know there is a lot of condis and our healer can't clear it in time. However none of this invalidates the fact that the importance of rotation.

If you really disagree with this, you have a very fundamental misunderstanding of how this game works.

what wins, highest maxed damage with rotation equal to the one with some weakened damage coz it's not about the maxed damage but i use arcdps?

easy methamatics..

and go apply in a comedy bar..

Your sentence does not make any sense at all.

We talk about highest max damage at the golem because is an easy comparison at a vacuum. That is why even though in theory rifle deadeye has the highest damage potential in the game, it is not the brought everywhere because its performance in fights depends heavily on the boss fight.

We know that your damage will be lower in a fight, people have said this. We know you cannot always execute a perfect rotation in fight. What you can do however is learning how the rotation works so that 1) you can do it if you are not interrupted and 2) if you are interrupted to do mechanics, you know how to pick it back up. What you are not getting at is that arcdps is THE tool that let you know whether or not you are doing this correctly or not. Nobody expect you to do max damage possible compared to a golem, but you are expected to do your best with the rotation with the boss mechanic in mind and arcdps is what allow you to track it.

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zionophir.6845

zionophir.6845

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@maddoctor.2738 said:

@zionophir.6845 said:so what's the moral lesson? don't assume that someone is always inventing stuff up..

Do you know what dps means?It's Damage Per Second, not how much damage you are doing with an attack but how much damage you are doing over a longer period of time.Arcdps will show you how much damage you did over 1 minute or 10 minutes, which is what is important. Otherwise you'd see Thieves showing their Backstab damage and call it a day (spoiler: even though Backstab gets insane high numbers, Dagger/X Thief isn't the top DPS)

11111,skill2,1111,skill3,1111,skill4,1111,skill5 (or apply the right combo/rotation) rinse, repeat with weapon reduction and weapon bonus boost from traits..

tell me what DPS is..

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maddoctor.2738

maddoctor.2738

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@zionophir.6845 said:

@zionophir.6845 said:so what's the moral lesson? don't assume that someone is always inventing stuff up..

Do you know what dps means?It's Damage Per Second, not how much damage you are doing with an attack but how much damage you are doing over a longer period of time.Arcdps will show you how much damage you did over 1 minute or 10 minutes, which is what is important. Otherwise you'd see Thieves showing their Backstab damage and call it a day (spoiler: even though Backstab gets insane high numbers, Dagger/X Thief isn't the top DPS)

11111,skill2,1111,skill3,1111,skill4,1111,skill5 (or apply the right combo/rotation) rinse, repeat with weapon reduction and bonus boost from traits..

tell me what DPS is..

So you still don't know what DPS is...Show us your numbers from an actual fight. Your DPS from the entire rotation. That's what matters.

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zionophir.6845

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@Warscythes.9307 said:

@neven.3785 said:In the past it was possible with one of the common DPS meters used. Also range check that told.you how many enemies are nearby. I left a guild I was a long time member of because they started interrogating members over specific slotted gear pieces or a minor trait choice. I wasn't the target but I'm of firm opinion that it was not how to run a guild especially since it violated terms of service. Other ways to git gud without such tools.

There is a reason those tools where banned and Arc was not. Not sure how that's relevant now.

@zionophir.6845 said:so does arcdps dictate your "Rotation"?

of course you don't just 1111111 the Violet Boss Right? assuming that you've played a single class for how many, 7 years, you don't just 111111 right? there are 9 other skills, right?

and you can even not copy a build using a website and discover by yourselves that there are higher damage build customizations other than the meta builds in the website..

i can just bring a warrior without banners and still damage is still high... its called "traits for weapon/skill cooldown reduction.."

right?

I'm not quite sure what your point here is.Arc doesn't dictate rotations, it simply let's you check if you or others are performing them up to standard and assists in the creation of them by providing feedback.

Plenty of skills reduce DPS due to cast times or aftercasts. It's not just not pressing 1. Additionally a lot of DPS builds utilize combos/burst windows, aka creating damage modifiers and then using as many of the highest damage skills available as possible in them.If you don't know the rotation, there is plenty you can do wrong.

The builds and rotations that are on those sites are there because they are the highest DPS achievable to current knowledge.If you came up with something higher, feel free to let the rest of us know.

Bringing Banners is a DPS sacrifice Warriors make to increase Squad DPS, which is all that matters.So yes, not taking Banners should not only result in "still" high personal DPS, but higher.Personal DPS isn't strictly what you take a Banner Warrior for though.

Again, not sure what the point is you are trying to make.

k.

assuming that you bring the Strength and Discipline banners

4 attributes gets to +100..

ok

compare that to berserker stance, which when used will make your adren full (try to know if how many times) and balanced stance (coz if you got CCed by the boss equals no damage). and traits that lengthen the stances (so more fast adrenaline recharge). Berserker Stance will make any conditions on you useless too. (Blind, Weakness, anything that can kitten or prevent damage)

now go to the weapons = reduced recharge means weapon skill is almost being used everytime, yes? make your main weapons (GS/whatever) have reduced recharge

and tactics - 3 - 3 -3

and since your weapon is GS and you slotted the GS cooldown reduction, you have access to Might Makes Right?

Right?

so now compare Berserker Stance + Balanced Stance (on a stance duration increase) versus Str and Disc Banners

and yeah, if the boss is condi heavy inflicting damage gimping/prevention, +400 on the attributes, even when it's shared, is almost incomparable/useless coz your constant uninterrupted damage became 0 with the Bosses condis..

You genuinely have no idea what the role of the Banner Warrior is.

4000 Squad wide Attributes with Banners + 500 from EA, in part needed to crit cap all your DPS's, as well as the CC from Mace/Mace is the main reason to bring pBS to Raids.

If you get constantly CC'ed or are afflicted with Weakness for a substantial amount of time, I a) am not sure what boss that is supposed to be and b) your supports suck.

In terms of Squad DPS and Utility, yes, your suggested build pales in comparison.Making a build that has higher personal DPS as a Banner Warrior is a no brainer, since Banner Warrior isn't strictly a DPS...

k.

you're talking about raids.

im talking about fractals/dungeons.

big difference.

I don't think you know what you are talking about.In Fractals your group even more so relies on you as Warrior to play Mace/Mace as primary CC together with the Renegade, with Axe/Axe being superior for DPS.You won't use that GS unless you know there won't be any Breakbars in the upcoming encounters.For Stab and condi cleanse, again, run a supFB. Together with the Rev being able to swap to Jalis, you will have more Stab than you'll ever need, freeing you to take Banners, which still are a valuable stat increase in 5 man content.

@zionophir.6845 said:and pugging/joining on the fly in raids is fake news. raid guilds sell them.

The fact that there are some raid sellers doesn't mean people aren't pugging Raids, what's your point?

@zionophir.6845 said:and if raid guilds say you must bring banner, you have no choice..

while banner on 5 people is almost negligible.. if all of you have skills that do not kitten your damage, IN ANY WAY...

It's less negligible than everything else you could bring.If you are neither bringing Banners nor Mace/Mace, then there is little reason to bring a pWarrior.

the max damage that i inflict to a Gold Champion boss with GS skill 2 alone, with all the skill boosters (no item booster) like might and vulnerability maxed is 30,000++

so you now know why i am advocating traiting Weapon Cooldown Reduction..

And Axe 5 can do over 100k damage.Not sure what that has to do with anything though...

Considering Hundred Blades has a cast time of 3.5 seconds without quickness and you are doing 30k damage with it, then congratulations, you are contributing less than 9k DPS.

@zionophir.6845 said:in a fractals party, if you spec your character to do 30,000 damage just using 1 skill and self-sustaining, and the other 4 do the same, sharing might and constant @ 25, resistance, stab, inflicting vulnerability, etc.. what do you think will happen?

i asked an oracle about this and she said, "Done in 5 minutes.." she speaks metaphors..

anyway, this is different from rAIDS, where damage is scaled coz you're so many there..

Again, not how DPS works.Your party of 5 would do less DPS at peak times than 1 1/2 DPS of a META group.

There is this program I can highly recommend called ArcDPS, which can greatly help you check your actual performance in terms of DPS, assisting you in improving as player.

This.

The question though is: is it really worth arguing with someone who does not even understand how damage is displayed in this game? I mean that's even below understanding game mechanics. Just let him be Asum. Some people are to far out to reach.

yeah, coz you only base it on numbers right? (thus you use this so called crappy arc dps and it only shows you numbers). you don't even consider how the boss attacks you and how that boss lessens/mitigates your damage..

yeah, and im pretty sure youll say "i played in GW2 beta so all i say is true.."

and ill just lel at you..

Yes we consider dps in regards to boss attacks in mind. That is why we use arcdps, so we can record the damage each member deal while performing mechanics in real time. Nobody actually thinks every class can do their benchmark numbers in every boss fight. Why do you think people use damage meters if not to track it while fighting?

Also we are going way off topic from the starting point, your claim was that as long as you have the highest damage build. You will do max damage. This is fundamentally wrong because a properly executed rotation brings considerably better damage. This does not mean you treat everything on a guide like snowcrow as the gospel because as you said yes, every group is different. I play power reaper, sometimes I bring spectral grasp even though is not max dps, sometimes I take a stunbreak if the situation calls for it, sometimes I take a condi clear if I know there is a lot of condis and our healer can't clear it in time. However none of this invalidates the fact that the importance of rotation.

If you really disagree with this, you have a very fundamental misunderstanding of how this game works.

what wins, highest maxed damage with rotation equal to the one with some weakened damage coz it's not about the maxed damage but i use arcdps?

easy methamatics..

and go apply in a comedy bar..

Your sentence does not make any sense at all.

We talk about highest max damage at the golem because is an easy comparison at a vacuum. That is why even though in theory rifle deadeye has the highest damage potential in the game, it is not the brought everywhere because its performance in fights depends heavily on the boss fight.

We know that your damage will be lower in a fight, people have said this. We know you cannot always execute a perfect rotation in fight. What you can do however is learning how the rotation works so that 1) you can do it if you are not interrupted and 2) if you are interrupted to do mechanics, you know how to pick it back up. What you are not getting at is that arcdps is THE tool that let you know whether or not you are doing this correctly or not. Nobody expect you to do max damage possible compared to a golem, but you are expected to do your best with the rotation with the boss mechanic in mind and arcdps is what allow you to track it.

do you speak english? it's clear.

BASICAlly, i said what is better, maxed damage or weakened damage, both with SAME/EQUAL ROTATIONS?

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Cyninja.2954

Cyninja.2954

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@zionophir.6845 said:

@neven.3785 said:In the past it was possible with one of the common DPS meters used. Also range check that told.you how many enemies are nearby. I left a guild I was a long time member of because they started interrogating members over specific slotted gear pieces or a minor trait choice. I wasn't the target but I'm of firm opinion that it was not how to run a guild especially since it violated terms of service. Other ways to git gud without such tools.

There is a reason those tools where banned and Arc was not. Not sure how that's relevant now.

@zionophir.6845 said:so does arcdps dictate your "Rotation"?

of course you don't just 1111111 the Violet Boss Right? assuming that you've played a single class for how many, 7 years, you don't just 111111 right? there are 9 other skills, right?

and you can even not copy a build using a website and discover by yourselves that there are higher damage build customizations other than the meta builds in the website..

i can just bring a warrior without banners and still damage is still high... its called "traits for weapon/skill cooldown reduction.."

right?

I'm not quite sure what your point here is.Arc doesn't dictate rotations, it simply let's you check if you or others are performing them up to standard and assists in the creation of them by providing feedback.

Plenty of skills reduce DPS due to cast times or aftercasts. It's not just not pressing 1. Additionally a lot of DPS builds utilize combos/burst windows, aka creating damage modifiers and then using as many of the highest damage skills available as possible in them.If you don't know the rotation, there is plenty you can do wrong.

The builds and rotations that are on those sites are there because they are the highest DPS achievable to current knowledge.If you came up with something higher, feel free to let the rest of us know.

Bringing Banners is a DPS sacrifice Warriors make to increase Squad DPS, which is all that matters.So yes, not taking Banners should not only result in "still" high personal DPS, but higher.Personal DPS isn't strictly what you take a Banner Warrior for though.

Again, not sure what the point is you are trying to make.

k.

assuming that you bring the Strength and Discipline banners

4 attributes gets to +100..

ok

compare that to berserker stance, which when used will make your adren full (try to know if how many times) and balanced stance (coz if you got CCed by the boss equals no damage). and traits that lengthen the stances (so more fast adrenaline recharge). Berserker Stance will make any conditions on you useless too. (Blind, Weakness, anything that can kitten or prevent damage)

now go to the weapons = reduced recharge means weapon skill is almost being used everytime, yes? make your main weapons (GS/whatever) have reduced recharge

and tactics - 3 - 3 -3

and since your weapon is GS and you slotted the GS cooldown reduction, you have access to Might Makes Right?

Right?

so now compare Berserker Stance + Balanced Stance (on a stance duration increase) versus Str and Disc Banners

and yeah, if the boss is condi heavy inflicting damage gimping/prevention, +400 on the attributes, even when it's shared, is almost incomparable/useless coz your constant uninterrupted damage became 0 with the Bosses condis..

You genuinely have no idea what the role of the Banner Warrior is.

4000 Squad wide Attributes with Banners + 500 from EA, in part needed to crit cap all your DPS's, as well as the CC from Mace/Mace is the main reason to bring pBS to Raids.

If you get constantly CC'ed or are afflicted with Weakness for a substantial amount of time, I a) am not sure what boss that is supposed to be and b) your supports suck.

In terms of Squad DPS and Utility, yes, your suggested build pales in comparison.Making a build that has higher personal DPS as a Banner Warrior is a no brainer, since Banner Warrior isn't strictly a DPS...

k.

you're talking about raids.

im talking about fractals/dungeons.

big difference.

I don't think you know what you are talking about.In Fractals your group even more so relies on you as Warrior to play Mace/Mace as primary CC together with the Renegade, with Axe/Axe being superior for DPS.You won't use that GS unless you know there won't be any Breakbars in the upcoming encounters.For Stab and condi cleanse, again, run a supFB. Together with the Rev being able to swap to Jalis, you will have more Stab than you'll ever need, freeing you to take Banners, which still are a valuable stat increase in 5 man content.

@zionophir.6845 said:and pugging/joining on the fly in raids is fake news. raid guilds sell them.

The fact that there are some raid sellers doesn't mean people aren't pugging Raids, what's your point?

@zionophir.6845 said:and if raid guilds say you must bring banner, you have no choice..

while banner on 5 people is almost negligible.. if all of you have skills that do not kitten your damage, IN ANY WAY...

It's less negligible than everything else you could bring.If you are neither bringing Banners nor Mace/Mace, then there is little reason to bring a pWarrior.

the max damage that i inflict to a Gold Champion boss with GS skill 2 alone, with all the skill boosters (no item booster) like might and vulnerability maxed is 30,000++

so you now know why i am advocating traiting Weapon Cooldown Reduction..

And Axe 5 can do over 100k damage.Not sure what that has to do with anything though...

Considering Hundred Blades has a cast time of 3.5 seconds without quickness and you are doing 30k damage with it, then congratulations, you are contributing less than 9k DPS.

@zionophir.6845 said:in a fractals party, if you spec your character to do 30,000 damage just using 1 skill and self-sustaining, and the other 4 do the same, sharing might and constant @ 25, resistance, stab, inflicting vulnerability, etc.. what do you think will happen?

i asked an oracle about this and she said, "Done in 5 minutes.." she speaks metaphors..

anyway, this is different from rAIDS, where damage is scaled coz you're so many there..

Again, not how DPS works.Your party of 5 would do less DPS at peak times than 1 1/2 DPS of a META group.

There is this program I can highly recommend called ArcDPS, which can greatly help you check your actual performance in terms of DPS, assisting you in improving as player.

last hit skill 2, on a copper Veteran mob, in WvWvW in 9 might

yfvAivM.jpg

SCALE THAT TO A GOLD BOSS WITH 4 PLAYERS 25 MIGHT MAX VULNERABILITY..

so what's the moral lesson? don't assume that someone is always inventing stuff up..

right, as
um[e]?

and arcdps will make you a pro player? it's akin to cheats that makes a noob feel supremely pro.. sadly, just a feeling..

you're a comedian man. go apply in some comedy bar..

ahahAnd it's still bad^^ (and it will still be bad with 25 mights and vulne^^)Thanks you for the laughter :)

But you know, you're right : we are all noobs and you are the only one here that is good :)

yeah. it's bad yeah?

k.

your sarcastic last sentence felt that you bluffed and still cried inside..

what is 25 - 9 again?

and what is vulnerability?

and can the damage still go up?

WITHOUT BANNERS?

of course..

You do realize, you are not doing any of your arguments any favors right and pretty much any player who has a basic understanding of this game is laughing at you?

You do not understand the difference between single big hits and damage per second (I love when people bring up Warrior Greatsword 2. The skill has always been one of those skills which scales up the damage number done, while always having been a mediocre damage skill. Unfortunately not so smart players usually do not understand what that big number at the end means and how it translates into damage per second. It has been THE ONE defining example of people nut understanding game mechanics and the irony that you brought it up is great).

You do not understand the difference between group damage and solo damage. The entire meta setup for over 4 years has always been designed with 1 thought in mind: which skills bring the overall most damage (or use and utility) to the group. It is this sole approach which makes chronos, druids, firebrands and renegades bring quickness, fury, might and alacrity over pure damage. It's the reason why warriors bring banners and offhand maces (for cc) instead of personal damage skills. It's why a thief might bring Basiliks Venom over Thiefs Guild as elite.

You are the prime example of why arcdps is needed. So players who think they are way smarter and experienced than they are can use arcdps to actually improve. In your case a short trip to the damage golem would be sufficient though.

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zionophir.6845

zionophir.6845

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@maddoctor.2738 said:

@zionophir.6845 said:so what's the moral lesson? don't assume that someone is always inventing stuff up..

Do you know what dps means?It's Damage Per Second, not how much damage you are doing with an attack but how much damage you are doing over a longer period of time.Arcdps will show you how much damage you did over 1 minute or 10 minutes, which is what is important. Otherwise you'd see Thieves showing their Backstab damage and call it a day (spoiler: even though Backstab gets insane high numbers, Dagger/X Thief isn't the top DPS)

11111,skill2,1111,skill3,1111,skill4,1111,skill5 (or apply the right combo/rotation) rinse, repeat with weapon reduction and bonus boost from traits..

tell me what DPS is..

So you still don't know what DPS is...Show us your numbers from an actual fight. Your DPS from the entire rotation. That's what matters.

do i have to know it? is it important? i pve to kill the boss, not to know my dps coz i trust my customizations..

if you pve to know your dps, you shouldve been a statistician or a stock broker..

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Warscythes.9307

Warscythes.9307

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@zionophir.6845 said:

@zionophir.6845 said:so what's the moral lesson? don't assume that someone is always inventing stuff up..

Do you know what dps means?It's Damage Per Second, not how much damage you are doing with an attack but how much damage you are doing over a longer period of time.Arcdps will show you how much damage you did over 1 minute or 10 minutes, which is what is important. Otherwise you'd see Thieves showing their Backstab damage and call it a day (spoiler: even though Backstab gets insane high numbers, Dagger/X Thief isn't the top DPS)

11111,skill2,1111,skill3,1111,skill4,1111,skill5 (or apply the right combo/rotation) rinse, repeat with weapon reduction and weapon bonus boost from traits..

tell me what DPS is..

You want to know the potential dps of every single class in the game?

Sure

https://snowcrows.com/benchmarks/

This list practically all the potentially best raid dps and support build in the game with rotation in video format. So name your class and it will explain to you the correct rotation and build.

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zionophir.6845

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@Cyninja.2954 said:

@neven.3785 said:In the past it was possible with one of the common DPS meters used. Also range check that told.you how many enemies are nearby. I left a guild I was a long time member of because they started interrogating members over specific slotted gear pieces or a minor trait choice. I wasn't the target but I'm of firm opinion that it was not how to run a guild especially since it violated terms of service. Other ways to git gud without such tools.

There is a reason those tools where banned and Arc was not. Not sure how that's relevant now.

@zionophir.6845 said:so does arcdps dictate your "Rotation"?

of course you don't just 1111111 the Violet Boss Right? assuming that you've played a single class for how many, 7 years, you don't just 111111 right? there are 9 other skills, right?

and you can even not copy a build using a website and discover by yourselves that there are higher damage build customizations other than the meta builds in the website..

i can just bring a warrior without banners and still damage is still high... its called "traits for weapon/skill cooldown reduction.."

right?

I'm not quite sure what your point here is.Arc doesn't dictate rotations, it simply let's you check if you or others are performing them up to standard and assists in the creation of them by providing feedback.

Plenty of skills reduce DPS due to cast times or aftercasts. It's not just not pressing 1. Additionally a lot of DPS builds utilize combos/burst windows, aka creating damage modifiers and then using as many of the highest damage skills available as possible in them.If you don't know the rotation, there is plenty you can do wrong.

The builds and rotations that are on those sites are there because they are the highest DPS achievable to current knowledge.If you came up with something higher, feel free to let the rest of us know.

Bringing Banners is a DPS sacrifice Warriors make to increase Squad DPS, which is all that matters.So yes, not taking Banners should not only result in "still" high personal DPS, but higher.Personal DPS isn't strictly what you take a Banner Warrior for though.

Again, not sure what the point is you are trying to make.

k.

assuming that you bring the Strength and Discipline banners

4 attributes gets to +100..

ok

compare that to berserker stance, which when used will make your adren full (try to know if how many times) and balanced stance (coz if you got CCed by the boss equals no damage). and traits that lengthen the stances (so more fast adrenaline recharge). Berserker Stance will make any conditions on you useless too. (Blind, Weakness, anything that can kitten or prevent damage)

now go to the weapons = reduced recharge means weapon skill is almost being used everytime, yes? make your main weapons (GS/whatever) have reduced recharge

and tactics - 3 - 3 -3

and since your weapon is GS and you slotted the GS cooldown reduction, you have access to Might Makes Right?

Right?

so now compare Berserker Stance + Balanced Stance (on a stance duration increase) versus Str and Disc Banners

and yeah, if the boss is condi heavy inflicting damage gimping/prevention, +400 on the attributes, even when it's shared, is almost incomparable/useless coz your constant uninterrupted damage became 0 with the Bosses condis..

You genuinely have no idea what the role of the Banner Warrior is.

4000 Squad wide Attributes with Banners + 500 from EA, in part needed to crit cap all your DPS's, as well as the CC from Mace/Mace is the main reason to bring pBS to Raids.

If you get constantly CC'ed or are afflicted with Weakness for a substantial amount of time, I a) am not sure what boss that is supposed to be and b) your supports suck.

In terms of Squad DPS and Utility, yes, your suggested build pales in comparison.Making a build that has higher personal DPS as a Banner Warrior is a no brainer, since Banner Warrior isn't strictly a DPS...

k.

you're talking about raids.

im talking about fractals/dungeons.

big difference.

I don't think you know what you are talking about.In Fractals your group even more so relies on you as Warrior to play Mace/Mace as primary CC together with the Renegade, with Axe/Axe being superior for DPS.You won't use that GS unless you know there won't be any Breakbars in the upcoming encounters.For Stab and condi cleanse, again, run a supFB. Together with the Rev being able to swap to Jalis, you will have more Stab than you'll ever need, freeing you to take Banners, which still are a valuable stat increase in 5 man content.

@zionophir.6845 said:and pugging/joining on the fly in raids is fake news. raid guilds sell them.

The fact that there are some raid sellers doesn't mean people aren't pugging Raids, what's your point?

@zionophir.6845 said:and if raid guilds say you must bring banner, you have no choice..

while banner on 5 people is almost negligible.. if all of you have skills that do not kitten your damage, IN ANY WAY...

It's less negligible than everything else you could bring.If you are neither bringing Banners nor Mace/Mace, then there is little reason to bring a pWarrior.

the max damage that i inflict to a Gold Champion boss with GS skill 2 alone, with all the skill boosters (no item booster) like might and vulnerability maxed is 30,000++

so you now know why i am advocating traiting Weapon Cooldown Reduction..

And Axe 5 can do over 100k damage.Not sure what that has to do with anything though...

Considering Hundred Blades has a cast time of 3.5 seconds without quickness and you are doing 30k damage with it, then congratulations, you are contributing less than 9k DPS.

@zionophir.6845 said:in a fractals party, if you spec your character to do 30,000 damage just using 1 skill and self-sustaining, and the other 4 do the same, sharing might and constant @ 25, resistance, stab, inflicting vulnerability, etc.. what do you think will happen?

i asked an oracle about this and she said, "Done in 5 minutes.." she speaks metaphors..

anyway, this is different from rAIDS, where damage is scaled coz you're so many there..

Again, not how DPS works.Your party of 5 would do less DPS at peak times than 1 1/2 DPS of a META group.

There is this program I can highly recommend called ArcDPS, which can greatly help you check your actual performance in terms of DPS, assisting you in improving as player.

last hit skill 2, on a copper Veteran mob, in WvWvW in 9 might

yfvAivM.jpg

SCALE THAT TO A GOLD BOSS WITH 4 PLAYERS 25 MIGHT MAX VULNERABILITY..

so what's the moral lesson? don't assume that someone is always inventing stuff up..

right, as
um[e]?

and arcdps will make you a pro player? it's akin to cheats that makes a noob feel supremely pro.. sadly, just a feeling..

you're a comedian man. go apply in some comedy bar..

ahahAnd it's still bad^^ (and it will still be bad with 25 mights and vulne^^)Thanks you for the laughter :)

But you know, you're right : we are all noobs and you are the only one here that is good :)

yeah. it's bad yeah?

k.

your sarcastic last sentence felt that you bluffed and still cried inside..

what is 25 - 9 again?

and what is vulnerability?

and can the damage still go up?

WITHOUT BANNERS?

of course..

You do realize, you are not doing any of your arguments any favors right and pretty much any player who has a basic understanding of this game is laughing at you?

You do not understand the difference between single big hits and damage per second (I love when people bring up Warrior Greatsword 2. The skill has always been one of those skills which scales up the damage number done, while always having been a mediocre damage skill. Unfortunately not so smart players usually do not understand what that big number at the end means and how it translates into damage per second. It has been THE ONE defining example of people nut understanding game mechanics and the irony that you brought it up is great).

You do not understand the difference between group damage and solo damage. The entire meta setup for over 4 years has always been designed with 1 thought in mind: which skills bring the overall most damage (or use and utility) to the group. It is this sole approach which makes chronos, druids, firebrands and renegades bring quickness, fury, might and alacrity over pure damage. It's the reason why warriors bring banners and offhand maces (for cc) instead of personal damage skills. It's why a thief might bring Basiliks Venom over Thiefs Guild as elite.

You are the prime example of why arcdps is needed. So players who think they are way smarter and experienced than they are can use arcdps to actually improve. In your case a short trip to the damage golem would be sufficient though.

i showed you a 15k damage GS on a Vet solo with only 9 might and no vuln on that target and you raise the DPS card and "it's not about one skill with the maxed damage.."

GS 2 is part of DPS calculation am i brite? and with weapon reduction and might per crit hits GS2, what happens to DPS?

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Warscythes.9307

Warscythes.9307

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@zionophir.6845 said:

@neven.3785 said:In the past it was possible with one of the common DPS meters used. Also range check that told.you how many enemies are nearby. I left a guild I was a long time member of because they started interrogating members over specific slotted gear pieces or a minor trait choice. I wasn't the target but I'm of firm opinion that it was not how to run a guild especially since it violated terms of service. Other ways to git gud without such tools.

There is a reason those tools where banned and Arc was not. Not sure how that's relevant now.

@zionophir.6845 said:so does arcdps dictate your "Rotation"?

of course you don't just 1111111 the Violet Boss Right? assuming that you've played a single class for how many, 7 years, you don't just 111111 right? there are 9 other skills, right?

and you can even not copy a build using a website and discover by yourselves that there are higher damage build customizations other than the meta builds in the website..

i can just bring a warrior without banners and still damage is still high... its called "traits for weapon/skill cooldown reduction.."

right?

I'm not quite sure what your point here is.Arc doesn't dictate rotations, it simply let's you check if you or others are performing them up to standard and assists in the creation of them by providing feedback.

Plenty of skills reduce DPS due to cast times or aftercasts. It's not just not pressing 1. Additionally a lot of DPS builds utilize combos/burst windows, aka creating damage modifiers and then using as many of the highest damage skills available as possible in them.If you don't know the rotation, there is plenty you can do wrong.

The builds and rotations that are on those sites are there because they are the highest DPS achievable to current knowledge.If you came up with something higher, feel free to let the rest of us know.

Bringing Banners is a DPS sacrifice Warriors make to increase Squad DPS, which is all that matters.So yes, not taking Banners should not only result in "still" high personal DPS, but higher.Personal DPS isn't strictly what you take a Banner Warrior for though.

Again, not sure what the point is you are trying to make.

k.

assuming that you bring the Strength and Discipline banners

4 attributes gets to +100..

ok

compare that to berserker stance, which when used will make your adren full (try to know if how many times) and balanced stance (coz if you got CCed by the boss equals no damage). and traits that lengthen the stances (so more fast adrenaline recharge). Berserker Stance will make any conditions on you useless too. (Blind, Weakness, anything that can kitten or prevent damage)

now go to the weapons = reduced recharge means weapon skill is almost being used everytime, yes? make your main weapons (GS/whatever) have reduced recharge

and tactics - 3 - 3 -3

and since your weapon is GS and you slotted the GS cooldown reduction, you have access to Might Makes Right?

Right?

so now compare Berserker Stance + Balanced Stance (on a stance duration increase) versus Str and Disc Banners

and yeah, if the boss is condi heavy inflicting damage gimping/prevention, +400 on the attributes, even when it's shared, is almost incomparable/useless coz your constant uninterrupted damage became 0 with the Bosses condis..

You genuinely have no idea what the role of the Banner Warrior is.

4000 Squad wide Attributes with Banners + 500 from EA, in part needed to crit cap all your DPS's, as well as the CC from Mace/Mace is the main reason to bring pBS to Raids.

If you get constantly CC'ed or are afflicted with Weakness for a substantial amount of time, I a) am not sure what boss that is supposed to be and b) your supports suck.

In terms of Squad DPS and Utility, yes, your suggested build pales in comparison.Making a build that has higher personal DPS as a Banner Warrior is a no brainer, since Banner Warrior isn't strictly a DPS...

k.

you're talking about raids.

im talking about fractals/dungeons.

big difference.

I don't think you know what you are talking about.In Fractals your group even more so relies on you as Warrior to play Mace/Mace as primary CC together with the Renegade, with Axe/Axe being superior for DPS.You won't use that GS unless you know there won't be any Breakbars in the upcoming encounters.For Stab and condi cleanse, again, run a supFB. Together with the Rev being able to swap to Jalis, you will have more Stab than you'll ever need, freeing you to take Banners, which still are a valuable stat increase in 5 man content.

@zionophir.6845 said:and pugging/joining on the fly in raids is fake news. raid guilds sell them.

The fact that there are some raid sellers doesn't mean people aren't pugging Raids, what's your point?

@zionophir.6845 said:and if raid guilds say you must bring banner, you have no choice..

while banner on 5 people is almost negligible.. if all of you have skills that do not kitten your damage, IN ANY WAY...

It's less negligible than everything else you could bring.If you are neither bringing Banners nor Mace/Mace, then there is little reason to bring a pWarrior.

the max damage that i inflict to a Gold Champion boss with GS skill 2 alone, with all the skill boosters (no item booster) like might and vulnerability maxed is 30,000++

so you now know why i am advocating traiting Weapon Cooldown Reduction..

And Axe 5 can do over 100k damage.Not sure what that has to do with anything though...

Considering Hundred Blades has a cast time of 3.5 seconds without quickness and you are doing 30k damage with it, then congratulations, you are contributing less than 9k DPS.

@zionophir.6845 said:in a fractals party, if you spec your character to do 30,000 damage just using 1 skill and self-sustaining, and the other 4 do the same, sharing might and constant @ 25, resistance, stab, inflicting vulnerability, etc.. what do you think will happen?

i asked an oracle about this and she said, "Done in 5 minutes.." she speaks metaphors..

anyway, this is different from rAIDS, where damage is scaled coz you're so many there..

Again, not how DPS works.Your party of 5 would do less DPS at peak times than 1 1/2 DPS of a META group.

There is this program I can highly recommend called ArcDPS, which can greatly help you check your actual performance in terms of DPS, assisting you in improving as player.

This.

The question though is: is it really worth arguing with someone who does not even understand how damage is displayed in this game? I mean that's even below understanding game mechanics. Just let him be Asum. Some people are to far out to reach.

yeah, coz you only base it on numbers right? (thus you use this so called crappy arc dps and it only shows you numbers). you don't even consider how the boss attacks you and how that boss lessens/mitigates your damage..

yeah, and im pretty sure youll say "i played in GW2 beta so all i say is true.."

and ill just lel at you..

Yes we consider dps in regards to boss attacks in mind. That is why we use arcdps, so we can record the damage each member deal while performing mechanics in real time. Nobody actually thinks every class can do their benchmark numbers in every boss fight. Why do you think people use damage meters if not to track it while fighting?

Also we are going way off topic from the starting point, your claim was that as long as you have the highest damage build. You will do max damage. This is fundamentally wrong because a properly executed rotation brings considerably better damage. This does not mean you treat everything on a guide like snowcrow as the gospel because as you said yes, every group is different. I play power reaper, sometimes I bring spectral grasp even though is not max dps, sometimes I take a stunbreak if the situation calls for it, sometimes I take a condi clear if I know there is a lot of condis and our healer can't clear it in time. However none of this invalidates the fact that the importance of rotation.

If you really disagree with this, you have a very fundamental misunderstanding of how this game works.

what wins, highest maxed damage with rotation equal to the one with some weakened damage coz it's not about the maxed damage but i use arcdps?

easy methamatics..

and go apply in a comedy bar..

Your sentence does not make any sense at all.

We talk about highest max damage at the golem because is an easy comparison at a vacuum. That is why even though in theory rifle deadeye has the highest damage potential in the game, it is not the brought everywhere because its performance in fights depends heavily on the boss fight.

We know that your damage will be lower in a fight, people have said this. We know you cannot always execute a perfect rotation in fight. What you can do however is learning how the rotation works so that 1) you can do it if you are not interrupted and 2) if you are interrupted to do mechanics, you know how to pick it back up. What you are not getting at is that arcdps is THE tool that let you know whether or not you are doing this correctly or not. Nobody expect you to do max damage possible compared to a golem, but you are expected to do your best with the rotation with the boss mechanic in mind and arcdps is what allow you to track it.

do you speak english? it's clear.

BASICAlly, i said what is better, maxed damage or weakened damage, both with SAME/EQUAL ROTATIONS?

If you have the same rotation with the same build, you would do the same damage under the same circumstance.

What are you talking about?

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Cyninja.2954

Cyninja.2954

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@zionophir.6845 said:

@neven.3785 said:In the past it was possible with one of the common DPS meters used. Also range check that told.you how many enemies are nearby. I left a guild I was a long time member of because they started interrogating members over specific slotted gear pieces or a minor trait choice. I wasn't the target but I'm of firm opinion that it was not how to run a guild especially since it violated terms of service. Other ways to git gud without such tools.

There is a reason those tools where banned and Arc was not. Not sure how that's relevant now.

@zionophir.6845 said:so does arcdps dictate your "Rotation"?

of course you don't just 1111111 the Violet Boss Right? assuming that you've played a single class for how many, 7 years, you don't just 111111 right? there are 9 other skills, right?

and you can even not copy a build using a website and discover by yourselves that there are higher damage build customizations other than the meta builds in the website..

i can just bring a warrior without banners and still damage is still high... its called "traits for weapon/skill cooldown reduction.."

right?

I'm not quite sure what your point here is.Arc doesn't dictate rotations, it simply let's you check if you or others are performing them up to standard and assists in the creation of them by providing feedback.

Plenty of skills reduce DPS due to cast times or aftercasts. It's not just not pressing 1. Additionally a lot of DPS builds utilize combos/burst windows, aka creating damage modifiers and then using as many of the highest damage skills available as possible in them.If you don't know the rotation, there is plenty you can do wrong.

The builds and rotations that are on those sites are there because they are the highest DPS achievable to current knowledge.If you came up with something higher, feel free to let the rest of us know.

Bringing Banners is a DPS sacrifice Warriors make to increase Squad DPS, which is all that matters.So yes, not taking Banners should not only result in "still" high personal DPS, but higher.Personal DPS isn't strictly what you take a Banner Warrior for though.

Again, not sure what the point is you are trying to make.

k.

assuming that you bring the Strength and Discipline banners

4 attributes gets to +100..

ok

compare that to berserker stance, which when used will make your adren full (try to know if how many times) and balanced stance (coz if you got CCed by the boss equals no damage). and traits that lengthen the stances (so more fast adrenaline recharge). Berserker Stance will make any conditions on you useless too. (Blind, Weakness, anything that can kitten or prevent damage)

now go to the weapons = reduced recharge means weapon skill is almost being used everytime, yes? make your main weapons (GS/whatever) have reduced recharge

and tactics - 3 - 3 -3

and since your weapon is GS and you slotted the GS cooldown reduction, you have access to Might Makes Right?

Right?

so now compare Berserker Stance + Balanced Stance (on a stance duration increase) versus Str and Disc Banners

and yeah, if the boss is condi heavy inflicting damage gimping/prevention, +400 on the attributes, even when it's shared, is almost incomparable/useless coz your constant uninterrupted damage became 0 with the Bosses condis..

You genuinely have no idea what the role of the Banner Warrior is.

4000 Squad wide Attributes with Banners + 500 from EA, in part needed to crit cap all your DPS's, as well as the CC from Mace/Mace is the main reason to bring pBS to Raids.

If you get constantly CC'ed or are afflicted with Weakness for a substantial amount of time, I a) am not sure what boss that is supposed to be and b) your supports suck.

In terms of Squad DPS and Utility, yes, your suggested build pales in comparison.Making a build that has higher personal DPS as a Banner Warrior is a no brainer, since Banner Warrior isn't strictly a DPS...

k.

you're talking about raids.

im talking about fractals/dungeons.

big difference.

I don't think you know what you are talking about.In Fractals your group even more so relies on you as Warrior to play Mace/Mace as primary CC together with the Renegade, with Axe/Axe being superior for DPS.You won't use that GS unless you know there won't be any Breakbars in the upcoming encounters.For Stab and condi cleanse, again, run a supFB. Together with the Rev being able to swap to Jalis, you will have more Stab than you'll ever need, freeing you to take Banners, which still are a valuable stat increase in 5 man content.

@zionophir.6845 said:and pugging/joining on the fly in raids is fake news. raid guilds sell them.

The fact that there are some raid sellers doesn't mean people aren't pugging Raids, what's your point?

@zionophir.6845 said:and if raid guilds say you must bring banner, you have no choice..

while banner on 5 people is almost negligible.. if all of you have skills that do not kitten your damage, IN ANY WAY...

It's less negligible than everything else you could bring.If you are neither bringing Banners nor Mace/Mace, then there is little reason to bring a pWarrior.

the max damage that i inflict to a Gold Champion boss with GS skill 2 alone, with all the skill boosters (no item booster) like might and vulnerability maxed is 30,000++

so you now know why i am advocating traiting Weapon Cooldown Reduction..

And Axe 5 can do over 100k damage.Not sure what that has to do with anything though...

Considering Hundred Blades has a cast time of 3.5 seconds without quickness and you are doing 30k damage with it, then congratulations, you are contributing less than 9k DPS.

@zionophir.6845 said:in a fractals party, if you spec your character to do 30,000 damage just using 1 skill and self-sustaining, and the other 4 do the same, sharing might and constant @ 25, resistance, stab, inflicting vulnerability, etc.. what do you think will happen?

i asked an oracle about this and she said, "Done in 5 minutes.." she speaks metaphors..

anyway, this is different from rAIDS, where damage is scaled coz you're so many there..

Again, not how DPS works.Your party of 5 would do less DPS at peak times than 1 1/2 DPS of a META group.

There is this program I can highly recommend called ArcDPS, which can greatly help you check your actual performance in terms of DPS, assisting you in improving as player.

last hit skill 2, on a copper Veteran mob, in WvWvW in 9 might

yfvAivM.jpg

SCALE THAT TO A GOLD BOSS WITH 4 PLAYERS 25 MIGHT MAX VULNERABILITY..

so what's the moral lesson? don't assume that someone is always inventing stuff up..

right, as
um[e]?

and arcdps will make you a pro player? it's akin to cheats that makes a noob feel supremely pro.. sadly, just a feeling..

you're a comedian man. go apply in some comedy bar..

ahahAnd it's still bad^^ (and it will still be bad with 25 mights and vulne^^)Thanks you for the laughter :)

But you know, you're right : we are all noobs and you are the only one here that is good :)

yeah. it's bad yeah?

k.

your sarcastic last sentence felt that you bluffed and still cried inside..

what is 25 - 9 again?

and what is vulnerability?

and can the damage still go up?

WITHOUT BANNERS?

of course..

You do realize, you are not doing any of your arguments any favors right and pretty much any player who has a basic understanding of this game is laughing at you?

You do not understand the difference between single big hits and damage per second (I love when people bring up Warrior Greatsword 2. The skill has always been one of those skills which scales up the damage number done, while always having been a mediocre damage skill. Unfortunately not so smart players usually do not understand what that big number at the end means and how it translates into damage per second. It has been THE ONE defining example of people nut understanding game mechanics and the irony that you brought it up is great).

You do not understand the difference between group damage and solo damage. The entire meta setup for over 4 years has always been designed with 1 thought in mind: which skills bring the overall most damage (or use and utility) to the group. It is this sole approach which makes chronos, druids, firebrands and renegades bring quickness, fury, might and alacrity over pure damage. It's the reason why warriors bring banners and offhand maces (for cc) instead of personal damage skills. It's why a thief might bring Basiliks Venom over Thiefs Guild as elite.

You are the prime example of why arcdps is needed. So players who think they are way smarter and experienced than they are can use arcdps to actually improve. In your case a short trip to the damage golem would be sufficient though.

i showed you a 15k damage GS on a Vet solo with only 9 might and no vuln on that target and you raise the DPS card and "it's not about the maxed damage.."

GS 2 is part of DPS calculation am i brite? and with weapon reduction and might per crit hits GS2, what happens to DPS?

Greatsword 2 is a 3.5 second attack (https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Hundred_Blades).

Warrior benchmarks at around 32.5k damage per second as damage dealer. Your Greatsword 2 would have to do 113,750 damage in those 3.5 seconds (3.5x 32.5k). That 15k single hit is useless information. A top performing warrior does twice that damage PER SECOND.

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zionophir.6845

zionophir.6845

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@Warscythes.9307 said:

@neven.3785 said:In the past it was possible with one of the common DPS meters used. Also range check that told.you how many enemies are nearby. I left a guild I was a long time member of because they started interrogating members over specific slotted gear pieces or a minor trait choice. I wasn't the target but I'm of firm opinion that it was not how to run a guild especially since it violated terms of service. Other ways to git gud without such tools.

There is a reason those tools where banned and Arc was not. Not sure how that's relevant now.

@zionophir.6845 said:so does arcdps dictate your "Rotation"?

of course you don't just 1111111 the Violet Boss Right? assuming that you've played a single class for how many, 7 years, you don't just 111111 right? there are 9 other skills, right?

and you can even not copy a build using a website and discover by yourselves that there are higher damage build customizations other than the meta builds in the website..

i can just bring a warrior without banners and still damage is still high... its called "traits for weapon/skill cooldown reduction.."

right?

I'm not quite sure what your point here is.Arc doesn't dictate rotations, it simply let's you check if you or others are performing them up to standard and assists in the creation of them by providing feedback.

Plenty of skills reduce DPS due to cast times or aftercasts. It's not just not pressing 1. Additionally a lot of DPS builds utilize combos/burst windows, aka creating damage modifiers and then using as many of the highest damage skills available as possible in them.If you don't know the rotation, there is plenty you can do wrong.

The builds and rotations that are on those sites are there because they are the highest DPS achievable to current knowledge.If you came up with something higher, feel free to let the rest of us know.

Bringing Banners is a DPS sacrifice Warriors make to increase Squad DPS, which is all that matters.So yes, not taking Banners should not only result in "still" high personal DPS, but higher.Personal DPS isn't strictly what you take a Banner Warrior for though.

Again, not sure what the point is you are trying to make.

k.

assuming that you bring the Strength and Discipline banners

4 attributes gets to +100..

ok

compare that to berserker stance, which when used will make your adren full (try to know if how many times) and balanced stance (coz if you got CCed by the boss equals no damage). and traits that lengthen the stances (so more fast adrenaline recharge). Berserker Stance will make any conditions on you useless too. (Blind, Weakness, anything that can kitten or prevent damage)

now go to the weapons = reduced recharge means weapon skill is almost being used everytime, yes? make your main weapons (GS/whatever) have reduced recharge

and tactics - 3 - 3 -3

and since your weapon is GS and you slotted the GS cooldown reduction, you have access to Might Makes Right?

Right?

so now compare Berserker Stance + Balanced Stance (on a stance duration increase) versus Str and Disc Banners

and yeah, if the boss is condi heavy inflicting damage gimping/prevention, +400 on the attributes, even when it's shared, is almost incomparable/useless coz your constant uninterrupted damage became 0 with the Bosses condis..

You genuinely have no idea what the role of the Banner Warrior is.

4000 Squad wide Attributes with Banners + 500 from EA, in part needed to crit cap all your DPS's, as well as the CC from Mace/Mace is the main reason to bring pBS to Raids.

If you get constantly CC'ed or are afflicted with Weakness for a substantial amount of time, I a) am not sure what boss that is supposed to be and b) your supports suck.

In terms of Squad DPS and Utility, yes, your suggested build pales in comparison.Making a build that has higher personal DPS as a Banner Warrior is a no brainer, since Banner Warrior isn't strictly a DPS...

k.

you're talking about raids.

im talking about fractals/dungeons.

big difference.

I don't think you know what you are talking about.In Fractals your group even more so relies on you as Warrior to play Mace/Mace as primary CC together with the Renegade, with Axe/Axe being superior for DPS.You won't use that GS unless you know there won't be any Breakbars in the upcoming encounters.For Stab and condi cleanse, again, run a supFB. Together with the Rev being able to swap to Jalis, you will have more Stab than you'll ever need, freeing you to take Banners, which still are a valuable stat increase in 5 man content.

@zionophir.6845 said:and pugging/joining on the fly in raids is fake news. raid guilds sell them.

The fact that there are some raid sellers doesn't mean people aren't pugging Raids, what's your point?

@zionophir.6845 said:and if raid guilds say you must bring banner, you have no choice..

while banner on 5 people is almost negligible.. if all of you have skills that do not kitten your damage, IN ANY WAY...

It's less negligible than everything else you could bring.If you are neither bringing Banners nor Mace/Mace, then there is little reason to bring a pWarrior.

the max damage that i inflict to a Gold Champion boss with GS skill 2 alone, with all the skill boosters (no item booster) like might and vulnerability maxed is 30,000++

so you now know why i am advocating traiting Weapon Cooldown Reduction..

And Axe 5 can do over 100k damage.Not sure what that has to do with anything though...

Considering Hundred Blades has a cast time of 3.5 seconds without quickness and you are doing 30k damage with it, then congratulations, you are contributing less than 9k DPS.

@zionophir.6845 said:in a fractals party, if you spec your character to do 30,000 damage just using 1 skill and self-sustaining, and the other 4 do the same, sharing might and constant @ 25, resistance, stab, inflicting vulnerability, etc.. what do you think will happen?

i asked an oracle about this and she said, "Done in 5 minutes.." she speaks metaphors..

anyway, this is different from rAIDS, where damage is scaled coz you're so many there..

Again, not how DPS works.Your party of 5 would do less DPS at peak times than 1 1/2 DPS of a META group.

There is this program I can highly recommend called ArcDPS, which can greatly help you check your actual performance in terms of DPS, assisting you in improving as player.

This.

The question though is: is it really worth arguing with someone who does not even understand how damage is displayed in this game? I mean that's even below understanding game mechanics. Just let him be Asum. Some people are to far out to reach.

yeah, coz you only base it on numbers right? (thus you use this so called crappy arc dps and it only shows you numbers). you don't even consider how the boss attacks you and how that boss lessens/mitigates your damage..

yeah, and im pretty sure youll say "i played in GW2 beta so all i say is true.."

and ill just lel at you..

Yes we consider dps in regards to boss attacks in mind. That is why we use arcdps, so we can record the damage each member deal while performing mechanics in real time. Nobody actually thinks every class can do their benchmark numbers in every boss fight. Why do you think people use damage meters if not to track it while fighting?

Also we are going way off topic from the starting point, your claim was that as long as you have the highest damage build. You will do max damage. This is fundamentally wrong because a properly executed rotation brings considerably better damage. This does not mean you treat everything on a guide like snowcrow as the gospel because as you said yes, every group is different. I play power reaper, sometimes I bring spectral grasp even though is not max dps, sometimes I take a stunbreak if the situation calls for it, sometimes I take a condi clear if I know there is a lot of condis and our healer can't clear it in time. However none of this invalidates the fact that the importance of rotation.

If you really disagree with this, you have a very fundamental misunderstanding of how this game works.

what wins, highest maxed damage with rotation equal to the one with some weakened damage coz it's not about the maxed damage but i use arcdps?

easy methamatics..

and go apply in a comedy bar..

Your sentence does not make any sense at all.

We talk about highest max damage at the golem because is an easy comparison at a vacuum. That is why even though in theory rifle deadeye has the highest damage potential in the game, it is not the brought everywhere because its performance in fights depends heavily on the boss fight.

We know that your damage will be lower in a fight, people have said this. We know you cannot always execute a perfect rotation in fight. What you can do however is learning how the rotation works so that 1) you can do it if you are not interrupted and 2) if you are interrupted to do mechanics, you know how to pick it back up. What you are not getting at is that arcdps is THE tool that let you know whether or not you are doing this correctly or not. Nobody expect you to do max damage possible compared to a golem, but you are expected to do your best with the rotation with the boss mechanic in mind and arcdps is what allow you to track it.

do you speak english? it's clear.

BASICAlly, i said what is better, maxed damage or weakened damage, both with SAME/EQUAL ROTATIONS?

If you have the same rotation with the same build, you would do the same damage under the circumstance.

What are you talking about?

while some of your game is laughing at me, i am currently laughing at you and I pity you at the same time..

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maddoctor.2738

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@zionophir.6845 said:do i have to know it? is it important? i pve to kill the boss, not to know my dps coz i trust my customizations..

if you pve to know your dps, you shouldve been a statistician or a stock broker..

You can go to Lion's Arch Aerodrome there is a portal to the special forces training area. Spawn an average golem and do your rotation there. Post an image with your dps it is shown automatically there, you don't need arcdps.

i showed you a 15k damage GS on a Vet solo

This is useless. 15k damage is pathetic low and it's only one hit. Show us your actual dps on the training golem instead. After all, you posted the rotation: 11111,skill2,1111,skill3,1111,skill4,1111,skill5 so you must know how to actually use it in combat. Go on then show us how much dps you do

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@Cyninja.2954 said:

@neven.3785 said:In the past it was possible with one of the common DPS meters used. Also range check that told.you how many enemies are nearby. I left a guild I was a long time member of because they started interrogating members over specific slotted gear pieces or a minor trait choice. I wasn't the target but I'm of firm opinion that it was not how to run a guild especially since it violated terms of service. Other ways to git gud without such tools.

There is a reason those tools where banned and Arc was not. Not sure how that's relevant now.

@zionophir.6845 said:so does arcdps dictate your "Rotation"?

of course you don't just 1111111 the Violet Boss Right? assuming that you've played a single class for how many, 7 years, you don't just 111111 right? there are 9 other skills, right?

and you can even not copy a build using a website and discover by yourselves that there are higher damage build customizations other than the meta builds in the website..

i can just bring a warrior without banners and still damage is still high... its called "traits for weapon/skill cooldown reduction.."

right?

I'm not quite sure what your point here is.Arc doesn't dictate rotations, it simply let's you check if you or others are performing them up to standard and assists in the creation of them by providing feedback.

Plenty of skills reduce DPS due to cast times or aftercasts. It's not just not pressing 1. Additionally a lot of DPS builds utilize combos/burst windows, aka creating damage modifiers and then using as many of the highest damage skills available as possible in them.If you don't know the rotation, there is plenty you can do wrong.

The builds and rotations that are on those sites are there because they are the highest DPS achievable to current knowledge.If you came up with something higher, feel free to let the rest of us know.

Bringing Banners is a DPS sacrifice Warriors make to increase Squad DPS, which is all that matters.So yes, not taking Banners should not only result in "still" high personal DPS, but higher.Personal DPS isn't strictly what you take a Banner Warrior for though.

Again, not sure what the point is you are trying to make.

k.

assuming that you bring the Strength and Discipline banners

4 attributes gets to +100..

ok

compare that to berserker stance, which when used will make your adren full (try to know if how many times) and balanced stance (coz if you got CCed by the boss equals no damage). and traits that lengthen the stances (so more fast adrenaline recharge). Berserker Stance will make any conditions on you useless too. (Blind, Weakness, anything that can kitten or prevent damage)

now go to the weapons = reduced recharge means weapon skill is almost being used everytime, yes? make your main weapons (GS/whatever) have reduced recharge

and tactics - 3 - 3 -3

and since your weapon is GS and you slotted the GS cooldown reduction, you have access to Might Makes Right?

Right?

so now compare Berserker Stance + Balanced Stance (on a stance duration increase) versus Str and Disc Banners

and yeah, if the boss is condi heavy inflicting damage gimping/prevention, +400 on the attributes, even when it's shared, is almost incomparable/useless coz your constant uninterrupted damage became 0 with the Bosses condis..

You genuinely have no idea what the role of the Banner Warrior is.

4000 Squad wide Attributes with Banners + 500 from EA, in part needed to crit cap all your DPS's, as well as the CC from Mace/Mace is the main reason to bring pBS to Raids.

If you get constantly CC'ed or are afflicted with Weakness for a substantial amount of time, I a) am not sure what boss that is supposed to be and b) your supports suck.

In terms of Squad DPS and Utility, yes, your suggested build pales in comparison.Making a build that has higher personal DPS as a Banner Warrior is a no brainer, since Banner Warrior isn't strictly a DPS...

k.

you're talking about raids.

im talking about fractals/dungeons.

big difference.

I don't think you know what you are talking about.In Fractals your group even more so relies on you as Warrior to play Mace/Mace as primary CC together with the Renegade, with Axe/Axe being superior for DPS.You won't use that GS unless you know there won't be any Breakbars in the upcoming encounters.For Stab and condi cleanse, again, run a supFB. Together with the Rev being able to swap to Jalis, you will have more Stab than you'll ever need, freeing you to take Banners, which still are a valuable stat increase in 5 man content.

@zionophir.6845 said:and pugging/joining on the fly in raids is fake news. raid guilds sell them.

The fact that there are some raid sellers doesn't mean people aren't pugging Raids, what's your point?

@zionophir.6845 said:and if raid guilds say you must bring banner, you have no choice..

while banner on 5 people is almost negligible.. if all of you have skills that do not kitten your damage, IN ANY WAY...

It's less negligible than everything else you could bring.If you are neither bringing Banners nor Mace/Mace, then there is little reason to bring a pWarrior.

the max damage that i inflict to a Gold Champion boss with GS skill 2 alone, with all the skill boosters (no item booster) like might and vulnerability maxed is 30,000++

so you now know why i am advocating traiting Weapon Cooldown Reduction..

And Axe 5 can do over 100k damage.Not sure what that has to do with anything though...

Considering Hundred Blades has a cast time of 3.5 seconds without quickness and you are doing 30k damage with it, then congratulations, you are contributing less than 9k DPS.

@zionophir.6845 said:in a fractals party, if you spec your character to do 30,000 damage just using 1 skill and self-sustaining, and the other 4 do the same, sharing might and constant @ 25, resistance, stab, inflicting vulnerability, etc.. what do you think will happen?

i asked an oracle about this and she said, "Done in 5 minutes.." she speaks metaphors..

anyway, this is different from rAIDS, where damage is scaled coz you're so many there..

Again, not how DPS works.Your party of 5 would do less DPS at peak times than 1 1/2 DPS of a META group.

There is this program I can highly recommend called ArcDPS, which can greatly help you check your actual performance in terms of DPS, assisting you in improving as player.

last hit skill 2, on a copper Veteran mob, in WvWvW in 9 might

yfvAivM.jpg

SCALE THAT TO A GOLD BOSS WITH 4 PLAYERS 25 MIGHT MAX VULNERABILITY..

so what's the moral lesson? don't assume that someone is always inventing stuff up..

right, as
um[e]?

and arcdps will make you a pro player? it's akin to cheats that makes a noob feel supremely pro.. sadly, just a feeling..

you're a comedian man. go apply in some comedy bar..

ahahAnd it's still bad^^ (and it will still be bad with 25 mights and vulne^^)Thanks you for the laughter :)

But you know, you're right : we are all noobs and you are the only one here that is good :)

yeah. it's bad yeah?

k.

your sarcastic last sentence felt that you bluffed and still cried inside..

what is 25 - 9 again?

and what is vulnerability?

and can the damage still go up?

WITHOUT BANNERS?

of course..

You do realize, you are not doing any of your arguments any favors right and pretty much any player who has a basic understanding of this game is laughing at you?

You do not understand the difference between single big hits and damage per second (I love when people bring up Warrior Greatsword 2. The skill has always been one of those skills which scales up the damage number done, while always having been a mediocre damage skill. Unfortunately not so smart players usually do not understand what that big number at the end means and how it translates into damage per second. It has been THE ONE defining example of people nut understanding game mechanics and the irony that you brought it up is great).

You do not understand the difference between group damage and solo damage. The entire meta setup for over 4 years has always been designed with 1 thought in mind: which skills bring the overall most damage (or use and utility) to the group. It is this sole approach which makes chronos, druids, firebrands and renegades bring quickness, fury, might and alacrity over pure damage. It's the reason why warriors bring banners and offhand maces (for cc) instead of personal damage skills. It's why a thief might bring Basiliks Venom over Thiefs Guild as elite.

You are the prime example of why arcdps is needed. So players who think they are way smarter and experienced than they are can use arcdps to actually improve. In your case a short trip to the damage golem would be sufficient though.

i showed you a 15k damage GS on a Vet solo with only 9 might and no vuln on that target and you raise the DPS card and "it's not about the maxed damage.."

GS 2 is part of DPS calculation am i brite? and with weapon reduction and might per crit hits GS2, what happens to DPS?

Greatsword 2 is a 3.5 second attack (
).

Warrior benchmarks at around 32.5k as damage dealer. Your Greatsword 2 would have to do 113,750 damage in those 3.5 seconds (3.5x 32.5k). That 15k single hit is useless information. A top performing warrior does twice that damage PER SECOND.

K, show me 113,750 and you and your gang wins this thread. hit a veteran guard, in wvwvw. no banners. GS 2 only..

you have 1 day to do that..

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Cyninja.2954

Cyninja.2954

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@zionophir.6845 said:

@neven.3785 said:In the past it was possible with one of the common DPS meters used. Also range check that told.you how many enemies are nearby. I left a guild I was a long time member of because they started interrogating members over specific slotted gear pieces or a minor trait choice. I wasn't the target but I'm of firm opinion that it was not how to run a guild especially since it violated terms of service. Other ways to git gud without such tools.

There is a reason those tools where banned and Arc was not. Not sure how that's relevant now.

@zionophir.6845 said:so does arcdps dictate your "Rotation"?

of course you don't just 1111111 the Violet Boss Right? assuming that you've played a single class for how many, 7 years, you don't just 111111 right? there are 9 other skills, right?

and you can even not copy a build using a website and discover by yourselves that there are higher damage build customizations other than the meta builds in the website..

i can just bring a warrior without banners and still damage is still high... its called "traits for weapon/skill cooldown reduction.."

right?

I'm not quite sure what your point here is.Arc doesn't dictate rotations, it simply let's you check if you or others are performing them up to standard and assists in the creation of them by providing feedback.

Plenty of skills reduce DPS due to cast times or aftercasts. It's not just not pressing 1. Additionally a lot of DPS builds utilize combos/burst windows, aka creating damage modifiers and then using as many of the highest damage skills available as possible in them.If you don't know the rotation, there is plenty you can do wrong.

The builds and rotations that are on those sites are there because they are the highest DPS achievable to current knowledge.If you came up with something higher, feel free to let the rest of us know.

Bringing Banners is a DPS sacrifice Warriors make to increase Squad DPS, which is all that matters.So yes, not taking Banners should not only result in "still" high personal DPS, but higher.Personal DPS isn't strictly what you take a Banner Warrior for though.

Again, not sure what the point is you are trying to make.

k.

assuming that you bring the Strength and Discipline banners

4 attributes gets to +100..

ok

compare that to berserker stance, which when used will make your adren full (try to know if how many times) and balanced stance (coz if you got CCed by the boss equals no damage). and traits that lengthen the stances (so more fast adrenaline recharge). Berserker Stance will make any conditions on you useless too. (Blind, Weakness, anything that can kitten or prevent damage)

now go to the weapons = reduced recharge means weapon skill is almost being used everytime, yes? make your main weapons (GS/whatever) have reduced recharge

and tactics - 3 - 3 -3

and since your weapon is GS and you slotted the GS cooldown reduction, you have access to Might Makes Right?

Right?

so now compare Berserker Stance + Balanced Stance (on a stance duration increase) versus Str and Disc Banners

and yeah, if the boss is condi heavy inflicting damage gimping/prevention, +400 on the attributes, even when it's shared, is almost incomparable/useless coz your constant uninterrupted damage became 0 with the Bosses condis..

You genuinely have no idea what the role of the Banner Warrior is.

4000 Squad wide Attributes with Banners + 500 from EA, in part needed to crit cap all your DPS's, as well as the CC from Mace/Mace is the main reason to bring pBS to Raids.

If you get constantly CC'ed or are afflicted with Weakness for a substantial amount of time, I a) am not sure what boss that is supposed to be and b) your supports suck.

In terms of Squad DPS and Utility, yes, your suggested build pales in comparison.Making a build that has higher personal DPS as a Banner Warrior is a no brainer, since Banner Warrior isn't strictly a DPS...

k.

you're talking about raids.

im talking about fractals/dungeons.

big difference.

I don't think you know what you are talking about.In Fractals your group even more so relies on you as Warrior to play Mace/Mace as primary CC together with the Renegade, with Axe/Axe being superior for DPS.You won't use that GS unless you know there won't be any Breakbars in the upcoming encounters.For Stab and condi cleanse, again, run a supFB. Together with the Rev being able to swap to Jalis, you will have more Stab than you'll ever need, freeing you to take Banners, which still are a valuable stat increase in 5 man content.

@zionophir.6845 said:and pugging/joining on the fly in raids is fake news. raid guilds sell them.

The fact that there are some raid sellers doesn't mean people aren't pugging Raids, what's your point?

@zionophir.6845 said:and if raid guilds say you must bring banner, you have no choice..

while banner on 5 people is almost negligible.. if all of you have skills that do not kitten your damage, IN ANY WAY...

It's less negligible than everything else you could bring.If you are neither bringing Banners nor Mace/Mace, then there is little reason to bring a pWarrior.

the max damage that i inflict to a Gold Champion boss with GS skill 2 alone, with all the skill boosters (no item booster) like might and vulnerability maxed is 30,000++

so you now know why i am advocating traiting Weapon Cooldown Reduction..

And Axe 5 can do over 100k damage.Not sure what that has to do with anything though...

Considering Hundred Blades has a cast time of 3.5 seconds without quickness and you are doing 30k damage with it, then congratulations, you are contributing less than 9k DPS.

@zionophir.6845 said:in a fractals party, if you spec your character to do 30,000 damage just using 1 skill and self-sustaining, and the other 4 do the same, sharing might and constant @ 25, resistance, stab, inflicting vulnerability, etc.. what do you think will happen?

i asked an oracle about this and she said, "Done in 5 minutes.." she speaks metaphors..

anyway, this is different from rAIDS, where damage is scaled coz you're so many there..

Again, not how DPS works.Your party of 5 would do less DPS at peak times than 1 1/2 DPS of a META group.

There is this program I can highly recommend called ArcDPS, which can greatly help you check your actual performance in terms of DPS, assisting you in improving as player.

last hit skill 2, on a copper Veteran mob, in WvWvW in 9 might

yfvAivM.jpg

SCALE THAT TO A GOLD BOSS WITH 4 PLAYERS 25 MIGHT MAX VULNERABILITY..

so what's the moral lesson? don't assume that someone is always inventing stuff up..

right, as
um[e]?

and arcdps will make you a pro player? it's akin to cheats that makes a noob feel supremely pro.. sadly, just a feeling..

you're a comedian man. go apply in some comedy bar..

ahahAnd it's still bad^^ (and it will still be bad with 25 mights and vulne^^)Thanks you for the laughter :)

But you know, you're right : we are all noobs and you are the only one here that is good :)

yeah. it's bad yeah?

k.

your sarcastic last sentence felt that you bluffed and still cried inside..

what is 25 - 9 again?

and what is vulnerability?

and can the damage still go up?

WITHOUT BANNERS?

of course..

You do realize, you are not doing any of your arguments any favors right and pretty much any player who has a basic understanding of this game is laughing at you?

You do not understand the difference between single big hits and damage per second (I love when people bring up Warrior Greatsword 2. The skill has always been one of those skills which scales up the damage number done, while always having been a mediocre damage skill. Unfortunately not so smart players usually do not understand what that big number at the end means and how it translates into damage per second. It has been THE ONE defining example of people nut understanding game mechanics and the irony that you brought it up is great).

You do not understand the difference between group damage and solo damage. The entire meta setup for over 4 years has always been designed with 1 thought in mind: which skills bring the overall most damage (or use and utility) to the group. It is this sole approach which makes chronos, druids, firebrands and renegades bring quickness, fury, might and alacrity over pure damage. It's the reason why warriors bring banners and offhand maces (for cc) instead of personal damage skills. It's why a thief might bring Basiliks Venom over Thiefs Guild as elite.

You are the prime example of why arcdps is needed. So players who think they are way smarter and experienced than they are can use arcdps to actually improve. In your case a short trip to the damage golem would be sufficient though.

i showed you a 15k damage GS on a Vet solo with only 9 might and no vuln on that target and you raise the DPS card and "it's not about the maxed damage.."

GS 2 is part of DPS calculation am i brite? and with weapon reduction and might per crit hits GS2, what happens to DPS?

Greatsword 2 is a 3.5 second attack (
).

Warrior benchmarks at around 32.5k as damage dealer. Your Greatsword 2 would have to do 113,750 damage in those 3.5 seconds (3.5x 32.5k). That 15k single hit is useless information. A top performing warrior does twice that damage PER SECOND.

K, show me 113,750 and you and your gang wins this thread. hit a veteran guard, in wvwvw. no banners.

Watch that video. He breaks 100k damage displayed consistently with attacks which do not take 3.5 seconds.

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Warscythes.9307

Warscythes.9307

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@zionophir.6845 said:

@neven.3785 said:In the past it was possible with one of the common DPS meters used. Also range check that told.you how many enemies are nearby. I left a guild I was a long time member of because they started interrogating members over specific slotted gear pieces or a minor trait choice. I wasn't the target but I'm of firm opinion that it was not how to run a guild especially since it violated terms of service. Other ways to git gud without such tools.

There is a reason those tools where banned and Arc was not. Not sure how that's relevant now.

@zionophir.6845 said:so does arcdps dictate your "Rotation"?

of course you don't just 1111111 the Violet Boss Right? assuming that you've played a single class for how many, 7 years, you don't just 111111 right? there are 9 other skills, right?

and you can even not copy a build using a website and discover by yourselves that there are higher damage build customizations other than the meta builds in the website..

i can just bring a warrior without banners and still damage is still high... its called "traits for weapon/skill cooldown reduction.."

right?

I'm not quite sure what your point here is.Arc doesn't dictate rotations, it simply let's you check if you or others are performing them up to standard and assists in the creation of them by providing feedback.

Plenty of skills reduce DPS due to cast times or aftercasts. It's not just not pressing 1. Additionally a lot of DPS builds utilize combos/burst windows, aka creating damage modifiers and then using as many of the highest damage skills available as possible in them.If you don't know the rotation, there is plenty you can do wrong.

The builds and rotations that are on those sites are there because they are the highest DPS achievable to current knowledge.If you came up with something higher, feel free to let the rest of us know.

Bringing Banners is a DPS sacrifice Warriors make to increase Squad DPS, which is all that matters.So yes, not taking Banners should not only result in "still" high personal DPS, but higher.Personal DPS isn't strictly what you take a Banner Warrior for though.

Again, not sure what the point is you are trying to make.

k.

assuming that you bring the Strength and Discipline banners

4 attributes gets to +100..

ok

compare that to berserker stance, which when used will make your adren full (try to know if how many times) and balanced stance (coz if you got CCed by the boss equals no damage). and traits that lengthen the stances (so more fast adrenaline recharge). Berserker Stance will make any conditions on you useless too. (Blind, Weakness, anything that can kitten or prevent damage)

now go to the weapons = reduced recharge means weapon skill is almost being used everytime, yes? make your main weapons (GS/whatever) have reduced recharge

and tactics - 3 - 3 -3

and since your weapon is GS and you slotted the GS cooldown reduction, you have access to Might Makes Right?

Right?

so now compare Berserker Stance + Balanced Stance (on a stance duration increase) versus Str and Disc Banners

and yeah, if the boss is condi heavy inflicting damage gimping/prevention, +400 on the attributes, even when it's shared, is almost incomparable/useless coz your constant uninterrupted damage became 0 with the Bosses condis..

You genuinely have no idea what the role of the Banner Warrior is.

4000 Squad wide Attributes with Banners + 500 from EA, in part needed to crit cap all your DPS's, as well as the CC from Mace/Mace is the main reason to bring pBS to Raids.

If you get constantly CC'ed or are afflicted with Weakness for a substantial amount of time, I a) am not sure what boss that is supposed to be and b) your supports suck.

In terms of Squad DPS and Utility, yes, your suggested build pales in comparison.Making a build that has higher personal DPS as a Banner Warrior is a no brainer, since Banner Warrior isn't strictly a DPS...

k.

you're talking about raids.

im talking about fractals/dungeons.

big difference.

I don't think you know what you are talking about.In Fractals your group even more so relies on you as Warrior to play Mace/Mace as primary CC together with the Renegade, with Axe/Axe being superior for DPS.You won't use that GS unless you know there won't be any Breakbars in the upcoming encounters.For Stab and condi cleanse, again, run a supFB. Together with the Rev being able to swap to Jalis, you will have more Stab than you'll ever need, freeing you to take Banners, which still are a valuable stat increase in 5 man content.

@zionophir.6845 said:and pugging/joining on the fly in raids is fake news. raid guilds sell them.

The fact that there are some raid sellers doesn't mean people aren't pugging Raids, what's your point?

@zionophir.6845 said:and if raid guilds say you must bring banner, you have no choice..

while banner on 5 people is almost negligible.. if all of you have skills that do not kitten your damage, IN ANY WAY...

It's less negligible than everything else you could bring.If you are neither bringing Banners nor Mace/Mace, then there is little reason to bring a pWarrior.

the max damage that i inflict to a Gold Champion boss with GS skill 2 alone, with all the skill boosters (no item booster) like might and vulnerability maxed is 30,000++

so you now know why i am advocating traiting Weapon Cooldown Reduction..

And Axe 5 can do over 100k damage.Not sure what that has to do with anything though...

Considering Hundred Blades has a cast time of 3.5 seconds without quickness and you are doing 30k damage with it, then congratulations, you are contributing less than 9k DPS.

@zionophir.6845 said:in a fractals party, if you spec your character to do 30,000 damage just using 1 skill and self-sustaining, and the other 4 do the same, sharing might and constant @ 25, resistance, stab, inflicting vulnerability, etc.. what do you think will happen?

i asked an oracle about this and she said, "Done in 5 minutes.." she speaks metaphors..

anyway, this is different from rAIDS, where damage is scaled coz you're so many there..

Again, not how DPS works.Your party of 5 would do less DPS at peak times than 1 1/2 DPS of a META group.

There is this program I can highly recommend called ArcDPS, which can greatly help you check your actual performance in terms of DPS, assisting you in improving as player.

last hit skill 2, on a copper Veteran mob, in WvWvW in 9 might

yfvAivM.jpg

SCALE THAT TO A GOLD BOSS WITH 4 PLAYERS 25 MIGHT MAX VULNERABILITY..

so what's the moral lesson? don't assume that someone is always inventing stuff up..

right, as
um[e]?

and arcdps will make you a pro player? it's akin to cheats that makes a noob feel supremely pro.. sadly, just a feeling..

you're a comedian man. go apply in some comedy bar..

ahahAnd it's still bad^^ (and it will still be bad with 25 mights and vulne^^)Thanks you for the laughter :)

But you know, you're right : we are all noobs and you are the only one here that is good :)

yeah. it's bad yeah?

k.

your sarcastic last sentence felt that you bluffed and still cried inside..

what is 25 - 9 again?

and what is vulnerability?

and can the damage still go up?

WITHOUT BANNERS?

of course..

You do realize, you are not doing any of your arguments any favors right and pretty much any player who has a basic understanding of this game is laughing at you?

You do not understand the difference between single big hits and damage per second (I love when people bring up Warrior Greatsword 2. The skill has always been one of those skills which scales up the damage number done, while always having been a mediocre damage skill. Unfortunately not so smart players usually do not understand what that big number at the end means and how it translates into damage per second. It has been THE ONE defining example of people nut understanding game mechanics and the irony that you brought it up is great).

You do not understand the difference between group damage and solo damage. The entire meta setup for over 4 years has always been designed with 1 thought in mind: which skills bring the overall most damage (or use and utility) to the group. It is this sole approach which makes chronos, druids, firebrands and renegades bring quickness, fury, might and alacrity over pure damage. It's the reason why warriors bring banners and offhand maces (for cc) instead of personal damage skills. It's why a thief might bring Basiliks Venom over Thiefs Guild as elite.

You are the prime example of why arcdps is needed. So players who think they are way smarter and experienced than they are can use arcdps to actually improve. In your case a short trip to the damage golem would be sufficient though.

i showed you a 15k damage GS on a Vet solo with only 9 might and no vuln on that target and you raise the DPS card and "it's not about the maxed damage.."

GS 2 is part of DPS calculation am i brite? and with weapon reduction and might per crit hits GS2, what happens to DPS?

Greatsword 2 is a 3.5 second attack (
).

Warrior benchmarks at around 32.5k as damage dealer. Your Greatsword 2 would have to do 113,750 damage in those 3.5 seconds (3.5x 32.5k). That 15k single hit is useless information. A top performing warrior does twice that damage PER SECOND.

K, show me 113,750 and you and your gang wins this thread. hit a veteran guard, in wvwvw. no banners. GS 2 only..

you have 1 day to do that..

You do realize that we are talking about raid builds in PvE right. This is with the assumption that you will have max boons, vul and some other raid utilities. Of course nobody should use max dps build in wvw, do you know what forum you are on?

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zionophir.6845

zionophir.6845

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@maddoctor.2738 said:

@zionophir.6845 said:do i have to know it? is it important? i pve to kill the boss, not to know my dps coz i trust my customizations..

if you pve to know your dps, you shouldve been a statistician or a stock broker..

You can go to Lion's Arch Aerodrome there is a portal to the special forces training area. Spawn an average golem and do your rotation there. Post an image with your dps it is shown automatically there, you don't need arcdps.

i showed you a 15k damage GS on a Vet solo

This is useless. 15k damage is pathetic low and it's only one hit. Show us your actual dps on the training golem instead. After all, you posted the rotation: 11111,skill2,1111,skill3,1111,skill4,1111,skill5 so you must know how to actually use it in combat. Go on then show us how much dps you do

yea. do you think that that's the way i use my GS?

lel. seems you underestimate who you talk to..

B) B) B).V.. ..I..

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zionophir.6845

zionophir.6845

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@Cyninja.2954 said:

@neven.3785 said:In the past it was possible with one of the common DPS meters used. Also range check that told.you how many enemies are nearby. I left a guild I was a long time member of because they started interrogating members over specific slotted gear pieces or a minor trait choice. I wasn't the target but I'm of firm opinion that it was not how to run a guild especially since it violated terms of service. Other ways to git gud without such tools.

There is a reason those tools where banned and Arc was not. Not sure how that's relevant now.

@zionophir.6845 said:so does arcdps dictate your "Rotation"?

of course you don't just 1111111 the Violet Boss Right? assuming that you've played a single class for how many, 7 years, you don't just 111111 right? there are 9 other skills, right?

and you can even not copy a build using a website and discover by yourselves that there are higher damage build customizations other than the meta builds in the website..

i can just bring a warrior without banners and still damage is still high... its called "traits for weapon/skill cooldown reduction.."

right?

I'm not quite sure what your point here is.Arc doesn't dictate rotations, it simply let's you check if you or others are performing them up to standard and assists in the creation of them by providing feedback.

Plenty of skills reduce DPS due to cast times or aftercasts. It's not just not pressing 1. Additionally a lot of DPS builds utilize combos/burst windows, aka creating damage modifiers and then using as many of the highest damage skills available as possible in them.If you don't know the rotation, there is plenty you can do wrong.

The builds and rotations that are on those sites are there because they are the highest DPS achievable to current knowledge.If you came up with something higher, feel free to let the rest of us know.

Bringing Banners is a DPS sacrifice Warriors make to increase Squad DPS, which is all that matters.So yes, not taking Banners should not only result in "still" high personal DPS, but higher.Personal DPS isn't strictly what you take a Banner Warrior for though.

Again, not sure what the point is you are trying to make.

k.

assuming that you bring the Strength and Discipline banners

4 attributes gets to +100..

ok

compare that to berserker stance, which when used will make your adren full (try to know if how many times) and balanced stance (coz if you got CCed by the boss equals no damage). and traits that lengthen the stances (so more fast adrenaline recharge). Berserker Stance will make any conditions on you useless too. (Blind, Weakness, anything that can kitten or prevent damage)

now go to the weapons = reduced recharge means weapon skill is almost being used everytime, yes? make your main weapons (GS/whatever) have reduced recharge

and tactics - 3 - 3 -3

and since your weapon is GS and you slotted the GS cooldown reduction, you have access to Might Makes Right?

Right?

so now compare Berserker Stance + Balanced Stance (on a stance duration increase) versus Str and Disc Banners

and yeah, if the boss is condi heavy inflicting damage gimping/prevention, +400 on the attributes, even when it's shared, is almost incomparable/useless coz your constant uninterrupted damage became 0 with the Bosses condis..

You genuinely have no idea what the role of the Banner Warrior is.

4000 Squad wide Attributes with Banners + 500 from EA, in part needed to crit cap all your DPS's, as well as the CC from Mace/Mace is the main reason to bring pBS to Raids.

If you get constantly CC'ed or are afflicted with Weakness for a substantial amount of time, I a) am not sure what boss that is supposed to be and b) your supports suck.

In terms of Squad DPS and Utility, yes, your suggested build pales in comparison.Making a build that has higher personal DPS as a Banner Warrior is a no brainer, since Banner Warrior isn't strictly a DPS...

k.

you're talking about raids.

im talking about fractals/dungeons.

big difference.

I don't think you know what you are talking about.In Fractals your group even more so relies on you as Warrior to play Mace/Mace as primary CC together with the Renegade, with Axe/Axe being superior for DPS.You won't use that GS unless you know there won't be any Breakbars in the upcoming encounters.For Stab and condi cleanse, again, run a supFB. Together with the Rev being able to swap to Jalis, you will have more Stab than you'll ever need, freeing you to take Banners, which still are a valuable stat increase in 5 man content.

@zionophir.6845 said:and pugging/joining on the fly in raids is fake news. raid guilds sell them.

The fact that there are some raid sellers doesn't mean people aren't pugging Raids, what's your point?

@zionophir.6845 said:and if raid guilds say you must bring banner, you have no choice..

while banner on 5 people is almost negligible.. if all of you have skills that do not kitten your damage, IN ANY WAY...

It's less negligible than everything else you could bring.If you are neither bringing Banners nor Mace/Mace, then there is little reason to bring a pWarrior.

the max damage that i inflict to a Gold Champion boss with GS skill 2 alone, with all the skill boosters (no item booster) like might and vulnerability maxed is 30,000++

so you now know why i am advocating traiting Weapon Cooldown Reduction..

And Axe 5 can do over 100k damage.Not sure what that has to do with anything though...

Considering Hundred Blades has a cast time of 3.5 seconds without quickness and you are doing 30k damage with it, then congratulations, you are contributing less than 9k DPS.

@zionophir.6845 said:in a fractals party, if you spec your character to do 30,000 damage just using 1 skill and self-sustaining, and the other 4 do the same, sharing might and constant @ 25, resistance, stab, inflicting vulnerability, etc.. what do you think will happen?

i asked an oracle about this and she said, "Done in 5 minutes.." she speaks metaphors..

anyway, this is different from rAIDS, where damage is scaled coz you're so many there..

Again, not how DPS works.Your party of 5 would do less DPS at peak times than 1 1/2 DPS of a META group.

There is this program I can highly recommend called ArcDPS, which can greatly help you check your actual performance in terms of DPS, assisting you in improving as player.

last hit skill 2, on a copper Veteran mob, in WvWvW in 9 might

yfvAivM.jpg

SCALE THAT TO A GOLD BOSS WITH 4 PLAYERS 25 MIGHT MAX VULNERABILITY..

so what's the moral lesson? don't assume that someone is always inventing stuff up..

right, as
um[e]?

and arcdps will make you a pro player? it's akin to cheats that makes a noob feel supremely pro.. sadly, just a feeling..

you're a comedian man. go apply in some comedy bar..

ahahAnd it's still bad^^ (and it will still be bad with 25 mights and vulne^^)Thanks you for the laughter :)

But you know, you're right : we are all noobs and you are the only one here that is good :)

yeah. it's bad yeah?

k.

your sarcastic last sentence felt that you bluffed and still cried inside..

what is 25 - 9 again?

and what is vulnerability?

and can the damage still go up?

WITHOUT BANNERS?

of course..

You do realize, you are not doing any of your arguments any favors right and pretty much any player who has a basic understanding of this game is laughing at you?

You do not understand the difference between single big hits and damage per second (I love when people bring up Warrior Greatsword 2. The skill has always been one of those skills which scales up the damage number done, while always having been a mediocre damage skill. Unfortunately not so smart players usually do not understand what that big number at the end means and how it translates into damage per second. It has been THE ONE defining example of people nut understanding game mechanics and the irony that you brought it up is great).

You do not understand the difference between group damage and solo damage. The entire meta setup for over 4 years has always been designed with 1 thought in mind: which skills bring the overall most damage (or use and utility) to the group. It is this sole approach which makes chronos, druids, firebrands and renegades bring quickness, fury, might and alacrity over pure damage. It's the reason why warriors bring banners and offhand maces (for cc) instead of personal damage skills. It's why a thief might bring Basiliks Venom over Thiefs Guild as elite.

You are the prime example of why arcdps is needed. So players who think they are way smarter and experienced than they are can use arcdps to actually improve. In your case a short trip to the damage golem would be sufficient though.

i showed you a 15k damage GS on a Vet solo with only 9 might and no vuln on that target and you raise the DPS card and "it's not about the maxed damage.."

GS 2 is part of DPS calculation am i brite? and with weapon reduction and might per crit hits GS2, what happens to DPS?

Greatsword 2 is a 3.5 second attack (
).

Warrior benchmarks at around 32.5k as damage dealer. Your Greatsword 2 would have to do 113,750 damage in those 3.5 seconds (3.5x 32.5k). That 15k single hit is useless information. A top performing warrior does twice that damage PER SECOND.

K, show me 113,750 and you and your gang wins this thread. hit a veteran guard, in wvwvw. no banners.

Watch that video. He breaks 100k damage displayed consistently with attacks which do not take 3.5 seconds.

I want you to DEmonstrate that to ME, since you're claiming 100k > 15k...

a screen shot can do.

DEADLINE: JUNE 2 8AMest

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zionophir.6845

zionophir.6845

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@Warscythes.9307 said:

@neven.3785 said:In the past it was possible with one of the common DPS meters used. Also range check that told.you how many enemies are nearby. I left a guild I was a long time member of because they started interrogating members over specific slotted gear pieces or a minor trait choice. I wasn't the target but I'm of firm opinion that it was not how to run a guild especially since it violated terms of service. Other ways to git gud without such tools.

There is a reason those tools where banned and Arc was not. Not sure how that's relevant now.

@zionophir.6845 said:so does arcdps dictate your "Rotation"?

of course you don't just 1111111 the Violet Boss Right? assuming that you've played a single class for how many, 7 years, you don't just 111111 right? there are 9 other skills, right?

and you can even not copy a build using a website and discover by yourselves that there are higher damage build customizations other than the meta builds in the website..

i can just bring a warrior without banners and still damage is still high... its called "traits for weapon/skill cooldown reduction.."

right?

I'm not quite sure what your point here is.Arc doesn't dictate rotations, it simply let's you check if you or others are performing them up to standard and assists in the creation of them by providing feedback.

Plenty of skills reduce DPS due to cast times or aftercasts. It's not just not pressing 1. Additionally a lot of DPS builds utilize combos/burst windows, aka creating damage modifiers and then using as many of the highest damage skills available as possible in them.If you don't know the rotation, there is plenty you can do wrong.

The builds and rotations that are on those sites are there because they are the highest DPS achievable to current knowledge.If you came up with something higher, feel free to let the rest of us know.

Bringing Banners is a DPS sacrifice Warriors make to increase Squad DPS, which is all that matters.So yes, not taking Banners should not only result in "still" high personal DPS, but higher.Personal DPS isn't strictly what you take a Banner Warrior for though.

Again, not sure what the point is you are trying to make.

k.

assuming that you bring the Strength and Discipline banners

4 attributes gets to +100..

ok

compare that to berserker stance, which when used will make your adren full (try to know if how many times) and balanced stance (coz if you got CCed by the boss equals no damage). and traits that lengthen the stances (so more fast adrenaline recharge). Berserker Stance will make any conditions on you useless too. (Blind, Weakness, anything that can kitten or prevent damage)

now go to the weapons = reduced recharge means weapon skill is almost being used everytime, yes? make your main weapons (GS/whatever) have reduced recharge

and tactics - 3 - 3 -3

and since your weapon is GS and you slotted the GS cooldown reduction, you have access to Might Makes Right?

Right?

so now compare Berserker Stance + Balanced Stance (on a stance duration increase) versus Str and Disc Banners

and yeah, if the boss is condi heavy inflicting damage gimping/prevention, +400 on the attributes, even when it's shared, is almost incomparable/useless coz your constant uninterrupted damage became 0 with the Bosses condis..

You genuinely have no idea what the role of the Banner Warrior is.

4000 Squad wide Attributes with Banners + 500 from EA, in part needed to crit cap all your DPS's, as well as the CC from Mace/Mace is the main reason to bring pBS to Raids.

If you get constantly CC'ed or are afflicted with Weakness for a substantial amount of time, I a) am not sure what boss that is supposed to be and b) your supports suck.

In terms of Squad DPS and Utility, yes, your suggested build pales in comparison.Making a build that has higher personal DPS as a Banner Warrior is a no brainer, since Banner Warrior isn't strictly a DPS...

k.

you're talking about raids.

im talking about fractals/dungeons.

big difference.

I don't think you know what you are talking about.In Fractals your group even more so relies on you as Warrior to play Mace/Mace as primary CC together with the Renegade, with Axe/Axe being superior for DPS.You won't use that GS unless you know there won't be any Breakbars in the upcoming encounters.For Stab and condi cleanse, again, run a supFB. Together with the Rev being able to swap to Jalis, you will have more Stab than you'll ever need, freeing you to take Banners, which still are a valuable stat increase in 5 man content.

@zionophir.6845 said:and pugging/joining on the fly in raids is fake news. raid guilds sell them.

The fact that there are some raid sellers doesn't mean people aren't pugging Raids, what's your point?

@zionophir.6845 said:and if raid guilds say you must bring banner, you have no choice..

while banner on 5 people is almost negligible.. if all of you have skills that do not kitten your damage, IN ANY WAY...

It's less negligible than everything else you could bring.If you are neither bringing Banners nor Mace/Mace, then there is little reason to bring a pWarrior.

the max damage that i inflict to a Gold Champion boss with GS skill 2 alone, with all the skill boosters (no item booster) like might and vulnerability maxed is 30,000++

so you now know why i am advocating traiting Weapon Cooldown Reduction..

And Axe 5 can do over 100k damage.Not sure what that has to do with anything though...

Considering Hundred Blades has a cast time of 3.5 seconds without quickness and you are doing 30k damage with it, then congratulations, you are contributing less than 9k DPS.

@zionophir.6845 said:in a fractals party, if you spec your character to do 30,000 damage just using 1 skill and self-sustaining, and the other 4 do the same, sharing might and constant @ 25, resistance, stab, inflicting vulnerability, etc.. what do you think will happen?

i asked an oracle about this and she said, "Done in 5 minutes.." she speaks metaphors..

anyway, this is different from rAIDS, where damage is scaled coz you're so many there..

Again, not how DPS works.Your party of 5 would do less DPS at peak times than 1 1/2 DPS of a META group.

There is this program I can highly recommend called ArcDPS, which can greatly help you check your actual performance in terms of DPS, assisting you in improving as player.

last hit skill 2, on a copper Veteran mob, in WvWvW in 9 might

yfvAivM.jpg

SCALE THAT TO A GOLD BOSS WITH 4 PLAYERS 25 MIGHT MAX VULNERABILITY..

so what's the moral lesson? don't assume that someone is always inventing stuff up..

right, as
um[e]?

and arcdps will make you a pro player? it's akin to cheats that makes a noob feel supremely pro.. sadly, just a feeling..

you're a comedian man. go apply in some comedy bar..

ahahAnd it's still bad^^ (and it will still be bad with 25 mights and vulne^^)Thanks you for the laughter :)

But you know, you're right : we are all noobs and you are the only one here that is good :)

yeah. it's bad yeah?

k.

your sarcastic last sentence felt that you bluffed and still cried inside..

what is 25 - 9 again?

and what is vulnerability?

and can the damage still go up?

WITHOUT BANNERS?

of course..

You do realize, you are not doing any of your arguments any favors right and pretty much any player who has a basic understanding of this game is laughing at you?

You do not understand the difference between single big hits and damage per second (I love when people bring up Warrior Greatsword 2. The skill has always been one of those skills which scales up the damage number done, while always having been a mediocre damage skill. Unfortunately not so smart players usually do not understand what that big number at the end means and how it translates into damage per second. It has been THE ONE defining example of people nut understanding game mechanics and the irony that you brought it up is great).

You do not understand the difference between group damage and solo damage. The entire meta setup for over 4 years has always been designed with 1 thought in mind: which skills bring the overall most damage (or use and utility) to the group. It is this sole approach which makes chronos, druids, firebrands and renegades bring quickness, fury, might and alacrity over pure damage. It's the reason why warriors bring banners and offhand maces (for cc) instead of personal damage skills. It's why a thief might bring Basiliks Venom over Thiefs Guild as elite.

You are the prime example of why arcdps is needed. So players who think they are way smarter and experienced than they are can use arcdps to actually improve. In your case a short trip to the damage golem would be sufficient though.

i showed you a 15k damage GS on a Vet solo with only 9 might and no vuln on that target and you raise the DPS card and "it's not about the maxed damage.."

GS 2 is part of DPS calculation am i brite? and with weapon reduction and might per crit hits GS2, what happens to DPS?

Greatsword 2 is a 3.5 second attack (
).

Warrior benchmarks at around 32.5k as damage dealer. Your Greatsword 2 would have to do 113,750 damage in those 3.5 seconds (3.5x 32.5k). That 15k single hit is useless information. A top performing warrior does twice that damage PER SECOND.

K, show me 113,750 and you and your gang wins this thread. hit a veteran guard, in wvwvw. no banners. GS 2 only..

you have 1 day to do that..

You do realize that we are talking about raid builds in PvE right. This is with the assumption that you will have max boons, vul and some other raid utilities. Of course nobody should use max dps build in wvw, do you know what forum you are on?

k.

B) B) B).V.. ..I..

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Warscythes.9307

Warscythes.9307

Posted
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@zionophir.6845 said:

@neven.3785 said:In the past it was possible with one of the common DPS meters used. Also range check that told.you how many enemies are nearby. I left a guild I was a long time member of because they started interrogating members over specific slotted gear pieces or a minor trait choice. I wasn't the target but I'm of firm opinion that it was not how to run a guild especially since it violated terms of service. Other ways to git gud without such tools.

There is a reason those tools where banned and Arc was not. Not sure how that's relevant now.

@zionophir.6845 said:so does arcdps dictate your "Rotation"?

of course you don't just 1111111 the Violet Boss Right? assuming that you've played a single class for how many, 7 years, you don't just 111111 right? there are 9 other skills, right?

and you can even not copy a build using a website and discover by yourselves that there are higher damage build customizations other than the meta builds in the website..

i can just bring a warrior without banners and still damage is still high... its called "traits for weapon/skill cooldown reduction.."

right?

I'm not quite sure what your point here is.Arc doesn't dictate rotations, it simply let's you check if you or others are performing them up to standard and assists in the creation of them by providing feedback.

Plenty of skills reduce DPS due to cast times or aftercasts. It's not just not pressing 1. Additionally a lot of DPS builds utilize combos/burst windows, aka creating damage modifiers and then using as many of the highest damage skills available as possible in them.If you don't know the rotation, there is plenty you can do wrong.

The builds and rotations that are on those sites are there because they are the highest DPS achievable to current knowledge.If you came up with something higher, feel free to let the rest of us know.

Bringing Banners is a DPS sacrifice Warriors make to increase Squad DPS, which is all that matters.So yes, not taking Banners should not only result in "still" high personal DPS, but higher.Personal DPS isn't strictly what you take a Banner Warrior for though.

Again, not sure what the point is you are trying to make.

k.

assuming that you bring the Strength and Discipline banners

4 attributes gets to +100..

ok

compare that to berserker stance, which when used will make your adren full (try to know if how many times) and balanced stance (coz if you got CCed by the boss equals no damage). and traits that lengthen the stances (so more fast adrenaline recharge). Berserker Stance will make any conditions on you useless too. (Blind, Weakness, anything that can kitten or prevent damage)

now go to the weapons = reduced recharge means weapon skill is almost being used everytime, yes? make your main weapons (GS/whatever) have reduced recharge

and tactics - 3 - 3 -3

and since your weapon is GS and you slotted the GS cooldown reduction, you have access to Might Makes Right?

Right?

so now compare Berserker Stance + Balanced Stance (on a stance duration increase) versus Str and Disc Banners

and yeah, if the boss is condi heavy inflicting damage gimping/prevention, +400 on the attributes, even when it's shared, is almost incomparable/useless coz your constant uninterrupted damage became 0 with the Bosses condis..

You genuinely have no idea what the role of the Banner Warrior is.

4000 Squad wide Attributes with Banners + 500 from EA, in part needed to crit cap all your DPS's, as well as the CC from Mace/Mace is the main reason to bring pBS to Raids.

If you get constantly CC'ed or are afflicted with Weakness for a substantial amount of time, I a) am not sure what boss that is supposed to be and b) your supports suck.

In terms of Squad DPS and Utility, yes, your suggested build pales in comparison.Making a build that has higher personal DPS as a Banner Warrior is a no brainer, since Banner Warrior isn't strictly a DPS...

k.

you're talking about raids.

im talking about fractals/dungeons.

big difference.

I don't think you know what you are talking about.In Fractals your group even more so relies on you as Warrior to play Mace/Mace as primary CC together with the Renegade, with Axe/Axe being superior for DPS.You won't use that GS unless you know there won't be any Breakbars in the upcoming encounters.For Stab and condi cleanse, again, run a supFB. Together with the Rev being able to swap to Jalis, you will have more Stab than you'll ever need, freeing you to take Banners, which still are a valuable stat increase in 5 man content.

@zionophir.6845 said:and pugging/joining on the fly in raids is fake news. raid guilds sell them.

The fact that there are some raid sellers doesn't mean people aren't pugging Raids, what's your point?

@zionophir.6845 said:and if raid guilds say you must bring banner, you have no choice..

while banner on 5 people is almost negligible.. if all of you have skills that do not kitten your damage, IN ANY WAY...

It's less negligible than everything else you could bring.If you are neither bringing Banners nor Mace/Mace, then there is little reason to bring a pWarrior.

the max damage that i inflict to a Gold Champion boss with GS skill 2 alone, with all the skill boosters (no item booster) like might and vulnerability maxed is 30,000++

so you now know why i am advocating traiting Weapon Cooldown Reduction..

And Axe 5 can do over 100k damage.Not sure what that has to do with anything though...

Considering Hundred Blades has a cast time of 3.5 seconds without quickness and you are doing 30k damage with it, then congratulations, you are contributing less than 9k DPS.

@zionophir.6845 said:in a fractals party, if you spec your character to do 30,000 damage just using 1 skill and self-sustaining, and the other 4 do the same, sharing might and constant @ 25, resistance, stab, inflicting vulnerability, etc.. what do you think will happen?

i asked an oracle about this and she said, "Done in 5 minutes.." she speaks metaphors..

anyway, this is different from rAIDS, where damage is scaled coz you're so many there..

Again, not how DPS works.Your party of 5 would do less DPS at peak times than 1 1/2 DPS of a META group.

There is this program I can highly recommend called ArcDPS, which can greatly help you check your actual performance in terms of DPS, assisting you in improving as player.

last hit skill 2, on a copper Veteran mob, in WvWvW in 9 might

yfvAivM.jpg

SCALE THAT TO A GOLD BOSS WITH 4 PLAYERS 25 MIGHT MAX VULNERABILITY..

so what's the moral lesson? don't assume that someone is always inventing stuff up..

right, as
um[e]?

and arcdps will make you a pro player? it's akin to cheats that makes a noob feel supremely pro.. sadly, just a feeling..

you're a comedian man. go apply in some comedy bar..

ahahAnd it's still bad^^ (and it will still be bad with 25 mights and vulne^^)Thanks you for the laughter :)

But you know, you're right : we are all noobs and you are the only one here that is good :)

yeah. it's bad yeah?

k.

your sarcastic last sentence felt that you bluffed and still cried inside..

what is 25 - 9 again?

and what is vulnerability?

and can the damage still go up?

WITHOUT BANNERS?

of course..

You do realize, you are not doing any of your arguments any favors right and pretty much any player who has a basic understanding of this game is laughing at you?

You do not understand the difference between single big hits and damage per second (I love when people bring up Warrior Greatsword 2. The skill has always been one of those skills which scales up the damage number done, while always having been a mediocre damage skill. Unfortunately not so smart players usually do not understand what that big number at the end means and how it translates into damage per second. It has been THE ONE defining example of people nut understanding game mechanics and the irony that you brought it up is great).

You do not understand the difference between group damage and solo damage. The entire meta setup for over 4 years has always been designed with 1 thought in mind: which skills bring the overall most damage (or use and utility) to the group. It is this sole approach which makes chronos, druids, firebrands and renegades bring quickness, fury, might and alacrity over pure damage. It's the reason why warriors bring banners and offhand maces (for cc) instead of personal damage skills. It's why a thief might bring Basiliks Venom over Thiefs Guild as elite.

You are the prime example of why arcdps is needed. So players who think they are way smarter and experienced than they are can use arcdps to actually improve. In your case a short trip to the damage golem would be sufficient though.

i showed you a 15k damage GS on a Vet solo with only 9 might and no vuln on that target and you raise the DPS card and "it's not about the maxed damage.."

GS 2 is part of DPS calculation am i brite? and with weapon reduction and might per crit hits GS2, what happens to DPS?

Greatsword 2 is a 3.5 second attack (
).

Warrior benchmarks at around 32.5k as damage dealer. Your Greatsword 2 would have to do 113,750 damage in those 3.5 seconds (3.5x 32.5k). That 15k single hit is useless information. A top performing warrior does twice that damage PER SECOND.

K, show me 113,750 and you and your gang wins this thread. hit a veteran guard, in wvwvw. no banners. GS 2 only..

you have 1 day to do that..

You do realize that we are talking about raid builds in PvE right. This is with the assumption that you will have max boons, vul and some other raid utilities. Of course nobody should use max dps build in wvw, do you know what forum you are on?

k.

B) B) B).V.. ..I..

Now I just kind of feel bad. I hope you think about this moment and reflect once you get out of school.

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maddoctor.2738

maddoctor.2738

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@zionophir.6845 said:

@zionophir.6845 said:do i have to know it? is it important? i pve to kill the boss, not to know my dps coz i trust my customizations..

if you pve to know your dps, you shouldve been a statistician or a stock broker..

You can go to Lion's Arch Aerodrome there is a portal to the special forces training area. Spawn an average golem and do your rotation there. Post an image with your dps it is shown automatically there, you don't need arcdps.

i showed you a 15k damage GS on a Vet solo

This is useless. 15k damage is pathetic low and it's only one hit. Show us your actual dps on the training golem instead. After all, you posted the rotation: 11111,skill2,1111,skill3,1111,skill4,1111,skill5 so you must know how to actually use it in combat. Go on then show us how much dps you do

yea. do you think that that's the way i use my GS?

lel. seems you underestimate who you talk to..

B) B) B).V.. ..I..

Show us then how you use it. I told you to go to the Aerodrome training area, spawn a golem and take a picture showing your DPS. Otherwise it's simple talk with nothing to support it. You demonstrated that you know how to take pictures, even useless ones, so taking a picture that shows in chat your DPS (I repeat you don't need arcdps for that, it's in-game) from the training golem should be enough to show everyone who you are.

But I think you can't do that because you overestimate yourself. You think you are special and good at this game, yet the only reason you believe so is because you haven't used ArcDPS yet, once you do you'll notice your damage is so low that you should be ashamed. Don't panic though, it happens to loudmouths that overestimate their worth, they think they do good, while in fact they are (as the topic of the thread says) trash.

So unless you post a picture of your DPS that is higher than the Warrior benchmark (it's 33972 average dps you can't even reach that on your picture!) then your dps is trash.

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zionophir.6845

zionophir.6845

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@Warscythes.9307 said:

@neven.3785 said:In the past it was possible with one of the common DPS meters used. Also range check that told.you how many enemies are nearby. I left a guild I was a long time member of because they started interrogating members over specific slotted gear pieces or a minor trait choice. I wasn't the target but I'm of firm opinion that it was not how to run a guild especially since it violated terms of service. Other ways to git gud without such tools.

There is a reason those tools where banned and Arc was not. Not sure how that's relevant now.

@zionophir.6845 said:so does arcdps dictate your "Rotation"?

of course you don't just 1111111 the Violet Boss Right? assuming that you've played a single class for how many, 7 years, you don't just 111111 right? there are 9 other skills, right?

and you can even not copy a build using a website and discover by yourselves that there are higher damage build customizations other than the meta builds in the website..

i can just bring a warrior without banners and still damage is still high... its called "traits for weapon/skill cooldown reduction.."

right?

I'm not quite sure what your point here is.Arc doesn't dictate rotations, it simply let's you check if you or others are performing them up to standard and assists in the creation of them by providing feedback.

Plenty of skills reduce DPS due to cast times or aftercasts. It's not just not pressing 1. Additionally a lot of DPS builds utilize combos/burst windows, aka creating damage modifiers and then using as many of the highest damage skills available as possible in them.If you don't know the rotation, there is plenty you can do wrong.

The builds and rotations that are on those sites are there because they are the highest DPS achievable to current knowledge.If you came up with something higher, feel free to let the rest of us know.

Bringing Banners is a DPS sacrifice Warriors make to increase Squad DPS, which is all that matters.So yes, not taking Banners should not only result in "still" high personal DPS, but higher.Personal DPS isn't strictly what you take a Banner Warrior for though.

Again, not sure what the point is you are trying to make.

k.

assuming that you bring the Strength and Discipline banners

4 attributes gets to +100..

ok

compare that to berserker stance, which when used will make your adren full (try to know if how many times) and balanced stance (coz if you got CCed by the boss equals no damage). and traits that lengthen the stances (so more fast adrenaline recharge). Berserker Stance will make any conditions on you useless too. (Blind, Weakness, anything that can kitten or prevent damage)

now go to the weapons = reduced recharge means weapon skill is almost being used everytime, yes? make your main weapons (GS/whatever) have reduced recharge

and tactics - 3 - 3 -3

and since your weapon is GS and you slotted the GS cooldown reduction, you have access to Might Makes Right?

Right?

so now compare Berserker Stance + Balanced Stance (on a stance duration increase) versus Str and Disc Banners

and yeah, if the boss is condi heavy inflicting damage gimping/prevention, +400 on the attributes, even when it's shared, is almost incomparable/useless coz your constant uninterrupted damage became 0 with the Bosses condis..

You genuinely have no idea what the role of the Banner Warrior is.

4000 Squad wide Attributes with Banners + 500 from EA, in part needed to crit cap all your DPS's, as well as the CC from Mace/Mace is the main reason to bring pBS to Raids.

If you get constantly CC'ed or are afflicted with Weakness for a substantial amount of time, I a) am not sure what boss that is supposed to be and b) your supports suck.

In terms of Squad DPS and Utility, yes, your suggested build pales in comparison.Making a build that has higher personal DPS as a Banner Warrior is a no brainer, since Banner Warrior isn't strictly a DPS...

k.

you're talking about raids.

im talking about fractals/dungeons.

big difference.

I don't think you know what you are talking about.In Fractals your group even more so relies on you as Warrior to play Mace/Mace as primary CC together with the Renegade, with Axe/Axe being superior for DPS.You won't use that GS unless you know there won't be any Breakbars in the upcoming encounters.For Stab and condi cleanse, again, run a supFB. Together with the Rev being able to swap to Jalis, you will have more Stab than you'll ever need, freeing you to take Banners, which still are a valuable stat increase in 5 man content.

@zionophir.6845 said:and pugging/joining on the fly in raids is fake news. raid guilds sell them.

The fact that there are some raid sellers doesn't mean people aren't pugging Raids, what's your point?

@zionophir.6845 said:and if raid guilds say you must bring banner, you have no choice..

while banner on 5 people is almost negligible.. if all of you have skills that do not kitten your damage, IN ANY WAY...

It's less negligible than everything else you could bring.If you are neither bringing Banners nor Mace/Mace, then there is little reason to bring a pWarrior.

the max damage that i inflict to a Gold Champion boss with GS skill 2 alone, with all the skill boosters (no item booster) like might and vulnerability maxed is 30,000++

so you now know why i am advocating traiting Weapon Cooldown Reduction..

And Axe 5 can do over 100k damage.Not sure what that has to do with anything though...

Considering Hundred Blades has a cast time of 3.5 seconds without quickness and you are doing 30k damage with it, then congratulations, you are contributing less than 9k DPS.

@zionophir.6845 said:in a fractals party, if you spec your character to do 30,000 damage just using 1 skill and self-sustaining, and the other 4 do the same, sharing might and constant @ 25, resistance, stab, inflicting vulnerability, etc.. what do you think will happen?

i asked an oracle about this and she said, "Done in 5 minutes.." she speaks metaphors..

anyway, this is different from rAIDS, where damage is scaled coz you're so many there..

Again, not how DPS works.Your party of 5 would do less DPS at peak times than 1 1/2 DPS of a META group.

There is this program I can highly recommend called ArcDPS, which can greatly help you check your actual performance in terms of DPS, assisting you in improving as player.

last hit skill 2, on a copper Veteran mob, in WvWvW in 9 might

yfvAivM.jpg

SCALE THAT TO A GOLD BOSS WITH 4 PLAYERS 25 MIGHT MAX VULNERABILITY..

so what's the moral lesson? don't assume that someone is always inventing stuff up..

right, as
um[e]?

and arcdps will make you a pro player? it's akin to cheats that makes a noob feel supremely pro.. sadly, just a feeling..

you're a comedian man. go apply in some comedy bar..

ahahAnd it's still bad^^ (and it will still be bad with 25 mights and vulne^^)Thanks you for the laughter :)

But you know, you're right : we are all noobs and you are the only one here that is good :)

yeah. it's bad yeah?

k.

your sarcastic last sentence felt that you bluffed and still cried inside..

what is 25 - 9 again?

and what is vulnerability?

and can the damage still go up?

WITHOUT BANNERS?

of course..

You do realize, you are not doing any of your arguments any favors right and pretty much any player who has a basic understanding of this game is laughing at you?

You do not understand the difference between single big hits and damage per second (I love when people bring up Warrior Greatsword 2. The skill has always been one of those skills which scales up the damage number done, while always having been a mediocre damage skill. Unfortunately not so smart players usually do not understand what that big number at the end means and how it translates into damage per second. It has been THE ONE defining example of people nut understanding game mechanics and the irony that you brought it up is great).

You do not understand the difference between group damage and solo damage. The entire meta setup for over 4 years has always been designed with 1 thought in mind: which skills bring the overall most damage (or use and utility) to the group. It is this sole approach which makes chronos, druids, firebrands and renegades bring quickness, fury, might and alacrity over pure damage. It's the reason why warriors bring banners and offhand maces (for cc) instead of personal damage skills. It's why a thief might bring Basiliks Venom over Thiefs Guild as elite.

You are the prime example of why arcdps is needed. So players who think they are way smarter and experienced than they are can use arcdps to actually improve. In your case a short trip to the damage golem would be sufficient though.

i showed you a 15k damage GS on a Vet solo with only 9 might and no vuln on that target and you raise the DPS card and "it's not about the maxed damage.."

GS 2 is part of DPS calculation am i brite? and with weapon reduction and might per crit hits GS2, what happens to DPS?

Greatsword 2 is a 3.5 second attack (
).

Warrior benchmarks at around 32.5k as damage dealer. Your Greatsword 2 would have to do 113,750 damage in those 3.5 seconds (3.5x 32.5k). That 15k single hit is useless information. A top performing warrior does twice that damage PER SECOND.

K, show me 113,750 and you and your gang wins this thread. hit a veteran guard, in wvwvw. no banners. GS 2 only..

you have 1 day to do that..

You do realize that we are talking about raid builds in PvE right. This is with the assumption that you will have max boons, vul and some other raid utilities. Of course nobody should use max dps build in wvw, do you know what forum you are on?

k.

B) B) B).V.. ..I..

Now I just kind of feel bad. I hope you think about this moment and reflect once you get out of school.

I don't have to prove myself to you. there are persons laughing at you atm (and even those people who are in remote mode)..

if i tell you can solo the overgrown grub in EBG (without glitches and naturally facetanking it), will you believe me?

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