Cristalyan.5728 Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 @Gop.8713 said:@Obtena.7952 said:That's easy to answer ... because mounts were probably NEVER intended to avoid combat. They were (at least to me) a way to get to where you want to be faster. I think the fact that you could be dismounted is an indication of what they were ... and were not meant to be. Okay, but if that was the case then why give them three dodges? Whey give them any dodges . . ?I think a better explanation is that they were intended as a means to get where you were going faster, INCLUDING avoiding combat along the way. But they allowed you to avoid combat in all these other situations as well, smallscale, capping points, etc. and they've been nerfing those all along, either as a design philosophy or as a reaction to player response, so now it's mostly only useful for crossing uncontested space . . .Anyway, it's just interesting to think about. What did anet intend the mount to do? When did they realize it needed to be changed? Why wasn't that need anticipated before release, etc. It's not really relevant to anything, just curious . . .In my opinion nobody (even on ANet) knows the exact intention for the mounts regarding the gamemode / influence on the gameplay etc. The only reason of the mount in WvW was economical. That means the marketing department is very strong in ANet structure. This is why the mount was so controversial. And this is why the changes to it took so much. And this is why the changes don't address the most controversial aspects - by chance these aspects are the strong points of the marketing campaign. The current dismount skill offers the same functionality (but implemented in more than 6 months) as the request to dismount a player by attacking him. The same. Yes, now a plyayer can dismount one enemy. If attacking, one player could dismount 4-5 other players. And? Who can survive too long in a 1 vs 5-6? I did not make any test but how the dodge behaves? Are you still invulnerable on dodges? That means the Dismount skill is not Dismount. Are you dismounted? That means the invulnerability on dodge is not invulnerability. The way ANet implemented this negates one of the skills you invested points to develop. @DemonSeed.3528 said:@"Domey.9804" said:i cant use dismount skill, cuz no PoF....gg anet , the struggle goes onI've been trying to bring the issue of non-PoF users not having an ability to dismount mounted players since they do not have access to a mount [and if they did have mount rentals, I doubt the dismount skill would be available making it moot]. My hope is that they will look into a mobile siege that can be bought from vendor that roots user for at least 1s while firing but it would need to retain 1.5k range and a lower cooldown than the mounts 30s lance skill as the player will be chasing on foot.As a side note, if there were plans for mount rentals, they could put them in with all 1-4 abilities unlocked but "lesser" versions.As I said before, the marketing is a strong department for ANet. This is the reason. Marketing. You don't have PoF? You can't play WvW as before. No matter you are our client for 7 years and you bought the vanilla/Hot and tons of gems. No matter. If you don't have PoF .... HM. Someone on ANet should understand that the Sales department will sell everything to reach the targets it have. Everything. Including the players and the own Company. ANet turns slowly from a customer driven Company to a sales target driven Company. In my opinion we have little chance to see these sieges used to dismount. And even if implemented - this will be another twisted solution - typical for ANet - like the "solution" for the perma-stealth. Instead of going to roots - investigating the stealth mechanic and adjusting, they introduced revealing traps. But even so, I have doubts that the marketing will approve this. It seems they don't care if for ONE player buying PoF because of these constrains other 100 leave the game. It seems that the marketing performance is judged only from how many sales they have. The detail with "how many left the game" is most probably put on the technical / developing departments responsibility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gop.8713 Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 @Cristalyan.5728 said:@Gop.8713 said:@Obtena.7952 said:That's easy to answer ... because mounts were probably NEVER intended to avoid combat. They were (at least to me) a way to get to where you want to be faster. I think the fact that you could be dismounted is an indication of what they were ... and were not meant to be. Okay, but if that was the case then why give them three dodges? Whey give them any dodges . . ?I think a better explanation is that they were intended as a means to get where you were going faster, INCLUDING avoiding combat along the way. But they allowed you to avoid combat in all these other situations as well, smallscale, capping points, etc. and they've been nerfing those all along, either as a design philosophy or as a reaction to player response, so now it's mostly only useful for crossing uncontested space . . .Anyway, it's just interesting to think about. What did anet intend the mount to do? When did they realize it needed to be changed? Why wasn't that need anticipated before release, etc. It's not really relevant to anything, just curious . . .In my opinion nobody (even on ANet) knows the exact intention for the mounts regarding the gamemode / influence on the gameplay etc. The only reason of the mount in WvW was economical. That means the marketing department is very strong in ANet structure. I considered that as well, but dismissed it as overly cynical. As already mentioned somewhere up there if the purpose was purely economic they would have had the dismount skill ready to go and it wouldn't have taken so long to develop it . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sviel.7493 Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 @Gop.8713 said:I feel like I've established that I don't care what the rules are. Mounts/no mounts, dismount skill/no dismount skill, it's all the same to me. Everyone is playing by the same rules, so just use whatever rules exist. But I can't help noticing how odd this decision is. What was the point of adding the mount only to add a dismount skill immediately afterwards? There seem to be so few players willing to adapt to either situation, everyone is entrenched in one camp or the other and I don't know how many ppl have really stopped to consider the motivations for it all . . .I can't adapt unless I have access to the tools needed to adapt.Right now, my only option is to play a long-ranged condi class with decent speed. That's the only semi-reliable way to dismount someone and stay close enough to actually put them in combat once dismounted. No actual WvW considerations are possible beyond simply having the ability to contest enemies trying to flip my stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gop.8713 Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 @Sviel.7493 said:@Gop.8713 said:I feel like I've established that I don't care what the rules are. Mounts/no mounts, dismount skill/no dismount skill, it's all the same to me. Everyone is playing by the same rules, so just use whatever rules exist. But I can't help noticing how odd this decision is. What was the point of adding the mount only to add a dismount skill immediately afterwards? There seem to be so few players willing to adapt to either situation, everyone is entrenched in one camp or the other and I don't know how many ppl have really stopped to consider the motivations for it all . . .I can't adapt unless I have access to the tools needed to adapt.Right now, my only option is to play a long-ranged condi class with decent speed. That's the only semi-reliable way to dismount someone and stay close enough to actually put them in combat once dismounted. No actual WvW considerations are possible beyond simply having the ability to contest enemies trying to flip my stuff.You have the same tools as everyone else . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sviel.7493 Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 @Gop.8713 said:@Sviel.7493 said:@Gop.8713 said:I feel like I've established that I don't care what the rules are. Mounts/no mounts, dismount skill/no dismount skill, it's all the same to me. Everyone is playing by the same rules, so just use whatever rules exist. But I can't help noticing how odd this decision is. What was the point of adding the mount only to add a dismount skill immediately afterwards? There seem to be so few players willing to adapt to either situation, everyone is entrenched in one camp or the other and I don't know how many ppl have really stopped to consider the motivations for it all . . .I can't adapt unless I have access to the tools needed to adapt.Right now, my only option is to play a long-ranged condi class with decent speed. That's the only semi-reliable way to dismount someone and stay close enough to actually put them in combat once dismounted. No actual WvW considerations are possible beyond simply having the ability to contest enemies trying to flip my stuff.You have the same tools as everyone else . . .Perhaps I need to break it down...-I don't have access to tools that are in PoF.-Outside of that dubious Lance skill, the tools available to me (and everyone else who bought HoT) are not sufficient. Even if everyone did have access to them, they still wouldn't be sufficient. It is not possible for anyone to adapt if no one has access to sufficient tools, even if everyone has access to the same tools. So a game can technically be fair (because everyone has access to the same skills), but still be broken (because some skills cannot be sufficiently responded to).I'm not asking for an I-Win button, I just want to be able to do something in a reasonable manner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gop.8713 Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 @Sviel.7493 said:@Gop.8713 said:@Sviel.7493 said:@Gop.8713 said:I feel like I've established that I don't care what the rules are. Mounts/no mounts, dismount skill/no dismount skill, it's all the same to me. Everyone is playing by the same rules, so just use whatever rules exist. But I can't help noticing how odd this decision is. What was the point of adding the mount only to add a dismount skill immediately afterwards? There seem to be so few players willing to adapt to either situation, everyone is entrenched in one camp or the other and I don't know how many ppl have really stopped to consider the motivations for it all . . .I can't adapt unless I have access to the tools needed to adapt.Right now, my only option is to play a long-ranged condi class with decent speed. That's the only semi-reliable way to dismount someone and stay close enough to actually put them in combat once dismounted. No actual WvW considerations are possible beyond simply having the ability to contest enemies trying to flip my stuff.You have the same tools as everyone else . . .Perhaps I need to break it down...-I don't have access to tools that are in PoF.You do . . .-Outside of that dubious Lance skill, the tools available to me (and everyone else who bought HoT) are not sufficient. Even if everyone did have access to them, they still wouldn't be sufficient. It is not possible for anyone to adapt if no one has access to sufficient tools, even if everyone has access to the same tools.I did. As did many, many others . . .So a game can technically be fair (because everyone has access to the same skills), but still be broken (because some skills cannot be sufficiently responded to).Well sure, there's never any good reason not to keep trying to make the game better . . .I'm not asking for an I-Win button, I just want to be able to do something in a reasonable manner.Then do so :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sviel.7493 Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 @Gop.8713 Please explain how I have access to tools that are in PoF. If this is some lame troll attempt saying that I just have to shell out for the expansion, you might as well just come out with it. Or, really, you can say anything at all instead of this absurd tease routine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bambi.6214 Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 F I N A L L Y Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Disgrace.4275 Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 @Sviel.7493 said:@Gop.8713 Please explain how I have access to tools that are in PoF. If this is some lame troll attempt saying that I just have to shell out for the expansion, you might as well just come out with it. Or, really, you can say anything at all instead of this absurd tease routine.What? I don't get it, what tools are in pof that are not anywhere else? If you're in about the mount it self they buy pof, if you can afford a pc... even a monthly subscription to your isp then you sure as hell can buy pof. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sephiroth.4217 Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 @Fat Disgrace.4275 said:@Sviel.7493 said:@Gop.8713 Please explain how I have access to tools that are in PoF. If this is some lame troll attempt saying that I just have to shell out for the expansion, you might as well just come out with it. Or, really, you can say anything at all instead of this absurd tease routine.What? I don't get it, what tools are in pof that are not anywhere else? If you're in about the mount it self they buy pof, if you can afford a pc... even a monthly subscription to your isp then you sure as hell can buy pof. maybe he/she is not old enough to have a job yet? maybe mummy and daddy doesnt give him as much pocket money as others... maybe he has debts... who knows.either way its an interesting point to level the playing field and remove pay to win factors from pvp environments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gop.8713 Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 @Sviel.7493 said:@Gop.8713 Please explain how I have access to tools that are in PoF. If this is some lame troll attempt saying that I just have to shell out for the expansion, you might as well just come out with it. Or, really, you can say anything at all instead of this absurd tease routine.I don't have any opinion at all about what you 'should' do. I'm just pointing out that all the same options that are available to everyone else are available to you, and the choices you make are your responsibility, they are not forced upon you . . .If you want to change 'I can't adapt' to 'Ive chosen not to adapt', I'd agree with you and I think it would be helpful and empowering for you . . .@Fat Disgrace.4275 said:@Sviel.7493 said:@Gop.8713 Please explain how I have access to tools that are in PoF. If this is some lame troll attempt saying that I just have to shell out for the expansion, you might as well just come out with it. Or, really, you can say anything at all instead of this absurd tease routine.What? I don't get it, what tools are in pof that are not anywhere else? If you're in about the mount it self they buy pof, if you can afford a pc... even a monthly subscription to your isp then you sure as hell can buy pof. I tend to agree. There are probably more ppl in the world who can't afford to buy PoF than there are ppl who can, but those ppl don't spend their idle time lamenting their inability to adapt to game mechanics on internet forums . . .@sephiroth.4217 said:@Fat Disgrace.4275 said:@Sviel.7493 said:@Gop.8713 Please explain how I have access to tools that are in PoF. If this is some lame troll attempt saying that I just have to shell out for the expansion, you might as well just come out with it. Or, really, you can say anything at all instead of this absurd tease routine.What? I don't get it, what tools are in pof that are not anywhere else? If you're in about the mount it self they buy pof, if you can afford a pc... even a monthly subscription to your isp then you sure as hell can buy pof. maybe he/she is not old enough to have a job yet? maybe mummy and daddy doesnt give him as much pocket money as others... maybe he has debts... who knows.either way its an interesting point to level the playing field and remove pay to win factors from pvp environments.I see what you're saying, but anet has a VERY player-friendly business model and I'm not sure keeping up with the latest release can really be considered p2w, esp when there have only been three releases in seven years . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sephiroth.4217 Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 @Gop.8713 said:@Sviel.7493 said:@Gop.8713 Please explain how I have access to tools that are in PoF. If this is some lame troll attempt saying that I just have to shell out for the expansion, you might as well just come out with it. Or, really, you can say anything at all instead of this absurd tease routine.I don't have any opinion at all about what you 'should' do. I'm just pointing out that all the same options that are available to everyone else are available to you, and the choices you make are your responsibility, they are not forced upon you . . .If you want to change 'I can't adapt' to 'Ive chosen not to adapt', I'd agree with you and I think it would be helpful and empowering for you . . .@Fat Disgrace.4275 said:@Sviel.7493 said:@Gop.8713 Please explain how I have access to tools that are in PoF. If this is some lame troll attempt saying that I just have to shell out for the expansion, you might as well just come out with it. Or, really, you can say anything at all instead of this absurd tease routine.What? I don't get it, what tools are in pof that are not anywhere else? If you're in about the mount it self they buy pof, if you can afford a pc... even a monthly subscription to your isp then you sure as hell can buy pof. I tend to agree. There are probably more ppl in the world who can't afford to buy PoF than there are ppl who can, but those ppl don't spend their idle time lamenting their inability to adapt to game mechanics on internet forums . . .@sephiroth.4217 said:@Fat Disgrace.4275 said:@Sviel.7493 said:@Gop.8713 Please explain how I have access to tools that are in PoF. If this is some lame troll attempt saying that I just have to shell out for the expansion, you might as well just come out with it. Or, really, you can say anything at all instead of this absurd tease routine.What? I don't get it, what tools are in pof that are not anywhere else? If you're in about the mount it self they buy pof, if you can afford a pc... even a monthly subscription to your isp then you sure as hell can buy pof. maybe he/she is not old enough to have a job yet? maybe mummy and daddy doesnt give him as much pocket money as others... maybe he has debts... who knows.either way its an interesting point to level the playing field and remove pay to win factors from pvp environments.I see what you're saying, but anet has a VERY player-friendly business model and I'm not sure keeping up with the latest release can really be considered p2w, esp when there have only been three releases in seven years . . .its a pvp environment and those who fork out money have an advantage. it's that simple to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gop.8713 Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 @sephiroth.4217 said:@Gop.8713 said:@Sviel.7493 said:@Gop.8713 Please explain how I have access to tools that are in PoF. If this is some lame troll attempt saying that I just have to shell out for the expansion, you might as well just come out with it. Or, really, you can say anything at all instead of this absurd tease routine.I don't have any opinion at all about what you 'should' do. I'm just pointing out that all the same options that are available to everyone else are available to you, and the choices you make are your responsibility, they are not forced upon you . . .If you want to change 'I can't adapt' to 'Ive chosen not to adapt', I'd agree with you and I think it would be helpful and empowering for you . . .@Fat Disgrace.4275 said:@Sviel.7493 said:@Gop.8713 Please explain how I have access to tools that are in PoF. If this is some lame troll attempt saying that I just have to shell out for the expansion, you might as well just come out with it. Or, really, you can say anything at all instead of this absurd tease routine.What? I don't get it, what tools are in pof that are not anywhere else? If you're in about the mount it self they buy pof, if you can afford a pc... even a monthly subscription to your isp then you sure as hell can buy pof. I tend to agree. There are probably more ppl in the world who can't afford to buy PoF than there are ppl who can, but those ppl don't spend their idle time lamenting their inability to adapt to game mechanics on internet forums . . .@sephiroth.4217 said:@Fat Disgrace.4275 said:@Sviel.7493 said:@Gop.8713 Please explain how I have access to tools that are in PoF. If this is some lame troll attempt saying that I just have to shell out for the expansion, you might as well just come out with it. Or, really, you can say anything at all instead of this absurd tease routine.What? I don't get it, what tools are in pof that are not anywhere else? If you're in about the mount it self they buy pof, if you can afford a pc... even a monthly subscription to your isp then you sure as hell can buy pof. maybe he/she is not old enough to have a job yet? maybe mummy and daddy doesnt give him as much pocket money as others... maybe he has debts... who knows.either way its an interesting point to level the playing field and remove pay to win factors from pvp environments.I see what you're saying, but anet has a VERY player-friendly business model and I'm not sure keeping up with the latest release can really be considered p2w, esp when there have only been three releases in seven years . . .its a pvp environment and those who fork out money have an advantage. it's that simple to me.You have to buy the game to enjoy its features. It's simple to me . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sviel.7493 Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 @Gop.8713 said:I don't have any opinion at all about what you 'should' do. I'm just pointing out that all the same options that are available to everyone else are available to you, and the choices you make are your responsibility, they are not forced upon you . . .If you want to change 'I can't adapt' to 'Ive chosen not to adapt', I'd agree with you and I think it would be helpful and empowering for you . . .You're like the real life GoP. I bet you'd tell a gay person that they can totally see their loved one in the hospital--they just have to adapt and love someone of the opposite sex. But they definitely have access to the same rights as everyone else.Top quality trolling right there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArchonWing.9480 Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 Ironically, most people complaining about being dismounted and being 50:1'd are usually the people that ride their mount safely to a zerg to 50:1 people.Yes you have to pay attention when you leave spawn. Oh the horror. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gop.8713 Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 @Sviel.7493 said:@Gop.8713 said:I don't have any opinion at all about what you 'should' do. I'm just pointing out that all the same options that are available to everyone else are available to you, and the choices you make are your responsibility, they are not forced upon you . . .If you want to change 'I can't adapt' to 'Ive chosen not to adapt', I'd agree with you and I think it would be helpful and empowering for you . . .You're like the real life GoP. I bet you'd tell a gay person that they can totally see their loved one in the hospital--they just have to adapt and love someone of the opposite sex. But they definitely have access to the same rights as everyone else.Top quality trolling right there.That's quite the slur. I'm sorry my efforts to help you help yourself have created this emotional response from you :( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psycoprophet.8107 Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 @Shaogin.2679 said:As someone that doesn't do WvW much, I don't see the issue here. So WvW is basically a big open world PvP map. It is a huge warzone. In this warzone players group together in large armies and fight for territories. Other players form small squads or roam solo and protect supply lines and smaller objectives and pick off enemy reinforcements. Now to me, this sounds like WvW presents an opportunity for many strategies and interesting battles. When the Warclaw first came around, I thought it was great because now you didn't have to build for speed to keep up with a group or catch up to the zerg. But it also made anything outside of zerg fights boring since roaming enemies would just run around staring each other down from the safety of their mounts. I found it to be really boring when I would get on to flip camps. Now with the dismount skill, you can still keep up or return to the zerg without changing your build, but now there is still a risk when you run into enemies as there should be. Why would people complain about being ganked by roamers? They are simply doing their job. The real question is, why would you place yourself in a position to where you can be ganked by roamers? If you were in a zerg and died, then you shouldn't just have safe passage back to your zerg. That doesn't make any sense. If you can sneak back to your zerg, cool. If you can't then wait for other zergers to respawn and then move out as a group. We have this same problem in sPvP where our team loses the mid fight, and instead of regrouping and attacking together, people will trickle back in to the mid fight 1 by 1 taking on 2 to 4 enemies and just constantly feeding the enemy team free kills. I don't know, this is just my opinion as an outsider looking in.U sir are a good man or woman.Wvw needs more players such as urself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sephiroth.4217 Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 @Gop.8713 said:@sephiroth.4217 said:@Gop.8713 said:@Sviel.7493 said:@Gop.8713 Please explain how I have access to tools that are in PoF. If this is some lame troll attempt saying that I just have to shell out for the expansion, you might as well just come out with it. Or, really, you can say anything at all instead of this absurd tease routine.I don't have any opinion at all about what you 'should' do. I'm just pointing out that all the same options that are available to everyone else are available to you, and the choices you make are your responsibility, they are not forced upon you . . .If you want to change 'I can't adapt' to 'Ive chosen not to adapt', I'd agree with you and I think it would be helpful and empowering for you . . .@Fat Disgrace.4275 said:@Sviel.7493 said:@Gop.8713 Please explain how I have access to tools that are in PoF. If this is some lame troll attempt saying that I just have to shell out for the expansion, you might as well just come out with it. Or, really, you can say anything at all instead of this absurd tease routine.What? I don't get it, what tools are in pof that are not anywhere else? If you're in about the mount it self they buy pof, if you can afford a pc... even a monthly subscription to your isp then you sure as hell can buy pof. I tend to agree. There are probably more ppl in the world who can't afford to buy PoF than there are ppl who can, but those ppl don't spend their idle time lamenting their inability to adapt to game mechanics on internet forums . . .@sephiroth.4217 said:@Fat Disgrace.4275 said:@Sviel.7493 said:@Gop.8713 Please explain how I have access to tools that are in PoF. If this is some lame troll attempt saying that I just have to shell out for the expansion, you might as well just come out with it. Or, really, you can say anything at all instead of this absurd tease routine.What? I don't get it, what tools are in pof that are not anywhere else? If you're in about the mount it self they buy pof, if you can afford a pc... even a monthly subscription to your isp then you sure as hell can buy pof. maybe he/she is not old enough to have a job yet? maybe mummy and daddy doesnt give him as much pocket money as others... maybe he has debts... who knows.either way its an interesting point to level the playing field and remove pay to win factors from pvp environments.I see what you're saying, but anet has a VERY player-friendly business model and I'm not sure keeping up with the latest release can really be considered p2w, esp when there have only been three releases in seven years . . .its a pvp environment and those who fork out money have an advantage. it's that simple to me.You have to buy the game to enjoy its features. It's simple to me . . .I agree on that for PvE otherwise its a pay to win model when applied to PvP.I just want WvW to be a healthy game mode for all players. I want it to attract more players not exclude. Just me though... I actually care about WvW and its understandable if others don't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gop.8713 Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 @sephiroth.4217 said:@Gop.8713 said:@sephiroth.4217 said:@Gop.8713 said:@Sviel.7493 said:@Gop.8713 Please explain how I have access to tools that are in PoF. If this is some lame troll attempt saying that I just have to shell out for the expansion, you might as well just come out with it. Or, really, you can say anything at all instead of this absurd tease routine.I don't have any opinion at all about what you 'should' do. I'm just pointing out that all the same options that are available to everyone else are available to you, and the choices you make are your responsibility, they are not forced upon you . . .If you want to change 'I can't adapt' to 'Ive chosen not to adapt', I'd agree with you and I think it would be helpful and empowering for you . . .@Fat Disgrace.4275 said:@Sviel.7493 said:@Gop.8713 Please explain how I have access to tools that are in PoF. If this is some lame troll attempt saying that I just have to shell out for the expansion, you might as well just come out with it. Or, really, you can say anything at all instead of this absurd tease routine.What? I don't get it, what tools are in pof that are not anywhere else? If you're in about the mount it self they buy pof, if you can afford a pc... even a monthly subscription to your isp then you sure as hell can buy pof. I tend to agree. There are probably more ppl in the world who can't afford to buy PoF than there are ppl who can, but those ppl don't spend their idle time lamenting their inability to adapt to game mechanics on internet forums . . .@sephiroth.4217 said:@Fat Disgrace.4275 said:@Sviel.7493 said:@Gop.8713 Please explain how I have access to tools that are in PoF. If this is some lame troll attempt saying that I just have to shell out for the expansion, you might as well just come out with it. Or, really, you can say anything at all instead of this absurd tease routine.What? I don't get it, what tools are in pof that are not anywhere else? If you're in about the mount it self they buy pof, if you can afford a pc... even a monthly subscription to your isp then you sure as hell can buy pof. maybe he/she is not old enough to have a job yet? maybe mummy and daddy doesnt give him as much pocket money as others... maybe he has debts... who knows.either way its an interesting point to level the playing field and remove pay to win factors from pvp environments.I see what you're saying, but anet has a VERY player-friendly business model and I'm not sure keeping up with the latest release can really be considered p2w, esp when there have only been three releases in seven years . . .its a pvp environment and those who fork out money have an advantage. it's that simple to me.You have to buy the game to enjoy its features. It's simple to me . . .I agree on that for PvE otherwise its a pay to win model when applied to PvP.I just want WvW to be a healthy game mode for all players. I want it to attract more players not exclude. Just me though... I actually care about WvW and its understandable if others don't.Sure if they wanted to give the game away for free to players of competitive modes that would be great, I just don't see how it's a viable business model. Compare your perspective to the thread asking for ways to monetize wvw to keep it afloat . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sephiroth.4217 Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 @Gop.8713 said:@sephiroth.4217 said:@Gop.8713 said:@sephiroth.4217 said:@Gop.8713 said:@Sviel.7493 said:@Gop.8713 Please explain how I have access to tools that are in PoF. If this is some lame troll attempt saying that I just have to shell out for the expansion, you might as well just come out with it. Or, really, you can say anything at all instead of this absurd tease routine.I don't have any opinion at all about what you 'should' do. I'm just pointing out that all the same options that are available to everyone else are available to you, and the choices you make are your responsibility, they are not forced upon you . . .If you want to change 'I can't adapt' to 'Ive chosen not to adapt', I'd agree with you and I think it would be helpful and empowering for you . . .@Fat Disgrace.4275 said:@Sviel.7493 said:@Gop.8713 Please explain how I have access to tools that are in PoF. If this is some lame troll attempt saying that I just have to shell out for the expansion, you might as well just come out with it. Or, really, you can say anything at all instead of this absurd tease routine.What? I don't get it, what tools are in pof that are not anywhere else? If you're in about the mount it self they buy pof, if you can afford a pc... even a monthly subscription to your isp then you sure as hell can buy pof. I tend to agree. There are probably more ppl in the world who can't afford to buy PoF than there are ppl who can, but those ppl don't spend their idle time lamenting their inability to adapt to game mechanics on internet forums . . .@sephiroth.4217 said:@Fat Disgrace.4275 said:@Sviel.7493 said:@Gop.8713 Please explain how I have access to tools that are in PoF. If this is some lame troll attempt saying that I just have to shell out for the expansion, you might as well just come out with it. Or, really, you can say anything at all instead of this absurd tease routine.What? I don't get it, what tools are in pof that are not anywhere else? If you're in about the mount it self they buy pof, if you can afford a pc... even a monthly subscription to your isp then you sure as hell can buy pof. maybe he/she is not old enough to have a job yet? maybe mummy and daddy doesnt give him as much pocket money as others... maybe he has debts... who knows.either way its an interesting point to level the playing field and remove pay to win factors from pvp environments.I see what you're saying, but anet has a VERY player-friendly business model and I'm not sure keeping up with the latest release can really be considered p2w, esp when there have only been three releases in seven years . . .its a pvp environment and those who fork out money have an advantage. it's that simple to me.You have to buy the game to enjoy its features. It's simple to me . . .I agree on that for PvE otherwise its a pay to win model when applied to PvP.I just want WvW to be a healthy game mode for all players. I want it to attract more players not exclude. Just me though... I actually care about WvW and its understandable if others don't.Sure if they wanted to give the game away for free to players of competitive modes that would be great, I just don't see how it's a viable business model. Compare your perspective to the thread asking for ways to monetize wvw to keep it afloat . . .PoF has many great features on release but Warclaw definitely wasnt one of them. That came separately and much later down the track. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gop.8713 Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 @sephiroth.4217 said:@Gop.8713 said:@sephiroth.4217 said:@Gop.8713 said:@sephiroth.4217 said:@Gop.8713 said:@Sviel.7493 said:@Gop.8713 Please explain how I have access to tools that are in PoF. If this is some lame troll attempt saying that I just have to shell out for the expansion, you might as well just come out with it. Or, really, you can say anything at all instead of this absurd tease routine.I don't have any opinion at all about what you 'should' do. I'm just pointing out that all the same options that are available to everyone else are available to you, and the choices you make are your responsibility, they are not forced upon you . . .If you want to change 'I can't adapt' to 'Ive chosen not to adapt', I'd agree with you and I think it would be helpful and empowering for you . . .@Fat Disgrace.4275 said:@Sviel.7493 said:@Gop.8713 Please explain how I have access to tools that are in PoF. If this is some lame troll attempt saying that I just have to shell out for the expansion, you might as well just come out with it. Or, really, you can say anything at all instead of this absurd tease routine.What? I don't get it, what tools are in pof that are not anywhere else? If you're in about the mount it self they buy pof, if you can afford a pc... even a monthly subscription to your isp then you sure as hell can buy pof. I tend to agree. There are probably more ppl in the world who can't afford to buy PoF than there are ppl who can, but those ppl don't spend their idle time lamenting their inability to adapt to game mechanics on internet forums . . .@sephiroth.4217 said:@Fat Disgrace.4275 said:@Sviel.7493 said:@Gop.8713 Please explain how I have access to tools that are in PoF. If this is some lame troll attempt saying that I just have to shell out for the expansion, you might as well just come out with it. Or, really, you can say anything at all instead of this absurd tease routine.What? I don't get it, what tools are in pof that are not anywhere else? If you're in about the mount it self they buy pof, if you can afford a pc... even a monthly subscription to your isp then you sure as hell can buy pof. maybe he/she is not old enough to have a job yet? maybe mummy and daddy doesnt give him as much pocket money as others... maybe he has debts... who knows.either way its an interesting point to level the playing field and remove pay to win factors from pvp environments.I see what you're saying, but anet has a VERY player-friendly business model and I'm not sure keeping up with the latest release can really be considered p2w, esp when there have only been three releases in seven years . . .its a pvp environment and those who fork out money have an advantage. it's that simple to me.You have to buy the game to enjoy its features. It's simple to me . . .I agree on that for PvE otherwise its a pay to win model when applied to PvP.I just want WvW to be a healthy game mode for all players. I want it to attract more players not exclude. Just me though... I actually care about WvW and its understandable if others don't.Sure if they wanted to give the game away for free to players of competitive modes that would be great, I just don't see how it's a viable business model. Compare your perspective to the thread asking for ways to monetize wvw to keep it afloat . . .PoF has many great features on release but Warclaw definitely wasnt one of them. That came separately and much later down the track. We seem to be talking about different things now . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sephiroth.4217 Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 @Gop.8713 said:@sephiroth.4217 said:@Gop.8713 said:@sephiroth.4217 said:@Gop.8713 said:@sephiroth.4217 said:@Gop.8713 said:@Sviel.7493 said:@Gop.8713 Please explain how I have access to tools that are in PoF. If this is some lame troll attempt saying that I just have to shell out for the expansion, you might as well just come out with it. Or, really, you can say anything at all instead of this absurd tease routine.I don't have any opinion at all about what you 'should' do. I'm just pointing out that all the same options that are available to everyone else are available to you, and the choices you make are your responsibility, they are not forced upon you . . .If you want to change 'I can't adapt' to 'Ive chosen not to adapt', I'd agree with you and I think it would be helpful and empowering for you . . .@Fat Disgrace.4275 said:@Sviel.7493 said:@Gop.8713 Please explain how I have access to tools that are in PoF. If this is some lame troll attempt saying that I just have to shell out for the expansion, you might as well just come out with it. Or, really, you can say anything at all instead of this absurd tease routine.What? I don't get it, what tools are in pof that are not anywhere else? If you're in about the mount it self they buy pof, if you can afford a pc... even a monthly subscription to your isp then you sure as hell can buy pof. I tend to agree. There are probably more ppl in the world who can't afford to buy PoF than there are ppl who can, but those ppl don't spend their idle time lamenting their inability to adapt to game mechanics on internet forums . . .@sephiroth.4217 said:@Fat Disgrace.4275 said:@Sviel.7493 said:@Gop.8713 Please explain how I have access to tools that are in PoF. If this is some lame troll attempt saying that I just have to shell out for the expansion, you might as well just come out with it. Or, really, you can say anything at all instead of this absurd tease routine.What? I don't get it, what tools are in pof that are not anywhere else? If you're in about the mount it self they buy pof, if you can afford a pc... even a monthly subscription to your isp then you sure as hell can buy pof. maybe he/she is not old enough to have a job yet? maybe mummy and daddy doesnt give him as much pocket money as others... maybe he has debts... who knows.either way its an interesting point to level the playing field and remove pay to win factors from pvp environments.I see what you're saying, but anet has a VERY player-friendly business model and I'm not sure keeping up with the latest release can really be considered p2w, esp when there have only been three releases in seven years . . .its a pvp environment and those who fork out money have an advantage. it's that simple to me.You have to buy the game to enjoy its features. It's simple to me . . .I agree on that for PvE otherwise its a pay to win model when applied to PvP.I just want WvW to be a healthy game mode for all players. I want it to attract more players not exclude. Just me though... I actually care about WvW and its understandable if others don't.Sure if they wanted to give the game away for free to players of competitive modes that would be great, I just don't see how it's a viable business model. Compare your perspective to the thread asking for ways to monetize wvw to keep it afloat . . .PoF has many great features on release but Warclaw definitely wasnt one of them. That came separately and much later down the track. We seem to be talking about different things now . . .We are? I was on the topic of it being interesting to level out the playing field in a pvp environment. You said they should buy PoF for the WvW mount or feature of which I responded that Warclaw wasnt even a PoF feature, it was introduced much later.but ok, lets leave it here before we have further communication problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gop.8713 Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 @sephiroth.4217 said:@Gop.8713 said:@sephiroth.4217 said:@Gop.8713 said:@sephiroth.4217 said:@Gop.8713 said:@sephiroth.4217 said:@Gop.8713 said:@Sviel.7493 said:@Gop.8713 Please explain how I have access to tools that are in PoF. If this is some lame troll attempt saying that I just have to shell out for the expansion, you might as well just come out with it. Or, really, you can say anything at all instead of this absurd tease routine.I don't have any opinion at all about what you 'should' do. I'm just pointing out that all the same options that are available to everyone else are available to you, and the choices you make are your responsibility, they are not forced upon you . . .If you want to change 'I can't adapt' to 'Ive chosen not to adapt', I'd agree with you and I think it would be helpful and empowering for you . . .@Fat Disgrace.4275 said:@Sviel.7493 said:@Gop.8713 Please explain how I have access to tools that are in PoF. If this is some lame troll attempt saying that I just have to shell out for the expansion, you might as well just come out with it. Or, really, you can say anything at all instead of this absurd tease routine.What? I don't get it, what tools are in pof that are not anywhere else? If you're in about the mount it self they buy pof, if you can afford a pc... even a monthly subscription to your isp then you sure as hell can buy pof. I tend to agree. There are probably more ppl in the world who can't afford to buy PoF than there are ppl who can, but those ppl don't spend their idle time lamenting their inability to adapt to game mechanics on internet forums . . .@sephiroth.4217 said:@Fat Disgrace.4275 said:@Sviel.7493 said:@Gop.8713 Please explain how I have access to tools that are in PoF. If this is some lame troll attempt saying that I just have to shell out for the expansion, you might as well just come out with it. Or, really, you can say anything at all instead of this absurd tease routine.What? I don't get it, what tools are in pof that are not anywhere else? If you're in about the mount it self they buy pof, if you can afford a pc... even a monthly subscription to your isp then you sure as hell can buy pof. maybe he/she is not old enough to have a job yet? maybe mummy and daddy doesnt give him as much pocket money as others... maybe he has debts... who knows.either way its an interesting point to level the playing field and remove pay to win factors from pvp environments.I see what you're saying, but anet has a VERY player-friendly business model and I'm not sure keeping up with the latest release can really be considered p2w, esp when there have only been three releases in seven years . . .its a pvp environment and those who fork out money have an advantage. it's that simple to me.You have to buy the game to enjoy its features. It's simple to me . . .I agree on that for PvE otherwise its a pay to win model when applied to PvP.I just want WvW to be a healthy game mode for all players. I want it to attract more players not exclude. Just me though... I actually care about WvW and its understandable if others don't.Sure if they wanted to give the game away for free to players of competitive modes that would be great, I just don't see how it's a viable business model. Compare your perspective to the thread asking for ways to monetize wvw to keep it afloat . . .PoF has many great features on release but Warclaw definitely wasnt one of them. That came separately and much later down the track. We seem to be talking about different things now . . .We are? I was on the topic of it being interesting to level out the playing field in a pvp environment. You said they should buy PoF for the WvW mount or feature of which I responded that Warclaw wasnt even a PoF feature, it was introduced much later.but ok, lets leave it here before we have further communication problems.Yes, we definitely are. I very specifically did not recommend that anyone 'should' do anything . . .What actually happened was someone complained that they did not have access to the same tools as everyone else, which is untrue . . .You mentioned that if everything was given to everyone for free that would be great, and I agreed, but pointed out that it isn't a viable business model . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sephiroth.4217 Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 @Gop.8713 said:@sephiroth.4217 said:@Gop.8713 said:@sephiroth.4217 said:@Gop.8713 said:@sephiroth.4217 said:@Gop.8713 said:@sephiroth.4217 said:@Gop.8713 said:@Sviel.7493 said:@Gop.8713 Please explain how I have access to tools that are in PoF. If this is some lame troll attempt saying that I just have to shell out for the expansion, you might as well just come out with it. Or, really, you can say anything at all instead of this absurd tease routine.I don't have any opinion at all about what you 'should' do. I'm just pointing out that all the same options that are available to everyone else are available to you, and the choices you make are your responsibility, they are not forced upon you . . .If you want to change 'I can't adapt' to 'Ive chosen not to adapt', I'd agree with you and I think it would be helpful and empowering for you . . .@Fat Disgrace.4275 said:@Sviel.7493 said:@Gop.8713 Please explain how I have access to tools that are in PoF. If this is some lame troll attempt saying that I just have to shell out for the expansion, you might as well just come out with it. Or, really, you can say anything at all instead of this absurd tease routine.What? I don't get it, what tools are in pof that are not anywhere else? If you're in about the mount it self they buy pof, if you can afford a pc... even a monthly subscription to your isp then you sure as hell can buy pof. I tend to agree. There are probably more ppl in the world who can't afford to buy PoF than there are ppl who can, but those ppl don't spend their idle time lamenting their inability to adapt to game mechanics on internet forums . . .@sephiroth.4217 said:@Fat Disgrace.4275 said:@Sviel.7493 said:@Gop.8713 Please explain how I have access to tools that are in PoF. If this is some lame troll attempt saying that I just have to shell out for the expansion, you might as well just come out with it. Or, really, you can say anything at all instead of this absurd tease routine.What? I don't get it, what tools are in pof that are not anywhere else? If you're in about the mount it self they buy pof, if you can afford a pc... even a monthly subscription to your isp then you sure as hell can buy pof. maybe he/she is not old enough to have a job yet? maybe mummy and daddy doesnt give him as much pocket money as others... maybe he has debts... who knows.either way its an interesting point to level the playing field and remove pay to win factors from pvp environments.I see what you're saying, but anet has a VERY player-friendly business model and I'm not sure keeping up with the latest release can really be considered p2w, esp when there have only been three releases in seven years . . .its a pvp environment and those who fork out money have an advantage. it's that simple to me.You have to buy the game to enjoy its features. It's simple to me . . .I agree on that for PvE otherwise its a pay to win model when applied to PvP.I just want WvW to be a healthy game mode for all players. I want it to attract more players not exclude. Just me though... I actually care about WvW and its understandable if others don't.Sure if they wanted to give the game away for free to players of competitive modes that would be great, I just don't see how it's a viable business model. Compare your perspective to the thread asking for ways to monetize wvw to keep it afloat . . .PoF has many great features on release but Warclaw definitely wasnt one of them. That came separately and much later down the track. We seem to be talking about different things now . . .We are? I was on the topic of it being interesting to level out the playing field in a pvp environment. You said they should buy PoF for the WvW mount or feature of which I responded that Warclaw wasnt even a PoF feature, it was introduced much later.but ok, lets leave it here before we have further communication problems.Yes, we definitely are. I very specifically did not recommend that anyone 'should' do anything . . .What actually happened was someone complained that they did not have access to the same tools as everyone else, which is untrue . . .You mentioned that if everything was given to everyone for free that would be great, and I agreed, but pointed out that it isn't a viable business model . . .well if you hand out warclaw to even the playing field then they can buy the skins for Warclaw? if its an even playing field it attracts more players and those players could pay for transfers if monetizing is the topic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gop.8713 Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 @sephiroth.4217 said:@Gop.8713 said:@sephiroth.4217 said:@Gop.8713 said:@sephiroth.4217 said:@Gop.8713 said:@sephiroth.4217 said:@Gop.8713 said:@sephiroth.4217 said:@Gop.8713 said:@Sviel.7493 said:@Gop.8713 Please explain how I have access to tools that are in PoF. If this is some lame troll attempt saying that I just have to shell out for the expansion, you might as well just come out with it. Or, really, you can say anything at all instead of this absurd tease routine.I don't have any opinion at all about what you 'should' do. I'm just pointing out that all the same options that are available to everyone else are available to you, and the choices you make are your responsibility, they are not forced upon you . . .If you want to change 'I can't adapt' to 'Ive chosen not to adapt', I'd agree with you and I think it would be helpful and empowering for you . . .@Fat Disgrace.4275 said:@Sviel.7493 said:@Gop.8713 Please explain how I have access to tools that are in PoF. If this is some lame troll attempt saying that I just have to shell out for the expansion, you might as well just come out with it. Or, really, you can say anything at all instead of this absurd tease routine.What? I don't get it, what tools are in pof that are not anywhere else? If you're in about the mount it self they buy pof, if you can afford a pc... even a monthly subscription to your isp then you sure as hell can buy pof. I tend to agree. There are probably more ppl in the world who can't afford to buy PoF than there are ppl who can, but those ppl don't spend their idle time lamenting their inability to adapt to game mechanics on internet forums . . .@sephiroth.4217 said:@Fat Disgrace.4275 said:@Sviel.7493 said:@Gop.8713 Please explain how I have access to tools that are in PoF. If this is some lame troll attempt saying that I just have to shell out for the expansion, you might as well just come out with it. Or, really, you can say anything at all instead of this absurd tease routine.What? I don't get it, what tools are in pof that are not anywhere else? If you're in about the mount it self they buy pof, if you can afford a pc... even a monthly subscription to your isp then you sure as hell can buy pof. maybe he/she is not old enough to have a job yet? maybe mummy and daddy doesnt give him as much pocket money as others... maybe he has debts... who knows.either way its an interesting point to level the playing field and remove pay to win factors from pvp environments.I see what you're saying, but anet has a VERY player-friendly business model and I'm not sure keeping up with the latest release can really be considered p2w, esp when there have only been three releases in seven years . . .its a pvp environment and those who fork out money have an advantage. it's that simple to me.You have to buy the game to enjoy its features. It's simple to me . . .I agree on that for PvE otherwise its a pay to win model when applied to PvP.I just want WvW to be a healthy game mode for all players. I want it to attract more players not exclude. Just me though... I actually care about WvW and its understandable if others don't.Sure if they wanted to give the game away for free to players of competitive modes that would be great, I just don't see how it's a viable business model. Compare your perspective to the thread asking for ways to monetize wvw to keep it afloat . . .PoF has many great features on release but Warclaw definitely wasnt one of them. That came separately and much later down the track. We seem to be talking about different things now . . .We are? I was on the topic of it being interesting to level out the playing field in a pvp environment. You said they should buy PoF for the WvW mount or feature of which I responded that Warclaw wasnt even a PoF feature, it was introduced much later.but ok, lets leave it here before we have further communication problems.Yes, we definitely are. I very specifically did not recommend that anyone 'should' do anything . . .What actually happened was someone complained that they did not have access to the same tools as everyone else, which is untrue . . .You mentioned that if everything was given to everyone for free that would be great, and I agreed, but pointed out that it isn't a viable business model . . .well if you hand out warclaw to even the playing field then they can buy the skins for Warclaw? if its an even playing field it attracts more players and those players could pay for transfers if monetizing is the topic.That seems to be the path they're on now. Future expansions seem pretty unlikely . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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