Stand Your Ground still 30s cooldown.

[ArchonWing.9480]

It's back to 5 targets, but the notes say it should be 45s cooldown in wvw.

[Jski.6180]

It should be a 60 sec cd like all self stab ability. If your support stab is stronger then self stab your effectively making a class needed to do any thing and removes a lot of counter play for each player. It simply removes interaction between players.

[Dawdler.8521]

There are lots of skills that arent doing what they are supposed, some bad, some that work in your advantage. Enjoy the cd while it lasts.

[Stand The Wall.6987]

it should stay at 30 sec so wvw doesn't turn into pirate ship or double fb. some people just don't get it lol... guards having the tools to do their thing means the rest of the party can do theirs. fb is op and should be nerfed BUT NOT STAB SINCE ITS THE MOST IMPORTANT BOON IN THE GAME.

[bluberblasen.9684]

it should use the 60 second cooldown to match the same cooldown as earth armor on ele.Or it should use 72 cooldown because its better than earth armor ( 5 target skill + Retaliation VS 1 target skill )

[ArchonWing.9480]

@Jski.6180 said:It should be a 60 sec cd like all self stab ability. If your support stab is stronger then self stab your effectively making a class needed to do any thing and removes a lot of counter play for each player. It simply removes interaction between players.

If you can't deliver 2 ccs within 35s, you need to replace your build. Or maybe your scourges because they can't even press a button.

@bluberblasen.9684 said:it should use the 60 second cooldown to match the same cooldown as earth armor on ele.Or it should use 72 cooldown because its better than earth armor ( 5 target skill + Retaliation VS 1 target skill )

Sure, let me mist away into a portal and it's a deal.

[Jski.6180]

@ArchonWing.9480 said:

@Jski.6180 said:It should be a 60 sec cd like all self stab ability. If your support stab is stronger then self stab your effectively making a class needed to do any thing and removes a lot of counter play for each player. It simply removes interaction between players.

If you can't deliver 2 ccs within 35s, you need to replace your build.

@bluberblasen.9684 said:it should use the 60 second cooldown to match the same cooldown as earth armor on ele.Or it should use 72 cooldown because its better than earth armor ( 5 target skill + Retaliation VS 1 target skill )

Sure, let me mist away into a portal and it's a deal.

Stand your ground gives you 5 stacks of stab so some one needs to deliver 6 hard cc with in 35 sec and that not the issue the issue is that stand your ground is much stronger then self stab skills and that not good for the game. In a lot of ways stand your ground is the example of what wvw is so messed up in making required classes for groups. If you gave every support class a stand your ground you would see far less gurds because its a boring class to play to start with. If gurd cant stand with out stab boons in wvw then other effects needs to be updated for sure but making a class a one trick effect that is required to play is bad for your team and for the person playing that one class.

Stand your ground needs to be balanced by making it 60 sec cd OR making it into a stun brake aoe with some other def boons not stab.

[ArchonWing.9480]

@Jski.6180 said:

@ArchonWing.9480 said:

@Jski.6180 said:It should be a 60 sec cd like all self stab ability. If your support stab is stronger then self stab your effectively making a class needed to do any thing and removes a lot of counter play for each player. It simply removes interaction between players.

If you can't deliver 2 ccs within 35s, you need to replace your build.

@bluberblasen.9684 said:it should use the 60 second cooldown to match the same cooldown as earth armor on ele.Or it should use 72 cooldown because its better than earth armor ( 5 target skill + Retaliation VS 1 target skill )

Sure, let me mist away into a portal and it's a deal.

Stand your ground gives you 5 stacks of stab so some one needs to deliver 6 hard cc with in 35 sec and that not the issue the issue is that stand your ground is much stronger then self stab skills and that not good for the game. In a lot of ways stand your ground is the example of what wvw is so messed up in making required classes for groups. If you gave every support class a stand your ground you would see far less gurds because its a boring class to play to start with. If gurd cant stand with out stab boons in wvw then other effects needs to be updated for sure but making a class a one trick effect that is required to play is bad for your team and for the person playing that one class.

Stand your ground needs to be balanced by making it 60 sec cd OR making it into a stun brake aoe with some other def boons not stab.

Have you ever heard of boonstrip? And also the 35s refers to the time stability ran out.

Other classes also have invuls to protect themselves. Guardian has like 2s of invul and it's not even taken on firebrands.

[Jski.6180]

@ArchonWing.9480 said:

@Jski.6180 said:

@ArchonWing.9480 said:

@Jski.6180 said:It should be a 60 sec cd like all self stab ability. If your support stab is stronger then self stab your effectively making a class needed to do any thing and removes a lot of counter play for each player. It simply removes interaction between players.

If you can't deliver 2 ccs within 35s, you need to replace your build.

@bluberblasen.9684 said:it should use the 60 second cooldown to match the same cooldown as earth armor on ele.Or it should use 72 cooldown because its better than earth armor ( 5 target skill + Retaliation VS 1 target skill )

Sure, let me mist away into a portal and it's a deal.

Stand your ground gives you 5 stacks of stab so some one needs to deliver 6 hard cc with in 35 sec and that not the issue the issue is that stand your ground is much stronger then self stab skills and that not good for the game. In a lot of ways stand your ground is the example of what wvw is so messed up in making required classes for groups. If you gave every support class a stand your ground you would see far less gurds because its a boring class to play to start with. If gurd cant stand with out stab boons in wvw then other effects needs to be updated for sure but making a class a one trick effect that is required to play is bad for your team and for the person playing that one class.

Stand your ground needs to be balanced by making it 60 sec cd OR making it into a stun brake aoe with some other def boons not stab.

Have you ever heard of boonstrip? And also the 35s refers to the time stability ran out.

Other classes also have invuls to protect themselves. Guardian has like 2s of invul and it's not even taken on firebrands. T

Sadly not every class has boonstrip and you cant forces boonstrip to hit the boons you want. The only thing for sure you can say to deal with stand your ground is to wait out the boon duration OR land hard cc (something all classes can do but as a massive cost). Few things guards have blocks more then they have invul and more then most classes have invul as well. I feel like you do not understand just how tankly the guard class is though its other boons.

[Gwaihir.1745]

@Dawdler.8521 said:There are lots of skills that arent doing what they are supposed, some bad, some that work in your advantage. Enjoy the cd while it lasts.

This guy want to watch wvw burn in pirate ship hell. How can he no see how dangerously close we are to it.

[ArchonWing.9480]

@Jski.6180 said:

@ArchonWing.9480 said:

@Jski.6180 said:

@ArchonWing.9480 said:

@Jski.6180 said:It should be a 60 sec cd like all self stab ability. If your support stab is stronger then self stab your effectively making a class needed to do any thing and removes a lot of counter play for each player. It simply removes interaction between players.

If you can't deliver 2 ccs within 35s, you need to replace your build.

@bluberblasen.9684 said:it should use the 60 second cooldown to match the same cooldown as earth armor on ele.Or it should use 72 cooldown because its better than earth armor ( 5 target skill + Retaliation VS 1 target skill )

Sure, let me mist away into a portal and it's a deal.

Stand your ground gives you 5 stacks of stab so some one needs to deliver 6 hard cc with in 35 sec and that not the issue the issue is that stand your ground is much stronger then self stab skills and that not good for the game. In a lot of ways stand your ground is the example of what wvw is so messed up in making required classes for groups. If you gave every support class a stand your ground you would see far less gurds because its a boring class to play to start with. If gurd cant stand with out stab boons in wvw then other effects needs to be updated for sure but making a class a one trick effect that is required to play is bad for your team and for the person playing that one class.

Stand your ground needs to be balanced by making it 60 sec cd OR making it into a stun brake aoe with some other def boons not stab.

Have you ever heard of boonstrip? And also the 35s refers to the time stability ran out.

Other classes also have invuls to protect themselves. Guardian has like 2s of invul and it's not even taken on firebrands. T

Sadly not every class has boonstrip and you cant forces boonstrip to hit the boons you want. The only thing for sure you can say to deal with stand your ground is to wait out the boon duration OR land hard cc (something all classes can do but as a massive cost). Few things guards have blocks more then they have invul and more then most classes have invul as well. I feel like you do not understand just how tankly the guard class is though its other boons.

If you don't have spellbreakers/scourges, you're going to lose anyways.

If you're referring to a small scale scenario, well guardian has 2s of invul, lowest base hp, 2nd worst mobility, only real ranged weapon is on one spec, and doesn't even take stand your ground anyways. You can deal with most of those literally just by walking away from them.

[Jski.6180]

@ArchonWing.9480 said:

@Jski.6180 said:

@ArchonWing.9480 said:

@Jski.6180 said:

@ArchonWing.9480 said:

@Jski.6180 said:It should be a 60 sec cd like all self stab ability. If your support stab is stronger then self stab your effectively making a class needed to do any thing and removes a lot of counter play for each player. It simply removes interaction between players.

If you can't deliver 2 ccs within 35s, you need to replace your build.

@"bluberblasen.9684" said:it should use the 60 second cooldown to match the same cooldown as earth armor on ele.Or it should use 72 cooldown because its better than earth armor ( 5 target skill + Retaliation VS 1 target skill )

Sure, let me mist away into a portal and it's a deal.

Stand your ground gives you 5 stacks of stab so some one needs to deliver 6 hard cc with in 35 sec and that not the issue the issue is that stand your ground is much stronger then self stab skills and that not good for the game. In a lot of ways stand your ground is the example of what wvw is so messed up in making required classes for groups. If you gave every support class a stand your ground you would see far less gurds because its a boring class to play to start with. If gurd cant stand with out stab boons in wvw then other effects needs to be updated for sure but making a class a one trick effect that is required to play is bad for your team and for the person playing that one class.

Stand your ground needs to be balanced by making it 60 sec cd OR making it into a stun brake aoe with some other def boons not stab.

Have you ever heard of boonstrip? And also the 35s refers to the time stability ran out.

Other classes also have invuls to protect themselves. Guardian has like 2s of invul and it's not even taken on firebrands. T

Sadly not every class has boonstrip and you cant forces boonstrip to hit the boons you want. The only thing for sure you can say to deal with stand your ground is to wait out the boon duration OR land hard cc (something all classes can do but as a massive cost). Few things guards have blocks more then they have invul and more then most classes have invul as well. I feel like you do not understand just how tankly the guard class is though its other boons.

If you don't have spellbreakers/scourges, you're going to lose anyways.

If you're referring to a small scale scenario, well guardian has 2s of invul, lowest base hp, 2nd worst mobility, only real ranged weapon is on one spec, and doesn't even take stand your ground anyways. You can deal with most of those literally just by walking away from them.

Well ya if the other team has perma stab because they have a benchmark of "right" classes just like having your benchmark of spellbrakers and scorges. The meta counter the meta but there no other way of build out side of that meta to deal with it. In the older version of the game you had real team comp that could differ. Stab was not as important of a boon but now its every thing and to make things worst is that the stab boon is most used on healing builds making the player base of though FB (lets not joke here to call the meta guard is fooling your self its just FB because of more stab skills) is very boring and tends to causes ppl to hate wvw more then like it.

Every class has the best mobility do not joke your self as long as you have boons like super speed every one moves at the same speed getting back to that meta set up and why ppl use just that meta to deal with other ppl using that meta. Books are FB ranged wepon or do you realy think a staff (is ranged) is FB main wepon?

[ArchonWing.9480]

In the older version of the game you had real team comp that could differ.

lol, you mean 2 guardians a party?

Stab was not as important of a boon but now its every thing and to make things worst is that the stab boon is most used on healing builds making the player base of though FB

The reason why you thought stab wasn't important is because those guardians kept it on you most of the time and there was no corrupt spam. Now that there's actually counter to it, you're feeling the difference.

You know, we could deal with this issue easily by just nerfing CC. That will devalue stability!

[MedievalThings.5417]

@Jski.6180 said:

@ArchonWing.9480 said:

@Jski.6180 said:It should be a 60 sec cd like all self stab ability. If your support stab is stronger then self stab your effectively making a class needed to do any thing and removes a lot of counter play for each player. It simply removes interaction between players.

If you can't deliver 2 ccs within 35s, you need to replace your build.

@bluberblasen.9684 said:it should use the 60 second cooldown to match the same cooldown as earth armor on ele.Or it should use 72 cooldown because its better than earth armor ( 5 target skill + Retaliation VS 1 target skill )

Sure, let me mist away into a portal and it's a deal.

Stand your ground gives you 5 stacks of stab so some one needs to deliver 6 hard cc with in 35 sec and that not the issue the issue is that stand your ground is much stronger then self stab skills and that not good for the game. In a lot of ways stand your ground is the example of what wvw is so messed up in making required classes for groups. If you gave every support class a stand your ground you would see far less gurds because its a boring class to play to start with. If gurd cant stand with out stab boons in wvw then other effects needs to be updated for sure but making a class a one trick effect that is required to play is bad for your team and for the person playing that one class.

Stand your ground needs to be balanced by making it 60 sec cd OR making it into a stun brake aoe with some other def boons not stab.

Pretty much this.

[subversiontwo.7501]

Cmc has commented on it if you actually took time to read the pre-patch update.

He noted that they stopped all further nerfs to stability skills beyond the target cap changes.

If you paid attention to how the changes have affected control-balance you would also have noticed that after the patch there is alot more control and separation going on so further thrusting towards more CC would be negative for the gameplay. It already is a comparative stunfest.

The reason some of us are defending stability also has nothing to do with looking favourable upon a class (like Guardians). It comes from the fact that we are smart and understand that when something is needed and has very averse effects on gameplay when it disappears, it will just make people stack those things more if they are nerfed (like Guardians).

Pay attention. Get smart.

Ps. This is not aimed @OP or anyone specific, the "you" is the collective noun, it's just meant to inform and ventilate a bit in general :3

[ArchonWing.9480]

Well, they didn't edit the final patch notes so I guess their copypasta needs buff. It is very tl;dr though so could have missed.

But thanks for the info.