Balancing.

[Kickpuncher.8109]

Thief Vault - 3 dodges, able to move pretty far distances with a long evasion time and able to do 7k damage at the end of the vault from landing. : I sleepMesmer - able to become invulnerable (like an evasion) and has 2 dodges and doesn't do 7k damage at the end of the mirage cloak: NUKEEE ITTTT

Wowowowowow

[Starbreaker.6507]

I look forward to more high-quality insightful posts that really cut to the heart of the problem.

[Kickpuncher.8109]

@Starbreaker.6507 said:I look forward to more high-quality insightful posts that really cut to the heart of the problem.

Not very hard when you actually play the game

Me staring at anet balance team 0.0

[Leonidrex.5649]

@Kickpuncher.8109 said:

@"Starbreaker.6507" said:I look forward to more high-quality insightful posts that really cut to the heart of the problem.

Not very hard when you actually play the game

Me staring at anet balance team

0.0

me staring at devs 0.0devs staring at us https://imgur.com/gallery/izvZ1jP

[Kickpuncher.8109]

@Leonidrex.5649 said:

@Kickpuncher.8109 said:

@"Starbreaker.6507" said:I look forward to more high-quality insightful posts that really cut to the heart of the problem.

Not very hard when you actually play the game

Me staring at anet balance team

0.0

me staring at devs 0.0devs staring at us

https://imgur.com/gallery/izvZ1jP

Lmao

[UNOwen.7132]

And yet Staff Vault Thief was not viable while Mesmer was top tier. Turns out Mesmer did a lot more than 7k damage with its condi-spam, and it wasnt as easily avoided as Vault was.

[Leonidrex.5649]

@Kickpuncher.8109 said:

@Leonidrex.5649 said:

@Kickpuncher.8109 said:

@"Starbreaker.6507" said:I look forward to more high-quality insightful posts that really cut to the heart of the problem.

Not very hard when you actually play the game

Me staring at anet balance team

0.0

me staring at devs 0.0devs staring at us

https://imgur.com/gallery/izvZ1jP

Lmao

im just waiting for another 3day ban.∠(｀･ω･´)

[Stallic.2397]

Two wrongs don't make a right. One cheese being worst than another isn't an excuse for either existing. Why is mesmer constantly being used as a defense??

[Kickpuncher.8109]

@UNOwen.7132 said:And yet Staff Vault Thief was not viable while Mesmer was top tier. Turns out Mesmer did a lot more than 7k damage with its condi-spam, and it wasnt as easily avoided as Vault was.

and yet the issue wasnt the mirage dodge itself, it was chaotic interruption and other traits synergizing in poor taste with it. But Anet is too short-sided and un-knowledgeable about their own game to know that.

[Kickpuncher.8109]

@Stallic.2397 said:Two wrongs don't make a right. One cheese being worst than another isn't an excuse for either existing. Why is mesmer constantly being used as a defense??

Because Anet didn't see what was actually causing Mesmer to be OP with chaotic interruption and other traits synergizing in poor taste with the build, but instead of nerfing that and fixing build they just nuked it cause they don't know about their own game lol.

it is a meme

[Arheundel.6451]

@Kickpuncher.8109 said:

@Stallic.2397 said:Two wrongs don't make a right. One cheese being worst than another isn't an excuse for either existing. Why is mesmer constantly being used as a defense??

Because Anet didn't see what was actually causing Mesmer to be OP with chaotic interruption and other traits synergizing in poor taste with the build, but instead of nerfing that and fixing build they just nuked it cause they don't know about their own game lol.

it is a meme

QFT

[Dantheman.3589]

Nerfs to staff were good IMO. They reduced spam with damage and bounding dodger nerf, while just becuz of damage modifier you can still do good damage hence less spam. I do however think staff thief is reduced to vault builds though, most likely if a staff build is viable it’s staff/staff with valk daredevil rune and crit strikes- with this it’s possible to land 8-13k vaults and can side node well from what I’ve seen with invigorating precision

[Tharan.9085]

@Kickpuncher.8109 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:And yet Staff Vault Thief was not viable while Mesmer was top tier. Turns out Mesmer did a lot more than 7k damage with its condi-spam, and it wasnt as easily avoided as Vault was.

and yet the issue wasnt the mirage dodge itself, it was chaotic interruption and other traits synergizing in poor taste with it. But Anet is too short-sided and un-knowledgeable about their own game to know that.

And yet the issue was mirage dodge bc it's the most unhealthy spec design in the game

[Kickpuncher.8109]

@Tharan.9085 said:

@Kickpuncher.8109 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:And yet Staff Vault Thief was not viable while Mesmer was top tier. Turns out Mesmer did a lot more than 7k damage with its condi-spam, and it wasnt as easily avoided as Vault was.

and yet the issue wasnt the mirage dodge itself, it was chaotic interruption and other traits synergizing in poor taste with it. But Anet is too short-sided and un-knowledgeable about their own game to know that.

And yet the issue was mirage dodge bc it's the most unhealthy spec design in the game

Literally not true. But i've already said my peace on this twice.

[bravan.3876]

@Kickpuncher.8109 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:Turns out Mesmer did a lot more than 7k damage with its condi-spam, and it wasnt as easily avoided as Vault was.

Good that we didn't nerf that condi dmg spam from clones directly because logic!

@"Tharan.9085" said:

and yet the issue wasnt the mirage dodge itself, it was chaotic interruption and other traits synergizing in poor taste with it. But Anet is too short-sided and un-knowledgeable about their own game to know that.

And yet the issue was mirage dodge bc it's the most unhealthy spec design in the game

Not sure what problems you guys have with a Mesmer can dodge while being stunned. They have so many opportunity costs in their dodge management from the Mirage mechanic as a whole, that this can be easy countered by baiting dodges. In fact i don't even need to hit a cc to hit a Mirage, they run out of dodges very soon, in particular when they use them also offensive (what is the whole point of Mirage, just it failed on Condimirage because bad designed condi ambushes and op normal clone autoattacks do not give any incentive to dodge offensive). If you fail to utilize the mindgame potential this offeres for both sides, then it has nothing to do with MC, it is a l2p issue. It is a strong feature for certain, but it has counterplay and is far away from being "beyond broken". At least on a squishy spec like Mesmer in general build around combining instant and non instant skills for strong combos. Ofc only not broken as long as Mirage cannot dodge for days (what already was nerfed to a lower limit than most other classes pre patch), has no stunbreak on dodge in addition (that got deleted) and only as long as clone ambushes are not too strong (what is still the case for condi clone ambushes post patch). MC was already balanced out by several pre patch nerfs to MC directly and by nerfs to vigor/ endurance reggen and by the inherent costs this spec has since PoF release. The only problem makes it an issue are too strong condi ambushes from clones. That is the only annoying and op thing makes me struggle vs Mirages, i didn't care for their ability to dodge a follow up after eating a cc at all, because i can outplay that and because a Mirage that dodges the cc in the first place gets way more rewarded and for that my cc is not completely neutralized when i hit it. But a Condimirage doesn't have those opporunity costs in dodge management for already mentioned reasons and when they eat the cc they also do not get punished as hard because their clones still do massive passive dmg, means the only reason a Condimirage has nearly zero opportunity costs in dodgemanagement (where all the skill ceiling comes from) and gets literally rewarded for not dodging the cc, are too strong and bad designed condi ambushes.

The most unhealthy designs in the game are passives and facetank sustain by far and not an active dodge that has counterplay.