chrono has ip back

[Stand The Wall.6987]

i've been on a long hiatus and i realize this change is over a year old, but wow this is awesome.

[Veprovina.4876]

I always forget, what is IP again?

[Salt Mode.3780]

yes but they took our distortion away so......

[Stand The Wall.6987]

@Veprovina.4876 said:I always forget, what is IP again?

illusionary persona allows shatters with no clones

[Stand The Wall.6987]

@Salt Mode.3780 said:yes but they took our distortion away so......

meh they have a double block

[Veprovina.4876]

@Stand The Wall.6987 said:

@Veprovina.4876 said:I always forget, what is IP again?

illusionary persona allows shatters with no clones

Ah right, yeah, that's on by default now.But we gave up distortion for it so...

[Kodama.6453]

@Veprovina.4876 said:

@Stand The Wall.6987 said:

@Veprovina.4876 said:I always forget, what is IP again?

illusionary persona allows shatters with no clones

Ah right, yeah, that's on by default now.But we gave up distortion for it so...

Continuum split is able to completely reset your health and cooldowns. Giving up distortion for this powerful effect is how it should have worked from the beginning...

[TheQuickFox.3826]

@Veprovina.4876 said:I always forget, what is IP again?

Internet Protocol.

[Yoci.2481]

@Kodama.6453 said:

@Veprovina.4876 said:

@Stand The Wall.6987 said:

@Veprovina.4876 said:I always forget, what is IP again?

illusionary persona allows shatters with no clones

Ah right, yeah, that's on by default now.But we gave up distortion for it so...

Continuum split is able to completely reset your health and cooldowns. Giving up distortion for this powerful effect is how it should have worked from the beginning...

It's a strong ability that is difficult to balance, I agree with that. But I don't think that the current iteration of Chronomancer would be too strong by getting distortion back. Continuum split is great as an offensive ability, allowing you to spam strong abilities, but it's defensive usefulness is very limited. For instance it is almost always better to dodge an attack than to try to tank it with CS. You will keep all CC effects and conditions that hit you when you leave CS. And your opponent gets to keep all the perks he got by hitting you. Also there is another downside to CS that is rarely discussed: Every second you spend in CS is a second you lose on regaining cool downs. By that I mean if some skill is on a 10 second cool down and you enter a 3 second CS that will effectively add 3 seconds to the 10 second cool down. And that is true for every skill and ability that is currently on cool down, except for the ones that happen to come off cool down during the CS. Effectively you give yourself 1.66 seconds of Chill for every second of CS. And people can just wait at the CS spot and effectively one-shot you as soon as your CS ends. Not that that has ever happened to me... 0:)

[Veprovina.4876]

@Kodama.6453 said:

@Veprovina.4876 said:

@Stand The Wall.6987 said:

@Veprovina.4876 said:I always forget, what is IP again?

illusionary persona allows shatters with no clones

Ah right, yeah, that's on by default now.But we gave up distortion for it so...

Continuum split is able to completely reset your health and cooldowns. Giving up distortion for this powerful effect is how it should have worked from the beginning...

CS can do that yes, but it also saves your position, so if you CS in a peaceful place, full health, 3 seconds later that place might not be so peaceful. Additionally, your position is visible to everyone who can then just wait at the point and surprise you with a burst attack. So all that health you saved is now down the drain.Distortion has other uses, CS isn't really a good idea to use for your health pool. And if you do use it "in a pinch", to save yourself from dying, but your cooldowns are spent, you just added 1+ seconds of cooldowns on top of every one.

So no, it wasn't a good trade. CS itself is "a fickle mistress" with its own caveats and tradeoffs when you use it. No skill should have been lost just because a Chrono has CS.What really happened is that Chronos were using distortion to share it with the squad in raids. And Anet being Anet didn't want to or know how to properly balance that so they did "an Anet", and just removed something. You know, just how they removed Mirages dodge when it became something that requires work to balance.

Now, i don't particularly miss Distortion on the Chrono in PvE, they have ok means of defending themselves, and it makes the profession play a bit more offensively which i like. But i do miss it in WvW a lot.

[Tseison.4659]

Continuum Split could’ve easily been a F5 but with a long cooldown to balance and then we keep our Distortion. I mean...HS get all their F1-4 skills and then the addition of F5 tied to their forge giving them more skills so... shrugs.

[Kondor.2904]

Giving up an exceptionally strong defensive skill for an offensive one is a healthy trade-off, should be the same for every class tho.

[Veprovina.4876]

@"Kondor.2904" said:Giving up an exceptionally strong defensive skill for an offensive one is a healthy trade-off, should be the same for every class tho.

But the point is it isn't the same for every class. And that's where the really unhealthy bias against Mesmers shows up in the developers. I don't think any other class has had to give up so much, for a marginal "benefit" going away from the "balance" with a net loss each time it happened.

[Kondor.2904]

@Veprovina.4876 said:

@"Kondor.2904" said:Giving up an exceptionally strong defensive skill for an offensive one is a healthy trade-off, should be the same for every class tho.

But the point is it isn't the same for every class. And that's where the really unhealthy bias against Mesmers shows up in the developers. I don't think any other class has had to give up so much, for a marginal "benefit" going away from the "balance" with a net loss each time it happened.

I'm not sure if mesmer is the only class that had to go though the kind of "unfair" trade-off process. But I would assume that mesmer is just generally hard to balance due to questionable design decisions and mechanics, which tend to lead to some either omega broken interactions or barely useful yet annoying synergies, so I guess it's safer to pick the lesser evil for the balance team. Especially considering the infamous chrono history. But idk, that particular f4 instance seems fine to me, I'd rather have them work on other problematic aspects of chrono, and just balance the rest of the specs/classes accordingly (which is pretty unrealistic but still, yeah).

[Veprovina.4876]

@Kondor.2904 said:

@Veprovina.4876 said:

@Kondor.2904 said:Giving up an exceptionally strong defensive skill for an offensive one is a healthy trade-off, should be the same for every class tho.

But the point is it isn't the same for every class. And that's where the really unhealthy bias against Mesmers shows up in the developers. I don't think any other class has had to give up so much, for a marginal "benefit" going away from the "balance" with a net loss each time it happened.

I'm not sure if mesmer is the only class that had to go though the kind of "unfair" trade-off process. But I would assume that mesmer is just generally hard to balance due to questionable design decisions and mechanics, which tend to lead to some either omega broken interactions or barely useful yet annoying synergies, so I guess it's safer to pick the lesser evil for the balance team. Especially considering the infamous chrono history. But idk, that particular f4 instance seems fine to me, I'd rather have them work on other problematic aspects of chrono, and just balance the rest of the specs/classes accordingly (which is pretty unrealistic but still, yeah).

I think the Mesmer needs a complete overhaul at this point to even begin to have any semblance of balance. What they're doing is band-aids at best, and those band-aids come with nails so they really hurt (1 dodge), etc... Whatever they tweak now will only be another layer of nothing on top of a broken core. First they need to take a step back, look at it as a whole and think what they want mesmers to be. Then fix the bugs and core.

Also i never understood why skill is punished when it comes to Mesmer. It seems that every time a Mesmer is good, played by a skilled player (and to be honest, you need skill to play a mediocre mesmer as well whereas you can just spam with some other classes). Then everyone is just "nerfnerfnerfnerf" and Anet does it which in turns screws up everyone because there's really not that many players that can pull off mesmer like that. And to be a skillful mesmer, you really need to play it like a piano. So why shouldn't that amount of work be rewarded as in - it's hard to kill a mesmer. If a player is playing it like a boss, that's how it should be! But then that 2% unkillable mesmers start being an argument how the whole class is broken (it's not, only a small amount of people can do that), and then everyone who plays mesmer gets punished.

But, i'm an optimist, and seeing as how there's literally no balance changes or bugfixes for mesmer in a long time, i think that's exactly what they're doing, kind of like a grand step back, let's look at this as a whole, no band aids type of thing, and that they'll revamp mesmer for EoD completely.

Anway, minirant over... I was never really bothered by no distortion on Chrono, there's tons of other stuff to be bothered about and Distortion isn't really that bad of a "nerf" on Chrono. If they did it to Mirage, then that would be almost as bad as a dodge nerf, but they kept it there so, it's fine at least in that aspect.

Fingers crossed that they finally start thinking about mesmers when EoD comes out!

[Firebeard.1746]

@Stand The Wall.6987 said:i've been on a long hiatus and i realize this change is over a year old, but wow this is awesome.

They removed all distort from chrono shatters, so there is still a nerf there. But overall yes, chrono is in a much better spot.

[Salt Mode.3780]

actually split is a double edge sword, without distortion if they focus on split you go back to a stack of condi's and often not less hp then you already do, i dont know if this is a bug or it is intentional. Point is split is made to use offensively in a sense where you burst reset cd into a double burst cuz if anyone finds your split they can just dps and condi bomb it and you will go back to all of that. Also it is a 90 second cd skill other classes have shorter cd utilities that can impact further throughout the fight. Essentially chrono is a core mesmer with double burstin terms of double block i rarely see chronos at it is but the ones i do see dont run shield unless its made for support/bunker purposes. I am not sure how it is like in the spvp world but in wvw thts the case.

[Kodama.6453]

@Tseison.4659 said:Continuum Split could’ve easily been a F6 but with a long cooldown to balance and then we keep our Distortion. I mean...HS get all their F1-4 skills and then the addition of F5 tied to their forge giving them more skills so... shrugs.

You realise that engineer does have a F5 skill that is lost in favour of the photon forge?F5 is the elite toolbelt skill. For core engineer, it can either be:

• Toss Elixir X
• Med Pack Drop
• Orbital Strike

Orbital strike is not really a big loss, but the other 2 skills are quite powerful.

[Tseison.4659]

@Kodama.6453 said:

@Tseison.4659 said:Continuum Split could’ve easily been a F6 but with a long cooldown to balance and then we keep our Distortion. I mean...HS get all their F1-4 skills and then the addition of F5 tied to their forge giving them more skills so...

shrugs.

You realise that engineer does have a F5 skill that is lost in favour of the photon forge?F5 is the elite toolbelt skill. For core engineer, it can either be:

• Toss Elixir X
• Med Pack Drop
• Orbital Strike

Orbital strike is not really a big loss, but the other 2 skills are quite powerful.

I have no idea what you're getting at lol. But anyways let me 'clarify' again what I wrote. Basically, I was saying that it would've been nice if Distortion was kept along with Continuum Split, just have the cooldown for CS be long(er). I figured since Holosmith gets a new F5 that gives them a new set of skills, and I guess we can say the same with Firebrand with their F1-3 skills giving them more skills, I wouldn't see us keeping Distortion and CS as a big problem, especially if CS was given a longer CD than what it has now.

Not that ANYTHING we say will change what we already have because it's already set in stone, but it's simply a thought...