Permanently Delete Arcane Thievery

[ZDragon.3046]

@Odik.4587 said:

@ZDragon.3046 said:

@Odik.4587 said:

@Poelala.2830 said:

@apharma.3741 said:

@ZDragon.3046 said:

@mortrialus.3062 said:

@ZDragon.3046 said:I still think based on what CaL said i hope Arcane will see some changes i think its easily classed under the

"skills that do too many things at once"

category

Arcane thievery's

actions per single use on successful hit.Grants quicknessInflicts slowSteals up to 3 boonsxfers up to 3 conditionsis unblockable.

Even if we compare it to

Corrupt Boon

Convers 3 boons to conditionsis UnblockableInflicts self poison

Corruption is stronger than a transfer and a boonsteal. And corrupt boon was already seeing meta use before it became an ammo skill, which you left out.

Thats subjective though. There is no blunt fact you can find on the wiki or anything ( im pretty sure) that factually states boon corruption is stronger than boon steal.I personally would rather steal boons rather than corrupt them to be perfectly honest with you.

The second part of your statement is not relevant to the things i listed as for why i listed them.These are the things they are looking to change with upcoming balance which is why i even bothered to point it out. I didnt point it out based on meta use i pointed out by looking at how many actions a skill does per 1 use which is factual and has nothing to do with meta vs non meta. A skill being meta or not is not something included in its tool tip as for the number of effects it does at 1 time.

Corrupt Boon:Removes 3 boonsApplies 3 conditionsUnblockable18s cool down2 charges.

Arcane Thievery:Removes 3 boonsApplies

3

4 conditionsUnblockable25s cool down

"but but...." So this is from the perspective of someone having both skills used on them, they're actually more similar than you think and 100% corrupt boon is stronger because you can control what conditions are put on the player. On the other hand the enemy can take some measures not to have stab corrupted but that's about it.

"but apharma, nice bias there, you forgot the mesmer gets those 3 boons and quickness"

Yeah I know but realistically it's a chaos mesmer running it, what are they getting they don't already have or that is actually useful? Quickness and the most annoying part about AT is the slow to be hit with which leads me back too...

"Edit: What's the point of story time with apharma? It's a really buggy skill that needs fixing and didn't "need" quickness and slow adding."

Also you should in generally use realistic examples, you're unlikely to always transfer 3 conditions and steal 3 boons, even when maximum usage is realised (when it doesn't random fail too) only 1 aspect is facilitating you usually.

Edit: As I say the actual mechanic of AT needs fixing then it should lose the quickness and slow, then maybe look at the cool down bringing it in line with the power level CMC hopefully nerfs everything down to.

I find it hilarious that you compare those two skills as if they exist in a vacuum. The ability to remove protection, regeneration, and stability while gaining those yourself and inflicting four conditions before 1-shotting or doing all the BS condi mesmer does is unique to mesmer only.

AT doesnt prioritize these boons (ReGeNeRaTiOn AlErT!1!1!1) while CB 100% prioritize stability (cant speak for other boons as I didnt play necro too much to remember what else it prioritizing). Feel free to prove otherwiseIll say it again thats falseIve been using corrupt boon in a few corruption heavy builds the past few days instead of my lesser corrupt builds and on any profession that can apply stability and more than 3-4 other boons at the same time it can totally miss the stability due to other boon coverage. There was even an instance in which i converted every thing except stability. Please dont use false information.

I play necro daily and any time ive ever used corrupt boon on a boon heavy profession like guardian , some eles, rangers using plasma etc. Its totally possible to completely miss the stability while hitting 3 other boons on the bar with CB. So either im right and you are wrong or both of us are wrong and neither one of us is correct. There is no priority on CB hitting stability lets just get that right....

Dont be fooled into thinking CB auto hits stability every single time when the reality is most players dont even realize how much stability they pump out in their powercrept builds without a lot of boon coverage.

Warriors and Ele will say that necro fear is op and that necros have too many fears without realizing the source of that fear is the stability they keep spamming with almost no other boons sitting along side it making it easier to convert. IF stab is like the 1 of the only 3 boons on the bar of course you will land it with CB if its up there with 8 or 9 other boons there is a good chance you can totally miss it.Second or third time you are writing a wall instead of short answer... :pepehands:tldr : CB doesnt convert stability if someone applied 3 boons over it... and... even if it would be true ( unless you run multipletests, but you didnt ) they should be able to cover it instant after applying stability and they would likely to use CP for stability asap... What the point you were trying to make? That corrupted stability = fear, wew, never knew that /s

That you shouldnt say CB priortizes stab when you dont have proof of such a thing ;) :pepehands:You say it does one thing and i say its does not what we have here is a good ole stand off. I guess both of us are just incorrect.

[storm.3120]

@ZDragon.3046 said:

@Odik.4587 said:

@ZDragon.3046 said:

@Odik.4587 said:

@Poelala.2830 said:

@apharma.3741 said:

@ZDragon.3046 said:

@mortrialus.3062 said:

@ZDragon.3046 said:I still think based on what CaL said i hope Arcane will see some changes i think its easily classed under the

"skills that do too many things at once"

category

Arcane thievery's

actions per single use on successful hit.Grants quicknessInflicts slowSteals up to 3 boonsxfers up to 3 conditionsis unblockable.

Even if we compare it to

Corrupt Boon

Convers 3 boons to conditionsis UnblockableInflicts self poison

Corruption is stronger than a transfer and a boonsteal. And corrupt boon was already seeing meta use before it became an ammo skill, which you left out.

Thats subjective though. There is no blunt fact you can find on the wiki or anything ( im pretty sure) that factually states boon corruption is stronger than boon steal.I personally would rather steal boons rather than corrupt them to be perfectly honest with you.

The second part of your statement is not relevant to the things i listed as for why i listed them.These are the things they are looking to change with upcoming balance which is why i even bothered to point it out. I didnt point it out based on meta use i pointed out by looking at how many actions a skill does per 1 use which is factual and has nothing to do with meta vs non meta. A skill being meta or not is not something included in its tool tip as for the number of effects it does at 1 time.

Corrupt Boon:Removes 3 boonsApplies 3 conditionsUnblockable18s cool down2 charges.

Arcane Thievery:Removes 3 boonsApplies

3

4 conditionsUnblockable25s cool down

"but but...." So this is from the perspective of someone having both skills used on them, they're actually more similar than you think and 100% corrupt boon is stronger because you can control what conditions are put on the player. On the other hand the enemy can take some measures not to have stab corrupted but that's about it.

"but apharma, nice bias there, you forgot the mesmer gets those 3 boons and quickness"

Yeah I know but realistically it's a chaos mesmer running it, what are they getting they don't already have or that is actually useful? Quickness and the most annoying part about AT is the slow to be hit with which leads me back too...

"Edit: What's the point of story time with apharma? It's a really buggy skill that needs fixing and didn't "need" quickness and slow adding."

Also you should in generally use realistic examples, you're unlikely to always transfer 3 conditions and steal 3 boons, even when maximum usage is realised (when it doesn't random fail too) only 1 aspect is facilitating you usually.

Edit: As I say the actual mechanic of AT needs fixing then it should lose the quickness and slow, then maybe look at the cool down bringing it in line with the power level CMC hopefully nerfs everything down to.

I find it hilarious that you compare those two skills as if they exist in a vacuum. The ability to remove protection, regeneration, and stability while gaining those yourself and inflicting four conditions before 1-shotting or doing all the BS condi mesmer does is unique to mesmer only.

AT doesnt prioritize these boons (ReGeNeRaTiOn AlErT!1!1!1) while CB 100% prioritize stability (cant speak for other boons as I didnt play necro too much to remember what else it prioritizing). Feel free to prove otherwiseIll say it again thats falseIve been using corrupt boon in a few corruption heavy builds the past few days instead of my lesser corrupt builds and on any profession that can apply stability and more than 3-4 other boons at the same time it can totally miss the stability due to other boon coverage. There was even an instance in which i converted every thing except stability. Please dont use false information.

I play necro daily and any time ive ever used corrupt boon on a boon heavy profession like guardian , some eles, rangers using plasma etc. Its totally possible to completely miss the stability while hitting 3 other boons on the bar with CB. So either im right and you are wrong or both of us are wrong and neither one of us is correct. There is no priority on CB hitting stability lets just get that right....

Dont be fooled into thinking CB auto hits stability every single time when the reality is most players dont even realize how much stability they pump out in their powercrept builds without a lot of boon coverage.

Warriors and Ele will say that necro fear is op and that necros have too many fears without realizing the source of that fear is the stability they keep spamming with almost no other boons sitting along side it making it easier to convert. IF stab is like the 1 of the only 3 boons on the bar of course you will land it with CB if its up there with 8 or 9 other boons there is a good chance you can totally miss it.Second or third time you are writing a wall instead of short answer... :pepehands:tldr : CB doesnt convert stability if someone applied 3 boons over it... and... even if it would be true ( unless you run multipletests, but you didnt ) they should be able to cover it instant after applying stability and they would likely to use CP for stability asap... What the point you were trying to make? That corrupted stability = fear, wew, never knew that /s

That you shouldnt say CB priortizes stab when you dont have proof of such a thing ;) :pepehands:You say it does one thing and i say its does not what we have here is a good ole stand off. I guess both of us are just incorrect.You see someone pop stab = CB = fear . Bigbrain. Thats also incorrect, never use CB, it does nothing ;)

[ZDragon.3046]

@Odik.4587 said:

@ZDragon.3046 said:

@Odik.4587 said:

@ZDragon.3046 said:

@Odik.4587 said:

@Poelala.2830 said:

@apharma.3741 said:

@ZDragon.3046 said:

@mortrialus.3062 said:

@ZDragon.3046 said:I still think based on what CaL said i hope Arcane will see some changes i think its easily classed under the

"skills that do too many things at once"

category

Arcane thievery's

actions per single use on successful hit.Grants quicknessInflicts slowSteals up to 3 boonsxfers up to 3 conditionsis unblockable.

Even if we compare it to

Corrupt Boon

Convers 3 boons to conditionsis UnblockableInflicts self poison

Corruption is stronger than a transfer and a boonsteal. And corrupt boon was already seeing meta use before it became an ammo skill, which you left out.

Thats subjective though. There is no blunt fact you can find on the wiki or anything ( im pretty sure) that factually states boon corruption is stronger than boon steal.I personally would rather steal boons rather than corrupt them to be perfectly honest with you.

The second part of your statement is not relevant to the things i listed as for why i listed them.These are the things they are looking to change with upcoming balance which is why i even bothered to point it out. I didnt point it out based on meta use i pointed out by looking at how many actions a skill does per 1 use which is factual and has nothing to do with meta vs non meta. A skill being meta or not is not something included in its tool tip as for the number of effects it does at 1 time.

Corrupt Boon:Removes 3 boonsApplies 3 conditionsUnblockable18s cool down2 charges.

Arcane Thievery:Removes 3 boonsApplies

3

4 conditionsUnblockable25s cool down

"but but...." So this is from the perspective of someone having both skills used on them, they're actually more similar than you think and 100% corrupt boon is stronger because you can control what conditions are put on the player. On the other hand the enemy can take some measures not to have stab corrupted but that's about it.

"but apharma, nice bias there, you forgot the mesmer gets those 3 boons and quickness"

Yeah I know but realistically it's a chaos mesmer running it, what are they getting they don't already have or that is actually useful? Quickness and the most annoying part about AT is the slow to be hit with which leads me back too...

"Edit: What's the point of story time with apharma? It's a really buggy skill that needs fixing and didn't "need" quickness and slow adding."

Also you should in generally use realistic examples, you're unlikely to always transfer 3 conditions and steal 3 boons, even when maximum usage is realised (when it doesn't random fail too) only 1 aspect is facilitating you usually.

Edit: As I say the actual mechanic of AT needs fixing then it should lose the quickness and slow, then maybe look at the cool down bringing it in line with the power level CMC hopefully nerfs everything down to.

I find it hilarious that you compare those two skills as if they exist in a vacuum. The ability to remove protection, regeneration, and stability while gaining those yourself and inflicting four conditions before 1-shotting or doing all the BS condi mesmer does is unique to mesmer only.

AT doesnt prioritize these boons (ReGeNeRaTiOn AlErT!1!1!1) while CB 100% prioritize stability (cant speak for other boons as I didnt play necro too much to remember what else it prioritizing). Feel free to prove otherwiseIll say it again thats falseIve been using corrupt boon in a few corruption heavy builds the past few days instead of my lesser corrupt builds and on any profession that can apply stability and more than 3-4 other boons at the same time it can totally miss the stability due to other boon coverage. There was even an instance in which i converted every thing except stability. Please dont use false information.

I play necro daily and any time ive ever used corrupt boon on a boon heavy profession like guardian , some eles, rangers using plasma etc. Its totally possible to completely miss the stability while hitting 3 other boons on the bar with CB. So either im right and you are wrong or both of us are wrong and neither one of us is correct. There is no priority on CB hitting stability lets just get that right....

Dont be fooled into thinking CB auto hits stability every single time when the reality is most players dont even realize how much stability they pump out in their powercrept builds without a lot of boon coverage.

Warriors and Ele will say that necro fear is op and that necros have too many fears without realizing the source of that fear is the stability they keep spamming with almost no other boons sitting along side it making it easier to convert. IF stab is like the 1 of the only 3 boons on the bar of course you will land it with CB if its up there with 8 or 9 other boons there is a good chance you can totally miss it.Second or third time you are writing a wall instead of short answer... :pepehands:tldr : CB doesnt convert stability if someone applied 3 boons over it... and... even if it would be true ( unless you run multipletests, but you didnt ) they should be able to cover it instant after applying stability and they would likely to use CP for stability asap... What the point you were trying to make? That corrupted stability = fear, wew, never knew that /s

That you shouldnt say CB priortizes stab when you dont have proof of such a thing ;) :pepehands:You say it does one thing and i say its does not what we have here is a good ole stand off. I guess both of us are just incorrect.You see someone pop stab = CB = fear . Bigbrain. Thats also incorrect, never use CB, it does nothing ;)

Yup i guess so sounds like you got it all figured out with BiGBrAiN4HeAd JuStDoDgE LeArN2pLaY GeEgEe

[apharma.3741]

@Poelala.2830 said:

@apharma.3741 said:

@ZDragon.3046 said:

@mortrialus.3062 said:

@ZDragon.3046 said:I still think based on what CaL said i hope Arcane will see some changes i think its easily classed under the

"skills that do too many things at once"

category

Arcane thievery's

actions per single use on successful hit.Grants quicknessInflicts slowSteals up to 3 boonsxfers up to 3 conditionsis unblockable.

Even if we compare it to

Corrupt Boon

Convers 3 boons to conditionsis UnblockableInflicts self poison

Corruption is stronger than a transfer and a boonsteal. And corrupt boon was already seeing meta use before it became an ammo skill, which you left out.

Thats subjective though. There is no blunt fact you can find on the wiki or anything ( im pretty sure) that factually states boon corruption is stronger than boon steal.I personally would rather steal boons rather than corrupt them to be perfectly honest with you.

The second part of your statement is not relevant to the things i listed as for why i listed them.These are the things they are looking to change with upcoming balance which is why i even bothered to point it out. I didnt point it out based on meta use i pointed out by looking at how many actions a skill does per 1 use which is factual and has nothing to do with meta vs non meta. A skill being meta or not is not something included in its tool tip as for the number of effects it does at 1 time.

Corrupt Boon:Removes 3 boonsApplies 3 conditionsUnblockable18s cool down2 charges.

Arcane Thievery:Removes 3 boonsApplies

3

4 conditionsUnblockable25s cool down

"but but...." So this is from the perspective of someone having both skills used on them, they're actually more similar than you think and 100% corrupt boon is stronger because you can control what conditions are put on the player. On the other hand the enemy can take some measures not to have stab corrupted but that's about it.

"but apharma, nice bias there, you forgot the mesmer gets those 3 boons and quickness"

Yeah I know but realistically it's a chaos mesmer running it, what are they getting they don't already have or that is actually useful? Quickness and the most annoying part about AT is the slow to be hit with which leads me back too...

"Edit: What's the point of story time with apharma? It's a really buggy skill that needs fixing and didn't "need" quickness and slow adding."

Also you should in generally use realistic examples, you're unlikely to always transfer 3 conditions and steal 3 boons, even when maximum usage is realised (when it doesn't random fail too) only 1 aspect is facilitating you usually.

Edit: As I say the actual mechanic of AT needs fixing then it should lose the quickness and slow, then maybe look at the cool down bringing it in line with the power level CMC hopefully nerfs everything down to.

I find it hilarious that you compare those two skills as if they exist in a vacuum. The ability to remove protection, regeneration, and stability while gaining those yourself and inflicting four conditions before 1-shotting or doing all the BS condi mesmer does is unique to mesmer only.

What? Did you bother to read anything?

"realistically it's a chaos mesmer running it, what are they getting they don't already have or that is actually useful?"

"you're unlikely to always transfer 3 conditions and steal 3 boons, even when maximum usage is realised (when it doesn't random fail too) only 1 aspect is facilitating you usually."

That's without saying I was pointing out that depending on your perspective the 2 skills are more similar than ZDragon initially thought. I didn't say which was better. No conclusion was drawn about how they measure up to each other.

[Phantaram.4816]

@mortrialus.3062 said:

@"Stand The Wall.6987" said:the poster child of power creep.

https://i.imgur.com/TqvvUsi.png

[Poelala.2830]

@Phantaram.4816 said:

@mortrialus.3062 said:

@"Stand The Wall.6987" said:the poster child of power creep.

https://i.imgur.com/TqvvUsi.png

One is a utility skill that can be accessed at any time with a negligible cast time and no tell and one is a weapon skill on a class that, at any given moment, has at least 15 weapon skills locked out from use. And the shatter stone has a very clear tell and activation time. Not the same.

[viquing.8254]

@Poelala.2830 said:

@Phantaram.4816 said:

@mortrialus.3062 said:

@"Stand The Wall.6987" said:the poster child of power creep.

https://i.imgur.com/TqvvUsi.png

One is a utility skill that can be accessed at any timeWhat it is supposed to mean ?with a negligible cast timeLike nearly everyone ulititary.I fail to see the cast time on ele metabuild utility skills....and no tellBecause your utilities have tells ?and one is a weapon skill on a class that, at any given moment, has at least 15 weapon skills locked out from use. And the shatter stone has a very clear tell and activation time. Not the same.You really think that it's better having survival tool and condiclear on utility slot only than on weapon slots ?

We can continue the game of how op look the other forever if you want, fact is that in the current environnement, AT isn't op at all.

[Stand The Wall.6987]

@Poelala.2830 said:

@"Phantaram.4816" said:

https://i.imgur.com/TqvvUsi.png

One is a utility skill that can be accessed at any time with a negligible cast time and no tell and one is a weapon skill on a class that, at any given moment, has at least 15 weapon skills locked out from use. And the shatter stone has a very clear tell and activation time. Not the same.

I think they were saying that both skills are memes.

[Axl.8924]

@viquing.8254 said:

@Poelala.2830 said:

@viquing.8254 said:

@Poelala.2830 said:

@apharma.3741 said:

@ZDragon.3046 said:

@mortrialus.3062 said:

@ZDragon.3046 said:I still think based on what CaL said i hope Arcane will see some changes i think its easily classed under the

"skills that do too many things at once"

category

Arcane thievery's

actions per single use on successful hit.Grants quicknessInflicts slowSteals up to 3 boonsxfers up to 3 conditionsis unblockable.

Even if we compare it to

Corrupt Boon

Convers 3 boons to conditionsis UnblockableInflicts self poison

Corruption is stronger than a transfer and a boonsteal. And corrupt boon was already seeing meta use before it became an ammo skill, which you left out.

Thats subjective though. There is no blunt fact you can find on the wiki or anything ( im pretty sure) that factually states boon corruption is stronger than boon steal.I personally would rather steal boons rather than corrupt them to be perfectly honest with you.

The second part of your statement is not relevant to the things i listed as for why i listed them.These are the things they are looking to change with upcoming balance which is why i even bothered to point it out. I didnt point it out based on meta use i pointed out by looking at how many actions a skill does per 1 use which is factual and has nothing to do with meta vs non meta. A skill being meta or not is not something included in its tool tip as for the number of effects it does at 1 time.

Corrupt Boon:Removes 3 boonsApplies 3 conditionsUnblockable18s cool down2 charges.

Arcane Thievery:Removes 3 boonsApplies

3

4 conditionsUnblockable25s cool down

"but but...." So this is from the perspective of someone having both skills used on them, they're actually more similar than you think and 100% corrupt boon is stronger because you can control what conditions are put on the player. On the other hand the enemy can take some measures not to have stab corrupted but that's about it.

"but apharma, nice bias there, you forgot the mesmer gets those 3 boons and quickness"

Yeah I know but realistically it's a chaos mesmer running it, what are they getting they don't already have or that is actually useful? Quickness and the most annoying part about AT is the slow to be hit with which leads me back too...

"Edit: What's the point of story time with apharma? It's a really buggy skill that needs fixing and didn't "need" quickness and slow adding."

Also you should in generally use realistic examples, you're unlikely to always transfer 3 conditions and steal 3 boons, even when maximum usage is realised (when it doesn't random fail too) only 1 aspect is facilitating you usually.

Edit: As I say the actual mechanic of AT needs fixing then it should lose the quickness and slow, then maybe look at the cool down bringing it in line with the power level CMC hopefully nerfs everything down to.

I find it hilarious that you compare those two skills as if they exist in a vacuum. The ability to remove protection, regeneration, and stability while gaining those yourself and inflicting four conditions before 1-shotting or doing all the BS condi mesmer does is unique to mesmer only.

I find it hilarious that you whine about a skill while your profession have a better noobfriendly 3 in 1 button in his toolbar. You know, it's all about context...

I could give endless examples of game-breaking and decadent mesmer builds but playing core fresh air Elementalist for four years despite being horridly out-classed by every other build is, again, completely different than playing a mesmer build that can do 20k damage in half a second from stealth.When is the last time you kill a ele with a condi mes ? Ho sorry ! they have passive condiclear on their rotation so didn't care about condi... Why even dedicate a utility slot to condiclear...You have no response to my statement,Your statement about how power mesmer cast AT from stealth before bursting so you have tells of the incoming burst ?Sorry I didn't meet this kind of play.so you talk about my main and fail. Whoops.Again, the grass seems greener in the neighboor garden yeah.

Lets complain about weaver? they got nice evades and you can combine it with having onyx skin flash and also some really nice condi dmg as well.

On a real note if you really are going to talk about Necros and eles the whole conversation goes the other way too you know, and i was joking about weaver.

Necros and eles have their weaknesses too

For instance tempest overloads are melee range and pretty big channeling effect and they are pretty squishy.

[Poelala.2830]

@viquing.8254 said:

@Poelala.2830 said:

@Phantaram.4816 said:

@mortrialus.3062 said:

@"Stand The Wall.6987" said:the poster child of power creep.

https://i.imgur.com/TqvvUsi.png

One is a utility skill that can be accessed at any timeWhat it is supposed to mean ?with a negligible cast timeLike nearly everyone ulititary.I fail to see the cast time on ele metabuild utility skills....and no tellBecause your utilities have tells ?and one is a weapon skill on a class that, at any given moment, has at least 15 weapon skills locked out from use. And the shatter stone has a very clear tell and activation time. Not the same.You really think that it's better having survival tool and condiclear on utility slot only than on weapon slots ?

We can continue the game of how op look the other forever if you want, fact is that in the current environnement, AT isn't op at all.

You somehow misunderstand. One is a utility skill with a negligible cast time and no tell you are never locked out of your utility skills unless they are on cool down or you are CC’d. Shatterstone is a weapon’s skill that is constantly locked out and cannot be used without penalty. It has a very respectable activation time and a clear tell. Phataram’s insinuation is that these two have been powercrept considerably, while true, the context shows that the power creep of shatter stone vs AT is completely different. AT is overpowered and needs to be deleted.

[viquing.8254]

@Poelala.2830 said:

@viquing.8254 said:

@Poelala.2830 said:

@Phantaram.4816 said:

@mortrialus.3062 said:

@"Stand The Wall.6987" said:the poster child of power creep.

https://i.imgur.com/TqvvUsi.png

One is a utility skill that can be accessed at any timeWhat it is supposed to mean ?with a negligible cast timeLike nearly everyone ulititary.I fail to see the cast time on ele metabuild utility skills....and no tellBecause your utilities have tells ?and one is a weapon skill on a class that, at any given moment, has at least 15 weapon skills locked out from use. And the shatter stone has a very clear tell and activation time. Not the same.You really think that it's better having survival tool and condiclear on utility slot only than on weapon slots ?

We can continue the game of how op look the other forever if you want, fact is that in the current environnement, AT isn't op at all.

You somehow misunderstand. One is a utility skill with a negligible cast time and no tell you are never locked out of your utility skills unless they are on cool down or you are CC’d. Shatterstone is a weapon’s skill that is constantly locked out and cannot be used without penalty. It has a very respectable activation time and a clear tell. Phataram’s insinuation is that these two have been powercrept considerably, while true, the context shows that the power creep of shatter stone vs AT is completely different. AT is overpowered and needs to be deleted.

That's why there is more uses of shatterstone than AT in builds ?Mean 2 meta mesmers builds out of 3 didn't use AT such overpowered attitude ....You'r right shatterstone is just a cherry on a cake.

[Leonidrex.5649]

@Poelala.2830 said:

@viquing.8254 said:

@Poelala.2830 said:

@Phantaram.4816 said:

@mortrialus.3062 said:

@"Stand The Wall.6987" said:the poster child of power creep.

https://i.imgur.com/TqvvUsi.png

One is a utility skill that can be accessed at any timeWhat it is supposed to mean ?with a negligible cast timeLike nearly everyone ulititary.I fail to see the cast time on ele metabuild utility skills....and no tellBecause your utilities have tells ?and one is a weapon skill on a class that, at any given moment, has at least 15 weapon skills locked out from use. And the shatter stone has a very clear tell and activation time. Not the same.You really think that it's better having survival tool and condiclear on utility slot only than on weapon slots ?

We can continue the game of how op look the other forever if you want, fact is that in the current environnement, AT isn't op at all.

You somehow misunderstand. One is a utility skill with a negligible cast time and no tell you are never locked out of your utility skills unless they are on cool down or you are CC’d. Shatterstone is a weapon’s skill that is constantly locked out and cannot be used without penalty. It has a very respectable activation time and a clear tell. Phataram’s insinuation is that these two have been powercrept considerably, while true, the context shows that the power creep of shatter stone vs AT is completely different. AT is overpowered and needs to be deleted.

anything that is not broken or overpowered is not going to be played pal.every single class, NO exeptions has overtuned stuff, if you nerf that. they WILL become garbage.using its op = remove from the game mentality will have 50% of all skills removed.lets look at warrior.rampage op -> removegs 3 op -> removetether op ->removebulls op -> removehp reg signet op -> removecondiclear shout op -> removeremove remove remove remove, whats left is stinking pile of crap \o/ celebrate.EVERY class has it, things to need to be toned down, ALL things ACROSS the board. making whiny post about AT of all things does nothing.plenty of more broken abilities out there.

[viquing.8254]

@Leonidrex.5649 said:

@Poelala.2830 said:

@viquing.8254 said:

@Poelala.2830 said:

@Phantaram.4816 said:

@mortrialus.3062 said:

@"Stand The Wall.6987" said:the poster child of power creep.

https://i.imgur.com/TqvvUsi.png

One is a utility skill that can be accessed at any timeWhat it is supposed to mean ?with a negligible cast timeLike nearly everyone ulititary.I fail to see the cast time on ele metabuild utility skills....and no tellBecause your utilities have tells ?and one is a weapon skill on a class that, at any given moment, has at least 15 weapon skills locked out from use. And the shatter stone has a very clear tell and activation time. Not the same.You really think that it's better having survival tool and condiclear on utility slot only than on weapon slots ?

We can continue the game of how op look the other forever if you want, fact is that in the current environnement, AT isn't op at all.

You somehow misunderstand. One is a utility skill with a negligible cast time and no tell you are never locked out of your utility skills unless they are on cool down or you are CC’d. Shatterstone is a weapon’s skill that is constantly locked out and cannot be used without penalty. It has a very respectable activation time and a clear tell. Phataram’s insinuation is that these two have been powercrept considerably, while true, the context shows that the power creep of shatter stone vs AT is completely different. AT is overpowered and needs to be deleted.

anything that is not broken or overpowered is not going to be played pal.every single class, NO exeptions has overtuned stuff, if you nerf that. they WILL become garbage.using its op = remove from the game mentality will have 50% of all skills removed.lets look at warrior.rampage op -> removegs 3 op -> removetether op ->removebulls op -> removehp reg signet op -> removecondiclear shout op -> removeremove remove remove remove, whats left is stinking pile of kitten \o/ celebrate.EVERY class has it, things to need to be toned down, ALL things ACROSS the board. making whiny post about AT of all things does nothing.plenty of more broken abilities out there.

Plus, AT is single target, it's way easier to rollface aoe like some specs can do with no care about targeting...

[Leonidrex.5649]

@viquing.8254 said:

@Leonidrex.5649 said:

@Poelala.2830 said:

@viquing.8254 said:

@Poelala.2830 said:

@Phantaram.4816 said:

@mortrialus.3062 said:

@"Stand The Wall.6987" said:the poster child of power creep.

https://i.imgur.com/TqvvUsi.png

One is a utility skill that can be accessed at any timeWhat it is supposed to mean ?with a negligible cast timeLike nearly everyone ulititary.I fail to see the cast time on ele metabuild utility skills....and no tellBecause your utilities have tells ?and one is a weapon skill on a class that, at any given moment, has at least 15 weapon skills locked out from use. And the shatter stone has a very clear tell and activation time. Not the same.You really think that it's better having survival tool and condiclear on utility slot only than on weapon slots ?

We can continue the game of how op look the other forever if you want, fact is that in the current environnement, AT isn't op at all.

You somehow misunderstand. One is a utility skill with a negligible cast time and no tell you are never locked out of your utility skills unless they are on cool down or you are CC’d. Shatterstone is a weapon’s skill that is constantly locked out and cannot be used without penalty. It has a very respectable activation time and a clear tell. Phataram’s insinuation is that these two have been powercrept considerably, while true, the context shows that the power creep of shatter stone vs AT is completely different. AT is overpowered and needs to be deleted.

anything that is not broken or overpowered is not going to be played pal.every single class, NO exeptions has overtuned stuff, if you nerf that. they WILL become garbage.using its op = remove from the game mentality will have 50% of all skills removed.lets look at warrior.rampage op -> removegs 3 op -> removetether op ->removebulls op -> removehp reg signet op -> removecondiclear shout op -> removeremove remove remove remove, whats left is stinking pile of kitten \o/ celebrate.EVERY class has it, things to need to be toned down, ALL things ACROSS the board. making whiny post about AT of all things does nothing.plenty of more broken abilities out there.

Plus, AT is single target, it's way easier to rollface aoe like some specs can do with no care about targeting...

yep

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/StompAoe dmg.aoe ccstun removing toolstabmighthealmobilitygives power and ferocitygenerates enduranceremoves boons\o/

EDIT added more