Arheundel.6451

Players are very good at identifying what frustrates them. They're not as good at identifying why and even less so at fixing it. But the devs first need to know what isn't fun so they can figure out where to start looking for changes. ........" Metrics, statistics, and knowledge of how the classes work."Fun is subjective, and by asking players to identify what they like and dont you are creating an outlook that is mostly biased.This is only true until a certain majority of people say that something is or is not fun at which point it starts to become less subjective and more factual. Fun is a part of the game. Some people play for fun for some people fun is winning or having a well fought match win or lose. Fun is indeed subjective and it can be a driving force of what keeps people playing the game. I stand by what I said then. Since you also acknowledge "fun" being subjective. That you can't use that feedback then as a starting point in balancing talks . Simply saying its subjective so your statement does not apply to the input of something is not a good way of really looking at it.What happens if someone says you telling someone something is subjective is also subjective should we just void out your statement too? As i told some one else its half and halfWhen possible metrics and statistics should be part of it but the other half should consist of client feedback data. Thats why businesses and companies often ask you how a service was to you.Say you order a package.Looking at metrics data tells the sender that the box got from point A to B.It might say how fast it got there and which route it took. But it does not tell them in the condition of how the box was when it got there or how pleased you were with how fast it got there. Maybe it got there at a bad time leaving your product to sit out all day exposed or maybe it got there quick but not quick enough to your liking. Subjective feedback is rather important one cannot simply dismiss it as it is a part of balance. And once again, I covered this in my first post, people seem to gloss over the bolded part of "Knowledge of how the game works"....Or from my first post in this thread"Devs should have an intimate understanding of what EVERY class is capable of.When I say intimate, I mean like this class shows up in your dreams intimate.Too often we have seen knee jerk fixes or changes to a class that don't make sense to the people playing, and sometimes these changes are contradictory to the way the class functions or even what the balancing "idea" for that patch tried to achieve.The Devs first and foremost need to play this game, and understand it to the level that people who have been playing since launch do." If you are relying on players to identify, WITHOUT BIAS the things that make a class over-perform you have set the ground for failure. Plain and simple. Even in this thread, you have evidence of that. No one want's to be nerfed further and everyone is pointing fingers at everything BUT what they have.This is why I said those 3 things are needed.Too many times player X throws out hyperbole to get player Y's class nerfed.It always goes like this " Bob plays a class (We'll call it class X) and wants to feel powerful, and be powerful, but bob gets killed by Tim on class Y. Bob could either, go into the game and make class Y and figure out what the strengths and weaknesses are, OR, he could complain about the class. Clearly Bob is a pro and class Y is just broken. So he makes a thread ( OR post in a thread with a dev asking what's fun or not) and decides to complain about everything he doesn't like. Citing that other people don't like it either. For added effect, Bob wiki's every skill and throws them all in, complaining about every effect Class Y has , then going through all the traits and doing the same. Bob creates a franken build that realistically CAN NOT EXIST. Then to put the final touches he creates scenarios in which no class could actually perform. Bob writes this as fact, and everyone that plays class X like bob agree's. This franken build to them exist in reality, and it does exactly what bob says.Tim and the other people playing class Y try and tell bob what actually happened but then it devolves into a shouting match where insults like " you main the class so you don't get a say" come in. This entire scenario, if we just stuck with player feedback. Would end up ( and has ended up) with a class being stripped of multiple tools it needs to function at a competitive level across multiple builds. It generates dead builds because they have been cried about repeatedly. This can not continue, and is unhealthy.The Devs MUST know how to pull apart fiction from fact.The devs need to play this game first, The devs must understand this system and game first, the devs need have to have every statistic, and metric first, before gathering feedback where players can't even be bothered to complain about specific aspects of a class and create these out of reality things and then complain about it. Edit: ALSO if they devs understood how this game worked, how classes worked, and how they fit in the grand picture of this game. We wouldn't have things like Launch day scourge, deadeye, mirage, spellbreaker, holosmith, weaver, renegade, etc. This is more than a numbers game, I acknowledge that. But changes like these tell me that in a grand picture for balance their was little or no vision. That needs to change like yesteryear.I could have not said it better...it's time to stop nerfing things based on forum outcry and use instead actual metrics like : -Percentage of players using a certain build/set up-Representation in high tiered pvp matches and wvw gameplay To nerf something because "Bob" comes to the forum and complain about what killed him....it's not valid feedback

For sPvP, have you consider a change in the stat budget through amulets? I know this puts WvW aside (or at least it would requires more work) but capping the main offensive stats to lower numbers while having the defensive ones remains the same would necessarily tone down the global power level but keep the power ranking of individual skills. A skill designed as powerful would remain powerful but would give more reaction time to the defender who could survive a bit longer. I thought it was the original idea of having separate modes : balancing the game mode by adjusting the stats and keeping a global balance for skills. Amulet stats are absolutely something we are looking at. If we're at amulets, would you consider adding some of the removed ones back? Settler's Amulet for example was removed at the sime times as Celestial in an effort to kill off the bunker meta (eventhough this amulet never really made it into high tier play). Condition builds were initially meant to outlast opponents but many of the things that'd enable this playstyle (such as Settler) have been removed from PvP, which is one of the reasons why there are hardly any viable condition damage based sidenoders right now. Adding them back could help build diversity.Outlasting everything simply because you play a certain way...it's really not a valid design choice in any game

Players are very good at identifying what frustrates them. They're not as good at identifying why and even less so at fixing it. But the devs first need to know what isn't fun so they can figure out where to start looking for changes. ........" Metrics, statistics, and knowledge of how the classes work."Fun is subjective, and by asking players to identify what they like and dont you are creating an outlook that is mostly biased.This is only true until a certain majority of people say that something is or is not fun at which point it starts to become less subjective and more factual. Fun is a part of the game. Some people play for fun for some people fun is winning or having a well fought match win or lose. Fun is indeed subjective and it can be a driving force of what keeps people playing the game. I stand by what I said then. Since you also acknowledge "fun" being subjective. That you can't use that feedback then as a starting point in balancing talks . Simply saying its subjective so your statement does not apply to the input of something is not a good way of really looking at it.What happens if someone says you telling someone something is subjective is also subjective should we just void out your statement too? As i told some one else its half and halfWhen possible metrics and statistics should be part of it but the other half should consist of client feedback data. Thats why businesses and companies often ask you how a service was to you.Say you order a package.Looking at metrics data tells the sender that the box got from point A to B.It might say how fast it got there and which route it took. But it does not tell them in the condition of how the box was when it got there or how pleased you were with how fast it got there. Maybe it got there at a bad time leaving your product to sit out all day exposed or maybe it got there quick but not quick enough to your liking. Subjective feedback is rather important one cannot simply dismiss it as it is a part of balance. And once again, I covered this in my first post, people seem to gloss over the bolded part of "Knowledge of how the game works"....Or from my first post in this thread"Devs should have an intimate understanding of what EVERY class is capable of.When I say intimate, I mean like this class shows up in your dreams intimate.Too often we have seen knee jerk fixes or changes to a class that don't make sense to the people playing, and sometimes these changes are contradictory to the way the class functions or even what the balancing "idea" for that patch tried to achieve.The Devs first and foremost need to play this game, and understand it to the level that people who have been playing since launch do." If you are relying on players to identify, WITHOUT BIAS the things that make a class over-perform you have set the ground for failure. Plain and simple. Even in this thread, you have evidence of that. No one want's to be nerfed further and everyone is pointing fingers at everything BUT what they have.This is why I said those 3 things are needed.Too many times player X throws out hyperbole to get player Y's class nerfed.It always goes like this " Bob plays a class (We'll call it class X) and wants to feel powerful, and be powerful, but bob gets killed by Tim on class Y. Bob could either, go into the game and make class Y and figure out what the strengths and weaknesses are, OR, he could complain about the class. Clearly Bob is a pro and class Y is just broken. So he makes a thread ( OR post in a thread with a dev asking what's fun or not) and decides to complain about everything he doesn't like. Citing that other people don't like it either. For added effect, Bob wiki's every skill and throws them all in, complaining about every effect Class Y has , then going through all the traits and doing the same. Bob creates a franken build that realistically CAN NOT EXIST. Then to put the final touches he creates scenarios in which no class could actually perform. Bob writes this as fact, and everyone that plays class X like bob agree's. This franken build to them exist in reality, and it does exactly what bob says.Tim and the other people playing class Y try and tell bob what actually happened but then it devolves into a shouting match where insults like " you main the class so you don't get a say" come in. This entire scenario, if we just stuck with player feedback. Would end up ( and has ended up) with a class being stripped of multiple tools it needs to function at a competitive level across multiple builds. It generates dead builds because they have been cried about repeatedly. This can not continue, and is unhealthy.The Devs MUST know how to pull apart fiction from fact.The devs need to play this game first, The devs must understand this system and game first, the devs need have to have every statistic, and metric first, before gathering feedback where players can't even be bothered to complain about specific aspects of a class and create these out of reality things and then complain about it. Edit: ALSO if they devs understood how this game worked, how classes worked, and how they fit in the grand picture of this game. We wouldn't have things like Launch day scourge, deadeye, mirage, spellbreaker, holosmith, weaver, renegade, etc. This is more than a numbers game, I acknowledge that. But changes like these tell me that in a grand picture for balance their was little or no vision. That needs to change like yesteryear. It goes without saying this is true but devs cant perdict what players will do once they get their hands on the content or how they will adapt to playin it after the fact. It is impossible for them to know every possible result because they are a group of a few hundred and we players are up in the thousands if not hundred thousands. We will try combos and playstyles that they would have never considered which may lead to unexpected or abusive mechanical tactics that will not be healthy for the game. To say tha the devs must understand the system without fail is simply not plausible as new content is added.The devs should not be doing balance on what they think is fun they how ever should mind how other players feel about that same content even more so in compeitive modes.Im sorry but if something causes major frustration because its not balanced then its not ok i dont really care how subjective you think it is. Fact is a game should not cause frustration to a person or a majority of people and once that starts to happen it means there is a problem that needs to be addressed.To ignore feedback and subjective feeling from the clients you provide a service too is very ignorant and what leads to the game gettin to the state its in right now. Players time and time again have told anet things they liked and did not like only to have the opposite happen in terms of balance in one mode or another. Players often came up with very creative and possibly balanced solutions to frustrating issues only to have anet ignore them and the problems remain problems for 6 months at a time. Its not so much pulling apart from the fun factor. When i say the devs must consider feed back data from people because its important it means just that. I dont mean the devs should be biased and design or blanace things based on how the feel when they play the game themselves. IF you dont agree the devs should listen to the people who play the game at all then you cant expect the game to ever be balanced. Im sorry i just wont agree with you no matter how you put it because when you say data is the only thing that should be looked at wont solve the problem. 1 patch you are on top because data said you were doing bad next patch you are trash because data said you were doing good. Data will be smothered by people who flock to what wins and works in the same way it is now by your above example of player x says player y's main class should be nerfed while player x's main class is still obviously broken but they defend it anyways. Regardless of how you "subjectively" think it should be done i don't agree. ITs a half and half situation for the best results. Devs are human beings and know how to read quality statement when they see it. Simply saying "nerf x class because y reason while im playing broken z profession" is not something they probably pay attention too. You said it yourself : "nerf x class because y reason while I am playing broken z profession" is not something the devs listen to. Players here tend to forget how frustrating it is to be at the receiving end of their own class ...while they complain about the frustration of being themselves at the receiving end of some other matchup...like "it's fun to hardcounter others...but I don't want to be hardcountered and what hardcounter me is clearly OP" I stand with what @Solori.6025 said : " you cannot balance an effective balance process on player's feedback" , a feedback based on emotions and self-preservation is not something to be ever taken seriously.

Fully agree with you, the full block on GS is amazing..for me the weapon is better than before

Why would I roam?...I don't mind lose to players...I don't want to lose to badly designed specs, game full of ganking deadeyes or some other perma stealth cheese that run miles when losing..it gets boring

It's why a wonder, why would a dev ask for subjective feedback instead of forming more non biased opinions through metrics,statistics, and knowledge of how the classes work. This thread is basically people acting like that old meme " Rock is OP, Paper is fine..sincerely Scissors" They keep doing it..and nobody knows why...

I think the matter of whether it's better or not is debatable. Not sure what you mean by "has more utility if you hit the target you're fighting", as there isn't a bonus for actually hitting with the skill. While it gives you more direct access to the leap, it sacrifices on direct access to a dodge, which I would argue is far more important in a combat scenario. Take PvE as an example, let's say at the raid boss Gorseval. If you wanted to dodge his slam, you could either dodge normally, or previously, you would do Serpent's Strike, maintaining dps and tempo. Now, if you wish to use Serpent's Strike for the same purpose, you have to prepare it beforehand, which will sacrifice some dps. My ping situation does not influence my opinion on the fundamental flaws that come with the game not allowing mid-air casting. I was simply stating it to explain why it can become a much larger issue to those with higher ping (if you have low ping, good for you). If you could explain in what combat scenarios that it does stand out above the previous way in which it worked, I might be persuaded to agree with you. But at the moment, I don't think it was ingenious at all, quite the opposite. It's the playstyle that needs adapting, people are used to defensive scenarios when they thought about sword but now it require a more aggressive playstyle to get the most out of the weapon, let's say they have added more "bite" to the weapon and personally I like it

-A legitimate question- After the last changes ,the dagger offhand has grown on me, it got exactly what I need for my playstyle based on evades and kiting. Dagger 4 it's a rather long evade that has allowed me to evade oneshot hits more than once, the cripple on dagger 5 is amazing to chase targets or keep pursuers off your back for a little while. enough to reclaim important CDs. Been beating gs/lb quite comfortably.....ofc remember skill difference is always a factor...still for me it shows promise and now I am wondering if there are others out there who use dagger offhand also

1) OUTLIERS -Warrior is absolutely insane right now after all the nerfs other classes have received; their elite Rampage should be deleted or completely reworked; the passive sustain needs immediate attention and...please make sure that not class in game can reach and keep 25 might as easily as warrior right now -Condi mirage....just rework Infinite Horizon, that's all really, the trait is super broken 2) CORE ISSUES -Over dependance of elementalists on healing power since the launch of the game coupled with their lowest base HP makes for not great customization -Core ranger pets should be either reworked or deleted, they're virtually useless outside PvE; they have extremely long CD on F1 skills with long cast times as further punishments, they can't keep up with moving targets ...this has been an issue since 2013 -Stealth counters are hard and few to come by...adding an elite that nulllify the already super rare counters...it's not really an ideal design choice -Condis have become too bursty and this is something that even @Jon Peters mentioned before he left for Amazon and it's something you devs are well aware of 3) PERSONAL POWER LEVEL PERSPECTIVE -The ability to stunlock/CC a target to death should be removed entirely, it's not fun for the recipient...there should be always at least one chance for the players , it should be not possible to chain CC back to back , in GW1 it was not possible to CC an already CCed target and that was smart game design , you had to cleverly space your CC skills and not just press everything on the keyboard like now -Burst damage must be toned down together with sustain but in a 2:1 ratio , slowing down the game would be beneficial not only for vet players but also newcomers and potential players -Every class should have something to work with in every gamemode , not necessarily meta...but competitive and enjoyable...right now that's not the case , the ranger class has almost nothing to work with both in PvP and WvW after numerous nerfs and adjustements https://metabattle.com/wiki/WvWhttps://metabattle.com/wiki/Conquest I really hope the new balance team will release "a little" their foot from the nerf pedal regarding rangers...they have received unjust nerfs (along with the justifed ones), the nerfs for druid went a tad too far

There's your problem. yeah, you should not kill the pet and that's what started the discussion here, you can't fight back and the pet will kill you. The only pet that hits remotely hard is Gazelle and it's attacks are telegraphed. If you're dying to an AI that just runs at you auto attacking, you need to get better at the game. so? that's your argument? get better at game? if the pet does nothing and its so easy to avoid why do you even need it? the problem is when he going to hit you, most of the times is when you are on low/half life hiding from the ranger at some pillar/wall and the pet will come to you and you can't fight back, if you kill the pet the ranger will come to you since you wasted all your cds, if you stay there the pet will kill you and if you run the ranger will hit you from 2k range doing 15k rapid fire attack, if you are playing a stealth class the pet will hit you revealing you.so if you want a competitive game play if you kill the pet in situations like that they should stay dead, not just ressed by changing it to reset the whole fightIf you want a competitive game...youl should not be able to re-stealth once you engage the opponent

It might just be a NA thing going on. A lot of players are just flat swapping to Core Ranger due to this choice to ditch Sic Em. They just run Skirm/Wild/Beast. It's surprisingly large damage while running something like Paladin, due to the additional feroc off of Skirm/Beast, and quite sustainy vs. power damage. They can brawl well against Holo/Spellbreaker/Herald. Not so hot vs. Condi DrD & Condi Mirage though. Those two counter any brawly Soulbeast/Core Ranger. ye those core rangers are I see quite alot nowadays, it's just not viable on soulbeast :) There are also several on EU. It is mostly carried by the gazelle pet though. I got hit by 15k by one the other day... I think the ranger wasn't even in LoS. I remember because I got a little angry... Had one guy saying the same thing...swapped to 2 core pets...killed him again......rangers can't win, people will cry regardless So you would be happy about a hard gazelle nerf? Then I'd be happy too. :smile: Before that I'd like to see if you know what is causing the dmg, what pet skills? I think it was Charge. The damage is dumb for a non-activated skill. It might just be a NA thing going on. A lot of players are just flat swapping to Core Ranger due to this choice to ditch Sic Em. They just run Skirm/Wild/Beast. It's surprisingly large damage while running something like Paladin, due to the additional feroc off of Skirm/Beast, and quite sustainy vs. power damage. They can brawl well against Holo/Spellbreaker/Herald. Not so hot vs. Condi DrD & Condi Mirage though. Those two counter any brawly Soulbeast/Core Ranger. ye those core rangers are I see quite alot nowadays, it's just not viable on soulbeast :) There are also several on EU. It is mostly carried by the gazelle pet though. I got hit by 15k by one the other day... I think the ranger wasn't even in LoS. I remember because I got a little angry... Had one guy saying the same thing...swapped to 2 core pets...killed him again......rangers can't win, people will cry regardless So you would be happy about a hard gazelle nerf? Then I'd be happy too. :smile: No yea for sure the gazelle is the number one issue in pvp right now. There’s just waves and waves of core Rangers one shotting all the meta builds. The last AT had four teams of five core rangers taking turns one shotting each other with the insane damage potential. Nerf ASAP Not sure where I said "core ranger is OP and dominates everything", but I just take this as the shocked reaction of a ranger main. Closer to a shocked revenant main who didn’t realize people unironically wanted to nerf something about core ranger but sure buddy Yes, I definitely want to get rid of 15k hits on random hits with almost zero tells. Confused you're okay with this very skillful playstyle, but sure, buddy. Sorry you’re having trouble beating core rangers. Lmaooo Core isn’t that good compared to like soulbeast when it comes to high damage spikes or mobility so I just don’t understand why you want to issue a nerf to a melee ranger pet that isn’t very tanky itself. Core classes are so much weaker than pof specs, them having a fighting chance to burst isn’t bad lol. The only time I actually get hit by a huge gazelle hit is if I’m not paying attention or ignoring the pet... that doesn’t mean the pet should be nerfed or when it gliches and snaps to your location. or many many other pet bugs. Then fix the bug don’t nerf the pet that would be awesome, but there is a point where nerfing the pet is simply faster then fixing 15 bugs it has.Guess we should nerf full counter too because of the graphic glitch

i'd agree with your number 1 there, tho funny thing is, i have had ppl cry to me so much on start of a match cuz i played core ranger and was throwing on purpose :)loads of ppl underestimate how strong/op this one is People will always complain about ranger because he's deemed unfair to fight for some backward reason , although Anet is well aware of ranger's concept and they're happy with the unique role they cover albeit some OP mishapes from time to time. I suggest new rangers to always become adept with all weapon skills/pet/traits. The class is constantly on the chopping board..but finds always a way to stay relevant, a combination of medium armor/health and dmg coefficients makes sure the class doesn't become too UP when the nerfs start raining. People hate rangers, not as much as thieves and mesmers..but still hate

It might just be a NA thing going on. A lot of players are just flat swapping to Core Ranger due to this choice to ditch Sic Em. They just run Skirm/Wild/Beast. It's surprisingly large damage while running something like Paladin, due to the additional feroc off of Skirm/Beast, and quite sustainy vs. power damage. They can brawl well against Holo/Spellbreaker/Herald. Not so hot vs. Condi DrD & Condi Mirage though. Those two counter any brawly Soulbeast/Core Ranger. ye those core rangers are I see quite alot nowadays, it's just not viable on soulbeast :) There are also several on EU. It is mostly carried by the gazelle pet though. I got hit by 15k by one the other day... I think the ranger wasn't even in LoS. I remember because I got a little angry... Had one guy saying the same thing...swapped to 2 core pets...killed him again......rangers can't win, people will cry regardless So you would be happy about a hard gazelle nerf? Then I'd be happy too. :smile: Before that I'd like to see if you know what is causing the dmg, what pet skills? I think it was Charge. The damage is dumb for a non-activated skill. It might just be a NA thing going on. A lot of players are just flat swapping to Core Ranger due to this choice to ditch Sic Em. They just run Skirm/Wild/Beast. It's surprisingly large damage while running something like Paladin, due to the additional feroc off of Skirm/Beast, and quite sustainy vs. power damage. They can brawl well against Holo/Spellbreaker/Herald. Not so hot vs. Condi DrD & Condi Mirage though. Those two counter any brawly Soulbeast/Core Ranger. ye those core rangers are I see quite alot nowadays, it's just not viable on soulbeast :) There are also several on EU. It is mostly carried by the gazelle pet though. I got hit by 15k by one the other day... I think the ranger wasn't even in LoS. I remember because I got a little angry... Had one guy saying the same thing...swapped to 2 core pets...killed him again......rangers can't win, people will cry regardless So you would be happy about a hard gazelle nerf? Then I'd be happy too. :smile: No yea for sure the gazelle is the number one issue in pvp right now. There’s just waves and waves of core Rangers one shotting all the meta builds. The last AT had four teams of five core rangers taking turns one shotting each other with the insane damage potential. Nerf ASAP Not sure where I said "core ranger is OP and dominates everything", but I just take this as the shocked reaction of a ranger main. There would be no problem in nerfing the dmg of Charge by 50% or more, I'd say lower this potential dmg from 15k as they say to 2-3k but leave the KD as it is ofc, it's an activated skill and normally used at close range..being too easy to evade if used from distance

Anything can become viable with PvE only stats....I can make work any build in WvW

This is not ele subforum and anyway, it'd be better to fix the other hundred issues on the class rather than focusing the balance on that little thing which may make it work somehow. The oblivious ele community ignores the fact that you all rely on a single weapon to accomplish anything in this game atm , really just a couple of skills : riptide and earthen vortex , for the rest the class is a complete waste of space ideal for the tryhard only for the glory of their inflated ego to flaunt on the forum. Once you wash away the fairy dust from your eyes ( courtesy of Anet) , all you're left with ....it's a joke of a class concept

It might just be a NA thing going on. A lot of players are just flat swapping to Core Ranger due to this choice to ditch Sic Em. They just run Skirm/Wild/Beast. It's surprisingly large damage while running something like Paladin, due to the additional feroc off of Skirm/Beast, and quite sustainy vs. power damage. They can brawl well against Holo/Spellbreaker/Herald. Not so hot vs. Condi DrD & Condi Mirage though. Those two counter any brawly Soulbeast/Core Ranger. ye those core rangers are I see quite alot nowadays, it's just not viable on soulbeast :) There are also several on EU. It is mostly carried by the gazelle pet though. I got hit by 15k by one the other day... I think the ranger wasn't even in LoS. I remember because I got a little angry... Had one guy saying the same thing...swapped to 2 core pets...killed him again......rangers can't win, people will cry regardless So you would be happy about a hard gazelle nerf? Then I'd be happy too. :smile: Before that I'd like to see if you know what is causing the dmg, what pet skills?

1) Condi Mirage2) Rampage sb/core/tactics war3) Reaper/Core necro 2 and 3 have easy access to 25 might and can often win fights by landing some lucky crit of 7k+ regardless of level of toughness 1...does not need introduction Core necro...the fear/boon rip chain can be extremely hard to deal with, close to impossible in some case, you just get condi bombed/feared to death

It might just be a NA thing going on. A lot of players are just flat swapping to Core Ranger due to this choice to ditch Sic Em. They just run Skirm/Wild/Beast. It's surprisingly large damage while running something like Paladin, due to the additional feroc off of Skirm/Beast, and quite sustainy vs. power damage. They can brawl well against Holo/Spellbreaker/Herald. Not so hot vs. Condi DrD & Condi Mirage though. Those two counter any brawly Soulbeast/Core Ranger. ye those core rangers are I see quite alot nowadays, it's just not viable on soulbeast :) There are also several on EU. It is mostly carried by the gazelle pet though. I got hit by 15k by one the other day... I think the ranger wasn't even in LoS. I remember because I got a little angry...Had one guy saying the same thing...swapped to 2 core pets...killed him again......rangers can't win, people will cry regardless

Warrior balanced and ele weaver seemingly OP?.......What?

This type of comment make me crazy. I read so many times that the main complaint of other classes is that Ranger does a lot of damage with LB when it is sitting on the wall. So, it doesn't matter that LB is not really a threat in 1 vs 1 or zerg, but only because can hit from the walls.@Infusion.7149, are you serious?I should have been more specific and split my WvW-specific post into two parts. Dismounting isn't the issue, it's dismounting and insta-killing before hitting the ground (or even being able to use a skill) off dismount despite 3000 armor. It is felt more on a class without passives such as Defy Pain on warriors or durability runes (increased mount health and activated protection passive). The wall example is more about elevation than structures. Skills like CoR cannot do this since it doesn't multi-hit, is slow , affected by terrain, and isn't tracking the target. The closest things with multi-hit are double-tap on deadeye which doesn't have the same damage levels, or warriors that for some reason decide to run rifle and use Volley (which has 1200 range and no vulnerability) which has higher travel time plus it doesn't arc. There are always going to be some people playing rangers (roleplayers or otherwise) because even before soulbeast, rangers would stay off tag and pew pew at >1200 range or doing their own thing roaming when literally every other class is trying to be on tag. It's one of the most common complaints against rangers in WvW besides pets (which is why it is mainly soulbeasts to address the pet issue). P.S. I was against nerfing longbow auto as it's not the problem, it's largely stacking soulbeast multiplicative % bonuses with food/keep bonuses/bloodlust as far as WvW.It's called ranger for a reason...do you guys ever played any other MMO? Since the dawn of time in all MMO, the ranger class has been played with a longbow...it's only in GW2 that people like you expect otherwise so...can we nerf to the ground axe/shield combo on warrior and force them on ranged by buffing rifle? see how stupid it sound?

Oh Really? Loads of people knew this would happen even before the release of the patch...I don't think you actually realize the issue here : you get up to 7k healing burst every 20s on top of passive healing, all the while you have absurd levels of dmg. The build is so loaded and easy to sustain/play that I have decided to give my warrior some more playtime as 3rd main It's way easier to get 25 might with this build than magebane which is already easy ..go figure

Spider Venon+Infiltrator's Strike+Steal+Dodge is literally lethal levels of condition damage against any build in the game that can be dropped on a player with a fraction of a second to anticipate. Often times no time to anticipate considering how often thieves graphically desync from their actual position in game. then a random passive condition cleanse happens... or swapped weapon for cleansing proc... or got cleansed by an actual skill.... or a light field got blasted... or a decent support cleansed it for you... or you had magnetic aura up and reflected the daggers on dodge back at them... or you dodged the quite obvious set up (a thief is running at you from 900, he most likely about to port rather than run all the way up to you).. or I dont care because this games level of skill has literally hit the point where we complain about completely stupid kitten instead of changing class or build to deal with it. "muuuuuuum! MUUUUUUUM!!!! I DONT LIKE RED M and M's, I LIKE THE CHOCOLATE ONES!" All of those handicaps and counters that effect condition daredevil also apply to more gradual condition classes except even more so. The problem with condition thief is that unlike other condi specs where you can anticipate "Okay there's 300 power damage and 500 condition damage on ranged auto attack" or "This attack will stack 10 bleed if it all hits me" or "if I stand in this field or stand nearby when they are very obviously farting out AoE I'll get conditioned to death", condition thief is able to do 100% health levels of condition damage with only a fraction of a second of a tell, often times less so because of how of ten thieves graphically desync fro their actual position in game, unblockably, and evading all the while. And then it ports out, often straight through line of sight, and then ports in again if the previous attempt didn't finish the job. Even sitting still and eating the entirety of a mesmer's pistol phantasm and scepter beam at the same time isn't going to dump half that level of damage on a target. And that takes three full seconds of pulsing conditions to ramp up. And daredevils can effectively do that with next to zero tell at 2100 range on top of having the capacity to have a guaranteed complete disengage from the encounter by the very nature of how their engage works. You can move , forcing them to overextend from the safety of their LoS infiltrator's strike return , you can dodge the instant they teleport in and pressure them as soon as they get close that's how I do. The main point here is I can actually punish thief for mistakes...while the mesmer will have distortion or evasive mirror or aegis from chaos field or simply stealthed when they do a fuck up or they safely teleport away thx to their 8s CD staff teleport, it's why it's preferable to fight a condi thief than a condi mesmer....You can punish the thief for making bad decisions The whole argument can be summurize in a single sentence I can punish the bad thief while the bad mesmer can still manage to get away , yes you can lose to thieves...I have lost some time ago to a plat 3 condi thief core and that was the only instance, I lose to thieves because I get outplayed. You lose to mesmers because they have a plethora of defensive sets on relatively low CD and all packed in the same build, You lose to a thief..you lose to the player...you lose to a mesmer..you lose to the class P.S Ofc I am talking about condi mirage

Yes - they took the evade out of the end of the GS autoattack chain, which messed up a lot of folks who came to depend on it as part of a good melee rotation. Instead of giving an evade frame, the final attack in the chain gives back some endurance. It still takes forever and a day to channel the whole final attack. WAIT WHAT!! Who in the hell in the balancing team thought it was a good idea to remove the evade frame???Devs do me a favor and play ur kitten game, you dont play it therefore you dont understand it. Thats why you dont know how to balance it.The evade frame on 3rd auto skill has been in game SINCE LAUNCH. So you just now remembered to remove it? Did MANY ppl complain about it? I guarantee it may have been 1% who did, others didnt even care about it. Rip our matchup with condi mes now, Ranger basically may not be able to get head to head in 1v1s at a high skill match with most of melee classes, nor it can in team fights. The 3rd auto evade was so unique for ranger it gave us room to get toe to toe with mesmers, weavers, staff thiefs, wars, power fbs, timing enemy burst skills with it. Its why i loved the weapon. Nerfed sicem and lb it was fair, nerfing soulbeasts dmg its still fair, nerfed boonbeast fair aswell, nerfed druid... idk why but ok... not many play it anyways because of you. And now you nerf/remove this? Whats next? Rip Didn't they give us a full block on GS4 to better deal with melee classes? Arheundel, you can say whatever you want, but all changes were a nerf for GS. Yes the block now it is a proper block, better than before, but we lost an evade and 1 damage skill , a range skill.People may disagree with me and all but..in the end of the day the GS AA chain cancel has been identified as an exploit or unintended action . In the past, other professions have received the same type of treatment : like RTL on ele, they removed the ability to use it mid air, while it was left untouched on ancestral grace; or when they removed the ability to shoot back from scepter ele, mantra mesmer and rifle engi or when they removed the ability of thieves to preload vault from distance and steal/teleport on unaware target.

Yes - they took the evade out of the end of the GS autoattack chain, which messed up a lot of folks who came to depend on it as part of a good melee rotation. Instead of giving an evade frame, the final attack in the chain gives back some endurance. It still takes forever and a day to channel the whole final attack. WAIT WHAT!! Who in the hell in the balancing team thought it was a good idea to remove the evade frame???Devs do me a favor and play ur kitten game, you dont play it therefore you dont understand it. Thats why you dont know how to balance it.The evade frame on 3rd auto skill has been in game SINCE LAUNCH. So you just now remembered to remove it? Did MANY ppl complain about it? I guarantee it may have been 1% who did, others didnt even care about it. Rip our matchup with condi mes now, Ranger basically may not be able to get head to head in 1v1s at a high skill match with most of melee classes, nor it can in team fights. The 3rd auto evade was so unique for ranger it gave us room to get toe to toe with mesmers, weavers, staff thiefs, wars, power fbs, timing enemy burst skills with it. Its why i loved the weapon. Nerfed sicem and lb it was fair, nerfing soulbeasts dmg its still fair, nerfed boonbeast fair aswell, nerfed druid... idk why but ok... not many play it anyways because of you. And now you nerf/remove this? Whats next? RipDidn't they give us a full block on GS4 to better deal with melee classes?

The only problem is that as a necro you will manage to pull that off only if the other players are terrible, unlike if you are in a mesmer for ex that has much better synergy and survival plus amazing burst damage as well but allows you to best other classes such as necro when outnumbered by them even if the players are on same skill lvl. If anything they can get in and out of the fight by stealth and teleports making you exaust your cds. Are you sure the problem is necromancer and not you?https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=2261&v=b1z0WytS4tQ When mastered, the necromancer is the shittiest thing to go against...look at the video! None of the classes you mentioned won against a single reaper, none of them!Necromancer tool set is mostly insta cast with chain triggering of traits....ofc people will ask for more but again...that's normal for a MMO