why are dungeons dead?

[Turmuhnal.6589]

On 10/25/2021 at 2:58 AM, Rasimir.6239 said:

I must've missed the memo, and so apparently did a lot of other people, because every time I feel like playing dungeons, I get a party filled through lfg in a matter of minutes.

As a somewhat new player I've noticed the opposite.  Hardly any groups up, and when you finally get in 1 people leave or go offline or afk in LA...just about to give up on em myself.

[Rasimir.6239]

11 hours ago, Turmuhnal.6589 said:

As a somewhat new player I've noticed the opposite.  Hardly any groups up, and when you finally get in 1 people leave or go offline or afk in LA...just about to give up on em myself.

Put up an lfg in the section of the dungeon you want to run, write something like "new to dungeons, story + exp", and chances are good you'll get a couple of veterans ready to lead a tour through the whole thing 😉 .

 

Or if you are on EU, just drop me a message and we'll go on a dungeon tour together 🙂 .

[Bakeneko.5826]

Dungeons are dead because Anet nerfed liquid gold reward of dungeons. The end.

[Epsilon Indi.2031]

On 1/29/2022 at 5:52 AM, Bakeneko.5826 said:

Dungeons are dead because Anet nerfed liquid gold reward of dungeons. The end.

If you do 16 paths, dungeons are like 20 raw gold.  That's more than they ere before.

[Shikaru.7618]

4 hours ago, Sir Alymer.3406 said:

If you do 16 paths, dungeons are like 20 raw gold.  That's more than they ere before.

How does the math work out on that one?

I'm excluding the 26s per path as that hasn't changed.

Daily AC was 1g50s per path x 3 = 4g50s

Daily CM to CoE per path was 1g x13 = 13g

Arah was 3g per path except p3 was 1g50 = 10g50s

If you ran Ac and 13 other easy paths that used to be 17g50s. Now it's 50x3=1g50s for ac and 35x13=4g55s for others plus 2 dungeon chests which is 10g. That totals to 16g5s which is less than the liquid rewards from before and also locks you out of getting a large portion of that liquid reward if you don't finish 8 paths. This discrepancy is further increased if you farmed arah before.

One could argue that the bonus tokens you get can translate into some liquid but that requires extra outside knowledge to know how to get those gains. You also do not make progress towards ascended gear at all doing dungeons.

So the culmination of delayed and reduced liquid, the obscurity around how to gain value from tokens, the lack of ascended gear, and also competing with fotm's way more straight forward reward structure lead to dungeons being abandoned.

Edited January 31, 2022 by Shikaru.7618

[Epsilon Indi.2031]

23 hours ago, Shikaru.7618 said:

How does the math work out on that one?

I'm excluding the 26s per path as that hasn't changed.

Daily AC was 1g50s per path x 3 = 4g50s

Daily CM to CoE per path was 1g x13 = 13g

Arah was 3g per path except p3 was 1g50 = 10g50s

If you ran Ac and 13 other easy paths that used to be 17g50s. Now it's 50x3=1g50s for ac and 35x13=4g55s for others plus 2 dungeon chests which is 10g. That totals to 16g5s which is less than the liquid rewards from before and also locks you out of getting a large portion of that liquid reward if you don't finish 8 paths. This discrepancy is further increased if you farmed arah before.

One could argue that the bonus tokens you get can translate into some liquid but that requires extra outside knowledge to know how to get those gains. You also do not make progress towards ascended gear at all doing dungeons.

So the culmination of delayed and reduced liquid, the obscurity around how to gain value from tokens, the lack of ascended gear, and also competing with fotm's way more straight forward reward structure lead to dungeons being abandoned.

Dungeon	Path	Coin (Gold)	Token	Experience
Ascalonian Catacombs	P1	0.76	100	177800
	P2	0.76	100	177800
	P3	0.76	100	177800
Caudecus’ Manor	P1	0.61	100	177800
	P2	0.61	100	177800
	P3	0.61	100	177800
Twilight Arbor	Up	0.61	100	177800
	Forward	0.61	100	177800
	Aether	0.92	100	177800
Sorrow’s Embrace	P1	0.61	100	177800
	P3	0.61	100	177800
Citadel of Flame	P1	0.61	100	177800
	P2	0.61	100	177800
Honor of the Waves	P1	0.61	100	177800
Crucible of Eternity	P1	0.61	100	177800
	P3	0.61	100	177800

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Dungeons_(achievements)#Dungeon_Frequenter

 

The Coin (Gold) Is raw gold awards. (G.SSCC where G is gold, S is silver, C is copper).  It factors in the 26 silver + the silver per path.

 

 

[Firebeard.1746]

On 1/28/2022 at 2:33 PM, Turmuhnal.6589 said:

As a somewhat new player I've noticed the opposite.  Hardly any groups up, and when you finally get in 1 people leave or go offline or afk in LA...just about to give up on em myself.

Best time to do them is when they're a daily, usually people join my groups pretty quick when I list. Also, story mode counts for the daily even though the wording suggests otherwise, so people will come. I usually make it clear in group description that they will get daily and they usually join if I'm listing on a character that hasn't done story yet. They're mostly ignored content these days because the rewards aren't competitve with fractals and raids. Most dungeons don't get anywhere near the level of challenge either. Alot of people do enjoy dungeons still. I find them refreshing in some ways, but I tend to only do them when they're dailies. Also vanilla players may find them boring because they were the ONLY end game group content for so long. As someone who joined later, it's still fun to do when they're up. 

People still run ascalonians catacombs and twilight arbor outside of dailies because the runes you can get from them are meta for certain builds. So you may still have luck with making groups for them in that case. 

Edited February 2, 2022 by Firebeard.1746

[Shikaru.7618]

5 hours ago, Sir Alymer.3406 said:

Dungeon	Path	Coin (Gold)	Token	Experience
Ascalonian Catacombs	P1	0.76	100	177800
	P2	0.76	100	177800
	P3	0.76	100	177800
Caudecus’ Manor	P1	0.61	100	177800
	P2	0.61	100	177800
	P3	0.61	100	177800
Twilight Arbor	Up	0.61	100	177800
	Forward	0.61	100	177800
	Aether	0.92	100	177800
Sorrow’s Embrace	P1	0.61	100	177800
	P3	0.61	100	177800
Citadel of Flame	P1	0.61	100	177800
	P2	0.61	100	177800
Honor of the Waves	P1	0.61	100	177800
Crucible of Eternity	P1	0.61	100	177800
	P3	0.61	100	177800

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Dungeons_(achievements)#Dungeon_Frequenter

 

The Coin (Gold) Is raw gold awards. (G.SSCC where G is gold, S is silver, C is copper).  It factors in the 26 silver + the silver per path.

 

 

Right but that doesn't demonstrate that it's higher than it was before. These values still show that your raw gold is lower than what it was before.

[Epsilon Indi.2031]

12 minutes ago, Shikaru.7618 said:

Right but that doesn't demonstrate that it's higher than it was before. These values still show that your raw gold is lower than what it was before.

You need to realize something here;

The 13 "easy" paths back in the day were anywhere from 2-3 hours for the average player group.

The 16 "easy" paths today are  possible in 1h 30min and the raw gold is a base of 20g.  This discounts any drops you get in the dungeon themselves.

[sdaugherty.1984]

I would love to see Anet completely re-do the dungeon Ascalonian Catacombs! This dungeon is a classic part of the rich GW2 story and is due more respect. It was the first dungeon to be added to the game and after 10 years it is starting to show its age. Since it is an instance could Anet simply replace it with a modern version?  I feel this would give new life to these areas if they were brought up to modern standards of design. In my opinion there is nothing better than a classic ghost filled dungeon. What do you think?

[Stone.6751]

Dungeons aren't dead. At any given time the number of LFGs across all 8 dungeons isnt that far off the number of LFGs for all tiers of Fractals.

 

I run dungeons frequently, and it's extremely rare that I can't fill a party for any dungeon - even Aetherblades - fairly quickly. Don't wait for someone else to start a LFG, put up your own. The trick is to be specific in LFG about what you are doing. "CM P1,2,3" is going to fill faster than "Need tokens" or even worse no LFG message at all. 

 

Not sure why people think the payout isn't worth the time. I find they can pay quite nicely and, more importantly, I find five man content the most social and enjoyable content in the game. The real trick is to getting a party that will hop dungeon to dungeon to minimize your downtime. The back pieces that drop can pay well, especially some of the rares. Use excess tokens to buy exotic weapons and throw them in the forge. I've had three precursors drop ever, one was a drop from a dungeon run and one was from throwing exotics bought with tokens in the forge.

 

I can understand why people don't like some of the outdated mechanics and fights. They can be a little weird or imbalanced, but they have a certain charm I suppose and become trivial once you know how they eork. Another turnoff for some players is that many dungeon groups fill with inexperienced pugs looking to level and experience the content for the first time. I rather enjoy playing with new players so it's not an issue for me, and the content is so easy now with power creep that a good player can pretty much carry an inexperienced party.

 

I'd recommend people give dungeons a second look.