What's so wrong with tryhards ?

[stuntmaniac.5483]

There's a lot I want to say about GW2. I've played for so long. There was a time gw2 was THE end all be all to mmos just for the pvp. The combat system was godly. The outplay potential, the combo mechanics, the small and simple things you could do like immobing someone then standing behind them so they couldnt hit you,.... Little things like he good ole mesmer "triangle" for setting up shatters.......True there were some builds that were toxic and played themselves.... but skill could outplay most things..... Why Anet? Why did the game turn to "passive" save your life so you don't have to think. Why did it turn to "we want our players to enjoy the game by winning without actually putting effort in to win"..... Look back to the growth you had in the pvp community between the first and second worlds pvp tournaments...... Why did you throw all that away for the sake of "casual" gameplay........ What's so wrong with getting better at something difficult and then being better at someone who doesn't want to learn??? Why is brainless the same thing as "Enjoyment" ?? Why did you guys abandon PvP when it was at its peak ? I never understood and probably never will.... The pve content got better then it was sure.... But what about us? Why are minion mancer builds a thing in pvp? Why were problem builds ignored for months on end with no discussion between the players and devs?  Why do people not have to use YOUR dodge mechanic to survive a full glass cannons burst but instead be saved by a classes passive mechanics..... Why are brainless builds promoted ? Player vs player is literally  "What can I do to beat this person that's competing against me". Why did it come to "what can the game do to beat the player competing against me" What's so wrong with the mindset "I want to better then the person on the other team"? I know we'll never  get an answer from Anet.  90% of the old PvP community is gone. They moved on long ago.... The 15 that are left end up win trading to get an gismo just to sell their account off to some dude in Dubai with too much money....... People are toxic and Ego driven with a leaderboard that literally never showed the skill of a player just games played. Don't worry though.... living story got a new update... There's an entirely new area coming out.... Oh there's a beta event..... Don't worry we've given a teleporting stealth class as much barrier as a scourge... "Fun"... Oh and there's a new A.I. build for Engi where the a.i. does the work for you...."Fun" Don't worry you dont have to play the game. Just log in q and run to a point. Your golem will do 5k auto attacks because that is  "Fun".... People will say "It's just a beta the numbers will be squished."...... After all these years and all this silence towards the pvp community other then randomly coming out and dealing with a problem that bothers a small minority of players. Or even fixing a problem that never existed in the first place..... The biggest problem of all is that we can't trust that feedback would even go noticed.... Oh well this is my one and only rant on these forums. One last "Game sucks"..... Hope everyone enjoys their giant aoe circles, passive explosions on dodge, and the continuous "I'm a full tank build with no dmg modifiers and my pet still does more dmg then a fresh air eles or pwr shatter mesmers entire kit." This post isn't out of anger. This post isn't to flame the decisions they made even if I don't agree with them. It's just an old washed up pvp player wondering why was it so wrong to get "better" at the game he loved. I dont think there's anything wrong with playing a game causally... Enjoy yourself. But.... Why was the best combat system implemented into a MMO thrown away just for the sake of "casual" play... Thanks for the experience Anet. 

[xiaoyan.1637]

Sir this is a Wendy’s

[Genesis.5169]

3 hours ago, stuntmaniac.5483 said:

"I'm a full tank build with no dmg modifiers and my pet still does more dmg then a fresh air eles or pwr shatter mesmers entire kit."

 

Post build.

[Bazsi.2734]

49 minutes ago, Genesis.5169 said:

 

Post build.

Mechanist lol.

[Vancho.8750]

19 hours ago, Bazsi.2734 said:

Mechanist lol.

Isn't the river drake better than allot professions these days, might be that one too.

[Morwath.9817]

 

11 hours ago, Vancho.8750 said:

Isn't the river drake better than allot professions these days, might be that one too.

 

I think you're joking with this post. However, I find it funny that many posters lately target Ranger as some overpowered abomination. Ranger in reality isn't even that strong. I mean, Valk Ranger is nothing more than SoloQ hero. It's not even powerful enough to be picked for mAT finals, unlike Holosmith, Revenant, Necro, Thief, Guardian that are nearly in each team.

 

If a build is good only at holding a side node, then well... It should have huge advantages over builds that overperform it in other areas like team fighting or mobility. Theres nothing wrong with that. In fact, thats how you should balance things, side node builds should be superior in 1v1 compared to non side node builds, because they usualy sacrifice ability to do anything else with their weapon, utility and trait picks. At least how I would balance specializations, if it would be my job.

 

Edited November 5, 2021 by Morwath.9817

[Vancho.8750]

46 minutes ago, Morwath.9817 said:

 

 

I think you're joking with this post. However, I find it funny that many posters lately target Ranger as some overpowered abomination. Kinda not seeing Ranger in reality isn't even that strong. I mean, Valk Ranger is nothing more than SoloQ hero. It's not even powerful enough to be picked for mAT finals, unlike Holosmith, Revenant, Necro, Thief, Guardian that are nearly in each team.

 

If a build is good only at holding a side node, then well... It should have huge advantages over builds that overperform it in other areas like team fighting or mobility. Theres nothing wrong with that. In fact, thats how you should balance things, side node builds should be superior in 1v1 compared to non side node builds, because they usualy sacrifice ability to do anything else with their weapon, utility and trait picks. At least how I would balance specializations, if it would be my job.

 

The problem is that an AI is doing a better job at sidenode than some professions in the game with their full kit, as in they need fixing cause they are worse than a dumb auto attacking AI. They don't even have a cheese build for queues.
Personally I think they did a big mistake giving GS on ranger block, it is too good for everything like that, should have been block projectiles and one melee attack. The problem here is that it becomes good in ranged and melee just by switching weapons. The complaints are coming in cause the ranger character capabilities are equal or better to some professions, while the AI is getting these extra 5k hits.
The MaT thing, of all the builds you mention only Holosmith is multipurpose, since it ticks the damage, sustain and mobility boxes and might need to be made to chose which one to suffer instead of getting them all, this would make some room for ranger which fills in similar role. To contest the teamfight ranger needs reworks on druid so it is just support and doesn't end up god of the side node by healing itself and staring you down till you die from the pet. People moved necro builds to sidenodes since the sidenoders are kind a not useful on Tournaments, since you can pull skirmishes way more than 1v1s and you are not baiting for long fights you are there to push for 2v2 and the outnumbers with just enough sustain to wait for help and basically draw people into teamfights which is the necro field of expertise. 
The direction should go in This build can do that task on a good great level and this other build can do another task at good level  instead of I can do everything on one build.  

[Morwath.9817]

1 hour ago, Vancho.8750 said:

The problem is that an AI is doing a better job at sidenode than some professions in the game with their full kit, as in they need fixing cause they are worse than a dumb auto attacking AI. They don't even have a cheese build for queues.
Personally I think they did a big mistake giving GS on ranger block, it is too good for everything like that, should have been block projectiles and one melee attack. The problem here is that it becomes good in ranged and melee just by switching weapons. The complaints are coming in cause the ranger character capabilities are equal or better to some professions, while the AI is getting these extra 5k hits.
The MaT thing, of all the builds you mention only Holosmith is multipurpose, since it ticks the damage, sustain and mobility boxes and might need to be made to chose which one to suffer instead of getting them all, this would make some room for ranger which fills in similar role. To contest the teamfight ranger needs reworks on druid so it is just support and doesn't end up god of the side node by healing itself and staring you down till you die from the pet. People moved necro builds to sidenodes since the sidenoders are kind a not useful on Tournaments, since you can pull skirmishes way more than 1v1s and you are not baiting for long fights you are there to push for 2v2 and the outnumbers with just enough sustain to wait for help and basically draw people into teamfights which is the necro field of expertise. 
The direction should go in This build can do that task on a good great level and this other build can do another task at good level  instead of I can do everything on one build.  

 

I disagree on block on GS being mistake.

I think in general Ranger weapons should be better, while pet should be worse (utility mechanic).

Edited November 5, 2021 by Morwath.9817

[Vancho.8750]

1 minute ago, Morwath.9817 said:

 

I disagree on block on GS being mistake.

I think in general Ranger weapons should be better, while pet should be worse (utility mechanic).

It did cannibalise the other weapons after this change, sword dagger was the defense set and GS was the heavy damage  melee set, now there is no reason for the sword dagger, when GS fills the same role while doing more damage. Am still confused  why they nerfed the dodge out of staff at the same time, while giving GS another dodge on top of the block, this skill now will get you killed because it was meant to have the dodge. It feels like they wanted to make everyone play with GS on all builds.     

[Morwath.9817]

5 minutes ago, Vancho.8750 said:

It did cannibalise the other weapons after this change, sword dagger was the defense set and GS was the heavy damage  melee set, now there is no reason for the sword dagger, when GS fills the same role while doing more damage. Am still confused  why they nerfed the dodge out of staff at the same time, while giving GS another dodge on top of the block, this skill now will get you killed because it was meant to have the dodge. It feels like they wanted to make everyone play with GS on all builds.     

Maybe they need to buff other weapons and nerf pets at same time? 😉

[Vancho.8750]

Just now, Morwath.9817 said:

Maybe they need to buff other weapons and nerf pets at same time? 😉

Maybe, but I'm still pissy that Renger gets the whole weapon set of GS/shield from warrior on one set of GS, but they should probably fix warrior to not have so many useless weapons. And you are right about pets, but not as nerfs but reworks to lean more in the utility instead of the whole you got killed by a Goat HAHA cause it does more damage than the ranger kind of deal and that would be constant problem since people will just find the next GOAT till it is fixed on mechanical level. And they did have the idea with untamed but it is half baked, they didn't go far enough to fix up the pet system. It is kinda funny that Engi is the better pet class.    

[Morwath.9817]

4 minutes ago, Vancho.8750 said:

Maybe, but I'm still pissy that Renger gets the whole weapon set of GS/shield from warrior on one set of GS, but they should probably fix warrior to not have so many useless weapons. And you are right about pets, but not as nerfs but reworks to lean more in the utility instead of the whole you got killed by a Goat HAHA cause it does more damage than the ranger kind of deal and that would be constant problem since people will just find the next GOAT till it is fixed on mechanical level. And they did have the idea with untamed but it is half baked, they didn't go far enough to fix up the pet system. It is kinda funny that Engi is the better pet class.    

 

Thats why I meant nerf pets (all of them damage wise and just make them good F2 utility) while buffing weapons, this way you not only make fighting against Rangers more fun (you can focus on player instead of pet) as well as playing Ranger more fun (buttons you push are more meagniful).

 

And yes, I think many Warrior problems are based on their weapon kit.

Edit: Untamed has buffed pet version anyway and both Druid and Soulbeast have separate mechanics.

Edited November 5, 2021 by Morwath.9817

[Lighter.5631]

pre-HoT was the golden time, i enjoyed every moment of outplays and set ups..now is just evade/block/invul/cc spam chain..who break the chain first who wins..boring and unfun to watch.

like mesmer triangel positioning clone spawn and skill canceling to bait dodges, positioning behind enemy to cancel skills, setup to combo long cast time skill with low cast time for bursts..was nice optimization which no where to be seen now

 

this game pvp dead after HoT

Edited November 5, 2021 by Lighter.5631

[Genesis.5169]

8 minutes ago, Lighter.5631 said:

pre-HoT was the golden time, i enjoyed every moment of outplays and set ups..now is just evade/block/invul/cc spam chain..who break the chain first who wins..boring and unfun to watch.

like mesmer triangel positioning clone spawn and skill canceling to bait dodges, positioning behind enemy to cancel skills, setup to combo long cast time skill with low cast time for bursts..was nice optimization which no where to be seen now

 

this game pvp dead after HoT

Sounds like you miss the time when the game was easier and there is nothing wrong with that but much of you are misrepresenting core.

Edited November 5, 2021 by Genesis.5169

[Lighter.5631]

45 minutes ago, Genesis.5169 said:

Sounds like you miss the time when the game was easier and there is nothing wrong with that but much of you are misrepresenting core.

LOL bruh, now is so much easier, so much more braindead that's why i miss the old days when it's actually skillful, not sure how you can misunderstand my comment.

before everybody was close to second place team of NA now and multiple duel servers were full all day  with people try hard dueling all day and teams doing in-houses everyday, if you think that time was easier, you have something wrong with your head.

like you literally have no idea how competitive it was back then, now is no where close

Edited November 5, 2021 by Lighter.5631

[Morwath.9817]

2 minutes ago, Lighter.5631 said:

LOL bruh, now is so much easier, so much more braindead that's why i miss the old days when it's actually skillful and noob friendly, not sure how you read my comments properly to misinterpret.

...but man, Celestial meta was extremly forgiving compared to current berserker meta. Also, keep in mind that all those passive o-kitten things from traits had low CDs unlike they have now 300s CD.

 

Can you please list me all those Core Guardian extra i-frames added since then? Maybe Holosmith has something extra compared to Core Engineer back in pre-Hot meta? Necro gained some i-frames maybe? Thief got something more than just one extra dodge on Daredevil? No? Maybe you mean power Revenant who isn't even playing with shield for i-frame anymore, but goes full offense? So what you're talking about, since those are most meta specs?

 

[Lighter.5631]

12 minutes ago, Morwath.9817 said:

...but man, Celestial meta was extremly forgiving compared to current berserker meta. Also, keep in mind that all those passive o-kitten things from traits had low CDs unlike they have now 300s CD.

 

Can you please list me all those Core Guardian extra i-frames added since then? Maybe Holosmith has something extra compared to Core Engineer back in pre-Hot meta? Necro gained some i-frames maybe? Thief got something more than just one extra dodge on Daredevil? No? Maybe you mean power Revenant who isn't even playing with shield for i-frame anymore, but goes full offense? So what you're talking about, since those are most meta specs?

 

nah, people now in berserker lives longer then celestial pre-HoT. a single mispositioning with celestial shoutbow war in a teamfight = instant delete, same with pre-hot thief, and how can you compare daredevil even just after HoT release to pre-hot thief...like...how..and how did you play rev before HoT release? do you even have idea what you talking about?

holosmith comparing to core engi pre-hot? how is it even comparable

 

like what are you smoking...what?...

don't argue about something you have no idea and have not experienced. like for real..

Edited November 5, 2021 by Lighter.5631

[Morwath.9817]

11 minutes ago, Lighter.5631 said:

nah, people now in berserker lives longer then celestial pre-HoT. and how can you compare daredevil even just after HoT release to pre-hot thief...like...how..and how did you play rev before HoT release? do you even have idea what you talking about?

holosmith comparing to core engi pre-hot? how is it even comparable

 

like what are you smoking...what?...

You can compare Revenant to any other class of that period sustain wise.

Do you think Power Herald has more i-frames now, than for example Core Engineer had back then? Because on Power Herald you've Sword3, Staff3 and Staff5 compared Gear Shield on Tool Kit, Elixir S invul, then you had passive Elixir S at 25% if I remember correctly. Then Holosmith has less i-frames, than core Engineer was back then since passive Elixir S is gone. While I can't really compare Daredevil right after HoT release to pre-HoT Thief, I certainly can do it now, as current daredevil doesn't have as much evades, I'd argue if in reality it has less evades than core Thief back then due to Acrobatics nerf etc.

 

And no, people in berseker don't live longer now, than people in celestial pre-HoT, because there ain't passive traits to save them consistently to chain with other i-frame abilities anymore. So, I just feel you're yet another unhappy core Ele fan.

[Lighter.5631]

13 minutes ago, Morwath.9817 said:

You can compare Revenant to any other class of that period sustain wise.

Do you think Power Herald has more i-frames now, than for example Core Engineer had back then? Because on Power Herald you've Sword3, Staff3 and Staff5 compared Gear Shield on Tool Kit, Elixir S invul, then you had passive Elixir S at 25% if I remember correctly. Then Holosmith has less i-frames, than core Engineer was back then since passive Elixir S is gone. While I can't really compare Daredevil right after HoT release to pre-HoT Thief, I certainly can do it now, as current daredevil doesn't have as much evades, I'd argue if in reality it has less evades than core Thief back then due to Acrobatics nerf etc.

 

And no, people in berseker don't live longer now, than people in celestial pre-HoT, because there ain't passive traits to save them consistently to chain with other i-frame abilities anymore. So, I just feel you're yet another unhappy core Ele fan.

LOL

do you realize what are you talking? that means, now if you give core engi back the passive S, core engi now would be as strong as holosmith. or are you trying to say core engi pre-hot is as strong as power rev now?

which all engi will disagree with you.

you need to look the class as a whole, even with one less passive invuln, holosmith/rev still outclass core engi by miles..anyone who actually plays the game or have logic will agree with that.

good job trying to argue by nit picking and not looking at the whole picture tho

Edited November 5, 2021 by Lighter.5631

[TrollingDemigod.3041]

7 minutes ago, Morwath.9817 said:

You can compare Revenant to any other class of that period sustain wise.

Do you think Power Herald has more i-frames now, than for example Core Engineer had back then? Because on Power Herald you've Sword3, Staff3 and Staff5 compared Gear Shield on Tool Kit, Elixir S invul, then you had passive Elixir S at 25% if I remember correctly. Then Holosmith has less i-frames, than core Engineer was back then since passive Elixir S is gone. While I can't really compare Daredevil right after HoT release to pre-HoT Thief, I certainly can do it now, as current daredevil doesn't have as much evades, I'd argue if in reality it has less evades than core Thief back then due to Acrobatics nerf etc.

 

And no, people in berseker don't live longer now, than people in celestial pre-HoT, because there ain't passive traits to save them consistently to chain with other i-frame abilities anymore. So, I just feel you're yet another unhappy core Ele fan.

You guys need some cables to get back connection to reality or something?
Now, since you make this pepe comparision, what are the cooldowns of said skills. You also forgot about to add Shiro Skill to Rev, which DOES provide i-frame. 
Holosmith is just Engineer Core+, it didn't bring any kind of "i-frames" in it's kit, but for sure it brought powercreep via Forge itself(damage, mobilty, etc.), not gonna mention utilities since they do bring a lot to the table with said e-spec as well.
Daredevil is also Thief Core+, it DOES bring more evades than core class, it also gives more i-frames through weapon(Staff) and have a block, which core doesn't have, it screams "powercreep" to me here.
If said e-speces hasn't brought "anything" to the table, then why people USE them all the time?
When was the last time you saw core engineer or core teef that wasn't f2p?

[Morwath.9817]

32 minutes ago, Lighter.5631 said:

LOL

do you realize what are you talking? that means, now if you give core engi back the passive S, core engi now would be as strong as holosmith. or are you trying to say core engi pre-hot is as strong as power rev now?

which all engi will disagree with you.

you need to look the class as a whole, even with one less passive invuln, holosmith/rev still outclass core engi by miles..anyone who actually plays the game or have logic will agree with that.

good job trying to argue by nit picking and not looking at the whole picture tho

 

Oh dear, do you even know what we're discussing right now? Let me remind you:

 

You (p1): "pre-HoT was the golden time, i enjoyed every moment of outplays and set ups..now is just evade/block/invul/cc spam chain..who break the chain first who wins..boring and unfun to watch."

 

Genesis in response: "game is harder"

 

You (p2): "LOL bruh, now is so much easier, so much more braindead that's why i miss the old days when it's actually skillful and noob friendly, not sure how you read my comments properly to misinterpret."

 

me: Celestial meta was more forgiving and noob friendly with more tanky talismans and invul passives, which are gone.

 

You (p3): Gibberish about core not being equal to especs.

 

I don't really understand what you're trying to say. Core Engineer being worse than Holosmith doesn't connect to your main argument about more i-frames in games and chaining them or game being easier or harder. Since I feel discussing with you is just pure waste of time I will just withdraw. Have fun.

Edited November 5, 2021 by Morwath.9817

[Morwath.9817]

30 minutes ago, TrollingDemigod.3041 said:

You guys need some cables to get back connection to reality or something?
Now, since you make this pepe comparision, what are the cooldowns of said skills. You also forgot about to add Shiro Skill to Rev, which DOES provide i-frame. 
Holosmith is just Engineer Core+, it didn't bring any kind of "i-frames" in it's kit, but for sure it brought powercreep via Forge itself(damage, mobilty, etc.), not gonna mention utilities since they do bring a lot to the table with said e-spec as well.
Daredevil is also Thief Core+, it DOES bring more evades than core class, it also gives more i-frames through weapon(Staff) and have a block, which core doesn't have, it screams "powercreep" to me here.
If said e-speces hasn't brought "anything" to the table, then why people USE them all the time?
When was the last time you saw core engineer or core teef that wasn't f2p?

 

Indeed, Rev has one more on Shiro. 

 

Holosmith indeed is Engineer upgrade, which is kinda opposite to what @Lighter.5631 was saying (game being easier, more forgiving and more i-frame chain based). Holosmith is much more glassy than core Engineer was in Celestial meta, less forgiving and more skill based as it's easier to die on it now, than back on Core Engineer pre-HoT. Which is exacly my point.

 

Daredevil technicaly is core Thief upgrade as well, it has more evades than core Thief right now. It doesn't have more evades than core Thief had during pre-HoT era with Acrobatics trait line being different and played in each build for perma vigor.

 

I never said e-specs hasn't bought anything. I only compared metas: Pre-Hot celestial meta specs against each other back then (not against current specs), and current meta specs against each other. Certainly TTK during Pre-HoT meta was longer, we had as much i-frames as we do now, specs were harder to burst due to low CDs on life saving trait passives. Thus playing back then (as staying alive for longer) was easier then than now, as I agree with @Genesis.5169. 

 

I never was implying that old Core Engineer would beat Holosmith today, or Revenant, as they existed in different enviroments. If anything I will totaly agree with you that some e-specs are superior to core and Anet should work on that giving more viability to core specs and making all e-specs viable for different role (which I tend to accent in every topic related to balance) and why I believe Necromancer is prime example how other classes should be balanced with both Core and e-specs being viable in different roles at same time.

 

[ArthurDent.9538]

Pre hot core specs would destroy current meta builds in overall power levels, the power dip from feb 2020 patch was extreme. Remember when nade holo was completely dominating the meta? That was because nades were ignored and left at core power levels while most other things were gutted then nades also received heavy nerfs yet are still very strong. The same thing that is happening with various core ranger pets drake being the most recent example, and minionmancer necro. Throw in all the removed amulets and the virtual deletion of all sigils other than basically cleansing, doom, and energy core specs had much more powerful builds than current builds.

[Lighter.5631]

On 11/5/2021 at 11:44 AM, Morwath.9817 said:

 

Oh dear, do you even know what we're discussing right now? Let me remind you:

 

You (p1): "pre-HoT was the golden time, i enjoyed every moment of outplays and set ups..now is just evade/block/invul/cc spam chain..who break the chain first who wins..boring and unfun to watch."

 

Genesis in response: "game is harder"

 

You (p2): "LOL bruh, now is so much easier, so much more braindead that's why i miss the old days when it's actually skillful and noob friendly, not sure how you read my comments properly to misinterpret."

 

me: Celestial meta was more forgiving and noob friendly with more tanky talismans and invul passives, which are gone.

 

You (p3): Gibberish about core not being equal to especs.

 

I don't really understand what you're trying to say. Core Engineer being worse than Holosmith doesn't connect to your main argument about more i-frames in games and chaining them or game being easier or harder. Since I feel discussing with you is just pure waste of time I will just withdraw. Have fun.

its you who have no idea, that's why you got 0 reaction.

funny how you think some thing doesn't connect to the argument, yet it is you who brought it up in the first place. lol

learn to logic before typing.

[RedAvenged.5217]

Trying hard to be good at the game is fine. My problem is the average top 10 player that got there only asking people to q dodge and dc for them, and believe me as most people I know that got top ten did this while I watched and that’s a lot, and the players that were the most toxic players in the game and also depended on ways and means to get to their spots which is top streamers and pvp ranks atm.

 

the saddest part is people like me who played in high levels since forever and never had to cheat or even duo for 5% of their matches will get the heat.

the saddest part of the heat is that the ppl who by now are well known for insanity and threatening players are just friends of the rest of the degens and will spread their cult agenda for them.

there is a massive divide between the average player and the top teir players, and yet they aren’t try hards- because they don’t try. This kills the community.