Outstanding Lore for going forward.

[TeeracK.3601]

I tried making a map of all the story beats that I can see coming back in the next season of living story. Any thought? Anything I forgot about?

 

https://imgur.com/gallery/BiRqA4x

Edited March 24, 2022 by TeeracK.3601

[DarcShriek.5829]

Who is the succesor to the Krytan throne?  This person was briefly mentioned in the human personal story during the "choose your order" section.

[Sajuuk Khar.1509]

The Zaishen weren't mysteriously absent in EoD, a good chunk of them became Crystal Bloom at the end of LWS4. Those that remained Zaishen were briefly seen/mentioned in EoD when we see Zafirah mention them as the Void is spreading to Elona in that cutscene near the end.

Kanaxai is dead.

We found out what the Fort Trinity Orb was, it was something made by Soo-Won to repulse the Risen.

We saw some Dwarves post IBS, during the Dragon Bash event, now that Primordus is gone they are largely just chilling.

Bangar was sent to a hospital to recover from de-icing after Jormag's death. After that hes 100% in prison for the rest of his life/until the Legions execute him for his crimes.

Edited March 23, 2022 by Sajuuk Khar.1509

[Genesis.8572]

2 hours ago, DarcShriek.5829 said:

Who is the succesor to the Krytan throne?  This person was briefly mentioned in the human personal story during the "choose your order" section.

With our luck and the current ArenaNet writing team, it will be Kasmeer. 

[ugrakarma.9416]

I vote for isles of janthir being a map/chapter. the geographic position is promising oportunity to new/interesting landscapes.

i don't care with the "excuse" to go there, can be a simple recover a "magical artifact" or something like that;.

[TeeracK.3601]

updated map in first pose based on feedback

[TeeracK.3601]

9 hours ago, Sajuuk Khar.1509 said:

The Zaishen weren't mysteriously absent in EoD, a good chunk of them became Crystal Bloom at the end of LWS4. Those that remained Zaishen were briefly seen/mentioned in EoD when we see Zafirah mention them as the Void is spreading to Elona in that cutscene near the end.

What you're talking about is a completely different scent of the Zaishen. Zafirah(and anyone else) wouldn't have been aloud into Cantha, and the Zaishen that were in Cantha wouldn't have been aloud to leave either. Since the order was originally from Cantha it would make sense they still had a base in Cantha. Similar to how the Order of Shadows was cut off and had nothing to do with the Order of Whispers once they broke off cause that region of the world was also locked down for most of the gap between games.

 

It's more likely we don't see any of them is because the Zaishen still in Cantha were wiped out by the Zhaitan disaster, but I'm hoping that's not the case and the reason we don't see them is cause they are all mostly north holding back the risen or something. 

Edited March 24, 2022 by TeeracK.3601

[Sajuuk Khar.1509]

16 minutes ago, TeeracK.3601 said:

What you're talking about is a completely different scent of the Zaishen. Zafirah(and anyone else) wouldn't have been aloud into Cantha, and the Zaishen that were in Cantha wouldn't have been aloud to leave either. Since the order was originally from Cantha it would make sense they still had a base in Cantha. Similar to how the Order of Shadows was cut off and had nothing to do with the Order of Whispers once they broke off cause that region of the world was also locked down for most of the gap between games.

 

It's more likely we don't see any of them is because the Zaishen still in Cantha were wiped out by the Zhaitan disaster, but I'm hoping that's not the case and the reason we don't see them is cause they are all mostly north holding back the risen or something. 

Did you mean sect not scent? And the Zaishen were a singular order back in GW1, with bases in all the major regions. By the time of GW2 they were basically gone, and those that remained rallied under Balthazar for his campaign in Elona. There's nothing indicating any remained in Cantha by the time of the Zhaitan Disaster. Though if there was they were likely killed in the disaster.

[DanAlcedo.3281]

8 hours ago, Genesis.8572 said:

With our luck and the current ArenaNet writing team, it will be Kasmeer. 

New Story threath happens and we need go to the other side on the planet. 

After we saved the day once more we return to South sun (for some reason) and see Logan and Jennah chillen on the beach. 

"OH hi commander, I'm to old to be queen so I gave the position to best person I could think of." 

Commader: "I'm pretty sure I know who it is." 

Jennah: " Thats right. Taimi." 

 

Diabolical laughter in the distants

Edited March 24, 2022 by DanAlcedo.3281

[TeeracK.3601]

2 hours ago, Sajuuk Khar.1509 said:

Did you mean sect not scent? And the Zaishen were a singular order back in GW1, with bases in all the major regions. By the time of GW2 they were basically gone, and those that remained rallied under Balthazar for his campaign in Elona. There's nothing indicating any remained in Cantha by the time of the Zhaitan Disaster. Though if there was they were likely killed in the disaster.

I did mean sect.

 

The order of whisper was also a singular faction in gw1 but because of the movement of the world the group splintered. It doesn't make sense for people to have no contact for over 200 years, and the two different groups not grow into their own branches.

 

Maybe the group did die out in cantha and just become part of the minsteray of security, was whipped out by the ministry of purity, died in the Zhatain disaster, or something. I'd still just like some clarification about the Zenshin. It just makes sense that the order would have been able to endure the loss if the battle isles in their homeland when its mangled to survive in the rest of the world. 

[ugrakarma.9416]

about "deep sea lore" we just fight adolescent leviathan, so theres a "big mother" in some place. its a oportunity to large water map.

[ugrakarma.9416]

Also a mystery to add to map, the misterious origin of Doern Velazquez https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Doern_Velazquez . (and the rarity of spanish names). some ppl suggested that could be a good excuse to introduce Sunrise Crest(the far West peninsula area) as possibly place of their origin.

 

 

 

 

[ugrakarma.9416]

ancient races of Tyria: we have visited The Mursaat(LS3) and The Forgotten(POF). But not a trace of The Seers. theyr status is probably "exterminated" but, at least visit some "ruins" would be cool.

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Seer

[Kalavier.1097]

32 minutes ago, ugrakarma.9416 said:

about "deep sea lore" we just fight adolescent leviathan, so theres a "big mother" in some place. its a oportunity to large water map.

 

We can see skeletons of various sizes all over, and a few to a lot of them became risen too.

[TeeracK.3601]

51 minutes ago, ugrakarma.9416 said:

ancient races of Tyria: we have visited The Mursaat(LS3) and The Forgotten(POF). But not a trace of The Seers. theyr status is probably "exterminated" but, at least visit some "ruins" would be cool.

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Seer

That's a cool idea. I was expecting if they didn't cut so much of the IBS story short we would have gotten some seer stuff later on cause I was expecting Jormag stuff in the far shiver peaks and then Primordus stuff in the southern shiver peaks. The southern shiverpeaks are now the last main gw1 region we haven't returned to in gw2. Considering that region is full of dwarfs, a blood stone, and had a few seers. The locations seemed like a perfect spot to play out Primordus's story. Plus also the location of the second wave of primordus drms being in thunderhead and ebonhawk also suggests that if the IBS was done fully  there would have been a story moment where Primordus was active in that region.

 

The southern shiverpeaks was also a location where we were introduced to the Eidolon which I always thought were super cool. Honestly considering just how things in the story have worked out where we keep coming close to ascending, but never actually doing it fully they could introduce a Eidolon storyline very easily since we were only able to see them in gw1 after we ascended.

 

It also be cool to find some more Giganticus Lupicus lore/ruins since they were this super cool classic world building set piece from gw1 seeing their remains all over tyria and then gw2 comes out and the only time there is any mention of them at all is a single risen one we kill and then that's it. The race is just gone without a trace.

Edited March 24, 2022 by TeeracK.3601

[Sajuuk Khar.1509]

3 hours ago, ugrakarma.9416 said:

Also a mystery to add to map, the misterious origin of Doern Velazquez https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Doern_Velazquez . (and the rarity of spanish names). some ppl suggested that could be a good excuse to introduce Sunrise Crest(the far West peninsula area) as possibly place of their origin.

I wouldn't be surprised if this is were Xpack 4 is set. With Tyria proper representing Eruope and the Middle East, Elona representing Africa, and Cantha representing Asia, having Xpack 4 take place far to the west, and represent central/south America would make sense to round out GW2's world a bit.

2 hours ago, TeeracK.3601 said:

That's a cool idea. I was expecting if they didn't cut so much of the IBS story short we would have gotten some seer stuff later on cause I was expecting Jormag stuff in the far shiver peaks and then Primordus stuff in the southern shiver peaks. The southern shiverpeaks are now the last main gw1 region we haven't returned to in gw2. Considering that region is full of dwarfs, a blood stone, and had a few seers. The locations seemed like a perfect spot to play out Primordus's story. Plus also the location of the second wave of primordus drms being in thunderhead and ebonhawk also suggests that if the IBS was done fully  there would have been a story moment where Primordus was active in that region.

From what we know the original plan for IBS was a two parter in the Centaur Homelands, and then another 2 parter around Anvil Rock.

Also we do have the southern Shiverpeaks in-game, both core(Lornar Pass, Dredgehunt Cliff, Timberline Falls, Mount Maelstrom), and LWS4(Thunderhead Peaks) cover it. There's pretty much not anything really left to cover down there beyond a thin strip between Thunderehead and the Black Citadel. And that didn't have much in it back in GW1 either.

Edited March 24, 2022 by Sajuuk Khar.1509

[Konig Des Todes.2086]

6 hours ago, TeeracK.3601 said:

What you're talking about is a completely different scent of the Zaishen. Zafirah(and anyone else) wouldn't have been aloud into Cantha, and the Zaishen that were in Cantha wouldn't have been aloud to leave either. Since the order was originally from Cantha it would make sense they still had a base in Cantha. Similar to how the Order of Shadows was cut off and had nothing to do with the Order of Whispers once they broke off cause that region of the world was also locked down for most of the gap between games.

 

It's more likely we don't see any of them is because the Zaishen still in Cantha were wiped out by the Zhaitan disaster, but I'm hoping that's not the case and the reason we don't see them is cause they are all mostly north holding back the risen or something. 

The Zaishen didn't originally come from Cantha. In GW1, they were settled in the Battle Isles, which was destroyed by Zhaitan's awakening.

There's actually almost zero presence of Zaishen in Cantha during GW1, and there's no non-Battle Isles outposts the Zaishen had, except one in Orr per GW2. Only some very temporary bases of operations at Tomb of the Primeval Kings and Kamadan during Nightfall, which would have packed up and left the moment Abaddon was killed and his demonic armies quelled (and given no evidence of them by Joko's reign or GW2, they did).

5 hours ago, Sajuuk Khar.1509 said:

Did you mean sect not scent? And the Zaishen were a singular order back in GW1, with bases in all the major regions. By the time of GW2 they were basically gone, and those that remained rallied under Balthazar for his campaign in Elona. There's nothing indicating any remained in Cantha by the time of the Zhaitan Disaster. Though if there was they were likely killed in the disaster.

Not fully accurate. Prior to Lion's Arch's destruction, the Zaishen Order had actually gone multiracial and had a significant presence in Lion's Arch. The arena that Logan, Rytlock, and Caithe fights in during Edge of Destiny is even owned by the Zaishen in pre-BfLA Fort Marriner.

It's easy to miss because ArenaNet never brought them back for some reason (oversight?) but... they were there. Even fought the karka during The Lost Shores alongside the Lionguard (most NPCs would just cower or not respond to them).

And depending on how accurate The Movement of the World's lore remains, basically all of the Mists Warriors is an offshoot of the Zaishen Order, as WvW was established by "Balthazar" (real or successor given PoF lore) for his faithful.

 

Which does open one plot thread to explore for the Zaishen: what happened to the non-human Zaishen? Wiped out in Scarlet's War (even though they were so close to the city's exit)? Outcasted because of the human Zaishen's actions? Off doing their own thing (like reclaiming the Battle Isles from risen unchained)?

3 hours ago, ugrakarma.9416 said:

Also a mystery to add to map, the misterious origin of Doern Velazquez https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Doern_Velazquez . (and the rarity of spanish names). some ppl suggested that could be a good excuse to introduce Sunrise Crest(the far West peninsula area) as possibly place of their origin.

I remain convinced this is just a red herring. GW1 Kryta has lots of Hispanic and Italian sounding names and inspirations, so if anything Doern's name is just ancient Krytan. It would be fully in the realm of a preceptor of the Order of Whispers to mislead new recruits to making them think he's more mysterious than he actually is.

3 hours ago, ugrakarma.9416 said:

ancient races of Tyria: we have visited The Mursaat(LS3) and The Forgotten(POF). But not a trace of The Seers. theyr status is probably "exterminated" but, at least visit some "ruins" would be cool.

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Seer

Well, according to Ree Soesbee in an interview in... 2010 probably? IIRC, she said the last remnant of seer architecture would be seen "even if we don't know it yet". This ultimately meant the Bloodstones. And with One Path Ends confirming their extinction (and Mursaat's)...

At least until the interview gets ignored for new lore, there probably isn't anything left of the Seers. A total destruction of culture, history, and species by the mursaat in the end.

2 hours ago, Kalavier.1097 said:

We can see skeletons of various sizes all over, and a few to a lot of them became risen too.

There are no risen leviathans. Just sharks and megaladons.

Kinda funny that the huge adolescent leviathan is so much bigger than the small leviathan skeletons, though.

Edited March 24, 2022 by Konig Des Todes.2086

[Konig Des Todes.2086]

16 hours ago, TeeracK.3601 said:

I tried making a map of all the story beats that I can see coming back in the next season of living story. Any thought? Anything I forgot about?

 

https://imgur.com/gallery/BiRqA4x

I've commented on the original map, so I'll add on my thoughts of the edited version here since it's easier than reddit:

• The Krytan Throne successor plot was fully abandoned according to Angel McCoy, who was the main advocate for it. Unless a fan of the plot became a dev, I don't expect it to ever become relevant again.
• Xotecha is unlikely to become a thing because of the stated rule about open world maps back in S4 when the Mists came into play, which was simply put: if it isn't in the world of Tyria, it won't get an open world map. At most, Xotecha would receive merely a story instance or two and that's fully undeserving of that. Unless they change the role, I don't see Xotecha happening.
• Still not sure what the dotted red circle is meant to be - possible bloodstone? If so, I doubt one made it so far out (despite appearances, the distance from Abaddon's Mouth volcano to both Shiverpeaks and Maguuma Bloodstone is equal).
• Wizard's Tower is firmly in the land of "mystery for mystery's sake" and I don't see any devs expanding that, certainly not while hitting any levels of player expectation.
• Kodan post-Jormag's death could end up following the same route as norn. Some move back north, others stay south to "educate" the "lesser" races. Will be interesting seeing that go forward, but that's only a side-plot of stuff.

[Kalavier.1097]

37 minutes ago, Konig Des Todes.2086 said:

There are no risen leviathans. Just sharks and megaladons.

Kinda funny that the huge adolescent leviathan is so much bigger than the small leviathan skeletons, though.

 

I meant lorewise. Like the one dead one off Claw Island was a massive Risen Leviathan until it got killed. Sea of Sorrow's book I believe? I didn't read that one just blurbs. But out in the ocean other Risen Leviathans may exist. Not for sure, but maybe.

 

But in general, we know the Risen death/black fleets (whichever it's called) still are actively roaming the unending ocean, they just lack coordination allowing people to sneak past now, especially airships with mesmers onboard to cloak them.

 

I said other day that in theory, the ocean could be infested for decades, or even longer with Risen whales, sharks/Megaladons, or leviathans who are out in the open ocean and simply can't easily be hunted down.

[TeeracK.3601]

3 hours ago, Konig Des Todes.2086 said:

I've commented on the original map, so I'll add on my thoughts of the edited version here since it's easier than reddit:

• The Krytan Throne successor plot was fully abandoned according to Angel McCoy, who was the main advocate for it. Unless a fan of the plot became a dev, I don't expect it to ever become relevant again.
• Xotecha is unlikely to become a thing because of the stated rule about open world maps back in S4 when the Mists came into play, which was simply put: if it isn't in the world of Tyria, it won't get an open world map. At most, Xotecha would receive merely a story instance or two and that's fully undeserving of that. Unless they change the role, I don't see Xotecha happening.
• Still not sure what the dotted red circle is meant to be - possible bloodstone? If so, I doubt one made it so far out (despite appearances, the distance from Abaddon's Mouth volcano to both Shiverpeaks and Maguuma Bloodstone is equal).
• Wizard's Tower is firmly in the land of "mystery for mystery's sake" and I don't see any devs expanding that, certainly not while hitting any levels of player expectation.
• Kodan post-Jormag's death could end up following the same route as norn. Some move back north, others stay south to "educate" the "lesser" races. Will be interesting seeing that go forward, but that's only a side-plot of stuff.

The dotted red line in the southern shiverpeaks is were one of the bloodstones was. It was mentioned to us, but we never actually see it ourselves and don't know its exact location, but the entire reason the mursatt are all over that place and are there with markis is because they are trying to sacrifice our allies on a  bloodstone over there.

 

from the wiki

Both Glint and Blade Scout Shelby mention a bloodstone in the Southern Shiverpeaks in the intermediate cinematic of The Dragon's Lair and her dialogue respectively. 

Gods. Where are the survivors?

"There aren't many. Those who managed to escape have scattered all over the Shiverpeaks. But the White Mantle have pursued us. Many have been captured, Saidra and Evennia included.

The Mantle took Evennia's ship off of Sanctum Cay. When they followed the rest of the Blade into the mountains, they brought her up here. Rumor has it there is another Bloodstone up here in the mountain peaks."

 

 As I have foreseen, the Mursaat will meet their demise at the hands of the Chosen. Their stranglehold on the lands of Kryta and beyond will be broken. For years the Mursaat and their human disciples have hunted down the Chosen, murdering them to prevent the prophecies from coming to pass. But you have slipped through their fingers, and your friends now pay the price. The one called Markis betrays them as he betrayed you, and if you do not hurry to their aid, none will survive. Many have already been taken captive. Their souls will be reaped upon one of the five Bloodstones, just as the Chosen you witnessed being slaughtered in the Maguuma Jungle

Edited March 24, 2022 by TeeracK.3601

[Balor.8432]

I would like to know some gw1 open lore also.

Where did the gw1 hero  go/fate after Cantha?

What happened at granite citadel to cause the deaths of gw1 hero's henchmen.

Where did the Fiery dragon swords design come  from the Gods original world if it was indeed Balthazar's sword?

Where are the other bloodstones ?

Where are the other portals to mists that Lord Odran made other then tomb of prime evil kings.

What happened to Cynn, Mhenlo and Eve?

Where did Bone dragons go after gw1?

What happened to Evennia?

What happened to the Scepter of Orr after Livia was done with it.?

What happened to Razah?

 

 

[Sajuuk Khar.1509]

1 hour ago, Torn Fierceslash.6375 said:

What happened to Evennia?

IIRC Evennia was implied to have been hanged by Adelbern in one of the letter one can find as part of the "open letter" achievement for the Justice of the Blad content.

1 hour ago, Torn Fierceslash.6375 said:

Where are the other portals to mists that Lord Odran made other then tomb of prime evil kings.

One was in Drascir, the old capital of Ascalon, and the other was on the Battle Isles.

1 hour ago, Torn Fierceslash.6375 said:

Where did the gw1 hero  go/fate after Cantha?

The GW1 Canthan hero gets mentioned in Arborstone once you fully upgrade the mastery.

Edited March 24, 2022 by Sajuuk Khar.1509

[Konig Des Todes.2086]

16 hours ago, TeeracK.3601 said:

The dotted red line in the southern shiverpeaks is were one of the bloodstones was. It was mentioned to us, but we never actually see it ourselves and don't know its exact location, but the entire reason the mursatt are all over that place and are there with markis is because they are trying to sacrifice our allies on a  bloodstone over there.

 

from the wiki

Both Glint and Blade Scout Shelby mention a bloodstone in the Southern Shiverpeaks in the intermediate cinematic of The Dragon's Lair and her dialogue respectively. 

Gods. Where are the survivors?

"There aren't many. Those who managed to escape have scattered all over the Shiverpeaks. But the White Mantle have pursued us. Many have been captured, Saidra and Evennia included.

The Mantle took Evennia's ship off of Sanctum Cay. When they followed the rest of the Blade into the mountains, they brought her up here. Rumor has it there is another Bloodstone up here in the mountain peaks."

 

 As I have foreseen, the Mursaat will meet their demise at the hands of the Chosen. Their stranglehold on the lands of Kryta and beyond will be broken. For years the Mursaat and their human disciples have hunted down the Chosen, murdering them to prevent the prophecies from coming to pass. But you have slipped through their fingers, and your friends now pay the price. The one called Markis betrays them as he betrayed you, and if you do not hurry to their aid, none will survive. Many have already been taken captive. Their souls will be reaped upon one of the five Bloodstones, just as the Chosen you witnessed being slaughtered in the Maguuma Jungle

The Shiverpeaks Bloodstone you're talking about is the Bloodstone Caves bloodstone. This was confirmed by devs, we visit it in EotN and is already circled on your map.

 

7 hours ago, Torn Fierceslash.6375 said:

I would like to know some gw1 open lore also.

Where did the gw1 hero  go/fate after Cantha?

What happened at granite citadel to cause the deaths of gw1 hero's henchmen.

Where did the Fiery dragon swords design come  from the Gods original world if it was indeed Balthazar's sword?

Where are the other bloodstones ?

Where are the other portals to mists that Lord Odran made other then tomb of prime evil kings.

What happened to Cynn, Mhenlo and Eve?

Where did Bone dragons go after gw1?

What happened to Evennia?

What happened to the Scepter of Orr after Livia was done with it.?

What happened to Razah?

In regards to the GW1 Heroes, ANet said they want to keep the origin and fate of PCs ambiguous. It'll never be canonized because it's the one thing above all the writers want people to headcanon for themselves. Some devs have said what their personal opinion would be, but it's in no way canon (most are either "die fighting Joko" or "die in the Foefire fighting charr").

The Fiery Dragons Swords were long confirmed to be Ascalonian imitations of Sohothin and Magdaer, which in turn were Balthazar's swords as you mention.

The Bone Dragons were probably wiped out over time with the rest of the Orrian undead made by Khilbron - they weren't unique creatures after all (Rotscale was risen by the Stone Summit instead, but killed by Kieran canonically, I believe).

Evennia's fate was more or less confirmed in Season 3 - Adelbern had her hanged from Ascalon City's ramparts. Of course it's possible this was just Caudecus lying to create propaganda, however it's not something that can be easily falsified when preached about as if it's common knowledge.

[Kalavier.1097]

16 minutes ago, Konig Des Todes.2086 said:

Evennia's fate was more or less confirmed in Season 3 - Adelbern had her hanged from Ascalon City's ramparts. Of course it's possible this was just Caudecus lying to create propaganda, however it's not something that can be easily falsified when preached about as if it's common knowledge.

 

Just out of curiosity, where does he talk about her? I mean, I completely believe that ending for Evennia anyway because of how Adelbern was, and fully believe that he was responsible for her going "missing" (aka, dead).

[Sajuuk Khar.1509]

1 hour ago, Kalavier.1097 said:

Just out of curiosity, where does he talk about her? I mean, I completely believe that ending for Evennia anyway because of how Adelbern was, and fully believe that he was responsible for her going "missing" (aka, dead).

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Open_Letters

Quote

My brothers and sisters from Ascalon, you know my history. I fought with you against the charr! I bled with you, I wept with you as the once-great country was consumed by the ravenous beasts. And this is not the first time the White Mantle aided Ascalon in their fight with the charr. Generations ago, Zain the Merciful brought food and clothing for your countrymen. What did the Shining Blade send? Assassins, who your king had hanged from Ascalon City! Join me, and the White Mantle will reclaim your home from the charr, and we shall form a grand human empire the likes of which has never been seen before! —Lord Caudecus Beetlestone