Remove core revenants ability to provide pernament alacrity.

[celestia.3829]

This would free up the ability to have dps-quick supports and quick-healers on revenant. It would also allow for vindicator to have more idenity as a healer that can provide quickness.

[LucianTheAngelic.7054]

They could easily make it so that “when slotting X specialization Serene Rejuvenation gives X (I.e. vigor, might, other boon) instead of alacrity..  They’ve done similar things on other professions where “slotting X elite spec” changes how certain traits and interactions work.

 

What I’d like to see is them restore Serene Rejuvenation to its original 3s to allow for easier Alacrity Healers on Herald/Vindicator instead of the very tight and rigid rotation that is currently required for both of those specs.  And then IF they want Vindicator (or another spec for rev) to give quickness they can just rework it so that that Elite Spec can’t give alacrity with Ventari.  This is the best solution that doesn’t limit build diversity. 

Edited April 6, 2022 by LucianTheAngelic.7054

[Obtena.7952]

Actually, there is a massive problem with this idea ... you can get an Alac-Quick-Healer. That kind of massive role compression is a what causes 'default' classes and reasons for exclusion for meta comps. That's a big problem for many players (hello FB ... looking at you) and it's exactly the thing Anet seems to be targeting to reduce on FB to tone it back. I don't believe Anet is creating roles and designating classes to them ... just to create this kind of monstrosity. 

So just imagine this ... but it has  almost perma quickness:

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PmgAYVllQLMKajNRasKKjFSjsBygj0z/7H-zRJYqRFfZUdKkeF47s43BA-e

That's about as unreasonable as it gets IMO. 

Edited April 6, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[Redfeather.6401]

It was given to the tablet for a reason! If you want to sit on a tablet for alacrity because you don't have another class then go for it. But P.U.! Stinky, no fun. It's just a stop gap.

[The Boz.2038]

11 hours ago, Obtena.7952 said:

Actually, there is a massive problem with this idea ... you can get an Alac-Quick-Healer. That kind of massive role compression is a what causes 'default' classes and reasons for exclusion for meta comps. That's a big problem for many players (hello FB ... looking at you) and it's exactly the thing Anet seems to be targeting to reduce on FB to tone it back. I don't believe Anet is creating roles and designating classes to them ... just to create this kind of monstrosity. 

So just imagine this ... but it has  almost perma quickness:

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PmgAYVllQLMKajNRasKKjFSjsBygj0z/7H-zRJYqRFfZUdKkeF47s43BA-e

That's about as unreasonable as it gets IMO. 

Did you even read the thread? Or the title? 
The idea is to *remove* alacrity from core. Your comment makes no sense.

[Thon.3780]

Errr. If we got what you want , we will get big nerf for sure.

 

if you focus on healing. Now you already got crazy vindicator bunny.

- 10sec heal

- jump heal

- sigil refill energy 50% every 10 sec swap ( like alacrity?)

- if you crazy enough , put frenzy and stamina , to boost jump and cool down after kill.

 

and… although ANET do as you want . How you sure that Rev Alacrity will be picked between other Alacrity build profession?

 

[The Boz.2038]

A lot of people here not understanding the opening post, it seems.

CORE revenant, with no e-specs, can maintain team alacrity through a lot of BD and spamming Natural Harmony while having the Salvation trait line selected, due to the Serene Rejuvenation trait.
This costs all of your energy, is boring, clunky, and ineffective as all heck. 
It is also blocking herald, vindicator, and potentially other, future revenant e-specs from being sources of valuable boons like quickness, because of the theoretical "omg quickness + alacrity in one build, OP, must delete". 

The OP wants Serene Rejuvenation changed so that it no longer applies alacrity.
That was, revenant alacrity remains the domain of renegade, which is untouched by this change.

This is a good thing. You should heart-react, not confuse react the OP.

[Obtena.7952]

4 hours ago, The Boz.2038 said:

Did you even read the thread? Or the title? 
The idea is to *remove* alacrity from core. Your comment makes no sense.

Right ... remove alacrity from core from Serene Rej and somehow give it quickness. Yup I read it. Does removing Alacrity from core mean Renegade here? I don't interpret the OP's statement that way. Usually people don't refer to especs as 'core'.

This means I can take a Renegade, STILL have alacrity, STILL take Salvation and Centaur for Healing and SOMEHOW get quickness on top of all that. What did I miss?

Edited April 7, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[The Boz.2038]

1 minute ago, Obtena.7952 said:

Right ... remove alacrity from core somehow give it quickness. Yup I read it. Does removing Alacrity from core mean Renegade here? I don't interpret the OP's statement that way. Usually people don't refer to especs as 'core'.

You mentioned an alac-quick-healer.
Explain how alac-quick-healer works if core no longer has alac.

OP never said core should get quickness. Specified it would apply to *a revenant* spec, and would fit vindicator nicely. 

[Obtena.7952]

4 minutes ago, The Boz.2038 said:

OP never said core should get quickness. 

Then where is the quickness support or quickness healer he suggests coming from? Of course his is saying core should get quickness. He just doesn't say how. 

Who read the OP's post ... SOMEONE did. 😉

Edited April 7, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[The Boz.2038]

Just now, Obtena.7952 said:

Then where is the quickness support or quickness healer he suggests coming from?

  

21 hours ago, celestia.3829 said:

This would free up the ability to have dps-quick supports and quick-healers on revenant.

How is this confusing you?

[Obtena.7952]

Just now, The Boz.2038 said:

  

How is this confusing you?

It's not ... how does Revenant get the ability to have  dps-quick supports and quick-healers? Obviously, team quickness would have to be added to it. 

[The Boz.2038]

1 minute ago, Obtena.7952 said:

It's not ... how does Revenant get the ability to have  dps-quick supports and quick-healers? Obviously, team quickness would have to be added to it. 

THROUGH AN E-SPEC.
SUCH AS VINDICATOR.
Or did you forget vindicator is still a revenant?

[Obtena.7952]

9 minutes ago, The Boz.2038 said:

THROUGH AN E-SPEC.
SUCH AS VINDICATOR.
Or did you forget vindicator is still a revenant?

So the whole thread is just a suggestion that Vindicator get quickness role, assuming it doesn't get it because Serene Rej has alacrity.

Why do we need that? Maybe the next espec. 

Edited April 7, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[Obtena.7952]

How about we think about why Vindicator (or any other e-spec) didn't get quickness team role in the first place instead of assuming existing features prevent it?

How about you think about what a Vindicator team quickness would even look like considering it's theme. 

Edited April 7, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[Za Shaloc.3908]

17 hours ago, LucianTheAngelic.7054 said:

They could easily make it so that “when slotting X specialization Serene Rejuvenation gives X (I.e. vigor, might, other boon) instead of alacrity..  They’ve done similar things on other professions where “slotting X elite spec” changes how certain traits and interactions work.

 

What I’d like to see is them restore Serene Rejuvenation to its original 3s to allow for easier Alacrity Healers on Herald/Vindicator instead of the very tight and rigid rotation that is currently required for both of those specs.  And then IF they want Vindicator (or another spec for rev) to give quickness they can just rework it so that that Elite Spec can’t give alacrity with Ventari.  This is the best solution that doesn’t limit build diversity. 

 

After playing around with this more in PvE, I'm a total believer and supporter of your suggestion. 3s baseline alacrity would add a whole lot more flexibility to builds and make rotations more enjoyable/adaptable. I played with your boon healer Vindi build that you had theorycrafted but ultimately didn't pursue it much more beyond the testing phase because the rotation felt unnecessarily restrictive. It's a simple and straightforward change that I think would really go a long way.

 

 

[celestia.3829]

1 hour ago, Obtena.7952 said:

How about we think about why Vindicator (or any other e-spec) didn't get quickness team role in the first place instead of assuming existing features prevent it?

How about you think about what a Vindicator team quickness would even look like considering it's theme. 

....

 vindicator CANT have quickness because then it could provide all 3 key boons. Most vindi skills already have quickness on them - and it would give it a support niche.

[Obtena.7952]

5 hours ago, celestia.3829 said:

....

 vindicator CANT have quickness because then it could provide all 3 key boons. Most vindi skills already have quickness on them - and it would give it a support niche.

I understand that having this level of role compression is likely unacceptable (if you read my posts, you would know). 

Again, how did you conclude the reason Vindicator didn't get a team quickness role is because of Alacrity in Core? You say MOST Vindi skills have quickness on them? I count ONE! That's not most.

My hot take here: Team quickness on Vindicator doesn't fit the theme, it doesn't need it to be useful as an espec and it's unlikely there is much bandwidth to add it without losing something on Vindicator ... all at the expense of your proposal we lose alacrity in core as well. Yeah, no thanks. 

I mean, it's arguable that core provides a reasonably useable permanent alacrity build in the first place. Who is even considering playing that build when Renegade is far superior to it? This whole line of reasoning is not sensible.

Edited April 7, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[celestia.3829]

42 minutes ago, Obtena.7952 said:

I understand that having this level of role compression is likely unacceptable (if you read my posts, you would know). 

Again, how did you conclude the reason Vindicator didn't get a team quickness role is because of Alacrity in Core? You say MOST Vindi skills have quickness on them? I count ONE! That's not most.

My hot take here: Team quickness on Vindicator doesn't fit the theme, it doesn't need it to be useful as an espec and it's unlikely there is much bandwidth to add it without losing something on Vindicator ... all at the expense of your proposal we lose alacrity in core as well. Yeah, no thanks. 

I mean, it's arguable that core provides a reasonably useable permanent alacrity build in the first place. Who is even considering playing that build when Renegade is far superior to it? This whole line of reasoning is not sensible.

lose what on vindi? vindi has nothing. as you said losing alac on core means nothing.

[Knighthonor.4061]

Honestly,  Core Revenant should be more stronger not weaker. 

[Obtena.7952]

23 minutes ago, celestia.3829 said:

lose what on vindi? 

That's what I'm asking YOU ... you think Anet is just going to slap a 5 man quickness team buff SOMEWHERE on Vindicator? If you do, then there is no reason to nerf alac in core. 

Quote

as you said losing alac on core means nothing.

I didn't say that. I wouldn't say that. I don't believe that. 

Again, what is your proposal for how Vindicator gets a team quickness buff and why does it require removal of alacrity from core? You just haven't put any critical thinking towards what you are proposing here because if you DID that, you would realize access to alacrity on core isn't preventing a Vindicator team quickness build ... something ELSE is doing that. 

Edited April 7, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[celestia.3829]

13 minutes ago, Obtena.7952 said:

That's what I'm asking YOU ... you think Anet is just going to slap a 5 man quickness team buff SOMEWHERE on Vindicator? If you do, then there is no reason to nerf alac in core. 

I didn't say that. I wouldn't say that. I don't believe that. 

Again, what is your proposal for how Vindicator gets a team quickness buff and why does it require removal of alacrity from core? You just haven't put any critical thinking towards what you are proposing here because if you DID that, you would realize access to alacrity on core isn't preventing a Vindicator team quickness build ... something ELSE is doing that. 

.... Alacrity on core means vindi CANNOT have quickness. if it had quickness it would provide might,quick and alac - making it compress all roles into one healer. 

[Obtena.7952]

3 minutes ago, celestia.3829 said:

.... Alacrity on core means vindi CANNOT have quickness. if it had quickness it would provide might,quick and alac - making it compress all roles into one healer. 

No it doesn't. Access to boon sharing does not mean the ability to providing permanent boons to teams. Think about how the builds you are talking about would work. What has to happen on a Revenant for them to be able to be EFFECTIVE in providing teams with permanent Alacrity, Quickness and Healing ... 

Edited April 7, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[Charybdis.3695]

People just aren't satisfied with classes being unique anymore. This boring trend of "my class should do everything" is getting old.

[Charybdis.3695]

To put it simply, taking away the alacrity from Serene Rejuvenation would remove the freedom to reduce the amount of boon duration needed for a Renegade that is built to heal to provide enough alacrity while (instead of Righteous Rebel) traited with Lasting Legacy as a source of might.

Heya pals, bored of Diviner Rev?