Rip my server this week

[Xenesis.6389]

3 minutes ago, Labjax.2465 said:

First time I saw people sneaky trying to gank zerg tail from behind outside of an actual fight. Like picking off tail during a defend or fight in general is just strategy, doing it when the zerg is just running somewhere is gonna discourage players who are new to WvW; have a harder time keeping up cause they don't have a mount or don't know where to go. And no, I was not personally picked off. I just noted it happening and was dismayed at how sad a strategy it is. Like the WvW equivalent of ganking players in lowbie zones in some games.

That happens on every server, it's just a matter of how many roamers that server has willing to do it. Do you expect new players to get a free pass or something? at what point will it be ok to attack them? when they have a mount and 500 ranks? Mag roamers are more relentless with this because they know the rest of the pack won't stop to help, is that their fault or the commanders or the mindless sheep that only follow a tag?

Like seriously it's pvp, you're going to get attacked, it's up to the player to properly position themselves to not get ganked, if you can't keep up with the pack then use movement skills every class has it, or stealth skills, use shortcuts or less travelled areas to get to places, if you're with the zerg position yourself with the zerg between you and the gankers.

These are just experiences the new players need to learn from to survive in pvp, if they want a easy freebie ktrain then they can go back to pve.

[Labjax.2465]

14 minutes ago, Xenesis.6389 said:

That happens on every server, it's just a matter of how many roamers that server has willing to do it. Do you expect new players to get a free pass or something? at what point will it be ok to attack them? when they have a mount and 500 ranks? Mag roamers are more relentless with this because they know the rest of the pack won't stop to help, is that their fault or the commanders or the mindless sheep that only follow a tag?

Like seriously it's pvp, you're going to get attacked, it's up to the player to properly position themselves to not get ganked, if you can't keep up with the pack then use movement skills every class has it, or stealth skills, use shortcuts or less travelled areas to get to places, if you're with the zerg position yourself with the zerg between you and the gankers.

These are just experiences the new players need to learn from to survive in pvp, if they want a easy freebie ktrain then they can go back to pve.

First and last time I saw it was that server. Hard to believe you have evidence it happens on every server. You must have transferred around a ton over the years I guess and between regions too (isn't there NA/EU split?).

Anyway, players new enough to WvW don't even have a mount and if the zerg mounts up, it's next to impossible for them to keep up properly. Picking on them is sad. And no, they won't "learn from it" any more than a player getting ganked in a lowbie zone in other games will. They will more than likely blame the game for putting them at a disadvantage and not want to return. Some will because they are the kind who likes PvP enough they will take it on the chin, but others will not.

Wild that you say they need to learn to survive as opposed to an "easy freebie ktrain," when the "strategy" we're discussing is, well... one might say an "easy freebie kill."

Anyway, please continue. It's a fantastic look describing other players as "mindless sheep" as a way to defend how you play. Let's not reflect too hard on how if they're mindless sheep, you shouldn't need such underhanded tactics to defeat them.

[Atticus.7194]

20 hours ago, Xenesis.6389 said:

 

Ok and? tell us something we don't already know?

We all already know activity isn't measured perfectly, of every player, to the hour, of every time zone. That's kind of the point to the restructuring?

So your server is getting beat by a bigger server, well then your server doesn't belong in t1 then?

The difference is degrees, if there was a slight imbalance okay you can fight through that but Mag has queues 24/7 all the time on every single map. This matchup should never have happened CD and SoS have their active times and their less than active times that's normal, Mag is something else. I had a bit of insomnia and logged on at like 3:00am PST and there were multiple maps with 20+ mag just building siege and spawn camping maybe 5 or so players trying to get out. I've never seen this level of coverage the population and activity disparity is out of control and I don't know what cause it if it was guild transfers or what but considering population > everything else this shouldn't ever happen again/ 

As evidence Mag has T3 everything on the entire EB map and has for all week, they paper every BL regularly when they want to ktrain and outside of that they roam in fat groups or taunt and spawn camp cause there's simply nothing for them to do anymore. You can't for a minute think that this is healthy or how matchups should result. 

[Kate.3679]

32 minutes ago, Atticus.7194 said:

The difference is degrees, if there was a slight imbalance okay you can fight through that but Mag has queues 24/7 all the time on every single map. 

This is 100% false mag only queues 2-3 maps during NA prime and no maps during all other timezones outside of the weekend.

[Atticus.7194]

1 minute ago, Ruru.1302 said:

This is 100% false mag only queues 2-3 maps during NA prime and no maps during all other timezones outside of the weekend.

Well right now there are so many Mag playing that you have 6 trebs built at CD's spawn trolling us you have a large blob that just wiped CD's BL and are currently spawn camping SoS's spawn. So considering SoS and CD can maybe pull 20 players atm I'd say 2-3 maps is still a rather large imbalance. 

[Xenesis.6389]

1 hour ago, Labjax.2465 said:

First and last time I saw it was that server. Hard to believe you have evidence it happens on every server. You must have transferred around a ton over the years I guess and between regions too (isn't there NA/EU split?).

Anyway, players new enough to WvW don't even have a mount and if the zerg mounts up, it's next to impossible for them to keep up properly. Picking on them is sad. And no, they won't "learn from it" any more than a player getting ganked in a lowbie zone in other games will. They will more than likely blame the game for putting them at a disadvantage and not want to return. Some will because they are the kind who likes PvP enough they will take it on the chin, but others will not.

I've played for 10 years against every NA server, and I've even been on mag for a few years before, only reason why it would seem amplified with them is because they cloud fight which is essentially always harassing zergs like roamers. Every single server has players that go after zerg tails, even roamer guilds dedicated to it, pretty sure there's gankers running around Indo's zerg too that do this to enemies, why would anyone think that's off limits in pvp? do you think roamers just sit around when a zerg runs by? /boggle

And yes new players will learn to deal with it or they will constantly die, if they refuse to learn from mistakes and refuse to play better then that's on them not the enemies to take it easy on them. Every single player has been a new player in the beginning of their time in wvw, we all learned to get better and handle situations appropriately, there's no excuses, we experienced it, we overcame it, why can't the current newbies? /shrug

I don't have a problem with picking off zerg tails, they have more than enough players to scare enemies off, if they won't protect their group then they'll lose players, simple, I only have a problem with gank groups actively going around looking to 10v1 other "roamers".

Edited June 10, 2022 by Xenesis.6389

[Kate.3679]

6 minutes ago, Atticus.7194 said:

Well right now there are so many Mag playing that you have 6 trebs built at CD's spawn trolling us you have a large blob that just wiped CD's BL and are currently spawn camping SoS's spawn. So considering SoS and CD can maybe pull 20 players atm I'd say 2-3 maps is still a rather large imbalance. 

Actually scratch that I just logged on and there's no queue at all right now

https://i.imgur.com/dLIT8Bo.png

[Xenesis.6389]

39 minutes ago, Atticus.7194 said:

if there was a slight imbalance okay you can fight through that but Mag has queues 24/7 all the time on every single map.

We're suppose to take you seriously after stating this?

 

39 minutes ago, Atticus.7194 said:

This matchup should never have happened CD and SoS have their active times and their less than active times that's normal, Mag is something else.

Errr I'm sorry but lol, SoS normal times? SoS has had OCX domination for 10 years. Their massive ppting has over inflated where SoS really belongs all this time. Why do you think Indo moved to SoS, so their ppt would keep him up in the higher tiers lol.

I still don't understand where you guys think Mag should be, you are all in T1, there's is no where else higher to go! One of you is going to have to wait for Papa BG to ppt their way back to T1.

 

39 minutes ago, Atticus.7194 said:

I had a bit of insomnia and logged on at like 3:00am PST and there were multiple maps with 20+ mag just building siege and spawn camping maybe 5 or so players trying to get out.

What do you mean trying to get out? there's 3 exits you know.

 

39 minutes ago, Atticus.7194 said:

I've never seen this level of coverage the population and activity disparity is out of control and I don't know what cause it if it was guild transfers or what but considering population > everything else this shouldn't ever happen again/ 

You must be really new to wvw then, it's happened many times before, it'll keep happening in the future. Tell your side to show up.

 

39 minutes ago, Atticus.7194 said:

As evidence Mag has T3 everything on the entire EB map and has for all week, they paper every BL regularly when they want to ktrain and outside of that they roam in fat groups or taunt and spawn camp cause there's simply nothing for them to do anymore.

That's what happens when your players disappear, the enemy will take everything.

 

39 minutes ago, Atticus.7194 said:

You can't for a minute think that this is healthy or how matchups should result. 

Oh yeah it's problem now, not when SoS was winning over servers by blowing up ocx scores, nope, not when BG had 24/7 coverage blowing away opponents, nope, it's only bad when it's happening to you now.

[Ninhalem.4258]

I'm from DR and would like to know why the kitten we got paired with SoS when we are nowhere near the size of SoS or Mag. What's the point in playing WvW during this linkup when every fight is 100 vs 20? Make it super easy and ban all server transfers in the first 2 weeks of the new linkup. And if you do see evidence of servers colluding to keep others in T1 or T2, issue all the major players in those servers a 1 or 2 week ban.

[Xenesis.6389]

18 minutes ago, Ninhalem.4258 said:

I'm from DR and would like to know why the kitten we got paired with SoS when we are nowhere near the size of SoS or Mag.

Because DR is one of the lowest population servers on medium status, SoS is one of the highest on full status, links usually matches the highest with the lowest to kinda balance out the full servers.

Quote

What's the point in playing WvW during this linkup when every fight is 100 vs 20? Make it super easy and ban all server transfers in the first 2 weeks of the new linkup. And if you do see evidence of servers colluding to keep others in T1 or T2, issue all the major players in those servers a 1 or 2 week ban.

Did you only have 20 the previous week or more? People don't want to fight Mag so they probably took the week off. Banning transfers would do nothing, it's a matter of people only showing up for easy fights and ktrains. If both servers bothered to show up  and play normally and double team Mag, you could probably put them in their place, but people choose not to.

Also CD probably doesn't belong in T1, they should drop and let BG come up.

Edited June 10, 2022 by Xenesis.6389

[Sahne.6950]

16 hours ago, Mabi black.1824 said:

at this time mag has a total of kd 68,000 and the opponents have one 49,000 and the other 45,000 . normally when you go online in gw2 starts playing, and when you play you can only do two things, I kill someone and you get killed by someone. so the kd parameter is one of the few tools we have to measure the population of the teams. so I would say that mag has a population that exceeds its opponents by at least 40%

uhh yesss... KD = Number of players.... got it!

[Labjax.2465]

6 hours ago, Xenesis.6389 said:

I've played for 10 years against every NA server, and I've even been on mag for a few years before, only reason why it would seem amplified with them is because they cloud fight which is essentially always harassing zergs like roamers. Every single server has players that go after zerg tails, even roamer guilds dedicated to it, pretty sure there's gankers running around Indo's zerg too that do this to enemies, why would anyone think that's off limits in pvp? do you think roamers just sit around when a zerg runs by? /boggle

And yes new players will learn to deal with it or they will constantly die, if they refuse to learn from mistakes and refuse to play better then that's on them not the enemies to take it easy on them. Every single player has been a new player in the beginning of their time in wvw, we all learned to get better and handle situations appropriately, there's no excuses, we experienced it, we overcame it, why can't the current newbies? /shrug

I don't have a problem with picking off zerg tails, they have more than enough players to scare enemies off, if they won't protect their group then they'll lose players, simple, I only have a problem with gank groups actively going around looking to 10v1 other "roamers".

I'm having trouble hearing more than a variation of the same old trope in MMOs, where PvPers don't want to reconsider how they play in any way other than winning. It's not your fault that Anet put players new to WvW at a disadvantage by making them do a grind for a mount. But for that matter, it's not any of our fault that Anet released HPs with Heart of Thorns years back that most people couldn't solo and struggled to find help with, and yet out of that, some people created HP trains and do them to this day. Those people understood something that a lot of PvP-minded people don't, which is that you need a healthy influx of new people who want to stick around. And if that's not encouraged, the game will struggle. I have no objections to having a toughen up attitude in the heat of competition, I don't expect PvP to be a group hug or for people to second guess every strategy because it might be too mean, but I will push back against practices that don't seem to take into account the reality that goes beyond the match itself.

I mean, at the end of the day, it's a game that's for fun. And if a PvPer's idea of fun is stomping other playing into the dirt and expecting them to toughen up or leave, they will tend to find that a significant number of those they stomp will, in fact, leave and won't be back. And that's not like... morally wrong or something, I'm not making a moral judgment here, but when it comes to whether a game is active and getting funding, expecting people to toughen up simply doesn't work a lot of the time.

[Djamonja.6453]

4 hours ago, Xenesis.6389 said:

Also CD probably doesn't belong in T1, they should drop and let BG come up.

BG is tanking and so is SoS, so Tier 1 is probably not going to change.

[Xenesis.6389]

39 minutes ago, Labjax.2465 said:

I'm having trouble hearing more than a variation of the same old trope in MMOs, where PvPers don't want to reconsider how they play in any way other than winning. It's not your fault that Anet put players new to WvW at a disadvantage by making them do a grind for a mount. But for that matter, it's not any of our fault that Anet released HPs with Heart of Thorns years back that most people couldn't solo and struggled to find help with, and yet out of that, some people created HP trains and do them to this day. Those people understood something that a lot of PvP-minded people don't, which is that you need a healthy influx of new people who want to stick around. And if that's not encouraged, the game will struggle. I have no objections to having a toughen up attitude in the heat of competition, I don't expect PvP to be a group hug or for people to second guess every strategy because it might be too mean, but I will push back against practices that don't seem to take into account the reality that goes beyond the match itself.

I mean, at the end of the day, it's a game that's for fun. And if a PvPer's idea of fun is stomping other playing into the dirt and expecting them to toughen up or leave, they will tend to find that a significant number of those they stomp will, in fact, leave and won't be back. And that's not like... morally wrong or something, I'm not making a moral judgment here, but when it comes to whether a game is active and getting funding, expecting people to toughen up simply doesn't work a lot of the time.

You can say all that but what do you honestly expect to happen? You can complain about morals and picking on the weak is not right, but there's a lot of players who already have a line of honor they follow in pvp, but the pure gankers don't care and throwing up paragraphs of argument over it isn't going to change "their" minds, they will always exist in pvp. You either adapt to the situations including to avoid those bad situations in the first place, or you sit there assigning a mountain of blame when nothing is going to change. If you want to rant about mounts well we already have monthly discussions about it, sure it's a disadvantage, but it's not hard to get. In fact here, tell the newbies 

 

 

[Labjax.2465]

29 minutes ago, Xenesis.6389 said:

You can say all that but what do you honestly expect to happen? You can complain about morals and picking on the weak is not right, but there's a lot of players who already have a line of honor they follow in pvp, but the pure gankers don't care and throwing up paragraphs of argument over it isn't going to change "their" minds, they will always exist in pvp. You either adapt to the situations including to avoid those bad situations in the first place, or you sit there assigning a mountain of blame when nothing is going to change. If you want to rant about mounts well we already have monthly discussions about it, sure it's a disadvantage, but it's not hard to get. In fact here, tell the newbies 

 

 

Me: I'm not making a moral judgment here, just pointing out that players tend to leave when the attitude in PvP toward them is to toughen up.

You: You're complaining about morals and need to adapt.

 

??????

[The Raven.1320]

I'm on SoS during NA times. I don't mind fighting Mag, but I'm tired of all the a-holes on there. 

[Nekro.3096]

9 hours ago, Labjax.2465 said:

... if a PvPer's idea of fun is stomping other playing into the dirt and expecting them to toughen up or leave, they will tend to find that a significant number of those they stomp will, in fact, leave and won't be back. And that's not like... morally wrong or something, I'm not making a moral judgment here, but when it comes to whether a game is active and getting funding, expecting people to toughen up simply doesn't work a lot of the time.

 

This.

Edited June 10, 2022 by necromancin.2396

[Xenesis.6389]

8 hours ago, Labjax.2465 said:

Me: I'm not making a moral judgment here, just pointing out that players tend to leave when the attitude in PvP toward them is to toughen up.

You: You're complaining about morals and need to adapt.

 

??????

What else do you expect? What do you expect to change by pointing this out?

I'm not complaining about morals, you brought up morals, just pointing out that not everyone will be on board to treat newbies any easier.

 

??????????????

 

P.S Everyone on Mag is probably getting a good laugh off this thread, and you're probably just fueling them to punish/camp you harder. 🤷‍♂️

Edited June 10, 2022 by Xenesis.6389

[iKeostuKen.2738]

2 hours ago, Xenesis.6389 said:

P.S Everyone on Mag is probably getting a good laugh off this thread, and you're probably just fueling them to punish/camp you harder. 🤷‍♂️

That's fine. Just a game and conferences are giving some of us new options. They can server camp 5 players if they want for hours on end.

[Evenge.4067]

19 hours ago, Xenesis.6389 said:

Oh yeah it's problem now, not when SoS was winning over servers by blowing up ocx scores, nope, not when BG had 24/7 coverage blowing away opponents, nope, it's only bad when it's happening to you now.

It was not good for WvW back then or ever. 

The linking system and bandwagoning is toxic for WvW.  Isle of Janthir was already decently strong yet somehow they got linked with Mag. Suspicious. 

In any competition, it's never healthy to have a side that humiliates it's opponent.  Mag is the only server that is over the top with this. Spawn camping to the level that Mag takes it to is damaging to the game mode. It won't change, ownership does nothing and Mag players will never see how toxic it is.

WvW as a whole will continue to decline because of bandwagoning and oppressive tactics.

[Xenesis.6389]

27 minutes ago, Evenge.4067 said:

It was not good for WvW back then or ever. 

The linking system and bandwagoning is toxic for WvW.  Isle of Janthir was already decently strong yet somehow they got linked with Mag. Suspicious. 

In any competition, it's never healthy to have a side that humiliates it's opponent.  Mag is the only server that is over the top with this. Spawn camping to the level that Mag takes it to is damaging to the game mode. It won't change, ownership does nothing and Mag players will never see how toxic it is.

WvW as a whole will continue to decline because of bandwagoning and oppressive tactics.

Well maybe you all should be complaining louder about alliances/world restructuring not being done yet?

Links were a temporary feature that has long outlived it's task, all the way back to 2016.

It's just hilarious that NOW you all want to come complain about links when it's not in your favor, or about Mag who has always had this type of attitude. Like please, this isn't the first time it's happened, it's not the last time it will happen, even after world restructuring.

[ArchonWing.9480]

Wow, it's been years and people are still feeding in EB to Mag. Well, actually SoS is doing ok-- 1.0 KDR, meaning you have people with some sense.

The only thing wrong is that Anet still hasn't banned the EBG bots; I saw a lot on DR and CD when linked with them. I mean, only a bot would be stupid enough to run over and over again into the same meatgrinder. Wait, maybe it's not bots.

I mean I've always wanted to suggest Mag to put a bright  neon pink sign on each wall on  SMC saying "Don't come in here, we're definitely waiting next to the portal" but then again I realize nothing would really change.

Edited June 10, 2022 by ArchonWing.9480

[Labjax.2465]

7 hours ago, Xenesis.6389 said:

What else do you expect? What do you expect to change by pointing this out?

I'm not complaining about morals, you brought up morals, just pointing out that not everyone will be on board to treat newbies any easier.

 

??????????????

 

P.S Everyone on Mag is probably getting a good laugh off this thread, and you're probably just fueling them to punish/camp you harder. 🤷‍♂️

Are you trolling me? Starting to think I'm just being trolled. I explicitly said that I'm not talking about morals twice, that I'm talking about the consequences of actions as it relates to the health of the game, and somehow you keep turning this into me talking about morals. You can go laugh it up with your mag buddies if you want. When the game mode suffers because of how you play and you have less and less people to stomp because they stop showing up, just don't go blaming others for it. That's all there is to it. I have negative one hundred expectations. I made my point like two posts ago. At this point, I'm just hitting back the tennis ball you keep sending my way for some reason.

[Xenesis.6389]

3 minutes ago, Labjax.2465 said:

Are you trolling me? Starting to think I'm just being trolled. I explicitly said that I'm not talking about morals twice, that I'm talking about the consequences of actions as it relates to the health of the game, and somehow you keep turning this into me talking about morals. You can go laugh it up with your mag buddies if you want. When the game mode suffers because of how you play and you have less and less people to stomp because they stop showing up, just don't go blaming others for it. That's all there is to it. I have negative one hundred expectations. I made my point like two posts ago. At this point, I'm just hitting back the tennis ball you keep sending my way for some reason.

I'm not on Mag, I didn't bring up morals.

/hits tennis ball back

[Knighthonor.4061]

On 6/8/2022 at 4:05 PM, Despot.3048 said:

CD have been putting up more of a fight than SoS this week. Disappointing. 

We tried to communicate with SoS but no action. We need to gank up on MAG.