Tempest support killed by mechanists in pve.

[Luna.6203]

I started my journey as ely recently. So correct me if im wrong. Its amazing support in pvp i already have blast of fun after playing support guard for soo long.

 

But without alac or quickness nobody wants tempest support in pve. I believe tempest need alac on grant aura trait or overload or something.

[soulknight.9620]

Correct. Although Tempest does provide the best heal output in game and some nice aura effects for pvp.

[Jski.6180]

Its not like eng healing out put is any weaker then tempest  and eng comes with barrier and dps ontop of the alactiry. The kits that eng has realty brakes the ability for the class over all to support and dps.

Tempest and realty ele over all is in a sad shape and it sounds like it may get a lot worst with the war and ranger update as well as "more dps classes getting aoe 5 target fury" destroying the core boon support of ele and tempest. We know nothing about what changes are coming to ele but as of right now its not looking good in any game type.

[draxynnic.3719]

I think it was more killed by the removal of 10-man. Tempest was always outperformed in 5-man contexts by things like druid and healbrand that offered much more role compression, but it had a niche in 10-man because you could add just one tempest and get extra healing and support for an entire raid squad. If it wasn't for mechanist, tempest would probably still be being outcompeted by healbrand, druid, healscourge, and probably more that I can't bring to mind at this hour.

Definitely needs buffs of some sort to bring it back, either way. Finding a way to finagle alacrity into it (since catalyst already has quickness) would probably go a long way.

Edited June 16, 2022 by draxynnic.3719

[Lord of the Fire.6870]

41 minutes ago, Luna.6203 said:

I started my journey as ely recently. So correct me if im wrong. Its amazing support in pvp i already have blast of fun after playing support guard for soo long.

 

But without alac or quickness nobody wants tempest support in pve. I believe tempest need alac on grant aura trait or overload or something.

alarc is thing for Renegade or Mesmer means giving it to Tempest doesn't make sense because the only build you could pair this then would be qFB which is for runs without support.

 

I suggested a while a go because of this giving quickness to core ele produced by swapping attunement .( can be increased with concentration/boon duration but is by standard less a tiny bit less then next overload/attunement change ) Tempest then can share the quickness with one of its traits . Maybe they can this expand on with sharing all self inflicted boons with this you could share stabi from earth armor.

 

Weaver wouldn't get this because it is already a fast paced build and from lore it has a different attunement from the rest

[Luna.6203]

57 minutes ago, Lord of the Fire.6870 said:

alarc is thing for Renegade or Mesmer means giving it to Tempest doesn't make sense because the only build you could pair this then would be qFB which is for runs without support.

 

I suggested a while a go because of this giving quickness to core ele produced by swapping attunement .( can be increased with concentration/boon duration but is by standard less a tiny bit less then next overload/attunement change ) Tempest then can share the quickness with one of its traits . Maybe they can this expand on with sharing all self inflicted boons with this you could share stabi from earth armor.

 

Weaver wouldn't get this because it is already a fast paced build and from lore it has a different attunement from the rest

 

As far as i know anet removed all 10 target skills with 5.There is one supp healer per group you are not supposed to pair with them u are supposed to replace them / compete for same spot... right ? ATM tempest stand no chance. Also im not talking about weaver at all.. weaver is great dps thus there is no problem to get into group. Same for cata with quickenss. And its completely different topic. BUT Reason why i picked ely (same as guard) is you can play support role. Exept i find out you cant. 😞(in pve)

 

Now a days machinist is only pve support whereas firebrand is also acceptable.. but even on heal fireband i have to go ritualist-dps-quick boonbot...because heal spot belongs to alac mechanist. And no way im going to play that ugly green ugly jade ugly bot. 🤢🤮

 

You Ely veterans are probably used to it. But im really disappointed. Thats not what i expected. Although i knew there must be something wrong with ely heal since i dont really see support ely in pve at all.. Actually i rarely see elementalist overall. 🤔

 

I may be wrong but i bet giving tempest alac would be 100% fix.

[anbujackson.9564]

The only thing tempest needs is a stronger chrono. Maybe give group stab on overload and voila, you got amazing boon coverage (like they never run out), great healing and great utility.

[Luna.6203]

Oh my ... It's happening!

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/arenanet-studio-update-june-2022/

Elementalist: Tempest will now be able to provide party alacrity, with a rework to their grandmaster trait Lucid Singularity.

😮😍🥳

[Serephen.3420]

14 hours ago, Luna.6203 said:

Oh my ... It's happening!

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/arenanet-studio-update-june-2022/

Elementalist: Tempest will now be able to provide party alacrity, with a rework to their grandmaster trait Lucid Singularity.

😮😍🥳

Which is nice except heal temp will not be able to compete with heal mech because you lose heal on auras. But we'll see what happens when we get the preview. I'll stay hopeful for now.

[Sunshine.5014]

Raw heal can never compete with Barrier.

- Barrier increases "max" HP, allowing people to withstand bigger attacks.

- Barrier is not wasted when the target is full HP.

- Barrier has higher multiplier.

- For Heal Mech specifically, it doesn't have to choose between Barrier or Alac. It actually gets Alac via Barrier application. Ele on the other hand have to pick between heal and Alac. It's just facepalm.

[Luna.6203]

@Serephen.3420 @Sunshine.5014

 

I think people dont care about raw healing in pve. Your on.1 priority as support is keep all boons on your party (that must include quick or alac). I think having both aura share and alac would be way too powerful and its fair you can chose one or another but not both.

 

Problem is:

You cant deal good dps and be alac at same time. But you can be good dps and provide quick. ...SO... You want heal with alac and dps with quick. ...SO... This change will make tempest better support than firebrand. Now imagine share auras on top of that.. that would be way too OP!!!

[draxynnic.3719]

2 hours ago, Luna.6203 said:

@Serephen.3420 @Sunshine.5014

 

I think people dont care about raw healing in pve. Your on.1 priority as support is keep all boons on your party (that must include quick or alac). I think having both aura share and alac would be way too powerful and its fair you can chose one or another but not both.

 

Problem is:

You cant deal good dps and be alac at same time. But you can be good dps and provide quick. ...SO... You want heal with alac and dps with quick. ...SO... This change will make tempest better support than firebrand. Now imagine share auras on top of that.. that would be way too OP!!!

You still have aura share - that's the Water grandmaster. You just don't add healing to the aura.

[HowlKamui.5120]

 

2 hours ago, Luna.6203 said:

@Serephen.3420 @Sunshine.5014

 

I think people dont care about raw healing in pve. Your on.1 priority as support is keep all boons on your party (that must include quick or alac). I think having both aura share and alac would be way too powerful and its fair you can chose one or another but not both.

 

Problem is:

You cant deal good dps and be alac at same time. But you can be good dps and provide quick. ...SO... You want heal with alac and dps with quick. ...SO... This change will make tempest better support than firebrand. Now imagine share auras on top of that.. that would be way too OP!!!

 

You can still share your auras which is great. That's a water grandmaster trait.

What tempests will lose is the healing on aura share if they want to go for the new trait, which should be fine imo. Tempests still have other sources of heal for the crucial moments. 

[Zhaid Zhem.6508]

Problem is, you will not compet ewith FB (or scrapper/harbinger/herald etc) but with mechanist, druid, renegade, chrono ...

All seems to have better utilities for groups.

Edited June 24, 2022 by Zhaid Zhem.6508

[Luna.6203]

Ahh right... its fine.. you can always swap trait if more heal is needed and there will be other source of alac. After patch everyone will be able to do anything.. thats what anet aiming for.

And yes firebrand will have to go ritualist dps or so...  I think willbender need improvements on how alac is generated.. But thats not discussion for this subforum.

[Zhaid Zhem.6508]

We can also hope to have hybrid dps/alacrity.
For example if Overloads give alacrity, then you could just play fresh-air ...

[Luna.6203]

Yeah this kind of worry me even more. Where one profession have to sacrifice half of dps/heal or even more for boon support and other can do 90% pure dps variant and provide same boon support. Ppl will find out quicky whats next meta and other proffesions will be unwanted again.

 

Like i mentioned alac willy is already pretty bad and unwanted. Now when other professions gain easy access to alac this problem will only grow. Its good there is trade of for alac on tempest there should to be.. As firebrand i can lower my heal even more for example signet sharing to boost group dps, swap axe for mace for more heal but loosing fury uptime.. Mosly you want max boon/max dps and heal not an issue. right? Mechanist is exception and thats not fair.

 

But regardless its step to right direction... right now tempest support without quick or alac is not viable at all.

Edited June 24, 2022 by Luna.6203