why is there no solo end-game content?

[CrashTestAuto.9108]

20 minutes ago, Urud.4925 said:

As you both noticed, there is already a lot of soloable content and I think we can all agree that adding few more options wouldn't destroy the game. The problem is indeed in that "rewarding": if you add... let's say, the usual tower with floors to clean, that is also rewarding, then many players will start to play that instead of group events, like HoT metas. And this won't benefit the game, since it's still an MMO after all, and it shines in those group open world contents (while you already have plenty of options for solo players, in many games nowadays). Don't forget that most of the people play video games to farm gold; this is their goal. So if a soloable content is also rewarding, you'll remove a lot of people from the open world.

 

ArenaNet could add some soloable tower or similar, but the reward shouldn't be higher than cleaning a dungeon. Would you play it in that case? Would you clean a soloable tower if the reward is around 50 silver for 30 minutes? ArenaNet should spend their time on something that it's designed to be niche and not rewarding. They might find the time at some point, but this is something that must not be designed as good/rewarding content.

I think this is easily solved with the existing daily/weekly reward systems that Dungeons/Fracs/Strikes/Raids already have in place.  These don't break the rest of the game, because you can't just spend your whole time in there farming, but at the same time they feel rewarding enough to be played on the set cadence.  Just add the same limits to the solo versions and problem solved.

 

This would actually be really good from a number of active players per day perspective, because the group oriented stuff is particularly bad for short bursts of unexpected play.  If you have 20 minutes at a random point, you're fairly pushed to log in, find a pug that happens to be playing content you want (which is less likely in some places because e.g. fractals are usually all dailies + recs groups). 

Conversely, you could easily log in and blast out a couple of strikes/fracs to get some dailies before you'd have to log out again.  Moreover, you can do this repeatedly throughout the day because you can easily pick and choose which strikes/fracs to do, and when.

 

As ever, the major benefit of solo content is it lets players with more restrictive/unpredictable gaming schedules make the best use of their time.  As this is a game that is ten years old, and a lot of its player base will have aged up with it by that same ten years, that likely represents a significant proportion of the player base.

[Astralporing.1957]

1 hour ago, Cyninja.2954 said:

That's why I referenced different sized bananas, because that is quite literally the extent of how different single player content is.

To you. At the same time, from a perspective of an OW player, all group content might just be different sizes of oranges.

1 hour ago, Cyninja.2954 said:

In either case, it is not asking for more variety in the scope of it all when 1 group of players demand only fruit on a buffet which is already composed of 90% fruit.

Or, you might see it as some players asking for some higher-quality fruit instead of having only a lot of cheaper ones.

For me personally, i'd be fine with the current ratio of fruits to veggies, but instead i'd rather see them on two separate platters. Without either of those platters being waved under the noses of those that came for the other one.

[Hashberry.4510]

Well the current buffet is kind of stale for both sides, OW is power creeped to hell and the small group folks get strikes now and then. Solo challenges would help though I think just some harder non mandatory OW zones would help as well.

[samsar.9152]

This made thinking again how cool it was to actually have heroes system in Guild Wars 1. To be honest, if I have to decide between playing the stuff with the ppl who are all the time whining and telling to you how you should play the game or playing alone, I decide to play alone. 

[Linken.6345]

7 minutes ago, samsar.9152 said:

This made thinking again how cool it was to actually have heroes system in Guild Wars 1. To be honest, if I have to decide between playing the stuff with the ppl who are all the time whining and telling to you how you should play the game or playing alone, I decide to play alone. 

Then as other have stated there are alot of single player games that offer exactly what you want already go find your solo expeirence in any of those mate.

[yoni.7015]

18 minutes ago, samsar.9152 said:

playing the stuff with the ppl who are all the time whining and telling to you how you should play the game 

I have never really experienced this behavior in the game and I play a lot of group content. 

Edited September 28, 2022 by yoni.7015

[CrashTestAuto.9108]

10 minutes ago, Linken.6345 said:

Then as other have stated there are alot of single player games that offer exactly what you want already go find your solo expeirence in any of those mate.

Again... how do you think this helps the game?

The game is heavily marketed on the single player/Open World experience.  How do you think sending people who enjoy solo content to other games is going to benefit you?

[Astralporing.1957]

10 minutes ago, Linken.6345 said:

Then as other have stated there are alot of single player games that offer exactly what you want already go find your solo expeirence in any of those mate.

One of those games is called Guild Wars. GW2 is supposed to be its continuation.

[yoni.7015]

1 minute ago, Astralporing.1957 said:

One of those games is called Guild Wars. GW2 is supposed to be its continuation.

Maybe Guild Wars is the better game for him then. The servers are still up, right?

Why play an MMO when you don’t want to play with others? Playing an MMO is also about the social interactions between players. 

[CrashTestAuto.9108]

1 minute ago, yoni.7015 said:

Maybe Guild Wars is the better game for him then. The servers are still up, right?

Why play an MMO when you don’t want to play with others? Playing an MMO is also about the social interactions between players. 

For you, maybe.

Besides, this doesn't have to be an either or question.  You can enjoy social interactions some of the time, but not want it to be the thing you do all the time (and there is a massive difference between social interactions and scheduling with a group of nine other people to do specific content at a specific time).

 

Plus, plenty of socialising is done while in solo content.  Guild chat doesn't require people to be in the same instance.  You can play solo aspects of the game and still gain the benefits of an MMO.

[samsar.9152]

2 minutes ago, yoni.7015 said:

Maybe Guild Wars is the better game for him then. The servers are still up, right?

Why play an MMO when you don’t want to play with others? Playing an MMO is also about the social interactions between players. 

You got me wrong. :) I have guilds to do stuff. Nothing is more fun than do the raids for example with guildies. :) 

[Linken.6345]

4 minutes ago, CrashTestAuto.9108 said:

For you, maybe.

Besides, this doesn't have to be an either or question.  You can enjoy social interactions some of the time, but not want it to be the thing you do all the time (and there is a massive difference between social interactions and scheduling with a group of nine other people to do specific content at a specific time).

 

Plus, plenty of socialising is done while in solo content.  Guild chat doesn't require people to be in the same instance.  You can play solo aspects of the game and still gain the benefits of an MMO.

Yes and there is plenty of stuff to do alone, map completing the newest maps in EoD you can even repeat over and over.

spvp, WvW or open world event/metas you dont need to talk to anyone in either mode.

Story on another character etc.

 

[CrashTestAuto.9108]

8 minutes ago, Linken.6345 said:

Yes and there is plenty of stuff to do alone, map completing the newest maps in EoD you can even repeat over and over.

spvp, WvW or open world event/metas you dont need to talk to anyone in either mode.

Story on another character etc.

 

True indeed, which explains why there are so many solo players here.  But many of that large number of solo players would also enjoy challenging and rewarding content along the lines of the grouped instance content 🙂 

Edited September 28, 2022 by CrashTestAuto.9108

[Linken.6345]

24 minutes ago, CrashTestAuto.9108 said:

True indeed, which explains why there are so many solo players here.  But many of that large number of solo players would also enjoy challenging and rewarding content along the lines of the grouped instance content 🙂 

Well solo open world run around with faceless people are already more rewarding then any instanced group content and it can be done as little or as much as you have time for with no limit weekly.

Edited September 28, 2022 by Linken.6345

[CrashTestAuto.9108]

1 minute ago, Linken.6345 said:

Well solo open world run around with faceless people are already more rewarding then any instanced group content and it can be done as little or as much as you have time for with no limit weekly.

O... kay.  It's weird that you'd respond to a post asking for challenging content by saying you can run around doing easy content.

[ArchonWing.9480]

5 hours ago, Astralporing.1957 said:

On individual basis, you are right. On the other hand, when enough players in the target group like (or dislike) something, that definitely should impact the design.

Maybe, but sometimes people overestimate how many players actually support it.

I'm not even sure if people want challenging content. When Liadri first come out there were many concerns it was so difficult that players felt left out. So how do you handle that?

So let's say we introduce some very challenging dungeons that require a modest, I dunno, 15k dps to do. I feel like it wouldn't go over very well.

Now if stuff scaled, that might actually be more interesting. But solo without help? Some people might not like it. What about all those people that only play support? Almost all skills and traits are balanced for group play.

Yes, one could say "Well, you don't have to do it", but that argument never works in my experience.

Edited September 28, 2022 by ArchonWing.9480

[Linken.6345]

13 minutes ago, CrashTestAuto.9108 said:

O... kay.  It's weird that you'd respond to a post asking for challenging content by saying you can run around doing easy content.

Challengeing solo content already exsist multiple people have already told you that.

But you want rewarding perfectly suitable content for you that you can run untill you get bored of it untill you scream for more of the same.

Then use the gold you generate to get what ever you want from the game without the effort of finding other people to do content with because reasons of time comitment most of the time. 

[Dayra.7405]

23 minutes ago, Linken.6345 said:

But many of that large number of solo players would also enjoy challenging and rewarding content along the lines of the grouped instance content

While the group content isn't that bad in it's own, the forced group building is bad. No real interest from one side, overreached requirements on the other, role-spezialisations that take time to satisfy, it isn't fun to build groups, and it waste much time to build adequate groups. With solo-playable content you can just play what you want at the time you want it.

Edited September 28, 2022 by Dayra.7405

[CrashTestAuto.9108]

17 minutes ago, Linken.6345 said:

Challengeing solo content already exsist multiple people have already told you that.

But you want rewarding perfectly suitable content for you that you can run untill you get bored of it untill you scream for more of the same.

Then use the gold you generate to get what ever you want from the game without the effort of finding other people to do content with because reasons of time comitment most of the time. 

Okay I'm observing a pattern here where I say a thing, and then you either answer something else, or just invent a completely new thing that I meant to say.  This doesn't feel like it will lead to a productive conversation, so I think it's probably better to stop engaging with you.  Thank you for your time 🙂 

[Sobx.1758]

5 hours ago, CrashTestAuto.9108 said:

Again... how do you think this helps the game?

And how does your wish about closing yourself off from the rest of mmorpg's community in a solo instance helps the game in any way? 🙄

Edited September 28, 2022 by Sobx.1758

[Sobx.1758]

1 hour ago, CrashTestAuto.9108 said:

O... kay.  It's weird that you'd respond to a post asking for challenging content by saying you can run around doing easy content.

There's already harder soloable content you can play. The rewards will be lower -because of the clear speeds- when compared to completing it in a small group, but you've already wrote you're fine with soloable rewards being lower than the group ones, so I don't know what your problem is. It sure isn't "I want more rewards for it", right?

As for "maybe add dailies to x so people with more restrictive schedules can benefit more" (ah, yes, the ever elusive and mostly irrelevant scheduling issues strike again) -there's already A LOT to do in this game even with limited time.

 

44 minutes ago, CrashTestAuto.9108 said:

Okay I'm observing a pattern here where I say a thing, and then you either answer something else, or just invent a completely new thing that I meant to say.  This doesn't feel like it will lead to a productive conversation, so I think it's probably better to stop engaging with you.  Thank you for your time 🙂 

You wrote about challenging content (while questioning why he's mentioning an easy one in his previous post), he re-explained it to you that soloable challenging content already exists and you -again- just ignored it by saying he invented something you didn't say. But what he said was a direct response to what you were talking about -wanting a soloable challenging content. 🙄 

Edited September 28, 2022 by Sobx.1758

[Astralporing.1957]

1 hour ago, ArchonWing.9480 said:

Maybe, but sometimes people overestimate how many players actually support it.

I'm not even sure if people want challenging content. When Liadri first come out there were many concerns it was so difficult that players felt left out.

Oh, i fully agree. I even brought liadri (and how that fight didn't end up being too popular) up at some point. Personally, i don't think there's all that much support for solo challenging content (or group challenging content, for that matter). There's definitely a lot of support for more laid-back solo content however. Or, to be more precise, a content for which you are not forced to goup with others (because most of OW is hardly solo content, even if you do not have to organize in groups for it)

[Beast Sos.1457]

9 hours ago, Cyninja.2954 said:

Asking for more solo content is not asking for more variety. It is literally the opposite when the majority of content is already solo friendly/able.

You are basically at a buffet with 2 apples, 3 oranges and 90 bananas asking for more bananas of different sizes. 

The fact you dont enjoy the provided bananas as much while still asking for more, hoping the next batch will taste different, seems to not even enter your mind.

The developers meanwhile look at what gets eaten and wonder: why are we throwing away so much money on bananas when 50% of them are just rotting away at the end of each day.

What is being asked for is difficult instance solo content. I don't see that anywhere in the game. 

[Beast Sos.1457]

7 hours ago, Urud.4925 said:

As you both noticed, there is already a lot of soloable content and I think we can all agree that adding few more options wouldn't destroy the game. The problem is indeed in that "rewarding": if you add... let's say, the usual tower with floors to clean, that is also rewarding, then many players will start to play that instead of group events, like HoT metas. And this won't benefit the game, since it's still an MMO after all, and it shines in those group open world contents (while you already have plenty of options for solo players, in many games nowadays). Don't forget that most of the people play video games to farm gold; this is their goal. So if a soloable content is also rewarding, you'll remove a lot of people from the open world.

 

ArenaNet could add some soloable tower or similar, but the reward shouldn't be higher than cleaning a dungeon. Would you play it in that case? Would you clean a soloable tower if the reward is around 50 silver for 30 minutes? ArenaNet should spend their time on something that it's designed to be niche and not rewarding. They might find the time at some point, but this is something that must not be designed as good/rewarding content.

I agree there is solo content but what is being asked for is difficult instanced solo content. 

 

Heres a ez way to make it rewarding while not effecting other aspects of the game- Every 5-10 lvls (depends on the amount of lvls) you get a reward. Could be anything from 1-6 MC (depending on the lvl) to ascended trinkets on first clear and the higher level maybe ascended armor. After the first clear you can only get a daily reward from one lvl, being the max lvl you can do. 2g, tiered mats and a chance at ascended gear would be fine enough rewards while also not trivializing other content. 

 

Gw2 is a game where you go in and play what you want and get rewarded for it. It is one of the main features. The fact that you're saying they shouldn't reward people for it is beyond me. You said it yourself, a big part of a MMO is making gold so you're pretty much asking them to put in the content but in a way that will have it dead within a couple weeks of release. 

[Sobx.1758]

1 hour ago, Beast Sos.1457 said:

What is being asked for is difficult instance solo content. I don't see that anywhere in the game. 

Depending on the difficulty you're looking for, at the very least drms, dungeons, lower varying levels of fractals.

...and then there's also plenty of non-instanced ones.

Edited September 28, 2022 by Sobx.1758