June 27 Balance Update Preview

[Doggie.3184]

May be the most Thief buffs I've ever seen. As of now though:

Please buff Thief Dual Pistols and rework "Deadly Aim." 5%+ Reduced Damage on on all Pistol skills just for QoL (plus the damage loss from not taking Practiced Tolerance) for a weapon set that does the lowest DPS can't possibly be working as intended. Someone added a -% in the wrong spot by accident or something, it's so bizarre.

And does Fire for Effect make Deadeye Mark not need a Target? Because some enemies the mark will not work on at all, Octovine for example. 

Let Thief use F1 skills on ourselves/without target for benefits and that would fix+futureproof it. Siphon included, let us Siphon our own Shadows as if we were our own Ally for Shroud bar so we can continue to use Alacrity for OOC situations.

 

Edited June 9, 2023 by Doggie.3184

[Vera.9125]

Putting alac on scourge seems like a mistake. I think it's the correct decision to nerf scourge's healing output if it gets alac, but I don't think scourge needs access to it. Heal scourge occupies a really unique place in the support meta and taking that away removes some of the uniqueness out of the specialization and the meta as a whole for me.

[DarkMage.5068]

For Harbinger, why the CD removal from Vile Vials when the CD reductions on the Elixirs themselves only apply to PvP/WvW??  Elixirs are a major part of our rotations and this seems like it is going to hose us in PvE.  Seriously, guys, why?  

[Decinomicon.4619]

On 6/8/2023 at 4:12 PM, Rubi Bayer.8493 said:

 Scrapper

• Kinetic Accelerators: This trait has been reworked. Apply boons to nearby allies when you successfully combo with a blast or leap finisher. Your function gyro is now a blast finisher.

No, just no, the way quickness scrapper is has a good flow, this would interrupt that flow. Getting quickness from superspeed feels good, being forced to interact with combo fields as part of normal gameplay does not, that's why I avoid elementalist. Just don't do this change please. Everything else in this patch with the exception of this and sand shade duration is fine. 

[Assassine.1958]

On 6/8/2023 at 11:12 PM, Rubi Bayer.8493 said:

Firebrand

• Weighty Terms: This trait no longer reduces the mantra charge-recovery times. Increased pages granted from 1 to 2

Are there any changes to mantra recharges? I was wondering, because actually you have a 9 1/2 sec recharge on heal and some utility mantras which are important to provide quickness. So if you will change this trait, just think about the recharge of all mantras.

Thank you! Just saying, because I feel you change a lot of working stuff to garbage and don't focus on the important things.

[Varon.2564]

Please don't nerf chaos vortex, that seems unnecessary 😕

[ClawfingerPL.5263]

4 minutes ago, ClawfingerPL.5263 said:

ai generated balance ahh changes 💀

no for real what are those changes for scrapper? straight up thanos snapped heal scrapper out of existance. indie company

[Cryptically.2746]

The Warrior Greatsword Arc Divide change is dumb no one complained about it, it wasn't needed there was no in depth explanation for how big the skill radius would be and reducing the damage coefficient, basically makes zerker not want to use greatsword its not rewarding now. Cleaving down multiple targets in ur spike putting pressure on healers in WvW, as well as creating downs with ur spike is the reason u use greatsword. warrior mains that play WvW won't use greatsword if patch goes thru they will use hammer and then if u have zerker and spellbreaker in each line everyone is gonna complain about the CC, and then you'll nerf warrior again... makes zero sense.

[troy.3257]

Hope that Deadeye group buff radius is HUGE or it will be useless.

[ZenDrake.8316]

37 minutes ago, BANNED.9527 said:

Please keep a close eye on Power Berserker...Greatsword swaps NEED to remain relevant to keep the class interesting. If the new Arc Divider isn't cutting it, please buff Hundred Blades. We all know GS Spellbreaker could use the love to make it competitive with the Hammer build.

Remove the stupid after cast cancel mechanic first. Same for Guardian, the need for weapon stow in COMBAT is such a bad thing to have.

[AresGuildwars.6372]

I'm a tad salty; even tho I thought it couldn't get worse, you somehow decided to supernerf Mirage (Dodge) across all gamemodes and builds (Mes doesn't bring that many condi cleanses to begin with), but also ripped chrono further apart. I'd say those notes look way worse than last years for Mes and I never thought that could happen. 

Poor Necro and Ranger as well. Professions not only need to give up power for bringing boons, but moreso their identity as a whole/concept and their flavor, it seems. Old Scourge was so much better designed even tho there is no alac. 

I'd prefer you just revert to back before last years patch or at least just skip this update, scrap it and try it next year again. Pls don't ruin Mes, but have a nice day anyway! On the bright side: I for sure know now, that I'll have plenty of free time to touch grass this summer.

(Also that Tempest Joke was hilarious. XD 10/10 Shout out to that!)

Edited June 9, 2023 by AresGuildwars.6372

[Acron.3712]

On 6/8/2023 at 11:12 PM, Rubi Bayer.8493 said:

Arc Divider: Reduced the number of strikes from 3 to 1. Reduced the casting time from 1.86 seconds to 0.8 seconds. Reduced total power coefficient from 5.1 to 2.5 in PvE and from 2.112 to 1.82 in PvP.

Not sure what to think about this one tbh. 
Don't know if I'm missreading something, but that seems like a pretty substantial nerf to a skill that was finally nicely powerfull and very satisfiying.

GS on Warrior could use some more love in general to be able to keep up with weapons like Dual Axe and Hammer.

Edited June 9, 2023 by Acron.3712

[Forgotten Legend.9281]

Question: with Desert Empowerment going to Grandmaster tier... 1) does that mean Feed from Corruption is moving to Master tier? or 2) is Feed from Corruption going to be gone and a new master trait instead? (i presume the first option based on the notes, but would like some clarity)

[sadalsuud.4302]

Guess i'm gonna start running reaper instead of scourge from now on. thanks for 8sec duration, just killed off the reason i played necro. no comments on lowering its 30sec cooldown so bascially if blood as sand gives me 15% damage reduction i have to choose between 8s of damage reduction or try to span it out over time to do more dps. either way i'm screwed. worst thing you could have done to this class that was rare to see used anyway.

Edited June 9, 2023 by sadalsuud.4302
added to post

[VictorLeal.4102]

Ok reaper still good i sleep

[ReshiKyo.9038]

I am a Necro Player and I liked to play Condi Scourge.
With an emphasis on "liked" as the duration nerf on Sand Shade will severely damage this profession, in particular this playstyle. I thought you wanted to give professions more options to play with and as, so why on gods earth do you think its a good Idea to remove a large amount of:
- Boon Corrupt
- Condi/Damage Capabilities
- Rez - Power - Niche
- Barriers
From Scourge for Alac? I thought Alac was a real nice to have on Scourge, but I take that back. I dont want Alac on those conditions AT ALL.

 

Edited June 9, 2023 by ReshiKyo.9038

[Roadkizzle.2157]

I'm not a fan of what the Chronomancer changes look like.

 

It looks like they are completely trying to remove anything that makes the class specialization.

Remove the boon generation from the Shield ability, Wells were already seldomly used and now with everything tied to Phantasm generation there is only one viable gameplay for the Chrono and it is avoiding the use of Wells or Shields.

Phantasm fast spamming is now going to be the only way to play Chrono to get DPS, or maintain Quick or Alac.

They are putting the nail in the coffin of giving the Chrono any identity.

[Nickv.8031]

• Mirage can no longer dodge while immobilized or under the effects of crowd control.
  
  Please dont.... My dodge is attached to my condi clense. If i cant dodge while immobilized. I lose my condi clense, to a condition. 

[Antina.5973]

Please make cooldowns on Mantras reduced with Wighty Terms change, so we dont have to run 80% boon duration...

[Mewtu.9720]

Hey I really enjoy the majority of the changes I am seeing but I feel like in some ways Mesmer got changes that are not tuned in a good way...

Virt F5 not longer blocks -> I feel that's a healthy change in PvP and WvW but for PvE it makes stuff like Deimos HK increadibly unreliable since we lose our one block that actually blocks for a duration. It's something I dont feel needs to be adjusted in PvE content.

Chrono rework: Losing the ability to provide meaningful alacrity in downtimes will make playing it feel like the inferior option compared to all alacrity providers... Quickness uptime may not matter when the party cannot proceed hitting hart but alacrity sure does. I'd welcome a change that does not restrict how much utility can be brought to a fight but if it comes at the cost of actual alac uptime I would not want to take it.

Since I play chrono mainly as a healer I'd also welcome to see better protection (and even regen) maybe trhough precog well or shield abilities because running Rune of the Herald to archive this is so much more work compared to other healers out there

 

[StabbersTheThird.6053]

Constructive Response :D. If you plan to read it. If not, sorry for the thicc feedback chunk. I play Necro (all), Bladesworn, and Thief/Deadeye/Daredevil. So thats my feedback.

First off:

Thanks for listening to my suggestion and making Dagger and QUICKENING THIRST good for something (I made a suggestion on Reddit, not here). Will it overtake Axe in pvp? No. Not a chance. Will it overtake Staff+X in pve? Definitely not. But hey its a start. In pvp: Dagger suffers from being a melee spec on a profession with minimal safety/protections (Spellbreaker works because it rocks around with stuns, leaps, stability, prot, regen, quickness, superspeed, and barrier- Necro can run at Swiftness speed oooooooh, then you shroud on and the dagger becomes worthless to discuss because its Shroud now). The removal of CORRUPTIONS for boon corruption is just silly. There's no question here on any level. Necromancer is the spec, the concept of taking whats good and making it bad. Both in theme and in balance XD.

Suggestion: Go all in. Do it. Be brave. DAGGER should be good for life force generation. Really good. Quickening Thirst should be a way to reduce cooldown of going into shroud and reset shroud cooldowns and be shifted to Grandmaster. Rip it off Dagger if you have to. Not every weapon even has a trait anyway (Dagger has two between Quickening Thirst and Weakening Shroud). But make it synergistic that if you want a Shroud spec, you want dagger. Not a pigeonhole in this way either. Its an enabler. If you want SHROUD itself, this is the way. Mandalorian sounds. Anyway. Now that Necro got slapped around for corrupting boons (...?) let me make another option clear. Necromancer has a subset of Utility Skills named Corruption. Yep. Redo Master of Corruption. Instead of "now you eat more condi's for using Corruption" and the cdr- Make the cooldown part baseline (thats obvious) and have it corrupt a boon on use baseline. Then the trait itself corrupts a second boon. A simple, single, clean line of text. Necromancer is the corruption, the plague, the voodoo that you do. Having minimal or no corruption is a terrible decision thematically. Having Necro be your go to Boon Corrupt option and Boon Rip option also gives them a place in all content without making them overbearing. TLDR: Dagger for Life Gen good. Quickening Thirst should absolutely give something to Shroud, preferably cdr. Scourge has too much changing for me to vote so I won't (but I really hope you buff the dps spec: This coming from one of the four people who plays DPS scourge). The removal of Corruption is VERY bad. Use the utilities named Corruption to boon corrupt and redo the trait to corrupt a second boon then make cooldown reduction baseline.

Now for Thief. Not sure what the decision making on Thief is. I'm glad Daredevil is getting a buff. It needs one for power (its quite literally bottom tier for damage and I'm frequently told to "just go Deadeye, its better"). Bound getting more damage is nice- what about Vault? Are we really pushing an Auto Attack and Dodge based Staff that spams Weakening Charge? Vault and WC do about the same damage BUT Vault costs 2 more init and has 1/4 longer cast time. Vault should be the skill for damage. WC should not. Also Brawler's Tenacity is now completely worthless. Whats the play? I like those steal changes though. Really really appreciated. Pain Response change is GREAT: always reward skill over oopsie-woopsie. STRONG against for Guarded Initiation. Condi's get thrown about like its going out of style in pvp- Resistance is not the move. Its a good idea. OitC change is fantastic and might (maybe) see play. Kudos. Shadow Flare is god tier. The amount of backstabs I've been revealed out of because I mentally space during the chaos and CnD is too kitten high.

Feedback: This is much better than Necro. I was going to riot over Necro. Improvisation is good IF the internal cooldown changes or leaves. Otherwise its just a giga nerf for some unknown reason. ES/Fluid Strikes is nice but may not see play since its fighting for viability against kitten and CS lines. Redoing kitten to be condi/expertise oriented and having Acro be utility+evade oriented could fix that. Not recommended.  PR is good. GI is bad because condi removal is better than resistance so its just a nerf on a trait line that is already the worst thief trait line (yes, we're including Shadow Arts in this list). SE change works. UH is whatever. Bound and Auto Attack chain for Staff makes a low intensity build. A high intensity build should include a way to make the dps drop a TINY amount (neglible, maybe like 1-2k not 10k the way DE looks at DD for power options) in exchange for huge cc options (Pitfall exists, it should be an option rather than a furnishing choice). BT is dead since now it just gives some small amount of endurance for using skills that require you to stand still and cast/channel. CDR should be baseline on all cooldown options on all professions. Just wish you swapped BT. Maybe using the Physical skills give Prot/Regen/Resist/Reso/ or Aegis (not all 5, just one or two if generous). You forgot the cdr for Distracting Daggers. Vault is a better dps option than WC, except that WC is just faster and hits harder and nothing is done to make that work. Also: How did P/P, S/D, and S/P get completely ignored in this balance patch?  Acro changes and SE changes do not a buff make. Slap some burning onto P/P if you have to. Last bit of feedback: Whats the plan to make Havoc Specialist less punishing (looking at Lead Attacks here for inspiration) and to make Staff Mastery not an inferior option (because its quite simply a calculator equation here when your options are "+damage and sometimes +damage" vs "+lots of damage")? DE changes are fantastic. No complaint. Well actually. Rifle vs P/P is my complaint. But the DE changes are simply good. OitC (one in the chamber) is great now with the steal skill changes. MI change here is going to slightly buff D/D power AND adjust the rotation a tiny bit. Its good. I like your DE shifts. The Meta DE build brings nothing. No cc, no party synergy, no downtime/forgiveness. It brings damage. Meta Power DE is the devourer of synergy/support and that means your damage changes are good. Now if DD could be a good option for CC and Q-DPS (Hey Staff Mastery could offer Quickness when you spend X amount of Endu/Initi).

Daring Dragon change is good. Its the right spot. The question now if what you plan to do about Immortal Dragon. Unyielding is the damage option (as it should be). Can Immortal have Stability and Resolution/Resistance (whichever) on Dragon Slash so that it can be usable in pvp and bring Dedgesworn out of the depths of permablind death? Tada :D. GodSworn is saved!

PS: Hey can Signets of Power do something Crit related? Its a bad Signet trait in a bad line. The two non-crit based trait options in the line named Critical Strikes are bad (go figure). A look at Critical Strikes the line is a good idea. Then a deepdive into S/X and P/P and Acro could be fantastic. Shadowarts is good conceptually but needs buffs/shifts.

[RetributionZero.1347]

PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE STOP NERFING ALAC MIRAGE! It's ONLY useful in raidbosses, and the damage keeps getting nerfed. Stop. Please. It's already dead. Its becoming like Ele at this point with the stacked nerfs for no reason. Now it cant dodge while immobilized in PvE (which, the WvW and PvP getting another dodge doesnt help PvE at all), and also the staff damage is nerfed.

At this point, you may as well remove alac from it and go back to launch of PoF where AlacMirage wasnt a thing.

[Jub.9027]

Why was Toss Elixir R not given a reduced cooldown like every other Elixir skill for Engineer?

[melodyspectrum.2980]

30 minutes ago, Caitmonster.9036 said:

Not a fan of the Scrapper quickness rework. Instead of being pigeon-holed into bringing ~3 gyros at a time we'll just have to stack as many blasts and leaps as we can into our skillbar instead. I can already see myself flying off ledges and platforms with said leaps as I try to combo to get some quickness... oh boy, what fun.
 

This. Scrapper already can have issues leaping off platforms w/ hammer 3 (or rocket boots that they'll now need to bring to provide boons). Imagine needing to spam it every 3-5 seconds. We're gonna need like 400 scrappers just to keep up quickness on Harvest Temple wtf.

On 6/8/2023 at 11:12 PM, Rubi Bayer.8493 said:

Kinetic Accelerators: This trait has been reworked. Apply boons to nearby allies when you successfully combo with a blast or leap finisher. Your function gyro is now a blast finisher.

This is not good. See the quote above - leaps are unreliable considering how many strikes are on platforms you can fall off of nowadays. You guys are doing literally the same thing, except instead of gyros people now have to stack their utilities/rotations with blasts and leaps and hopefully not kill themselves in the process by yeeting off some edge, not to mention a more mundane leap out of the group issue.

 

That aside, Function Gyro is a high value situation skill, it should be used when there are people going down, not spammed for quickness. That was literally what was wrong with heal scrapper until the quickness duration got buffed so that they could hold onto FG for when it's needed and this feels like it'll be a NOT ENOUGH BLASTS/FIELDS! all over again.

[LichOverlord.6329]

1 minute ago, Nickv.8031 said:

• Mirage can no longer dodge while immobilized or under the effects of crowd control.
  
  Please dont.... My dodge is attached to my condi clense. If i cant dodge while immobilized. I lose my condi clense, to a condition. 

Yeah, I can't help but wonder if the reason this change even occurred was due to devs not actually playing the class - if they did, they'd realize that this change makes mesmer - already one of the squishier classes - basically now just dead with some easy cc and condi application

It makes not dodging out of a CC ability FAR TOO punishing, while also removing one of the core aspects of its toolkit. I sincerely hope they decide to adjust talents elsewhere if they're worried about it being too strong, rather than going after it's core profession mechanic (dodging)