GW2Claims and GW2Skirmish - Tools for WvW

[ManiacMika.9851]

Hi there!

# https://gw2skirmish.github.io/gw2claims/

I have made an automatic listing of guilds sorted per team and per match.
It's looking periodically at the claims on all 4 maps and adds a score to the guild.
The higher the score, the higher on the list.
The reason is that there are a lot of casual guilds to be pushed at the bottom, while main WvW ones should appears towards the top.
If claims happen in different teams because the guild member is split, it will list that guild also in the other team, but with a smaller score.

Ctrl + F : [TALE]
I can see, in this moment,
24 claim score on 2-1 Green Skrittsburgh
59 claim score on 2-5 Red Dragon's Claw (main)

It's ugly and does not have a reset system implemented for Friday yet,
but that will be a problem for Later-Me
I hope this can be useful.
Let me know what you think of it,
and if you have any other idea for tools like this.

I'll eventually integrate it better with gw2skirmish,
it's already generated from the same script,
Wanted to have it out in the wild in time to be still relevant with the wvw beta

# https://gw2skirmish.github.io/

This is my attempt at visualizing the WvW score differently.
I was often wondering if we had already lost or won a match by Thursday but couldn't find the answer easily on other websites.
I have more ideas how to improve the readability for future updates.
Also thinking about implementing an Objective Advisor, that would analyze the current map and the score and give a recommendation on which structure to capture for efficient PPT. I'm sure I could also make it recommend to feed a certain opponent team to make the 3rd opponent lose more score.
And last feature I'm thinking of implementing in the future would be like a Media Player of the 4 maps, that would record any capture and would allow to review what happened during the night for example.

I'm using a Shell script to generate a simple static html page, because I love the blazingly speediness of it.
Also... I don't know how to code properly, so I'll probably learn Python at some point and rewrite it.
If you have any suggestion or wish to help, let me know 🙂

Have a good day!

Edited June 16, 2023 by ManiacMika.9851
Update URL link

[TheGrimm.5624]

Thanks! Does give an interesting view of the split of guilds across the matchups.

[blp.3489]

Perhaps I'm missing something but Giant's Rise, my beta world, isn't Red but is listed as so.

Seeing my guild scattered over many worlds in the listing, I was led to wonder if claims should be for your chosen WVW guild rather than the guild you are representing.

[ManiacMika.9851]

34 minutes ago, blp.3489 said:

Perhaps I'm missing something but Giant's Rise, my beta world, isn't Red but is listed as so.

Seeing my guild scattered over many worlds in the listing, I was led to wonder if claims should be for your chosen WVW guild rather than the guild you are representing.

That's interesting!
I'm a EU player, and this is one of my account,
on 2-3 Green Reaper's Corridor (world id 12012)
and we are facing 2-3 Red Giant's Rise (12011) and 2-3 Blue Grenth's Door (12015)
https://imgur.com/ZtnawMN

I have just found this picture that shows the NA teams, if it can be trusted:
https://imgur.com/FgCNZMl

I actually didn't know what the NA teams were named, so this is new for me. I'm a bit disappointed to see that they are the same names for EU and NA, as it creates more confusion compared to the older names.

Matches starting with 2- are EU.
Matches starting with 1- are NA.
You must be talking about 1-4 Blue Giant's Rise (world id 11011) vs 1-4 Green Thornwatch (11006) and 1-4 Red Griffonfall (11007)

As you can see NA new world ids are 110XX,
while EU new worlds ids are 120XX
In the old system, NA is 10XX
EU English is 20XX, French is 21XX, German is 22XX and Spanish is 23XX.
The new teams are 5 digits instead of 4 digits, as it adds a leading 1.

[Cyninja.2954]

Interesting.

First and only question:

Quote

563 Whiteside Ridge Intelligence [WSR]

How? Guild cap is supposed to be 500.

[ManiacMika.9851]

These numbers are "claim scores", to help show who is contributing to claiming objectives in the team.
(and helps to understand which team is the main one for a guild)
If you have a tower claimed on red map, and a camp on blue map, that's 2 claim scores.
I set the script to check the map every 5 min, like in-game tick, but that doesn't work as intended and instead it's checking every 15 min approximately.
So if you are still claiming those 2 objectives for 1 hour, maybe your guild claim score will be 8 (assuming a check every 15 min) or maybe 24 (if it works as intended every 5 min)

[Gotejjeken.1267]

Is there a way to put active guild size on there too?

As I run with DARK (Shattered Darkness) and its usually anywhere from 1-5 of us nightly; to see us that high on the rankings is fun since we are purely havoc.  But maybe that's why too because as havoc we're always moving from one obj to another, but I mentioned guild size as we obviously couldn't fend off or even fight a zerg.  

If there was a way to tell how many guild members were active in WvW it'd help a lot to organize upcoming alliances.  Because then you could ally with similar sized guilds or maybe a larger one would take on a smaller one if the smaller one is doing a ton of work in helping win the matchup.  

[Cyninja.2954]

10 hours ago, ManiacMika.9851 said:

These numbers are "claim scores", to help show who is contributing to claiming objectives in the team.
(and helps to understand which team is the main one for a guild)
If you have a tower claimed on red map, and a camp on blue map, that's 2 claim scores.
I set the script to check the map every 5 min, like in-game tick, but that doesn't work as intended and instead it's checking every 15 min approximately.
So if you are still claiming those 2 objectives for 1 hour, maybe your guild claim score will be 8 (assuming a check every 15 min) or maybe 24 (if it works as intended every 5 min)

Ah yes, makes a lot more sense. Should not have just skimmed over the lists.

Would be nice to have some sort of history too for past days. To have a general overview of how different active guilds are spread out. 

On occansional inspection, it seems each world has a mix of active guilds and bar some outliers, it seems rather well spread out for now. 

[Dawdler.8521]

10 hours ago, Gotejjeken.1267 said:

If there was a way to tell how many guild members were active in WvW it'd help a lot to organize upcoming alliances.  Because then you could ally with similar sized guilds or maybe a larger one would take on a smaller one if the smaller one is doing a ton of work in helping win the matchup.  

Tbh that part is on players to organize by talking to each other, not Anet. 

Its an interesting stat to see anyway, the flips.

[Gotejjeken.1267]

10 hours ago, Dawdler.8521 said:

Tbh that part is on players to organize by talking to each other, not Anet. 

Its an interesting stat to see anyway, the flips.

Right, but since this tool is player generated, I figured it'd be a good update for it. 

As right now if someone chose our guild by looking at that list and the number of flips we do, they may be surprised or frustrated that it isn't a huge guild but essentially a group of 5 carrying havoc.  

I guess an analogue would be a tool for kills by guild.  Such a tool may show a guild with a high number, but they may be on a certain server that likes to SMC/spawn camp and so would not reflect a 'fight guild' or similar that would be expected of such a tool.  

[Dawdler.8521]

19 minutes ago, Gotejjeken.1267 said:

As right now if someone chose our guild by looking at that list and the number of flips we do, they may be surprised or frustrated that it isn't a huge guild but essentially a group of 5 carrying havoc.  

Though I would think that if an alliance leader is interested in inviting a guild sight unseen from a list, the first question would be "how many are you"... especially since an invite would require that info due to assigned slots.

There are things you can be surprised/frustrated over being too small, but a guild really aint it.

[ManiacMika.9851]

On 6/14/2023 at 1:08 AM, Gotejjeken.1267 said:

Is there a way to put active guild size on there too?

[...] If there was a way to tell how many guild members were active in WvW it'd help a lot to organize upcoming alliances.  Because then you could ally with similar sized guilds or maybe a larger one would take on a smaller one if the smaller one is doing a ton of work in helping win the matchup.  

That would be nice, yeah!
But, I would need access to each player's API key for that. I'm not sure I want to do that.
https://gw2mists.com/leaderboards/guild
This website provides that kind of information.
You can register your guild there (guild leader has to register the guild, and each member has to register that guild as theirs).
This is my recommendation.

On 6/14/2023 at 11:54 AM, Dawdler.8521 said:

Its an interesting stat to see anyway, the flips.

Just for clarification, the claim score shown adds +1 every tick, so it's not exactly "flips". But I could re-code it that way. I was thinking of it. But I'm not sure it gives more information. Maybe you can only be considered active if you flip something, because you don't need to be online to hold something. Maybe I'll add both stats next week.

---

I have to reveal, to my own disappointment, that the app is not automated yet.
I have messed up something on GitHub Actions and sometimes it adds correctly the new data,
but then sometimes it would reload a previous state and enter a not-very-useful loop.
In the mean time, I am manually uploading online the correct data processed by my computer though.

[ManiacMika.9851]

https://gw2skirmish.github.io/gw2claims/ updated with next matches prediction for Europe
(I forgot NA, oops, will do later updated!)

NA 🇺🇸
Tier 1
🟩↘️ Dragon's Claw
🟦➡️ Skrittsburgh
🟥↗️ First Haven
Tier 2
🟩↘️ Phoenix Dawn
🟦➡️ Stonefall
🟥↗️ Moogooloo
Tier 3
🟩↘️ Seven Pines
🟦➡️ Titan's Staircase
🟥↗️ Giant's Rise
Tier 4
🟩↘️ Reaper's Corridor
🟦➡️ Thornwatch
🟥↗️ Griffonfall

EU 🇪🇺
Tier 1
🟩↘️ Stonefall  
🟦➡️ Skrittsburgh
🟥↗️ Moogooloo  
Tier 2
🟩↘️ Thornwatch   
🟦➡️ Fortune's Vale
🟥↗️ Grenth's Door  
Tier 3
🟩↘️ Titan's Staircase
🟦➡️ Reaper's Corridor
🟥↗️ Silent Woods      
Tier 4
🟩↘️ Giant's Rise
🟦➡️ Phoenix Dawn
🟥↗️ Griffonfall  
Tier 5
🟩↘️ First Haven
🟦➡️ Seven Pines   
🟥↗️ Dragon's Claw 🙂

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/872791478345281588/1119252536109572156/zYoPDQJuowAAAAASUVORK5CYII.png

Edited June 16, 2023 by ManiacMika.9851
Update with NA prediction

[Riba.3271]

This is cool. I wonder if lot of these claim scores are from inactive guilds having rarely flipping objectives claimed.

The matchup prediction doesn't make much sense tho, I thought whole idea of this beta test was for teams to go anew for 2nd week anyways?

Edit: Nvm, I was wrong

Edited June 16, 2023 by Riba.3271

[Dayra.7405]

17 minutes ago, Riba.3271 said:

Aren't teams going anew for 2nd week anyways?

No, they want to test if winner up/looser down works for alliances.

Edited June 16, 2023 by Dayra.7405

[Dawdler.8521]

48 minutes ago, Riba.3271 said:

This is cool. I wonder if lot of these claim scores are from inactive guilds having rarely flipping objectives claimed.

The score would heavily favor guilds that claim keeps on home border/EB and spawnside towers. More maps covered, more points. So inactive is a relative term. Often its the larger guilds that have them but they dont exactly need to work for a garri thats been held for 48h+.

Edited June 16, 2023 by Dawdler.8521

[ManiacMika.9851]

Above answer is super correct.

On the other hand, if you already have a Garrison T3 claimed, you won't claim anything ever on that map, even though your guild might be active.

Both methods of counting have their advantages and inconveniences.
I haven't worked on the Flip Score yet. I'm lazy 😞 and reset is soon for EU... I might just deal with it during weekend.

Any ways, those numbers aren't 100% reliable as it takes about 40 sec to process data, then script goes on sleep for 5 min before repeating, so it has a cycle that's longer than 5 min and I might miss a capture on rare occasions.
Also, it's relying on Anet's API to check the map, which sometimes it gets stuck for some reason.
Finally, since this script is run on my machine, I might stop it for some times while modifying the code.
But it gives a very good approximation (if your claim was not up while I was down, was it really a worthy contribution?)

[MedievalThings.5417]

Is the point of this to track a ktrain contest?  I guess I don't get it.  Claiming the most things per week seems like it would just show who doesn't defend, fights the most doors, or only zergs when no one else is on.

I mean, data points are cool and all, but I must be missing the point.

On a side note, I find it interesting that I was 18th in claims on my server, and I play solo.

Edited June 16, 2023 by Ubi.4136

[Mabi black.1824]

On 6/13/2023 at 6:21 PM, ManiacMika.9851 said:

The reason is that there are a lot of casual guilds to be pushed at the bottom, while main WvW ones should appears towards the top.

while I congratulate you for the work and the initiative you put here, in addition to the fact that new data and information of this type can be useful to users ;

I'm not sure why to put the random guilds down and put the WWW guilds up. or at least I don't quite understand what you mean. If my guild habitually plays WWW only 2 days a week, is it random? So you have to push it lower?

In addition, many players play for the server, often do not claim what they have taken. You reset an enemy T3 and got points for your server, this might be enough, and you start working on another objective.

Edited June 16, 2023 by Mabi black.1824

[ManiacMika.9851]

14 minutes ago, Ubi.4136 said:

Is the point of this to track a ktrain contest?  I guess I don't get it.  Claiming the most things per week seems like it would just show who doesn't defend, fights the most doors, or only zergs when no one else is on.

I mean, data points are cool and all, but I must be missing the point.

On a side note, I find it interesting that I was 18th in claims on my server, and I play solo.

At the first reset, people were wondering "which guilds are playing with me? which guilds are we facing", because you know when you'll have content if you have a Night guild for example. Or if there's a GvG guild around you can expect some good fights.

As said above, there's 2 ways of checking the claims: the held ones (like keep) and the flipped ones (like camps).
If you (alone) flips a lot of camps, you'll likely have +1 claim score per tick.
A guild that will stay Home border to defend its Garrison will also have only +1, since they hold the keep only on that map.
You will have contributed as much as that guild in "covering grounds" for your team in the mists (aka claimed territory).

22 minutes ago, Mabi black.1824 said:

I'm not sure why to put the random guilds down and put the WWW guilds up. or at least I don't quite understand what you mean. If my guild habitually plays WWW only 2 days a week, is it random? So you have to push it lower?

The first goal I had in mind, when making this tool, is to be able to share with others that "This Famous Guild" is with us and we could join their Discord to participate in their leads.
In EU Stonefall, Whiteside Ridge Intelligence has a strong presence, and according to the name, it's probably a large Community, Alliance-like guild.
If you play against them, you'll know that if you see one, the others might not be far, and you could set up a fight, or run for your life.
If you play with them, you might want to check if you can join their Discord, see how social they are, and maybe transfer server (or join their Alliance for the next Beta) if you prefer playing with a lot of people.

"Pushing lower" might not be the best words I should have used.
"Pushing higher guilds that are actively claiming objectives" (therefore showing an online presence) would be better explained.
Are you interested in joining that Solo In My Guild that plays WvW 30 min per week with a score of 2? Probably not.
Your guild that plays 2x a week probably claims enough structure to have like 100 Claim score. That's enough to get higher in the list, above the all the Solo Guilds with 1-3 points.
Yet your guild will likely be under a Community guild that provides near-24h entertainment, which would be more attractive for the majority with their 1000 Claim score.

It is not random: the more you do, the more you get.

[Mabi black.1824]

I now understand the intention better. A sort of legend to understand more quickly who you are playing against or with whom you are playing. 

[ManiacMika.9851]

I'm trying to redesign https://gw2skirmish.github.io/#w2013 to make it easier to understand the state of the match, with less weird numbers.
Numbers will be replaced by colourful bars and the whole ladder is visible.
The colour of the bar indicates which colour that team will be next week. (yellow is blue...)

If the meter is depleted, then that team is locked at 3rd place and goes tier-down.
If the meter is filled, then that team is locked at 1st place and goes tier-up.
The second place can only be determined once both the first and third place have been locked.

I am hesitant on 2 designs:

• sort the list by next week result (current victor is at the top)
  https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1122453115128524862/1122453215393370253/image.png
• sort the list by this week result (always green, blue, red)
  https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1122453115128524862/1122453315989557298/image.png

Any preference?
Or do you have other ideas to make look better, easier to read?

[Batdogi.7142]

I noticed on Lutgardis Conservatory NA 1-5 the primary guild I'm in,You See Nothing [boop], doesn't show up despite claiming and holding keeps on several maps for hours if not days at a time.  Even SMC for a couple of hours earlier this week.  on the other hand a basically dead guild [TRHN] I use simply to claim camps for +5 does show up.  Is this a bug or a feature?

 

[ManiacMika.9851]

4 hours ago, Batdogi.7142 said:

I noticed on Lutgardis Conservatory NA 1-5 the primary guild I'm in,You See Nothing [boop], doesn't show up ...

Such a fitting guild name. I booped Stories End [SE] link and found out that is your sneaky You See Nothing with an old name.
That is because I saved the name the first time I encountered that ID and never bothered checking if it's still the current name.
So you can consider this a bug (or missing feature).
I'll make it so that it will look for the info once a week, instead of once in a lifetime.
I'll also fix this one manually right now.
Thanks for the feedback!

[Batdogi.7142]

thanks!