Amateur balancing, you should be ashamed ANET

[Bladestrom.6425]

Ive played sceptre condy tempest for 2 years, its been a struggle but i got a build that works, and then the recent round of balancing to bring eles up to line.  Great i thought.

And what do i get?

My Sceptre went down from 870 to 87 dmg - WHAT THE ***

My secondary sustain went from a heal of 2k every 16 seconds to 1 heal every 30 seconds with a small chance i will get a 2 second aura. WHAT THE *** 

my signet of restoration also went up to once every 30 seconds WHAT THE *** 

if i go to Dagger off hand, you wrecked churning earth so it does 3.8 dmg over 8 seconds once every 20 seconds.  WHAT THE ****

effectively you destroyed several build due to your gross ignorance to everything bar some stupid meta CATA builds that this person CMC plays. 

great way to treat your customers. Furious.

[Dorsai.1458]

We're you this upset when ele as a class was buffed to godlike levels?

Cause only a fool would think fire scepter auto was fine and that aura spam (along with all the goodies that came with the aura) was fine.  Imagine if SPBs could get full counter from every push of a signet (without disabling the signets passive buffs....and can be cast while CC'ed ....).

Ele's have been enjoying the bloat for some time.  Time to adjust to mortal levels.

[Bladestrom.6425]

6 minutes ago, Dorsai.1458 said:

We're you this upset when ele as a class was buffed to godlike levels?

Cause only a fool would think fire scepter auto was fine and that aura spam (along with all the goodies that came with the aura) was fine.  Imagine if SPBs could get full counter from every push of a signet (without disabling the signets passive buffs....and can be cast while CC'ed ....).

Ele's have been enjoying the bloat for some time.  Time to adjust to mortal levels.

i was, they should never have buffed it like they did, and my build was nowhere near the meta builds.  Not every player is obsessed with playing the top broken build of the day.

Edited July 20, 2023 by vesica tempestas.1563

[Chyro.1462]

The point is, the nerfs are never directly aimed at the thing that is overperforming. They hit all the weaker less popular builds played by other specs too instead of just the spec where it overperforms. I can see how that is upsetting.

[Avead.5760]

1 hour ago, Dorsai.1458 said:

We're you this upset when ele as a class was buffed to godlike levels?

Cause only a fool would think fire scepter auto was fine and that aura spam (along with all the goodies that came with the aura) was fine.  Imagine if SPBs could get full counter from every push of a signet (without disabling the signets passive buffs....and can be cast while CC'ed ....).

Ele's have been enjoying the bloat for some time.  Time to adjust to mortal levels.

You really don't get it.. Let me explain this to you. X trait is buffed to ungodly levels of power. Several skills and traits from a set Y get the nerf hammer to compensate for the new level of power. They fail to compensate regardless so they also destroy original X trait. Every single non cata build that uses a skill from set Y is now unusable. The end! Is it clear now? Imagine if they never did that change and just nerfed power catalyst..

[soulknight.9620]

1 hour ago, Dorsai.1458 said:

We're you this upset when ele as a class was buffed to godlike levels?

Not everyone in the community is a tryhard OP build abuser. A lot of players play their prefered build/style which are not even close to being OP, but their build recieve nerfs for partially using "meta" build skills. Collateral damage... 

[DylanLucas.6058]

2 hours ago, Dorsai.1458 said:

We're you this upset when ele as a class was buffed to godlike levels?

Cause only a fool would think fire scepter auto was fine and that aura spam (along with all the goodies that came with the aura) was fine.  Imagine if SPBs could get full counter from every push of a signet (without disabling the signets passive buffs....and can be cast while CC'ed ....).

Ele's have been enjoying the bloat for some time.  Time to adjust to mortal levels.

Sorry but you must be the dumbest GW2 player I have encountered for a long time.

"godlike levels"?

Edited July 20, 2023 by DylanLucas.6058

[Bladestrom.6425]

55 minutes ago, soulknight.9620 said:

Not everyone in the community is a tryhard OP build abuser. A lot of players play their prefered build/style which are not even close to being OP, but their build recieve nerfs for partially using "meta" build skills. Collateral damage... 

Absolutely nailed it.  As a Lead software engineer that's been in the industry for 25 years I can tell you that the PRIMARY requirement for making changes to existing systems is high quality objective Impact Analysis.  I have a super high regard for ANET, their software is high quality, but the recent changes reeks of unqualified decisions and borderline hacking quite frankly.  Small changes often and fast, not this embarrassing nonsense that is actually impacting their customers enjoyment of their product.

 

To add one of the other reason i'm livid is that i spent a lot of time investing in getting a legendary sceptre skin, including spending money to support the game.  All that just went down the drain.

Edited July 20, 2023 by vesica tempestas.1563

[Bladestrom.6425]

to put things into perspective:

Issue : Cata was broken:

Today :

Cata Hammer auto attack does 955 condy dmg + 240 strike every 1/2 seconds for a condy build. A CATA only weapon.

Sceptre now does 84?!!!!! strike dmg every 3/4 of a second and ZERO ?!!!! condy dmg for a condy build (do they know people move?)  A core weapon.

just lost for words at the incompetence.

Edited July 20, 2023 by vesica tempestas.1563

[Gendalfs.7521]

I boosted a Tempest and its very enjoyable class overall (in PVE) full exo cele gear ofc, but strike dmg is kittenning. 

Im playing ele for just about 4 days and starting to like/hate this class. Cannot give full review of it, but its fun, but also quite hard.

Thou I need to admit Turai Ossa I beat on my Rifle Mech 😄

1 hour ago, vesica tempestas.1563 said:

Not everyone in the community is a tryhard OP build abuser. A lot of players play their prefered build/style which are not even close to being OP, but their build recieve nerfs for partially using "meta" build skills. Collateral damage... 

I dont think Anet should balance classes around 1-5% players, but thats my take on things. I also hate Mech being nerfed because some encounters in some game modes....

[Dorsai.1458]

4 hours ago, Avead.5760 said:

You really don't get it.. Let me explain this to you. X trait is buffed to ungodly levels of power. Several skills and traits from a set Y get the nerf hammer to compensate for the new level of power. They fail to compensate regardless so they also destroy original X trait. Every single non cata build that uses a skill from set Y is now unusable. The end! Is it clear now? Imagine if they never did that change and just nerfed power catalyst..

Oh I get it.  I was just refuting the person who thought no nerfs were required.  I don't like the way they nerfed ele this patch.  If anything, it looks like it hurts fresh air more than signet.  The way these nerfs were implemented nerfed other ele specs more than cata.

[soulknight.9620]

12 hours ago, vesica tempestas.1563 said:

Sceptre now does 84?!!!!! strike dmg every 3/4 of a second and ZERO ?!!!!

Agreed, this is outrageous! Its just too much, a solid 50% dmg nerf is required asap!

[RazieL.5684]

54 minutes ago, soulknight.9620 said:

Agreed, this is outrageous! Its just too much, a solid 50% dmg nerf is required asap!

just... don't.... don't even joke about it... cuz they are gonna do it...

[soulknight.9620]

5 minutes ago, RazieL.5684 said:

just... don't.... don't even joke about it... cuz they are gonna do it...

Let em come! Do it! I believe as an ele main player i developed a masochist trait! Hurt me more CMC! 

[Bizgurk.5639]

On 7/20/2023 at 6:22 PM, vesica tempestas.1563 said:

 and then the recent round of balancing to bring eles up to line.  Great i thought.

The change to Written in Stone, which caused Signets to apply Auras, wasn't meant to be a balancing change for Pvp. They only had Pve in mind, not thinking about what they're about to create in terms of Pvp. Every rework of traits, skills, gear etc. we had during the past few years was done with the sole purpose of Pve. They don't care about Pvp anymore, they just tune down those changes in Pvp shortly after. So it was clear from the very beginning of those changes what's going to happen.

 

On 7/20/2023 at 6:22 PM, vesica tempestas.1563 said:

effectively you destroyed several build due to your gross ignorance to everything bar some stupid meta CATA builds that this person CMC plays.

I agree with you, but need to add something: They destroyed several "PVP" builds, which isn't much of an issue to them, since they don't care about Pvp anymore.

[Barabbas.8715]

Anet wouldn't know how to balance even if a Kodan explained it to them.

[Serephen.3420]

Just change the signet aura trait to be fire auras in pvp only and revert some of the other nerfs. Solves a bunch of problems.

[Fearless.3569]

Not going to lie, as a mage-at-heart player, I've been skipping out on the entire MMO genre for the past 2 weeks. I've been playing Singleplayer games like Skyrim SE/AE with AI and behavioral mod packs. It pretty much feels like I'm PvPing in the MMOs while playing the singleplayer games that have AI support. The NPCs actually have personalities thanks to the AI and behavioral mod packs. They are a serious threat, and in some case, actually outsmart and kill my character. Of course, I make sure to dial the difficulty settings to the max and turn on survival mode. Now I can actually be immersed while playing a mage that has power but can still be defeated. 

 

THANK YOU, Artificial Intelligence developers. You have pretty much saved me from the sadness of being forced to play a weak mage. I guess the days are pretty numbered for the MMORPG genre. More so, as more and more people figure out that they can get better fights and interactions in moddable singleplayer or co-op RPGs that have AI support. Even more so as we move forward towards commercialized generalized AI. 

Ok rant is done, carry on! You people can keep being sad that you have to play a bummed out weak version of a magic caster.

[ArthurDent.9538]

On 7/20/2023 at 1:15 PM, Chyro.1462 said:

The point is, the nerfs are never directly aimed at the thing that is overperforming. They hit all the weaker less popular builds played by other specs too instead of just the spec where it overperforms. I can see how that is upsetting.

People could say this about the changes no matter what was actually changed. For example if they focused more on nerfing cata traits harder and laid off core more there would be people complaining about how they nerfed poor hammer cata, or there would be people coming out asking why they nerfed their poor beloved heal catalyst build. All the weaker less popular builds will share aspects with the meta builds and typically those aspects will be the strongest parts of the class which is why everyone is taking them; collateral damage to all the random snowflake builds people come up with is inevitable and acceptable. With that being said, the changes do feel sloppy and lack any real sort of intentional design other than bring down signet cata so it stops people from quitting the game. CMC has hopefully learned his lesson being forced to butcher his beloved elementalist with rushed emergency fixes because he couldn't see how obviously broken the monstrosity he created was.

[Mell.4873]

These changes only really affect PvP so it isn't that bad. Don't worry Elementalist no matter the Specialization is still very Strong.

[Bladestrom.6425]

9 hours ago, Mell.4873 said:

These changes only really affect PvP so it isn't that bad. Don't worry Elementalist no matter the Specialization is still very Strong.

that's the whole point, they badly effect PVP, and that includes people who PVE and PVP.  For example NONE of the following are very strong as you put it, in fact they are now unplayable:

- CORE Condy Sceptre /off  Focus/ off Warhorn/ offDagger  - was never meta to start, but was viable with 4 or 5 build variations.  Now unusable.

- TEMPEST Condy Sceptre /off Focus/off Warhorn/off Dagger  - was never meta to start, but was viable with 4 or 5 build variations now unusable

- WEAVER Condy Sceptre /off Focus/ off Warhorn/ off Dagger  - was never meta to start, but was viable with 4 or 5 build variations now unusable

ANET could have summarised their hacks with:

'To counteract our recent patches that broke CATA we have made further changes that has removed sceptre as the only viable ranged weapon in PVP '   

Edited July 24, 2023 by vesica tempestas.1563

[Helgaley.3619]

On 7/20/2023 at 10:15 AM, Chyro.1462 said:

The point is, the nerfs are never directly aimed at the thing that is overperforming. They hit all the weaker less popular builds played by other specs too instead of just the spec where it overperforms. I can see how that is upsetting.

I agree. It also ends up sucking the fun out of the less popular builds and makes it to where you are essentially punished for not playing the popular build that arguably isn't popular because it's fun, but because it's the only viable build left. I'm at the point where, as a result of their profession balance and design decisions, the professions feel so unsatisfying to play that I haven't played for weeks now. 

I would like to experience the content that is currently in the game and learn about the lore in the first mini expac, but if the vehicles through which I experience that content are just fundamentally not fun or satisfying to play, then I am just not going to play the game at all. 

I feel like a broken record about this, but what I really don't get is why they are so bad at profession balance and design, especially since the EOD specializations were revealed. I get that they probably don't have the time and resources to make the big redesigns a lot of players may be hoping for, but is it really that hard to just tweak the numbers on underutilized weapons to make them more viable or remove smaller mechanics that add nothing fun or satisfying to a profession? And yes, I'm looking at you catalyst sphere energy mechanic. 

[Flowki.7194]

On 7/24/2023 at 8:37 AM, Mell.4873 said:

These changes only really affect PvP so it isn't that bad. Don't worry Elementalist no matter the Specialization is still very Strong.

That isnt true at all. Condi hybrid tempest was the only support build in the game that was tolerable to play. If your teammates were more newb, you could carry (to a point), if your team mates were good, you could still support. It was not as optimal as staff with a good team.. but we all know thats not how matchmaking works. In reality, you end up with a newb team every other game on staff, and you are then just a spectator with no damage. You can not staff support carry dps who don't know how to use their own mitigation or burst windows/attacking the same target etc. The hybrid temepst build was not meta, becuase it was not optimal at the highest level play, nobody complained about me playing it in ranked for months. That spec is now dead, power does not work.. becuase temepst team support lines simply favour condi.. but now their is no condi. If you go power tempest, you lose team support, and at that point you mightaswell just go power cata. Power cata also took nerfs, its a high skill floor spec with a high ceiling and is very punishing for mistakes. So in reality, power cata makes even less sense for the average player after it also took some significant nerfs. I can't justify the effort to player power cata now, not when you have specs doing similar or more damage/sustain for half the effort. Weaver is the same, a lot of effort and added complexity for mediocre damage. Only die hard ele mains will remain, and ranked will then have more specs that are far more annoying to face than ele, just wait and see o0.

 

I know this will happen becuase ele is a high skill floor class, yet all of its specs now are less effective, leaving you feel its simply not worth the effort. As I pointed out with staff temepst, most who have not tried it, will play it for a little, and then realise the issues I pointed out above. Their is no good alternative now, so the only real option is to move on to another class.. again the effort to reward is just not there now. With less tempests in the game, a lot of people seem to think thats a good thing... until they realise that tempests kept a lot of high damage specs in check. Do look out for rangers spamming you with 30k burst from 1200.. you'll see a lot more of that in good time. Unless ofc they revert the absolute overkill nerfs to scepter.. so that tempest is actually playable in this RNG matchmaking system.

Edited July 28, 2023 by Flowki.7194

[Arheundel.6451]

On 7/24/2023 at 8:37 AM, Mell.4873 said:

These changes only really affect PvP so it isn't that bad. Don't worry Elementalist no matter the Specialization is still very Strong.

The PvP changes didn't completely destroy ele, threads like these are grossly overeactions for nothing really. Ele was toned down to expected levels, anybody else claiming otherwise is obviously out of touch with reality. It cannot be ignored how much CMC did for ele, the class was literally in the lowest levels of the gutter before CMC came along...he has revamped entire weapon sets, skills and utilities left untouched by uncaring devs since 2013...and for ele community to say anything but :"Thank You CMC for everything"...it's really bad taste and let you realize how out of depth is the MMO playerbase these days

[Arheundel.6451]

On 7/24/2023 at 5:41 PM, vesica tempestas.1563 said:

that's the whole point, they badly effect PVP, and that includes people who PVE and PVP.  For example NONE of the following are very strong as you put it, in fact they are now unplayable:

- CORE Condy Sceptre /off  Focus/ off Warhorn/ offDagger  - was never meta to start, but was viable with 4 or 5 build variations.  Now unusable.

- TEMPEST Condy Sceptre /off Focus/off Warhorn/off Dagger  - was never meta to start, but was viable with 4 or 5 build variations now unusable

- WEAVER Condy Sceptre /off Focus/ off Warhorn/ off Dagger  - was never meta to start, but was viable with 4 or 5 build variations now unusable

ANET could have summarised their hacks with:

'To counteract our recent patches that broke CATA we have made further changes that has removed sceptre as the only viable ranged weapon in PVP '   

That's simply untrue...current scepter is anything but unplayable..dunno you but killing people with the auto-attack is nothing short of broken and claiming otherwise is truly something