Runes of the Trapper are a problem in PvP

[Seventh Ranger.3968]

We've all seen tons of people using them, and I think most of us can agree they create annoying balance issues by giving a ton of free stealth to classes or builds that weren't meant to have lots of stealth in the first place. Fighting a Guardian or Ranger shouldn't feel like fighting a Thief. Guardian in particular gets a ton of extra survivability from it on top of all the defense and healing they already have. Does anyone else feel differently, or is this a common opinion?

[Endorphin.9147]

They are not a problem. They are a solution. 

[thc enjoyer.4976]

Of all the unbalance I gotta say trapper is closer to stealths general field of game-breakedness which I put 2 tiers under pig maul and 1 tier under bladesworn as a class. 

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

I feel like dh would fall apart without them. Ranger has options but theyre def necessary for DH in its current form. 

Edited August 5, 2023 by Azure The Heartless.3261

[Seventh Ranger.3968]

3 minutes ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

I feel like dh would fall apart without them. Rangee has options but theyre def necessary for DH in its current form. 

That's debatable. DH still has stupidly massive damage and fantastic cc. I think it would be perfectly fine without trapper runes on top of that.

[Eddie.9143]

No class other than thief should be balanced around or have multiple ways to access stealth

 

Also retargetting is bs, I shouldn't have to tab target or click you every time you stealth, the target should stay 

Edited August 4, 2023 by Eddie.9143
Word

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

Just now, Seventh Ranger.3968 said:

That's debatable. DH still has stupidly massive damage and fantastic cc. I think it would be perfectly fine without trapper runes on top of that.

Those things have to land and they all take 3 years to do so.  The repositioning is important.

[Bazsi.2734]

This will become a non-issue once the new X-pac drops, because the 6th effects will be decoupled from runes. I can't wait for all the broken relic effects though...(stealth on X usage will surely make its comeback, maybe on multiple offenders) so anyway this problem won't get fixed, and it won't need to be in a month or so, also we will have much bigger problems due to an inevitable balance apolcalypse.

[Balsa.3951]

yep DH has lets be generous 12k hp

if i had no stealth im dead. they are condi and be used in a power build. that shows u how desperate DH are.

also they stealth is very short its more a way to loose be target for a moment but nothing to be able to get out of outnumbered situations. I would love use other runes but not enough hp .

 

will Trapper rumes become op in Soto. prob not bcs soto brings better runes/ relics 

[Balsa.3951]

7 minutes ago, Eddie.9143 said:

No class other than thief should be balanced around or have multiple ways to access it. 

 

Also retargetting is bs, I shouldn't have to tab target or click you every time you stealth, the target should stay 

i agree on the dmg but curious which part is the great cc? i can only think of longbow 5 skill 3 is really hard to land.

im open for anet give DH 8k more base  hp and delete the Trapper rune

Edited August 4, 2023 by Balsa.3951

[Eddie.9143]

4 minutes ago, Balsa.3951 said:

i agree on the dmg but curious which part is the great cc? i can only think of longbow 5 skill 3 is really hard to land.

im open for anet give DH 8k more base  hp and delete the Trapper rune

I have no problem with DH getting more base hp, killing trapper rune, and lowering DH damage. Anet will do none of these.

 

Instead they will add more access to stealth for every class in soo.

[Balsa.3951]

4 minutes ago, Eddie.9143 said:

I have no problem with DH getting more base hp, killing trapper rune, and lowering DH damage. Anet will do none of these.

 

Instead they will add more access to stealth for every class in soo.

they already showed a AOE pull. I can already see how strong this will be for a full trap dh build 😜

[Saiyan.1704]

29 minutes ago, Eddie.9143 said:

Also retargetting is bs, I shouldn't have to tab target or click you every time you stealth, the target should stay 

Sorry but this is a huge L2P issue on your behalf... go to your keybinds and keybind Select Nearest Enemy to a key. One button press when he appears and you'll select him. Or just get good at left clicking like every other gamer...

I don't mind the cut-back to stealth but you better give the 11k hp DH, double the Superspeed so they're not completely worthless in Ranked.. lol.

[Eddie.9143]

5 minutes ago, Saiyan.1704 said:

Sorry but this is a huge L2P issue on your behalf... go to your keybinds and keybind Select Nearest Enemy to a key. One button press when he appears and you'll select him. Or just get good at left clicking like every other gamer...

I don't mind the cut-back to stealth but you better give the 11k hp DH, double the Superspeed so they're not completely worthless in Ranked.. lol.

Just lower the CD leap of faith. It's not a l2p issue. Retargetting is ridic. 

[Eddie.9143]

25 minutes ago, Balsa.3951 said:

they already showed a AOE pull. I can already see how strong this will be for a full trap dh build 😜

Can't wait for 5v5s with 10 players with aoe pull lmao 🤣

[bethekey.8314]

3 hours ago, Balsa.3951 said:

yep DH has lets be generous 12k hp

DH chooses* to have 12k HP, to do 8k trap and 9k true shot wombo combos.

3 hours ago, Balsa.3951 said:

if i had no stealth im dead.

Except for, you know, the Scrapper-level superspeed, the stability+mobility+cleanse+heal+stunbreak overloaded Virtue 3, great condition defense with Resolution, multiple Aegis sources,  multiple Prot sources, multiple teleports (with sword/JI), multiple blocks (sword, shield)...all coupled with the invuln + recharge everything elite.

I've done much more with much less.

Edited August 5, 2023 by bethekey.8314

[Eddie.9143]

38 minutes ago, bethekey.8314 said:

DH chooses* to have 12k HP, to do 8k trap and 9k true shot wombo combos.

Except for, you know, the Scrapper-level superspeed, the stability+mobility+cleanse+heal+stunbreak overloaded Virtue 3, great condition defense with Resolution, multiple Aegis sources,  multiple Prot sources, multiple teleports (with sword/JI), multiple blocks (sword, shield)...all coupled with the invuln + recharge everything elite.

I've done much more with much less.

Anyone saying DH with trapper rune is okay hasn't fought a good one that plays to win, even if it's lame

[Saiyan.1704]

17 minutes ago, Eddie.9143 said:

Anyone saying DH with trapper rune is okay hasn't fought a good one that plays to win, even if it's lame

This thread is becoming a bigger meme than it original started, I'm about to ask what yalls ratings are.

You're asking for nerfs towards a side-node duelist class that's not even meta in Plat1+, nor AT's unless people are memeing around, all because you can't beat a DH 1v1.

1 second worth of stealth on a single trap isn't what's beating yall... it's the fact you're being outplayed by a good DH that's clearly a higher rank than you. A good DE that stealths and CC every half second is eons more problematic that a DH with limited stealths.. all because you cant select a target that's right in front of you.

If yall can't select a target At Will then how in the world do you guys select a target in mid fights..? Let alone selecting a target immediately when getting plus 1'd? Every single game I play, on every engagement, I'm clicking on targets left and right. It's second nature.

[Balsa.3951]

1 hour ago, bethekey.8314 said:

DH chooses* to have 12k HP, to do 8k trap and 9k true shot wombo combos.

Except for, you know, the Scrapper-level superspeed, the stability+mobility+cleanse+heal+stunbreak overloaded Virtue 3, great condition defense with Resolution, multiple Aegis sources,  multiple Prot sources, multiple teleports (with sword/JI), multiple blocks (sword, shield)...all coupled with the invuln + recharge everything elite.

I've done much more with much less.

u mean DH just choose wrong? I guess other classes choosing better hp to do even more dmg burst?

never knew there is a amulet with that amazing hp 

what are u talking multiple teleport with sword???

 

Edited August 5, 2023 by Balsa.3951

[MedievalThings.5417]

This won't be a problem in 18 days when they take the 6th bonus from us.

[bethekey.8314]

2 hours ago, Balsa.3951 said:

u mean DH just choose wrong? I guess other classes choosing better hp to do even more dmg burst?

I just wouldn't phrase my survival as hinging on stealths alone, due to an HP pool that can very much be influenced. That's disingenuous. You actually have many defenses already, especially for a bursty build. Like protection/resolution/aegis, heavy armor is built into Guardian to help offset the lower HP pool.

What builds, that aren't already called out as OP, are putting up similar 8-10k numbers with more defense? Note I said defense, not just HP lol.

2 hours ago, Balsa.3951 said:

what are u talking multiple teleport with sword???

I said with sword and Judge's Intervention (JI), as an example. I'm just looking at a standard metabattle DH build. I'm sure other options are available to trade teleport for more damage/defense etc.

[Balsa.3951]

2 hours ago, bethekey.8314 said:

I just wouldn't phrase my survival as hinging on stealths alone, due to an HP pool that can very much be influenced. That's disingenuous. You actually have many defenses already, especially for a bursty build. Like protection/resolution/aegis, heavy armor is built into Guardian to help offset the lower HP pool.

What builds, that aren't already called out as OP, are putting up similar 8-10k numbers with more defense? Note I said defense, not just HP lol.

I said with sword and Judge's Intervention (JI), as an example. I'm just looking at a standard metabattle DH build. I'm sure other options are available to trade teleport for more damage/defense etc.

u miss the point

it was asked to remove Trapper rune and i said ok but give guard 8k hp more.

u can try urself play dh without Trapper and see how long u survive with this great multitudes of defense skills.

u will notice DH cant escape a loosing fight

[Myror.7521]

Letz say it like this. They could have simply added something like superspeed or more Balanced swiftness on trab use and remove trab rune. But nope just a whole class mechanic on rune is for sure stupid and should not be a thing at all

[Eddie.9143]

13 hours ago, Saiyan.1704 said:

This thread is becoming a bigger meme than it original started, I'm about to ask what yalls ratings are.

You're asking for nerfs towards a side-node duelist class that's not even meta in Plat1+, nor AT's unless people are memeing around, all because you can't beat a DH 1v1.

1 second worth of stealth on a single trap isn't what's beating yall... it's the fact you're being outplayed by a good DH that's clearly a higher rank than you. A good DE that stealths and CC every half second is eons more problematic that a DH with limited stealths.. all because you cant select a target that's right in front of you.

If yall can't select a target At Will then how in the world do you guys select a target in mid fights..? Let alone selecting a target immediately when getting plus 1'd? Every single game I play, on every engagement, I'm clicking on targets left and right. It's second nature.

I'm clicking shi like crazy too with yolo mouse, so many ridic animations that clutter the screen and then other powerful attacks with 0 animation. Big joke 

Edited August 5, 2023 by Eddie.9143
Word

[doozer.7063]

16 hours ago, Saiyan.1704 said:

This thread is becoming a bigger meme than it original started, I'm about to ask what yalls ratings are.

You're asking for nerfs towards a side-node duelist class that's not even meta in Plat1+, nor AT's unless people are memeing around, all because you can't beat a DH 1v1.

1 second worth of stealth on a single trap isn't what's beating yall... it's the fact you're being outplayed by a good DH that's clearly a higher rank than you. A good DE that stealths and CC every half second is eons more problematic that a DH with limited stealths.. all because you cant select a target that's right in front of you.

If yall can't select a target At Will then how in the world do you guys select a target in mid fights..? Let alone selecting a target immediately when getting plus 1'd? Every single game I play, on every engagement, I'm clicking on targets left and right. It's second nature.

What ppl always fail to understand is, that just because something is not meta doesn't mean it is healthy design: In particular in a game insanely powercreeped and bad balanced as GW2 you have a lot of unhealthy and actually op stuff not meta, just because there is some even more broken stuff to abuse. The moment the most broken stuff gets nerfed the next best broken stuff will instantly become a problem.

I think traps as existing in current state are in general a bad design choice for competitive modes. Everything buffing them no matter in which way is bad. In addition is it obviously not a good idead to give stealth to classes which have no or very low amount of stealth by basic design for good reasons. 

Superspeed just as Quickness are also way too omnipresent in the game already and should not be available on runes/ relicts.