Nerf Guardian , elementalist and necromancer.

[Serephen.3420]

On 12/9/2023 at 5:57 PM, Sansar.1302 said:

Yes i play ranger , no it dont play Long bow ( not the last 3 years )

Yes i play a bit with main hand axe ( but not only that )

Willbender,  Harbinger and Catalysts have to much inbuilt defence an sustain in wvw

This is a wvw only isue as in spvp they are actualy quite ballanced (habinger and willbender migth even need a little buff in spvp)

The reason is that stats in spvp is way more resticted than in wvw.

There are other strong builds in wvw too but they dont reatch the op state that these 3 do( druid, thief , scrapper , vidicator )

Been a long while since there have been any focus on wvw in the patches.

Been playing a lot of catalyst myself bc it is fun to be that powerfull and melt 2-3 ppl at once but i dont think it is good for the game.

If you knew how to play catalyst then you'd know how to beat it too. It's certainly not unkillable by any means. It suffers from hogh burst spikes like most other ele specs do as well, and it suffers a lot from chill. The one condition that cripples most eles. (Poison is solid too). 

[Sansar.1302]

50 minutes ago, Serephen.3420 said:

If you knew how to play catalyst then you'd know how to beat it too. It's certainly not unkillable by any means. It suffers from hogh burst spikes like most other ele specs do as well, and it suffers a lot from chill. The one condition that cripples most eles. (Poison is solid too). 

Yes knowing it helps , but not as much when the spec is this overtuned.

Edited December 10, 2023 by Sansar.1302
bad spelling

[Doggie.3184]

On 12/8/2023 at 6:02 AM, SirDoNKeY.4578 said:

What did elementalist do that requires a nerf?

Their Downed state too OP

[Sansar.1302]

These classes is so op that it ruins guild wars 2

[Sirvaleen.1379]

There are catas left in WvW ? Only see tempests lately... though imho the "pests" part atm belong in full to some willies. So really, that thread's title looks wrong on so many levels..

On another note, seeing scrapper and vindi put in the same category killed my eyebrows. Not nice.

[Sansar.1302]

2 hours ago, Sirvaleen.1379 said:

There are catas left in WvW ? Only see tempests lately... though imho the "pests" part atm belong in full to some willies. So really, that thread's title looks wrong on so many levels..

On another note, seeing scrapper and vindi put in the same category killed my eyebrows. Not nice.

Scrapper and vindicator certainly is strong but I would not label them op

[Serephen.3420]

1 hour ago, Sansar.1302 said:

Scrapper and vindicator certainly is strong but I would not label them op

Most common roamers are still rangers and thieves, with a sprinkle of mesmers and the occasional willbender. The rest I hardly see, though I have noticed an increase in beserkers lately which is surprising. 

I just think you still lack experience so it's easier to just label classes which usually bring counters to common ranger and thief builds as op to you. 

Don't worry as you gain experience and expand your skillset it'll get easier to deal with.

[Sansar.1302]

20 hours ago, Serephen.3420 said:

Most common roamers are still rangers and thieves, with a sprinkle of mesmers and the occasional willbender. The rest I hardly see, though I have noticed an increase in beserkers lately which is surprising. 

I just think you still lack experience so it's easier to just label classes which usually bring counters to common ranger and thief builds as op to you. 

Don't worry as you gain experience and expand your skillset it'll get easier to deal with.

Been playing solo roamer for over a decade now. 

[SeTect.5918]

2 hours ago, Sansar.1302 said:

Been playing solo roamer for over a decade now. 

You may want to collect 2-3 more decades worth of experience then.

Seriously tho. Druid is one of the better builds for roaming currently. It has the ability to keep up with cata, willbender and harbinger pretty well. 

Yet you complain about catalyst, willbender and harbinger being too op, but you are saying devs hate ranger in wvw. 

 

 

Seems like a typical "nerf everything but buff my class"-case.

Edited December 12, 2023 by SeTect.5918

[Sansar.1302]

46 minutes ago, SeTect.5918 said:

You may want to collect 2-3 more decades worth of experience then.

Seriously tho. Druid is one of the better builds for roaming currently. It has the ability to keep up with cata, willbender and harbinger pretty well. 

Yet you complain about catalyst, willbender and harbinger being too op, but you are saying devs hate ranger in wvw. 

 

 

Seems like a typical "nerf everything but buff my class"-case.

You know that ranger have been nerfed in 5 patches in row now? , and while Druid certainly is quite decent in solo roaming it can't compete with those three specs.

After those specs are nerfed they should look at other strong specs and if they do maby we finally can get some build variety again. 

Why not strive towards actually having decent ballance. 

Edited December 12, 2023 by Sansar.1302
Bad spelling

[Jedrik.3109]

Are we really talking about solo wvw roaming balance? And my boy is complaining that ranger isn't strong? After how many years of pew pew slb?

.....

Sir.

[Obtena.7952]

7 hours ago, Jedrik.3109 said:

Are we really talking about solo wvw roaming balance? And my boy is complaining that ranger isn't strong? After how many years of pew pew slb?

.....

Sir.

Someone just wants easy wins. 

[Nokaon.4603]

the only thing i see needing nerfs in this thread is Harbinger

why? they can run bloodmagic+deathmagic and still get a crapton of dps thanks to their elite while having perma 5-10k barrier, im talking about roaming in wvw ofc

if a full zerk+devastation vindicator can't as much as scratch a bloodnecro, then its a problem, they legit get rewarded for doing nothing special, while the rest of us need to bleed our fingers out to win (which is impossible vs a necro main)

 

And yes im a vindi main, and i'd gladly take a salvation nerf if it means in return necros cant spec full support and still win.

Edited December 13, 2023 by Nokaon.4603

[Dadnir.5038]

2 hours ago, Nokaon.4603 said:

why? they can run bloodmagic+deathmagic and still get a crapton of dps thanks to their elite while having perma 5-10k barrier, im talking about roaming in wvw ofc

I do believe that you don't quite understand where the harbinger's sustain come from as such barrier numbers on harbinger are unrealistic.

That said, the health pool reduction from blight seem to fit perfectly this range of number and is something that the harbinger is encouraged to maintain through the fight. 😉

You're pointing out at "support" but those harbingers that give you a hard time probably don't use blood magic but curse instead and Death magic isn't a "support" specialization. You're pointing out at barrier but the sustain probably come from the heal over time per blight stack and % of outgoing condition damage done as health from parasitic contagion in the curse traitline (which is a "dps" traitline).

The Harbingers get rewarded from reducing their max health pool and applying many conditions on their foes. Nothing special.

Edited December 13, 2023 by Dadnir.5038

[Nokaon.4603]

26 minutes ago, Dadnir.5038 said:

I do believe that you don't quite understand where the harbinger's sustain come from as such barrier numbers on harbinger are unrealistic.

That said, the health pool reduction from blight seem to fit perfectly this range of number and is something that the harbinger is encouraged to maintain through the fight. 😉

You're pointing out at "support" but those harbingers that give you a hard time probably don't use blood magic but curse instead and Death magic isn't a "support" specialization. You're pointing out at barrier but the sustain probably come from the heal over time per blight stack and % of outgoing condition damage done as health from parasitic contagion in the curse traitline (which is a "dps" traitline).

The Harbingers get rewarded from reducing their max health pool and applying many conditions on their foes. Nothing special.

im a roamer main so i understand perfectly how good harb is in roaming terms, the barrier managing is stupid easy to do, lets not try and be dishonest here, harb's currently the most hated spec next to dagger mirage because harbs in its current state is 2-3x tankier than a core necro.

also the health pool reduction has no difference whatsoever if you're running bloodbank, to put this into perspective a harb using bloodbank+deathmagic can 1v3 people, without it he can be downed in a 1v1, pm me in game i'll show you how stupid easy it is to maintain constant barrier with harb, in fact if you run blood it removes blight management as a whole, you get rewarded the more stack of blight you got (1k heals per second passively at 25 then even more if you can apply damage) so by kiting well enough the hp screen could say you got 18k health, but in reality you got 40-50k because the barrier keeps stacking and stacking nonstop

and in the regards of it being support traits, deathmagic applies carapace which gives you a crapton of toughness, then you have mass cleansing while in shroud, combine this with bloodmagic which is used for support scourges, they shouldn't have a consistent dps output when they can be as tanky as i would be with full minstrel, so yes in a sense its ''support'' 

you don't see elementalists obliterating people low effort while using water+arcane, so why should necros with blood+dm?

 

Edited December 13, 2023 by Nokaon.4603

[Dadnir.5038]

21 minutes ago, Nokaon.4603 said:

pm me in game i'll show you how stupid easy it is to maintain constant barrier with harb, in fact if you run blood it removes blight management as a whole, you get rewarded the more stack of blight you got (1k heals per second passively at 25 then even more if you can apply damage)

Before suggesting me to pm you in game you should just check your fact right.

[Nokaon.4603]

13 minutes ago, Dadnir.5038 said:

Before suggesting me to pm you in game you should just check your fact right.

if you're too scared to be proven wrong just say so, or perhaps you already knew this and you're trying to defend your class that you know is op in hopes people would not catch on  that it is by discrediting any attempts to shed light on it in hopes it won't get nerfed.

have a nice day.

Edited December 13, 2023 by Nokaon.4603

[SeTect.5918]

3 hours ago, Nokaon.4603 said:

you get rewarded the more stack of blight you got (1k heals per second passively at 25 then even more if you can apply damage) so by kiting well enough the hp screen could say you got 18k health, but in reality you got 40-50k because the barrier keeps stacking and stacking nonstop

You know what I hate the most about the forum? Everyone keeps calling out random numbers to prove their points but dont prove where the numbers are coming from.

25 blight stacks give 1k hp each sec? 

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PS0Ao+plhyAZZsLWLWMTQxXA-D2IY1oj/QyRE0lEIQFgCPGUkgYH8Wc9TDA-w

I would say calculate it yourself but i ll do it for you. 

Thats 789 healing power because of blood magic. If you hover over the blight it says "22¾" hp each sec for each stack. So lets just take 23 hp per stack. 23 x 25 = 575 on 25 stacks. 575 is somewhat the half of what you said. 

You also need perma 25 blight for that. Shroud 3 and 4 both consume 5 blight per cast. The blight generation in shroud is 1 stack per second. 

You would probably need to run 4-5 elexirs to keep 25 stacks up perm. 

 

Additionally you seem to be a Fan of death magic + blood magic. So your only passive healing is basically blight and the minimal from life transfer of blood magic. 

But i ll be generous, lets just say..however..you heal 1500 per second (Basically the double of what you should normally do with both perm 25 blight (very unrealistic) and blood magic).

Now lets take a look aaat barrier: https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Barrier

"Barrier disappears 5 seconds after being applied."

Hm...so with 1500 hp per Sec, your max is 7500...strange. 

Even if we consider perma "regeneration", it wouldn't be your so said 10k barrier since regen only adds 229 hp per Sec on 779 healing power (look build editor above). So that would add 229 to the already unrealistic 1500 hp per sec. However, you need 2000 hp per sec to reach 10k barrier and that while not being hit for 5 seconds straight. 

[Nokaon.4603]

On 12/14/2023 at 12:17 AM, SeTect.5918 said:

You know what I hate the most about the forum? Everyone keeps calling out random numbers to prove their points but dont prove where the numbers are coming from.

25 blight stacks give 1k hp each sec? 

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PS0Ao+plhyAZZsLWLWMTQxXA-D2IY1oj/QyRE0lEIQFgCPGUkgYH8Wc9TDA-w

I would say calculate it yourself but i ll do it for you. 

Thats 789 healing power because of blood magic. If you hover over the blight it says "22¾" hp each sec for each stack. So lets just take 23 hp per stack. 23 x 25 = 575 on 25 stacks. 575 is somewhat the half of what you said. 

You also need perma 25 blight for that. Shroud 3 and 4 both consume 5 blight per cast. The blight generation in shroud is 1 stack per second. 

You would probably need to run 4-5 elexirs to keep 25 stacks up perm. 

 

Additionally you seem to be a Fan of death magic + blood magic. So your only passive healing is basically blight and the minimal from life transfer of blood magic. 

But i ll be generous, lets just say..however..you heal 1500 per second (Basically the double of what you should normally do with both perm 25 blight (very unrealistic) and blood magic).

Now lets take a look aaat barrier: https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Barrier

"Barrier disappears 5 seconds after being applied."

Hm...so with 1500 hp per Sec, your max is 7500...strange. 

Even if we consider perma "regeneration", it wouldn't be your so said 10k barrier since regen only adds 229 hp per Sec on 779 healing power (look build editor above). So that would add 229 to the already unrealistic 1500 hp per sec. However, you need 2000 hp per sec to reach 10k barrier and that while not being hit for 5 seconds straight. 

the 10k barrier comes from the heal itself, not the passive barrier, i can maintain the heal barrier in 1v1 fights because of vampiric traits, and by the time the heal is off cooldown, i can refresh it again, i've literally had 10k barrier then it was reduced to like 3k during the fight, and then i just popped the heal again. (you don't even need to dodge vs many matchups, your barrier generation surpasses their damage.

also vampiric presence synergises extremely well with this build and since you have quickness it stacks up really quickly since you're basically a machinegun in shroud, ANY healing is converted into barrier and that includes damage. the whole point of bloodmagic is Blood Bank, so ofc im a fan of it being combined with deathmagic which essentially turns you into a minstrel tank with dps.

so yes maintaining 5k+ barrier permanently is very much so an option, especially if you're good at the game, most fights people wont get through your barrier before you can refresh it again because the heal has a very VERY low cooldown.

go into your harb, add bloodbank, pop a few elixirs on yourself to get 15-20 blight, enter combat pop heal, and tell me this is not op afterwards and doesn't need a nerf.

you can also juice things up with dagger 2 for even more barrier. i know im not wrong here JUST TEST IT FOR YOURSELF INSTEAD OF SCREAMING IM WRONG, it takes you like 2-5 minutes!  lmfao i used to main blood harb, and im honestly surprised it hasn't been nerfed to the ground yet.

Try it you'll see how little that 5 second barrier text matters once you get the rotation going.

ask any roamer out there thats not new on what class they want nerfed most of all, they will all say  blood harbingers, this isn't even up for debate that they are the tankiest of tanks in the current meta with an obscene amount of dps to back it up.

their only weakness is cc which yes surprise surprise means nothing if you're running bloodbank and cele.

And finally since im not here to argue my points im gonna end it with a challenge

if you think im wrong i challenge you to find an above average necro player, record it and have him put on full cele with bloodbank traits+deathmagic and tell me how that goes for you. (but im sure none of you would even attempt that since its clear you don't play the game and only argue on the forums)

 

 

Have a jolly good christmass! 🙂

Edited December 15, 2023 by Nokaon.4603

[Palikka.8249]

After quick reading i agree with OP!

Nerf ele downstate and delete thiefs!

[Sansar.1302]

On 12/14/2023 at 12:24 AM, Nokaon.4603 said:

the 10k barrier comes from the heal itself, not the passive barrier, i can maintain the heal barrier in 1v1 fights because of vampiric traits, and by the time the heal is off cooldown, i can refresh it again, i've literally had 10k barrier then it was reduced to like 3k during the fight, and then i just popped the heal again. (you don't even need to dodge vs many matchups, your barrier generation surpasses their damage.

also vampiric presence synergises extremely well with this build and since you have quickness it stacks up really quickly since you're basically a machinegun in shroud, ANY healing is converted into barrier and that includes damage. the whole point of bloodmagic is Blood Bank, so ofc im a fan of it being combined with deathmagic which essentially turns you into a minstrel tank with dps.

so yes maintaining 5k+ barrier permanently is very much so an option, especially if you're good at the game, most fights people wont get through your barrier before you can refresh it again because the heal has a very VERY low cooldown.

go into your harb, add bloodbank, pop a few elixirs on yourself to get 15-20 blight, enter combat pop heal, and tell me this is not op afterwards and doesn't need a nerf.

you can also juice things up with dagger 2 for even more barrier. i know im not wrong here JUST TEST IT FOR YOURSELF INSTEAD OF SCREAMING IM WRONG, it takes you like 2-5 minutes!  lmfao i used to main blood harb, and im honestly surprised it hasn't been nerfed to the ground yet.

Try it you'll see how little that 5 second barrier text matters once you get the rotation going.

ask any roamer out there thats not new on what class they want nerfed most of all, they will all say  blood harbingers, this isn't even up for debate that they are the tankiest of tanks in the current meta with an obscene amount of dps to back it up.

their only weakness is cc which yes surprise surprise means nothing if you're running bloodbank and cele.

And finally since im not here to argue my points im gonna end it with a challenge

if you think im wrong i challenge you to find an above average necro player, record it and have him put on full cele with bloodbank traits+deathmagic and tell me how that goes for you. (but im sure none of you would even attempt that since its clear you don't play the game and only argue on the forums)

 

 

Have a jolly good christmass! 🙂

It is like they want Guardian , elementalist and necromancer to be the absolute most powerfull classes  on top they are two of the easyest classes to play (not elementalist that requier a bit skill but not as much as people think )

[jpsssss.7530]

On 12/6/2023 at 5:53 PM, Sansar.1302 said:

Willbender,  Harbinger and Catalysts 😉

ok but we have to remove ambgushes from Mirage, longbow from ranger, the whole berserker and spellbreaker elite specs, stealth and shadowsteps from thief, anything that's not an elixir, turret, or the flamethrower kit from Engineer, and double the energy costs on all rev weapon skills. /s (satire for those that miss it)

[Oahkahmewolf.6210]

On 12/9/2023 at 4:57 AM, Sansar.1302 said:

Yes i play ranger , no it dont play Long bow ( not the last 3 years )

Yes i play a bit with main hand axe ( but not only that )

Willbender,  Harbinger and Catalysts have to much inbuilt defence an sustain in wvw

This is a wvw only isue as in spvp they are actualy quite ballanced (habinger and willbender migth even need a little buff in spvp)

The reason is that stats in spvp is way more resticted than in wvw.

There are other strong builds in wvw too but they dont reatch the op state that these 3 do( druid, thief , scrapper , vidicator )

Been a long while since there have been any focus on wvw in the patches.

Been playing a lot of catalyst myself bc it is fun to be that powerfull and melt 2-3 ppl at once but i dont think it is good for the game.

I used to use axe as a ranger, then I got bored ranging as ranger so I decided to go melee purist. Honestly, I generally don't have any problems with the classes you listed. The only issue I generally have is an extremely patient and persistent thief.

 

[Oahkahmewolf.6210]

On 12/9/2023 at 4:57 AM, Sansar.1302 said:

Yes i play ranger , no it dont play Long bow ( not the last 3 years )

Yes i play a bit with main hand axe ( but not only that )

Willbender,  Harbinger and Catalysts have to much inbuilt defence an sustain in wvw

This is a wvw only isue as in spvp they are actualy quite ballanced (habinger and willbender migth even need a little buff in spvp)

The reason is that stats in spvp is way more resticted than in wvw.

There are other strong builds in wvw too but they dont reatch the op state that these 3 do( druid, thief , scrapper , vidicator )

Been a long while since there have been any focus on wvw in the patches.

Been playing a lot of catalyst myself bc it is fun to be that powerfull and melt 2-3 ppl at once but i dont think it is good for the game.

I used to use axe as a ranger, then I got bored ranging as ranger so I decided to go melee purist. Honestly, I generally don't have any problems with the classes you listed. The only issue I generally have is an extremely patient and persistent thief.

 

[Sansar.1302]

3 hours ago, Oahkahmewolf.6210 said:

I used to use axe as a ranger, then I got bored ranging as ranger so I decided to go melee purist. Honestly, I generally don't have any problems with the classes you listed. The only issue I generally have is an extremely patient and persistent thief.

 

You have trouble with thief?  Why ranger is the class that does best vs thieves.