Chrono: Undo Oct 17th 2023 Nerf to Split Second

[Lincolnbeard.1735]

33 minutes ago, Rdm.3186 said:

If you facetank both bursts from a chrono (means double cs burst) you ofc should be dead. No one here claimed otherwise. I was refering to eating the initial inc. Means only one burst. No one complains about a half hp amount of burst dmg. Also did even anyone in this thread complained about moa? Moa was not the topic at all until now, if i am not mistaken.

Alright we're getting somewhere.

So, why should you survive a burst? If I'm out of CDs now and have to survive 10sec without any sort of reliable sustain, sustain damage, no condi cleanse, no mobility.

[Terrorhuz.4695]

1 hour ago, Rdm.3186 said:

i just explained to you how to make comparisions which actually hit reality

Careful with the "hitting reality" part, if you hit reality too much you might actually be tempted to test your comparisons, rather than just typing them out.

[Shagie.7612]

17 minutes ago, Deadmoose.6594 said:

If we don't use those abilities, we are dead in literally one second.

must be nice actually having the tools to survive
-a kalla enjoyer

aren't you also that guy who complained about reaper being bad
i don't think you're actually very knowledgeable lol

[Terrorhuz.4695]

Just now, Shagie.7612 said:

-a kalla enjoyer

Now you're literally entering pvp with the single purpose of searching for troubles

[Shagie.7612]

2 minutes ago, Terrorhuz.4695 said:

Now you're literally entering pvp with the single purpose of searching for troubles

1200 range to my 900, don't have to deal with projectile hate like shortbow does, better and harder to avoid burst, better survivability, control, stealth and escapes, but chrono deserves to be the highest damage in the game?
how's that one work out?

i mean for goodness sake the dude's complaining about power zerk which is also considerably worse than chrono lol

[Deadmoose.6594]

12 minutes ago, Shagie.7612 said:

aren't you also that guy who complained about reaper being bad

No, I complained that shroud attacks are too short because as soon as you enter shroud you're focused. People run away from you, counter-freeze you, etc, rendering the shroud useless.

7 minutes ago, Shagie.7612 said:

1200 range to my 900, don't have to deal with projectile hate like shortbow does, better and harder to avoid burst, better survivability, control, stealth and escapes, but chrono deserves to be the highest damage in the game?

Feel free to make your own post complaining about revenant, I don't know anything about it.

9 minutes ago, Shagie.7612 said:

i mean for goodness sake the dude's complaining about power zerk which is also considerably worse than chrono lol

Never said it wasn't, but it did hit me for 11k with one attack. Spellbreaker is definitely a struggle for a chrono right now.

[Shagie.7612]

Just now, Deadmoose.6594 said:

Never said it wasn't, but it did hit me for 11k with one attack.

A power zerk that hits you for 11k got through aegis, weakness, blind, and every other form of mitigation to land a pretty dang telegraphed attack, and in exchange is playing a build that insta dies from a sneeze even from you as the Chrono. He's you but worse, basically.

2 minutes ago, Deadmoose.6594 said:

Spellbreaker is definitely a struggle for a chrono right now.

It's a struggle for everyone still lol
That isn't a very useful metric for balance at that point. Like pointing out you're struggling with mace Untamed or something.

[Terrorhuz.4695]

36 minutes ago, Shagie.7612 said:

bruh I was literally saying I feel your pain because you play an underdog class

 

[Rdm.3186]

7 hours ago, Lincolnbeard.1735 said:

Alright we're getting somewhere.

So, why should you survive a burst? If I'm out of CDs now and have to survive 10sec without any sort of reliable sustain, sustain damage, no condi cleanse, no mobility.

You lit. answered your own question: Because you are not out of cds after one gs burst.

Typical mesmer way of illusionary logic. You already start with a false claim that you are out of cds after one gs blink burst. And blink bursting is 2014, no mesmer with sanity would use blink to burst outside of doing it with chrono using cs or when you gank a pressured not full hp target and know it will go down with the blink burst. Blink is not mandatory to hit the burst.

No skill that has also high defensive value (stealth like midnight signet, mass invisib., teleport stunbreak, invuln, lock down hard cc) is needed to actually hit the burst. It is a luxury to do so, just to have an easier life by deleting some counterplay to the burst. But going the easy way is not what a balanced game should reward with more dmg.  When you wanna waste most of your defensive cds to cover your burst and delete counterplay and delete skill requirment to get a kill with power mes, so you dont need to reactively and interactive outplay the opponent and bait cds and position yourself correct and have a good burst timing with counting opponents defensives cds left and/or timing the burst well (for example so it hits right in the end of a dodge etc. etc.) then you cannot expect being rewarded with an assassin kill potential for fu**ing skillwastes. Your reward for investing your defensive strong cds into the burst IS hitting the burst with remarkable less need to outplay the opponent, your reward is NOT getting even more noobcarry dmg at your hand for a 100% to zero kill. That is exactly the reason why bad to mediocre mesmers should not give balance suggestions to devs tbh... I am not even a mes main and i can hit a gs burst without stealth inc, without teleport and without using a lock down cc, even when the target can see me coming and is not busy fighting some other ppl and i also know how to not get interupted during it without just wasting f4 for it.

But lets continue to check what skills you still have rdy when you do a 2014 standard blink burst on core mesmer:

 You still have not used gs4, gs5, sword 2, 3 , both offhandskills, at least one utility (if you burst with blink and mirror images) otherwise 2 utilities, Elite, heal, f2, f4. kitten... now i think about it you rly can go afk and accept death after not oneshotting with your initial burst 😂

If i stand there for 3-5 secs and facetank your first gs burst, then let you cast zerkers, then let you weaponswap and cast both offhandweaponskills, then sw3, and sw2 into  a 3 clone f2 and then i am still alive, THEN you can start complaining that your dmg does not match the defensive kit you have. And even when you rly unload all of these skills on a target, you are still not out of cds. You still have gs5, distort, elite and one utility (either signet of illusion to get shatters back for another round of spam or midnight signet/ decoy for disengage, or cleanse mantra for condi clease or whatever you want to use in that slot) outside of general infight movement and repositioning/ kiting/ los etc. 

Edited May 3 by Rdm.3186

[vanflyheight.6832]

6 hours ago, Rdm.3186 said:

You lit. answered your own question: Because you are not out of cds after one gs burst.

(this is what i call delusional, cause thats exactly what you have, out of cds when doing a blink burst)

Typical mesmer way of illusionary logic. You already start with a false claim that you are out of cds after one gs blink burst. And blink bursting is 2014, no mesmer with sanity would use blink to burst outside of doing it with chrono using cs or when you gank a pressured not full hp target and know it will go down with the blink burst. Blink is not mandatory to hit the burst.

(Blink may be not manditory but its all part of the burst if like terror or deadmoose were to use it from range when range is the best way to burst a target down in seconds without having that other player use up a stunbreak or see it coming like you keep saying which makes it telegraphed by anyone who is looking for it and im sure your more of a silver player over these two who are high lvl maybe even plat players. so dont be replying to something when you only do the writing and not enough reading and or testing. Oh almost forgot to mention, blink burst is not so 2014, its become part of the mes burst kit since it was first introduced.)

No skill that has also high defensive value (stealth like midnight signet, mass invisib., teleport stunbreak, invuln, lock down hard cc) is needed to actually hit the burst. It is a luxury to do so, just to have an easier life by deleting some counterplay to the burst. But going the easy way is not what a balanced game should reward with more dmg.  When you wanna waste most of your defensive cds to cover your burst and delete counterplay and delete skill requirment to get a kill with power mes, so you dont need to reactively and interactive outplay the opponent and bait cds and position yourself correct and have a good burst timing with counting opponents defensives cds left and/or timing the burst well (for example so it hits right in the end of a dodge etc. etc.) then you cannot expect being rewarded with an assassin kill potential for fu**ing skillwastes. Your reward for investing your defensive strong cds into the burst IS hitting the burst with remarkable less need to outplay the opponent, your reward is NOT getting even more noobcarry dmg at your hand for a 100% to zero kill. That is exactly the reason why bad to mediocre mesmers should not give balance suggestions to devs tbh... I am not even a mes main and i can hit a gs burst without stealth inc, without teleport and without using a lock down cc, even when the target can see me coming and is not busy fighting some other ppl and i also know how to not get interupted during it without just wasting f4 for it.

(Again delusional, since you have not played mesmer except in little sections, means your not one who should be jumpin on these two mes main players who are telling it like it is based on the recent nerf to chrono's f1. Your problem bout "high defensive value" is bout as useless as an old boot. like i explained on page 2 of this post which is already documented. Ranger- reveal on sic em, pierce on longbow when traited, barrage which again is aoe dmg. DH- reveal on spear of justice with tether that can yank a mesmer or thief for that matter way beyond the 1200 pull which according to the text of it shouldnt be able to pull if your outside of its range. ive already encountered this least once where i got pulled twice by what appeared like the dh spear from two different directions when i was out of range of that pull. Even shorts has some vod clips of this happening to him on occasion. Invuln only lasts like 1sec and if your not out of range of like a dhs tether you can get yanked after which some dhs will wait for the invuln to expire and then pull em hows that for them apples. Cata- ES aka earth shield which does twice the dmg of chrono, has invuln for 5secs, mag aura aka proj block which any mes using off hand pistol will get reflected and most times ya cant kill a cata on mes much less chrono. Vindi- High dmg on dodge which kills a mesmers clones. Necro- aoe pressure, weakness which cuts a power mes's dmg severely which also destroys the clones if your building up clones from range then hit f1 for shatter dmg when they'll just evaporate before they even connect, Even on dh also can do this with traps again aoe dmg like ToF aka test of faith so wheres the capable of mes clones to do dmg when they cant even connect correctly without havin to use the invuln on phantasms trait? Its also not a mesmer burst without putting blink in the mix which is optional when you have to do this from range which is outside of any condi dmg, traps, etc on a node. Lastly cant forget thief which is a natural predator to mesmer. So lets spell this out the easy way, natural predator= hard counter even deadeye is a hard matchup for mesmer in general.)

But lets continue to check what skills you still have rdy when you do a 2014 standard blink burst on core mesmer:

 You still have not used gs4, gs5, sword 2, 3 , both offhandskills, at least one utility (if you burst with blink and mirror images) otherwise 2 utilities, Elite, heal, f2, f4. kitten... now i think about it you rly can go afk and accept death after not oneshotting with your initial burst 😂

(Yep lets continue destroying all your arguements here, gs4- who'd use this skill in melee range anyway? Plus gs4 is used as a skill to bait a dodge before the mes burst+blink if needed. gs5- cant knockback a player who has stab, willbender has it on f3 when they jump in on their burst+ aegis, tempest has it on their earth overloads and even now anet added aegis to aftershock *in wvw ofc* but still even in pvp with the prot on aftershock its still dmg mitigation on a mes burst. sword 2-3- 2 is used mostly defensive utility instead of dmg even though it does get used like that, 3- again utility+combo able to swap the user with the clone added to immob a target or port to higher ground when able isnt dmg, its just setting up for the burst which im sure terror does and i know shorts does this quite well when the situation calls for it. Which offhands are you refering to? By all means lets go over all 3. focus- temperal curtain got a small nerf in the radius department recently so your pull range is lowered so ya might not get all the players a mes user would hope to get then burst after and even the phantasm is more of a distraction or adding another clone in the mix to setup the burst. pistol- gets shut down by any proj block, holo blocks/shield, ele earthshield, mag aura,  warrior offhand sword  since warriors now have swapped off hands from shield to sword. Rev- on dome trait which also blocks projs. Scrapper with shield bubble+ any barrier. Necro with CPC aka corrupt poison cloud which is a proj block if being used. So who does the burst with blink+ mirror images when its an inferor utility to pick up now when its been said that clones get destroyed by any form of aoe dmg.) 

If i stand there for 3-5 secs and facetank your first gs burst, then let you cast zerkers, then let you weaponswap and cast both offhandweaponskills, then sw3, and sw2 into  a 3 clone f2 and then i am still alive, THEN you can start complaining that your dmg does not match the defensive kit you have. And even when you rly unload all of these skills on a target, you are still not out of cds. You still have gs5, distort, elite and one utility (either signet of illusion to get shatters back for another round of spam or midnight signet/ decoy for disengage, or cleanse mantra for condi clease or whatever you want to use in that slot) outside of general infight movement and repositioning/ kiting/ los etc. 

(Think your semi confusing yourself between mesmer here and warrior spec berserker for one, 2nd is congrats, you just blew your entire load on a single target got any idea on how to reset your cds, kite away or not get targeted so ya can resustain without getting plussed in a fight?  Far as using both off hand skills, you dont always do this as part of a combo rotation. Like terror above has told you, its reactive not proactive which it seems your very much implicating. So like three of us have said, you have no leg to stand on at all, im sure terror, deadmoose and i from any further responces from you will just get ignored since your tryin to talk as if you got a pov when you got nothin+zilch. )

@ everyone above, whoever mentioned bout support chrono being a thing you just completely lost your marbles since support chrono is garbage since its rarely played less your a lower ranked type just cause mes is your favorite class that wants to play a different build or a newbie who's pickin up the class for the first time and has no clue that bunker mes is something we dealt with back in HoT timeline, which is why it got gutted. It does nothing, its boring to play and you just become thief's next meal or just get ignored completely. 

 

Edited May 4 by vanflyheight.6832

[Shagie.7612]

6 hours ago, vanflyheight.6832 said:

support chrono is garbage since its rarely played less your a lower ranked type

i think it's really funny when people say things like this and call everyone else bad and then you check and they're 34-51 and 1100

[Lincolnbeard.1735]

@Rdm.3186

What logic is that? You should only kill someone if you're out of CDs?

So thief, ele and Holo should never manage to kill someone?

So, chrono burst - if using torch, torch 4, phantasmal berserker if extra oompf needed (good luck killing anything other than complete glass without it), GS2, blink (and yes blink is still used, otherwise you wouldn't be complaining about one shot from Stealth)  F3 F1 GS3. Replace torch 4 with MI If not using torch. That's 6 skills. You're left with GS5 and GS1 no damage whatsoever. Changing to other set, SW1 is never used unless opponent is with low hp, swap used to juke and false stun (immo+F3 daze), BF - good kitten. If torch you're left with 5, if shield Sh4 - good kitten, sh5 not that good anymore.

You're also left with one stun breaker, no mobility, no condi cleanse.

Yes, no hard cc needed to hit the burst, if you're against trash that is. Otherwise yeah you'll need it. - There's a reason F3 used to stun traited.

See a giant pink sword - time to dodge.

So much bla bla bla, tell me a spec that needs this so highly skillful play in order to score kills you talk about please.

Also please play mesmer before spewing kitten.

[Deadmoose.6594]

User story #2, went up against a weaver and got rocked. Weaver only used one defensive, and its like my shatters did nothing. Then I get into aoe trouble and my health evaporates. Something needs to change, it's just not even close to other classes. It's really only good if there's a team fight, the chrono is left alone to send shatters in. That's literally it, what a kitten class/spec in pvp. People are complaining about mesmer damage literally only when mesmer is left alone to actually do damage to an entire team. Other than that one situation, its a piece of kitten and you can't argue against me because I have 1359 games played as a mesmer over the span of two years.

[Rdm.3186]

22 hours ago, vanflyheight.6832 said:

big collection of nonsense provided in a strange way... you don't want to be quoted on your stuff ? I can understand that...

I do not do a step by step go-through and write another esssay since none of your arguments justify having oneshot dmg, a lot of them totally missing my points and/ or make zero sense at all. But Anet should give all of us non-rangers the ability to oneshot rangers with 6 skills in under 1 sec, since we just learnt from you, that giving assassin ability in a mmo to deal with broken classes we dont play ourselfs and to deal with things countering us is good balance 😂

Also i like how you mesmer mains lit can ignore or deny most obvious facts and logic. I just told you what cds you still have rdy after a standard gs burst and i clearly defined what ensemble of skills i mean, when i say standard gs blink burst.  

Seriously tho, is there a hidden school for mesmer mains teaching them illusionary logic and how to on purpose miss the points ppl make, so you don't nead to deal with their real arguments and that, if you call yourself a mesmer main you are right about mesmer things by default, despite your skill lvl  even? It is actually insane.

 

13 hours ago, Lincolnbeard.1735 said:

🤦‍♂️

Could say nearly the same to you than to vanflylow before, but i like to give you a personal note 🤗 

13 hours ago, Lincolnbeard.1735 said:

What logic is that? You should only kill someone if you're out of CDs? So thief, ele and Holo should never manage to kill someone?

No, the logic is, that you act as if you use all your cds for one standard gs burst, while i clearly defined that a standard gs burst includes gs2, f3, mi (if used), f1, gs3. And that amount of skills (even with torch 4 added) should not have enough dmg for an 100% to zero kill in 1 sec or less, not even on a light target. Even if you combine torch 4 into the oneshot combo, you still have more than enough cds rdy after that. 6-7 skills out of 17 f.f.s., can you count? +autoattack dmg,+all other ways of defensive plays like infight movement, kiting, los.

Using gs4 is not part of the oneshot combo, its either a bait to get a dodge and then time the burst right into the end of the dodge (that already warrants a pretty secure hit of the burst even on good opponents by itself) or you hit them after the target has no defensive cds rdy anymore iin case you want to use the phantasms for dmg. 2. case makes zerkers part of your sustained dmg not your burst dmg, case 1 makes it a bait (even a skillful, interactive and reactive one) but you do not cast them for dmg, you cast them for the bait (to hit the burst with a higher chance) in that case.

You try to argue that you invest all your cds, make it sound like 14 out of 17 skills not 6 or 7  in 1 sec or less, what is not even possible due to casttimes, (already casting zerker before that is not part of a oneshot, since you will never hit zerker dmg in the same time than the burst, even a silver 1 will dodge  that burst try, do you even play mesmer?). Using 6 skills (1 even without dmg) which are all usable or better hitable at the same time should never be enough dmg  for a 100-0 kill in 1 sec or less. Simple. 

BUT: IF you use and hit all your cds as you claimed, so way more than those 6 skills, just as i did in my example here:

Quote

If i stand there for 3-5 secs and facetank your first gs burst, then let you cast zerkers, then let you weaponswap and cast both offhandweaponskills, then sw3, and sw2 into  a 3 clone f2 and then i am still alive, THEN you can start complaining that your dmg does not match the defensive kit you have.

then ofc for very sure you should get a kill. Good we agree on that one! But you do not use all your cds as you claim, you only use 6 out of 17.  And all other skills you add to that 6 skills will (due to addtional casttimes you cannot overlap into the burst)  increase your kill time remarkable, and with that increases the ability to react and to counterplay for the opponent and with that enables a reactive, interactive fight.
 

 

Edited May 4 by Rdm.3186

[Deadmoose.6594]

User story #3 and for full transparency, I used to get to at least gold 2 solo with this build, now I'm a gold 1 which is significantly lower than my usual rank even though I should be higher if anything, not lower. Also, I tend to get top dmg way less now than before. Prior to the nerf I could get top dmg almost every time, but now I'm lucky to even get 20% of the team's damage. Doesn't really seem right for a glass build.

[vanflyheight.6832]

18 hours ago, Shagie.7612 said:

i think it's really funny when people say things like this and call everyone else bad and then you check and they're 34-51 and 1100

i find it redonkulous when players dont get the jest of what support chrono is, its a bunker spec aka do no dmg, only boon and minor healing which is superiorly done by other supports, lets list em here: tempest- overloads least with water gives condi cleanse+alot of healing, earth- mag aura+ prot+stab+other boons, res with glyph. scrapper- aoe healing with gyros, function gyro with res/finishing off downs, barrier, core support guard- aegis, stab, res utility, healing, boons, does mes on rifle support do all of that or just a minor gimmick of these that ive listed? 

Since Rdm the bonker of nonsense mentions MI aka mirror images which that utility do not go into the mesmer burst at all period, its a stunbreak mostly, adds 2 clones yes but again like ive said above, gets deleted by any aoe dmg so your left with nothing and think this guy keeps throwing out numbers just to make himself important and seem like a scholar on mes when dont think he plays it for one. 2 the mesmer burst is a 5-6 skill combo not 8-12. sword 1 autos for low hp targets or if your other skills are on cd. sword 3, swap is utility for kiting or setting up the burst not a skill thats defensive. sword 2, 1 sec evade/distort mid defensive which is one of two. the other is distortion itself (f4) which if you use and run out of defensive utility your done no way to block, kite or los less your on like mirage which has added utility ports via jaunt but thats a side note not based on chrono only. So when your on chrono, use the burst+CS your done period no  squeeling out of it cause you're dead less someone on the other team isnt looking or paying attention aka tunnel vision. Do us a favor and dont reply back. 

[Shagie.7612]

27 minutes ago, vanflyheight.6832 said:

Do us a favor and dont reply back. 

hey that's a really nice incoherent screed

you should explain why you think it's won every MAT since it came out if it's so horrible
it'll be fun

[Terrorhuz.4695]

16 hours ago, Deadmoose.6594 said:

User story #2, went up against a weaver and got rocked. Weaver only used one defensive, and its like my shatters did nothing. Then I get into aoe trouble and my health evaporates. Something needs to change, it's just not even close to other classes. It's really only good if there's a team fight, the chrono is left alone to send shatters in. That's literally it, what a kitten class/spec in pvp. People are complaining about mesmer damage literally only when mesmer is left alone to actually do damage to an entire team. Other than that one situation, its a piece of kitten and you can't argue against me because I have 1359 games played as a mesmer over the span of two years.

The average forumling never really evolved past this

https://clips.twitch.tv/TallViscousPlumberTwitchRPG

Edited May 5 by Terrorhuz.4695

[Paradoxoglanis.1904]

Mes can get buffs when F4 becomes channelled.

[melcor.1094]

On 5/3/2024 at 3:30 PM, Deadmoose.6594 said:

No one asked for this, there are other ways to prove how much experience a person has with a certain spec.

First i was not sure what you mean. Then i remembered that you said this:

On 4/27/2024 at 9:33 PM, Deadmoose.6594 said:

I have been playing consistently for 2+ years, probably 1600 matches played. When I said you weren’t speaking from experience I meant you didn’t seem like someone who actually plays a power chrono, let alone mesmer.

Since you think, having such a low amount of games proves anything, then i guess you want to see my number of pvp games with mesmer:

https://ibb.co/tP7D43g Playing since realese of the game with breaks inbetween. Means in total over 7k pvp games (inkluding 74 unranked matches), what is tbh also not that much overall for 10 years of playing the game on and off, still 40% of all my pvp games (around 3k) were with mesmer, with that my most played class.

On 5/5/2024 at 12:58 AM, Rdm.3186 said:

Also i like how you mesmer mains lit can ignore or deny most obvious facts and logic. 

Seriously tho, is there a hidden school for mesmer mains teaching them illusionary logic and how to on purpose miss the points ppl make, so you don't nead to deal with their real arguments and that, if you call yourself a mesmer main you are right about mesmer things by default, despite your skill lvl  even? It is actually insane.

Careful  with that one! We mes mains are not all like this!. 

As a proven mes main... (drum roll) i think, you are pretty clear, on point and overall correct in your arguments. But it is not a school, it is a club, and i was kicked from it the moment i dared to touch another class in pvp in addition to mesmer. Rip. So i am wrong by default too i guess.

 

Edited May 5 by melcor.1094

[melcor.1094]

7 hours ago, Paradoxoglanis.1904 said:

Mes can get buffs when F4 becomes channelled.

Double horrible suggestion. No thanks

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

I'm a simple man. I join an active thread, I see power zerk complaints, I leave. 

[Clumsy.7926]

Player with chrono profile picture, asking to undo chrono nerfs. Who would have thought 🤣

[Paradoxoglanis.1904]

2 hours ago, melcor.1094 said:

Double horrible suggestion. No thanks

then remove the channel from other classes invulns pls.

[arazoth.7290]

12 hours ago, Terrorhuz.4695 said:

The average forumling never really evolved past this

https://clips.twitch.tv/TallViscousPlumberTwitchRPG

Mesmer is FRREECASTINGG 😂😂