My spear feedback after twitch showcase.

[StraightPath.3972]

Numbers look good, unlike the weapon design itself - it's a mess.
 

1. A ranged weapon that rewards being up close - what?
2. Skill 2 aftershock radius is just pitiful. Tragic ranged, nothing to sing about in melee.
3. Unlike the autos which have godly cleave in melee unlike you know... the actual melee weapons?
4. Skill 4 which is meant as an interrupt has a dysmal 3/4s cast time. Do I need to elaborate further?
5. Skill 5 accuracy will be a huge problem in spvp. If it's easy to avoid - trash. If not - either broken or nerfed into oblivion.
6. Gotta love a gap maker skill on a weapon that rewards being up close instead of keeping your distance.
7. And it's not like revs got an aoe skill that pulls in enemies so they can land their tiny aoe skills at range...
8. 900 range...yeah

Well at least i can say it does not make the rifle obsolete. Not sure though if it's more thanks to 900 range,
or Rifle already making itself obsolete with it's own design, so it's not like you can kill a horse that's already dead..
You can give it some beating though, as cruel as it sounds..

Edited June 22 by StraightPath.3972

[Lighter.5631]

melee reward is fine, fan of fire longbow 2 has always been my favorite skill, because it does big burst in point blank, but it can also do great poke pressure when ranged.

one thing that longbow has over rifle, that's makes longbow played in basically every mode and started as meta power pvp build back in core, and continue to shine now is it's synergy with melee weapons, as warrior require fast hand and fast weapon swapping. rifle has no synergy with any warrior kit what so ever...longbow you can just land the AoEs on your feet and pretend it's melee weapon, i can literally fight with longbow like it's melee weapon, 2 is melee burst, 3 place under yourself is melee aoe, blind and 5 immob to get close to land melee 2,3, unlike rifle when enemy get close to you, you struggle to even execute your skills

it's not going to reward you for being farther away, as you will just camp spear and become the most boring play style ever(cough rifle). melee reward is fine, as long as you have range option.

it's a melee range hybrid weapon, which is literally the best weapon. range only weapon is as bad as melee only weapon, just look at rifle..all the best weapons are the range ones that can act as melee

Edited June 22 by Lighter.5631

[Verdict is Vengence.6912]

Apparently the melee range buff is a balance thing. They also emphasized that it there isn't a lot of drop in damage, but the spear's effects like the shockwave from Spear #2 will be reduced at range.

All in all, the spear's not bad. I don't hate it or love it. Though I wish there was a brutal move that looks more warrior-ish, like an Achilles's jump and stab from the movie Troy or just running someone through. The moves just all look so ranger-ish. Even the burst looks like a ranger move.

6.5/10 for now. I'm sure playing with the spear will be different than merely watching it.

[Captain Crapface.7528]

On 6/22/2024 at 3:48 PM, Verdict is Vengence.6912 said:

Apparently the melee range buff is a balance thing.

I'ts not.
Not a single skill scales its damage with range. 180 radious on auto already makes it unlikely to hit multiple targets in PvP/WvW unless you play in Zergs (where Gunzerker has the same AoE on 1500 range oneshot, lol) - so Spear 1 range scaling practically doesn't matter.

Spear 2 only scales AoE size, making it obnoxious for warrior beond 600 range, and obnoxious for his opponents within 300.

But definitely the worst is Spear 5. Its delay, before damage starts, is whats scaling. So you have to guess, weither that was 599 or 601, becouse the timer or range tresholds have no indication at all, and if you guess wrong and dodge prematurely, you either have to burn another dodge or eat kitten. - we already had similar problem with [Dragon's Tooth] before it got nerfed into the ground, and that thing at least had consistent dodge timings.
This is ten times worse.

Literally removing range scaling from this weapon whatsoever, will instantly improve spear's balance and desighn.

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

1 hour ago, Captain Crapface.7528 said:

I'ts not.
Not a single skill scales its damage with range. 180 radious on auto already makes it unlikely to hit multiple targets in PvP/WvW unless you play in Zergs (where Gunzerker has the same AoE on 1500 range oneshot, lol) - so Spear 1 range scaling practically doesn't matter.

Spear 2 only scales AoE size, making it obnoxious for warrior beond 600 range, and obnoxious for his opponents within 300.

But definitely the worst is Spear 5. Its delay, before damage starts, is whats scaling. So you have to guess, weither that was 599 or 601, becouse the timer or range tresholds have no indication at all, and if you guess wrong and dodge prematurely, you either have to burn another dodge or eat kitten. - we already had similar problem with [Dragon's Tooth] before it got nerfed into the ground, and that thing at least had consistent dodge timings.
This is ten times worse.

Literally removing range scaling from this weapon whatsoever, will instantly improve spear's balance and desighn.

After looking at the tooltips over on Reddit, I have to second this. They really should make it work the same at all ranges, with making the melee version the version at all ranges.

My biggest worry on Spear 5 is the 90 radius on the attacks when they land. I'm worried that nobody with movement speed increases will get hit by that if they are moving so it will end up a de facto useless skill outside of PvE bosses.

[Katary.7096]

8 minutes ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

My biggest worry on Spear 5 is the 90 radius on the attacks when they land. I'm worried that nobody with movement speed increases will get hit by that if they are moving so it will end up a de facto useless skill outside of PvE bosses.

An ability with a bunch of hits that add up to a sizeable amount of damage if you can actually land all of them, which will require locking down a target with hard CC or immobilize.

Wait, have they made a ranged version of Hundred Blades?!

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

1 hour ago, Katary.7096 said:

An ability with a bunch of hits that add up to a sizeable amount of damage if you can actually land all of them, which will require locking down a target with hard CC or immobilize.

Wait, have they made a ranged version of Hundred Blades?!

Looks like it...

[WingSwipe.3084]

1 hour ago, Katary.7096 said:

An ability with a bunch of hits that add up to a sizeable amount of damage if you can actually land all of them, which will require locking down a target with hard CC or immobilize.

Wait, have they made a ranged version of Hundred Blades?!

 

Edited June 24 by WingSwipe.3084
Text can not describe the emotions.

[Aaron.1294]

IMO what they should really do is what they did to other spears - just make it melee/ranged. It makes 0 sense for it to have this range scaling the closer you are and literally 0 melee skills or flipover skills like ranger...

@StraightPath.3972nobody should ever care about range beyond 600 especially on warrior

Edited June 24 by Aaron.1294

[Lonecap.4105]

On 6/24/2024 at 2:47 PM, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

Looks like it...

It seems to track in the same way Hunter's Call would, I think it'll be pretty good actually. The 90 radius is just cleave radius (it's 5 target).

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

13 minutes ago, Lonecap.4105 said:

It seems to track in the same way Hunter's Call would, I think it'll be pretty good actually. The 90 radius is just cleave radius (it's 5 target).

I hope so. 

[Dirame.8521]

On 6/22/2024 at 1:06 PM, Lighter.5631 said:

melee reward is fine, fan of fire longbow 2 has always been my favorite skill, because it does big burst in point blank, but it can also do great poke pressure when ranged.

one thing that longbow has over rifle, that's makes longbow played in basically every mode and started as meta power pvp build back in core, and continue to shine now is it's synergy with melee weapons, as warrior require fast hand and fast weapon swapping. rifle has no synergy with any warrior kit what so ever...longbow you can just land the AoEs on your feet and pretend it's melee weapon, i can literally fight with longbow like it's melee weapon, 2 is melee burst, 3 place under yourself is melee aoe, blind and 5 immob to get close to land melee 2,3, unlike rifle when enemy get close to you, you struggle to even execute your skills

it's not going to reward you for being farther away, as you will just camp spear and become the most boring play style ever(cough rifle). melee reward is fine, as long as you have range option.

it's a melee range hybrid weapon, which is literally the best weapon. range only weapon is as bad as melee only weapon, just look at rifle..all the best weapons are the range ones that can act as melee

As someone who has been messing around with Rifle over the past few months, I can definitely say, I completely disagree. Rifle is like my favourite thing now. Before BM burst was nerfed, it was Rifle BladS I was using to teach them lessons. Rifle + Daredevil Relic = match made at Arenanet's Heaven.

Also made a SPB build that used Rifle to wittle people down then went in to burst them with a Dagger 4 and Sword 3 combo. I love the synergy because I can land Sword burst switch to rifle, Rifle 5 them and watch them boomerang back at me while I line up Rifle Burst. So there's ways to make it work.

I look forward to testing out what they've done with Spear. I agree that it doesn't have anything that makes it super brill but, I think it will work extremely well when paired with Rifle funny enough.

 

Edited June 25 by Dirame.8521

[Lonecap.4105]

2 hours ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

I hope so. 

I'm betting cold hard stacks that the core F1 and the 5 skill will be the standout winners. Its 2 and 4 skill I'm worried about - ground target abilities with narrow radius

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

8 minutes ago, Lonecap.4105 said:

I'm betting cold hard stacks that the core F1 and the 5 skill will be the standout winners. Its 2 and 4 skill I'm worried about - ground target abilities with narrow radius

Looking at the tool tips alone, here is my commentary:

• Scrape the varied functionality based on range. Make the 'melee' or 'mid' range version the version at all ranges. Especially on Spear 5.  We deserve consistency, and so do people fighting against a spear warrior.
• There needs to be some boons.
  • I am assuming that FGS will work with it, so Might will be covered.
  • Spear 3 could use Swiftness.
  • Spear 2 could use Fury.
  • Spear 5 could grant any number of boons if all spears hit. Just pick some flavorful ones, vigor, quickness, resistance, resolution, etc.
• There needs to be some more condis.
  • Cripple, Vuln, and immob are all cool, but Rifle does that and does it better.
  • Why not put weakness or slow somewhere?
• I know that we can trait several other boons and conditions, but the weapon should stand on its own first.
• If they keep it light on boons and condis, then it really needs to have the range variance removed and ensure that the thing does STRONG power damage on it's own.

[Aaron.1294]

@Lonecap.4105If spear 5 going to be insanely powerfull it's going to get hard nerfed in 1 or 2 months, same for F1, but burst viability depends on evade frame which most likely doesn't cover entire burst.. And we forgot about spear 4 which is piercing daze/immob skillshot, prob best skill on spear by far in terms of balance/viability.

We really should be worried about spear 5 which may get destroyed in next patch after expansion release and F1 because of evade frames on it. Both of these skills can be insanely bad or insanely op, making both of them just broken af

 

Edited June 25 by Aaron.1294

[Lonecap.4105]

2 hours ago, Aaron.1294 said:

@Lonecap.4105If spear 5 going to be insanely powerfull it's going to get hard nerfed in 1 or 2 months, same for F1, but burst viability depends on evade frame which most likely doesn't cover entire burst.. And we forgot about spear 4 which is piercing daze/immob skillshot, prob best skill on spear by far in terms of balance/viability.

We really should be worried about spear 5 which may get destroyed in next patch after expansion release and F1 because of evade frames on it. Both of these skills can be insanely bad or insanely op, making both of them just broken af

 

Spear 4 has 3/4 sec cast time and has no tracking sadly, will be dead on arrival 

[Aaron.1294]

@Lonecap.4105go on DH and use instant cast not fast with range indicator... simple fix to projectile based skills because it can be aimed to the very end of the cast time and not just at the beggining of it.

[GamerToad.9248]

On 6/24/2024 at 7:44 AM, Captain Crapface.7528 said:

I'ts not.
Not a single skill scales its damage with range. 180 radious on auto already makes it unlikely to hit multiple targets in PvP/WvW unless you play in Zergs (where Gunzerker has the same AoE on 1500 range oneshot, lol) - so Spear 1 range scaling practically doesn't matter.

Spear 2 only scales AoE size, making it obnoxious for warrior beond 600 range, and obnoxious for his opponents within 300.

But definitely the worst is Spear 5. Its delay, before damage starts, is whats scaling. So you have to guess, weither that was 599 or 601, becouse the timer or range tresholds have no indication at all, and if you guess wrong and dodge prematurely, you either have to burn another dodge or eat kitten. - we already had similar problem with [Dragon's Tooth] before it got nerfed into the ground, and that thing at least had consistent dodge timings.
This is ten times worse.

Literally removing range scaling from this weapon whatsoever, will instantly improve spear's balance and desighn.

Imagine making a whole design choice to make your weapon worse.

[Arewn.2368]

They really should have just made it a melee two-hander condo weapon.

Even assuming they tweaked all of skills and got them to a place where they are good and useable, I still don't understand where this is even supposed to be used.