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bethekey.8314

By bethekey.8314
in Player vs. Player

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bethekey.8314

bethekey.8314

Posted
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As the game population naturally declines, so too do the number of people contributing to the forums. While the internet does bring out the worst in people, most people aren't bad faith actors. However, trolls/bad faith actors are likely to stick longer as their influence grows with declining population.

Competition also declines with population. Most of the players in PvP today aren't able to push their class to its limits and there is a huge skill gap between veterans and others.

Most of the arguments on here seem to result from this. You have:

  • the trolls trying to derail any meaningful discussion
  • the conspiracy theorists who have finally pieced it all together
  • the bad faith actors who know their class is imbalanced but will fight tooth-and-nail to keep it that way, to the detriment of the game as a whole
  • the ignorant who blame balance over skill, confidently unaware of most of the game's complexity
  • the tired, disillusioned veterans who just want good PvP
  • that one nice guy/girl, you beautiful person you 🥰

All of these people are welcome. Only some should influence balance. None of them do influence balance. Anet does whatever it wants and often poorly, riding the coattails of a good initial design.

So when you're replying to the latest hot topic, keep in mind which group you fall into, what group they probably fall into, and what impact your post will have. Have fun with it.

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Dean Calaway.9718

Dean Calaway.9718

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15 minutes ago, bethekey.8314 said:

Only some should influence balance.

There's a word for what you're trying to do there...

16 minutes ago, bethekey.8314 said:

Anet does whatever it wants and often poorly

Anet relies on data they collect to balance 9 professions with their added 27 elite specs and I can't be bother to do the math on total weapon combinations, someone give me a hand, plus sigil combination, plus runes...

If there's one job they couldn't pay me enough to do, was balance, because it's hard, and I mean REALLY hard, and what do they get in return from the community? Comments like this, when they're the hardest working members of the team and get zero recognition or appreciation for their efforts.

You might as well be watching a tier one sporting event from the side line claiming you could have scored that while carrying your grandma on your back, same energy.

22 minutes ago, bethekey.8314 said:

the bad faith actors who know their class is imbalanced but will fight tooth-and-nail to keep it that way, to the detriment of the game as a whole

If there's an imbalanced class that is soooooo much better than anyone else, play it, no one gate keeps them, go ahead and enjoy it, why don't you?

If you can't be bother to play it, it's not as good as you claim it to be.

That's not to mention 999/1000 people that try those "OP" classes quickly come to the realisation all that the "OPness" comes from a very high skill level they could never achieve, before they go back to their familiar one while still complaining the "OP" class should be nerfed anyway.

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bethekey.8314

bethekey.8314

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3 hours ago, Dean Calaway.9718 said:

Anet relies on data they collect to balance 9 professions with their added 27 elite specs and I can't be bother to do the math on total weapon combinations, someone give me a hand, plus sigil combination, plus runes...

If there's one job they couldn't pay me enough to do, was balance, because it's hard, and I mean REALLY hard, and what do they get in return from the community? Comments like this, when they're the hardest working members of the team and get zero recognition or appreciation for their efforts.

You might as well be watching a tier one sporting event from the side line claiming you could have scored that while carrying your grandma on your back, same energy.

Yes, very complicated. But how many of those 9 professions and 27 elite specs are relevant at any given time? How long have the irrelevant things been irrelevant?

Funny enough, many people here have put in considerable time and effort ~for free~ to improve the game through analyses and well thought out suggestions. The current game director and balance lead were both players I PvP'd against back in the day. To dismiss the value and efforts of the community is misguided.

I've seen evidence of how Anet seems to conduct balance. Leaked private balance discord logs, clear favoritism being given to streamers known to have skirted TOS in the past etc. I don't doubt that the balance team works for their pay, but if it's a question of who cares more? Have you seen how much @Trevor Boyer.6524 writes or how Devs play? I rest my case.

3 hours ago, Dean Calaway.9718 said:

If there's an imbalanced class that is soooooo much better than anyone else, play it, no one gate keeps them, go ahead and enjoy it, why don't you?

If you can't be bother to play it, it's not as good as you claim it to be.

That's not to mention 999/1000 people that try those "OP" classes quickly come to the realisation all that the "OPness" comes from a very high skill level they could never achieve, before they go back to their familiar one while still complaining the "OP" class should be nerfed anyway.

Believe it or not, not everyone's goal is to simply "win". Having fun while winning matters and is, arguably, the point of most video games.

Despite that, I have openly tried other classes to test my beliefs, collected and shared data here, and have a YouTube channel where I show gameplay. Me trying S/D thief was a funny one that happened not that long ago if you want to search it. I agree that more people should test things. I don't think I'm the one you should criticize.

Edited by bethekey.8314
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Shagie.7612

Shagie.7612

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just play it yourself is how we got the 10 man ele monthly lol

such a weak cop out for poor balance

anyways i do actually agree balance is very difficult to do but it's pretty insulting when things are left terrible for months if not years, and then when they finally get a change it's like a percent or two increase to something and it does little to nothing to actually change the skill/build/elite/whatever's position in the meta

Edited by Shagie.7612
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Azure The Heartless.3261

Azure The Heartless.3261

Posted
Posted
12 hours ago, bethekey.8314 said:

 

Believe it or not, not everyone's goal is to simply "win". Having fun while winning matters and is, arguably, the point of most video games.

Big correct.  What's the point of having an overperforming spec that carries you to victory if the people you're fighting hate interacting with it? You need rivals to have a pvp community, and to get good rivals you need a level playing field so people don't have to float from annoying spec to annoying spec just to deal with other players who want to turn a dying game mode that can't support then into a side hustle. 

Quote

Me trying S/D thief 

Mind pretending that didn't happen while people try to nerf axe thief

I need a buffer, you understand~ 💀🥃

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shion.2084

shion.2084

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5 hours ago, Dean Calaway.9718 said:

There it is, classic 👌

You keep doing what you like, this apparently.

Bah if that was really the case @bethekey.8314 you and I wouldn't be playing engi.  We'd switch classes.

I also don't want to win if I have to play some cheese engi stealth gank build that has to run away and reset for 30seconds if the gank didn't work.

So I'll say my motivation is not "simply" to win.  I want to win, but while feeling it was a good contest of skill and all participants had a fair chance and that in the end the result came down to skill.  I'd like to win without cheese.    (note I don't consider picking the Flavour Of the Week OP class to be a matter of skill).

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bethekey.8314

bethekey.8314

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1 minute ago, shion.2084 said:

Bah if that was really the case @bethekey.8314 you and I wouldn't be playing engi.  We'd switch classes.

He touts the complexity of Anet devs jobs in keeping 9 classes/27 specs competitive, then provides the solution to the gross imbalance as:

18 hours ago, Shagie.7612 said:

10 man ele monthly lol

 

5 hours ago, Dean Calaway.9718 said:
18 hours ago, bethekey.8314 said:

Believe it or not, not everyone's goal is to simply "win".

There it is, classic 👌

If you kept reading, you'd see it says the goal is to still win, but have fun while doing so. Even in the last(?) big AT, the players were complaining about having to play bunker Spellbreaker to counter bunker Spellbreaker.

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bethekey.8314

bethekey.8314

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7 hours ago, Mne Malo Tebya.2965 said:

Yeah we all know our forum hero. I dont think anyone who knows a bit about this game or the devs themself still read any of his novels. Maybe if you like to read a good fantasy novel, you might enjoy reading his posts.

Haha I'm not saying he's right, just that he cares very much.

6 hours ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

Mind pretending that didn't happen while people try to nerf axe thief

I need a buffer, you understand~ 💀🥃

11k Larcenous, never forget.

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jdawgie.1835

jdawgie.1835

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18 hours ago, bethekey.8314 said:

Believe it or not, not everyone's goal is to simply "win". Having fun while winning matters and is, arguably, the point of most video games.

Boom Headshot - Its a game. Having fun is the only real point that matters. If we are'nt doing that what on earth are booting up the game for? Stopped having fun. Im taking a break and doing Arenas in WoW where I would be doing arenas in GW2. Especially with them canceling the mini season for 2v2. 

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DanAlcedo.3281

DanAlcedo.3281

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The best part about discussing PvP balance here is that nobody knows the rank/skill of the player talking.

Is that a silver 1 player crying big tears or plat 3? Nobody knows. 

Homie could have not played PvP for 5 years. We don't know. 

Imagine people could display their current ranks here. Would make things way more interesting. 

Edited by DanAlcedo.3281
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Azure The Heartless.3261

Azure The Heartless.3261

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Posted (edited)
58 minutes ago, Gotejjeken.1267 said:

 

I don't, but since you two apparently want me to be...

How's quitting going bro?

 

*pearl clutching*

Where did I say I quit? Misinformation! I'll never be so proud as to announce my departure here. 

That was an inquiry about the possibility of refunding Janthir Wilds because spear does nothing for me on zerk since the instant rework (among other things). 

Granted a certain ranger player hoped I got my acc closed really hard in that thread.  Three guesses as to whom. ❤️

Now if you ask me how the refund went, it went very well thanks. Turns out they can just deactivate access to xpack content, which is exactly what I wanted.

The pve players really didn't like me not having the same opinion as them (or not just accepting an unsatisfying comtent change), though. They tried really hard to make sure I understood that. 

 💀🫶

Edited by Azure The Heartless.3261
I'm sure they'll make fine business owners someday
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