AFK Farmers

[Ayumi Spender.1082]

@"usnedward.9023" said:Having a Necro I have tried this "farming" on more than one occasion to watch the mechanics. I was kicked on all of those for "not using a skill". Now this was some time ago and sure that that hasn't changed. However When I see this type of farming it makes me curious because many of them are casting and usually on CD casting which means some type of triggering outside of the game and most likely a mouse clicking program or timed macro. SINCE neither involve programming changes I assume it is difficult for ANET to determine if they are present or not. Simply chatting with them cannot be used against them because they "could" have chat off.

I remember watching (if I remember correctly) a Guardian casting on CD so I dragged mobs over with my thief, I poofed then came back and rez'd until he was naked with broken armor.

I think this has moved from a pandemic to epidemic and wish ANET would address somehow but since kill-steal is not a mechanic of the game it doesn't hurt all that much other than these dopes taking advantage of a silent ANET.

I don't think you can turn off whispers, can you?Correct me if I'm wrong as I'm not in game at the moment, but I think all forms of my chat tabs have whisper on them even when I don't recall ever setting whisper to it.

[Faaris.8013]

@usnedward.9023 said:I remember watching (if I remember correctly) a Guardian casting on CD so I dragged mobs over with my thief, I poofed then came back and rez'd until he was naked with broken armor.

Cool story bro, but armor does not break when you get resurrected. You can die 100 times, if you always get resurrected, your armor will be just fine. So he definitely was not naked.

[Cranky wo Coffee.5914]

@"sorudo.9054" said:i just hope ppl don't automatically see necro's as bad, i main a necro but never AFK in groups......

Unfortunately it's too late for that. Necros might as well be the new "Bear Bow", the dirty name given to players with bad skill and tons of half naked bots running ranger with bear when this game began. Many people use Necro to AFK farm and "2nd Health bar" mentality(bad player skill combined with ignorance) leaves people with a poor view of Necro players anyway. Every time Necro get anything near good dps(in pve) there are massive hyperbolic threads and complaints ...(sorry off topic). end rant.

If you think someone is afk farming Anet has deemed this "o.k." get over it. If you think someone is botting, Report it and move on. End of Story.

[RoseofGilead.8907]

@Faaris.8013 said:

@usnedward.9023 said:I remember watching (if I remember correctly) a Guardian casting on CD so I dragged mobs over with my thief, I

poofed

then came back and rez'd until he was naked with broken armor.

Cool story bro, but armor does not break when you get resurrected. You can die 100 times, if you always get resurrected, your armor will be just fine. So he definitely was not naked.

If you die, being revived by another player doesn't negate armor damage. Your armor will still be damaged every time you die, and then it will start to break completely once every piece has been damaged. The only time it doesn't is if you die from falling damage or (I think) burning damage from lava.

[Abelisk.4527]

Maybe ANet should make an invisible "tally" that builds up the longer a player AFKs at a single spot WHILE attacking. If you are around the same spot and haven't moved anywhere and you're constantly attacking enemies (and attacking the air perhaps) then the tally slowly builds up and over time, you'll be notified to move out of the spot to prevent getting suspended. The notification may occur after 20-50 minutes (randomly to prevent bot countercoding) after doing such a practice, which then a conscious, non-bot player would then understand and move out of the way and find another spot.

It's highly unlikely that a conscious player would trigger the tally, since I believe it's possible to set up an algorithm that captures bots mostly instead of conscious players, even if the conscious player is farming. Even then, conscious players are generally moving around to slay as many enemies as they can (most of the time) rather than waiting for respawns on a singular spot.

[Abelisk.4527]

@Biff.5312 said:What annoys me more is people who join a world event and just sit there on their mount like they're too good to help the rest of us. They just collect the loot and leave. It's irksome but it doesn't ultimately affect my game so I don't get too worked up about it.

I've done this before. Why? I had to use the bathroom. Then I grabbed a quick snack and came back to find the world boss dead.

Granted some players may actually regularly AFK (chronic AFKers around Octovine for example) but for people like me with the occasional IRL stuff, I have no choice.

[Cranky wo Coffee.5914]

@"Abelisk.4527" said:Maybe ANet should make an invisible "tally" that builds up the longer a player AFKs at a single spot WHILE attacking. If you are around the same spot and haven't moved anywhere and you're constantly attacking enemies (and attacking the air perhaps) then the tally slowly builds up and over time, you'll be notified to move out of the spot to prevent getting suspended. The notification may occur after 20-50 minutes (randomly to prevent bot countercoding) after doing such a practice, which then a conscious, non-bot player would then understand and move out of the way and find another spot.

It's highly unlikely that a conscious player would trigger the tally, since I believe it's possible to set up an algorithm that captures bots mostly instead of conscious players, even if the conscious player is farming. Even then, conscious players are generally moving around to slay as many enemies as they can (most of the time) rather than waiting for respawns on a singular spot.

Anet have officially stated that AFK Farming is ok, botting is not. As long as you respond to a GM and are not determined to be botting you can afk farm. The original comment from Chris Cleary is no longer available on the old forums, maybe some one has it on screen shot.

[Super Hayes.6890]

They probably are getting hammered since they don't have to be at the keyboard while they farm...

[Glacial.9516]

@Laila Lightness.8742 said:I wish anet couldmake it so ifyou dont move every 5 mins and use skills youdiscconect

There is already a mechanism to disconnect players after a period of inactivity. I believe in WvW its 15 minutes, and in most maps it may be 60. Five minutes however is much too short. I spend more than 5 minutes standing still waiting for people to show up for bounties or other events, or doing laundry while waiting for a meta to start. Regardless, the problem isn't the auto-disconnect. If players are farming for hours then they are already bypassing this mechanism and reducing the time is only harmful to non-botters. On the flip side if players are NOT bypassing the disconnect mechanic (ie. Just using ctrl+right click on skills) then I do believe they're within the boundaries of what is allowed.

I tend to say report and move on. There's little more you can do. Just because the person isn't temporarily banned from your report doesn't mean it wasn't or won't be effective. I suspect it would take several minor infractions before any action is taken.

[Bloodstealer.5978]

@"usnedward.9023" said:Having a Necro I have tried this "farming" on more than one occasion to watch the mechanics. I was kicked on all of those for "not using a skill". Now this was some time ago and sure that that hasn't changed. However When I see this type of farming it makes me curious because many of them are casting and usually on CD casting which means some type of triggering outside of the game and most likely a mouse clicking program or timed macro. SINCE neither involve programming changes I assume it is difficult for ANET to determine if they are present or not. Simply chatting with them cannot be used against them because they "could" have chat off.

I remember watching (if I remember correctly) a Guardian casting on CD so I dragged mobs over with my thief, I poofed then came back and rez'd until he was naked with broken armor.

I think this has moved from a pandemic to epidemic and wish ANET would address somehow but since kill-steal is not a mechanic of the game it doesn't hurt all that much other than these dopes taking advantage of a silent ANET.

If you watch them and then time their skills activation.. they are always exactly the same... so for 4+months those exploiters at the jotun camp in timberline falls have been really, really, really dedicated to keep accurately timing their moves 24/7.So yeah I smell a big fat rat of a macro behind them .. maybe ANET can enlighten us all as to whether it's now ok for everyone to do this, no one ever has to play the game as was intended, we can all let a mouse clicker macro/bot do it all for us instead.

[Bloodstealer.5978]

@Abelisk.4527 said:

@Biff.5312 said:What annoys me more is people who join a world event and just sit there on their mount like they're too good to help the rest of us. They just collect the loot and leave. It's irksome but it doesn't ultimately affect my game so I don't get too worked up about it.

I've done this before. Why? I had to use the bathroom. Then I grabbed a quick snack and came back to find the world boss dead.

Granted some players may actually regularly AFK (chronic AFKers around Octovine for example) but for people like me with the occasional IRL stuff, I have no choice.

You do.. you log out and let others into the map. When RL has settled down you can happily log back in and begin playing again.

[Illconceived Was Na.9781]

@"UnDeadFun.5824" said:Anet have officially stated that AFK Farming is ok, botting is not. As long as you respond to a GM and are not determined to be botting you can afk farm. The original comment from Chris Cleary is no longer available on the old forums, maybe some one has it on screen shot.

In fact, they said, AFK farming is not okay. Inattentive farming is. ANet will use several methods to check, including whispering or mailing, and moving the character to another spot to see what happens. (I'll post some quotes below, as soon as I can document them.)

• Botting: not okay. Use of additional software to automate your movement/responses.
• AFK farming: not okay. Physically not present at the computer. This is possible without using "obvious" botting software, using otherwise innocuous tools like the software that came with your programmable mouse and setting a heal skill to auto-attack.
• Inattentive farming: fine. Present at the computer, more or less (more 'more' than 'less'), but nothing strenuous. Some folks manage the Wintersday JP "inattentively", others stick with durable turret or minion or bearbow builds that collect minor amounts of loot.

Again, if you suspect someone is violating the rules, report them. Use the in-game tool if you are in a rush (always use "botting", even if you think it's "just" AFK farming). Otherwise, use the exploits@arena.net email or file a support ticket, including relevant details such as time/place, toon names, screenshots (if you have them), suspect behavior(s), etc.

tl;dr report to ANet (not to the forums) if you suspect someone of not playing by the rules. Then leave it to ANet to decide how to handle it (whether as you'd hope or otherwise).

[Illconceived Was Na.9781]

Most Recent Comment Regarding AFK Farming Policies (on old forums)

According to Chris Cleary, Game Security Lead, aka Professor of Bearbow Math @Tyria State (2017-04-07)

1. [We] do investigate player reports for every issue. Sometimes these investigations can take some time, and we may choose to action in bulk rather than individually.
2. Harassment of any type is NOT OK. If you believe someone is not playing fair, please use the report feature. It not only helps us track the issue, but also helps us identify possible hotspot issues. Even [if the accused] has been ...actioned multiple times for using 3rd party tools, there are better ways to handle this [other than harassment].
3. [On 7 April 2017] we took action against a number of accounts that were involved in running 3rd party tools to automate gameplay. These “bots” create an unfair game experience for everyone and can cause a toxic atmosphere both in-game and out (as we see in this thread). We will continue to do our best to keep the game fair for everyone.

Here are the best ways to report another player:

• In-Game Player Reporting
• Email exploits@arena.net
• Customer Support Ticket

quoter's note: I moved the 'best ways' to the bottom (to be more easily seen) & changed a definite statement about a specific person to be a generic conditional about ANet's policies. The text is otherwise unchanged.

---

Rules of Thumb

2016-05-18

The auto-cast feature was never intended to be used as an AFK farming mechanism, and usage of the auto-cast feature while AFK is fine as long as it is not used to facilitate unattended gameplay.

Mastery auto-loot also stopping players from being flagged afk seems like a bug instead of a feature, and I’ll be sure to bring it up today while we have a chat about this internally.

1. Using skill (1 or more) while AFK
2. AFKing in a place where it is beneficial for your character to be at
3. Unresponsive to interaction with GMs

If all 3 of these apply to what you are doing, you may get actioned for it.

---

Responding to a Request for a Clear Statement on AFK Farming

2016-05-19

I would rather us fix the underlying issue with this rather than band-aid the issue by enforcing rules and punishments that don’t solve the issue at all.

The core issue here is we don’t want to have players feeling that their main source of income is generated while they are not at the computer. We have already started to see the impact of this in-game and within the community. Not only does this behavior impact players in the world when they run across a pack of unattended farmers, but also the players who are performing the unattended farming. Eventually these players spend less and less time actually playing the game, and more time unattended farming.

We see the same trends in players that use bots, macros and cheats. It eventually leads to players falling out of the game (from both encountering the impact in the world, or by participating themselves).

While there is an economic impact of having a large number of players farming like this, I’m more more concerned about behavior trends shifting than anything else.

The 3 rules above aren’t just for your protection, they are for everyone’s protection. GMs have been trained to identify and handle these situations, it’s one of the first things they learn. GMs are overly generous on the amount of time that players are given to respond.

As for how we intend on fixing that, some of us had a meeting today to talk about that. While there are some systems working against each other here, we all agreed that we didn’t want to make any changes that anyone would actually run into unless they were no longer at their keyboard for an extended period.

Rest assured, we aren’t going to take away auto-loot in the world, or remove your ability to auto-cast. Everything we implement will only impact players who aren’t actually performing actions. I’m sure when we do implement something, it’ll be in the patch notes to read about. Until then, follow the 3 rules above. After that, they won’t be relevant anymore.

(Automation is still against the rules, unless you are using it to play music in-game)

[Trae.2384]

@UnDeadFun.5824 said:

@"Abelisk.4527" said:Maybe ANet should make an invisible "tally" that builds up the longer a player AFKs at a single spot WHILE attacking. If you are around the same spot and haven't moved anywhere and you're constantly attacking enemies (and attacking the air perhaps) then the tally slowly builds up and over time, you'll be notified to move out of the spot to prevent getting suspended. The notification may occur after 20-50 minutes (randomly to prevent bot countercoding) after doing such a practice, which then a conscious, non-bot player would then understand and move out of the way and find another spot.

It's highly unlikely that a conscious player would trigger the tally, since I believe it's possible to set up an algorithm that captures bots mostly instead of conscious players, even if the conscious player is farming. Even then, conscious players are generally moving around to slay as many enemies as they can (most of the time) rather than waiting for respawns on a singular spot.

Anet have officially stated that AFK Farming is ok, botting is not. As long as you respond to a GM and are not determined to be botting you can afk farm. The original comment from Chris Cleary is no longer available on the old forums, maybe some one has it on screen shot.

Right but if I remember correctly that same statement or at least same thread stated using a program to avoid the afk auto kick is a violation. They also stated going afk in an "advantageous" spot is against rules as well so these people are doing both of those things. Auto clicking buttons to kill stuff for many hours straight standing still cant be anywhere near allowed in this mmo. I stayed in the area and killed mobs with my buddy to see what he was choosing that spot for and racked up a bunch of karka shells and powerful blood, not to mention the unbound magic every kill as well as the karma consumables. Doing this all night this guy probably wakes up to a bunch of currency once it's all converted. If you or I need karka shells we have to farm them or farm gold to buy them, its boring and not what Id prefer to be doing with my game time so when people do this they need to be banned like any other cheater would be. This is what happens to games when they go free to play, ppl make dummy accounts to bot and cheat, send the goods to their main accounts until the dummy account gets banned then simply make a new free account. If they were taken care of swiftly then it wouldnt be worth leveling a fresh account to 80 every couple days but how it is now ppl just use their main accounts. I see GWAMM title accounts doing this, that to me is insane.

[TheGrimm.5624]

@Rayti.6531 said:I think part of the problem is the immense number of reports ANet has to go through. Especially paired with the limited amount of report options I can't imagine how they are even supposed to manage those reports.

I don't know their software. I am a database engineer, that has coded audits into systems for 20+ years. In software its all about identifying patterns. Again, assume they have audits/transactions in place so it would be a matter of player x is within same areas x/y and moving or not and collecting loot within area. If repeated x times, its an audit. If audited transaction repeated with same frequency or in a repeatable time, then another action/audit. Its the same way you would auto-detect macros. Player x skills sequence and is there a pattern If so potential macro and action required.

[Faaris.8013]

@RoseofGilead.8907 said:

@Faaris.8013 said:

@usnedward.9023 said:I remember watching (if I remember correctly) a Guardian casting on CD so I dragged mobs over with my thief, I

poofed

then came back and rez'd until he was naked with broken armor.

Cool story bro, but armor does not break when you get resurrected. You can die 100 times, if you always get resurrected, your armor will be just fine. So he definitely was not naked.

If you die, being revived by another player doesn't negate armor damage. Your armor will still be damaged every time you die, and then it will start to break completely once every piece has been damaged. The only time it doesn't is if you die from falling damage or (I think) burning damage from lava.

You haven't tested this, right? Go test it and come back and confirm your statement.

[DeWolfe.2174]

@Neural.1824 said:

@Illconceived Was Na.9781 said:

PS A single farmer at Malchor's Leap isn't going to have a noticeable impact on the 8k supply of lodes on the TP.

Yes, but several farmers in different instances over 8+ months will.

Ever consider the Dev's made changes to the game that caused such changes? Like the last big dip in prices was when they added Siren's Landing map.

[DeWolfe.2174]

As a multiboxer who's been using a team of MM Necro's for years, don't assume someones not behind the screen. Seriously, some players are just outright rude to flat out toxic toward Necro's. The creeper's, as I call them, literally stalk and stare at my Necro's! I can be actively talking in map chat even and they'll still come up, lurk around, and I assume are reporting me. Maybe because the Necro's are all females and these players don't have decent boundaries, I don't know. What I do know is, TALK before assuming anything and give proper time to respond. We all play the game with non continuous attention spans, that's just normal behavior.

[sorudo.9054]

@UnDeadFun.5824 said:

@"sorudo.9054" said:i just hope ppl don't automatically see necro's as bad, i main a necro but never AFK in groups......

Unfortunately it's too late for that. Necros might as well be the new "Bear Bow", the dirty name given to players with bad skill and tons of half naked bots running ranger with bear when this game began. Many people use Necro to AFK farm and "2nd Health bar" mentality(bad player skill combined with ignorance) leaves people with a poor view of Necro players anyway. Every time Necro get anything near good dps(in pve) there are massive hyperbolic threads and complaints ...(sorry off topic). end rant.

If you think someone is afk farming Anet has deemed this "o.k." get over it. If you think someone is botting, Report it and move on. End of Story.the problem with this is that good necro players suffer under this prejudice, we need to carry whole parties but still get blamed at.and they wonder why ppl get anti-social.....

[RoseofGilead.8907]

@Faaris.8013 said:

@RoseofGilead.8907 said:

@Faaris.8013 said:

@usnedward.9023 said:I remember watching (if I remember correctly) a Guardian casting on CD so I dragged mobs over with my thief, I

poofed

then came back and rez'd until he was naked with broken armor.

Cool story bro, but armor does not break when you get resurrected. You can die 100 times, if you always get resurrected, your armor will be just fine. So he definitely was not naked.

If you die, being revived by another player doesn't negate armor damage. Your armor will still be damaged every time you die, and then it will start to break completely once every piece has been damaged. The only time it doesn't is if you die from falling damage or (I think) burning damage from lava.

You haven't tested this, right? Go test it and come back and confirm your statement.

I just tested it using my son's level 14 toon on his account and one of my level 80s on my account. When my level 80 revived his level 14, the broken piece of armor did indeed fix itself. However, when his level 14 revived my level 80, the armor piece did not repair itself. Edit: Tried it three more times each way to be sure, and the result was the same. So, we're both technically right; a level 80 (and maybe other levels above the level 15 area) can definitely end up naked after repeatedly being killed/being revived, but a low level wouldn't be able to end up naked from it.

[Illconceived Was Na.9781]

@RoseofGilead.8907 said:I just tested it using my son's level 14 toon on his account and one of my level 80s on my account. When my level 80 revived his level 14, the broken piece of armor did indeed fix itself. However, when his level 14 revived my level 80, the armor piece did not repair itself.

Interesting. This apparently is new behavior, as I've never seen it before. Of course, I spend a lot less time sub-80 than before and what time I do spend, I rarely die.

Is your son's account fully vested? That is, does it have at least one level 80? i can imagine that this might (or might not) be a feature for newer accounts.

[RoseofGilead.8907]

@Illconceived Was Na.9781 said:

@RoseofGilead.8907 said:I just tested it using my son's level 14 toon on his account and one of my level 80s on my account. When my level 80 revived his level 14, the broken piece of armor did indeed fix itself. However, when his level 14 revived my level 80, the armor piece did not repair itself.

Interesting. This apparently is new behavior, as I've never seen it before. Of course, I spend a lot less time sub-80 than before and what time I do spend, I rarely die.

Is your son's account fully vested? That is, does it have at least one level 80? i can imagine that this might (or might not) be a feature for newer accounts.

It is interesting. His account is still pretty new (about three weeks, I guess), and he hasn't made it to level 80 on a character yet. So, it could definitely be something for new accounts. I guess I'll have to check it out again once he gets a character to 80.

[Illconceived Was Na.9781]

@RoseofGilead.8907 said:

@Illconceived Was Na.9781 said:

@RoseofGilead.8907 said:I just tested it using my son's level 14 toon on his account and one of my level 80s on my account. When my level 80 revived his level 14, the broken piece of armor did indeed fix itself. However, when his level 14 revived my level 80, the armor piece did not repair itself.

Interesting. This apparently is new behavior, as I've never seen it before. Of course, I spend a lot less time sub-80 than before and what time I do spend, I rarely die.

Is your son's account fully vested? That is, does it have at least one level 80? i can imagine that this might (or might not) be a feature for newer accounts.

It is interesting. His account is still pretty new (about three weeks, I guess), and he hasn't made it to level 80 on a character yet. So, it could definitely be something for new accounts. I guess I'll have to check it out again once he gets a character to 80.

I know that L80 toons rez'd in e.g. toypacalypse or dungeons don't get their armor repaired (source: just happened this week). So at best, it's a feature for sub-L80 toons.

[usnedward.9023]

@Faaris.8013 said:

@"usnedward.9023" said:I remember watching (if I remember correctly) a Guardian casting on CD so I dragged mobs over with my thief, I

poofed

then came back and rez'd until he was naked with broken armor.

Cool story bro, but armor does not break when you get resurrected. You can die 100 times, if you always get resurrected, your armor will be just fine. So he definitely was not naked.

Wrong BRO. If the player dies their armor breaks....try again :)

EDIT: I am willing to hook up with you in game and we can try it. He definitely was naked when I got done with him. From a downed state your response is true but from a death state the armor does break rez'd or not.

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Repairs

[usnedward.9023]

@Ayumi Spender.1082 said:

@"usnedward.9023" said:Having a Necro I have tried this "farming" on more than one occasion to watch the mechanics. I was kicked on all of those for "not using a skill". Now this was some time ago and sure that that hasn't changed. However When I see this type of farming it makes me curious because many of them are casting and usually on CD casting which means some type of triggering outside of the game and most likely a mouse clicking program or timed macro. SINCE neither involve programming changes I assume it is difficult for ANET to determine if they are present or not. Simply chatting with them cannot be used against them because they "could" have chat off.

I remember watching (if I remember correctly) a Guardian casting on CD so I dragged mobs over with my thief, I

poofed

then came back and rez'd until he was naked with broken armor.

I think this has moved from a pandemic to epidemic and wish ANET would address somehow but since kill-steal is not a mechanic of the game it doesn't hurt all that much other than these dopes taking advantage of a silent ANET.

I don't think you can turn off whispers, can you?Correct me if I'm wrong as I'm not in game at the moment, but I think all forms of my chat tabs have whisper on them even when I don't recall ever setting whisper to it.

Yes you can untick whisper in chat box options. I know in other MMOs when a GM would speak, say for a ticket, a separate window popped up. Not sure if ANET GM's actually can do this or not or how they communicate if they wanted to for outside of game play purposes.