[merged] About the Skyscale Timegate...

[HazyDaisy.4107]

@Rukario.1695 said:

@Linken.6345 said:

@HazyDaisy.4107 said:If it makes you feel better, the grow lamps are timegate too (1 per day). I don't know, but that made me laugh :).

wait you need more then 1 lamp?

You only need one lamp, the time-gate here isn't very relevant.

So far you only need 1 yes.

I just found it humorous in the case of those with loads of mats thinking they'd make loads of bucks off those that didn't have enough mat's to craft one lamp.

[PervMonk.4891]

@"bOTEB.1573" said:I see all of you are acting like the real problem is the time gate. When in fact the real problem is that you are upset of not getting the "toy" as fast as you want because you want it sooooo bad.There are time gates all over Tyria, let's remove all of them? After all you all said that time gating is bad design.If ANET remove this time gate, I want the WvW time gate to be removed too, the PvP too, the HoT meta events rewards too, the eaters too, the crafting too and anything else. After all, it is what you want, righ? Remove the time gate, coz it is a bad design, right guys?

clearly u dont understand what we are talking about

[Kidel.2057]

@HazyDaisy.4107 said:If it makes you feel better, the grow lamps are timegate too (1 per day). I don't know, but that made me laugh :).

as well as the Quartz ingredient itself.

Timegated ingredient for a timegated item in a timegated step (the food takes 4 days) in a timegated achievement. It's liek they did it on purpose but somehow didn't predict the storm.

[Kidel.2057]

@HazyDaisy.4107 said:

@Rukario.1695 said:

@Linken.6345 said:

@HazyDaisy.4107 said:If it makes you feel better, the grow lamps are timegate too (1 per day). I don't know, but that made me laugh :).

wait you need more then 1 lamp?

You only need one lamp, the time-gate here isn't very relevant.

So far you only need 1 yes.

I just found it humorous in the case of those with loads of mats thinking they'd make loads of bucks off those that didn't have enough mat's to craft one lamp.

The only reason why the lamp is 60g now is that the supply can't feed the demand BECAUSE of the timegating. If the lamp craft wasn't timegated the price would have been much lower despite the quartz crystals.

[CJtheBigBear.9610]

Well, I said I was going to bed hours ago and I'm still here, so I think I should actually force myself into bed now :joy:

Leaving this message to remind you all to please listen to Stephane and keep things clean and civil, especially if they decide to merge more threads into this one like they did yesterday. The people in those threads will not have been here when many things were explained, so please be patient when explaining these things to them.

To those who are coming here with intent of opposing ideas stated in the thread, please do take a quick look, or at the very least a skim, of the main arguments posted here these past few days, as they probably contain answers to the questions you have.

And to everyone, I ask that if you see anyone breaking the rules set by ANet in Stephane's last post, on either side, please simply report them with the forums' built-in report system, and drop it. It'll save a lot of drama and effort on all sides.

Thank you once again to those who have helped me try and keep order on this thread in these hectic days, and good morning night.

[Cragga the Eighty Third.60]

Ever since the Zephyrite festival caused the price of quartz to plunge to near worthlessness, I've been charging my overflow quartz instead of selling it, which puts me in a pretty sweet spot now.

But I've been saying since last year that a big quartz sink is badly needed. This could be it. It costs 25 quartz to make a time-gated charged quartz crystal. What if you could buy a non-time-gated charged quartz crystal from a merchant for, say 100 quartz? or 200 quartz? Solution to the time-gate problem, quartz would be worth something again, and the next Zephyrite festival (where quartz was handed out like candy) would be a huge deal again.

Please think about it, Anet! Sounds like a win-win-win situation to me!

[Kidel.2057]

To the people defending the Skyscale collection: just wait until you are at the feeding part.

I mean, even the rest of us don't know anything about the last step. For what we know it may be even worse (by the look of the trend, it's probably going to be worse).

[Daishi.6027]

Everybody wins if collection time gates are removed. I don’t see why people are fighting so hard for restrictions. (Giving the benefit of the doubt this isn’t just trolling)

If you want to wait 24 hours between each one, or just feed the thing only 3 times each day; fine you can actively do it.

What difference would it make if others could go past unhindered?

Some time gates are fine, for example behind a world boss, or a meta event, bounties, something like that is generally okay since they are on set timers that come up multiple times per day. But for various reasons many have posted daily reset is just to restrictive, and frankly to long. It’s like a mobile game telling you you can’t play.

Plus the biggest issue in all of this was expectation and communication, not that I really want to see this design in the future but people would be much more receptive of time gated content if there was transparency and not locked to a single hour per day.

[ZDragon.3046]

@Aerlen.5326 said:

@"bOTEB.1573" said:I see all of you are acting like the real problem is the time gate. When in fact the real problem is that you are upset of not getting the "toy" as fast as you want because you want it sooooo bad.There are time gates all over Tyria, let's remove all of them? After all you all said that time gating is bad design.If ANET remove this time gate, I want the WvW time gate to be removed too, the PvP too, the HoT meta events rewards too, the eaters too, the crafting too and anything else. After all, it is what you want, righ? Remove the time gate, coz it is a bad design, right guys?

Did you even read what I wrote?

Timegate? Annoying but that's all it is. Managable so long as the entire quest can be soloed at one's own pace.

The problem? Collections that cannot be soloed in a game where the playerbase moves on quickly and can make some collections near impossible to complete - IE once the people really excited for this mount who started at Day One are done with the entire collection chain then good luck getting the non-soloable parts done if you lagged behind or started late. We've seen this with Wayfarer's Henge and Griffon already.

Ok let me rebuttal thisI hear what you are saying but consider thisYour whole example here as a concept is still going to happen, ontop of that in the future no one is going to want to help you knowing that you will get stuck after you finish one particular part. There will never be trains for this mount unlock in the far future because of the needlessly long time gate. Progress stops you for a full day.

I still see trains for mastery points in HoT areas , PoF areas, and occasionally/rarely i still see commander trains for Griffion unlock.Whats going to happen when everyone who finishes this mount in a few weeks never ever wants anything to do with the collection ever again. There wont be full trains for it because its not possible to run from start to finish at any single time or within any reasonable span of time. Even if you get a commander to help you with collection 1 what if the commander never comes back to help you with 2-5 because you cant progress them till the next days. What if that commander does collection 2 on the 2nd day but some people cant play that next day or log on at that time the commander is doing the collection.

What you are saying logically makes no sense because its still going to happen anyways and with many more reasons why there wont be people to help with non soloable parts. There are people even now who are very far behind in the collection stages and are struggling finish in a day (i feel bad for the people who have been on collection 2 for a few days now). While the majority of people who can "play every day for hours a day" Are on the 3rd step, it means the rest are not. For every day that passes more and more people will fall out of sync with those who are a day or two in some rare cases (3 days) ahead of everyone else.

The only real benefit to being behind from a time gate perspective is that there will likely be a guide to help you out a bit by the time you reach the next stage which without a doubt people are going to use to rush through it if they can.

While the time gate may delay players from completing it right away it wont solve the problem of players getting left behind if anything its going to split people more and more even more so when people who are on step 2 cant get help from the majority people who are on step 4 or 5. In the end its still going to happen and i cant see how time gating this drastically really going to help for the long term of the situation you presented. Because its causing so much frustration now what makes you think people will want to go back and help others later on 2-4 weeks from now who are on collection 1 or 2. Im on step 3 and cant progress for the next 3 days do you think im going to go back and help people on step 2 no... im done with it unless they are guildmates or close friends certainly not.

[RizelStar.3724]

@"Cragga the Eighty Third.6015" said:Ever since the Zephyrite festival caused the price of quartz to plunge to near worthlessness, I've been charging my overflow quartz instead of selling it, which puts me in a pretty sweet spot now.

But I've been saying since last year that a big quartz sink is badly needed. This could be it. It costs 25 quartz to make a time-gated charged quartz crystal. What if you could buy a non-time-gated charged quartz crystal from a merchant for, say 100 quartz? or 200 quartz? Solution to the time-gate problem, quartz would be worth something again, and the next Zephyrite festival (where quartz was handed out like candy) would be a huge deal again.

Please think about it, Anet! Sounds like a win-win-win situation to me!

Almost a win but we can already by skyscale food on TP.

However in my opinion where you were headed isn’t all that bad IMO.

[eldrin.6471]

after the resent layoffs at anet you would think customer satisfaction would be a top priority.

[octagon.6504]

It's starting to become an issue of effort being equal to reward. If this was a legendary mount I could understand all the requirements. But basically it's main talents are the ability to hover and ascend. Now it seems easier to get a legendary weapon then it is to get a mount. Or, are mounts considered legendary because they are... mounts?

[LucianDK.8615]

From that shaman's post about the skyscale datamining. The one whom claimed 247 unlocks more, did not even read it properly. Its in total.

https://thatshaman.com/files/skyscale.txt

[Starfall Leyline.2481]

@"ZDragon.3046" said:

While the time gate may delay players from completing it right away it wont solve the problem of players getting left behind if anything its going to split people more and more even more so when people who are on step 2 cant get help from the majority people who are on step 4 or 5. In the end its still going to happen and i cant see how time gating this drastically really going to help for the long term of the situation you presented. Because its causing so much frustration now what makes you think people will want to go back and help others later on 2-4 weeks from now who are on collection 1 or 2. Im on step 3 and cant progress for the next 3 days do you think im going to go back and help people on step 2 no... im done with it unless they are guildmates or close friends certainly not.

Thankfully for this unlock, trains aren't a requirement, and there are players who will go back and help you with the collections (I'm one of them). Unlock trains make things easy, but this seems more like Anet wanted a "personal journey" type thing. I can "live with" the time gate even though I'm not thrilled with it, because I see that Anet was trying to give an experience of you actually raising the mount - Whether or not someone wants that experience is a different matter. Me? I actually do kinda like raising the skyscale, but it was a disappointment when at first I thought I was going to be able to get it right away and realized how long it was going to take.

I think Anet's mistake was not telling people that it would be a process, and instead making it sound like "Pick up your Skyscale today!!!" I also think the Skyscale mount should be a bit stronger given the amount of time and effort invested in getting it. I said in another thread, having the stamina last 15-20% longer would be good - and I don't mean wall jumping, I mean enough stamina that it doesn't feel like you're constantly struggling to get up off the ground. Either that, or a mastery with the next Living World chapter that increases the stamina.

It Is An Optional Mount - they have "rentals" all throughout the map where you need it, so you don't actually have to get it to use it, which is a boon. If they tweak it to give it a little more freedom, I think it'll be a great mount. But they did posterboard the finale with it, and so everyone was revving at the gates to get it. I think they had a better approach with the Griffon where it was literally a hidden, unannounced mount that was a "pleasant surprise" for those who wanted to get it.

I won't be stopping till I have my Skyscale, and that may take me a while. Anet, just make sure it's a mount that's really worth waiting for. And give me the ability to name my mounts plx. If I'm going to raise this dragon, I want the ability to friggin name him.

[Wondrouswall.7169]

Kind of weird to see them still using timegates without microtransactions to speed them up. From the other side of the fence, the grass is greener here. Regardless, no matter how it's used, it seems to end up rubbing a players the wrong way. (drops 2 cents in the penny tray)

[Starfall Leyline.2481]

@"Wondrouswall.7169" said:Kind of weird to see them still using timegates without microtransactions to speed them up. From the other side of the fence, the grass is greener here. Regardless, no matter how it's used, it seems to end up rubbing a players the wrong way. (drops 2 cents in the penny tray)

I don't think it's weird entirely. It's weird if you're assuming they're trying to get money out of it, yeah, but as I look at how this is structured, I think it was much more about the experience. They wanted to simulate raising a dragon - just without players having to wait actual years for said dragon to grow up. So this is like... "raising in miniature." From that perspective, a story perspective, it makes sense that it isn't accompanied with microtransactions.

Of course, the irony is, with the outcry that people have had with the Time-gates (my own included at first), they just might introduce microtransactions to speed it up.

[Wondrouswall.7169]

@Starfall Leyline.2481 said:I don't think it's weird entirely. It's weird if you're assuming they're trying to get money out of it, yeah.

My apologies, it was not meant that way. Many games have been using timegates with microtransactions as of late, and to return to GW2 and see a timegate without microtransactions is jarring [to me]. Guess I'm cynical of the industry as a whole now.

Some publishers/developers wouldn't bat an eyelash to the idea of adding a 10, 25, 50, or 100 Gem tag next to timegated occurrences just to test the waters.

[Kidel.2057]

@"LucianDK.8615" said:From that shaman's post about the skyscale datamining. The one whom claimed 247 unlocks more, did not even read it properly. Its in total.

https://thatshaman.com/files/skyscale.txt

Saddle and Lost could even mean more time-gated or pricy items. Als ffs, 80 more items...And it seems some are related to the personal PoF story.

I hope they won't require tedious or bugged achievements. At this point we are walking on the edge of a huge collective table flip.

This may be actually longer compared to a Legendary collection, even without the time gate.

We are looking at 250 collection items over a collection that lasts from 9 days to a month and who knows how many gold of value.

[LucianDK.8615]

If you remember the beetle collection, you made a saddle there too

[Elesmira.3782]

I m not really the guy who comes on forum to complain often but since the matter is also concerning me I would just toss my opinion on the matter here as well.

I love the game I loved the last episode and I also love this mount and how it works. Not saying its perfect but I love the mechanics around it. Now aside from that I must say I m pretty frustrated about the time gating that it requires but my reason is not just that I m waiting 24 hours or so but the fact that I m currently serving in the military of my country and I can't be home every day. My time at home is restricted and I would have loved it if I could just melt myself for a few hours and then get the mount since I m already time gated from my obligations in army. Yet apparently I ll have to wait up a month or more to get something that could be complete way easier.As someone said above if someone wants to take his time and Co. Plete the collections he is free to do it, but forcing and restricting everyone with needless time restrictions while they might have their own RL ones is borderline annoying to say the least.I appreciate the work u have done to deliver a fantastic episode but u can erase this mistake with just a tiny patch and remove needless restrictions. Please do...

[Kidel.2057]

At least Anet can still change the final steps before we see them. Guess the timegate could be useful

[Etria.3642]

Erase my prior complaints. I have been having a blast, from the suicide squads in DR to working on my flameseeker achieve while waiting to hving a use for my quartz crystals.

Now that I can get xp, I really have no issues. the chapter was great, the thing I wanted to happen, happened, our entire discord is helping each other progress, from making lamps to sharing waypoints.

Please anet don't take what the overfussers have to say too seriously.

[Lundarion.1968]

hello guys and girls. all in all i like the collections and the story for the skyscale very much. the journey around the new map for the scales and sick dragons where okay, but after this again 21 eggs to find, where kinda annoying for me. having to pause after a big collection and wait for a daily reset is also okay for me. i really had fun to travel around the world and infuse my egg with different kinds of magic. again, after this collection it was okay to have a time-gate as the daily reset.

i was so happy as my tiny little dragon came out of its egg and i wanted to explode into glitter because its so cute. i was ready to travel and collect the different kinds of treats and now i am ready with this whole collection except the lamp and (of course) the feeding part. i think this is kinda cruel to force us to wait a whole day after feeding the baby 3 times, just to feed it again 3 times. is it really necessary to also use a material (quartz) that only can be crafted 1 time a day?

my opinion to its usefulness:i liked to fly around with the borrowed dragons and i find it really practical to be able to stop in the air to look around, re-think or something like that, where in comparison the springer falls down fast, and the griffon just keeps gliding down. but for me, the skyscale could be way cooler. i dont need it to fly around indefinetly, but a bit more flight energy could be better. id like to be able to do a moving forward combo with the roll where it skips the loss of flight energy so it is really practical and kinda fun to use. but as it is now, when you are flying straight forward and then do the roll, your flight energy decreases as fast as you move forward with it. i hope you can understand what i mean.sorry for my bad english :-D

[Starfall Leyline.2481]

@Etria.3642 said:Erase my prior complaints. I have been having a blast, from the suicide squads in DR to working on my flameseeker achieve while waiting to hving a use for my quartz crystals.

Now that I can get xp, I really have no issues. the chapter was great, the thing I wanted to happen, happened, our entire discord is helping each other progress, from making lamps to sharing waypoints.

Please anet don't take what the overfussers have to say too seriously.

I have to admit, the fact that this mount release literally resulted in mass suicides in DR is deliciously hilarious. I actually kind of enjoyed throwing myself off of the side of the stairs for people to rez. I still think the mount needs to be stronger (more stamina) to justify the amount of time and effort, but the collections of the second part were kinda fun.

[Kidel.2057]

@LucianDK.8615 said:If you remember the beetle collection, you made a saddle there too

It's probably a different saddle. For what we know it may even require ascended mats (for the timegated trend)