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  • Artyport.2084Artyport.2084 Member ✭✭✭

    @MithranArkanere.8957 said:

    @Artyport.2084 said:

    @MithranArkanere.8957 said:
    Since mesmers are often artists, a bard would work better as a mesmer elite specialization, but since Chronomancer is already a support role, a mesmer bard would have to be an offensive/debuff bard. Like a Jester or a a Court Bard.

    The weapon would have to be as musical as possible. Since the most musical legendary weapon is already used by mesmers (The Minstrel), it'll have to be something different, and the next best thing is a two handed axe held like a guitar. So it'll have to be a new weapon type.

    Something like this:

    • Mesmer : Banshee (aka Court Bard or Virtuoso/a)
      • New Weapon: 2h Great Axe. (held like a guitar)
      • New skill type: Chants (Basically AoE signet, they have a small passive effect on allies or enemies while active, and can be activated for a 'Finale' with a greater effect)
      • Profession mechanic: Banshee wails. Clones no longer run all the way to the enemy to shatter, instead now the banshee and the clones shout in place before shattering while facing the target, and their effects are now a cone in front of them, so the clones will only move close enough for the shouts to hit.
      • Playstyle focus: Enemy debuff, control, disables.
      • Theme: METAL. Weapon skills sound like guitar riffs, the banshee wails are metal shouts, and the chants are metal songs.

    The mesmer sacrifices its 'gracefulness' to gain impact. Rather than charming enemies with subtle spells and dancing movements, confuse them with loud noises charged with mesmer magic.

    In the lines of stuff like these:

    What? A two handed axe? Held like a guitar? Nooooo just nooo lol.

    Hello warhorn!
    Put it in mainland.
    Shoot notes.

    I’d also like a buff/debug spec
    But make it still cute and call it a siren

    If it was a cute and gentle character, it'd be support, and Chronomancer does that already. It has to be aggressive. Metal.
    So it can't be a soft-voiced siren. It has to be a Banshee destroying the eardrums of enemies.

    A horn is not metal. If you read Soul Music by Terry Pratchett, you learn that to have rocks in it, it has to be a guitar. And to be a guitar, it has to be an axe. And since 1h axe has been used already, we need a 2h axe added to the roster of weapons.

    There's just no way around it. I do not make the rules, I just follow them.

    also i love a cute and sweet character that will destroy lives!!!!

  • Airdive.2613Airdive.2613 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Everyone can become a bard (sort of) in Siren's Landing. Many people concluded it's the closest we will get to bards in GW 2.

  • @Eekasqueak.7850 said:
    If thief got a more support spec I think it'd be more fitting to be a "spell thief" style thing, Bard doesn't fit at all and tbh I'd rather have Paragon as a spec for Guardian since that's the guild wars bard equivalent.

    Bard fits. Thief has a lot of references to dungeon a d dragons built into their kits. When we look at the design of the bards in 3.5, and pathfinder 1.0 and 2.0B, and 5e we can see that their lives started off as a martial rogue that eventually picked up spell casting. In fact, they made better spell blades in 3.5 and pathfinder than the actual spellblade.

    Build wise they are incredibly versatile, from being a bruiser, a ranged user, CC demon, or a mastermind. Itd be a nice addition to thief.

  • draxynnic.3719draxynnic.3719 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I'm tempted to bring up Bootts' "go permastealth and chase around enemy players in WvW playing music" build... but to be more serious:

    In a way, Firebrand already has a bit of the 'keeper and teller of history' feel.

    Mesmer, thief, and guardian are probably the best fits for a bard archetype, particularly since none of them have warhorns yet. Guardian has probably already gone there with Firebrand. Thief would work, on a similar basis to how the daredevil already has a reduced reliance on stealth: the minstrel thief could similarly be based around the idea of being unafraid of the spotlight but able to hide when they need to. Mesmer is... intuitively probably the most obvious, but it does have the complicating factor that mesmers are a heavy magic profession, while the bard archetype is usually more associated with employing more martial fighting styles while having a bit of magic to support that, which is a behaviour that fits better with thieves.

  • Eekasqueak.7850Eekasqueak.7850 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497 said:

    @Eekasqueak.7850 said:
    If thief got a more support spec I think it'd be more fitting to be a "spell thief" style thing, Bard doesn't fit at all and tbh I'd rather have Paragon as a spec for Guardian since that's the guild wars bard equivalent.

    Bard fits. Thief has a lot of references to dungeon a d dragons built into their kits. When we look at the design of the bards in 3.5, and pathfinder 1.0 and 2.0B, and 5e we can see that their lives started off as a martial rogue that eventually picked up spell casting. In fact, they made better spell blades in 3.5 and pathfinder than the actual spellblade.

    Build wise they are incredibly versatile, from being a bruiser, a ranged user, CC demon, or a mastermind. Itd be a nice addition to thief.

    Spellthief is from DnD too, we don't really have a class with a boonstealing focus yet and with mirage taking from thief we should have a thief spec borrow from mesmer in that regard.

  • draxynnic.3719draxynnic.3719 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Between Bountiful Theft and Larcenous Strike, thieves are already probably better at boonstealing than mesmers - mesmers have more boonrip in general, but apart from Arcane Thievery it just removes the boon altogether rather than stealing it.

    Doesn't mean there can't be room for more, though, kinda like how chronomancer was mostly enhancing things the mesmer already had (even if I do think there's a bit of guardian in chronomancer).

  • Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited October 2, 2018

    @Eekasqueak.7850 said:

    @Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497 said:

    @Eekasqueak.7850 said:
    If thief got a more support spec I think it'd be more fitting to be a "spell thief" style thing, Bard doesn't fit at all and tbh I'd rather have Paragon as a spec for Guardian since that's the guild wars bard equivalent.

    Bard fits. Thief has a lot of references to dungeon a d dragons built into their kits. When we look at the design of the bards in 3.5, and pathfinder 1.0 and 2.0B, and 5e we can see that their lives started off as a martial rogue that eventually picked up spell casting. In fact, they made better spell blades in 3.5 and pathfinder than the actual spellblade.

    Build wise they are incredibly versatile, from being a bruiser, a ranged user, CC demon, or a mastermind. Itd be a nice addition to thief.

    Spellthief is from DnD too, we don't really have a class with a boonstealing focus yet and with mirage taking from thief we should have a thief spec borrow from mesmer in that regard.

    What is a bard other than a thief signing away his soul for mesmer abilities. A lot of bard spells are often some form of hypnosis, suggestion, sonic attack, mind flay, and some of it requires the bard to be perceived.

  • Eekasqueak.7850Eekasqueak.7850 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497 said:

    @Eekasqueak.7850 said:

    @Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497 said:

    @Eekasqueak.7850 said:
    If thief got a more support spec I think it'd be more fitting to be a "spell thief" style thing, Bard doesn't fit at all and tbh I'd rather have Paragon as a spec for Guardian since that's the guild wars bard equivalent.

    Bard fits. Thief has a lot of references to dungeon a d dragons built into their kits. When we look at the design of the bards in 3.5, and pathfinder 1.0 and 2.0B, and 5e we can see that their lives started off as a martial rogue that eventually picked up spell casting. In fact, they made better spell blades in 3.5 and pathfinder than the actual spellblade.

    Build wise they are incredibly versatile, from being a bruiser, a ranged user, CC demon, or a mastermind. Itd be a nice addition to thief.

    Spellthief is from DnD too, we don't really have a class with a boonstealing focus yet and with mirage taking from thief we should have a thief spec borrow from mesmer in that regard.

    What is a bard other than a yhief signing away his soul for mesmer abilities

    It can be a lot of things, but 'stealthy' isn't one of them which is pretty core to the theme of thief IMO. While I agree that thief could use a support spec, I'd rather bard just go to mesmer(like how they showed mesmer as a bard before 'breaking the illusion' and revealing mesmer officially leading up to the game's release) and thief get something along the lines of spellthief. A thief who focuses on stealing boons and mimicking magic users would be much more thematic than a thief who plays music in combat.

  • Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited October 2, 2018

    @Eekasqueak.7850 said:

    @Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497 said:

    @Eekasqueak.7850 said:

    @Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497 said:

    @Eekasqueak.7850 said:
    If thief got a more support spec I think it'd be more fitting to be a "spell thief" style thing, Bard doesn't fit at all and tbh I'd rather have Paragon as a spec for Guardian since that's the guild wars bard equivalent.

    Bard fits. Thief has a lot of references to dungeon a d dragons built into their kits. When we look at the design of the bards in 3.5, and pathfinder 1.0 and 2.0B, and 5e we can see that their lives started off as a martial rogue that eventually picked up spell casting. In fact, they made better spell blades in 3.5 and pathfinder than the actual spellblade.

    Build wise they are incredibly versatile, from being a bruiser, a ranged user, CC demon, or a mastermind. Itd be a nice addition to thief.

    Spellthief is from DnD too, we don't really have a class with a boonstealing focus yet and with mirage taking from thief we should have a thief spec borrow from mesmer in that regard.

    What is a bard other than a yhief signing away his soul for mesmer abilities

    It can be a lot of things, but 'stealthy' isn't one of them which is pretty core to the theme of thief IMO. While I agree that thief could use a support spec, I'd rather bard just go to mesmer(like how they showed mesmer as a bard before 'breaking the illusion' and revealing mesmer officially leading up to the game's release) and thief get something along the lines of spellthief. A thief who focuses on stealing boons and mimicking magic users would be much more thematic than a thief who plays music in combat.

    You probably have not played bard if you think they can't be stealthy while performing.

    A performance does not need to be a song. It can simply be an act, a speech, or what ever. Ive already had a scary as hell assassin that was a full bard. His performance used ventriloquism and that magnification cantrip to make voices while he created shadow puppeys with the light.

    Shadowdancers, requires 6 ranks in Perform(dance).

    Rogues or Bards (who gains sneak attack) with shadowstepping and shades.

  • Eekasqueak.7850Eekasqueak.7850 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497 said:

    @Eekasqueak.7850 said:

    @Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497 said:

    @Eekasqueak.7850 said:

    @Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497 said:

    @Eekasqueak.7850 said:
    If thief got a more support spec I think it'd be more fitting to be a "spell thief" style thing, Bard doesn't fit at all and tbh I'd rather have Paragon as a spec for Guardian since that's the guild wars bard equivalent.

    Bard fits. Thief has a lot of references to dungeon a d dragons built into their kits. When we look at the design of the bards in 3.5, and pathfinder 1.0 and 2.0B, and 5e we can see that their lives started off as a martial rogue that eventually picked up spell casting. In fact, they made better spell blades in 3.5 and pathfinder than the actual spellblade.

    Build wise they are incredibly versatile, from being a bruiser, a ranged user, CC demon, or a mastermind. Itd be a nice addition to thief.

    Spellthief is from DnD too, we don't really have a class with a boonstealing focus yet and with mirage taking from thief we should have a thief spec borrow from mesmer in that regard.

    What is a bard other than a yhief signing away his soul for mesmer abilities

    It can be a lot of things, but 'stealthy' isn't one of them which is pretty core to the theme of thief IMO. While I agree that thief could use a support spec, I'd rather bard just go to mesmer(like how they showed mesmer as a bard before 'breaking the illusion' and revealing mesmer officially leading up to the game's release) and thief get something along the lines of spellthief. A thief who focuses on stealing boons and mimicking magic users would be much more thematic than a thief who plays music in combat.

    You probably have not played bard if you think they can't be stealthy while performing.

    A performance does not need to be a song. It can simply be an act, a speech, or what ever. Ive already had a scary as hell assassin that was a full bard. His performance used ventriloquism and that magnification cantrip to make voices while he created shadow puppeys with the light.

    Shadowdancers, requires 6 ranks in Perform(dance).

    Rogues or Bards (who gains sneak attack) with shadowstepping and shades.

    Obscure rules doesn't make it thematically fitting and if it did end up in GW2 it would still look better on Mesmer.

  • Durzlla.6295Durzlla.6295 Member ✭✭✭✭

    If there’s a bard elite spec it will be called Minstrel and will probably be a Mesmer spec since bards are traditionally illusionists spell swords, which is the Mesmer MO.

    "But my children sing to me. Listen. They sing dark, delicious notes about power and family. As their mother, I have to grant them their wish."

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