Dye Kits need to be seriously looked at

Somewhat recently, Black Lion Keys were changed so that you got statuettes as a definite drop from chests. This was a very welcome change and since I actually started buying keys. It seemed like ArenaNet was looking at ways to make things more fair. Even Mount Licenses, even though in my opinion they were fine as random because the price was good and you always got a new skin, they then went and added Mount Select Licenses so you can simply choose.

The worst and most brutal RNG gamble however hasn't been looked at. And that is the horror which is Dye Kits. With these, it's all or nothing. There is no value in an 80c blue dye. I personally don't even consider buying these, because this is truly a case of money down the drain.

Please address this. A statuette-like system would be good, with every dye kit giving a "Smidgen of Dye" or some named currency (placeholder name) as a guaranteed drop. You would then be able to amass these to trade in for a rotating set of Exclusive Dye colours which would change over with every black lion chest cycle. It could be something like 20-30 Smidgens of Dye for a colour.

Wasting real money on rng black lion chests, better to buy food instead of pixels.

@googel.3278 said:Wasting real money on rng black lion chests, better to buy food instead of pixels.

Some of us are able to buy food, pay bills, and still have money to pay for pixels. Budgeting is a nice skill to have.

I don't know. We are able to get many of the Exclusive Dyes (albeit after a period of time) through Birthday Gifts. That seems pretty generous, to me.

@Inculpatus cedo.9234 said:I don't know. We are able to get many of the Exclusive Dyes (albeit after a period of time) through Birthday Gifts. That seems pretty generous, to me.

That's not really a reliable way to get the colours you're after. Also you can't even select newer kits from it.

@googel.3278 said:Wasting real money on rng black lion chests, better to buy food instead of pixels.

Not that it matters, but I never specified real money when I said I was buying keys.

@ProverbsofHell.2307 said:

@Inculpatus cedo.9234 said:I don't know. We are able to get many of the Exclusive Dyes (albeit after a period of time) through Birthday Gifts. That seems pretty generous, to me.

Thus, the 'albeit after a period of time' statement.

@googel.3278 said:Wasting real money on rng black lion chests, better to buy food instead of pixels.

Yes, the quality of food is worth the gold to get that extra 20 power.

@Sanity Obscure.6054 said:

@googel.3278 said:Wasting real money on rng black lion chests, better to buy food instead of pixels.

Ow yeah, badges of honor needs to be spent too! Steak and asparagus!

@ProverbsofHell.2307 said:Dye Kits. I personally don't even consider buying these, because this is truly a case of money down the drain.They are lotto tickets; they are designed to be generally worthless, with people hoping to get lucky. Before Birthday Gifts included them, I managed to acquire nearly all of them without spending gems, just waiting for prices on the TP I could afford.

Please address this.They did address it. With dye kits dropping like flies from BL chests. Price on the TP for the dyes that can drop from the exclusive kits in the BL chest are always low, sometimes lower than 5g.

@Illconceived Was Na.9781 said:

@ProverbsofHell.2307 said:Dye Kits. I personally don't even consider buying these, because this is truly a case of money down the drain.They are lotto tickets; they are designed to be generally worthless, with people hoping to get lucky. Before Birthday Gifts included them, I managed to acquire nearly all of them without spending gems, just waiting for prices on the TP I could afford.

Please address this.They did address it. With dye kits dropping like flies from BL chests. Price on the TP for the dyes that can drop from the exclusive kits in the BL chest are always low, sometimes lower than 5g.

But I don't think they should be lotto tickets. It doesn't make any sense. We have ecto gambling for that. At the moment some dyes are worth hundreds of gold, not even slightly affordable. How are we supposed to access the new colours? I get that they ARE meant to be exclusive, and are supposed to have a degree of rarity. What I'm suggesting preserves that. You would buy like 20-30 dye kits (which is a lot, you must agree), and are then able to pick just a single exclusive colour from a rotating set. I'm actually kind of surprised you don't agree with my suggestion.

It's not even that I'm against in-game lottos. I actually ecto gamble, I buy black lion keys and random licenses. And as someone who does, I'm telling you that dye kit gambling is absolute garbage and needs a currency system like statuettes. Nothing over-the-top, just a way to recoup some losses over a long period of time.

I save the common dyes and use them in the Mystic Forge when that's one of the dailies.

@Witch of Doom.5739 said:I save the common dyes and use them in the Mystic Forge when that's one of the dailies.

I mean I guess... why are you defending this?

@googel.3278 said:Wasting real money on rng black lion chests, better to buy food instead of pixels.

Because the Six forbid we use money on entertainment

@"ProverbsofHell.2307" said:But I don't think they should be lotto tickets.OK. You think they shouldn't be. I think it makes no difference to most of us.

It doesn't make any sense. We have ecto gambling for that.Ecto gambling is different from Lotto and it serves a different purpose. Ecto gambling is a minor sink for material (ecto) and coin. BL Dye Kits, BL Chest Keys are promotions to attract gem spending (and likely RL cash investments in the game).

The first is set up with high costs and either no reward or high reward. On average, you lose a small amount of wealth, but in practice, because the amounts involved are so huge, you end up with spectacular patterns (big gains or big losses), with extended losing streaks slightly outnumbering/outlasting winning streaks.

The second is setup as a lotto: relatively low cost, small chance of winning, big earnings on jackpot. On average, you lose 30-60% of your investment (public lottos in nearly all US states, most of the EU, and elsewhere are designed to average 50% returns). In practice, most people lose a little and a tiny fraction win big.

At the moment some dyes are worth hundreds of gold, not even slightly affordable.Yes, that is the design. Like I say, I just wait it out.

How are we supposed to access the new colours?Wait. Pay extra to get access now; pay 90-99% less if you wait.

And as someone who does, I'm telling you that dye kit gambling is absolute garbageAnd obviously, other people are demonstrating that it's not. I get you don't like the system. I'm not even against the idea. I am, however, against the idea of misrepresenting the intended design or stating that it's "bad" -- not liking the design isn't the same as bad design.

There are often these demands for real value in something that is expressly designed to be a gem sink. The point of BLCs was never to give you your money's worth. It is to give you a shot at something good but generally to provide junk, such that the odds favour the house. Buying keys is a frivolity, and should be expected to yield nothing but amusement. Sometimes one WILL pay off, but the more you buy, the less likely you are to find an imbalance of value in your favour.

If you took the gems you used to buy keys and converted to gold, you could buy the dyes you want and ultimately very probably save money.

As to your suggested system- that would be great, for players. They make more money the way it is now, or I'm sure they'd do it that way. The fact is there are enough people desperately buying key after key that there's no incentive for that kind of change. We can hope that may change, but I wouldn't hold your breath.

So are you guys against black lion key statuettes? I'm just trying to figure out what's going on here. ArenaNet has consistently been trying to make these "lotto" items more attractive. I bet Black Lion Keys sell a lot more now than prior to the statuettes, although of course I can only speculate on that, as can anyone else.

You say the system I suggested would only be good for the players but that's wrong - how many dye kits really get sold? I bet not many compared to the safer gambles in the game. This would encourage people to spend more on dyes for those who were put off at the prospect of gaining nothing.

Right now, statuettes are amazing because you get access to a pool of exclusive items. No key is a waste, you always get something valuable and worthwhile. I have reason to believe that adding a similar system for dye kits would benefit the company and the players.

I gamble a lot in this game in various ways, and there's nothing wrong with that, but I'm of the opinion that dye kits are simply a bad deal. The numbers just aren't there. Stick to keys or ecto gambling.

@Deimos.4263 said:I gamble a lot in this game in various ways, and there's nothing wrong with that, but I'm of the opinion that dye kits are simply a bad deal. The numbers just aren't there. Stick to keys or ecto gambling.

Yeah I'm glad there is someone who feels the same at least.

@Dante.1763 said:

@googel.3278 said:Wasting real money on rng black lion chests, better to buy food instead of pixels.

A shame that you're wasting all that money then. Dyes especially can be easily gained from birthday gifts.

@nosleepdemon.1368 said:

@Dante.1763 said:

@googel.3278 said:Wasting real money on rng black lion chests, better to buy food instead of pixels.

The absurdity of saying something can be easily gained... once a year that is. Oh and only certain dyes. The celebration dye choice doesn't include all dye packs, and usually it only includes the cheapest dyes.

@ProverbsofHell.2307 said:

@nosleepdemon.1368 said:

@Dante.1763 said:

@googel.3278 said:Wasting real money on rng black lion chests, better to buy food instead of pixels.

It's mostly the other way around: exclusive dyes become cheaper due to people receiving them as birthday gifts.

As to the point: the fact is that there is a steady supply of exclusive dyes with some of them being fairly accessible (and some being readily available for a higher price). It necessarily follows that there is a sufficient supply of dyes right now, either from gamblers or as occasional drops for various players.Now, you realize it's currently not profitable for you to engage in dye gambling. The solution is simple: don't gamble.

I don't buy Dye Kits because I can wait to get them from Birthday Gifts. It's not like you only get one Birthday Gift per year. There's one for every character. Plus, for me, they drop quite often in Black Lion Chests.The newer Dyes are only expensive because they haven't made it to the Birthday Gifts yet. I don't know if players would purchase 20, 30, 50 Dye Kits to redeem the 'statuette' (or whatever) for one Dye (and would it be random, like they are now even if you do hit the Exclusive Dye lotto?); I know I would rather wait the 6 to 12/15 months.Maybe they would. /shrug

@Airdive.2613 said:As to the point: the fact is that there is a steady supply of exclusive dyes with some of them being fairly accessible (and some being readily available for a higher price). It necessarily follows that there is a sufficient supply of dyes right now, either from gamblers or as occasional drops for various players.Now, you realize it's currently not profitable for you to engage in dye gambling. The solution is simple: don't gamble.

OK, dye kits are currently fine, the supply is fine, the prices are fine, the value of buying dye kits for gems is fine, it's all fine and there are no improvements that could currently be made to the system. The contrarians have won. o/