Kralkarotic´s mistake (Spoiler) — Guild Wars 2 Forums

Kralkarotic´s mistake (Spoiler)

Hi there, i would like to speak with the rest of the players about the last theory about the next chapter of the story.

In the last episode; all or nothing, we fougth and lost against the cristal dragon losing our only hope in the last heartbreaking scene; Aurene.

Lately, i have been reading about the theory of Yoko´s powers. Aurene ate Yoko so Aurene is inmortal. I have to admit this was the first though i had, but then i realize, imo, how lame it is. Because, if this is true, Aurene is inmortal and all the dangerous in the future story is lost for this character.

Nevertheless, my idea is the next:

We know that Glint is a dragon, a death dragon, and she is in the mist. So, we can conclude that when this kind of dragon dies, they go to the Mist. So, Aurene, rigth now, is inside the Mist.

Kralkatoric is injured, so is logical to think that is going to go to the mist to heals his wounds absorbing more magic. But, that is the best part... killing our dragon was a mistake.

who is going to be in the Mist waiting for him?

Aurene.

So we will go to the Mist for the last round, and be helped by Guild Wars character and the ones that have died in Guild Wars 2. A nostolgic reunion.

And, with this idea, the problem of the magic is solve. When Kralkatoric will die, someone has to absorb all the remaining magic, or it will go to Tyria, and the system will collapse. But, this problem does not exist in the Mist, because the magic would not reach the Tyria system.

Have fun.

Comments

  • Ashantara.8731Ashantara.8731 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 5, 2019

    I posted that theory weeks ago, so no news there. ;) Many assume that the Mists will play a role in this and that Aurene isn't "dead" dead.

    Also, we know that Ascension will play a role, because (the Memory of?) Glint talked to Aurene about it in private at the end of the trials mission.


    My GW2 content charts: (1) LWS 4, (2) PoF , (3) Personal story (pre-Claw Island/Orr) , (4) LWS 2 , (5) HoT, (6) Orr campaign , (7) LWS 3

  • derd.6413derd.6413 Member ✭✭✭✭

    this theory is nothing new tho i have to disagree with us killing kralk next episode

    (also glint is a dead dragon, not a death dragon)

    I Have No friends, so I Must pug

  • Do not forget the magic that dragons contain is also part of the system that maintains the balance in Tyria, and that magic does flow from the mists from the many rifts and 'thin' sports that naturally connect to it like the rift in the Hall of Primeval Kings and the rift to the Underworld.

    And it while the mists do not have space and time in the same way as in the physical plane that contains Tyria, it appears that Tyria has some sort of 'vicinity' in the mists that is easier to reach from Tyria and in which there's something closer to Tyrian time and space. Kind of like a blurry area of Tyria-ness and memories of the world that fades into more abstract mists. Like sand and scum floating in the water around an island.
    The gods had to leave this 'vicinity' to avoid getting pulled into the Dragon Conflict.

    If Kralkatorrik were to die in this 'vicinity', my guess is that rifts would open all over the place, and the magic he has gathered would seep back into Tyria slowly at first, then massively until everything goes out of wack and the world breaks apart.
    Like a house with holes on the roof during a a storm that makes a nearby dam overflow and eventually break.

  • Biff.5312Biff.5312 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I still maintain that since he absorbs the essence of dragons that have been killed, Aurene is now a part of Kralk. I don't think we'll end up killing him. I think we'll end up transforming him into something benign.

  • Ayakaru.6583Ayakaru.6583 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 5, 2019

    @vier.1327 said:

    Lately, i have been reading about the theory of Yoko´s powers. Aurene ate Yoko so Aurene is inmortal. I have to admit this was the first though >i had, but then i realize, imo, how lame it is. Because, if this is true, Aurene is inmortal and all the dangerous in the future story is lost for this >character.

    That is nothing more than conjecture. Its nothing but speculation that Aurene killing Joko will make her immortal, or allow her revival.
    Aurene was a key in defeating Joko, but that was to wrap up Joko’s story. He was immortal because he could drain magic and convert it to life force. Aurene was necessary to unbind that magic. If they pull a revival stunt on Aurene, it would be considered poor, if not downright terrible storyboard writing.

    We know that Glint is a dragon, a death dragon, and she is in the mist. So, we can conclude that when this kind of dragon dies, they go to the >Mist. So, Aurene, rigth now, is inside the Mist.

    I think you mean dead dragon? Zhaitan was the death dragon. But it’s only Glint we know of.
    There was no mention of the dead elder dragons, Vlast, etc. so we have one point from which we cannot extrapolate information.

    To defeat the dragons, see the good in them.
    Zhaitan reunites lost ones, primordus creates fertile land, mordremoth spreads the green, and jormag..
    ..jormag? Who's that?

  • Ayakaru.6583Ayakaru.6583 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 5, 2019

    @Biff.5312 said:
    I still maintain that since he absorbs the essence of dragons that have been killed, Aurene is now a part of Kralk. I don't think we'll end up killing him. I think we'll end up transforming him into something benign.

    Absorbing magic isn’t instant.
    Kralkatorrik is strong enough to consume large amounts in a short time (after killing Dramathazar), but we know that dragons take years to feast on leyline nodes.
    Mordremoth had been nibbling on the leyline islands, and Zhaitan needed to ‘digest’ magic as well.
    I think we sufficiently threatened Kralkatorrik that he decided to make a run for it without staying to consume Aurene.

    Possibly, the wound on his eye has broken his forme to an extend he felt he had a fatal wound he needed heal, not taking the risk to stay in a hallway with enemies who know his own brand can hurt him. (Just my thoughts, though)

    To defeat the dragons, see the good in them.
    Zhaitan reunites lost ones, primordus creates fertile land, mordremoth spreads the green, and jormag..
    ..jormag? Who's that?

  • Konig Des Todes.2086Konig Des Todes.2086 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 5, 2019

    @vier.1327 said:
    And, with this idea, the problem of the magic is solve. When Kralkatoric will die, someone has to absorb all the remaining magic, or it will go to Tyria, and the system will collapse. But, this problem does not exist in the Mist, because the magic would not reach the Tyria system.

    The system that collapses is not magical balance, but "elder dragon balance" or The All's balance. Regardless of the destination of magic, without a replacement for Zhaitan, Mordremoth, or Kralkatorrik, the world dies anyways.

    At the end of Path of Fire, Taimi stated that Kralkatorrik becoming more powerful would imbalance The All. The severe weakening, death, or severe empowerment of an Elder Dragon over others all imbalance The All.

    As stated by Taimi in Season 3, the magical influx isn't that great of an issue. Given what we've seen, it should handle two Elder Dragon deaths before world goes boom; but The All will give out before that could happen.

    @MithranArkanere.8957 said:
    magic does flow from the mists from the many rifts and 'thin' sports that naturally connect to it like the rift in the Hall of Primeval Kings and the rift to the Underworld.

    There's literally nothing to suggest this claim.

    @Biff.5312 said:
    I still maintain that since he absorbs the essence of dragons that have been killed, Aurene is now a part of Kralk. I don't think we'll end up killing him. I think we'll end up transforming him into something benign.

    Given that Tequatl or the Claws of Jormag or The Shatterers weren't/aren't part of Primordus, Kralkatorrik, Mordremoth, or Jormag, and given that the Elder Dragons have only shown to utilize the magic of dead Elder Dragons and former gods, it's unlikely that Aurene is part of Kralkatorrik even if he ate her magic.

    P.S. this probably belongs in the lore forum.

  • MithranArkanere.8957MithranArkanere.8957 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 6, 2019

    @Konig Des Todes.2086 said:

    @MithranArkanere.8957 said:
    magic does flow from the mists from the many rifts and 'thin' sports that naturally connect to it like the rift in the Hall of Primeval Kings and the rift to the Underworld.

    There's literally nothing to suggest this claim.

    It was mentioned by at least 2 devs when people asked about the leylines under LA and the flow of magic back during Season 1. Magic slowly comes into Tyria from the mists at certain spots like a fickle water spring slowly trickling water out of a crack in a rock, and one of those spots was under Lion's Arch somewhere where the LA leyline hub is.
    It has been pretty much established that Tyria isn't a completely closed system, that magic (and other things) come and go between Tyria and the mists, and that there's certain 'power spots' in which tearing reality is easier, and rifts to the mists are easier to create and may even appear naturally.
    Examples of those spots can be found the Battle Isles, the Tomb of the Primeval Kings, Ruins of Morah, in the Godlost Swamp, somewhere under Lion's Arch.
    Some were created by the gods to allow humans to visit the mists, others are naturally occurring, others were created by disasters like the fall of Abaddon, but they all have pretty much in common that they are a spot where it's easier to tear reality and get into the Mists.
    Even the Commander uses one of those spots in the PoF story to open a portal to the mists and contact the gods.

    All of that along everything else we know about the Mists tells us that Tyria does not exists within the mists as a closed system isolated from them, but that it's permeated by them.

    if I'm right on that, Kralkatorrik dying in the mists would quite probably mean that most of the magic would end up back into Tyria anyways, tearing apart reality in the process. Not in an explosive way like when the Bloodstone exploded, but like a pocket of water on the roof accumulating and gaining weight until the roof gives in.

    But even if my 'mists neighborhood' theory is not as correct as I think it is, and killing Kralkatorrik would trap or disperse the magic in the mists, preventing it from going back into Tyria, that would still be bad, since Tyria needs to keep its magic in balance and flowing. Without that magic, Tyria would keep getting out of whack until it breaks.

    Using the Antikythera of The All as reference. If I'm right Kralkatorrik's orb would zip back into the central orb like Zhaitan's orb in the Season 2 cutscene, and i'f I'm wrong Kralkatorrik's orb would lose its light, fly off the system, and the whole system would crash like with Taimi's simulation.

    Which means that killing Kralkatorrik in the mists would solve nothing either way, and that the only solution left we have is replacing Kralkatorrik with something else.

    So unless Aurene isn't 'all dead', we better hope there's other creatures or machines that can also do the same job, or we are screwed.

  • I don't know if this was ever pointed out but Aurene's Mom and Brother shattered when they died... Aurene did not

  • @MithranArkanere.8957 said:

    @Konig Des Todes.2086 said:

    @MithranArkanere.8957 said:
    magic does flow from the mists from the many rifts and 'thin' sports that naturally connect to it like the rift in the Hall of Primeval Kings and the rift to the Underworld.

    There's literally nothing to suggest this claim.

    It was mentioned by at least 2 devs when people asked about the leylines under LA and the flow of magic back during Season 1. Magic slowly comes into Tyria from the mists at certain spots like a fickle water spring slowly trickling water out of a crack in a rock, and one of those spots was under Lion's Arch somewhere where the LA leyline hub is.

    Got a source for that? Because I do recall folks asking, and the only response I recall was a super vague "magic is in the Mists too and it might lead into Tyria, but Tyrians can't say for certain about that". If there was something far more concrete about "magic in the Mists goes into Tyria" then that would have surely been added and referenced on the wiki.

    AFAIK, it has never been confirmed whether or not Tyria's magic is a closed system, and implications ran towards the direction that it is. After all "dragons do not destroy magic" so if magic kept seeping into Tyria from the Mists, but it's only reduced by the Elder Dragons, then magic is constantly flooding into the place and increasing, being an inevitable bubble to pop and self-destruct no matter what. Especially since the Elder Dragons release magic over time. It would result in the time between cycles shortening more, and more, and more until the Elder Dragons are simply constantly awake because there's too much magic, and they'd just keep feeding, and feeding, until Tyria's destroyed.

    If Tyria is not a closed system of magic, then the magic must also leak out of Tyria, not just in, and at an equal rate or else Tyria would eventually die no matter what.

    It has been pretty much established that Tyria isn't a completely closed system, that magic (and other things) come and go between Tyria and the mists, and that there's certain 'power spots' in which tearing reality is easier, and rifts to the mists are easier to create and may even appear naturally.
    Examples of those spots can be found the Battle Isles, the Tomb of the Primeval Kings, Ruins of Morah, in the Godlost Swamp, somewhere under Lion's Arch.
    Some were created by the gods to allow humans to visit the mists, others are naturally occurring, others were created by disasters like the fall of Abaddon, but they all have pretty much in common that they are a spot where it's easier to tear reality and get into the Mists.
    Even the Commander uses one of those spots in the PoF story to open a portal to the mists and contact the gods.

    Tears in reality occurring is definitely established in lore, but lore indicates that it happens in places that 1) traversal to the Mists is done often (e.g., Godlost Swamp) or 2) a ton of deaths occur (which is probably causing the weakening to occur because souls are passing into the Mists from that spot in high numbers) (e.g., Speaker of the Dead)

  • @Konig Des Todes.2086 said:

    If Tyria is not a closed system of magic, then the magic must also leak out of Tyria, not just in, and at an equal rate or else Tyria would eventually die no matter what.

    That's where the dragons (and anything that can absorb and contain magic) comes in.

    Imagine Tyria as a bathtub with a leaky faucet and plug that doesn't fit properly, the water trickles in slowly, and also leaves slowly. After all, the largest rift we've ever seen is not even a speck compared to what must be the real size of Tyria.
    I can't remember any one-way portals to the mists, so I willconsider that the amount of water that comes in is the same or very close to the water that comes down the drain. Let's give them numbers: 1magic/second for the faucet and -1m/s for the drain.
    With nothing else in the bathtub, the water that comes in will simply leave at the same rate. No magic would stay around to have any effect.

    Then imagine all things that absorb magic as sponges of various sizes and degrees of absorptiveness inside the tub, soaking up water.
    Some of those sponges would be very good at taking water in than others, and some of those sponges would be better at keeping the water in than others.

    If you also imagine the dragons as sponges, they would be huge sponges that soak up all the water they can until they can't soak up anymore, then slowly leak it over time. Any magic leaking from the faucet will likely get soaked up by the dragonsponges or any of the other smaller sponges before it can go down the drain.
    Going back to the numbers: while the dragons are soaking up magic, the faucet still produces 1m/s, but the dragons would try to drain as much as possible, like -0.15ms/s from the tub each, then all other things would get trace amounts they may be able to scrap, let's make it 0.1m/s. So there would be practically nothing left left for the drain to leak: 1-(6*0.15)-0.1=0
    This way the system fills with magic even with a drain, since less or no magic goes down the drain while magic is being absorbed, as whatever absorbs magic within itself acts as a 'buffer' to keep the magic in the system.
    Then, when the dragon-sponges leak the water, since the amount that can leave is still small, all that extra water soaked that could not leave while the dragonsponges were soaking up the water would stay in the system filling the bathtub.
    Fauced 1m/s, drain -1m/s, dragons 0.1m/s each. That gives us a surplus of 0.6ms with 6 dragons that won't go down the drain slowly filling up the bathtub until the dragonsponges wake up again and soak it all up.

    Now imagine what would happen if someone squished one of those huge sponges. All the water inside would fill up the bathtub, the other huge sponges would get most of that magic, and the rest of the water would fill the bathtub.
    Squish any large sponges too much, like a 2 Dragonsponges and a Bloodstonesponge, and the leaky bathtub plug would probably begin to cave under the pressure of the water, or the bathtub may overflow and the bathroom floor gets all wet.

    This is just a rough analogy, but it should explain what I mean: even with a drain dragons can fill the system with magic, and if their system isn't in balance, bad things happen.

  • Konig Des Todes.2086Konig Des Todes.2086 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 6, 2019

    @MithranArkanere.8957 said:

    @Konig Des Todes.2086 said:

    If Tyria is not a closed system of magic, then the magic must also leak out of Tyria, not just in, and at an equal rate or else Tyria would eventually die no matter what.

    -snip-

    Yet no source provided for your "magic comes from the Mists' proclamation. Not even a time-frame or location for me to try to look for the source, or a dev name who stated it.

    And if your wording is right from the beginning, no implication of a "drain" either.

  • cptaylor.2670cptaylor.2670 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Ayakaru.6583 said:

    @vier.1327 said:

    Lately, i have been reading about the theory of Yoko´s powers. Aurene ate Yoko so Aurene is inmortal. I have to admit this was the first though >i had, but then i realize, imo, how lame it is. Because, if this is true, Aurene is inmortal and all the dangerous in the future story is lost for this >character.

    That is nothing more than conjecture. Its nothing but speculation that Aurene killing Joko will make her immortal, or allow her revival.
    Aurene was a key in defeating Joko, but that was to wrap up Joko’s story. He was immortal because he could drain magic and convert it to life force. Aurene was necessary to unbind that magic. If they pull a revival stunt on Aurene, it would be considered poor, if not downright terrible storyboard writing.

    We know that Glint is a dragon, a death dragon, and she is in the mist. So, we can conclude that when this kind of dragon dies, they go to the >Mist. So, Aurene, rigth now, is inside the Mist.

    I think you mean dead dragon? Zhaitan was the death dragon. But it’s only Glint we know of.
    There was no mention of the dead elder dragons, Vlast, etc. so we have one point from which we cannot extrapolate information.

    You know what would be worse than reviving Aurene? Sitting on the current plot of the world is ending and reality is being undone by a dragon we can't kill because he will destroy Tyria and a dragon we can't leave alive because... he's tearing apart the fabric of reality. Then, while we sit with this for another season, we find some random solution out of nowhere that we've spent a few episodes discovering despite years developing Aurene's story and the fact that all evidence thus far points to her being our only solution. Even if there were another solution, finding it all of a sudden after exhausting everything else would be far more terrible and cheap.

    The only less insufferable alternative would be to somehow leave Aurene dead and use the Pale Tree as another solution with her ascending. But honestly, that would be just as bad as the former because we've known the Pale Tree being of Mordremoth since... a little before Heart of Thorns?

    I mean, whatever way you cut it, when you start exponentially increasing the odds the way they have, any solution is going to seem "terrible and cheap." But weighing whether you want them to create a brand new solution out of thin air, or pay tribute to the story they've been working on for years. So, I mean, you have two options: 1. "Terrible and cheap" revival of Aurene that gives her character and a very long running story arc a good and decisive ending, or 2. "Terrible and cheap" leaving Aurene dead for shock value and as a catalyst to move the story towards whatever solution they pull out of thin air to get us moving forward.

    As to your comment about her being immortal making all future dangers trivial, if she is immortal she becomes the perfect unkillable magic sponge that we need in an Elder Dragon. You also have to consider that upon taking up the mantle, for all we know, she could go straight into hibernation as elder dragons do. Thus, she wouldn't have any involvement with "future dangerous" because she would be asleep. She would also more than likely, if not asleep, be too busy fixing the brand and damage that Kralk has done to help us with Joko/Balthazar/Lazarus/Cadeacus 2.0. To be honest, the only real threat I can see her having any necessary involvement in story-wise, would be another elder dragon threat. But, having traveled with us, she knows that we cannot simply kill another Elder Dragon, so while she could potentially enforce our armies with her own branded reinforcements, but she wouldn't be able to just swoop down and take out the Elder Dragon and save the day.

    I mean, I get that people want to keep spouting out this idea that reviving Aurene is cheap, but it doesn't seem like anyone is actually thinking it through or considering the alternatives. We've gone from killing two elder dragons, to putting two to sleep in the same episode with the help of a machine and a God. Killed said God, and now we're attempting to fight another dragon with the strength of two of those plus the god, and now Tyria is doomed or Reality & Tyria is doomed. The story needs to be reeled in somehow, to be frank. And I would find it a lot more enjoyable and it would make a lot more sense to have it end the way it was designed to, with Aurene replacing Kralk.

    As far as the mists goes, it's honestly another "terrible and cheap" plot decision for me if they have her be able to fulfill that role solely from the mists. Because why would her being in the mists be necessary? And how would, if her corpse released its magic, she suddenly have all of the same magic and potential she had when she's alive carry over into the mists? And if that were the case, why would Glint not have been able to achieve this all along instead of priming Aurene?

    It's going to be a messy resolution either way, but it's far less messier having Aurene revive - especially via the magic of a being that had to have his body be ripped apart and eaten by a being that eats magic in order to actually permanently die. Kralk didn't do what Aurene did to Joko and eat her or rip her body apart, or chomp down on all that magic. He just left her there. It's also logical to assume that Kralk wouldn't know Aurene ate Joko or that her revival could be possible as Joko wouldn't have been on his radar. He may have left partially because he was wounded but also left thinking that he took out his only threat.

    It's just the lesser of two evils at this point, and can make far more sense than whatever else I see happening.

    There's just no other way that does the same justice to the story and where we've been, while giving a conclusive ending that makes the most sense. And I don't know about anyone else, but I'm ready to be done with Kralk and these end of reality circumstances.

  • My 2 coppers in this topic would be to ask what exactly did Aurene do to Caithe? Is Caithe a stepping stone to the next solution? Or did Aurene imprint something of herself into Caithe so that she could be revived or broken out of her crystallized state? It was stated that Caithe is directly connected to Aurene in the last episode.

  • cptaylor.2670cptaylor.2670 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Well they apparently originally planned to kill Caithe off with Aurene but decided it would lessen the impact of Aurene. So that to me tells me that, “ I know my purpose and I’m humbled” isn’t really foreshadowing anything long term. But that could have been added in later on to make way for something else. If it isn’t foreshadowing anything then I think that scene was just to show what Aurene was capable of and ease the team that was acting up about her branding stuff a second before.

    I don’t feel like she pulled a Mordremoth vs Traeherne and implanted herself in Caithe or something.

    But who knows. Only way we’ll ever have a definitive answer to any of this is when the next patch comes out

  • @Konig Des Todes.2086 said:

    @MithranArkanere.8957 said:

    @Konig Des Todes.2086 said:

    If Tyria is not a closed system of magic, then the magic must also leak out of Tyria, not just in, and at an equal rate or else Tyria would eventually die no matter what.

    -snip-

    Yet no source provided for your "magic comes from the Mists' proclamation. Not even a time-frame or location for me to try to look for the source, or a dev name who stated it.

    And if your wording is right from the beginning, no implication of a "drain" either.

    /upset
    The "drain" is just part of the analogy. The 'faucet' and the 'drain' in the analogy are any and all portals, rifts, tears and reality and 'thin spots' in which things can come in and out of the mists. They are shown as two different things in the analogy because the analogy is a bathtub, and in a bathtub water enters and leaves through two separate holes.
    But what you should have taken from the analogy is the description of a partially open system in which a resource can come in and out, but slowly, and entities inside the system keep the system from ever depleting by gathering faster than the system can fill with the resource, and releasing faster than the system can deplete itself.
    With that analogy I wasn't saying that things are exactly like that, but giving an explanation of how it's possible for magic to enter and leave Tyria and never get depleted of magic, or even gather more magic, when you factor in how dragons gather large amounts of magic.
    Magic could even drain out faster than it comes in and still never get depleted, as long as the dragons gather enough magic and then all of them combined release an amount larger than the amount that can leave, since while the dragons gather magic much of the magic that comes in would be hoarded by them instead leaving.

    Nobody should be asked to dig through years of reddit posts and the incomplete backup of the old forums for a couple posts that may not even be still there to prove something that doesn't need a proof when we can see it.
    But if you have the time to look for it that I do not, I already mentioned it was 1 or 2 answers in reddit or the forums to a question someone made in Season 1 about the leylines under LA. So it probably was around the time the Breachmaker attacked LA, give or take 3-6 months.
    All I can remember is that it was a response from a dev, that it may have been one of the female writers, and that they didn't say that all magic comes from the mists, but that there's some spots in which magic comes from the mists. And me thinking that sounded kind of like a water spring.

    Anyways, after all we've seen, it's just not possible to see Tyria as a closed system. The Artesian Waters, the godlosts swamp, the spirits of the wild and havrouns coming in an out of the mists, any eerie spot where ghosts linger, any of the posts where rifts to the mists have been opened... Even if none of those spots were naturally occurring, they have already happened, and they will probably keep happening.
    GW2's lore is purposely vague to leave room for imagination and interpretation. So we can deduce what we do not know for sure based on what we do known.
    And what we know shows us that Tyriacan't be completely closed off from the mists, and that magic has to flow in and out, no matter how slowly.

    Nevertheless, my final point stands. Killing Kralkatorrik in the mists is a bad idea, because regardless of what happens with he magic afterwards, it'll be bad for Tyria.
    If the magic can come back to Tyria all at once, it'll be too much as it can barely stand two dragon deaths for too long already.
    And if the magic doesn't come in or comes in too slowly, the system will fall apart anyways due to lack of magic as shown in Taimi's simulation when Jormag and Primordus magics cancel each other and the whole system collapses.

  • In addition to the Mists (ghost memory) theory and to Palawa Joko's (undead) powers, I am thinking of a few other [very unlikely] ways the Commander and First born Caithe could save their daughter.

    • Use of the knowledge of the Awakened (why having made them allies and kept as such other) (undead)
    • Use of Zhaïtan's power (undead, recovery of a severed tail under sea?)
    • Creation of Shards of Aurene (Mists like theory)
    • Mordremisation of Aurene (Magic seeds, Venturi's tablets, the egg's chamber...)
    • Banded Aurene (from mother's and brother's shards, by a turned Kralkatorrik (in fear, wounded and sorry for having killed all those of his kind, in alliance against the other Elders))
    • A quest for the creation of a mix off all the Elders in order to stabilize the magic and still be able to slaughter them (expansion)
    • Cantha's knowledge (Jade, new elder?)
    • Robocop golemisation (versions of films about a giant bipedal lizard with crystals on the back spitting green fire)
  • Konig Des Todes.2086Konig Des Todes.2086 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 8, 2019

    @MithranArkanere.8957 said:
    Nobody should be asked to dig through years of reddit posts and the incomplete backup of the old forums for a couple posts that may not even be still there to prove something that doesn't need a proof when we can see it.
    But if you have the time to look for it that I do not, I already mentioned it was 1 or 2 answers in reddit or the forums to a question someone made in Season 1 about the leylines under LA. So it probably was around the time the Breachmaker attacked LA, give or take 3-6 months.
    All I can remember is that it was a response from a dev, that it may have been one of the female writers, and that they didn't say that all magic comes from the mists, but that there's some spots in which magic comes from the mists. And me thinking that sounded kind of like a water spring.

    If it's difficult to find, I don't expect you to dig for it. But I would expect you to state where you got it. That said, most talkative female devs from that time would be Angel McCoy and Linsey Murdock. So I dug through their reddit posts, search reddit for key words, then decided to dig through their official forum posts both old and, for the hell of it, new (search function may be poor in the old forums' archive, but searching post history isn't). Also checked interviews that came up from my searches.

    Found nothing.

    Quite a few discussions on magic from Angel McCoy, which I do recall, but none about magic entering the world from the Mists.

    The only bits about magic flowing into the world is about it coming from the Elder Dragons:

    Magic is the lifeblood of Tyria. The entire world is infused with it, and it flows through everything via ley lines that criss-cross the planet.
    The natural role of the dragons is to keep this magic balanced. From time to time, in the long history of the world, the dragons have awoken and begun to draw the world’s magic into themselves, reducing the level of magic flowing through the ley lines.
    When the dragons have consumed enough and thus reduced the world to a low level of magic, they go back to sleep. From then on, the magic leaks from them, back into the world at a reasonable rate. Eventually, it builds up in the world again, and the dragons awaken again to tip the teeter-totter back in the other direction.

    https://web.archive.org/web/20131023013807/http://www.esprits-dorr.fr/node/261

    And here:

    The bloodstone didn’t contain all the world’s magic, nor did it contain all types of magic. The dragons had already consumed some of the world’s magic, so it all wasn’t available to the Seers.
    Each of the four magic-filled bloodstones had a particular “flavor” of magic when it was separated from its siblings. These flavors became the ancient schools of magic, and humans, who at the time didn’t realize there was a whole lot more magic waiting to leak out of the sleeping dragons, believed that was all the magic there was. And they organized their teachings, their research, and their spells according to that paradigm.
    Over time, however, magic has gradually leaked back into the world from the sleeping dragons, becoming both more complex, more powerful, and more flexible. The citizens of Tyria have adjusted their spells, their research, and their teachings as they’ve had access to greater and more complex magic.
    Since the dragons have been waking in recent years, one might assume that magic is at its peak right now, and the dragons are here to drain the world. They tap the world’s magic, consume it, and reduce the overall level of available magic in the world.

    https://www.guildwars2roleplayers.com/forum/page/1/m/2737230/viewthread/9902543-2rps-lore-interview-arenanet

    Dug quite a lot, found nothing about magic coming from the Mists.

  • They killed each other and aureen was able to swap minds modremoth style and use joko and zaithan magic to reanimate kralkatorrik body. Why else would he just leave without killing us off. Or maybe kralkatorrik is just that dumb leaving his would be killers alive.

  • Palador.2170Palador.2170 Member ✭✭✭

    @Magnus Godrik.5841 said:
    Why else would he just leave without killing us off. Or maybe kralkatorrik is just that dumb leaving his would be killers alive.

    To Kralkatorrik, we were only a threat because we had Aurene with us. Once she was dead, why bother with the rest of us? Do you go into a field and smash all the anthills before you level the place to start construction? No, you just let what comes next do that for you. Kralk is hurt, and healing will involve eating more magic, which will also kill us all off.

    Also, hurt as he is, we might actually be a threat even without Aurene. But he doesn't have to face us directly to kill us. Again, him healing himself will kill us off indirectly.

    Anyway... I've had a thought. Aurene was needed, but is it really written anywhere that it's her job to take over from Kralk, or are we all just assuming that? What if her death isn't a step in her ascension, but the Commander's? She is/was linked to us, and the bond was growing ever stronger. In the latest chapter, you can even call on some of her power freely while she's not even there (shattering brand crystals for he Dredge heart). Ascension is to become "like the gods", but we've seen that anyone trying to make the step into actual godhood needs to absorb a HUGE amount of magic. Could this be ANet's answer to complaints about Kormir and Trahearne stealing "our" spot? Would they dare to elevate the Commander up and out of the story, forcing a new hero to have to emerge?

    Lip synching is just mime karaoke.

  • I have to disagree with the idea that reviving Aurene would be cheap storytelling. I don't want to get too wordy about it, but just a couple points.
    Kralk has the ability to see the future, at least vaguely. As such, it's unlikely that any plan of attack would have any chance of winning. Just about any conflict would be at least partially on his terms, and he would most likely know the outcome before committing. That is, he only chose to attack at the end of episode 5 because he knew the outcome would be his slaying Aurene. Even if he knew he would be severely wounded in the process.
    Aurene knew she was going to die, yet she went on as though the prophecy was unbroken. This was what she was afraid of, this is what you fought when you and her were in Glint's lair. It was quite literally fighting her fear of her inevitable death in the coming fight. It's hard for me to imagine that Glint didn't also know what was about to happen, yet Glint also spoke of the prophecy as though it was unbroken. I expect we will be hearing from Glint one way or another in the near future.
    Joko had the ability to raise himself, and I know this theory has been beaten to death; but, the way the scene with Aurene crashing into the fight with Joko and immediately eating him seemed like it had purpose beyond just that one fight. As though it was an important and essential part of the bigger picture, not just ending Joko's reign. It was her that led us to Istan, to facing off with Joko, instead of pursuing Kralkatorrik in the immediate aftermath of Episode 1's 'Eye of the Brandstorm'.
    Finally, we discovered Aurene's ability to brand in episode 5. I think this is important. If Aurene is going to replace Kralkatorrik, it will have to be in a way that even he wouldn't see with his precognition. Which means her coming back cannot be known by any except a very select few. I suspect that we will see her mark left on something at the end of the next episode, or the end of the season to hint at her being alive. Likely that only the Commander and/or Caithe will see/know.

  • Tzarakiel.7490Tzarakiel.7490 Member ✭✭✭
    edited February 12, 2019

    Kralkarotic sounds like a carrot based vitamin pill advertised in one of those weird commercials where they dub over an actor wearing a lab coat that is clearly speaking a different language.

    PvP? What's that? Never heard of it.

  • Deadly Moonshiner.1354Deadly Moonshiner.1354 Member ✭✭✭
    edited February 12, 2019

    In my conspiracy theory:
    1) Aurene will become an undead branded dragon in the Mists (undead because she absorbed Joko's magic, branded because that is what Kralkatorik does to his victims)
    2) We will fight branded Aurene in the mists - that is a part of Glint's trials.
    3) We will defeat Aurene in that fight, releasing her from the "undead & branded" curse. She will become a "good" dragon again (Yes Rytlock and Canach, do shut-up now :) ). Also, during the fight we will get a piece of "Crystal dragon tissue/scale" that will be used in the Thunderkeep forge to build a full-power Dragon-spear.
    4) She will help us again fight Kralkatorik, that is still weakened from the last fight (the next episode will be very short in terms of timeline, and we will have to move very fast so he wont have enough time to fully recover)
    5) Once he is dead, Aurene's will absorb his magic. Then she will voluntarily go to sleep so Tyria's magic balance remains in place. All will be hanky-dory again... :3

    Or

    She dies a true death together with Kralkatorik - by impaling him and herself to a Dragonspear. The dragon magic gets released and everything explodes in magic flames - Searing Reloaded. Those lucky enough (commander for sure) to survive it flee to Cantha.

    Rytlock Brimstone: So we find the archon, take him out, then use Kas's "imposter" trick to take his place, right?
    Lady Kasmeer Meade: It's not a trick. Mesmers don't do "tricks"—we utilize illusion.
    Rytlock Brimstone: Yeah, yeah. You guys are worse than elementalists.

  • FrizzFreston.5290FrizzFreston.5290 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Konig Des Todes.2086 said:

    @MithranArkanere.8957 said:
    Nobody should be asked to dig through years of reddit posts and the incomplete backup of the old forums for a couple posts that may not even be still there to prove something that doesn't need a proof when we can see it.
    But if you have the time to look for it that I do not, I already mentioned it was 1 or 2 answers in reddit or the forums to a question someone made in Season 1 about the leylines under LA. So it probably was around the time the Breachmaker attacked LA, give or take 3-6 months.
    All I can remember is that it was a response from a dev, that it may have been one of the female writers, and that they didn't say that all magic comes from the mists, but that there's some spots in which magic comes from the mists. And me thinking that sounded kind of like a water spring.

    If it's difficult to find, I don't expect you to dig for it. But I would expect you to state where you got it. That said, most talkative female devs from that time would be Angel McCoy and Linsey Murdock. So I dug through their reddit posts, search reddit for key words, then decided to dig through their official forum posts both old and, for the hell of it, new (search function may be poor in the old forums' archive, but searching post history isn't). Also checked interviews that came up from my searches.

    Found nothing.

    Quite a few discussions on magic from Angel McCoy, which I do recall, but none about magic entering the world from the Mists.

    The only bits about magic flowing into the world is about it coming from the Elder Dragons:

    Magic is the lifeblood of Tyria. The entire world is infused with it, and it flows through everything via ley lines that criss-cross the planet.
    The natural role of the dragons is to keep this magic balanced. From time to time, in the long history of the world, the dragons have awoken and begun to draw the world’s magic into themselves, reducing the level of magic flowing through the ley lines.
    When the dragons have consumed enough and thus reduced the world to a low level of magic, they go back to sleep. From then on, the magic leaks from them, back into the world at a reasonable rate. Eventually, it builds up in the world again, and the dragons awaken again to tip the teeter-totter back in the other direction.

    https://web.archive.org/web/20131023013807/http://www.esprits-dorr.fr/node/261

    And here:

    The bloodstone didn’t contain all the world’s magic, nor did it contain all types of magic. The dragons had already consumed some of the world’s magic, so it all wasn’t available to the Seers.
    Each of the four magic-filled bloodstones had a particular “flavor” of magic when it was separated from its siblings. These flavors became the ancient schools of magic, and humans, who at the time didn’t realize there was a whole lot more magic waiting to leak out of the sleeping dragons, believed that was all the magic there was. And they organized their teachings, their research, and their spells according to that paradigm.
    Over time, however, magic has gradually leaked back into the world from the sleeping dragons, becoming both more complex, more powerful, and more flexible. The citizens of Tyria have adjusted their spells, their research, and their teachings as they’ve had access to greater and more complex magic.
    Since the dragons have been waking in recent years, one might assume that magic is at its peak right now, and the dragons are here to drain the world. They tap the world’s magic, consume it, and reduce the overall level of available magic in the world.

    https://www.guildwars2roleplayers.com/forum/page/1/m/2737230/viewthread/9902543-2rps-lore-interview-arenanet

    Dug quite a lot, found nothing about magic coming from the Mists.

    Looking purely at the current situation, magic is moving in and out of the mists each time kraalkatoorrik switches planes.

  • Just wanted to pop up to say that there exist concept art of aurene labelling her baby undead crystal dragon. So after eating joko and getting the death-to-be vision I pretty much figured she was going to turn undead. Plus it would give joko's death a bit more flavor.

  • Link if that undead aurean?

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