Concerned about the upcoming big balance

[aymnad.9023]

Overall I am happy with all the recent balance patch even if they take way too long to come out because many builds are available. I cannot like 100% of every patch but the direction has been pretty good.I agree that most of the damage builds are fine (some side noders could have slightly less damage) and just do not want a bunker meta back. Wait and see.

[santso.9201]

They should just bring couple bruiser ammys back, reduce all boons(esp might+fury+quickness) and change how stealth works

[Kuma.1503]

I'm hopeful, but apprehensive about the upcoming changes.

I would like PvP to be less bursty, and i would like for boons to be less spammable, and for classes to have to think a little more about when and where to apply said boons. The intent of these changes is to give players more opportunities to interact before someone bites the dust. The biggest boon GW2 has over other MMOs is it's fun and fluid combat system. It'd be nice if we had more time to enjoy it, rather than duels being reduced to "I pressed a few buttons and stacked 25 might, and I landed my burst first therefore I win"

Again, that is the intent.

My fear is that this game will go down the same path WoW did. WoW saw a steady power creep, which peaked in Mists of Pandaria, where every class had a little bit of everything. This caused the PvP community to complain endlessly on the forums because "CC is too high" and "X class has too much of Y" What did Blizzard do in response?

They nerfed. And nerfed again. And again. They deleted spells, passives, synergies, mechanics. And even when classes were left as shells of of their formers selvess, when people thought "Surely they can't take anything else away", they nerfed again. The result? A mass exodus from the game because Classes aren't fun to play anymore. Casters don't even bother trying to kite melee because kiting tools have been stripped away. Casters just plant their feet and hope to get a cast off without getting stuned or inturrpted. Melees can get away with spamming their PvE rotation in PvP.

The rotations themselves are as easy as "Hit the big damage button first. The medium damage button second and the Filler button when nothing else is up" with the occasional random proc and maybe a DoT to maintain on the target to really spice things up. Because of this the gap between a skilled player and an unskilled player has gone down significantly.

Yet, people still complain, because when everyone is underpowered, classes which simply function begin to look overloaded and unfair. Mages get a fair amount of complaints because their tools still allow them to kite melee... somewhat. Hunters get complaints because they can cast while moving (something which every ranged class could do to some extent in the past) and that gives them a MASSIVE advantage over other ranged classes.

Moral of the story, be careful what you wish for. Yes there may be a class or two that is over performing now, but simply nerfing repeatedly won't necessarily make things better. It will just create a reverse power creep, and then the specs that were not nerfed as hard become the new OP, and the cycle continues. Instead, try to also identify what classes you like to fight. What playstyles do you think are healthy? What gameplay styles should Anet promote? We need to have a goal like this in sight, otherwise we risk making the same mistake as Blizzard.

[Poelala.2830]

@Hederrain.9207 said:

@ProverbsofHell.2307 said:Greatsword F1 is a slow, highly telegraphed skill that can only be landed in 130 range. Warrior is one of the only classes stuck at 130 range to do any damage and also has clunky and buggy mobility skills. 9k is fine.

9k is fine? thats more than half the hp for 90% of the classes atm in 1 shot. and not like its hard to land with the cc warrior has acces to. from a holo perspective my hardest hitting skill is prime light beam that crits for 7.5k, thats a 60 sec cd ELITE skill vs 1 adrenaline burst 8 sec cd skill xD

dmg is fine, nothing to see here /o/

Allow me to remind you that PLB has higher range, is unblockable, and can be activated from the same stealth holosmith so easily applies.

[Psycoprophet.8107]

No reason for concern, either it will get better with the new patch or pvp will remain garbage tier. Either way not a loss from what it is now. I mean if patch is bad than the population will drop.... oh wait lolAnets working on side projects for console and gw2 will prob be basically in maintenance mode for the remaining yrs of its life either than a few small living story episodes like the last and balance changes. The whole cal thing with him making huge changes is probably a attempt to keep players interested and spending coin on a game In maintenance mode.I could be wrong but we shall see.

[Solitude.2097]

They could make so Amulets start with low stats 300strenght/300agility/300ferocity and its stacks 30 atributes every day + Might capped .The first 10 days will be slow pace , next medium and 10 last days even faster that now .Let ppl as long as they play (every 25 min , same person can vote multi times as long as he is online) to choose between the Red crystal (increase the stats in the next Hour) or Blue Pill (Hold On) in their UI , or try to mix it up .The third day , continues the stats from the first's , but there is also a Orange crystal (to scale down).

Next 10 days , it will start 600strenght/600agility/600ferocity , regadles what ppl have voted from the fist 10 days.If for 3 days straight , the votes are 70-30% for Red Crystal , then the ''medium pace starts imidiatly , rather than wa8ing the remaining 7 days.After 23:00 server time till dead zone the mechanic is disabled , so the pace is just like nowOr ask streamers , what time should this mechanic should be disabled 2-3 hours , for their enjoyment

Edit: Programing will be nightmare , but :Amulets have a static 300/300/300 stats .Your UI have the extra points (just like capturing the NPCs that give you 50 stats to all) , and ppl can vote to subtrack or increase themOr manually choose a gem , from a plethora of 3 stats combinations of x30 points , to be shown on your UI . If ppl choose the increased stats > you get an ''open space'' to place the gem

[Jasonbdj.4021]

Current damage is far from fine, its a brust or be brust gameplay which it is indeed boring and dull with less of hand full of options that are viable.

This game is ment to be smart skillful gameplay but it is far from it.

80% of builds and even less for skills are not viable because of this.

PVP needs more build options to keep it intresting then same old few build options.

[Tycura.1982]

@Jasonbdj.4021 said:Current damage is far from fine, its a brust or be brust gameplay which it is indeed boring and dull with less of hand full of options that are viable.

This game is ment to be smart skillful gameplay but it is far from it.

80% of builds and even less for skills are not viable because of this.

PVP needs more build options to keep it intresting then same old few build options.

Burst vs burst is far from boring when you're given the ability to mitigate it. Just today I had many duels with a Rev and either of us have the damage to 0-100 in moments but we both main our classes and know the matchup so it becomes a matter of who messes up first. Thats when things actually become interesting.

[Jasonbdj.4021]

@Tycura.1982 said:

@Jasonbdj.4021 said:Current damage is far from fine, its a brust or be brust gameplay which it is indeed boring and dull with less of hand full of options that are viable.

This game is ment to be smart skillful gameplay but it is far from it.

80% of builds and even less for skills are not viable because of this.

PVP needs more build options to keep it intresting then same old few build options.

Burst vs burst is far from boring when you're given the ability to mitigate it. Just today I had many duels with a Rev and either of us have the damage to 0-100 in moments but we both main our classes and know the matchup so it becomes a matter of who messes up first. Thats when things actually become interesting.

Your probably using the matching meta builds that is viable in this current mess so obviously will be interesting.

Classes was not designed to take such damage, toughness is next to useless and hp is not great for most.

No matter defence stats you use it still feels like glass cannon anyways for 80% of build options.

You are limited to meta builds with block/invu/boon spam/brust everything else usually melt.

There are fun creative builds/skills available for smart skillful play on each class but it is op by brusty/invul/boons builds.

They need to decrease burst/block/invu/boon or rework the rest of the classes builds/skills.

[Hederrain.9207]

@Poelala.2830 said:

@Hederrain.9207 said:

@ProverbsofHell.2307 said:Greatsword F1 is a slow, highly telegraphed skill that can only be landed in 130 range. Warrior is one of the only classes stuck at 130 range to do any damage and also has clunky and buggy mobility skills. 9k is fine.

9k is fine? thats more than half the hp for 90% of the classes atm in 1 shot. and not like its hard to land with the cc warrior has acces to. from a holo perspective my hardest hitting skill is prime light beam that crits for 7.5k, thats a 60 sec cd ELITE skill vs 1 adrenaline burst 8 sec cd skill xD

dmg is fine, nothing to see here /o/

Allow me to remind you that PLB has higher range, is unblockable, and can be activated from the same stealth holosmith so easily applies.

well u clearly didnt get my point

still dosnt take away from my argument that 50% hp gone in 1 skill is bad for the game. regardless of what skill that does it.

[Ten.2617]

Warrior has 2 unblockable effect/boon, 1 active and 1 passive with Signet Might and Signet. It't a minimal of 50% uptime of unblockable attacks vs one or two unblockable skills(of engie) with high CD... Some others classes has the same unblockable effect/boon.

[Vicariuz.1605]

@"mrauls.6519" said:Remove tanky amulets

this abominable dh player is spotted again.

it is now known who is ACTUALLY behind these projected changes all in an effort to bring this heinous monster up from the depths where it rightfully belongs.

question not the motives of a person who plays dh for they are always focused solely to their own benefit!

[Vicariuz.1605]

@Axl.8924 said:

@ProverbsofHell.2307 said:

@Hederrain.9207 said:

@ProverbsofHell.2307 said:Greatsword F1 is a slow, highly telegraphed skill that can only be landed in 130 range. Warrior is one of the only classes stuck at 130 range to do any damage and also has clunky and buggy mobility skills. 9k is fine.

9k is fine? thats more than half the hp for 90% of the classes atm in 1 shot. and not like its hard to land with the cc warrior has acces to. from a holo perspective my hardest hitting skill is prime light beam that crits for 7.5k, thats a 60 sec cd ELITE skill vs 1 adrenaline burst 8 sec cd skill xD

dmg is fine, nothing to see here /o/

It's a burst skill. Is it so hard to dodge, use your own skills, kite, etc? You say Warrior has CC and that's true. So if you also failed to dodge this or avoid it, ok, so this is where you use stunbreak. If all that failed, yeah, you get hit for 9k. Only half hp, really not that much for a burst skill delivered by a zerk amulet spellbreaker at high might stacks (cause that's what arcing slice would need to do that damage). It's not like you don't have a heal you can use or mobility. I don't get the complaint tbh.

What about necros? we lack ways to avoid dmg and have limited evades no invulns few teleports and you actually have to place it, and our gap closers are kinda trash too.

9k is a lot of dmg to a class with some toughness I agree with that, 15 to 20k is way too much. In fact: Damage and sustain is so crazy and out of control, that necro underperforms, and other classes too probably due to the ridiculous nature of power creep.

You warrior guys have a 60k rifle shot and can do 9k or more with your weapons plus you got power crept mobility cc and sustain.

Time to nerf everyone down to like 5 or 6k dmg so it isn't one-shot anymore.

yeah necros are soooo weak they could never do 14k with just axe 2 and like 3 might.

https://www.twitch.tv/boycerino/clip/WrongYawningOwlBrainSlug

dont forget the speed rune in combat movespeed and the 2 ports.

[storm.3120]

@"Vicariuz.1605" said:yeah necros are soooo weak they could never do 14k with just axe 2 and like 3 might.

https://www.twitch.tv/boycerino/clip/WrongYawningOwlBrainSlug

dont forget the speed rune in combat movespeed and the 2 ports.El o el.@Axl.8924 said:9k is a lot of dmg to a class with some toughness I agree with that, 15 to 20k is way too much. In fact: Damage and sustain is so crazy and out of control, that necro underperforms, and other classes too probably due to the ridiculous nature of power creep.Ye, poor necros. watching the entire game... 15-20k is too much.... watching necro's spinning up to 18k ... So underperforming... poor necro, nerf chrono again plos

[TorQ.7041]

@Khalisto.5780 said:

@ProverbsofHell.2307 said:

@Khalisto.5780 said:nerfing all the one man army builds should be ok, their over all dmg and sustain. If they do that they also have to nerf some role buids, like scrapper and firebrand sustain.

Im kinda ok with one shots as long as you dont have a lot of everything else along with it, I think fresh weaver and power mesmer are the best examples of it

While I'd rank their burst 100 they lack sustain and you have to work on your positioning to stay alive. But every other meta build has like a rank 80 burst while also having similar sustain and mobility, holo, war, weaver are the ones that come to my mind with crazy burst and sustain and good mobility

How does Warrior have crazy burst and sustain? Spellbreaker has strong damage and excellent sustain, but it's hardly OP burst (especially not since Rampage was nerfed). Infact Spellbreaker barely has burst at all. I can't think of a single OP burst skill on Spellbreaker. Then you have Berserker with TRASH sustain but amazing burst. If Berserker burst gets nerfed then you might aswell bury the spec entirely because the sustain is hot trash.

@ProverbsofHell.2307 said:

@Khalisto.5780 said:nerfing all the one man army builds should be ok, their over all dmg and sustain. If they do that they also have to nerf some role buids, like scrapper and firebrand sustain.

Im kinda ok with one shots as long as you dont have a lot of everything else along with it, I think fresh weaver and power mesmer are the best examples of it

While I'd rank their burst 100 they lack sustain and you have to work on your positioning to stay alive. But every other meta build has like a rank 80 burst while also having similar sustain and mobility, holo, war, weaver are the ones that come to my mind with crazy burst and sustain and good mobility

How does Warrior have crazy burst and sustain? Spellbreaker has strong damage and excellent sustain, but it's hardly OP burst (especially not since Rampage was nerfed). Infact Spellbreaker barely has burst at all. I can't think of a single OP burst skill on Spellbreaker. Then you have Berserker with TRASH sustain but amazing burst. If Berserker burst gets nerfed then you might aswell bury the spec entirely because the sustain is hot trash.

I still see some 9k from gs f1, the gs spin has some high crits as well. I think warrior has the best suatained dmg of all classes, when I fight them i don't feel i have time to breathe. Sure they should have unnerfed gs f1 and FC dmg when they nerfed rampage.

Big cast time, big telegraphed animations, No teleport. If you get hit by that, that's your own fault.

A warrior should hardly ever connect on you. If it does connect. It should be reward. Because it is far easier to land hits on every other class since every other class has projectiles and ports.

[TorQ.7041]

@Leonidrex.5649 said:

@mortrialus.3062 said:

@Leonidrex.5649 said:

@mortrialus.3062 said:I think we're all a bit nervous.

I do hope @"Cal Cohen.2358" l is ready though because it sounds like they are extensively going through and nerfing literally everything. Like they've set up a barometer for how strong a skill and trait should be based on it's cooldown, and have gone through hammering everything that's deviating from it.

“The big thing we have coming down the line for both PvP and WvW is a major balance update. We’ve talked a little about it on the forums and on the WvW weekly stream, but to reiterate: our main goal is to reevaluate the desired power level for competitive game modes. We’re reviewing every skill and trait in the game to bring them more in line with our goals."

Sounds to me like the Wizard of the

when it came to Mana in to Power Out for creatures. I do hope he's prepared for an ocean of negative feed back because if everything in the game is getting hammered down balancewise, literally everyone is going to walk away initially angry and upset regardless of whether the changes are good or bad.

getting pissed off is part of the fun.If nobody is mad after the patch then the patch was bad.Alot of passives need to be slapped, singular traits should never provide perma boons.Looks at mirage regeneration or thiefs vigor/swiftness.

I know, it's just anyone who's had to be in the driver's seat of an ongoing game knows it can be pretty toxic right now.

I think people would shocked to see how glacially slow 2012-2015 gameplay footage looks compared to what we're useful. I don't think I want to see it go back to tha tlevel. Maybe a 10-20% decrease in over all damage, trimming some of the extreme evade/block/invuln chaining some builds have access to, and hit healing to prevent fights from stalling out for longer than a minute straight.

I honestly want the monkey perma evade builds gone, fighting rev 1v3 and he just chain evades for over 20s on node is just honestly pissing me off to no end.Having them stunned 3 times and just remove all of it back to back is a big yikes too. Sustain of holo, boons across the board. Fb vomit.Thiefs mobility and evades. Stupid level of might on some classes like engi/war/ele. Passive condi from mirage, it all needs to go.

? No 1 in high lvls can 1v3. Show us a high lvl game where any body 1v3. You can't. 1v3 only happens in low ranked games where u have 3 ppl who press all buttons then complain target didn't die

[Leonidrex.5649]

@TorQ.7041 said:

@Leonidrex.5649 said:

@mortrialus.3062 said:

@Leonidrex.5649 said:

@mortrialus.3062 said:I think we're all a bit nervous.

I do hope @"Cal Cohen.2358" l is ready though because it sounds like they are extensively going through and nerfing literally everything. Like they've set up a barometer for how strong a skill and trait should be based on it's cooldown, and have gone through hammering everything that's deviating from it.

“The big thing we have coming down the line for both PvP and WvW is a major balance update. We’ve talked a little about it on the forums and on the WvW weekly stream, but to reiterate: our main goal is to reevaluate the desired power level for competitive game modes. We’re reviewing every skill and trait in the game to bring them more in line with our goals."

Sounds to me like the Wizard of the

when it came to Mana in to Power Out for creatures. I do hope he's prepared for an ocean of negative feed back because if everything in the game is getting hammered down balancewise, literally everyone is going to walk away initially angry and upset regardless of whether the changes are good or bad.

getting pissed off is part of the fun.If nobody is mad after the patch then the patch was bad.Alot of passives need to be slapped, singular traits should never provide perma boons.Looks at mirage regeneration or thiefs vigor/swiftness.

I know, it's just anyone who's had to be in the driver's seat of an ongoing game knows it can be pretty toxic right now.

I think people would shocked to see how glacially slow 2012-2015 gameplay footage looks compared to what we're useful. I don't think I want to see it go back to tha tlevel. Maybe a 10-20% decrease in over all damage, trimming some of the extreme evade/block/invuln chaining some builds have access to, and hit healing to prevent fights from stalling out for longer than a minute straight.

I honestly want the monkey perma evade builds gone, fighting rev 1v3 and he just chain evades for over 20s on node is just honestly pissing me off to no end.Having them stunned 3 times and just remove all of it back to back is a big yikes too. Sustain of holo, boons across the board. Fb vomit.Thiefs mobility and evades. Stupid level of might on some classes like engi/war/ele. Passive condi from mirage, it all needs to go.

? No 1 in high lvls can 1v3. Show us a high lvl game where any body 1v3. You can't. 1v3 only happens in low ranked games where u have 3 ppl who press all buttons then complain target didn't die

I watched it on short stream, I think he was in legend at the time ( NA ) . Unless legend is low rank then I dont know what to tell you lol.

[Axl.8924]

@Odik.4587 said:

@"Vicariuz.1605" said:yeah necros are soooo weak they could never do 14k with just axe 2 and like 3 might.

https://www.twitch.tv/boycerino/clip/WrongYawningOwlBrainSlug

dont forget the speed rune in combat movespeed and the 2 ports.El o el.@Axl.8924 said:9k is a lot of dmg to a class with some toughness I agree with that,

15 to 20k is way too much.

In fact: Damage and sustain is so crazy and out of control, that necro underperforms, and other classes too probably due to the ridiculous nature of power creep.Ye, poor necros.

watching the entire game

... 15-20k is too much.... watching necro's spinning up to 18k ... So underperforming... poor necro, nerf Chrono again PLoS

You mean reaper which can have its shroud busted down instantly by a warr with a rifle and thief deadeye build from stealth for 30k.

I am not asking for nerfs to Chrono may be mirage I dunno. Mesmers aren't my concern anyways, thieves warriors guardians and soulbeast are.

Also let's not forget mesmers were the king of broken between chronomancers mirage and core. They were running around with Chrono getting 20k 1 shot blasts in the past while spamming infinite illusions and phantasms, and also broken op in support.

Also I don't just play necro, I play Elementalist, Necromancer, Ranger with Druid spec, Thief with Daredevil, Mes with Chronomancer.

While I am admittedly no absolute master in PVP, I can speak at least in some aspects.

Mirage with their illusions dropping condis and self shattering seemed super effective while squishy, seems to look pretty solid from the video I saw, not sure what you want from folks. You want changes to Chrono for the better? me to, but please don't act like core necro doesn't have its issues. reaper while very solid has its issues due to core defenses being around conditional defenses which have a fairly high amount of counters and power creep from other classes.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying reaper is bad, but it cannot keep up with dmg sustain and mobility power creep until some classes get nerfed.

It's also possible that Chrono might also come back into some play if others get nerfed down to their level in hot, because of the amount of mobility spam cc spam with sustain and damage.

[storm.3120]

@Axl.8924 said:

@Odik.4587 said:

@"Vicariuz.1605" said:yeah necros are soooo weak they could never do 14k with just axe 2 and like 3 might.

https://www.twitch.tv/boycerino/clip/WrongYawningOwlBrainSlug

dont forget the speed rune in combat movespeed and the 2 ports.El o el.@Axl.8924 said:9k is a lot of dmg to a class with some toughness I agree with that,

15 to 20k is way too much.

In fact: Damage and sustain is so crazy and out of control, that necro underperforms, and other classes too probably due to the ridiculous nature of power creep.Ye, poor necros.

watching the entire game

... 15-20k is too much.... watching necro's spinning up to 18k ... So underperforming... poor necro, nerf Chrono again PLoS

You mean reaper which can have its shroud busted down instantly by a warr with a rifle and thief deadeye build from stealth for 30k.So everyone else can get bursted down instantly but directly into downedstate (war with a rifle...

eyeroll

)Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying reaper is bad, but it cannot keep up with dmg sustain and mobility power creep until some classes get nerfed.(didnt read most of your post tbh) Many whined that rev is bad after nerfs and before nerfs and when its counter is gone (condi thief/mirage) its monster again, who would have thought.It's also possible that Chrono might also come back into some play if others get nerfed down to their level in hot, because of the amount of mobility spam cc spam with sustain and damage.haHAHAactually...Also let's not forget mesmers were the king of broken between chronomancers mirage and core. They were running around with Chrono getting 20k 1 shot blasts in the past while spamming infinite illusions and phantasms, and also broken op in support.WTF? Spamming phantasms/clones while bursting for 20k????????? and broken in suppot????????????????? May I know the name of your drugdealer?

[Axl.8924]

@Odik.4587 said:

@Axl.8924 said:

@Odik.4587 said:

@"Vicariuz.1605" said:yeah necros are soooo weak they could never do 14k with just axe 2 and like 3 might.

https://www.twitch.tv/boycerino/clip/WrongYawningOwlBrainSlug

dont forget the speed rune in combat movespeed and the 2 ports.El o el.@Axl.8924 said:9k is a lot of dmg to a class with some toughness I agree with that,

15 to 20k is way too much.

In fact: Damage and sustain is so crazy and out of control, that necro underperforms, and other classes too probably due to the ridiculous nature of power creep.Ye, poor necros.

watching the entire game

... 15-20k is too much.... watching necro's spinning up to 18k ... So underperforming... poor necro, nerf Chrono again PLoS

You mean reaper which can have its shroud busted down instantly by a warr with a rifle and thief deadeye build from stealth for 30k.So everyone else can get bursted down instantly but directly into downedstate (war with a rifle...

eyeroll

)Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying reaper is bad, but it cannot keep up with dmg sustain and mobility power creep until some classes get nerfed.(didnt read most of your post tbh) Many whined that rev is bad after nerfs and before nerfs and when its counter is gone (condi thief/mirage) its monster again, who would have thought.

There is a catch: necro's defenses are normalized we don't have crazy amount of mobility spam sustain spam like aegis etc to deal with the power creep of damage that others got, plus evades. This is a good thing, but it also means others need to be nerfed and damage brought down. to normalize the damage to when it wasn't so crazy(heart of thorns or earlier)

It's also possible that Chrono might also come back into some play if others get nerfed down to their level in hot, because of the amount of mobility spam cc spam with sustain and damage.haHAHAactually...Also let's not forget mesmers were the king of broken between chronomancers mirage and core. They were running around with Chrono getting 20k 1 shot blasts in the past while spamming infinite illusions and phantasms, and also broken op in support.kitten? Spamming phantasms/clones while bursting for 20k????????? and broken in suppot????????????????? May I know the name of your drugdealer?

one of the mesmers i saw on this forum admitted chronophantasma was op and before the nerfs, Chronos used to have a lot stronger sustain.

[Leonidrex.5649]

@Axl.8924every mesmer player knows chronophantasma is OP, it still is.doesnt change the fact that chrono is dog shit .And necro DOES have sustain, expecially reaper.Shroud to tank hits.Healing skills like everyone else.And heals for damage done.

[Axl.8924]

@Leonidrex.5649 said:@Axl.8924every mesmer player knows chronophantasma is OP, it still is.doesnt change the fact that chrono is dog kitten .And necro DOES have sustain, expecially reaper.Shroud to tank hits.Healing skills like everyone else.And heals for damage done.

You keep forgetting or leaving out that tanking blows will never be as good as all the spam of stuff, which probably came into existence because of the insane dmg everyone does, reaper probably included, which i think needs reduced in pvp. Having that much dmg combined makes shroud which is tanky less viable compared to the mobile bombers.

[Leonidrex.5649]

@Axl.8924 said:

@Leonidrex.5649 said:@Axl.8924every mesmer player knows chronophantasma is OP, it still is.doesnt change the fact that chrono is dog kitten .And necro DOES have sustain, expecially reaper.Shroud to tank hits.Healing skills like everyone else.And heals for damage done.

You keep forgetting or leaving out that tanking blows will never be as good as all the spam of stuff, which probably came into existence because of the insane dmg everyone does, reaper probably included, which i think needs reduced in pvp. Having that much dmg combined makes shroud which is tanky less viable compared to the mobile bombers.

depends, insane offensive is the best defence. its hard to pressure someone that can hit you for 10k+ with 1 skill.

[storm.3120]

@Axl.8924 said:

@Odik.4587 said:

@Axl.8924 said:

@Odik.4587 said:

@"Vicariuz.1605" said:yeah necros are soooo weak they could never do 14k with just axe 2 and like 3 might.

https://www.twitch.tv/boycerino/clip/WrongYawningOwlBrainSlug

dont forget the speed rune in combat movespeed and the 2 ports.El o el.@Axl.8924 said:9k is a lot of dmg to a class with some toughness I agree with that,

15 to 20k is way too much.

In fact: Damage and sustain is so crazy and out of control, that necro underperforms, and other classes too probably due to the ridiculous nature of power creep.Ye, poor necros.

watching the entire game

... 15-20k is too much.... watching necro's spinning up to 18k ... So underperforming... poor necro, nerf Chrono again PLoS

You mean reaper which can have its shroud busted down instantly by a warr with a rifle and thief deadeye build from stealth for 30k.So everyone else can get bursted down instantly but directly into downedstate (war with a rifle...

eyeroll

)Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying reaper is bad, but it cannot keep up with dmg sustain and mobility power creep until some classes get nerfed.(didnt read most of your post tbh) Many whined that rev is bad after nerfs and before nerfs and when its counter is gone (condi thief/mirage) its monster again, who would have thought.

There is a catch: necro's defenses are normalized we don't have crazy amount of mobility spam sustain spam like aegis etc to deal with the power creep of damage that others got, plus evades. This is a good thing, but it also means others need to be nerfed and damage brought down. to normalize the damage to when it wasn't so crazy(heart of thorns or earlier)

It's also possible that Chrono might also come back into some play if others get nerfed down to their level in hot, because of the amount of mobility spam cc spam with sustain and damage.haHAHAactually...Also let's not forget mesmers were the king of broken between chronomancers mirage and core. They were running around with Chrono getting 20k 1 shot blasts in the past while spamming infinite illusions and phantasms, and also broken op in support.kitten? Spamming phantasms/clones while bursting for 20k????????? and broken in suppot????????????????? May I know the name of your drugdealer?

one of the mesmers i saw on this forum admitted chronophantasma was op and before the nerfs, Chronos used to have a lot stronger sustain.CP was the sole reason why phantasms got trashed and then CP itself which should have been done in the first place but it never had everything in 1 package as "burst shatter" and this phantasm spam simply cuz u took phatnasm trait and sustain.

[mrauls.6519]

@Vicariuz.1605 said:

@"mrauls.6519" said:Remove tanky amulets

this abominable dh player is spotted again.

it is now known who is ACTUALLY behind these projected changes all in an effort to bring this heinous monster up from the depths where it rightfully belongs.

question not the motives of a person who plays dh for they are always focused solely to their own benefit!

I laughed out loud XD