nthmetal.9652

Care to elaborate? Not everyone of us has played GW1. :)

No. Yes. :)It is fun for the ppl doign the killing. It is not fun for the people there for the jormag meta. You can only do that in an environment, where both sides have signed in to that agreement, and I doubt you'd get many PvE players to do that. Surely not enough to make the whole event fun.Or are you really suggesting, that it should be done without consent, or that consent is already given by logging in? Surely not.

And one dodge makes Mirage unusable. Honestly, first I don't care. Secondly, look at any WvW zerg video from the last year and the sea of red when you attempt to push, or push yourself. Yes, of course it is not guaranteed all that stuff hits. But enough of it did hit. Yes, I am very aware that 4 (! - in words: FOUR - not TWO) targets are split between two different areas, and I do realize that this especially relieves ranged pressure. Something that melee classes could do little to nothing against. But when the zerg pushes, there is still a lot of pressure and zones going on, and that's when you want it to be on. Yes, it isn't guaranteed that you hit with all 4 targets. But guess what? My hammerburst isn't guaranteed to hit its 5 targets either. It is not persistent, but only momentary. It can only occur where I am - and if I am CC'd before the impact, that impact actually never happens. And it deals no damage. If 4 targets make scourges unusable, I've been playing a profession that has been unusable since the last big balance patch. A little less ranged pressure is good - and if the scourge nerf actually means there is a lot less ranged pressure, congratulations: We have just adressed a big problem in the meta of the last year. Of the last two years, because it means they were having too great of an impact. Other classes should also contribute to the ranged pressure.A little less ranged pressure is good, because two zergs dancing in front of each other, left and right, looking for the right moment to push, isn't especially fun. Yes, your ranged characters have something to do, but the rest are just sitting there, waiting for the action to happen. Of course we don't want melee to simply power through everything; however I still see a lot of red, and I still see it hurting, so I am not overly worried about ranged becoming utterly irrelevant. And maybe with this current change we have the chance to adress the fact that we still need one firebrand in every squadgroup, otherwise that group is pretty much unable to do anything.

No.

So 2x3 targets (which is > 5 targtets) counts as a nerf these days? I am not sure my math agrees.Yes, they need to be perfectly placed. But so did the shades before, when you had to decide between range and melee. And it showed. Scourges did typically hog top or high spots in DPS and strips. Yes, warriors can outstrip them, but look where they typically end up damage-wise, if they do. And yes, revs, good soulbeasts and probably more professions can greatly outdamage scourges, but look where they appear in terms of strips, heals or cleanses.There was a good reason the typical "ideal" squad compo was: fb, healer (ele or scrapper), rev (or sometimes spb) and .... 2x scourge. Raising the number of overall targets would not have done this justice.The one thing I might agree on is that big shades should probably 3 targets - but then again I main warrior and I have a defense traitline with 2 passive traits with a 300 second cooldown. So ... suck it up?

Yes. Scourges get outDPSd, but at the same time they still hog upper spots in the DPS spectrum. Typically after the revs, or scrappers. Usually core guards or burn guards aren't even taken into zergs. I've also seen some soulbeasts take top spots, but they are likely rarely taken into squads.However: The scourges are high up there. While also being high up there in strips. They do soft CC. Their strips are actually often corrupts. They provided persistent area denial through lasting / pulsing zones. And for that, the damage was clearly too high.While, when I am on a warrior, and I wanna do CC, I have to pick: do damage or CC. And it shows. Hopefully the current change will open zergs up to give more classes easy access. I guess some additional changes are needed until more builds are actually viable and we need to see that the work is kept up. Keep the meta changing, so we got something to do!

What do you mean "for no reason"? I am pretty sure that, for example, most Mirage nerfs are actually targeted at PvP, but ruined it for WvW, so a problem in one area is a perfect reason to ruin the class in another area of the game.

We're not talking PvP, but WvW here. How exactly are you gonna distinguish these skill animations and effects on a 50 man zerg? (hell, even a 20 man guild group)?

Let me guess: you are on a high population server and / or have proper link. All this gets way less fun if you constantly find yourself outnumbered. We have few and ever fewer mechanisms to help combat size imbalances. This makes it harder and harder to get fair fights in WvW.

And even that has pretty much been gutted by previous nerfs. I wish we could find a proper role for the warclaw in WvW. Especially now that numbers matter more than ever before, its mobility could be increased again, but I don't really expect anything like that to happen. I really wish changes done could be reviewed once more in terms of their greater context, and checked against that.

That is, because you are nice person maybe :) Or maybe not focused as muich on optimization. Other commanders do not think the same way. You might even be limited in your choice of guilds to join, because demand for other classes isn't as high.That's not to say it is impossible. But it is easier. Even if other classes come close, scourge does not only strip. They corrupt. And depending on the build they deal damage while doing so. They CC (at least "soft" CC, though honestly, fear is a very impactful condition). They limit healing (poison is quite effective). I do strip more on a spellbreaker, but in order to be able to sustain that, I have to give up on the idea of dealing damage. For one reason because I need different stats in order to survive, which limit my ability to deal damage. For the other reason that my CC skills do not deal damage. And I can only do it in melee.I have seen mesmers strip quite effectively, however what do they give up for that, and what could you take alternatively to a mesmer, and what would you gain for your whole zerg, if you did? Scourges are very effective and they are quite versatile in zergs. They just bring too much good to the table; few other classes do that. FB is another such example. If it were my choice: Since Scourge does all of these: stripand convert conditionsdeal hindering conditionsprovide area denialand deal damage... I would focus the class down on the corruption and area denial mechanic and giving them the same treatment warriors got. If you do area denial, corruption and (soft) CC, you don't get to deal any notable damage anymore.If you wanna deal damage, or if you wanna heal / provide barrier, build differently. You don't get the whole area denial/condi/strip stuff.Now we have a focused role for WvW zerg fights.Obviously that approach can only be taken for WvW. It doesn't work in PvE and PvP. So the mechanics need to be split off for WvW. Thus making room for other classes in WvW zergs.

And how often do you meet a group of 20 thiefs, rangers, mesmers, revs?How often do you meet a group of 20 scourges? Hint: look at the composition of any 50 man zerg. And now ask yourself why that is. Even now, even after all the nerfs, the ideal squad group in WvW is:1 FB1 Healer (scrapper or Ele)1 rev (sometimes replaced by 1 Spb)and .... 2 (!) scourges.That is before the incoming buffs. Maybe the problem isn't every SINGLE scourge, maybe their mechanics would be fine, but the stuff they do stacks nicely and combines nicely.There are clear limits to buffs you can place, creating strongly diminishing returns on overstacking FBs, Healscrappers or Eles. There are no clear diminishing returns on stacking necros / damaging AoEs. Damaging, persistent AoEs (as in those, that stay for a while and/or pulse). And in the future, damaging, moving persistent AoEs. Maybe the problem should be addressed by fixing the core mechanic. But as we don't seem to be able to do that, we have to work on the only thing we can: The classes.

If we have these shade changes, in order ESPECIALLY for melee classes to still be useful, we do need further changes to complement the scourge changes. If it is truly the intention to buff scourges, the result will be that we have more AoEs. That by itself is difficult enough, as in the past WvW servers have shown not to be able to handle this kind of mechanic very well. These AoEs bring additional fear and chill and possible cripple and other hard or soft-cc conditions. Now combine this change with reduced stability across the board, it will lead to melee being derived of options to act, especially if we have size differences between zergs. So if this is the way to go, can we please also buff stability and resistance again, to make up for this change? I know, we're turning in circles, it's not where I'd like to see things move, but these are the consequences we need if we're to head down this path.

So we are buffing necros, nerfing FBs, which will maybe work for PvP - but in WvW it will emphasize the difference in size even more. I am not sure I understand the goal ...

Neither of the two is the case. Aha. So going for a solution, which leads to groups of a size, where the AoEs, condis and boons cause the server to lag out is a BETTER solution than actually creating an environment, in which you can actually fight? Just the fight won't be 50+ vs 50+ vs 50+ but maybe only 40 vs 40 vs 40 or 30 vs 30. In those situations my experiences with group fights have been quite good.Whereas the 50+ fights always end up with one or both sides going 1-1-1-1 all the time, because nothing else works. Clearly THAT is a great experience for everyone and no one here is crying because of that. Well, I don't have to understand your reasoning. I do agree that my suggestion is not idea, it's an emergency fix for an emergency situation. Yes, but this change will also mean facing an overall design change. Designers will have to come up with alternative mechanics to keep things interesting - otherwise you'd just end up with variations of 1-1-1-1 all the time, which is also not very interesting.This design change would also have to be implemented across all game modes, thus possibly making it necessary to rebalance all PvE content. And that with a player base complaining about the cost in general and utterly opposed to the idea of a game going subscription base. I don't see how such an effort can be realistically financed.

That sounds like a local problem. I'm doing metas in SW, HoT and personal story with a new character. I hang out in populated places as well as empty ones and usually in PvE unless there are massive numbers of players on a limited area in a map, I don't experience lag. Neither skill lag, nor network lag.In WvW the problem regularly occurs, usually when two big zergs are nearby; three way fights between big groups are basically always problematic. Sometimes (depending on zerg composition, tactical decisions and regarding actions) even 2-way fights are problematic. If you can't address the problem as it currently is .... why don't we at least to solve the problem by: lowering the number of players per map to two-thirds of currently allowed players per mapcloning desert and alpine map once more to compensate, thus offering: EB, 2x desert, 3x alpine, thus offering 1/3rd more maps than currently.

While much of that is true, over the sum of a zerg, part of this line of thinking is irrelevant.Yes, AoE damage is spread unspecificly by a single guard or necro, but over the sum of a group, if a bomb is dropped, it is dropped all on the same group, dealing massive damage and conditions to the group.Where thieves and rangers each focus one target and down it, the guards and necros, when dropping a bomb don't only deal more damage. They also down more people. Only when you look at a single guard or necro, of if your AoE casters cannot coordinate their bombs does their damage not also equal downs. That said, there are professions, which are better in roaming and smallscale, and there are professions, which are better large scale. But if only really two professions take top DPS large scale, I'd still follow the reasoning of the OP that we do indeed have a balancing problem. Specific builds allowing for variance in playstyles across one professions should be a lot more relevant. I would love to see more and harder work on Anet's side to enable us the character we really want to play, in the situation we want to play them in.

To a certain point we already have such in the game. You can take sustainy armor, but that automatically means you will have less damage, since you have to sacrifice some damage-dealing stats to toughness / vitality. However where we clearly don't have this in any form that really helps is in terms of ranged and AoE compared to melee. Some of the hardest-hitting powers are ranged AND not even single target. Yes, they are telegraphed hard, however in group content this does hardly matter, as you're not looking at individual animation phases. Also AoEs, often pulsing AoEs can hit quite hard, most (if not all) melee cannot compare. Even if the damage on a single target is a bit lower, it is not lower by an amount that accounts for the limited range and targets of most melee attacks / melee focused characters.

Generally, reading through the points broguht forward in OP I have a feeling that a lot of the problems relate to tiered-up objectives. Have you ever thought about not allowing the enemy to tier up those objectives?Is your server maybe a fight-server? "Not interested in PPT, we don't do PvE trash here"? Well, maybe there's more reasons to go after objectives early and all the time other than just wanting to PPT. Not only does it create a good mix of activities, but it also prevents enemies from tiering that stuff up, so that it gets harder to take. And hey, maybe, just maybe you can establish a culture where you have fight commanders work alongside "PPT" commanders, where one tries for the hard fights, while the other flips objectives so that that even if a fight moves toward one of the objectives, the enemy doesn't have that big of an advantage. Or maybe the objective the fights moves to is... your own! Shocking, isn't it?And on top of all that, you give your pugs and non-meta players something to do instead of trying to sort into all guild-only heavily organized combat oriented squads.

BS. Really. Maybe it needs to be fixed where you can bring a dragonbanner, that is meant for the defense of a specific objective, but it doesn't need to be nerfed overall. We kill dragonbanners all the time, sometimes needing to face two or more at the same time. Just dodge that stuff, cleanse and counterattack. They are not a big issue; if they are, the attacking group has other problems. It's almost never the dragonbanner, that's the root cause of the problem.Of course in a 1v1 a dragonbanner is powerful, but it rightfully so. It is a tactic available for a limited time, you need to invest to create that defensive option by tiering up an objective, and having the dragon banner tactic in the first place so that it can be placed on the objective. It needs to have impact for all this to make sense.

I still feel I have much to learn, but in the end, I come to WvW for the community and chat. Hop into WvW, hop into the voice discord or TS, talk with people, have fun!

The problem is not limited to the combination of the three maguuma pieces. I just tried assigning the foefire mantle while wearing the maguuma gauntlets and boots. The result is the very same crash. Maybe the problem is indeed related to the combination of particle effects?

Lucky that I had applied an outfit to my character, so I can still use it. Just cannot change equipment anymore. Fingers crossed that anet will fix it, because the game still crashes every time I access the hero panel to check / change equipment.

how exactly is this gonna solve the problems of permastealth thieves?Sorry, you fail, no star for you.

That's strange. I've seen your stats, maybe a mix of cleric and minstrel isn't idea for damage. I run zerker weapons, cleric armor (with some Knight pieces), cleric and minstrel rest and I do crit controlled (!) enemies for over 5k. Not much, but my stats are not focused on damage, as I like to focus more on CC, strips and cleanses. The damage is mostly to deter gankers. I do not see what break enchantments might do to you being blinded or under weakness, which might well cause misses. INvulnerable can be an issue, but in my experience, unless you are vastly outnumbered or your own people do not know what they are doing, break enchantments does do the trick.I have no issue with Backbreaker either. Especially the f1->f2->f1 hammer combo does a lot of CC. Of course do not try to pull it off on an enemy zerg which is just buffing / hast just buffed. I typically go on with dagger+warhorn first, engaging with dagger 2, firing break enchantments (at least if bubble isn't up or worth it), maybe try some dagger 3 and f1 for minor cc and strripping and then activate hammer. And usually (not always! - usually!) this is very effective. In many fights this manages to out-strip scourges or even keep up with them (even if bubble is not available).You do absolutely need additional support though. If your party does not someone doing additional cleansing like a scrapper, you might still be in trouble. If your fb isn't good, you will be in trouble due to the lack of stab.Yes, I just said, that in a spb party it does not hurt at all to have a fb AND a scrapper! This is how the meta currently works (at least on my server). And obv not every party needs a spellbreaker, but you can still use them and they can be uzilized to terrible effectivity. Maybe not damage-wise, but they disrupt the enemy structure with a massive amount of CC and strips.