Opinion on ranked restrictions

[choovanski.5462]

@Ron Burgundy.4035 said:So did Anet consider how much throwing there will be in plat? people who get tired of solo q will de-rank themselves to play with others. Now you have people crying about throwers..... Well done Anet.

this was obviously going to happen, just shows the calibre of the people that thought it was a good idea

it's actually motivation for match manipulation, not a solution

[Hot Boy.7138]

i'm glad duo queue is more limited

[Elementalist Owner.7802]

Sorry boys, no more getting carried by duo queue. Now everyone has a fair shot. In a competitive sense this change was much needed.

[Skugga.5298]

I can only agree with this post.After a long break I decided to start a PvP guild.Managed to find people to join and I got really excited, I was unaware of the ranked changes.Now I really wonder what the point is of a PvP guild, of course we have the guild missions but that won't be enough to keep my guild members interested.

Any competitive game I have played allows you to create your own group of people, I really don't understand why they had to change this.Let people join as a group or let people join solo,...works the same way in for example Cs Go.

[Reaper Alim.4176]

@Skugga.5298 said:I can only agree with this post.After a long break I decided to start a PvP guild.Managed to find people to join and I got really excited, I was unaware of the ranked changes.Now I really wonder what the point is of a PvP guild, of course we have the guild missions but that won't be enough to keep my guild members interested.

Any competitive game I have played allows you to create your own group of people, I really don't understand why they had to change this.Let people join as a group or let people join solo,...works the same way in for example Cs Go.

It's simple ANet allowed it's MM to produce such poor quality matches for soo long. That a lot of players stopped playing. Since a lot of players stopped playing, the MM has less players to draw on. Since the MM has less players to draw on, the MM started to produce worst matches. To combat the MM system high ranking players decided to make a discord and coordinate mass match manipulation in multiple matches. So instead of just punishing these players who was just a symptom of the very bad MM system. They decided to take the easy way out and punish everyone and left the bad MM functioning as is.

Also you have to remember GW2 ranked PvP is the farthest thing from competitive. That you can get in a competitive PvP environment. To the point I dare said it's the complete polar opposite of competitive game mode.

[Juidodin.5829]

@Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:

@AngelsShadow.7360 said:

With regards to what the pvp team is doing, they’ve mentioned that they’re working on a large project that is still several months out. Several high profile streamers have also referred to this in passing comment. I’m fairly certain this is why we haven’t seen any new maps or ‘development’ so-to-speak.

Just a quick note to properly set expectations: We're not working on some giant PvP overhaul, so I don't want people to expect that. Most of the changes I mentioned that are a few months out are tournament features.

don't worry, I gave it up a long time ago to expect anything from you.. anet is obviously way in over its head when it comes to pvp.. you cant even fix the shitmaker.. aka matchmaker.

[Skugga.5298]

@Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:

@AngelsShadow.7360 said:

With regards to what the pvp team is doing, they’ve mentioned that they’re working on a large project that is still several months out. Several high profile streamers have also referred to this in passing comment. I’m fairly certain this is why we haven’t seen any new maps or ‘development’ so-to-speak.

Just a quick note to properly set expectations: We're not working on some giant PvP overhaul, so I don't want people to expect that. Most of the changes I mentioned that are a few months out are tournament features.

Most people I know are not very interested in tournaments, you need to wait for it to start (even if they add more tournaments it's the same thing).People expect to login and play, additional to that is that the majority I know loves the league reward system, pips and chests.

Please just make changes to the league queue size.

[Rodzynald.5897]

@shadowpass.4236 said:

@OriOri.8724 said:

@ShadowDragoonFTW.3418 said:To be fair Omar... if they really are eliminating the ability to queue as a team, that would make PvP... well, it would kill a lot of the organizing and strategic elements. If you can only solo-queue (which is what it sounds like OP says is going on, first i'm hearing of it myself), then you get stuck with a team of completely random people (probably still rank-based, but nobody you know), and you have to HOPE that the people you're playing with are going to take the match as seriously as you. Which you can't guarantee if you don't know Teammate A from a hole in the ground.

Blame the population at the top of the leaderboards who cheated their way there via match manipulation. This is in direct response to those players and their actions? Is it the best solution? No. But it is a solution. If people who played PvP in this game weren't such huge cheaters then this wouldn't have happened.

They did it because people were complaining that coordinated 5 mans were too hard to fight against if you were solo quing. (lol no kitten)

But anyways, almost everyone at the top of the leaderboards got their legitimately. If you really think it was that easy to get there using match manipulation, try actually fighting anyone in the top 10 and see if you can beat them.

The players at the top are there for a reason, and its not because we cheat.

Actually, I had a pleasure of fighting against one god of pvp lately. He was tough to beat, but sometimes it's the matter of build you play, so I might have just countered what he had. But this is how PvP is meant to be played, to take advantage of opponent's weaknesses. In the long run I wouldn't say that they are amazingly awesome, there are plenty of platinum players on the same level if it comes to combat prowess. Besides, pretty much every top player plays something that has a gimmick attached to it, be it invisibility, strong passive procs or loads and loads of mobility - all that gives more control on the battlefield. Anyway, from twitch streams and other videos I can tell that they gain so much mostly because there is a huge community of unskilled players who let themselves get tanked or just killed on sight. Top players know how to cooperate and that is the strongest fact. By cooperation I mean both duo, team comps and queue with a bunch of lads on discord to boost personal win rate. You won't tell me otherwise because I've already witnessed at least 2 cases and heard about such a few times more. With my own eyes I saw how some dude from top 10 had some player in the other team to throw the game for his bud's team (lucky me, I was in that team as well). That thrower didn't even hide it and admitted it, saying that a vast majority, if not every top player, does something that is close to match manipulation. However he was not afk, he either camped close or ran around the spawn point.I don't think this change will bring much, smurfs will pop into queue without party, discord/ts is enough. What we need is an automatized system of account suspension based on ammount of reports sent in a given time limit.

[Ioras Dagnir.3927]

This old post again. We are running in the same circles for seasons now. Anet makes sPvP changes but doesn't make it any better, we suggest how they could improve sPvP in leaps and bounds and they basically ignore us.Some players want soloQ only others want teamQ so they should bite the bullet give us both already and see what happens

[Magnus Godrik.5841]

Don't see how, seeing that they have tournaments that you can group up 5 people. And really when you pug ranked how many players do you keep in contact with?

[ReaverKane.7598]

@Omar Aschi Popp.7496 said:

@ShadowDragoonFTW.3418 said:To be fair Omar... if they really are eliminating the ability to queue as a team, that would make PvP... well, it would kill a lot of the organizing and strategic elements. If you can only solo-queue (which is what it sounds like OP says is going on, first i'm hearing of it myself), then you get stuck with a team of completely random people (probably still rank-based, but nobody you know), and you have to HOPE that the people you're playing with are going to take the match as seriously as you. Which you can't guarantee if you don't know Teammate A from a hole in the ground.

Oh no I feel you there, and I understand OP too. I'm just saying that after all the stuff that has already happened that SHOULD have killed PvP did not. So this too will pass.

That's depressing.

Yet here we are begrudgingly playing this PvP with the insane idea of home.

It's our fault really.We should pull the plug, but are unable to let go.

Did it not?I don't see them doing world series anymore, i don't see them presenting us with pvp numbers anymore... I see them rolling pretty much the same stuff with as little fuss as possible.But i can tell you my experience: 90% of my friends stopped playing and of those 10% left, 90% don't pvp anymore.Because now a days you have to make a choice, either you play unranked with your friends and don't get the stuff you want from the rewards, or you play ranked, but only with one of your friends.Also the change itself is indicative of low numbers, because its pretty much that, they can't have duos on legendary rank because there aren't enough players at that level that they can matchmake properly and having a duo of legs +3 plats vs 1 Leg + 4 plats would be unfair.

This all boils down to low numbers and a crappy matchmaking system that DOES NOT reward skill. Hot Streaks? Congrats, here's LESS points than you got at the beginning of your winning spree.Winning too much are we? Lets pair you up with a couple bronze players on your team to get you down a peg.But if you farm the game, eventually you'll get where you want (or not, it's more of a RNG thing than anything else, really).

[Ashgar.3024]

@Despond.2174 said:I'd love for it--and many others including pros--to just go back to solo queue only.

For all intent and purpose its already how it works for the "Pros" since what's happening under 1600 should be irrelevant to them.

Let us casual idiots have our fun.

[shadowpass.4236]

Hi, I was holding 2 or 3 people all game at far in one of my qualifiers and my team kept wiping for some reason.

I can't carry 4 other people if they are absolutely garbage. This is why it shouldn't be solo que only.

PvP is frustrating because wins and losses are out of your control. What the hell type of game is this when wins and losses come down to luck rather than player skill.

Pathetic. I'm honestly disgusted by this.

[Aplethoraof.2643]

Yeah, the new changes are pretty silly. Now, any-time I (I duo-que with my friend, I find soloing PvP to be duller) get too high I have to say this to myself:

"I accidentally got too high in rank. Looks like I have to purposely make my team lose the next match(s) in order to drop my rating down so I can play with my friend again."

There is so much wrong with this. The fact that I have to actively make other players suffer (purposefully throw matches) in order for the game to allow me to enjoy it (play with my friend again) is beyond asinine. This is entering borderline retarded territory.

That should not have to happen. Not only that, but it kills team cohesiveness as mentioned above. You can't create any neat strategies with your team beforehand, you just have to pray and spray. Its no wonder why FotM has so much salt in its map chat. As much as anet has many quality of life improvements over other MMOs in GW2, they have actively killed sPvP quality of life.

[choovanski.5462]

solo queue is the absolute death of pvp community

it removes all incentives to form bonds & help other players. why would i give a player i see struggling advice? it doesn’t benefit me at all. however if we had a team queue i would be incentivised to take players under my wing & help them out, because they are potential team mates. without the ability to play with friends, there is no reason to make them.

like, another example:i have a few friends who don’t play guild wars anymore, but we still hang out. i still enjoy playing my berserker, & think at a base level gw2 combat is pretty nifty. i’m sure they could get a kick out of it too, if they reinstalled.but i don’t tell them to reinstall. here’s why- we wouldn’t be able to @€%&ing play together. so it defeats the whole point of playing the same game. they may as well be playing league of legends, because it’s the same experience- us in separate matches chatting on discord.

this applies to people who are even playing guild wars already. why would a guild who does WvW or fractals go into pvp? the queue system stops them from playing as a guild, which is a huge part of the fun of the game for them.

[Shaogin.2679]

Having a solo leader board and queue in a 5v5 game mode is beyond ridiculous. Ranked should of always been nothing but 5-man team queue only, especially if you're going to attach a leader board to it. As it stands right now, ranked PvP is the equivalent of WoW random battlegrounds, with a solo player leader board attached so that we can pretend it is a competitive environment. You can tell me it is hard to make a full group all you want, but yet I see people doing it with no problem every day for ATs and Fractals. Between Unranked and the LFG tool, getting a team together just requires you to socialize a bit.

This brings us to the supporters of solo queue. These are the anti-social and/or simply lazy players that can't be bothered to form a group and want everyone else brought down to their level to make things easier for them. Also, running a solo queue and team queue side by side then saying solo queue was more popular is incredibly stupid. You're presenting players with two options, both options provide the exact same rewards, but one option has shorter queues, less coordinated opponents, and requires no prep work or social interactions. Like seriously, why would anyone be shocked that the easier option is more popular? The majority of the PvE community (the bulk of those guys after the rewards) is dead set on finding the easiest and fastest path to obtaining the most rewards.

As for the population issue, if you've messed up PvP so bad for so long that your population has dropped to the point where you can no longer support a 5-man team queue, then the solution you should have pursued was to create a PvP game mode based on smaller team sizes. Removing the option to play with your friends, in a 5v5 game mode, in an mmo, was a horrible idea. You know what Anet, how about you go over to the PvE side and remove the option to play with your friends in fractals and raids, see how they like it since it is such a big hit in PvP. Just make a queue for fractals and raids and assign completely random group members, and restrict any changes to the group from being made until the fractal or raid is complete. I'm sure nothing could possibly go wrong there.

Sadly though, the PvE players and whiners have won, and the exodus of players from PvP has done too much damage to go back. ATs are the only source for competitive team PvP now, but all the kinks have yet to be worked out. Without a healthy population and with the existence of ATs, there is no longer any reason to not make ranked PvP solo queue only. All of the rewards are based on solo players, the population can't even support duo queues in this 5v5 game mode anymore, it's time to just let team play in ranked die. Let the solo queue players go back to focusing all of their complaints on match making, since they'll need something else to blame their losses on. Maybe someday, if Anet cares about PvP again, we can get a 2v2 or 3v3 team only game mode with it's own leader boards.

[shadowpass.4236]

Oh, but of course we aren't going to see a dev address this issue. It's just going to be ignored just like every other major issue on the forum.

What happened to polls? Couldn't you do an in game poll of the entire PvP population about who wants solo que vs who wants team que? Who thought this was a good idea?

[choovanski.5462]

@shadowpass.4236 said:Oh, but of course we aren't going to see a dev address this issue. It's just going to be ignored just like every other major issue on the forum.

What happened to polls? Couldn't you do an in game poll of the entire PvP population about who wants solo que vs who wants team que? Who thought this was a good idea?

when the originally did the pol i recall them saying they would do it again in the future to see what the community thought after the change was implemented. yet here we are.

it’s almost... like we’re playing an abandoned gamemode in a dying game

[Shaogin.2679]

@choovanski.5462 said:

@shadowpass.4236 said:Oh, but of course we aren't going to see a dev address this issue. It's just going to be

ignored

just like every other major issue on the forum.

What happened to polls? Couldn't you do an in game poll of the entire PvP population about who wants solo que vs who wants team que? Who thought this was a good idea?

when the originally did the pol i recall them saying they would do it again in the future to see what the community thought after the change was implemented. yet here we are.

Yeah, they were supposed to poll the players again at the end of the season 5, but that has yet to happen.

[shadowpass.4236]

I, for the life of me, have never even heard of a company where one of their policies is to "disclose nothing with their playerbase and have as little communication as possible."

That's just called happy extremely crappy PR, and I don't know of a case where that's turned out well.

I really want this game to succeed. I've stuck with it since release. Yet time and time again I become very frustrated over the decision making. Obviously they are doing something wrong if the entire PvP population is insanely small. If they were doing something right, it would be a bustling, interactive, competitive community. Another piece of proof for this point is the fact that GW2 was dropped by ESL. Hint: That means Arenanet messed up somewhere.

[Frozenblade.6039]

Very roughly, what is the average population of the EU PVP players?Moreover, I think, we must brainstorm on, how Anet can lure more players from PvE to PvP content. Playing with same people over and over again don't make ay sense at all.

[witcher.3197]

@Frozenblade.6039 said:Very roughly, what is the average population of the EU PVP players?Moreover, I think, we must brainstorm on, how Anet can lure more players from PvE to PvP content. Playing with same people over and over again don't make ay sense at all.

Getting PvE players into PvP for farming is already happening but by itself that's not always a good thing because the keyword is farm

We need people to have incentives to improve and that's where Anet is failing repeatedly. Titles are good at first but once you get one or 2 it's no longer a carrot on a stick, not to mention by now it's been farmed by wintraders and made worthless.

A PvP only weapon set that actually looks good would be better. Award some minimal ticket scraps in plat and above for every win, then a large amount based on where someone finishes the given season, so with ~120 games and a good placement maybe people can buy 1.5-2 weapons per season and ~3 if they grind hardcore.

Or a new title track like the old glory system before the instant r80 bump, but only wins above X rating (or AT wins) progress it. PvP doesn't have any long term goals except for a PvE stat stick re-skin labeled as legendary PvP armor, lol

[Morwath.9817]

@witcher.3197 said:

@Frozenblade.6039 said:Very roughly, what is the average population of the EU PVP players?Moreover, I think, we must brainstorm on, how Anet can lure more players from PvE to PvP content. Playing with same people over and over again don't make ay sense at all.

Getting PvE players into PvP for farming is already happening but by itself that's not always a good thing because the keyword is

farm

We need people to have incentives to improve and that's where Anet is failing repeatedly. Titles are good at first but once you get one or 2 it's no longer a carrot on a stick, not to mention by now it's been farmed by wintraders and made worthless.

A PvP only weapon set that actually looks good would be better. Award some minimal ticket scraps in plat and above for every win, then a large amount based on where someone finishes the given season, so with ~120 games and a good placement maybe people can buy 1.5-2 weapons per season and ~3 if they grind hardcore.

Or a new title track like the old glory system before the instant r80 bump, but only wins above X rating (or AT wins) progress it. PvP doesn't have any long term goals except for a PvE stat stick re-skin labeled as legendary PvP armor, lol

If Quaggan would be in charge, he would give exclusive skins (different each season) for reaching gold or even plat at the end of season with minimum of 100 games played given season... and since reward would given for performance, players would have to improve to get it, instead of mindlessly farming pips.

[Reaper Alim.4176]

@choovanski.5462 said:

@shadowpass.4236 said:Oh, but of course we aren't going to see a dev address this issue. It's just going to be

ignored

just like every other major issue on the forum.

What happened to polls? Couldn't you do an in game poll of the entire PvP population about who wants solo que vs who wants team que? Who thought this was a good idea?

when the originally did the pol i recall them saying they would do it again in the future to see what the community thought after the change was implemented. yet here we are.

it’s almost... like we’re playing an abandoned gamemode in a dying game

This is exactly what's going on. Though you'll still have some deny that it's happening. But in the end... It is what it is.

[Malediktus.9250]

@"Omar Aschi Popp.7496" said:"X will finally kill PvP for good and ever"

I've been hearing this kitten a long time man.Boooorrriìng.If you guess often enough you will eventually guess correctly.