How do you beat fire Weaver?

[Arklite.4013]

Hello Eles,

 

I come to you as a sidenoder who doesn't understand your class at all. Fire weaver consistently gives me trouble - it seems like they have a ton of damage mitigation/invulns/evades and somehow thirds of my health vanish. Also, you guys have like 30 skills so if someone could give me a "fighting fire weaver 101" breakdown about what I should be looking out for I'd really appreciate it

[Sunshine.5014]

1 hour ago, Arklite.4013 said:

Hello Eles,

 

I come to you as a sidenoder who doesn't understand your class at all. Fire weaver consistently gives me trouble - it seems like they have a ton of damage mitigation/invulns/evades and somehow thirds of my health vanish. Also, you guys have like 30 skills so if someone could give me a "fighting fire weaver 101" breakdown about what I should be looking out for I'd really appreciate it

Beating Fire Weaver is very easy with Burst. Don't fight Fire Weaver with Condi, but with pure Power damage. Any class that can burst can kill Fire Weaver very well: Warrior, Explosive Holo, DH. The key is to NOT wait for them to switch out of Water. That's a myth based on the old age of bunker Ele. Just go all out in damage, the new Fire Weaver with 500 healing power can't out heal your damage at all.

[Guybrush.4762]

Hi, from your description I have assumed you are referring to sPvP.

 

One of the strength of fire weaver (and most duelists for that matter) is the ability to waste the time of the opposite team. A weaver dragging a 1v2 or even a 1v3 create a lot of space for his team even if he ends up dying. Based on that, your most basic yet powerful tool to counter a weaver is to not allow them to waste your time and simply rotate elsewhere if you don't have the tool to kill him.

In term of skills, the most important thing you want to look for to predict the fight is attunement swaping, especially air. When an elementalist swap attunement there is a brief but obvious sparkling effect that match the new element and the attunement icon under their portrait change. If you ever in doubt you can also look at the elementalist's wrists but it is harder to see in the middle of a fight.

 

Here is a tldr of the skills you want to keep in mind (I assumed Sword/Focus since it is the most popular setup as far as I know at the current time):

 

CC:

Polaric leap (air sword 2) is a 600 range teleport with a short daze. The cooldown of 12 seconds is short enough to kinda spam it and it is typically used to engage, flee (the weaver needs to see and target an enemy) or interrupt impactful skills like your healing skill (which is a big no no).

Gale (air focus 5) is a 900 range, unblockable fairly long knockdown that you should dodge or stun break. Some weaver will try to spam it right after they attune to X/air so be ready for that. Here is what the animation looks like: the weaver is gathering a lot of sparkling lighting around his hands and then he reaches forward with his arms.

 

DAMAGE:

Pyro vortex (fire/air sword 3) is the most damaging skill of the weaver both for condition and power. The range is however atrociously small so kite the weaver ; in general kiting a weaver is a really good advice and it denies a lot of dps. If you kite too hard, some weaver will try to pre-cast this skill then teleport in melee range with lightning flash (a 900 range teleport). This is a huge commitment because it severely limit their ability to disengage if stuff does not go well.

Cauterizing strike (fire/fire sword 3), Quantum strike (air/air sword 3) are clunky easily dodgeable, melee blasts. If you see a weaver doing his best to stick to you in melee range while pulling his sword backward with big sparkles then shoving it in front of him, that is one of these skills. Kite it or dodge it. Like Pyro vortex, some weaver will try to pre-cast it into Lightning flash.

Twin strike (Fire/Water Sword 3) is a deceptively ok damaging skill that inflict chill and a bit of burning. It's main important feature imho is being a good filler while waiting for the riptide sustain combo (see below).

Flame uprising (fire sword 2) is a 450 range kinda slow leap with good damage both for condition and power. It drops a damaging fire field and there is no reason to stay inside it.

Primordial stance (utility skill) pulses damage and conditions at melee range around the weaver. Yet another reason to kite a weaver.

 

SUSTAIN:

Riptide (water sword 2) while not scary this skill is still worth mentioning. It is a small backward evade (turn yourself for forward evade) that heals and create a water field. This is generally a skill that is casted right before swapping to another atunement. The most common scenario is swaping to water then doing stuff for 2-3 seconds - Water/x dual attack are ok fillers - and only then Riptide>attune to an another element (often earth)>combo into his field for maximum healing. If the weaver is already attuned to earth prior to water then he can combo with Magnetic wave (Earth focus 4) right away. For me specifically if I am safing (healing before an emergency), I personally try to combo with a leap to maintain the pressure (swap to either fire or air). If on the other hand I am in dire need of emergency healing or if I am expecting a burst, I often prefer to swap to earth and combo with Earthen vortex (Earth Sword 2). The idea is Earthen vortex includes an evade and if I can survive 3-4 more seconds I then try to swap attunement again and use Osidian flesh (Earth focus 5 - see below) then either Lava skin (Sword Fire/Earth 3 - also see below) to re-sustain or Polaric leap (Air Sword 2 - see above) to run away.

Lava skin (fire/earth sword 3) is a big barrier skill with stability and pulsing damage. Most weaver will try to swap to fire/earth or earth/fire every 18 seconds or so to gain a bit of sustain from Lava skin. It is useful to know so you can predict what is coming your way a bit better.

Signet of restoration (healing skill) heals the weaver every time he uses a skill. It is a good sustain tool BUT it is awful at burst healing on a class that already struggle against burst (due to low health and armour). Use this information at your advantage.

Stone resonance (utility skill) (proc form the trait bolster element) pulses a lot of barrier and stability. Bolster element is a trait that automatically cast that skill when the weaver reaches 50% health, the cooldown however is a fairly long 70 seconds. When a weaver approaches 50% health assume this skill is coming and play accordingly.

 

DEFENSIVE:

Magnetic wave (Earth focus 4) and Swirling wind (air focus 4) respectively blocks projectiles in an area and reflects projectiles. The first one drop a gigantic, obvious area that last 6 seconds, don't fight into it if you are using projectile. The second last 3 seconds and is way more discrete, don't use projectile while the buff last for obvious reason. If you have a weapon that does not use projectile you can swap into it to maintain the pressure.

Obsidian flesh (earth focus 5) is a 3 second invulnerability. Play passively for the duration. No reason to give the weaver what he wants, save your burst.

Fire shield>Transmute fire (fire focus 5) gives a fire aura that the weaver can transmute for a bit of might. With the correct traits that means cleansing 3 conditions. If you play an heavy condition build try to play around this big cleanse. If you can manage to move the fight away from his fire fields (and therefor deny his aura generation) that is also a huge benefit.

Twist of fate (utility skill) is a stun break and an evade with 2 charges on a very long 75 seconds recharge time. Why is this skill important? While 2 charge is good I would like you to notice the very very punishing recharge time. You should abuse that fact and force a weaver to use his stun break often until he runs out of them.

 

This is a quick summary and other skills are of course also relevant but I feel there is already a lot to read. Anyway that is the modest insight of a not so great PvPer so take it with a grain of salt. 🙂

TLDR : Kite them, Stun them, Burst them.

Edited October 30, 2021 by Guybrush.4762
Adding twin strike info

[Downstate.4697]

Spacing is pretty important vs a fire weaver. Most of their damage is in the 100-300 range. I also tend to wait out the barrier duration instead of attacking through it. Their burst is from a fire sword 2 combo so dodge that

[Milosz.5938]

 

First of all, at least try to learn your profession in minimum level (some brainless profession: necro, ranger),

Any profession that has 900+ range weapon and know a little bit what is doing  will kill weaver - keep distance, weaver mostly can't swap weapon (exeption for FGS and others conj. weapons). 

If you are killed by ele that's mean that you have to learn a lottttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttt how to play your class.

Im wvw roamer as weaver/tempest and also sometimes you can fight vs much more skilled player then you (or with deadly build vs yours); in those situations death is common thing. Sometimes you win sometimes no.  

Any more skilled player will be difficult enemy - doesn't metter if it will be ele or not.

 

Edited October 26, 2021 by Milosz.5938

[TrollingDemigod.3041]

The answer is swiftly.
On what class though? Chill can pretty much be death sentence to any Ele build if you catch them with pants down in wrong attument.

[Jski.6180]

Don't let the weaver "hide" its burning with another condi. The moment they can start to stack burning they won the fight. Often that is when you used up all of your condi clear.

Oddly d/d aura cata seems to be able to beat fire weaver.

[Xanadrine.4352]

With a bucket of water 😊

[lightDestroyer.1265]

On 10/26/2021 at 2:53 PM, Arklite.4013 said:

Hello Eles,

 

I come to you as a sidenoder who doesn't understand your class at all. Fire weaver consistently gives me trouble - it seems like they have a ton of damage mitigation/invulns/evades and somehow thirds of my health vanish. Also, you guys have like 30 skills so if someone could give me a "fighting fire weaver 101" breakdown about what I should be looking out for I'd really appreciate it

Ok best and easy solution.  Depends on what your role is.  Assuming you are a duelist,  the skills you have to dodge are "Fire 2", and "Fire/Air" dual attack.  For the dual attack,  you can also move away from it or sidestep it and ele will miss.  

You have to use your stunbreak only ONCE.  When the ele uses GALE(unblockable 900 range knockdown).  You dont need to stunbreak it if ele doesnt do dmg after it. Dont stun break anything else.  

Kite away from weaver when weaver uses primordial stance,  you can see that on the ELE's BAR.  That is the major bust condi that can stack upto 20 bleeding stavks or 10 stacks of burning.  

Major tip,  dont step on AOE.

DONT ATTACK when barrier is up. 

Also,  if  you are a ranged class,  than ele sort of counters you.  Wait for ypur tuen to burst when swirling winds (air 4) or magnetic wave (rarth 4) are not there. 

[Zhaid Zhem.6508]

Chill  > Weakness > CC > dead.

 

Obviously all classes are weak to chill and weakness; but elementalist is above;  chill also impacts its "weapon swap" (attunement swap) needed for cleanse, boons, sigil of energy etc. 
Same with weakness ;  arcana evasive, the barrier on dodge etc. Endurance and "dodge rotation" (looks like daredevil) are key mechanics fo weavers.
So you really really slow weaver's mechanic, but also their mental, their calm;  as most of  average-good weavers abuse the attunement swap but have lost their ability to confront the danger without it, with "higher" attunement CD like a core elementalist.

 

If you have no condition to apply, and no cc, just stay at mid-range,  call a friend. They're nor really dangerous, just annoying.

[Aedil.1296]

Really? 

Any mosquito mob in the game could easily show you how to kill weaver 😂

[AliamRationem.5172]

23 minutes ago, Aedil.1296 said:

Really? 

Any mosquito mob in the game could easily show you how to kill weaver 😂

Somebody's doing it wrong.

[Zhaid Zhem.6508]

33 minutes ago, Aedil.1296 said:

Really? 

Any mosquito mob in the game could easily show you how to kill weaver 😂

 

In PvP most of players / casual players think they need to confront and to kill all enemies, to win the game, rather than give-up / rotate.  And so they act greedily against everyone, even when they have no clue how to counter. It's just common SoloQ game.

FireWeaver benefits a lot of those players, because all they need is pyrovortex + primordial stance at 130 range to kill  in 3sec.

Otherwise I agree fireweaver as a duelist. is more annoying than it is dangerous. but it also means it's great to decap or hold side nodes.