Which New Elite Spec Is Best?

[Infusion.7149]

The question should be beyond DPS... what does each spec actually bring to the class?

Actually fresh concept
Specter brings support to thief and shroud (which means thief has teamfight potential as well). This is a strong spec currently both in terms of damage (44K with allies bench , 36K solo) and support (barriers, alacrity/quickness). Unless it is nerfed to the ground that would remain the case. The spec actually made a UI change in terms of ally target selection so conceptually and game design-wise it is a step in the right direction. It makes it high skill cap innately because you don't just spam things in AOE. I've seen some players run it as a power damage spec in competitive modes but I suspect support will be the main use.

Novel in concept , brings something

Harbinger brings a high risk high reward playstyle to PVE necros as well as quickness boon support and minor bit of mobility. Elixirs and blight need work but pulsing damage in shroud while boring provides consistency. Some skills such as Dark Barrage do more damage at melee range due to fanning out so the risk/reward is kept even though it is ranged. Necros already have power and condi covered, so this will either be a condi boon support or scourge will be nerfed such that this is the premier necro condition damage option. Blight inherently changes how necromancer is played, let's hope the payoff is increased beyond bland "more strike damage" or "more condition damage".

Willbender brings mobility to guardian. The damage numbers are undertuned, but let's say they become competitive, it still would be unwanted in PVE and WVW because firebrand is dominant in both those modes. It has some potential in PVP if the spec is adjusted.

Vindicator for revs brings 5 target PBAOE on greatsword and a payoff on dodges. It likely won't see much play in raids or in WVW unless the greatsword damage is far higher. However, if retuned to be strong pDPS and the dodge bugs are fixed it would be the pDPS of revenant which many have asked for a long time. Payoff on 5 targets is going to be non-existent in PVP so I don't anticipate this being strong in PVP , especially with one dodge.

Brings something in theory

Bladesworn brings large burst damage to warrior which neither variants currently possess (discounting Gunflame memes), but in PVP/WVW those numbers are heavily lowered which is why opinions differ so strongly. Therefore it is not a great spec once you look past DPS in PVE. It breaks some encounter designs so it isn't healthy for the game overall. Also I wouldn't consider pressing a button and afking 5 seconds engaging gameplay. Many played wanted a support warrior but I guess tactics spellbreaker is filling that role and in PVE people ask for banner berserker/warrior.

Mechanist is rated highly by PVE players but at the end of the day it is still AI-heavy. All the benchmarks for condi mech are still using 4 kits which is a major turnoff for running condi engi. In my testing I've seen anywhere from 20-30% DPs coming from the mech depending how poor kit rotation was. In competitive modes the current beta iteration it does more damage than expected from the mech , but it is unlikely overtake holo in PVP or scrapper in WVW since the entire traitline hinges on the mech. This could be problematic in open-world though as some players manage to do DPS with the mech alone ~7K+. In summary, it's a spec for people that play the game akin to an "idler" where spamming 1 and using an AI pet is "fun".

Virtuoso right now is rather shoddy in competitive modes due to aggressive damage splits , traits aren't that great, but it removes reliance on clones for damage. Removing reliance on clones means you can deal with trash mobs easier , especially with 5 target dagger mainhand. Prestocking blades also makes the burst potential higher in theory any time there is an invuln phase or some sort of block/aegis. As long as the damage is okay it could be the mesmer pDPS spec, whereas mirage is condi and chrono is quickness boon support. The projectile aspect of shatters need to be able to bypass reflect or not have you receive reflected psionic blades.

Untamed in theory brings a tanky 5 target melee to ranger with more CC and boonrips. However the amount of CC is gated behind Unleash states and the Unleashed Pet state results in a 15% outgoing damage reduction which is not good in any mode. It really needs that penalty removed , focused boon rip to prot/stability, and better ability to stow pet in WVW. In competitive modes CC generally doesn't do damage so the concept needs work.

HORRIBLE

Catalyst is a total wreck because the concept of hammer is convoluted (upkeeping the orbs are  pain point) and jade sphere has very low payoff considering it is not frontloaded. In PVE the damage is so variant depending on hitbox it is insanity (45K condi bench vs large , but ~30K vs small). There is low mobility for competitive modes and not much in terms of sustain unless you can get auras which are dependent on the jade sphere (which requires energy) if you use hammer.

Edited November 2, 2021 by Infusion.7149

[draxynnic.3719]

Good analysis. I disagree with the assertion that Willbender won't be used in PvE or WvW because of Firebrand - Willbender and Firebrand aren't really in direct competition since Willbenders are power DPS oriented, while Firebrand is more about condi DPS and support. Willbender is more in competition with Dragonhunter, and if balanced appropriately I could see it winning out against bosses that require power damage and mobility, and in small-scale WvW.

[otto.5684]

I voted, but the word best is not clear what it refers to. Normally efficiency, but that is something that cannot be measured for beta specs.

[Tails.9372]

That depends on how you define "best".

The Mechanist is probably going to have the biggest impact in general PvE scenarios as it has the chance to uplift the damage of the average player by quite a bit. It's also the only pet based spec that actually puts the pet in the center of things so that's a breath of fresh air although people kind of seem to have the wrong idea regarding one thing: the mech ≠ the AI partner. In some regards the mech is just a glorified attack animation while the AI itself (without further buffs) only brings around 4k DPS to the table (with a questionable uptime as it tends to wander around quite a bit if you're not using the ranged variant).

The harbinger is also quite interesting and easily one of the best specs you can run outside of organized endgame PvE content (assuming they don't nerf its damage into the ground) and even there it's still decent.

Specter wins in the support category but this had to be expected as it's the only one of the new specs where support is actually what they were primarily going for.

[anbujackson.9564]

I wonder how many warrior mains actually voted for bladesworn or if all those votes are from people who only like the "style". Anyway:

Virtuoso: Solid pdps spec apparently since chrono was always a mixed bag. Condi traits might as well not exist.

Willbender: Probably the duelist equivalent to spellbreaker. No opinion on it (not really a guard player) but its tough to compete with dragonhunter.

Harbringer: Can do high damage, got quickness and many other boons (my vote actually, its different I guess even if the elixiers are not that amazing, at least it got a ranged pistol!).

 

Catalyst: That hammer auto attack needs some (more like a lot) love. Hammer 3 is cool, ele now can do quickness... something to build on.

Vindicator: Apparently very weak in PvE. No opinion on it either but we dont need another overtuned spec like renegade. Just give it some decent power damage.

Bladesworn: 90% of your damage is from 1 skill (PvE dps). Think about that for a second. So what is there left if it and lush forest gets nerfed? Yeah exactly. I would take ANYTHING over this, literally any other spec. At least then I feel like playing gw2 (fast paced combat duh). Give warrior something else than banners pls.

 

Untamed: Not sure where this fits. A bruiser/duelist spec for ranger? It cant do much else. Damage and support roles are covered quite well by the other specs though. Also it needs some kind of effect when using other weapons, which they didnt add (yet).

Mechanist: Fun idea, condi is still doomed into 4 kits like core engi. The support is nice. Cool mace. Sadly bad AI.

Specter: Cool design, lots of potential, requires active gameplay and is mobile/fast paced. A few tweaks maybe.

 

[Grand Marshal.4098]

I didn't vote cause it's a vague question. But now I did out of curiosity and chose specter since I enjoyed it the most and had Shadow Arts to cover any mistakes for me. 

 

LMAO BLADESWORN VOTES WTH BOY!! 🤣🤣🤣😂😂

[oscuro.9720]

On 11/4/2021 at 10:42 AM, Grand Marshal.4098 said:

I didn't vote cause it's a vague question. But now I did out of curiosity and chose specter since I enjoyed it the most and had Shadow Arts to cover any mistakes for me. 

 

LMAO BLADESWORN VOTES WTH BOY!! 🤣🤣🤣😂😂

I voted bladesworn. We both know I’m strange though.

[Grand Marshal.4098]

9 hours ago, oscuro.9720 said:

I voted bladesworn. We both know I’m strange though.

At least you know what you are talking about. Warrior main. I'm more intrigued by the rest.. 

[Tails.9372]

2 hours ago, Grand Marshal.4098 said:

At least you know what you are talking about. Warrior main. I'm more intrigued by the rest.

Keep in mind that "best" does not necessarily relate to general performance otherwise the Harbinger should have gotten a lot more votes. E.g. someone might think that the class mechanic is the best as it essentially gives you another take on a weapon warrior already has access to (I for once sure would love to see something like this for dual pistol on thief in context of a new "outlaw" themed e-spec).

[Kodama.6453]

24 minutes ago, Tails.9372 said:

Keep in mind that "best" does not necessarily relate to general performance otherwise the Harbinger should have gotten a lot more votes. E.g. someone might think that the class mechanic is the best as it essentially gives you another take on a weapon warrior already has access to (I for once sure would love to see something like this for dual pistol on thief in context of a new "outlaw" themed e-spec).

True, having another take for one of your weapons sounds awesome. Engineer main, would love an e-specs which redefines our rifle as a gatling gun.

[Borked.6824]

This was an unnecessarily difficult decision to make, but I painfully clicked Virtuoso; an unloved class from me, because it's the only one playing it safe.  Everything else is just projectile vomiting ham-fisted ideas, with ham-fisted cohesion to theme or finesse, and arriving at utterly ham-fisted results that nobody will actually play over the prior E-specs past week 2.  

[Mesket.5728]

On 11/4/2021 at 2:42 PM, Grand Marshal.4098 said:

I didn't vote cause it's a vague question. But now I did out of curiosity and chose specter since I enjoyed it the most and had Shadow Arts to cover any mistakes for me. 

 

LMAO BLADESWORN VOTES WTH BOY!! 🤣🤣🤣😂😂

Same, I posted in the other topic cause wtf,.. who votes for bladeswan srsly! At this point I just assume its either weebs or trolls.

[Comus.7365]

Specter for me.. it just felt really good. and Bladesworn as it made the most bland profession at least feel  interesting.

[Zergs.9715]

It depresses me when I see the number of ppl equating big numbers with being good spec. Like... it's the easiest thing for them to fix. One day you're on top the next you're in the gutter. And all you're left with are kitten mechanics. I'm willing to bet that 99% of ppl will stop playing Bladesworn a week after release. Maybe even sooner depending on how spaz is the community.