Ele feels like an 1 HP Class?

[Schnezzler.5742]

Hey all, i returned to GW 2 after ~7 Years and i decided to play with my "main" the elemantalist.

 

After i try`d many of the new builds, i go back to my Staff, because in Melee Range, i always getting one-shotted, and i only do a little bit of Open World and Main Quests.
Weaver looked cool with the Sword or Daggers, but so dam Squishy... Now with Staff and Tempest, i feel a bit better, but still, if i get any dmg, i drop so dam insane to 0, i cant even react.

How do u build ur Ele.? Is it just a Glasscannon and i have to Build on full dmg or do i have to gear me on Tank-Stats?

Dont get me wrong, i love my Mage-Girl, i just feel a bit usless atm, my Teammates i play from time to time deal so insane burst dmg, got big HP pools and i getting killed by everything even when i gear to HP/Armor Stuff and lose my dmg.

[AliamRationem.5172]

We discussed this in a recent thread.  Here's are some build suggestions for high-sustain in solo open world/story play:

The Dire Build is a great build and very inexpensive to gear in level 80 exotic!  It has a ton of health (nearly 29k!) as well as a lot of toughness (2.9k).  It achieves +100% burn duration (in combat) and 2k+ condition damage as well.

The Trailblazer Build has less health (20.4k) but significantly higher armor (3.5k).  Condition damage is slightly higher and this build also increases bleed duration significantly where the Dire build does not.

The Celestial Build is a little different.  It has the least health, armor, and damage, but it heals rapidly, generates a ton of barrier, and is significantly more evasive.  It can sustain even better than the tankier builds, but is a bit more difficult and active style of play.  Another quirk of this particular build is that it can stack might very rapidly and share it with allies.

Here's a clip of the celestial build to give you an idea of how it plays.

 

[Arheundel.6451]

...So bloody stupid that players in your game are forced to play exclusively with tank stats to actually "enjoy" a class concept you designed....complete failure on all possible sides...

[Fueki.4753]

I use Marauder gear for power builds on my Elementalists, or Trailblazer gear for Condition builds.

Trailblazer's Toughness let's you benefit from Strength of Stone.

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Strength_of_Stone

[Pirogen.9561]

If you see a build for open world, that recommends berserker or viper, so called glass-cannon gear, ignore it. Noob trap.

For open world, story, more or less solo, always go Marauder or Trailblazer or Celestial, or something in that direction. Gear that trades some damage for big boost in survivability. 80/50 rule. Not 100 damage, trade top 20 damage for lots of support, survivability.

Glass cannon gear is for organized groups.

 

Edited November 15, 2021 by Pirogen.9561

[AliamRationem.5172]

3 hours ago, Arheundel.6451 said:

...So bloody stupid that players in your game are forced to play exclusively with tank stats to actually "enjoy" a class concept you designed....complete failure on all possible sides...

Here's a clip of a champ solo in grieving stats.  You can play these builds in glass stats. Weaver in fire/earth or fire/arcane flavors has plenty of defensive options as does sword/focus as a set.  You also have utility options available as well.  There's just no real advantage to doing so as any damage you gain is likely to be counteracted by being forced to play defensively under pressure.  I save the glass stats for group play where I have support.

[Schnezzler.5742]

1 hour ago, AliamRationem.5172 said:

Here's a clip of a champ solo in grieving stats.  You can play these builds in glass stats. Weaver in fire/earth or fire/arcane flavors has plenty of defensive options as does sword/focus as a set.  You also have utility options available as well.  There's just no real advantage to doing so as any damage you gain is likely to be counteracted by being forced to play defensively under pressure.  I save the glass stats for group play where I have support.

Thanks for that.

 

Is Weaver that much great ?Tempest feels cool for me, but i dont see any build recommended(not 1 in that Threat, and most i see are always Weaver).

[AliamRationem.5172]

16 minutes ago, Schnezzler.5742 said:

Thanks for that.

 

Is Weaver that much great ?Tempest feels cool for me, but i dont see any build recommended(not 1 in that Threat, and most i see are always Weaver).

Tempest is a good option, too.  I just happen to enjoy weaver.  You can use similar builds with Tempest.  Usually dagger/focus or scepter/focus for condition builds running celestial, trailblazer, etc.

[Schnezzler.5742]

1 hour ago, AliamRationem.5172 said:

Tempest is a good option, too.  I just happen to enjoy weaver.  You can use similar builds with Tempest.  Usually dagger/focus or scepter/focus for condition builds running celestial, trailblazer, etc.

 

Ok, i will try the weaver now. I just got one last Question. The Elite Skill, what does that second Use actually do? First Use is clear, i get the buffs, yes, but the second use, i lose them and do a bit dmg? Looks not really strong or do i miss something?

[AliamRationem.5172]

3 minutes ago, Schnezzler.5742 said:

 

Ok, i will try the weaver now. I just got one last Question. The Elite Skill, what does that second Use actually do? First Use is clear, i get the buffs, yes, but the second use, i lose them and do a bit dmg? Looks not really strong or do i miss something?

The way it works you use the skill, gain a buff that lasts for 20 seconds and does something different for each attunement.  If during the 20 seconds you rotate through all attunements, you gain a new buff that gives you the benefit of the buffs for all attunements at once.  This lasts for 10 seconds, but you can choose to use the new skill that becomes available to end it early.  This causes an area float.

So, you can use it for breakbars or to CC groups of enemies, but the main benefit comes from a fairly long duration buff of up to 30 seconds.

[fuzzyp.6295]

4 hours ago, Schnezzler.5742 said:

Thanks for that.

 

Is Weaver that much great ?Tempest feels cool for me, but i dont see any build recommended(not 1 in that Threat, and most i see are always Weaver).

Tempest is a fantastic open world class as well, however Weaver is usually a better option. It has more DPS (either power or condi focused) and has some better survivbility built into it with barrier and evades. That said, you absolutely can run a Tempest in open world and have great success. I run Tempest for all my PvE related events.

Here is my build: http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PGgEsEWGBjipwuYn4ors2yA-zRJYiRDfZEYBUaCY7A-e

A few things: I have it here basically full marauders, but this is not actually what I run. Its really up to each elementalist to mix and match their gear as they see fit. What works for me might not work with you. If you want more power start swapping out some gear (shoulders, gloves, boots) for beserker and then go from there. You can also try running Beserker Weapons instead of Marauders. You really gotta test it out yourself though because what I enjoy might be too glassy for your taste. Full Marauders is the safest bet if you're unsure of anything though.

This build also uses Fire, but if you want more defense you can instead run Arcane (1-3-3) for a bit more sustain instead of DPS.

You can also use Dagger on this build instead of Scepter, but I find that Scepter lets you play more glassy since its a ranged weapon. If you wanna do Dagger, swap in some Knights, Valkyires or Celestial. The trade off is, if you run Scepter you will kinda have to dance around a bit more if you're fighting more than one mob to try and get them hit by the autoattack or mostly rely on your overload to kill mutiple mobs. Dagger can hit more, but you're also getting hit more so.. /shrug. I like Scepter more personally, gives me that good ol' real mage feeling.

EDIT: Arcane Shield is also only a recommendation, if you want you can also put in stuff like Lightening Flash, Eye of the Storm or Aftershock for more survivability, or if you really wanna go ham, get your Lightening Hammer, but I honestly think thats just a little TOO much.

There is a bit of a rotation on this build. It may look complicated, but once you get the flow of it down, its really not. Basically:

1) Attune to Air, use Air 1 and 2 for damage until you can overload.

2) Overload fully. You will go on cooldown and get the Transcendent Tempest Buff

3) Swap to either Fire or Water. You can usually drop your Fire Warhorn 5 or a Dragon's Tooth while your Air Overload is still ticking away. The Air Overload should crit (since you're heavy power) letting you swap back into Air. Water can also be used for Shatterstone, basically you just want to attune out of Air for a moment so you can refresh the cool down.

4) Attune back to Air. Now you should have both the Transcendent Tempest and Fresh Air buffs. With these two buffs, you then wanna drop some of your heavy hitting moves (Air Warhorn 5, Gylph of Storms, FGS). You'll only want to drop one though because your Damage buffs should be wearing off soon, so use only one and save the others for your next rotation through.

5) Swap to the other of the two attunements you didn't before. So if you did Fire, now swap to Water and drop Shatterstone or vice versa. Your air should refresh.

6) Repeat from Step 1.

While this rotation is what gives you the best DPS, its not super important you follow it to to the letter. As long as you constantly try and drop your heavy hitting moves with both Transcendent Tempest and Fresh Air, you should be fine.  There may be times where you need to stay in Water, Fire or Earth for their overloads depending on the situation, don't stress it.

If you are getting hit hard, swap to Water for your heals (Scepter 3, Warhorn 4 and 5 all heal.) Earth has Sand Squall which is great projectile hate. You also have Heat Sync on Fire for more Might but I usually don't need that between might and battle I have plenty of might. Its honestly overkill at time so I swap out my sigils depending on my mood.

Consider this build if you're looking to play more power based gameplay. Yes, you are a bit more fragile than the condition builds, but its still very fun to play and feels really good.

Hope this helps!! Don't give up on Ele!! 🙂

Edited November 16, 2021 by fuzzyp.6295

[Ace.1784]

On 11/15/2021 at 9:37 AM, Arheundel.6451 said:

...So bloody stupid that players in your game are forced to play exclusively with tank stats to actually "enjoy" a class concept you designed....complete failure on all possible sides...

 

You don't have to play with tank stats, you just have to be good enough to play without them. If you don't know what to dodge/what to sidestep, you're going to have a bad time.

 

Marauder/Celestial/Trailblazer give a QoL that helps you do your damage rotation. Then when you learn how to utilize combo fields effectively, you can go to Berserker/Viper.

Edited November 25, 2021 by Vinteros Asteano.1209

[BOOO.9184]

Hi OP, 

 

Try this build  (vid below). Its effective in WvW and Immortal in PvE. Commentary and Gameplay Footage is included.   

 

 

[vardeleanu.8972]

it doesn't feel like, it is. hope you enjoy the floor

[brutalbarbarian.1403]

As another long-term ele main, who also took a long hiatus, welcome back to ele!

 

 

Ele has both changed a lot, but also not at all over time. I would suggest keep using what you were comfortable with back then - it still works. Then you can slowly ease your way into trying out more content with it. If that's staff, then so be it. Get comfortable again with the game, before easing your way into trying to push more out of the class.

 

Ele has always been squishy. And optimal dps has almost always been achieved at melee range. Meaning staying alive is more due to knowing when to dodge, positioning, and making use of your numerious defensive skills you have at your disposal. Yes you can also wear tankier gear with vit and toughness built in, which is great for open world, wvw, and learning. Once you're more comfortable wtih the class and surviving, you can start to swap towards more dps orientated gear such as vipers or zerkers, particularly in instanced content e.g. fractals.

 

As for the 2 new elite specs.

Tempest is essentially same as the old core ele, but with overloads. Use that mentality to ease into it, and you can then experiment more to make the most out of the spec. 

Weaver is a giant clusterf*** to get your head around and learn, and even moreso of one to actually be good with it. That said, it's very fast paced and fun, and surprisingly tanky once you learn how to play it. 

 

 

 

 

[Shiyo.3578]

On 11/15/2021 at 9:04 AM, AliamRationem.5172 said:

We discussed this in a recent thread.  Here's are some build suggestions for high-sustain in solo open world/story play:

The Dire Build is a great build and very inexpensive to gear in level 80 exotic!  It has a ton of health (nearly 29k!) as well as a lot of toughness (2.9k).  It achieves +100% burn duration (in combat) and 2k+ condition damage as well.

The Trailblazer Build has less health (20.4k) but significantly higher armor (3.5k).  Condition damage is slightly higher and this build also increases bleed duration significantly where the Dire build does not.

The Celestial Build is a little different.  It has the least health, armor, and damage, but it heals rapidly, generates a ton of barrier, and is significantly more evasive.  It can sustain even better than the tankier builds, but is a bit more difficult and active style of play.  Another quirk of this particular build is that it can stack might very rapidly and share it with allies.

Here's a clip of the celestial build to give you an idea of how it plays.

 

Aren't these builds going to be doing, at the most, 2/3rd of the damage of a zerker reaper/DH/holo? Those classes have insane amounts of sustain and survivability while running full zerker set ups, too.

Edited November 27, 2021 by Shiyo.3578

[AliamRationem.5172]

1 hour ago, Shiyo.3578 said:

Aren't these builds going to be doing, at the most, 2/3rd of the damage of a zerker reaper/DH/holo? Those classes have insane amounts of sustain and survivability while running full zerker set ups, too.

I don't know, but maybe we can find out.  Here's Trailblazer Weaver clocking in at about 18k DPS and completing the fight in 40 seconds (celestial lags behind a bit, but I can still solo most champions in about a minute).  I've seen only two clips of players doing it faster and only one of those was a glass power build (chronomancer).  That player managed it in 38 seconds.

So, I guess what we need here is more data.  What kind of damage do you typically see when soloing champions on glass DH, Holo, or Reaper?  And how "insane" is the sustain really?

Edited November 27, 2021 by AliamRationem.5172

[Shiyo.3578]

18k is pretty solid with pure self buffs only, tbh.

Litany of wrath is more often than not a full heal every time it's up, and f2/f3 are helpful mitigation and healing.

Holo gets a lot of healing from burning off heat.

Reaper sustain is really absurd with a high health pool.

Reaper also gives itself perma quickness, so it might overall be better, more forgiving(and tons easier) solo.

Edited November 27, 2021 by Shiyo.3578

[AliamRationem.5172]

6 minutes ago, Shiyo.3578 said:

18k is pretty solid with pure self buffs only, tbh.

Litany of wrath is a full heal every time it's up, and f2/f3 are helpful mitigation and healing.

Holo gets a lot of healing from burning off heat.

Reaper sustain is really absurd with a high health pool.

Nothing against those classes.  They're all great!  I just wanted to show that ele doesn't have to feel like a "1 HP class" and it doesn't have to give up all of its damage to do it.

[Py Romantic.9134]

it felt that way at first for me but I just needed to get used to it. Im using the sword and a dagger, with the sword on fire and the dagger on earth which gives you a nice little damage causing barrier you can use as your dual skill.. I have the toughness glyph, and the elemental, burning, speed, and storm. I have my specialties or whatever they are called on fire, lightning and tempest. Im just one barring it right now because of the pause in changing elements, waiting for the other one I want. Ive been mostly soloing everything, and i just hit 80 this week so I am not all that geared. I mean I die occasionally but frankly its a good change to ESO where I pretty much just two shot mobs. Just always be moving and use dodge. Let the elemental take the first shot so first aggro is on it. There are a few fights I did have to use a staff on but the staff is pretty underwhelming sadly. I used daggers through 80, its so bad, but I have it on my backbar. I really wish they would give us weapon swap. I get we have elemental swap but it would give us survivability in a fight where we could kite out of range and swap and go back in. 

Im not saying its good enough for pvp or even raiding but if youre mostly doing in world and story quests, with story quests and most in world I use the sword and dagger, in bigger group fights I swap to staff. Its definitely ok for all that stuff. Im doing my story and world stuff on that because its always going to be my favorite, hence the name, in any mmo but I will probably role out something else when I am ready to raid and stuff. I have to admit i havent done any dungeons yet even on story mode. But i am not having problems on the fights in the story. with my mismatched gear I have 13600 or something health. If I know I am going to have problems in a fight I eat some vitality food. 

Edited November 27, 2021 by Py Romantic.9134

[taara.3217]

13 hours ago, Shiyo.3578 said:

Reaper sustain is really absurd with a high health pool.

Reaper also gives itself perma quickness, so it might overall be better, more forgiving(and tons easier) solo.

In a high pressure solo battle (Champ/Bounty) Power Reaper will be killed very fast despite all this "sustain", "high health pool", "perma quickness".

Edited November 27, 2021 by taara.3217

[The Fear.3865]

17 hours ago, Shiyo.3578 said:

Aren't these builds going to be doing, at the most, 2/3rd of the damage of a zerker reaper/DH/holo? Those classes have insane amounts of sustain and survivability while running full zerker set ups, too.

Sad but true, and that is why ele feels like a 1hp class, cause you got two shots by everything on zerk/grieving/viper stuff, and your dps is not even better than holo, dh or scourge. 

Catalyst will probably change that because of defensive bonus stats, dmg modifiers (aura spam, hammer 3) and easy access to protection or resolution. 

[SeTect.5918]

16 hours ago, Shiyo.3578 said:

Aren't these builds going to be doing, at the most, 2/3rd of the damage of a zerker reaper/DH/holo? Those classes have insane amounts of sustain and survivability while running full zerker set ups, too.

Holo? Insane amount of sustain and survivabiility while running full zerker set up?
Sorry but no. Not even close to insane.
Not a single damage reduction in the whole build.

I personally run vipers holo.
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PekAoqlFw6YaMOGKOWL5vTA-zRRYfBhaGNcXlRHFQIJgmXkgYD8A-e
This is my condi holo build. Can u tell me where the insane amount of survivability is hidden in this build? Because somehow i couldnt find it in the years that i played it.
I even chose to not use Photonic_Blasting_Module to not get forced to overheat and losing a good amount of my health.

I am not saying that condi holo has lower survivability than condi weaver for example, but vipers/zerkers holo sustain comes not even close to reaper sustain or trailblazers weavers sustain.

[Shiyo.3578]

No idea about condi holo but this trait alone makes you very durable in open world pve.

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Crystal_Configuration:_Eclipse

Edited November 28, 2021 by Shiyo.3578

[The Fear.3865]

 

17 hours ago, SeTect.5918 said:

Holo? Insane amount of sustain and survivabiility while running full zerker set up?
Sorry but no. Not even close to insane.
Not a single damage reduction in the whole build.

I personally run vipers holo.
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PekAoqlFw6YaMOGKOWL5vTA-zRRYfBhaGNcXlRHFQIJgmXkgYD8A-e
This is my condi holo build. Can u tell me where the insane amount of survivability is hidden in this build? Because somehow i couldnt find it in the years that i played it.
I even chose to not use Photonic_Blasting_Module to not get forced to overheat and losing a good amount of my health.

I am not saying that condi holo has lower survivability than condi weaver for example, but vipers/zerkers holo sustain comes not even close to reaper sustain or trailblazers weavers sustain.

Inter armor, high hp pool, heat therapy, crystal config, big boomer, nice healing skill (insane with AOD), great mobility, lots of hard / soft cc and if you go sword you can take the shield without consequence on dps cuz no power offhand (reflect and block). Holo is also the only spec with less dps loss when dodging because of EE. Even with rifle PBM, the survivability is pretty good. 

You play condi holo, which is not optimal, but still, survivability is by default really good because engi, you should try some other classes to compare. 

Holo has by far the most bruiser meta pdps build in the game, of course reaper is really good too but much lower dps, fb and scourges dominate condi meta builds. 

Btw, it's a thread about ele.

Edited November 28, 2021 by The Fear.3865