I like the new Ventari.

[Shao.7236]

While it may not heal as much, it's less of a sitting duck and got more utility out of it's skill. Quite less prone to be overwhelmed by conditions as well with that new dodge trait. As someone who used to play support with it, the team healing potential got nerfed but you're hella more useful now with how much of an impact skills can have, before all you could really do is heal and even that wouldn't do much. That elite is also pretty nasty paired with Hammer.

[Aeolus.3615]

9 hours ago, Shao.7236 said:

While it may not heal as much, it's less of a sitting duck and got more utility out of it's skill. Quite less prone to be overwhelmed by conditions as well with that new dodge trait. As someone who used to play support with it, the team healing potential got nerfed but you're hella more useful now with how much of an impact skills can have, before all you could really do is heal and even that wouldn't do much. That elite is also pretty nasty paired with Hammer.

EDIT: trait is working... Generous abundance  says its a orb while its actually a separate healing value :P

@Shao since i dont use boon duration stats for support due herald facets mechanic i wont be gaining much but the no energy tablet movement for Solace dome is a beast vs range and the swiftess was actually a clever move to it to help players move out of spike zone faster.

 

Edited June 29, 2022 by Aeolus.3615

[Shao.7236]

1 hour ago, Aeolus.3615 said:

EDIT: trait is working... Generous abundance  says its a orb while its actually a separate healing value 😛

@Shao since i dont use boon duration stats for support due herald facets mechanic i wont be gaining much but the no energy tablet movement for Solace dome is a beast vs range and the swiftess was actually a clever move to it to help players move out of spike zone faster.

 

Inactive skills at least in PvP still have the old tool tip. 

 

I can smell a lot of people calling Energy Expulsion OP already which I'd agree to if Ventari had a stunbreak, it doesn't and therefor can be allowed to be strong as it is.

 

There is still the annoying bugs that need to be address though, those being Tablet not exploding while jumping or the majority of skills that simply do not work while in mid air, it breaks the kitting flow when that happens.

[Ludovide.1967]

For the most part I like the changes but I still feel like it should heal on move. I am very conflicted because I like having no energy to move it, it makes it much easier to reposition, but at the same time, it just feels clunkier now. If I send my tablet over to a low health ally, it does nothing unless I activate another skill, and considering how small the tablets radius is, my ally might have already moved away at that point. I feel like making one of the abilities a slow pulsing heal over time, or just adding some inherent pulsing healing to the tablet by default, would make up for no heal on move.

The biggest advantage of movement not costing energy is the ability to keep the projectile bubble up longer and move it around. But that makes me worry that they will nerf this ability.  Protective solace is one of the reasons I love Rev/ventari so much and I would hate to see it be overly nerfed.

I think the empower mechanic is weird, because it is incentivising you to blow up and replace your tablet, when I would rather save the explode ability for when I need cc, not when I want to empower my skills. Maybe make it so when you move the tablet it empowers the next skill, but with a long internal cooldown?  I'm not sure what the best solution would be.

Edited June 29, 2022 by Ludovide.1967

[Charybdis.3695]

Sure, the extra condition removal, cooldown and energy reduction for moving the tablet, and all the added boons will raise the skill floor for using tablet, but it seems like y'all didn't play it enough to realize how good the alacrity was especially when paired with Ancient Echo.

[Fwog.9387]

I wish Vindicator had more support so i could enjoy the ventari tablet changes more. People don't really want me healing for them because i don't bring quickness or alacrity. I cannot stack might for them, i have some fury but not enough. 

Just good heals. Thats all i bring. 

[Aeolus.3615]

59 minutes ago, Jaricko.6143 said:

I wish Vindicator had more support so i could enjoy the ventari tablet changes more. People don't really want me healing for them because i don't bring quickness or alacrity. I cannot stack might for them, i have some fury but not enough. 

Just good heals. Thats all i bring. 

u can stil use the 3-3-3 traits on vindi to boost  tree song and stack the  endurance  from TS itself + the 3 endurance  from ventari trait and gain prot both when  condi cleanse, its leaps condi cleanse as well., and this can be also used on a power build.

 

Edited June 29, 2022 by Aeolus.3615

[Shao.7236]

@Ludovide.1967 It would be stupid to nerf Ventari in anyway right now considering the lack of stunbreak and is purely supportive.

 

Protective Solace may be strong but it's also a way to compete with other options, not having it would make Ventari hardly worth playing. Just like how Mallyx has no way to optimally play against poison like it used to, making it dependent on cleanses that it doesn't have.

 

If you really want to burst heal teammates, Core is good at it with SotM, generally speaking it can reach a solid 6k still on Avatar's which I wouldn't scuff it as bad given all the boons that can now be had with the empowered bonuses or generally speaking the traitline being more useful for both the user and teammates rather than just the teammates.

@Echo.6310 Alacrity is overrated though and would hardly be useful compared the Vigor of now which helps surviving so much more than having skills on repeat that don't have much of an impact, sure was nice and I would have kept it but at best it helped spamming more heals in which wasn't always the best thing to do compared how you can now instead have the possibility of shutting down someone for quite a bit. I'll take the new Ventari anyday over the old one by far now.

@Jaricko.6143 The same can be said for many others that want to play support but have to sit back on the meta because there's hardly any options. Anet should consider removing such use of the boon if they want builds to be more competitive, as long as there is an AoE option for a full team, it's always going to be the preferred choice.

Edited June 29, 2022 by Shao.7236

[Belisaria.8136]

Yeah, I'm pleased with the changes to it and Salvation as well. As you say, it's not as strong, but it's actually fun to use now and it feels like you actually have choices to make.

[VixusIrine.9013]

While it's nice that healing vindicator is more of thing now I kinda wish they didn't remove the more unique aspects of Ventari and Salvation. I'm probably in the minority here but I liked how the tablet exploded into fragments and how you'd just litter healing orbs everywhere with it. I know the trait is still kinda there but I swear I don't see them actuall materialize anymore. 

[Knighthonor.4061]

10 hours ago, Jaricko.6143 said:

I wish Vindicator had more support so i could enjoy the ventari tablet changes more. People don't really want me healing for them because i don't bring quickness or alacrity. I cannot stack might for them, i have some fury but not enough. 

Just good heals. Thats all i bring. 

Those people are dumb. Just ignore them and move on

[Angesombre.4630]

11 hours ago, Jaricko.6143 said:

I wish Vindicator had more support so i could enjoy the ventari tablet changes more. People don't really want me healing for them because i don't bring quickness or alacrity. I cannot stack might for them, i have some fury but not enough. 

Just good heals. Thats all i bring. 

It should be part of the features of vindi so that it is not too strong if you choose dps to not be nerfed right after

 

I agree with that, I'm still boring about it but if we could put the sigil back on the legend exchange it would be good enough:

"Protective Solace may be strong but it's also a way to compete with other options, not having it would make Ventari hardly worth playing. Just like how Mallyx has no way to optimally play against poison like it used to, making it dependent on cleanses that it doesn't have."

 

There is still a lack of synergy between the legends I think

Edited June 30, 2022 by Angesombre.4630

[Fwog.9387]

Mallyx was built around having resistance and then they changed resistance. Laziness honestly. 

[ShazaM.2583]

Would heal/quick herald work now with these new changes? Or would these have to be built separately to be remotely effective?

Edited June 30, 2022 by ShazaM.2583

[Shao.7236]

4 hours ago, ShazaM.2583 said:

Would heal/quick herald work now with these new changes? Or would these have to be built separately to be remotely effective?

If you play as Herald, you'll be a better boon provider with possibly better passive healing over the other options.

 

However Quickness doesn't do anything for Ventari, Ventari at best offers burst healing and cleansing while not so much for passive.

Edited June 30, 2022 by Shao.7236

[Za Shaloc.3908]

I agree OP. Really enjoying what I've played of the Ventari changes so far. Glad you are enjoying the changes to Energy Expulsion because that so far has been the hardest adjustment for me. But then again, they butchered that skill in sPvP so I would also welcome the change there. Haven't tested each and every trait but so far it feels like a win. The extra self-sustain potential is very noticeable.

[Shao.7236]

35 minutes ago, Za Shaloc.3908 said:

I agree OP. Really enjoying what I've played of the Ventari changes so far. Glad you are enjoying the changes to Energy Expulsion because that so far has been the hardest adjustment for me. But then again, they butchered that skill in sPvP so I would also welcome the change there. Haven't tested each and every trait but so far it feels like a win. The extra self-sustain potential is very noticeable.

I was able to keep Harbingers permanently stunned in FFA for around 8 seconds on Core, pretty funny to witness.

Expensive to achieve certainly with no easy way to add damage but you can tell from that alone that Ventari can have more of an impact in a team fight since it's a knock done that heals and clear a condition, quite useful in a team fight aspect.

In solo play that's free constant AA if you can multi task it.

Edited June 30, 2022 by Shao.7236

[Za Shaloc.3908]

8 minutes ago, Shao.7236 said:

I was able to keep Harbingers permanently stunned in FFA for around 8 seconds on Core, pretty funny to witness.

Hope you stream it some time so I can see it being used in PvP in neat ways. I never catch you during your streams but like to watch your vods.

Edited June 30, 2022 by Za Shaloc.3908

[Shao.7236]

9 minutes ago, Za Shaloc.3908 said:

Hope you stream it some time so I can see it being used in PvP in neat ways. I never catch you during your streams but like to watch your vods.

I had hardly any incentive but with how the patch seems to have at least shook things up a bit for Core, I have more options to have fun with.

Core Revenant is so vulnerable to the new specs that spam conditions (Harbinger, Specter) but Ventari with the way things are could possibly be playable in a power build even. Lots of stuff to experiment and without a doubt I'm still looking for Mallyx to not be so useless in the near future.

Vindicator was quite the only thing I had fun with against the new specs because Treesong even after being nerfed allows me to survive the condi spam.

Edited June 30, 2022 by Shao.7236