Revenant has the least playable content in PvP.

[Shao.7236]

Dwarf nerfed to crap, Inspiring Reinforcement inconsistencies with overnerfed initial stability, Forced Engagement inconsistencies with huge range nerf with LoS bugs, Damage.modifiers changed from additive to multiplicative.

Mallyx nerfed to crap, Resistance duration nerfed, Resistance effects nerfed, no counters to poison to heal properly.

Renegade nerfed to crap, Heal nerfed badly, elite nerfed to a laughable degree of inefficiency.

Vindicator nerfed to crap, Heal nerfed badly, endurance restoration nerfed badly.

 

All you can do is rush with Herald and call it good gameplay. Even to that point Shiro Impossible Odds is badly nerfed with huge Upkeep costs to hardly any benefits.

Surprisingly Ventari after the deserved reworked is playable but you'd be calling me crazy if I told you Ventari would have somehow a place.

That however makes Core, Renegade, Vindicator extremely unfun or borderline impossible to enjoy and the years are stacking with the neglected bug of CoR on Hammer as well.

[Scoobaniec.9561]

Oh so now rev is garbage? Just play +1 herald as everyone did forever and call it viable meta pick. Cmon i know you want to.

Its been well obvious for a while that rev is.. especially this joke called hammer

[Shao.7236]

2 hours ago, Scoobaniec.9561 said:

Oh so now rev is garbage? Just play +1 herald as everyone did forever and call it viable meta pick. Cmon i know you want to.

Its been well obvious for a while that rev is.. especially this joke called hammer

Yeah "now" after recent nerfs not the "now" from a year ago that many would cry for. You can still call Hammer garbage if you'd like but the numbers aren't garbage the negligence for it's bugs are, that's like 80% of the issues with the profession.

[Scoobaniec.9561]

10 hours ago, Shao.7236 said:

Yeah "now" after recent nerfs not the "now" from a year ago that many would cry for. You can still call Hammer garbage if you'd like but the numbers aren't garbage the negligence for it's bugs are, that's like 80% of the issues with the profession.

Rev (herald)  was +1 class for a while.  Like few years. Nothing changed here. Other issues persisted for a long time you just decided to ignore it and telling everyone how good rev is cuz 'me shiro/jalis'. 2 nerfs to Jalis, joke bunker vindi nerfed and that aint the case anymore huh? Well welcome to rev cuz its standard and now everything falls in line

And those nerfs may help you realize that lot of people who complain about rev like me played him since release where back then it played totally different to what it is actually. Your issues are literally minor compared to what was happening over the years where the gameplay completely changed and realize that said complains are valid as they may not be necessary about the viability itself but rather how things flow together. Wouldnt touch rev in current state with 10m pole as long cooldowns are on utility skills. Im sure many thieves would straight up uninstall if cooldowns were added to their weapon skills.

[Shao.7236]

Ah yes, you wanted keymashing. That's right, it's the mentality of me want fun and screw everyone else.

I wouldn't even consider putting you at the headdesign of any content given the very poor understanding of it.

I'm taking away more points for always using pink shades as the only excuse over all the years you've tried to convince anyone that removing cooldowns entirely is a healthy choice for the game.

Edited August 4, 2022 by Shao.7236

[Buran.3796]

   I agree with both. The class feels very different from what was, and there's a lot of things that could have been nerfed in numbers without nuked the gameplay and functionality.

   Placing a root instaff #5 breaking your flow wasn't a need, specially if they plan to remove all the damage from Surge of the Mist. Removing the damage burst while stawping elegnd below 10 energy wasn't a must: they just could have add a delay and a visual call as they did Invoking Torment. Breaking hammer instead of tunning dow the damage was a mistake, and the amount of glitches and bugs which still plague the class after all those years is just chilling and a manifest of how little they care.

   Almost as little as me. I won't ever touch again staff or hammer (any game mode), and in PvP I won't play again Renegade (any variant), core (same) nor power Herald or Vindicator. If I want to play condi Herald I run the stupidly strong celestial build (with Wizard amulet at PvP), which farms Dragonfall without even touching helaing skills (and battles favorably most of new specs in WvW). And when I'm not in the mood I just run a condi Willbender (which hits like a nuke) or a (very weak) cc Firebrand which lacks sustain but oh man can be fun!

   Vindi is now as bad as was designed to be (single evade with x2 endurance cost which must to be spammed to do 2/3 of the dps of a Willbender, what could go wrong?) and is fine, because when I see what this almagam of regurgitated skills from Ranger and Necro does, and what a class that actually jumps in the air (as Drakania or Lahn do in BDO) I want to puke.

   The only positives from EoD I have is: my out-of-EoD farming patterns are on point, and I'm now finishing my third set of legendary armor, whith very little pressure to play outside what I want to. Outside WB, I still run legacy builds in my other 15 characters. I don't care further buffs nor nerfs; I'm in cruising mode at this game...

[Scoobaniec.9561]

8 hours ago, Shao.7236 said:

Ah yes, you wanted keymashing. That's right, it's the mentality of me want fun and screw everyone else.

I wouldn't even consider putting you at the headdesign of any content given the very poor understanding of it.

I'm taking away more points for always using pink shades as the only excuse over all the years you've tried to convince anyone that removing cooldowns entirely is a healthy choice for the game.

Yeah nice to assume things about me based without knowing a thing.  And honestly even if i did want to spam i should be allowed to do so. Thats why energy system is here and adding cooldowns strips me of said choice to be made. Theres no longer promised freedom about how you use energy on rev.

"Along with swapping between legends, the revenant profession will employ a second new mechanic that distances it from any other profession currently in the game: energy. In yet another callback to the first Guild Wars, all of the revenant's skills — both weapon and legend skills — will use a portion of the character's energy bar. While other classes only need to wait for a cooldown to reuse skills, revenants will need to wait for their energy bar to refill over time." < Feel free to google any article from 2015, all of them will confirm what i said anyway

Simply put rev was designed to be opposite of thief so if anything your mentality is wrong here. I picked up rev (and im sure many other ppl as well) due to the fact that i could use utilities without cd as long i had energy. Instead i have now energy cost AND cd for whatever reason. Its really no different than adding cooldown to thief weapon skills.

Meanwhile you came years later, saw rev with cooldowns and thought its how it supposed to be. No it aint and never meant to really. Only powerful skills had at max 5cd for mechanical reasons like jade wind was used to bait dodges cuz it had no cd and i could interrupt it over and over by wep stow. Glint was made different to alter playstyle yet her cooldown design for whatever reason carried over to other elite specs and even core revenant.

 

And besides like i said your complain is invalid. Shiro/Glint still meta in pvp and can do well. You just mad they nerfed your favorite toy thats about it. At same time you dont care if toy of someone else was gutted/altered. The "That's right, it's the mentality of me want fun and screw everyone else." sounds like projection at this point.

 

 

[Tulkas.2576]

I’m having a lot of fun with power Shiro/jalis vindicator in PvP and WvW. I really enjoy herald too, but I’ve been stuck on vindicator. I feel like I barely lose any 1v1’s, and I’m really tanky in big fights too. I typically get top kills/healing/damage in many of my matches, so even if we lose, it still ends up being lots of fun. 
The Shiro/jalis vindicator hasnt received many nerfs compared to the alliance based builds so I feel like I’ve only gotten relatively better/stronger over the past few months. Particularly since harbinger has been brought in line. 

[Buran.3796]

13 minutes ago, Tulkas.2576 said:

The Shiro/jalis vindicator hasnt received many nerfs compared to the alliance based builds so I feel like I’ve only gotten relatively better/stronger over the past few months. Particularly since harbinger has been brought in line. 

   Sure it has. Forced Engagement has now half of the range and is bugged, Planar Protection increased its coodwon from 20 to 30 seconds and Unwavering Avoidance's vigor proc now lasts 1.5 seconds in PvP...  1.5 seconds!   I won't be surprised if ANet ends removing energy sigils from PvP just because the Vindicator, for the pleasure to all the other 25 specs. And all in a meta in which the dps specs are mainly ranged...

  Glad you are having fun with the spec, is what you shoul do, but think about the initial reveal and showcase of the spec a year ago:  to implement the silly jump (which was designed to be the origin of damage buffs) which replaces the evade in the Vindi ANet chose as a tradeoff to remove the stack of a second one and to increase the endurance cost; as compensation they filled the traitline and the F3 with sources of more endurance and procs to vigor. Then after 4 months of the patch team being unable to balance the spec at all they chose to trim down the vigor access and to turn the very low heals designed to be used oftenly in very low heals which can be only used sparsely....   Genious minds with unscrutable pattern designs. I won't touch Jalis/Kalla/Ventari/Mallyx/The Alliance in PvP again.

   Is like "I have a really, really bad idea for a design to a new class, which is also heavily untested, but I think that I can figure out how to balance it with my finely tuned traits. and counterweigths Then it happens that the balance isn't there at all, so I had to weed out all those intrincated mechanisms leaving the carcass of an abomination which doesn't work at any part of the game".

   By the way, and since a new expansion is on the making (and despite I would chose to have new core weapons and/or traits and skills INSTEAD of a new spec), in GW2:

Ranged damage > mele damage

Condition damage> strike damage

   So hopefully the next spec doesn't uses a mele strike weapon.

[Tulkas.2576]

I think the forced engagement nerf was pre vindi, so fortunately I played herald before and never got used to prenerf FE. 
Sure there was the planar protection nerf and unwavering avoidance nerf and I think a slight heal nerf  on Balance in Discord but I barely noticed those, particularly because WB and HB got nerfed as well and they were the main specs putting pressure on me. 
I’m currently really happy with the way vindicator and herald feel, but I’m also fairly new to the profession in general, only having started maining it since GS was revealed to be the next rev weapon.

[Shao.7236]

1 hour ago, Scoobaniec.9561 said:

Yeah nice to assume things about me based without knowing a thing.  And honestly even if i did want to spam i should be allowed to do so. Thats why energy system is here and adding cooldowns strips me of said choice to be made. Theres no longer promised freedom about how you use energy on rev.

"Along with swapping between legends, the revenant profession will employ a second new mechanic that distances it from any other profession currently in the game: energy. In yet another callback to the first Guild Wars, all of the revenant's skills — both weapon and legend skills — will use a portion of the character's energy bar. While other classes only need to wait for a cooldown to reuse skills, revenants will need to wait for their energy bar to refill over time." < Feel free to google any article from 2015, all of them will confirm what i said anyway

Simply put rev was designed to be opposite of thief so if anything your mentality is wrong here. I picked up rev (and im sure many other ppl as well) due to the fact that i could use utilities without cd as long i had energy. Instead i have now energy cost AND cd for whatever reason. Its really no different than adding cooldown to thief weapon skills.

Meanwhile you came years later, saw rev with cooldowns and thought its how it supposed to be. No it aint and never meant to really. Only powerful skills had at max 5cd for mechanical reasons like jade wind was used to bait dodges cuz it had no cd and i could interrupt it over and over by wep stow. Glint was made different to alter playstyle yet her cooldown design for whatever reason carried over to other elite specs and even core revenant.

 

And besides like i said your complain is invalid. Shiro/Glint still meta in pvp and can do well. You just mad they nerfed your favorite toy thats about it. At same time you dont care if toy of someone else was gutted/altered. The "That's right, it's the mentality of me want fun and screw everyone else." sounds like projection at this point.

 

 

More pink shades, I'd like to see Anet handle you spamming Unrelenting Assault, they can't even manage Thief skills properly and never have I disagree'd to Thief not being one of the easiest spec in the game because of Anet inability to clap their players hand and tell them to get good.

You assume I never looked back while the logic behind cooldowns being added is fairly obvious and I am more than glad to have came around the time Revenant started to require brain power. Like I said, you want keymashing and that's not only boring but would require skills to be insignificantly bad in the process.

I'm willing to bet that you even agree with the current state of Deathstrike being the buggy mess that it is while Axe was always meant to be the damage dealer but was let down by dual sword pro lifers opinions that hurr durr it has conditions so it must be a condition weapon.

Herald has to be the easiest goddamn thing to play that is the LEAST Revenant the profession gets, mash Herald skills, back away as Shiro, rinse and repeat. At least with Core Revenant you can counter people with actual tools and don't require instant casting.

Doesn't matter how late I came to the game, I've mastered pretty much all of the aspects that nobody would even think to touch and that without the need to cheese my way through, only that Anet dictates that their profession requiring an xpac should have the least playable content, good on them.

53 minutes ago, Tulkas.2576 said:

I’m having a lot of fun with power Shiro/jalis vindicator in PvP and WvW.

Point being, Vindicator skills are framed as equals while requiring a filthy 10 second swap in between.

Edited August 4, 2022 by Shao.7236

[Scoobaniec.9561]

11 hours ago, Shao.7236 said:

More pink shades, I'd like to see Anet handle you spamming Unrelenting Assault, they can't even manage Thief skills properly and never have I disagree'd to Thief not being one of the easiest spec in the game because of Anet inability to clap their players hand and tell them to get good.

Theres a huge difference between a good and bad thief its not even close. And at what point i mentioned spamming UA when i strictly speak about utility skills for rev? Speaking of rev weapon skills they were supposed to have cooldowns lower than other classes cuz they cost energy.  Whats the situation everyone knows yet skills still cost energy cuz.. reasons

Also technically speaking axe is neither power nor condi. It was designed as control weapon for mace to group up mobs into combos which works perfectly and rev need more of said synergy in general.

[Shao.7236]

10 hours ago, Scoobaniec.9561 said:

Theres a huge difference between a good and bad thief its not even close. And at what point i mentioned spamming UA when i strictly speak about utility skills for rev? Speaking of rev weapon skills they were supposed to have cooldowns lower than other classes cuz they cost energy.  Whats the situation everyone knows yet skills still cost energy cuz.. reasons

Also technically speaking axe is neither power nor condi. It was designed as control weapon for mace to group up mobs into combos which works perfectly and rev need more of said synergy in general.

The only respectable kind of Thief to this day is S/D Core, anything else no matter the skill ceiling has such a degree of low risk high reward cringe. Much like of a lot of what EoD introduced ridiculously power crept in features.

Axe was designed in mind with any sort of Damage, not just for Mace, it had the highest co-efficient before they reworked Deathstrike and it is still a heavy hitter with AoE wide damage on Frigid Blitz.

Sword Off Hand was the defensive alternative over Staff because no weapon swap was available in the first days, that obviously didn't last but there was definitely thematical bias in the decision to make Sword the ugly mess that it is now with hardly any fun to it. I was there before Duelist Preparation was taken out and it definitely needs to make a return over what we currently have, Deathstrike was headed in a proper direction with it's first rework until they removed condis and speed it up to have practically no animation.

In either cases the Chill and Slow were extremely good for any type of content yet here we are with it gone.

Whether it comes down to utility or weapon skills (I've seen it and the logic still applies) the class is fine as it is in the current state and should rather not constantly be tweaked by clueless changes. Some nerfs were deserved, but the majority are overdone and clueless, esp when there's better stuff out there roaming free at no profession mechanic limiting them.

Nothing is wrong with Phase Traversal having a CD, being able to move around the map so fast was overpowered, same can be said with Inspiring Reinforcement, it was overpowered with hardly in any counters but unlike PT they broke the skill consistency and it punishes players for using it properly.

Forced Engagement was never touched and only became a problem when it was touched, the hilarity only gets worst when they claim that having LoS is impotant when you have 10 other skills abused on the daily doing the same with longer range, they're clueless.

[godfat.2604]

On 8/5/2022 at 2:51 AM, Buran.3796 said:

Placing a root instaff #5 breaking your flow wasn't a need, specially if they plan to remove all the damage from Surge of the Mist.

Oh my goodness. I quit the game around the big fat 2020 nerf because it’s just awful. I came back around when EoD was announced, and I thought they messed up with Surge of the Mists that my 200~300 ping would cause me to root for some time, making this skill awful to use for me. I didn’t know it was actually intentional after all! What an amazing silly change.

Wow. I guess at least I knew it’s not just me anymore? They never cease to amaze me.

Edited: Actually, I just watched a video. It’s probably also ping. In my screen my rev will root even longer while swiping the staff. It looks much worse from my side.

Edited August 9, 2022 by godfat.2604

[Aeolus.3615]

Just play the classes that u see dev's playing, that will make ur life way easier 🙂

even if they nerf them the nerf will be removed or will be something buffed and by alot !

My herald build has been so much nerfed  over time even with the lates  revenant changes was much more a nerf to me than anything else.

As i tend to say, only classes dev's play will have access to better options to the gameplay they enforce the game to be played, it will save u a headache.

EDIT: when i play my main rev i have to put way more effort than playing certain meta builds... some even have way more damage output and sturdiness than a revenant lol.. way way more.

EDIT2:

Btw vindicator is way more useless than herald atm in every gamemode, due victor being buffed by support stats and those values have been nerfed, victor needs to be defensive gameplay w/o using or requiring defensive stats nor boons just like Jalis can be very effective using power based stats.

Vindicator needs to be only power based with both legends just swaping the agressive/defensive gameplay.

If Anet wants a hybrid power/support they already had Herald that has passive heals traits, there was no need for another spec that tries to do the same.\

Anet borked up class developent all over again 😞 with poor conscience of the effects their design implies.

 

EDIT3: have u guys noticed that the increase of boons spam actually helps  more necromancer and spellbreakers than anything else?

 

Edited August 9, 2022 by Aeolus.3615

[Knighthonor.4061]

On 8/3/2022 at 12:53 PM, Shao.7236 said:

Dwarf nerfed to crap, Inspiring Reinforcement inconsistencies with overnerfed initial stability, Forced Engagement inconsistencies with huge range nerf with LoS bugs, Damage.modifiers changed from additive to multiplicative.

Mallyx nerfed to crap, Resistance duration nerfed, Resistance effects nerfed, no counters to poison to heal properly.

Renegade nerfed to crap, Heal nerfed badly, elite nerfed to a laughable degree of inefficiency.

Vindicator nerfed to crap, Heal nerfed badly, endurance restoration nerfed badly.

 

All you can do is rush with Herald and call it good gameplay. Even to that point Shiro Impossible Odds is badly nerfed with huge Upkeep costs to hardly any benefits.

Surprisingly Ventari after the deserved reworked is playable but you'd be calling me crazy if I told you Ventari would have somehow a place.

That however makes Core, Renegade, Vindicator extremely unfun or borderline impossible to enjoy and the years are stacking with the neglected bug of CoR on Hammer as well.

Revenant is the Dan of GW2. So I recommend to new players only playing it if you are one of those DAN fans that like the thrill of being kitten and kicking butt while being kitten.  

[Angesombre.4630]

14 hours ago, godfat.2604 said:

Oh my goodness. I quit the game around the big fat 2020 nerf because it’s just awful. I came back around when EoD was announced, and I thought they messed up with Surge of the Mists that my 200~300 ping would cause me to root for some time, making this skill awful to use for me. I didn’t know it was actually intentional after all! What an amazing silly change.

Wow. I guess at least I knew it’s not just me anymore? They never cease to amaze me.

Edited: Actually, I just watched a video. It’s probably also ping. In my screen my rev will root even longer while swiping the staff. It looks much worse from my side.

In 2020 that's when they started to break the revenant

[godfat.2604]

4 hours ago, Angesombre.4630 said:

In 2020 that's when they started to break the revenant

Not trying to defend anything, but they broke so many more professions (mesmer specifically in my mind) during the time, to the point that I can even say it's the first and only time for me to rage quit over balance changes (or maybe we should say mechanism changes, because it's way more than just balance), around the time they suddenly fell in love with the weird trade-off ideas, giving artificial handicaps as a way to balance, breaking so many things. See my rage is still there 😞

I don't feel this will happen, but I really think they should revert all those weird trade-offs coming from nowhere, and apply proper balance changes from there. Sorry for my rants. I'll stop here.

[Scoobaniec.9561]

Id like them to at very least fix the animations. Starting from mace 2. Just a reminder its starting weapon for rev! The kitten they gonna get at steam release once people notice will be interesting to see

[Shao.7236]

21 hours ago, Scoobaniec.9561 said:

Id like them to at very least fix the animations. Starting from mace 2. Just a reminder its starting weapon for rev! The kitten they gonna get at steam release once people notice will be interesting to see

Or fix Hammer hitbox, animations and sounds. I never nor anyone asked for CoR sound to be suppressed harder than the firearm action movie trope out there or have the only skill in the game that can literally be avoided while sitting in front of someone.