Pure OW PvE idea for legendary armor

[Silent.6137]

5 hours ago, idpersona.3810 said:

No one expects the possible open world armor to be easy to get. I'd expect it to be roughly the same time gate as the other sets, with a comparable cost. It would still be nice to have that to work towards a little each day/week.

And it shouldn't be easy to acquire, as pretty much everyone who are supportive of this idea on this thread had said. However, some who are opposed to it kept insisting that's what this is all about: having a very easy option.

I advocated an OW option because I think it's a good idea to be inclusive. But this is the ultimate armor set for the game. It should be very hard to obtain and should include all aspect of the OW mode. And should be worthy of the word Legendary in the acquiring process. I definitely would not support an easy mode.

As for the Legendary armor not being needed in the OW, I consider that argument rather weak. It is a QoL item. It's either needed regardless of game mode or not needed at all. For those who are reluctant to do Raids, PvP or WvW, for whatever reasons, then this will be the ultimate goals for them. Truly grind for the best armor in the game if you really desire it.

The argument that legendary armor should only be rewarded for the hardest contents, i.e. Raids. doesn't wash either since either of the WvW or PvP options are hardly difficult at all in comparison.

Edited September 16, 2022 by Silent.6137

[Solvar.7953]

I'm fine with OW Legendary armor having a different skin, if those who do raids think the raid skin gives prestige and don't want others to have it.  Though honest, I never look at anyone's equipment and assess any prestige to it, because a person could have just bought it cash converted to gold for all I know.  Yes, you can't buy things directly for cash (except gen 1 weapons).  But if you have a pile of gold, you can pay others to carry you through the content to get that item.  I doubt many people do so (but some almost ceratainly do), but there isn't really anyway of knowing.

And to be clear, I'm not asking for an easy path to legendary armor.  I'm asking for a path that I (and probably a lot of other players) would enjoy.  Spending 6 months to get it is much more appealing if I can chip away with it in content that I enjoy, vs content where I instead don't want to play the only reason I would do it is to get the reward.

Yes, I could find the time to get the rewards in WvW if I really wanted to, but I'll play another game (and spend my money there) before spending hours on something I don't enjoy.

People seem to think that everyone enjoys all content.  This would be like telling someone they don't like kale and they really should like it.  It doesn't change the fact that different people have different preferences for what they enjoy.

(though I'm sure there are now going to be a bunch of posts from people that love kale)

 

[Flowersunshine.7385]

Ok, so I've read 8 pages and I'm mostly seeing the same arguments repeated, so I'm gonna assume no new arguments in favour it OW PvE armour vs. the raid option have been made in the next 14 pages. 

HOWEVER, I've got one! (I've got one set of raid leggy armour and two from PvP, jfyi) 

Having easy access to different stat sets might make it easier for PvE players to get into raids or even WvW. Scheduling for raids/finding a group doesn't get easier if you are limited to one or two classes because you don't have the right ascended gear. (I'm swimming in ascended gear now, I definitely was not when I first started raids, and if it hadn't been for the raid drops & currency, I probably still wouldn't have ascended on all my chars. I went from 1 piece of ascended to 9 characters with one or two sets of ascended each in two years, purely because of raids.)

Playing wvw like it's supposed to becomes a lot more fun & easier if you have the ability to use a viable build from the get-go, rather than first having to collect the right pieces for your build. 'Oh, I need x stats. I don't have those. I don't have stat selectable piece lying around. I guess I'll not join wvw this afternoon. Do I feel like collecting the gear instead? Not really, I'll get it some other time. *forgets all about getting the gear*' 

So maybe making legendary armor more accessible makes other game modes more accessible for casual players.

Also:

Don't devalue the 'I don't have time for that' argument. One of the major beauties of gw2 is that people can drop the game when they are too busy with life and pick up where they left off without being miles behind their friends when they get back in. It means you can always return to the game, which is great for keeping the population up. But both raids & wvw require regular time investment (to keep up wood participation at least, and to keep up with current builds or statics), something that isn't available to everyone. Having a goal that you can make progress towards when you do play (even if it would ofc take longer if you can't play regularly), might really be an incentive to return to the game when you do have time - even if it's half an hour per week. (I know PvP gives that, but PvP like wvw ramps up with how much you play. Something with a more linear progression, like map completion - a repeatable version though pls, or something like the Lamplighters badges - & token collection is less of a hurdle.)

If OW PvE got a leggy armor set with a new skin, I'd probably get that, even though I've got all three armour classes already. I love OW PvE, especially collections.

[Woof.8246]

7 hours ago, Sobx.1758 said:

It's when someone doesn't want to play more of the content the game provides but instead keeps complaning on the forum that said rewards should be brought to whatever they're already doing anyways. Hope that explains it. Nobody is "denying" anything to anyone.

I believe the other game-modes are just fine , there are no need force people by limiting them a qol thing .

If we look in the Raid forum for example , we will see a beautiful  calmness , were people have accepted it as it is  and not new demanding-hostile thread have been  created  .

 

(or it was decided by the community , that it should never change and any new ideas are not welcomed . This doesn't mean that other modes must suffer .

The game must always progress forward with the aim either new mass amount of people , or subtracting the "good population" from other games and they will collapse from the inside )

Edited September 16, 2022 by Woof.8246

[SentriX.3209]

Might also add a Fractal version.

[Kusarigama.6831]

God kitten this topic is booming

I have one stance and that's yeeting mystic clovers. Artifical gating is artificial.

Main thing though, I want another pve ring, I'm close to conflux but would like to have another "chapter" to auroras effect.

 

Raids are pretty casual if you ask me so it's not like the armor is difficult. First set is like 2 months, and then subsequent set is like 4 months.

 

[CrashTestAuto.9108]

9 hours ago, Linken.6345 said:

They dont get weapons or earrings tho but open world pve get those for playing what they already do so it balance itself out nicely.

I agree it balances, but I don't think "nicely".  Aurora and Confluence are, I think, pretty well designed quests, but they're a heck of an ask of people who don't like Open World (so for now, let's use them as a good equivalent of WvW armour).

 

It doesn't seem to me a good system to say "PvE players have to spend hours and hours in a game mode they don't like to get armour, but that's okay because WvWers also have to spend hours and hours in a game mode they don't like to get accessories."

 

It seems much better to just let people play the content they enjoy, and put accessories and weapons into WvW as well as armour into Open World.  I don't think it would take much work for WvW (the skirmish system is not good, but it easily scales, and I don't think WvWers want to be channelled into playing in specific ways).

[yoni.7015]

32 minutes ago, CrashTestAuto.9108 said:

I agree it balances, but I don't think "nicely".  Aurora and Confluence are, I think, pretty well designed quests, but they're a heck of an ask of people who don't like Open World (so for now, let's use them as a good equivalent of WvW armour).

 

It doesn't seem to me a good system to say "PvE players have to spend hours and hours in a game mode they don't like to get armour, but that's okay because WvWers also have to spend hours and hours in a game mode they don't like to get accessories."

 

It seems much better to just let people play the content they enjoy, and put accessories and weapons into WvW as well as armour into Open World.  I don't think it would take much work for WvW (the skirmish system is not good, but it easily scales, and I don't think WvWers want to be channelled into playing in specific ways).

Why do you automatically think that WvW players don’t like PvE and PvE players don’t like WvW? This is not black and white and player groups are not monolithic blocs. This may be shocking to you, but there are even WvW players that raid. 
Just because you are so limited in the content you like doesn’t mean that everyone is like you. 
Putting legendary weapons in WvW would be work for the devs and I don’t think that it would be worth it or that it is necessary. You see a lot of players with legendary weapons in WvW. So getting them don’t seem to be a big problem. 
PvE players don’t have to spend hours and hours in a game mode they don’t like. They can get legendary armor in PvE.

Edited September 16, 2022 by yoni.7015

[CrashTestAuto.9108]

33 minutes ago, yoni.7015 said:

Why do you automatically think that WvW players don’t like PvE and PvE players don’t like WvW? This is not black and white and player groups are not monolithic blocs. This may be shocking to you, but there are even WvW players that raid. 
Just because you are so limited in the content you like doesn’t mean that everyone is like you. 

You must know this is an uncharitable reading?  I mean, I myself have already said I think WvW is pretty entertaining.  It would also be almost impossible for someone to be familiar with the game (and just, humans in general), and to hold the view you're trying to attribute to me.

 

Nowhere did I present this as a strict binary, and my position doesn't rely on it.  If someone "quite likes" X and "loves" Y, then it is perfectly reasonable that they'd rather spend hundreds of hours doing Y than X.

[vandrefalk.6823]

On 9/13/2022 at 5:46 AM, Solvar.7953 said:

There is often discussions about current dislike for methods of getting legendary armor, and I'm in that same boat.  Raid content does not interest me much (and is not great for casuals), and I just don't have the time to spend 20 hours/week in WvW to get max claim tickets - for the time I do have, it will probably take me 6+ months to get 1 piece of legendary armor from wvw claim tickets.

 

I didn't make my first full legendary armor set until the 10th anniversary last month - and I started playing on launch, and I'm fine with it. I've done raiding on and off, WvW on and off, and the raid armor set was just recently completed.

 

Now I've started working on my second set since I want it for my main (fml - I chose the wrong precursor set 😄so I had to make heavy first, now I need twice as many LI for the light set lol)

 

Point is though - it's taken me all these years and the feeling was legendary. In the meantime during all those years, I've probably killed over 1k world bosses and done map metas etc, and sometimes those were a real snooze-fest and the legendary armor would not feel as cool if you got it from such events.

They've catered to all 3 game modes sPvP, WvW, instanced PvE and don't need another option for open world PvE. I get that players who don't go into instanced PvE also want in on the QoL that legendary gives you, but if a casual like me can get it in 10 years and be fine with it, I'm not about to accept that you whine it will take 6+ months to get 1 piece...

[pfuetzi.5421]

I would keep the original collections but maybe give players another timegated opportunity to get LIs.

There are always less enjoyable things but I think it is fair that players have to "work" for the most prestiges items. Otherwise, it doesn't feel like an achievement. And as the "raid" armor also involves a lot of open world, I think the potential "Open world" armor should involve some raiding (which would be the collection completion).

 

I think it could also be hard content for the alternative (LI)route (difficult jumping puzzles within a time limit, gold achievement for the HoT minigames, etc.). As I understand it, people don't like the raid content and it is not about the difficulty. WvW as an "easy" mode was mentioned but that doesn't mean that the PVE route needs to be easy mode as well (, especially as it is hard to believe that only flipping camps was what the developers had in mind when it comes to WvW).

[Astralporing.1957]

4 hours ago, Solvar.7953 said:

People seem to think that everyone enjoys all content.

Actually, no, they don't. At least some of them are fully aware that most players don't like the content they play. They don't care about that however. They think that you will either be forcefed with that content to the point you will eventually like it, or you won't, in which case you are a worse kind of player that does not deserve to get nice stuff anyway, and they get to laugh you concerns off.

Most will never say that outright (although some will), but you can feel that way of thinking just oozing from their every post.

[yoni.7015]

37 minutes ago, Astralporing.1957 said:

Actually, no, they don't. At least some of them are fully aware that most players don't like the content they play. They don't care about that however. They think that you will either be forcefed with that content to the point you will eventually like it, or you won't, in which case you are a worse kind of player that does not deserve to get nice stuff anyway, and they get to laugh you concerns off.

Most will never say that outright (although some will), but you can feel that way of thinking just oozing from their every post.

Now you are a mind reader. That’s impressive.

But I do think that it is not a bad thing that you sometimes have to step out of your comfort zone and widen your horizon in order to get the most prestigious items in the game. After all, if we look at where you can get the most legendary items, open world is leading. To get legendary weapons you have to play mostly open world content, plus the two accessories and the amulet. 
But I have yet to see raiders, WvW or PvP players crying for days that they have to play open world content to get legendary weapons or trinkets. 

Edited September 16, 2022 by yoni.7015

[Holmindeboks.3490]

This won’t happen. I have suggested this also several times before. But selfish forum community only laugh at it. The toxic ppl are on the forum (yes me2) only different is that I am not selfish.

and the nice ppl are ingame. 
i have done some raids. Asking as I don’t get an extra task it’s doable for me. My dps is fine. 
once they asked for kp. I said can I have a chance, if I do bad then just kick me. Because everyone started on zero. And we had 2 successful runs. Dps was fine. I didn’t get kicked. 
but the biggest problem is they ask too much from new players. I have no rotation. Since start of the game i mostly press skills which get off cooldown. Except skills that i know sure sure they are useless for dps. 

[vanfrano.1325]

14 minutes ago, yoni.7015 said:

Now you are a mind reader. That’s impressive.

No need to be a mind reader, a good reader is enough.

[god fragment.5716]

40 minutes ago, yoni.7015 said:

But I do think that it is not a bad thing that you sometimes have to step out of your comfort zone and widen your horizon in order to get the most prestigious items in the game. After all, if we look at where you can get the most legendary items, open world is leading. To get legendary weapons you have to play mostly open world content, plus the two accessories and the amulet. 
But I have yet to see raiders, WvW or PvP players crying for days that they have to play open world content to get legendary weapons or trinkets. 

 

Exactly. Legendaries are scattered across all game modes to encourage players to play all game modes. GW2 doesn't FORCE players to do anything, it ENCOURAGES whith QoL, utility and skins. 

[Taclism.2406]

Lets play "find the pattern"
As a reminder, leg gear main perk is rerolling stats at will.
Raids, pvp , wvw : Requieres somewhat specific specs, and gear adapted to spec to succeed
World bosses : Play literally anything, press 1

Good luck
 

[Woof.8246]

1 hour ago, Taclism.2406 said:

Lets play "find the pattern"
As a reminder, leg gear main perk is rerolling stats at will.
Raids, pvp , wvw : Requieres somewhat specific specs, and gear adapted to spec to succeed
World bosses : Play literally anything, press 1

Good luck
 

Well we must find a pattern to why new people are discourage from joining in the first place, rather than expecting  the existing community to step out their shell , by denying them a qol effect

For example in PvP , people hate the 2sec kills  , where hopefully Arenanet will step up to fix that problem in October .

Raiding have some problems at the "entry" level , such as this guy and this guy and some more that don't use he forums .

Edited September 16, 2022 by Woof.8246

[Astralporing.1957]

41 minutes ago, Taclism.2406 said:

Lets play "find the pattern"
As a reminder, leg gear main perk is rerolling stats at will.
Raids, pvp , wvw : Requieres somewhat specific specs, and gear adapted to spec to succeed
World bosses : Play literally anything, press 1

Good luck
 

Yes. let's.

SPvP: mode in which legendary gear stat changing (or, in general, any gear at all) is completely irrelevant, because stats are being done completely differently (through PvP amulet)

Raids, WvW, OW - content in which QoL stat changing actually works, and gear stats do matter, in some case a lot (yes, even in OW: example: DE meta).

Good Luck.

[Markus.6415]

Mhm.. Mhm... I gotta say I'm a bit unsure where the actual "need" of legendary amor in open world content is? I understand that you need a selection of builds and gears for PvP, a different selection for WvW and and also a couple of builds for different PvE instanced content roles. But open world?

 

GW2 is already an MMO where you can get so many things, so easily and to collect a set of the best armor ingame is really not a challenge (and the best armor here is ascended, legendary is just convenient stat swap with ugly looks*). I'm not a big fan of that "I want to get everything, everywhere, all at once" mentality. You're playing a massively multiplayer online game, just to play it solo? That means you won't get everything out of it.

 

*unpopular personal opinion

[god fragment.5716]

40 minutes ago, Woof.8246 said:

Well we must find a pattern to why new people are discourage from joining in the first place, rather than expecting  the existing community to step out their shell , by denying them a qol effect

Are new people discouraged thought? I believe a new player would think that those with legendary equipment have been playing for a long time and have earned it. 

[Caliboom.3218]

I find this "all OW players do is 11111" stereotype funny.

Even OW players like to experiment with different builds, boon builds, heal builds, condi builds, meme builds, whatever.

[yoni.7015]

Just now, Caliboom.3218 said:

I find this "all OW players do is 11111" stereotype funny.

Even OW players like to experiment with different builds, boon builds, heal builds, condi builds, meme builds, whatever.

You don’t need legendary armor to experiment with builds. 

[Caliboom.3218]

1 minute ago, yoni.7015 said:

You don’t need legendary armor to experiment with builds. 

But it helps with it without having to buy different sets of armor each time.

[yoni.7015]

2 minutes ago, Caliboom.3218 said:

But it helps with it without having to buy different sets of armor each time.

Sure it helps but it is not necessary. You can easily get multiple sets of exotic or ascended gear and stat changing ascended gear is not really expensive. 

Edited September 16, 2022 by yoni.7015