Anet, Stop Changing Things. The Game is FINE.

[Spiral.3724]

I don't know if there is some new employee at the company that feels like they need to shake things up, but please stop.

WEAPONS are fine. It's cool that we can only get a certain weapon with a class specialization. There's no reason to change this.

RUNES are fine. There is no reason to mess with them. (Also, we have something named relics already, in fractals. Get a thesaurus, geez.)

DAILIES and LOGIN REWARDS are fine. Why are you making this "battlepass" thing? 

I've been playing since beta. You're turning the game into something unrecognizable.

These new changes aren't "cool and exciting". They don't "open up the game to new possibilities". Stop trying to make us hyped about bad ideas.

Us long-timers are here cuz we like the game AS IT IS. Each new change makes me love GW2 a little bit less.

[moony.5780]

As a day 1 player im actually happy about these changes. But dont know yet if they will be good or bad. But im happy they change things. I honestly miss how gw2 felt the first 3-4 years. Its too much meta mehh here and there.

[Ashen.2907]

15 minutes ago, Spiral.3724 said:

I don't know if there is some new employee at the company that feels like they need to shake things up, but please stop.

WEAPONS are fine. It's cool that we can only get a certain weapon with a class specialization. There's no reason to change this.

RUNES are fine. There is no reason to mess with them. (Also, we have something named relics already, in fractals. Get a thesaurus, geez.)

DAILIES and LOGIN REWARDS are fine. Why are you making this "battlepass" thing? 

I've been playing since beta. You're turning the game into something unrecognizable.

These new changes aren't "cool and exciting". They don't "open up the game to new possibilities". Stop trying to make us hyped about bad ideas.

Us long-timers are here cuz we like the game AS IT IS. Each new change makes me love GW2 a little bit less.

Dailies and log in rewards were added post launch....kind of a means of shaking things up.

Elire specs were added post launch...very much shaking things up.

Legendary armor

and so much more.

 

[ZeftheWicked.3076]

Actually i'm pro Trump...erm wait wrong subject.
I'm pro relics.

Runes are not fine, they're better but there are still some clear winners and losers.
Also some very cool effects are often tied to stats that just don't work with your build no matter what.

Like rune of firebrand being the BiS for quickness providers, but sucks to be you if you're running a power build because this rune is a condi one (hi scrappers).

Separating pure stat boost from special, unique effects is something I can get behind.

[Redfeather.6401]

I like to earn things in game that I can play around with, that aren't cosmetic. So I am liking the weaponmaster and relic systems. I hope it gets some love.

[Cronospere.8143]

1 hour ago, Spiral.3724 said:

I don't know if there is some new employee at the company that feels like they need to shake things up, but please stop.

WEAPONS are fine. It's cool that we can only get a certain weapon with a class specialization. There's no reason to change this.

RUNES are fine. There is no reason to mess with them. (Also, we have something named relics already, in fractals. Get a thesaurus, geez.)

DAILIES and LOGIN REWARDS are fine. Why are you making this "battlepass" thing? 

I've been playing since beta. You're turning the game into something unrecognizable.

These new changes aren't "cool and exciting". They don't "open up the game to new possibilities". Stop trying to make us hyped about bad ideas.

Us long-timers are here cuz we like the game AS IT IS. Each new change makes me love GW2 a little bit less.

Hah people have been complaining about log in rewards and dailies for a long time. 

People wanted new weapons. 

And yes. They open the way for new posibilities. Dont pretend they won't. 

I am excited for what is to come. Seems you dont want any new content at all..

[Ashen.2907]

2 minutes ago, Cronospere.8143 said:

Hah people have been complaining about log in rewards and dailies for a long time. 

People wanted new weapons. 

And yes. They open the way for new posibilities. Dont pretend they won't. 

I am excited for what is to come. Seems you dont want any new content at all..

Rearranging the chairs (to borrow an analogy) at a party is not adding new content.

Edited June 30, 2023 by Ashen.2907

[Chichimec.9364]

2 hours ago, Spiral.3724 said:

...I've been playing since beta... 

...Us long-timers are here cuz we like the game AS IT IS. Each new change makes me love GW2 a little bit less.

Hmm, let's see...I've only been here about 5 1/2 years so some of the notable changes I've seen are:
- the introduction of the warclaw, which is what got me into WvW, where I am still running on a daily basis;
- the Icebrood Saga, parts of which, like Grothmar Valley, I really enjoyed and parts of which, like strike missions, I don't really care for;
- the introduction of the Legendary Armory, which I love and it was the first announcement that the Armory was coming that got me started on getting legendaries;
- the EoD expansion, which was disappointing to me;
- the announcement of the new expansion which intrigued me enough that I've already pre-ordered it.

Of course those are not the only changes in the last 5 1/2 years but they are enough to make my point. Change is going to happen. That's inevitable in life. Here in GW2, there have been some changes I really liked and some I didn't. So I can't agree with a blanket statement that each new change in GW2 has been bad.

 

[Panda.1967]

GW1 veteran who has participated in betas for both games… what the hell are you on? These changes are great and most of them are things many of us long term veteran players have been asking for for ages…

unlocking espec weapons from their espec is something that should have been done from the start. it was fine to lock them behind the spec, but to completely lock them to the specs was unnecessary and excessive… some people think this change will make balancing harder, I strongly disagree… I’ve seen the processes for balancing classes like this before, having the weapons locked to especs actually complicates balance more. With them locked to the espec they have to be very careful about any balance changes they make to core weapons so as to not invalidate the espec weapons, and there is an implied pressure to make espec weapons more powerful, flashier, and more useful than their core counterparts. Removing this lock loosens their constraints with balance considerably and allows them to just design weapon abilities for the class as a whole with no pressure to make it something special. Those extra flairs for espec weapons are a large part of balance issues BTW… having more freedom to remove those aspects or add them to other core weapons is great for balance going forwards.

Runes are fine you say? There are a LOT of absolutely amazing abilities tied to runes that have stat bonuses that shoehorn you into specific builds that don’t always complement the effect… and conversely there are some runes with amazing stat options not found on any other rune but utter garbage effects… this change is a godsend. Does it mean power creep? Absolutely… but what MMO in existence hasn’t had some power creep with the launch of a new expansion? A change adding power creep doesn’t mean its a bad change, it just means some balance passes will be necessary.

I don’t have a clue what you are on about with the dailies and login rewards becoming a battlepass… I’ve combed over all the recent announcements and seen nothing to this extent… the closest I can find is a new area with daily tasks for us to complete… its not a change to the system we have its something new to do along side what we already have… If there is something I’ve missed I’d love to have it pointed out.

3 hours ago, Spiral.3724 said:

Us long-timers are here cuz we like the game AS IT IS. Each new change makes me love GW2 a little bit less.

speak for yourself… been playing GW since the GW1 beta in 2004… followed the development of GW2 closely, participated in Alpha and every Beta… I welcome these changes and they make me love the game even more.

Edited June 30, 2023 by Panda.1967

[Ashen.2907]

5 minutes ago, Panda.1967 said:

GW1 veteran who has participated in betas for both games… what the hell are you on? These changes are great and most of them are things many of us long term veteran players have been asking for for ages…

unlocking espec weapons from their espec is something that should have been done from the start. it was fine to lock them behind the spec, but to completely lock them to the specs was unnecessary and excessive… some people think this change will make balancing harder, I strongly disagree… I’ve seen the processes for balancing classes like this before, having the weapons locked to especs actually complicates balance more. With them locked to the espec they have to be very careful about any balance changes they make to core weapons so as to not invalidate the espec weapons, and there is an implied pressure to make espec weapons more powerful, flashier, and more useful than their core counterparts. Removing this lock loosens their constraints with balance considerably and allows them to just design weapon abilities for the class as a whole with no pressure to make it something special. Those extra flairs for espec weapons are a large part of balance issues BTW… having more freedom to remove those aspects or add them to other core weapons is great for balance going forwards.

Runes are fine you say? There are a LOT of absolutely amazing abilities tied to runes that have stat bonuses that shoehorn you into specific builds that don’t always complement the effect… and conversely there are some runes with amazing stat options not found on any other rune but utter garbage effects… this change is a godsend. Does it mean power creep? Absolutely… but what MMO in existence hasn’t had some power creep with the launch of a new expansion? A change adding power creep doesn’t mean its a bad change, it just means some balance passes will be necessary.

I don’t have a clue what you are on about with the dailies and login rewards becoming a battlepass… I’ve combed over all the recent announcements and seen nothing to this extent… the closest I can find is a new area with daily tasks for us to complete… its not a change to the system we have its something new to do along side what we already have… If there is something I’ve missed I’d love to have it pointed out.

speak for yourself… been playing GW since the GW1 beta in 2004… I welcome these changes and they make me love the game even more.

Telling someone to speak for himself after, earlier in your own post, you choose to speak for others might make your argument less effective.

[Panda.1967]

Just now, Ashen.2907 said:

Telling someone to speak for himself after, earlier in your own post, you choose to speak for others might make your argument less effective.

They made a blanket claim applying to all veteran players. I made a limited claim applying to many of us. I’m not speaking for everyone, I’m speaking for myself and stating that I have seen many others share this opinion… they claimed all of us share their opinion that is in direct opposition to mine and many others I have seen.

[Dibit.6259]

Tbh my main concern if whether they will be able to deal with power creep and balancing of these new "features". They sound good on paper but when it comes to reality then this may just be opening a can of worms. No offense to the devs but considering they're having difficulty balancing the current state of the game how much of a uphill battle will it be once they changes are implemented? I like shinny new things as much as the next player but I would prefer that they focus more on current problems before adding more to their plate.

[StarPT.7431]

4 hours ago, Panda.1967 said:

I don’t have a clue what you are on about with the dailies and login rewards becoming a battlepass… I’ve combed over all the recent announcements and seen nothing to this extent… the closest I can find is a new area with daily tasks for us to complete… its not a change to the system we have its something new to do along side what we already have… If there is something I’ve missed I’d love to have it pointed out.

I think you can read that announce in 2 different ways:

1st way (and the one I want to believe in) is that they meant to say they took inspiration in the best aspects of daily login and daily activities in order to create this system

2nd way (and the one I hope it's not true) is that they mean to replace the current daily logins with this new system, this being supported by the fact that the feature will come to everyone with just some of the stuff being locked the SOTO owners.

[Batalix.2873]

Runes needed some sort of remaster. I don't like this solution since we will still have the problem of having a boring "all six same rune" meta, only now having six of the same rune will still be obligatory for the larger stat bonuses, but not grant as much to the player. If they are decoupling the "bonus ability" into a relic, they should redo runes to only grant a single, consistent stat bonus per rune. Otherwise, this change is just a lot of empty faffery imo, like so much else in SotO.

My opinion is mixed on dailies/logins. While it is tempting to want a more streamlined guide for newer players, the current daily system already kind of did that? A lot of the other daily bloat was totally optional and wasn't hurting anyone. Again, I think unnecessary faffery and really just erasing the ease of daily logins and *forcing* daily interaction for basic item drops. Overall I think encouraging players to rely more heavily on a "to-do list" to revisit content rather than actually do collections and discover what content they like is going to hurt overall map participation and game design in the future. Idk, battle pass may not be a safe path to be going down.

But I DO agree about the especs and weapons, hands down. The espec system is GW2's Black Prince Ruby and this change is just going to shatter that crown jewel. Very reckless. I am so close to just quitting this game after that announcement and likely will because job identity is just dead in the water now. We used to have 27 (well, 18-ish and some half-baked blehs) different job fantasies to engage with. This is going to likely consolidate everything back down to just nine. Good job ANet, you killed your baby. Woooooooo.

[EphemeralWallaby.7643]

MMOs are change.  It's difficult to come up with a better example of impermanence.

It's one of the things I like about playing them.

~EpWa

[Val.7826]

Until they keep the relaxing mood this game can give, I'm ok with almost every change. This doesn't meen I like them all, many of them are... questionable... but the very core of this game is the sensation of freedom from the duty of doing stuff every day at specific times and for a specific amount of time, even daily rewards are stable here, in many games if you skip a day you must restart from the beginning the daily login reward tiers, but not here. In Gw2 I am not feeling oppressed by a punding game design, and that is what real matters imho.

About the recent beta, the only thing I have to say is that I fear specializations can lose some of their identity with this weaponmastery stuff... but I have to admit that the idea of playing a Sword+Warhorn Catalyst is... kinda intriguing. We'll see.

I don't blame devs for trying to keeping the game fresh for paying players, it's fair and necessary, but I hope they'll do better with story and narration, EoD was a bit of disappointing (I didn't play yet "What Lies Beneath" and "What Lies Within" tho).

P.S. Sorry for any grammar mistakes, I'm not english and I don't speak/write english often, plus, it's late... or soon... 5 AM 🫠

Edited July 1, 2023 by Val.7826

[Dante.1508]

Some change is good.. Some change is bad. As the expac has not been released yet i'll figure out which it is after i try it.

[GetFoxxed.9478]

21 hours ago, Spiral.3724 said:

WEAPONS are fine. It's cool that we can only get a certain weapon with a class specialization. There's no reason to change this.

I agree with everything you said except this one. The elite spec lock was blocking a lot of build and theorycrafting options.

[Xperiment.6923]

Is OP a guardian? Game needs lots of fix'n I don't think all these changes will be the solution. Weaponnaster will have a few hits and many misses...[ahem...Warrior Weapons].

I'm looking forward to relics... I prefer all the tools I can get to make my own pokemon deck rather then copy/paste a build. I think the elitist sites out there probably influenced all the power creep making whole stats like toughness and vitality irrelevant.

Game Designers seem to just fixate on boons these days. Game should not be a one tone DPS, imo. 

[Ashen.2907]

22 minutes ago, Xperiment.6923 said:

Game should not be a one tone DPS,

The relic changes are going to exacerbate this issue and create more power creep, widening the gap between min-max and casual.

[Dante.1508]

10 hours ago, Ashen.2907 said:

The relic changes are going to exacerbate this issue and create more power creep, widening the gap between min-max and casual.

Well if that is the case, lets hope it helps the casual population catch up some what to the hard cores so we can do more content and not be left out so much.

[Ashen.2907]

27 minutes ago, Dante.1508 said:

Well if that is the case, lets hope it helps the casual population catch up some what to the hard cores so we can do more content and not be left out so much.

Im sorry, exacerbate, in this context, means that it is going to make that gap worse, not better. Casual players will not only NOT catch up but will fall further behind with this system. That said, content is balanced, for the most part, around casual levels of character performance.

[JusticeRetroHunter.7684]

21 hours ago, Xperiment.6923 said:

Is OP a guardian? Game needs lots of fix'n I don't think all these changes will be the solution. Weaponnaster will have a few hits and many misses...[ahem...Warrior Weapons].

I'm looking forward to relics... I prefer all the tools I can get to make my own pokemon deck rather then copy/paste a build. I think the elitist sites out there probably influenced all the power creep making whole stats like toughness and vitality irrelevant.

Game Designers seem to just fixate on boons these days. Game should not be a one tone DPS, imo. 

This guy understands game design.

[Dante.1508]

10 hours ago, Ashen.2907 said:

Im sorry, exacerbate, in this context, means that it is going to make that gap worse, not better. Casual players will not only NOT catch up but will fall further behind with this system. That said, content is balanced, for the most part, around casual levels of character performance.

Its not even close to being balanced.

[Ashen.2907]

5 minutes ago, Dante.1508 said:

Its not even close to being balanced.

Content is designed around casual performance.