Now that ascended items are easily available through Wizard's Vault

[Nabbut.7480]

11 minutes ago, DanAlcedo.3281 said:

The amount of Ascended gear entering the market is limitless as there are many ways to get Ascended while the demand is limited. 

A players only needs X amount of Ascended. 

A player puts new Ascended items onto the market everyday. 

And the amount of people who don't need Ascended anymore in Increasing everyday. 

The Value would tank. 

And removing Ascended items from content would the content less worth playing and basically telling people to just farm Drizzle wood. 

Overall, an unnecessary change. 

This is equally applicable to existing Exotic market but reality disagrees.

I don't know much about motivation of others but I play mainly to free roam and hunt open world creatures, gather and craft, without consigning myself to crazy boring stuff like repeatedly farming same events over and over, or even worse, camping with engineer turrets on creature respawn points, because it is "gold efficient".

Unnecessary change? Judging by these forums many changes Anet does for the sake of development are bad not just unnecessary.

This one at least haves economic meaning.

[Nabbut.7480]

12 minutes ago, Dayra.7405 said:

Hehe no 😀 but material sinks should not be tradable, they would stop working if they are.

I have trouble understanding this. If you sell material sinks to more buyers, who are otherwise not crafting, instead of making just a few for yourself, they use more materials, no?

Where am I wrong?

[Dayra.7405]

33 minutes ago, SpiderZ.9146 said:

I have trouble understanding this. If you sell material sinks to more buyers, who are otherwise not crafting, instead of making just a few for yourself, they use more materials, no?

Where am I wrong?

If you sell it, someone buys it, so he doesn't craft it -> sink is not working.

If you can only use or scrap (to research notes) or npc sell it, it doesn't help others to avoid the sink.

If they (currently) don't craft, it still leaves them as potential sink, if they buy instead, the sink is gone.

 

Edited September 14, 2023 by Dayra.7405

[Vayne.8563]

19 hours ago, SpiderZ.9146 said:

Looks kinda nonsensical and dyslexical to me. Ascended gear will be sold for over a dozen of gold so it will require at least some gameplay or wallet to get it.

Yeah I mean no one buys gems and sells them to get gold.

[Dayra.7405]

4 minutes ago, Vayne.8563 said:

Yeah I mean no one buys gems and sells them to get gold.

Correct would have been: Play or finance the game 🙂

Both is important to keep the game alive.

Edited September 14, 2023 by Dayra.7405

[Vayne.8563]

2 hours ago, Dayra.7405 said:

Correct would have been: Play or finance the game 🙂

Both is important to keep the game alive.

Yes and no. There are plenty of games people played that didn't survive, because of finances. I doubt there are many games that weren't financed that survived though.

[Nexideus.7946]

If anything is to change with ascended gear binding, it should be soulbound on use.

It is easier to get now, and the demand is dropping, to keep the demand it should be soulbinded to the wearer.

Ascended gear should never be tradeable between accounts - go play the game! craft! farm!

If ascended gear would be tradeable and open with no bind, it would create a strong p2w atmosphere, as people would shell real money to trade gems for gold and then buy all max gear at once.

No one should be able to get to max stats easily.

Edited September 14, 2023 by DanielKitchka.4709
Removed big spaces between lines

[prototypedragon.1406]

Technically isn't ascended gear the poor noobs equivalent of a Legendary? 🤔 if I remember right the only reason ascended gear was created was due to a stat disparity back when the game started when there only were legendary weapons  exotic stuff and below etc, but Legendary  weapons had slightly higher stats and there was no such thing as ascended let alone legendary armor or trinkets. That or it was added as a "progression" sort of thing🤷‍♂️

Edited September 14, 2023 by prototypedragon.1406
.

[Dayra.7405]

36 minutes ago, prototypedragon.1406 said:

Technically isn't ascended gear the poor noobs equivalent of a Legendary

I disagree. Since the legendary armory leggy armor is in the end cheaper than ascended very fast (depends of course also on the number of chars you have). It’s just that ascended is faster/easier to get.

36 minutes ago, prototypedragon.1406 said:

Legendary  weapons had slightly higher stats

At start  leg weapons had stats equal to exo. When ascended was added, leg was upgraded to be equal to ascended.

Edited September 14, 2023 by Dayra.7405

[Bollocks.4078]

3 hours ago, Dayra.7405 said:

If you sell it, someone buys it, so he doesn't craft it -> sink is not working.

If you can only use or scrap (to research notes) or npc sell it, it doesn't help others to avoid the sink.

If they (currently) don't craft, it still leaves them as potential sink, if they buy instead, the sink is gone.

 

You're only considering one of many variables.  The person who buys ascended on TP might be someone who was never going to craft ascended themself.  Someone else who is already fully ascended on all their chars and has no need to craft account bound ascended might want to craft sellable ascended.  If it were sellable on TP then wouldn't that create an incentive for other people to craft it just to sell it?  We'll never know for sure unless ANET actually makes it sellable.  I seriously doubt they will ever do that.  For the record, I don't think there's any need to make ascended tradable.

[ugrakarma.9416]

3 minutes ago, Bollocks.4078 said:

 I seriously doubt they will ever do that.  For the record, I don't think there's any need to make ascended tradable.

yeah, ppl are trying creating a 'solution' for a problem that didn't exists.

[Dayra.7405]

3 minutes ago, Bollocks.4078 said:

Someone else who is already fully ascended on all their chars and has no need to craft account bound ascended might want to craft sellable ascended. 

I don't think this will ever profitable. 

- The price of ascended will drop fast

- crafting is already only the fastest, but not the cheapest way to get ascended.

[Bollocks.4078]

8 hours ago, ugrakarma.9416 said:

last time i salvaged 15 pieces of armor, i got 500g in profit.

What exactly did you get from ascended armor salvage that netted you 500g?  The 300g Salvaged Excellence only comes form ascended amulets.  The chances of getting Salvaged Excellence from salvaging amulets is astronomically low.  You could salvage hundreds of amulets and not even get one.

[kharmin.7683]

4 minutes ago, ugrakarma.9416 said:

yeah, ppl are trying creating a 'solution' for a problem that didn't exists.

No, they're looking for a cheap/easy way to make more gold.

[Dayra.7405]

4 minutes ago, Bollocks.4078 said:

What exactly did you get from ascended armor salvage that netted you 500g?  The 300g Salvaged Excellence only comes form ascended amulets.  The chances of getting Salvaged Excellence from salvaging amulets is astronomically low.  You could salvage hundreds of amulets and not even get one.

Maybe research notes, ca 250 per ascended armor/weapon.

Since I've leggy armor, I turn all my ascended armor (new drops and old worn ones) into research notes.

Edited September 14, 2023 by Dayra.7405

[Obtena.7952]

I love the way the proponents ignore the fact that there ARE reasons Anet hasn't made Ascended gear sellable. The fact that players don't regurgitate those reasons to you is not a justification to enable selling Ascended gear. 

Make no mistake, the selling of Ascended gear isn't justified because proponents think they win an argument. That's nonsense. Somehow they have forgot that have to justify that change themselves CONSIDERING it's not the intent of how the items are available in the first place. 

Edited September 14, 2023 by Obtena.7952

[Sobx.1758]

9 hours ago, Gotejjeken.1267 said:

The counter arguments in this topic are 🤣.

You can sell Gen 1 and Gen 3 legendary items on the TP.

As much as I'd rather have legendaries be untradable, there's no way to drop them as whole items and nobody will sell you leggies at the cost -let alone below it- of the mats required to craft them. Meanwhile ascended gear drops in what looks like a substantial number which means crafted items will get undercut easly. You know... exactly like the named exotic gear is priced WAY below the crafted exotic gear. OP won't be making $$ for crafting and selling ascended the same way he's not doing it with exotics.
So despite your claims about "counterarguments in this topic being 🤣", there's still no valid argument to make this change in the first place.

Edited September 14, 2023 by Sobx.1758

[MithranArkanere.8957]

Ascended gear is mostly a sink. The extra stats are not completely negligible, but they are only just higher enough to still entice people to get it to max their stats while not increasing the stats too much. 
Making it tradeable would eliminate the sink.  That would be bad for any ascended gear other than the gear that is RNG-only like tequatl hoards, which are rare enough that they would not damage the sink too much. 
But even for the RNG-only ones it would still be better if the related bosses dropped unique consumable tokens (like the casino coins) that do not go into the wallet or material storage, and then trade them at a vendor near the boss alongside grandmaster marks after completing the meta enough times without ever getting one of those drops. 
Then once all the items in the vendor have been obtained, you would just consume the tokens for karma or exp. Or maybe the vendor could have something else worth getting, like a novelty, guild decorations, fishing baits, or some foods and utilities.

If anything we could use a way to get cheaper Ascended kits.  Like replacing one of the pointless newbie trap items in the vault with 2 packs of 20-use ascended salvage kits for 100 AA each.

[Gotejjeken.1267]

8 hours ago, Dayra.7405 said:

Hehe no 😀 but material sinks should not be tradable, they would stop working if they are.

Legendary items are a much bigger sink thank ascended, and as mentioned before both Gen 1 and 3 weapons are tradeable, with select Gen 1's additionally being offered in the Wizard Vault (about 60% completed).  

Example used earlier was Bifrost, which is still 1.5k sell price on the TP.  It had been 2k forever and tradeable forever, it was only when Wizard Vault practically made it 60% complete for doing noting it lost 500g in value.

So here it would seem making ascended easier to acquire ruins their value (i.e., adding them also to Wizard Vault), not making them tradeable--because otherwise market prices will ensure they aren't worthless just like with legendary. 

[Obtena.7952]

42 minutes ago, Gotejjeken.1267 said:

Legendary items are a much bigger sink thank ascended, and as mentioned before both Gen 1 and 3 weapons are tradeable, with select Gen 1's additionally being offered in the Wizard Vault (about 60% completed).  

Example used earlier was Bifrost, which is still 1.5k sell price on the TP.  It had been 2k forever and tradeable forever, it was only when Wizard Vault practically made it 60% complete for doing noting it lost 500g in value.

So here it would seem making ascended easier to acquire ruins their value (i.e., adding them also to Wizard Vault), not making them tradeable--because otherwise market prices will ensure they aren't worthless just like with legendary. 

I don't think it's a stretch to think that the decision to make Ascended armor tradeable or not is more than just the value of the materials that go into it. If we consider the time and material investment necessary to level up crafting AND then to craft Ascended gear, then the status quo starts making much more sense if people understand the non-sellable nature of the Ascended gear in the first place. 

The bottomline: Obviously Anet wants people to have some heavy engagement with the game systems they created for obtaining Ascended gear. That doesn't make Leg 1 and 3 weapons examples of exceptions to that intent either because for the most part, players need to be heavily engaged to be able to afford those weapons if they choose to buy vs. craft them. 

But here is the alternative if people want to have some absurd justification based on 'it's easy to get' to make it sellable: if people want to argue Ascended gear should be sellable because "Leg1/3 weapons" or 'easy to get", then sure, up the materials requirements for crafted Ascended gear to the SAME LEVEL of those weapons ... then flip the 'sellable' flag because there is no way that the intention the reasons to make Ascended unsellable have somehow been invalidated by WV implementation. 

Edited September 14, 2023 by Obtena.7952

[Schimmi.6872]

39 minutes ago, Gotejjeken.1267 said:

Legendary items are a much bigger sink thank ascended, and as mentioned before both Gen 1 and 3 weapons are tradeable, with select Gen 1's additionally being offered in the Wizard Vault (about 60% completed).  

Example used earlier was Bifrost, which is still 1.5k sell price on the TP.  It had been 2k forever and tradeable forever, it was only when Wizard Vault practically made it 60% complete for doing noting it lost 500g in value.

So here it would seem making ascended easier to acquire ruins their value (i.e., adding them also to Wizard Vault), not making them tradeable--because otherwise market prices will ensure they aren't worthless just like with legendary. 

The difference is that ascended items can drop from many sources and the legendaries currently only can be crafted and so all the tradeable ones still worked as material- and timesinks. If you want to compare it with lengendaries, look at the precursor crafting, it will end much worse than that.

[Sobx.1758]

1 hour ago, Gotejjeken.1267 said:

Legendary items are a much bigger sink thank ascended, and as mentioned before both Gen 1 and 3 weapons are tradeable, with select Gen 1's additionally being offered in the Wizard Vault (about 60% completed).  

Example used earlier was Bifrost, which is still 1.5k sell price on the TP.  It had been 2k forever and tradeable forever, it was only when Wizard Vault practically made it 60% complete for doing noting it lost 500g in value.

So here it would seem making ascended easier to acquire ruins their value (i.e., adding them also to Wizard Vault), not making them tradeable--because otherwise market prices will ensure they aren't worthless just like with legendary. 

The problem with your comparison to legendaries was already explained two posts earlier:

4 hours ago, Sobx.1758 said:

(...) there's no way to drop them as whole items and nobody will sell you leggies at the cost -let alone below it- of the mats required to craft them. Meanwhile ascended gear drops in what looks like a substantial number which means crafted items will get undercut easly. You know... exactly like the named exotic gear is priced WAY below the crafted exotic gear. OP won't be making $$ for crafting and selling ascended the same way he's not doing it with exotics.
(...)

Edited September 14, 2023 by Sobx.1758

[Venomstrike.3704]

Why don't they add them to dungeons as well? Oh wait that's a forgotten part of the game and has been laid to rest. I can't speak for everyone but I miss that part of the game. It sure would be nice to be able to make some gold or mats off of doing runs.

[Linken.6345]

2 hours ago, Venomstrike.3704 said:

Why don't they add them to dungeons as well? Oh wait that's a forgotten part of the game and has been laid to rest. I can't speak for everyone but I miss that part of the game. It sure would be nice to be able to make some gold or mats off of doing runs.

Dungeons

• Added a universal access point for dungeons in Lion's Arch outside the Aerodrome, and moved the dungeon weapon and armor vendors to a location nearby.

Go make your gold and mats in one convenient place mate.

[Gotejjeken.1267]

3 hours ago, Sobx.1758 said:

The problem with your comparison to legendaries was already explained two posts earlier:

Right, which is why they need to take out a lot of ways to get ascended then make them sellable.

This will both reinforce prestige of ascended and give even more value to crafting / mat sinks.  

The problem is all the free ways to get ascended, not that it is craftable or could be sellable.