Make Gift of Battle avaliable in PvE

[Sawyer.4127]

37 minutes ago, Hesione.9412 said:

Yes, the most prestigious items in the game should require effort. The removal of effort means they are no longer prestigious.

It is not compulsory to have a legendary.

So just to clarify, effort in your book has to be something you don't want to do? Putting in the same amount of time, or even more time in an activity you enjoy doing would not qualify as effort?

I'm genuinely trying to understand the opposing viewpoint, not trying to be rude. I don't feel like not enjoying a certain game mode should automatically disqualify you from ever owning a legendary item.

I've done gift of battle for example a couple of times already and I've hated it every single time. To the point where I would rather just play the game the way I enjoy it, sell everything for gold and then just buy the legendary I want. And honestly I think that kind of defeats the point.

Whether I spend 200 hours crafting it via PvE only, or 150 hours PvE and 50 hours PvP/WvW, the result is the same and I don't understand why it matters which of the two it is. The only variable here is whether you want the person to be annoyed for a large part of the process. 

[QueenKeriti.5176]

Welcome to gaming where you have to do things you may not like to get things you want? Like literally every MMO (and other games) in existence? At least you don't have to do things you hate to get gear you're required to have to even play the game. (looking at you, Aion)

Legendaries were supposed to show how you have "mastered" the multiple gamemodes.

It's a Gift of BATTLE. That kind of implies that you'd BATTLE for it. GoB isn't that bad anymore. They increased the speed you fill reward tracks. You don't even have to do it all in one sitting. Pop one of the light blue celebration boosters that you probably have stacks of by now, grab the WvW track boost buff from a guild hall, grab the WvW track enrichment item for your easily PvE-obtained legendary amulet, and go do WvW for 20 mins or whatever then come back another day.

35 minutes ago, Sawyer.4127 said:

To the point where I would rather just play the game the way I enjoy it, sell everything for gold and then just buy the legendary I want.

So, you found a way to get the legendaries you want without doing things you hate! Awesome!

[Sawyer.4127]

2 minutes ago, QueenKeriti.5176 said:

Welcome to gaming where you have to do things you may not like to get things you want? Like literally every MMO (and other games) in existence? At least you don't have to do things you hate to get gear you're required to have to even play the game. (looking at you, Aion)

Legendaries were supposed to show how you have "mastered" the multiple gamemodes.

It's a Gift of BATTLE. That kind of implies that you'd BATTLE for it. GoB isn't that bad anymore. They increased the speed you fill reward tracks. You don't even have to do it all in one sitting. Pop one of the light blue celebration boosters that you probably have stacks of by now, grab the WvW track boost buff from a guild hall, grab the WvW track enrichment item for your easily PvE-obtained legendary amulet, and go do WvW for 20 mins or whatever then come back another day.

So, you found a way to get the legendaries you want without doing things you hate! Awesome!

So the argument here is that because everyone else does it, then it's okay? No reason to evolve into something people might enjoy more, when we can just keep it the same?

Also funny you should mention the word battle. I fought zero things besides npcs getting mine. I ran around in no man's land flipping tiny camps enough to stay at the max tickrate. And I know for a fact that's what many of the people who don't want to be there do. There's zero mastering of anything involved.

I'd argue there's more battle involved in telling people to go kill a bunch of this, and that, and so forth. Can make that as much of a grind as you'd like, but people would get to stay in the lane they enjoy to play. 

Limiting the legendary crafting system to the people that enjoy all the game modes, or the people that can be bothered to spend their time on something they don't enjoy over and over makes no sense.

If the time investment is the same regardless of what you're playing to earn it, then the only argument for not making that change is because you think they'd become less exclusive and therefore less valuable to sell. Which means that you know for a fact that game modes are stopping people who want to make legendaries from doing it. And I don't know why that seems right to anyone. 

 

 

 

[QueenKeriti.5176]

My dude, what do you think legendary armor is? You have to (presently) do gamemodes you may hate for it (and thus I have my raid armor), but that's part of what makes it "elite." And the upcoming armor will require you to do something absolutely butt for an unknown amount of hours, including map comp all the SoTO maps at least 6 times, and people are already complaining about that and saying they don't want to do that and want to just buy the legendary armor. Humans are silly, fickle creatures, and I am happy for them.

And no wonder you hated WvW if all you did was flip tiny camps by yourself for 8 hours. Anyone would hate that. You chose a really weird/painful way to grind something out, but who am I to judge at this point. 

I never said anything about being less valuable to sell. I don't sell legendaries, lmao. I don't buy them either. I got hooked on the process of making them, gamemodes and all, and even eventually made a full set of trinkets (including 2x Conflux), even though I swore I was never going to make them.

If Anet wanted to add another way to get GoB, awesome! I don't actually care. I'd think it was silly, but I don't actually care. If y'all want an "easier" way for it, Anet is going to make that "easy" way as unpleasant as humanly possible.

[soul.9651]

All i can say is that this thread is just pointless currently. The game has other way more severe problems. Rn priority should be FIXING THE BUGS ANET.... fixing the non existing balance anymore and doing something about the current powercreep. Not mentioning the need of more new content, since people are getting done with SoTo. 1or 2 people complaining about their "GoB bAd experience and let me tell you why..." doesnt matter in comparinson whats currently going on in other places of the game.. oh and speaking about other places.. still nothing has been done about certain "farmers" + 3 extra letters(since that word is forbidden in forums like a dam Voldemort's name in Harry Potter)

Edited September 20, 2023 by soul.9651

[Sawyer.4127]

2 minutes ago, QueenKeriti.5176 said:

My dude, what do you think legendary armor is? You have to (presently) do gamemodes you may hate for it (and thus I have my raid armor), but that's part of what makes it "elite." And the upcoming armor will require you to do something absolutely butt for an unknown amount of hours, including map comp all the SoTO maps at least 6 times, and people are already complaining about that and saying they don't want to do that and want to just buy the legendary armor. Humans are silly, fickle creatures, and I am happy for them.

And no wonder you hated WvW if all you did was flip tiny camps by yourself for 8 hours. Anyone would hate that. You chose a really weird/painful way to grind something out, but who am I to judge at this point. 

I never said anything about being less valuable to sell. I don't sell legendaries, lmao. I don't buy them either. I got hooked on the process of making them, gamemodes and all, and even eventually made a full set of trinkets (including 2x Conflux), even though I swore I was never going to make them.

If Anet wanted to add another way to get GoB, awesome! I don't actually care. I'd think it was silly, but I don't actually care. If y'all want an "easier" way for it, Anet is going to make that "easy" way as unpleasant as humanly possible.

This thread is solely about GoB, so I figured I'd keep it to that point. I do similarly feel that legendary armor should be fully achievable playing any one of the three modes or a combination of them for those that enjoy that.

And I chose to take that WvW approach because I really dislike PvP in this game. I don't understand it and I have no desire to. Basically I'm bad and I don't get why some classes do half your health with one ability or why necros feel like they have 47 health bars. Nor do I want to get specific gear or builds for something I don't intend to play. It is what it is and it's not something I'm interested in spending my time learning. 

I know full well from experience that anet loves to make things as miserable as possible to achieve and that's fine. I'm merely advocating for letting PvP people be PvP people and PvE people be PvE people, while the jack of all trades people can carry on as they are. It doesn't hurt anyone to have game modes be one less hurdle to the barrier of entry on legendaries.

It gets brought up a lot, so clearly there's at least a vocal minority that are tired of being sent into PvP and WvW, and from what I see PvP players hate map completions just as much.

So I don't understand why so many argue against letting those that do not enjoy those modes get them in other ways within the modes that they do enjoy playing.

[QueenKeriti.5176]

1 hour ago, soul.9651 said:

All i can say is that this thread is just pointless currently. The game has other way more severe problems. Rn priority should be FIXING THE BUGS ANET.... fixing the non existing balance anymore and doing something about the current powercreep. Not mentioning the need of more new content, since people are getting done with SoTo. 1or 2 people complaining about their "GoB bAd experience and let me tell you why..." doesnt matter in comparinson whats currently going on in other places of the game.. oh and speaking about other places.. still nothing has been done about certain "farmers" + 3 extra letters(since that word is forbidden in forums like a dam Voldemort's name in Harry Potter)

There's a "balance patch" next Tuesday. 😂

1 hour ago, Sawyer.4127 said:

And I chose to take that WvW approach because I really dislike PvP in this game. I don't understand it and I have no desire to. Basically I'm bad and I don't get why some classes do half your health with one ability or why necros feel like they have 47 health bars. Nor do I want to get specific gear or builds for something I don't intend to play. It is what it is and it's not something I'm interested in spending my time learning. 

 

I just run around as a tempest auramancer in a group and slap my keys and hope people don't die. 🙃I know nothing about proper counters and stuff. I just enjoy trying to keep people alive. 😂Some people make it...very difficult. 🫠I totally don't yell "GET YO BOOTY BACK HERE IF YOU WANT HEALS, SIR" irl when playing...

[Kruhljak.2705]

Simple (conceptually, not necessarily implementationally...not a programmer) solution:  all game modes should use the track system with tracks that lead to acquisition of items necessary for the nifty end game junk to be crafted.  In a rational world (caveat) this removes the whining from all sides because it presupposes that those who favor a certain game mode will have their preferences served equally.  Only the usual suspects will be left by the side of the road because they can't dictate to others how it must be done (i.e. the way they like doing it).  Tracks can be balanced for each mode based primarily on estimated time to complete for a typical player in that mode.  Optimizers can still optimize, lazy casuals who just mess around for a couple hours a week can do their thing, and the average peon can just continue doing what they like...just as it's already done anyway.  The thing that gets tossed aside?  The frustration and annoyance of being forced to engage in a game mode one has no interest in.  Want to spend 8 hours grinding for a GoB/GoE?  Go ahead.  Do your PvE thing and/or do your WvW thing and/or do your PvP thing...for an average player, it should require roughly the same amount of time investment, but that player gets to "play how they want to play" by choosing 100% how they arrive at the end point.

 

As a disclaimer, I do not advocate everything suffering a reductio ad absurdum approach as in "then why not just make logging a tree count the same as killing a bandit?"  There are sensible boundaries to this concept that fall outside the question of preferred game modes vis a vis acquisition of special items which is the core point of the topic.  Although, killing a bandit with an axe /is/ quite a bit like chopping down a tree....

 

Disclaimer #2: I'm not presuming this is 100% bulletproof, and that there aren't details I haven't considered (this is pretty much off the cuff, but something I've thought about before), but I'm far more interested in the functionality of the concept than I am about it bruising anyone's feelings.  The latter shouldn't even be worthy of consideration, but 'modern day' and all that.

Edited September 20, 2023 by Kruhljak.2705

[Hesione.9412]

3 hours ago, Sawyer.4127 said:

So just to clarify, effort in your book has to be something you don't want to do? Putting in the same amount of time, or even more time in an activity you enjoy doing would not qualify as effort?

I'm genuinely trying to understand the opposing viewpoint, not trying to be rude. I don't feel like not enjoying a certain game mode should automatically disqualify you from ever owning a legendary item.

I've done gift of battle for example a couple of times already and I've hated it every single time. To the point where I would rather just play the game the way I enjoy it, sell everything for gold and then just buy the legendary I want. And honestly I think that kind of defeats the point.

Whether I spend 200 hours crafting it via PvE only, or 150 hours PvE and 50 hours PvP/WvW, the result is the same and I don't understand why it matters which of the two it is. The only variable here is whether you want the person to be annoyed for a large part of the process. 

You know ahead of time what is required. The need to do WvW isn't sprung on any player as a surprise. You want something, you need to do the activities associated with getting that something. Again, legendaries are something that is optional - don't want to do the activities? Get ascended.

[TheNecrosanct.4028]

8 hours ago, Sawyer.4127 said:

It's so confusing to me how some of you have literally zero value for your time.

This isn't real life. This isn't a job. This is a video game. Video games are meant as entertainment. They are meant to be fun. And you somehow want to tell me that there's nothing wrong with forcing me to do something I don't want to do for hours on end, in order to achieve the most prestigious items in the game? I spend enough of my time doing things I don't want to during my work day, I don't need to do it here as well. I couldn't care less about PvP or WvW. They aren't fun game modes to me. Plenty of people enjoy them and all the power to them for that, but that's not me.

This requirement doesn't benefit anyone. I'm not actively participating in either of those communities because I'm forced to spend hours there. My being there doesn't help out the server, nor does it improve the experience for anyone else. What it does, is waste my time on something I didn't want to do in the first place. Nobody wins here. And somehow you all seem to think that's okay? Is this the classic "I had to suffer, so you have to suffer too" scenario, or what exactly is the reasoning here, because there is no logic to that ideology.

The same is the case for forcing the PvP/WvW communities into PvE - It's just pointless, arbitrary inflation of player numbers in less active game modes.

Working hard for something is fine, but being forced to do things that aren't fun because it's "prestiguous" is insane.

Any gift should have been earnable in any game mode from the start. Just make up a task of equal effort. Making people play something they do not enjoy is not, and should not be, considered effort.

 

Three questions.

1. Who is forcing you to make legendaries?

2. What makes you think you can decide what value time has for another person and, by extension, what benefits someone and what doesn't?

3. Why are you wasting your time on something you don't want to do in the first place?

[Ashen.2907]

4 hours ago, Sawyer.4127 said:

I would rather just play the game the way I enjoy it, sell everything for gold and then just buy the legendary I want

And since this option exists you are not forced into a game mode you dislike. ANet created a system that allows one to bypass the GOB requirement. 

[Fueki.4753]

18 hours ago, Sawyer.4127 said:

This is a video game. Video games are meant as entertainment. They are meant to be fun. And you somehow want to tell me that there's nothing wrong with forcing me to do something I don't want to do for hours on end, in order to achieve the most prestigious items in the game?

If you don't want to do WvW, just don't do it. Noone forces you to do it. Stop implying anyone would do just that. But don't expect to get its exclusive rewards.

You can have fun and entertainment in the game without making a legendary.

 

Edited September 20, 2023 by Fueki.4753

[Biziut.3594]

@Sawyer.4127 I am curious about something. You advocate for the ability to get every prestigious item, by doing only the things one enjoy. What if all I enjoy about this game is for example, roleplay or gathering and crafting or if I only enjoy Queensdale of all the maps gw2 have to offer. 

Where does it stop. If I enjoy only playing on Queensdale, and the game force me to go to other maps with metas and events I do not like. Should ANet let me get all prestigious items only on that single map? How prestigious this items would be if they did? What would be so prestigious about HT cm title if I could also get it from a champion bandit in Queensdale?

For now you can get an end-game equipment by literally doing dailies. Is there really a need to trivialize the prestigious items that one do not even require to play the game? 

[soul.9651]

3 hours ago, QueenKeriti.5176 said:

There's a "balance patch" next Tuesday. 😂

Why do i have a feeling they will do something random again and "accidentaly" make another 50k build besides scourge... or fractal bug fixes will happen after a good month or so..

[Jianyu.7065]

Why dance around the topic of just getting rid of pvp altogether and transferring those rewards to pve....

🤷‍♂️

[Sawyer.4127]

3 hours ago, Fueki.4753 said:

If you don't want to do WvW, just don't do it Noone forces you to do it. Stop implying anyone would do just that. But don't expect to get its exclusive rewards.

You can have fun and entertainment in the game without making a legendary.

 

I wish any of you would make an actual argument for why you think it should be this way instead of just going "If you don't want to play WvW, don't have a legendary".

Again, please clarify to me why you think that should be a thing? Is it just entertaining to you for others to suffer in a video game they're supposed to enjoy? What pleasure do you get from preventing people from getting the best items in the game? What part of letting someone spend 5 hours in PvE instead of 5 hours in WvW hurts your experience with the game? Why does the idea of that upset you?

3 hours ago, Biziut.3594 said:

@Sawyer.4127 I am curious about something. You advocate for the ability to get every prestigious item, by doing only the things one enjoy. What if all I enjoy about this game is for example, roleplay or gathering and crafting or if I only enjoy Queensdale of all the maps gw2 have to offer. 

Where does it stop. If I enjoy only playing on Queensdale, and the game force me to go to other maps with metas and events I do not like. Should ANet let me get all prestigious items only on that single map? How prestigious this items would be if they did? What would be so prestigious about HT cm title if I could also get it from a champion bandit in Queensdale?

For now you can get an end-game equipment by literally doing dailies. Is there really a need to trivialize the prestigious items that one do not even require to play the game? 

This is just silly. Clearly this argument has always been limited to gamemodes and nothing specific within them. Plenty of things I don't like to do in PvE, but I'd still rather do those over spending hours in PvP.

The fact that a starter kit exists in the vault trivializes it? It has the option for 4 10+ year old legendaries so people have the option of getting ONE slightly easier than would otherwise be possible. There's 17 weapon types in this game, as well as armor. It does not and should not matter to you if it exists. 

4 hours ago, TheNecrosanct.4028 said:

Three questions.

1. Who is forcing you to make legendaries?

2. What makes you think you can decide what value time has for another person and, by extension, what benefits someone and what doesn't?

3. Why are you wasting your time on something you don't want to do in the first place?

1. I like some of the legendaries, I like the convenience that comes with them. And despite popular belief, I'm quite entitled to want to make one and still not want to play PvP/WvW.

2. I'm happy that the people going "No", with zero context or argument as to why, seem to enjoy their time getting legendaries as is. But plenty of people bring up this discussion, so clearly there's also a bunch that don't. And in the same vein, why do those people get to decide what that I should be spending my time doing stuff I don't want to, just because they enjoy it? Especially given any of the proposed options for change wouldn't make their experience any different. 

3. Because one of the biggest end game systems currently forces you to. It's fairly normal I would say to want to take part in the best gear in the game, but that doesn't mean I can't have problems with the process.

PvP and PvE are fundamentally different types of gameplay and while you can enjoy both, many also don't. And I really don't see what you are gaining by having people spend hours in game modes they don't enjoy playing. What are you wanting to force that for? Do you really want people in PvP/WvW that don't want to be there? I feel like that's more harmful to those gamemodes than anything because they'll always try for the easiest way to get out of there as quickly as they can.

So if someone wants to spend an equivalent amount of time doing something else, kill a trillion PvE mobs for example, why is that a problem? The time spent is the same. The impact on your experience is the same. What's the downside exactly? Are we trying to keep the image of prestige on something you can literally spend $100 and go buy on the trading post (Gen 2 and armor aside).

And before I get more comments saying buying them on the trading post is the solution for people like me, I want to ask this. Do you want people to play the game, or don't you? Because those are conflicting arguments. 

I'd love to earn my own legendaries, and I have already and I do enjoy majority of the process behind it. Nobody is asking for "easy" or "faster". Quite the opposite actually. I'll take harder and slower if it means I can continue to play the game mode I enjoy. And honestly if that's not good enough, then I feel like you're just looking to make people miserable. And for what? 

Just because something can be used in every game mode doesn't mean it will be. Just because I just play PvE doesn't mean I'm going to sit here and say "Haha PvP player go do map completion because that's how the system was made". No, I'd love it if they had a way to get gift of exploration doing just PvP. I don't understand the concept of actively trying to make the experience less enjoyable for others. You can have both without trivializing it or making it "easy".

[Fueki.4753]

21 minutes ago, Sawyer.4127 said:

Again, please clarify to me why you think that should be a thing?

It's obviously, because a legendary should require playing multiple game modes, not just PvE. It's not hard to understand

It's already bad enough that Gen 1 and Gen 3 legendary weapons can simply be bought from PvE money. We don't need to have the process of crafting the legendary weapons be reduced to PvE-only as well.

If you simply can't be bothered to even do WvW for as little as 4-5 hours, just use ascended weapons. They have the same attributes.

Edited September 20, 2023 by Fueki.4753

[TheNecrosanct.4028]

23 minutes ago, Sawyer.4127 said:

1. I like some of the legendaries, I like the convenience that comes with them. And despite popular belief, I'm quite entitled to want to make one and still not want to play PvP/WvW.

No, you're not entitled to want to make one without playing WvW (you don't even need to play PvP since all you need is Shards of Glory and you can buy those on the TP dirt cheap). ANet made it so WvW is required to make a legendary. What makes you so special that you are allowed to circumvent WvW? The only thing you're entitled to is playing the game, and that's because you paid for it. Anything and everything in the game is up to the player themselves.

23 minutes ago, Sawyer.4127 said:

2. I'm happy that the people going "No", with zero context or argument as to why, seem to enjoy their time getting legendaries as is. But plenty of people bring up this discussion, so clearly there's also a bunch that don't. And in the same vein, why do those people get to decide what that I should be spending my time doing stuff I don't want to, just because they enjoy it? Especially given any of the proposed options for change wouldn't make their experience any different.

Players don't decide what you're spending your time on. Only you do. ANet decided when they made GW2 that WvW is required for the acquisition of legendaries. Nothing and nobody forces you to make legendaries. It's only you doing this to yourself.

23 minutes ago, Sawyer.4127 said:

3. Because one of the biggest end game systems currently forces you to. It's fairly normal I would say to want to take part in the best gear in the game, but that doesn't mean I can't have problems with the process.

Nothing in this game forces you to have legendaries. Ascended gear has the exact same stats as legendary gear. The only thing that legendary gear adds is free stat change, free infusion/upgrade change and the opportunity to equip it across all characters on your account. I've literally never seen anyone in game demand people have legendary gear. So that's a perception fault on your part. Legendary gear is purely for convenience, and a nice skin if that's what you're going for.

People playing WvW who actually don't want to aren't damaging to WvW or inconveniencing to other WvW players. And even if it does, it's a MMO. You can't keep everyone happy all the time. The game mode has survived 11 years of people acquiring GoB's in WvW and it will survive another 11 years. It's also not nearly as prestigious as it used to be when the game was new. Besides, something is only prestigious if people award it that prestige, making it a subjective thing.

How is buying legendaries off the TP not playing the game? Plenty of people play to save gold to then buy legendaries. Not everybody gets out their credit card and pays for gold with real money. In fact, I'm willing to bet my 10k gold it's just a very small minority of players who do that. Buying them from the TP is also earning your own legendaries. If that doesn't count for you then again, that's on you. Your perspective and nothing else. And apparently that perspective creates obstacles you don't like. You've been presented plenty of alternative perspectives in this thread and have had some of your misconceptions corrected, but you still do not want to let go of those misconceptions, it seems. 

You'd love it if PvP players could get the Gift of Exploration in PvP? Then tell me, what exploration have they done in PvP? I'll tell you: none. There is no exploration in PvP so a Gift of Exploration through PvP would make no sense. WvW is focused on battling servers, so it's a fitting mode for the Gift of Battle. They've even made it faster to acquire now, thereby limiting the time you need to spend in WvW.

It's basically a bottom line thing: how much do you want legendaries and/or how much do you not want to play WvW? The answers to those questions will tell you what's best for you. One thing is true, though: nobody needs legendaries to play any content in GW2.

P.S.: the answer to your question of why legendaries require items from WvW and PvP is because ANet decided it was going to be that way. Legendary gear was supposed to require participation in all game modes. If there's anything that doesn't make sense in this whole process it is that PvP can be completely circumvented.

Edited September 20, 2023 by TheNecrosanct.4028

[Sawyer.4127]

1 minute ago, Fueki.4753 said:

It's obviously, because a legendary should require playing multiple game modes, not just PvE. It's not hard to understand

It's already bad enough that Gen 1 and Gen 3 legendary weapons can simply be bought from PvE money. We don't need to have the process of crafting the legendary weapons be reduced to PvE-only as well.

It's actually very hard to understand - Why do you think it should? I don't have plans to use my legendaries in those modes, so why require me to play them?

So you're against PvE only things? I very clearly asked that they be earnable in any mode. So PvP only would work as well. But you only seem to take issue with the PvE part?

[TheNecrosanct.4028]

1 minute ago, Sawyer.4127 said:

It's actually very hard to understand - Why do you think it should? I don't have plans to use my legendaries in those modes, so why require me to play them?

So you're against PvE only things? I very clearly asked that they be earnable in any mode. So PvP only would work as well. But you only seem to take issue with the PvE part?

Legendary armor can be acquired solely through PvE. PvE players actually have it easy. The time they need to spend in WvW to acquire a GoB is a lot less than the time it takes to earn a GoE. And that isn't the only PvE thing they need (depending on which generation of legendary they are making).

Also, you should stop asking people why they think WvW should be required. That question is better aimed at ANet, since they created this process in the first place. The PvE players who do participate in WvW for GoB's are simply the ones who have decided for themselves that the reward is worth the time and effort spent. Clearly you're leaning in the opposite direction. That doesn't mean we are the problem, though, as much as you want to make it seem that way.

[Fueki.4753]

3 minutes ago, Sawyer.4127 said:

Why do you think it should?

It's because you want something. And if you want something, you should put in the effort that developers deem required for it.

In the case of legendary weapons, Arenanet objectively deemed it a requirement to play multiple game modes.

But if you can't be bothered to do that, you can always just buy one from the Trading Post.

[Biziut.3594]

3 minutes ago, Sawyer.4127 said:

I wish any of you would make an actual argument for why you think it should be this way instead of just going "If you don't want to play WvW, don't have a legendary".

Again, please clarify to me why you think that should be a thing? Is it just entertaining to you for others to suffer in a video game they're supposed to enjoy? What pleasure do you get from preventing people from getting the best items in the game? What part of letting someone spend 5 hours in PvE instead of 5 hours in WvW hurts your experience with the game? Why does the idea of that upset you?

This is just silly. Clearly this argument has always been limited to gamemodes and nothing specific within them. Plenty of things I don't like to do in PvE, but I'd still rather do those over spending hours in PvP.

The fact that a starter kit exists in the vault trivializes it? It has the option for 4 10+ year old legendaries so people have the option of getting ONE slightly easier than would otherwise be possible. There's 17 weapon types in this game, as well as armor. It does not and should not matter to you if it exists. 

1. I like some of the legendaries, I like the convenience that comes with them. And despite popular belief, I'm quite entitled to want to make one and still not want to play PvP/WvW.

2. I'm happy that the people going "No", with zero context or argument as to why, seem to enjoy their time getting legendaries as is. But plenty of people bring up this discussion, so clearly there's also a bunch that don't. And in the same vein, why do those people get to decide what that I should be spending my time doing stuff I don't want to, just because they enjoy it? Especially given any of the proposed options for change wouldn't make their experience any different. 

3. Because one of the biggest end game systems currently forces you to. It's fairly normal I would say to want to take part in the best gear in the game, but that doesn't mean I can't have problems with the process.

PvP and PvE are fundamentally different types of gameplay and while you can enjoy both, many also don't. And I really don't see what you are gaining by having people spend hours in game modes they don't enjoy playing. What are you wanting to force that for? Do you really want people in PvP/WvW that don't want to be there? I feel like that's more harmful to those gamemodes than anything because they'll always try for the easiest way to get out of there as quickly as they can.

So if someone wants to spend an equivalent amount of time doing something else, kill a trillion PvE mobs for example, why is that a problem? The time spent is the same. The impact on your experience is the same. What's the downside exactly? Are we trying to keep the image of prestige on something you can literally spend $100 and go buy on the trading post (Gen 2 and armor aside).

And before I get more comments saying buying them on the trading post is the solution for people like me, I want to ask this. Do you want people to play the game, or don't you? Because those are conflicting arguments. 

I'd love to earn my own legendaries, and I have already and I do enjoy majority of the process behind it. Nobody is asking for "easy" or "faster". Quite the opposite actually. I'll take harder and slower if it means I can continue to play the game mode I enjoy. And honestly if that's not good enough, then I feel like you're just looking to make people miserable. And for what? 

Just because something can be used in every game mode doesn't mean it will be. Just because I just play PvE doesn't mean I'm going to sit here and say "Haha PvP player go do map completion because that's how the system was made". No, I'd love it if they had a way to get gift of exploration doing just PvP. I don't understand the concept of actively trying to make the experience less enjoyable for others. You can have both without trivializing it or making it "easy".

There are many points of view. Just becouse you do not agree with them, it does not make them less valid. Ascended items are equal to the Legendary ones stat wise. There is no content in game that requires You to have legendary equipment. You can get Ascended by playing a single gamemode.

As some ppls already said. Legendary requires You to show mastery over the whole game. (Yeah in theory, since some weapons are tradeable and GoB you can get by just flipping camps). But still, this is what they are meant to be.

If you want skon from certain achivment, you do this achivment, if you want skin from raids, you do raids, if you want skin from fractals, you do fractals, and same goes for WvW, PvP, ect. And Legendary equipment is by all means nor diffrent. If you want something, You do what is required of You to get it.

Other thing is the fact that Your needs are not the only ones. When I play a game, I have a need for exciting, challanging adventure with the awesome reward at the end that I can be proud of and show off. If someone get said reward for putting less effort than me, (Becouse boo hoo I don't like the content) than sorry, but you do not deserve it in my opinion. Becouse it will trivilize the effort I have put into getting where I am. Especially that, once again, it is by all means not required for you to play any of the game content. It is not restricting you from anything. It is only a vanity item.

So to summarise. If you want the shiny? Do what is required to get it. You dont like doing what is required? You are perfectly fine not to, it won't restrict you from playing any content in the game you enjoy. Regards.

 

[Dayra.7405]

How about an NPC that trade:

• 10 GoE & 200g -> 1 GoB
• 10 GoB & 200g -> 1 GoE

Then GoB is finally available via PvE and we can stop these threads, but it has it's price 🙂

Edited September 20, 2023 by Dayra.7405

[Linken.6345]

13 minutes ago, Sawyer.4127 said:

It's actually very hard to understand - Why do you think it should? I don't have plans to use my legendaries in those modes, so why require me to play them?

So you're against PvE only things? I very clearly asked that they be earnable in any mode. So PvP only would work as well. But you only seem to take issue with the PvE part?

I think you should be happy world completion dont need the 4 wvw maps like it did at relesae bud and go get your easy to aquire gift of battle.

[Fueki.4753]

16 minutes ago, Dayra.7405 said:

How about an NPC that trade

How about people just go and do the required content, if they want their shiny?

18 minutes ago, Dayra.7405 said:

but it has it's price

Even if your price was multiplied by 20, it'd not be enough to pay for their sheer unwillingness to play a bit of WvW.