will anet add lf Q

[Cuks.8241]

12 minutes ago, Puck.3697 said:

Because WoW and ffxiv both auto groyp will litterally not allow 5 dps to be matched, a tank and healer role is absolutely enforced. 

This was not the case when these systems were first introduced in wow and it worked fine. Picking role was on players.

[Killthehealersffs.8940]

1 hour ago, Puck.3697 said:

Players don't demand queue because they fill roles and can play their class dynamically, players demand queues to remove the control from players to allow engagement under their own terms. 

 

The game has no roles, whjch means its impossible for a system to divide up builds to create a group comp. Which means the player has to do it, auto queueing would remove that dynamic while not repairing the first. 

 

I'd love to see ffxiv raids even ones with a auto group finder to be cleared without a tank lmfao, I'd love to see even their dungeons done with strictly only dps. Same with WoW. 

 

 

 

All these 2 statements are true.

People want a system that other cannot control it .

And the game don't need a specific roles to complete .

 

I propose the devs for the next year to play a game with the instanced community .

The rules are simply: do what raiders believe will be best for their mode to increase participation and between each request take a a 3 months break.

 

They will ask :

A)you cannot push the Join button if you don't have 500li

B) increased gold

C) skins

D) more gold

Edit: E) condence all dungeons raids strikes lfg

 

If the skin is ungly and they say that it's not worth it , put it in WvW and if that period people flock it , make a blogpost about it , for some salt + congrats you spent the whole 1,5 year using programing resources

Edit: And we will witness the ingenuity of them .

Give them the spotlight old gg for the next year, and either they will succeed or create a Wildstar scenario , while we fix pvp if they don't ask for help

Edited October 24, 2023 by Killthehealersffs.8940

[Zohane.7208]

4 hours ago, TheNurgle.4825 said:

What are those special roles for all normal strikes, dungeons, fractals and DRMs if you do not count healer, alac/quick provider and dps? Also in majority of games you can have "wrong" builds or bad players doing minimum dmg and that is not issue of auto LFG tool to fix. Auto LFG tool automate creating groups that's it.

Btw I played several games where they added auto LFG system in game and overal quality of groups went down at first due to influx of new players which never did instanced content. Later you had bigger pool of players actually doing instanced content.

Even when you narrow it down to the non-raid/non-CMstrike content, you're still faced with the fact that healers come in 2 main flavors, quick/heal or alac/heal and booners also come in 2 flavors, quick/dps or alac/dps. You have to match those such that a quick/heal gets together with an alac/dps and vice versa. Might not be "special role" but it's still a combo the players have defined, which automatically puts it out of the scope of any automated system Anet might be able to build.
There are also some special roles used mainly in fractal farming, but let's leave those aside for now 🙂

 

Edited October 24, 2023 by Zohane.7208

[Sobx.1758]

24 minutes ago, Cuks.8241 said:

For me personally.

I wouldn't need to port to hub.

Said who? If anet wanted these ports to be world-wide, they'd already do it that way instead of limiting them to the hubs. Why do you think they'd change that just because you join a squad in a slightly different manner? You might as well demand that anet introduces the same pop-up we currently have to appear in any map you're in, the very moment someone opens the instance. And yet, we still need to be in specific player hubs (which for me isn't a problem at all, even moreso when we have direct portal scrolls to them)

24 minutes ago, Cuks.8241 said:

I usually wait in hub until group is full so I don't make others wait.

The only reason you're doing this is because you chose to. If I want to do something else, I don't wait in hubs and nobody ever cared or mentioned anything about it. If I sit in the hubs, it means I don't want to do anything else anyways. So... I'm not sure that's any point at all, let alone remotely solid one. You simply choose to sit in a hub so... sitting in a hub is bad? I don't think so. 

24 minutes ago, Cuks.8241 said:

After the instance I need to move back to where I was playing.

You literally just said you're sitting in a hub anyways. What if you're in the middle of [whatever activity] when the queue pops up and you need/want to finish it anyways? Now you're making the players wait or break your own progress all the same.

24 minutes ago, Cuks.8241 said:

There is a thread in "helping players" forums. A new guy asking how to enter fractals. Look it up if you're interested. A nice insight in how this game needlessly complicates grouping. There are full several step guides for something that should take 2 clicks and should be intuitive to a 4 year old.

If you actually read that thread, you'll notice how nothing in this situation would be changed with the lfg revamp, because he simply entered the fractal instance (hub?) alone before joining a group.

 

 

15 minutes ago, Killthehealersffs.8940 said:

All these 2 statements are true.

People want a system that other cannot control it .

And the game don't need a specific roles to complete .

Then make your own "all welcome" group and nobody will be controling anything nor you'll have any specific roles assigned. Not sure why you're still not doing it when you constantly keep claiming that's what you want 🤔

Edited October 24, 2023 by Sobx.1758

[Cuks.8241]

5 minutes ago, Zohane.7208 said:

Even when you narrow it down to the non-raid/non-CMstrike content, you're still faced with the fact that healers come in 2 main flavors, quick/heal or alac/heal and booners also come in 2 flavors, quick/dps or alac/dps. You have to match those such that a quick/heal gets together with an alac/dps and vice versa. Might not be "special role" but it's still a combo the players have defined, which automatically puts it out of the scope of any automated system Anet might be able to build.
There are also some special roles used mainly in fractal farming, but let's leave those aside for now 🙂

 

No you don't need to match it. You for sure don't need to match player made constructs and limitation for content without enrage timers. Actually it would be better for the game if they completely disregarded those limitations.

If there is one funny thing in this community is how players min/max content without requirements or requirements that are like 20% of the ceiling. If all the dps checks from different games went to school together, gw2 dps checks would be the weak short guy every other dps check would laugh at and picked on.

Also talking about non raid non CM content. But thats not narrowing down. Thats the majority of instanced content in this game.

[Cuks.8241]

6 minutes ago, Sobx.1758 said:

Said who? If anet wanted these ports to be world-wide, they'd already do it that way instead of limiting them to the hubs. Why do you think they'd change that just because you join a squad in a slightly different manner? You might as well demand that anet introduces the same pop-up we currently have to appear in any map you're in, the very moment someone opens the instance. And yet, we still need to be in specific player hubs (which for me isn't a problem at all, even moreso when we have direct portal scrolls to them)

The only reason you're doing this is because you chose to. If I want to do something else, I don't wait in hubs and nobody ever cared or mentioned anything about it. If I sit in the hubs, it means I don't want to do anything else anyways. So... I'm not sure that's any point at all, let alone remotely solid one. You simply choose to sit in a hub so... sitting in a hub is bad? I don't think so. 

You literally just said you're sitting in a hub anyways. What if you're in the middle of [whatever activity] when the queue pops up and you need/want to finish it anyways? Now you're making the players wait or break your own progress all the same.

If you actually read that thread, you'll notice how nothing in this situation would be changed with the lfg revamp, because he simply entered the fractal instance (hub?) alone before joining a group.

I agree most systems could be implemented in LFG. I wrote that in the post but you didnt quote it.

Yes like I wrote, because I choose not to waste other's time because I don't like other's to waste mine. You choose to waste it, that's OK, its how it's designed. This could be almost completely avoided with good system (yes it could be LFG).

Well with spvp I dont need to be in a hub. I do activities in between. I can just click and forget completely about it while I play something else. Yes I could waste others time but thats limited by the timer. And most of the time I dont waste any time at all because I can join game even in combat and I will be at the exact spot where I left the second I'm done.

Well my opinion is that all the grouping tools and lobbies and systems in gw2 are over designed, needlessly complicated. Something that most games are going away from to a single point of interaction UI that completely streamlines it. And for some reason they really like to waste design time on new systems that are usually just worse to what we had in the past (e.g., DRM private party which is atrocity, designed by their janitor I'm guessing). 

[Zohane.7208]

28 minutes ago, Cuks.8241 said:

No you don't need to match it. You for sure don't need to match player made constructs and limitation for content without enrage timers. Actually it would be better for the game if they completely disregarded those limitations.

If there is one funny thing in this community is how players min/max content without requirements or requirements that are like 20% of the ceiling. If all the dps checks from different games went to school together, gw2 dps checks would be the weak short guy every other dps check would laugh at and picked on.

Also talking about non raid non CM content. But thats not narrowing down. Thats the majority of instanced content in this game.

The community seems to want to have thisheal/boon combo in most instanced content, so I disagree with your statement here. If it should be a pre-req for auto-lfg to disregard the community's wishes for teambuilds then it's highly likely that the auto-lfg wouldn't be much used.

(I'm not arguing whether or not the team building block of heal/boon/3xdps is needed or not, I'm simply noting that this is what the community as a whole seems to want.)

 

Also, the narrowing I referred to was TheNurgle's - previously they have discussed team building as a whole, and that was met with a number of specialty roles in raids and CM strikes. Not they try by narrowing the proposition down to instanced group content except those.

[Cuks.8241]

1 minute ago, Zohane.7208 said:

The community seems to want to have thisheal/boon combo in most instanced content, so I disagree with your statement here. If it should be a pre-req for auto-lfg to disregard the community's wishes for teambuilds then it's highly likely that the auto-lfg wouldn't be much used.

(I'm not arguing whether or not the team building block of heal/boon/3xdps is needed or not, I'm simply noting that this is what the community as a whole seems to want.)

 

Also, the narrowing I referred to was TheNurgle's - previously they have discussed team building as a whole, and that was met with a number of specialty roles in raids and CM strikes. Not they try by narrowing the proposition down to instanced group content except those.

It's hard to say what the community really wants and how representative the LFG pug community really is of the overall interested crowd. I went through this in wow which in my opinion has a much more toxic and demanding community. And you have all the tools you want to really nit pick other players. I'm talking about the introduction of LFD for dungeons and heroic dungeons which is imo equivalent to what most games implement queue systems for and what would be comparable to gw2 non raid/cm content.

The wow community had a ton of player constructed hurdles for this mostly trivial content. From ilvl/gear score to preconception about classes... Yeah not everyone was like that and not everyone is like that in gw2. It was especially hard for pug dps players because like in most games there's a ton of "hi dps" players. I was like that, mostly playing tank and was quite trigger happy about dps players, because I could be. We had much the same discussion like these before the LFD introduction. And then LFD came and no one cared about those constructs because in the end its trivial content. And I think most were just happy that they didn't need to go through the whole manual process for trivial content. And if they really wanted to min/max that content, they constructed their own group like before and all was fine. I think most agree LFD is a good addition (LFR is a different story).

Now start a new game that already have such system. You go into a game, you queue, you finish content, you happy, everyone GG. You will start min maxing at some point but at the point that matters because content requires it. You start with that nonsense at entry lvl dungeons, everyone will probably tell you to stop being a kitten and go play some real content that actually requires it.

[Puck.3697]

1 hour ago, Cuks.8241 said:

This was not the case when these systems were first introduced in wow and it worked fine. Picking role was on players

But thats incorrect, uve never had tank rogues, uve never had healing rogues, either.

In WoW strict classes played specific roles. Until later on when speccs got further balanced out, but even then tank classes and healer classes were specific. 

But let's say in a world your right. 

Picking roles was on tbe players was fine, so this only worked because players had to make the group? Yah. 

The moment RDF happened trinity was enforced?. Even by ur own logic WoW had to completely destroy their prior system to make auto queue work lol. 

Even by ur own argument here, ur saying WoW couldnt hold its prior concepts when they took the control of group comps out the players hands.

But no dude. 

In classic if u played warrior it didn't matter the specc u were a tank. 

If u were a rogue it didn't matter the specc u were a rogue. 

WoW always had a trinity system, it didn't have todays icons to establish it. But blizzard stated they were tanks. They stated the trinity. It was brought with the concept specific classes tank specific classes dps and specific classes heal. 

Gw2 is built with the concept any class can be anything. U can change ur entire kit, from abilities to utilities entirely to fit roles. WoW was never that. A rogue was never gonna be tanky enough to be a tank. A mage regardless of how much spirit stacked couldnt heal

Where here they can. If u wanna be a healing mesmer u can. Wanna tank sure. In gw2 ur roles down to ur characters stats, and abilities chosen. Not class not specc, theres no defining point of the character itself that establishs a role. 

 

Edited October 24, 2023 by Puck.3697

[Jedrik.3109]

2 hours ago, IndigoSundown.5419 said:

Parity, viability or acceptance?  The only way to accomplish parity would be to remove builds and gear and simplify rotations to the point that messing up doesn't mean much.  Viability?  We have that to some degree.  Acceptance? Good luck changing human nature.

WHOOOOOOOSH! 

[Sobx.1758]

2 hours ago, Cuks.8241 said:

I agree most systems could be implemented in LFG.

Good, because that's also the point. Most reasonable complaints are solvable without holding random players hostage through some automated queue.

2 hours ago, Cuks.8241 said:

Yes like I wrote, because I choose not to waste other's time because I don't like other's to waste mine. You choose to waste it, that's OK, its how it's designed. This could be almost completely avoided with good system (yes it could be LFG).

I'm not wasting anything, using a portal scroll doesn't take minutes or w/e you're trying to suggest here. This is already avoided by simply not doing what you chose to do, apparently just to complain about you doing it.

2 hours ago, Cuks.8241 said:

Well my opinion is that all the grouping tools and lobbies and systems in gw2 are over designed, needlessly complicated. You go into a game, you queue, you finish content, you happy, everyone GG. You will start min maxing at some point but at the point that matters because content requires it. You start with that nonsense at entry lvl dungeons, everyone will probably tell you to stop being a kitten and go play some real content that actually requires it.

I don't see how they're over designed or complicated at all. You open the lfg and either join a group and create one, which only gets that much easier for what you claim you want to see here (which is no requirements, no roles and, well, no anything, just full on random). How's that overdesigned or compicated? Because someone can specify what they're looking for? That doesn't make anything here what you claim it is.

Edited October 24, 2023 by Sobx.1758

[LadyKitty.6120]

1 hour ago, Puck.3697 said:

That's incorrect lol. 

Ur telling me pre wotlk restoration druids, Holy paladins and Protection warriors were classified as DPS pre wotlk?. 

I've played WoW for 20 years, and no. WoW had a trinity system since day 1. 

To be Frank I wouldnt care if one was launched, the quantity of afkers and full dps comps that end up bundled together on perma wipes will kill the feature in a month lol. 

Regardless if it comes, it will never last. 

 

As WotLK era player, Kitty can confirm that trinity was there already at that point (Kitty mained Shadow Priest but also had alts of other classes) and specs defined the roles if a class could play multiple. Also, in WoW, aggro was already a thing. Meanwhile GW2 probably doesn't even have the traditional aggro system that most MMORPGs have (hence toughness/random/mechanic/proximity tanks).

Same trinity with aggro system has also been a thing for every non-MMO Kitty's played (though in PWI, DPSers could tank with "20% of DPS to self-heal" buff and/or using special invulnerability stuffs to survive and outgearing everyone else to maintain aggro through top DPS).

And to be clear: a DPS can indeed tank most bosses in GW2. But it requires knowing how to negate certain mechanics. DPS-to-selfheal traits can even heal enough to basically allow you to self-sustain without healer as long as you get boons to do enough DPS.

But that being the case, why don't we see LFGs say "alacDPS, quickDPS, DPS" without healer? Kitty's answer: role condensation and running with healer removing the requirement of very specific DPS builds and high skill to survive.

Also, to people saying "the content is trivial, there's no enrages!": every raid boss has enrage timer and so does Ankka and HT CMs. In raids, you simply rarely see them due to power creep and people running effective squad comps and builds. But even excluding enrage timer, quite a many bosses get harder the longer you take. Gors? You'll need updrafts and there's only 4. Sab? Platform. Sloth? Evolved slubs (mitigable by highly skilled pullers). KC? Boss gets damage buff every min. Xera? You'll need to destroy shards. Cairn? More attacks and petrification in CM. MO? More soldiers. Deimos CM? NPC dies. Dhuum CM? Same. Largos CM? Hard wipe. Q1? Extra slubs. Adina? Pillars destroy platform.

And if the content were so trivia to GW2 players, why don't we see 90%+ success rate even with current comps when players are already setting specific requirements? Not to mention for way less optimized comps that the LFR in form suggested by some people in this thread?

The reason why success rate of LFR squads in other games is so high in easy-to-medium difficulty content is that the instanced content is specifically designed for at-level standard role-comp in mind and within the same role the performance difference is usually less than 2x between minimum geared and BiS player due to ilvl gates and gear for the class being standardised to similar stats with very little chance of having "bad" stats. GW2? Players create comps and strats that can be quite different than what devs had in mind and the stat+trait+weapon system's versatility allows 10-15x difference between "bad" build and optimized build in instanced content before even taking player skill and ascended vs exotic (or worse) into account. 

[Killthehealersffs.8940]

23 minutes ago, Sobx.1758 said:

 

I don't see how they're over designed or complicated at all. You open the lfg and either join a group and create one, which only gets that much easier for what you claim you want to see here (which is no requirements, no roles and, well, no anything, just full on random). How's that overdesigned or compicated? Because someone can specify what they're looking for? That doesn't make anything here what you claim it is.

One can specify what they look for and the other can push a button . We give multiply choices , just lkike multiple tiers of dificulty

Ofc the only loosers are the raid sellers 

(ofc i will miss  also the 2 types of threads in reddit that comes up constandly :

a) asking for reuiremens is not toxic , make your own group (but auto-lfg is not allowed)

b) i am scrubs , how to et into raids

Edited October 24, 2023 by Killthehealersffs.8940

[Sobx.1758]

Just now, Killthehealersffs.8940 said:

One can specify what they look for and the other can push a button . We give multiply choices

Ofc the only loosers are the raid sellers , 

Creating "everyone welcome" group with no requirements in any regards, including roles, already provides those players with the option to "just push a button". So both options are already available and yet you're still not using what you claim you'd totally want to use.

[Killthehealersffs.8940]

7 hours ago, Sobx.1758 said:

Creating "everyone welcome" group with no requirements in any regards, including roles, already provides those players with the option to "just push a button". So both options are already available and yet you're still not using what you claim you'd totally want to use.

Ok ,else create a 3rd

The first 2 options , had 10 years . What are the results ?

 

We pushed them into trainning guilds. They used it as alternate form of LFG and they bail out  when they get the item , rather than participating in the  things that pushed them away fro the LFG in the first place..

 

(old gg , just give them the spotlight for a year . 

They will come up later and say that "all theses things , where too late" but atleast we will euxast everything 

 

Edit: let me show s glipse of  what will happen :

Spoiler

a) Collapse LFG in single > people stealth using the 4 old easy IBS , will not find same minded people in the sellers + li parties ...i guess its pitiful the number , so go for it .

b) Increased gold

c) New armor

And then 2-3 more patches with more gold , because they will understand that people no mater what they wont do them  and themsleves can benefit for the gold increase 

 

In the end we will spent pitiful resources , just to chase their own tail 

 

In the end old gg they have to understand , that in various games , DPS lovers + OW dont mix  :P

And wedont need any further new ideas , just to afk and they sell the Legendary armor

 

Edited October 25, 2023 by Killthehealersffs.8940

[starlinvf.1358]

On 10/22/2023 at 12:41 PM, Zohane.7208 said:

The idea of a queueing system comes up every now and then in the forum. When the experienced/hardcore/toxic (pick your favourite) people subject it to scrutiny there always pop up a number of questions which seem to make it not a very good idea. To this day I haven't really seen anyone come up with a good answer to (more or less) any of these questions. So the idea of a queueing system seems dead in the water.

Also, my experience with the lfg is vastly different; I only ever see a few people selling so it's mostly people seeking to make groups for their runs. Granted, a lot of these groups ask for experience - but that may be since they are in the "experienced" category, either in strikes or in raids category.

I got a good answer….. afkers.  Takes so long to get a group going, the queue suffers both attrition and people who fell asleep.  

Whats worse?  An LFG thats slow to fill, but status is clear?  Or a queue that pops with half the group afk or missing?  

[Urud.4925]

There is a long debate about how this feature ruined the genre: someone thinks it's one of the reason why modern MMORPGs became such a selfish single player experience, some other finds it a QoL since they would play the game in solo anyway. I goes down to how you play the game, in the end, so there isn't a correct answer.

When I played Age of Conan, I spent around 100 hours to reach the level cap, and I've never be able to play a single group instance, because people there must ask in the global chat if anyone wants to group up with them for a dungeon. It was too annoying for me, and I never did it. All the requests in chat were always for something high level that I didn't even know. But I was playing the game only to know a bit about it, I wasn't interested in playing it after reaching the level cap anyway, otherwise I would have joined a guild and ask in chat.

I used the auto queue in Final Fantasy XIV instead, to play all the dungeons and "raids" until the level cap: it was way faster, I have to admit, and easier for a new player like me, but also the reason why I quit the game so many times. In fact, I took breaks of several months always after an unsatisfactory dungeon. No one has been really mean, but people queueing for those contents were people who said hello at the beginning (often using a silly macro with cats or other funny things) and then never said a single word until the end of the dungeon, even if I directly asked them some info. As soon as the boss was killed, people instantly left the group, skipping the cutscene and not even looting the final chest or leaving commendations. And this happened 59/60 of the times. It made me feel sad and hollowed.

Personally, I would consider an auto Q only for a random instanced content: for example you can queue for a random dungeon, a random fractal, or a random strike. And that's it, only 3 queues (I don't think a random raid would ever work in GW2). So you would still have a reason to post your ad in LFG for a specific content, but if you just want to play a quick group instance, you have the option to queue for a random content (basically like the roulette in FFXIV). You don't need any specific profession for those contents anyway (maybe for some strike, but in that case it's up to you to bet on the RNG).

[Sakiri.4809]

Please no. 

It destroyed world of warcraft and made ffxiv turn into "pull til wall, aoe, kill boss, repeat". 

Boring, toxic, and annoying. 

[Sakiri.4809]

20 hours ago, LadyKitty.6120 said:

As WotLK era player, Kitty can confirm that trinity was there already at that point (Kitty mained Shadow Priest but also had alts of other classes) and specs defined the roles if a class could play multiple. Also, in WoW, aggro was already a thing. Meanwhile GW2 probably doesn't even have the traditional aggro system that most MMORPGs have (hence toughness/random/mechanic/proximity tanks).

Same trinity with aggro system has also been a thing for every non-MMO Kitty's played (though in PWI, DPSers could tank with "20% of DPS to self-heal" buff and/or using special invulnerability stuffs to survive and outgearing everyone else to maintain aggro through top DPS).

And to be clear: a DPS can indeed tank most bosses in GW2. But it requires knowing how to negate certain mechanics. DPS-to-selfheal traits can even heal enough to basically allow you to self-sustain without healer as long as you get boons to do enough DPS.

But that being the case, why don't we see LFGs say "alacDPS, quickDPS, DPS" without healer? Kitty's answer: role condensation and running with healer removing the requirement of very specific DPS builds and high skill to survive.

Also, to people saying "the content is trivial, there's no enrages!": every raid boss has enrage timer and so does Ankka and HT CMs. In raids, you simply rarely see them due to power creep and people running effective squad comps and builds. But even excluding enrage timer, quite a many bosses get harder the longer you take. Gors? You'll need updrafts and there's only 4. Sab? Platform. Sloth? Evolved slubs (mitigable by highly skilled pullers). KC? Boss gets damage buff every min. Xera? You'll need to destroy shards. Cairn? More attacks and petrification in CM. MO? More soldiers. Deimos CM? NPC dies. Dhuum CM? Same. Largos CM? Hard wipe. Q1? Extra slubs. Adina? Pillars destroy platform.

And if the content were so trivia to GW2 players, why don't we see 90%+ success rate even with current comps when players are already setting specific requirements? Not to mention for way less optimized comps that the LFR in form suggested by some people in this thread?

The reason why success rate of LFR squads in other games is so high in easy-to-medium difficulty content is that the instanced content is specifically designed for at-level standard role-comp in mind and within the same role the performance difference is usually less than 2x between minimum geared and BiS player due to ilvl gates and gear for the class being standardised to similar stats with very little chance of having "bad" stats. GW2? Players create comps and strats that can be quite different than what devs had in mind and the stat+trait+weapon system's versatility allows 10-15x difference between "bad" build and optimized build in instanced content before even taking player skill and ascended vs exotic (or worse) into account. 

I've played wow since June 04(thats closed beta) and the trinity was a thing even then. EverQuest had the trinity back in '99.

[Tiviana.2650]

When i started this game i was sad to see no one doing dungeons , sad they cant refresh them. Maybe add new loot to the tables and add an auto queue. Because at this point they may as well just remove them.  An auto queue would do wonders for dungeons, and emboldened raids

[Biziut.3594]

15 hours ago, Tiviana.2650 said:

An auto queue would do wonders for dungeons, and emboldened raids

Nope, it wouldn't. Dungeons will be in the same state with or without Q. 

For the easy faceroll content that do not require any roles, one can just make "All welcome" LFG and go do other stuff until group fills up. It's basicly equivalent of the most basic queue system. It works and let me do any dungeon I want, anytime. Other system will not magicly convince peoples to play dungeons more, it have to be rewarding or be made to progress something that many peoples will want to achive.

For harder content it won't work for the sole reason of how game is designed, peoples should know that before asking for such nonsense. Take a tank role for example. To be considered a tank by the game, you have to have the highest toughness number of all players in squad. Since stats works as they are, someone who join as dps, may run a max toughness build, thus creating a conflict becouse game design will consider him a tank and not a person that joined as a tank, and boss will target him instead of a tank. So you will end up with even more time lost, hoping that this full toughness dps will change his build, which can be complicated without access to legendaries or several ascended sets.

Other thing why auto LFG wouldn't work is that it would have to get it's own kp system. Becouse unless you want to get very unsure training session with most players being oblivious to mechanics, that will never get you any knowledge of the encounter, not even mention a kill and wasted time, You really might want to stick to organized training sessions, becouse AutoLFG is just not able to ensure that someone expirienced AND willing to spend hours on teaching will join You.

And if this unsure training session really is what You desire, than just as I said above, You are perfectly fine and able to use the equivalent of autoLFG, and just place "All Welcome" LFG. It have this advantage that once You relize how futile going into high-end content without proper preperation and composition is, You can always change "All Welcome" description into one thay says "All Welcome training, need mentor" or "no kp training run, need x, y, z role, and someone to explain mech", mix and match all You want. AutoLFG is just not able to give You that. This is a fact for everyone who at least dipped their toe into any high-end content in this game, becouse it is a games elementery design. Making 69th topic about it will not change that.

So to summarise, i think that creating a new AutoLFG system would be a massive waste of resources and probably give birth to many unexpected bugs, and I even dare to say that Arena is most likely aware of that, after trying to implement something like that for strikes public instances. If it would work as intended, and be better than normal LFG, than devs surely would implement it for other content as well.

Edited October 26, 2023 by Biziut.3594
Grammar

[Cuks.8241]

On 10/25/2023 at 1:09 AM, LadyKitty.6120 said:

As WotLK era player, Kitty can confirm that trinity was there already at that point (Kitty mained Shadow Priest but also had alts of other classes) and specs defined the roles if a class could play multiple. Also, in WoW, aggro was already a thing. Meanwhile GW2 probably doesn't even have the traditional aggro system that most MMORPGs have (hence toughness/random/mechanic/proximity tanks).

Trinity in wow is base design together with threat mechanic. It only got more loose over time - tanks got more tools to get and hold aggro and defense stat removed. Dps and heals hardly need to care about threat beyond pull and maybe special mechanics. Days of the strongest dps abilities being threat clears are long gone.

What I meant was that the initial LFD iterations had less checks for roles than later iterations. I think the first version only had class check for a role (its been 15 years I could be wrong) and additional build and gear checks came later after the talent reworks and later removal. It was possible to cheat role checks but from my experience it was not really a noticable problem in LFD.