Rush Fixed? "11 Years in the Making"

[Yerlock.4678]

https://youtube.com/clip/UgkxMJnTc7ZNKYuZPfNgUSTXYSRmBIQPKNiK?si=k2iJxpFOq9Y8YA-3

 

You gotta love cmc 😂

Edited February 18 by gmmg.9210

[someguy.4107]

11 hours ago, gmmg.9210 said:

You gotta love cmc 😂

No I don't friend. Acknowledging that these core QoL problems have been in the game for ages makes it worse. If CmC knew about them then the rest of the team knew about them. Knew and have done nothing for literal years. Sold you a car that veers left into traffic every now and again when you turn right. A car that has a 40% chance to not break when you try to. "love cmc". No. No I don't think I will.

 

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

1 hour ago, someguy.4107 said:

No I don't friend. Acknowledging that these core QoL problems have been in the game for ages makes it worse. If CmC knew about them then the rest of the team knew about them. Knew and have done nothing for literal years. Sold you a car that veers left into traffic every now and again when you turn right. A car that has a 40% chance to not break when you try to. "love cmc". No. No I don't think I will.

 

Think of it from a programming and cost benefit point of view. It could very well have been a tangled mess to fix and sufficient dev time was simply not available until recently on top of it most likely not being a high priority fix (Its warrior, so is automatically low priority unless it is something that lets us ragdoll eles and guardians).

[someguy.4107]

@Lan Deathrider.5910You're right. There's zero reason to fix anything in GW2, because the players will continue to blow money at the cash shop. Why put forth man hours fixing decade old community pain points when the community gives you money for mount skins regardless? The game being a potential "tangled mess" isn't my problem either. It's NCSoft & Anets problem. One or both of them allowed this game to sit in maintenance mode for years. I just bought the game then got scammed with inventory expansion slots thinking that they were account wide. I don't understand wanting to run defense for any dev of this game after all that's happened. It's bizarre to me that all the game modes are divided communities that all think the same on most points, but when anyone voices concern it's always this response. "Think of how hard it is to do their job" "After x is done the devs will have all the time in the world for my problem x" etc. None of that is a personal attack on you or your character Lan the man :j Just how I see this situation.

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

5 hours ago, someguy.4107 said:

@Lan Deathrider.5910You're right. There's zero reason to fix anything in GW2, because the players will continue to blow money at the cash shop. Why put forth man hours fixing decade old community pain points when the community gives you money for mount skins regardless? The game being a potential "tangled mess" isn't my problem either. It's NCSoft & Anets problem. One or both of them allowed this game to sit in maintenance mode for years. I just bought the game then got scammed with inventory expansion slots thinking that they were account wide. I don't understand wanting to run defense for any dev of this game after all that's happened. It's bizarre to me that all the game modes are divided communities that all think the same on most points, but when anyone voices concern it's always this response. "Think of how hard it is to do their job" "After x is done the devs will have all the time in the world for my problem x" etc. None of that is a personal attack on you or your character Lan the man :j Just how I see this situation.

No offense taken. As much as well all gripe and point out pain points in the class, traits, and weapons we all have to also remember that we don't get to see the code, or their internal bureaucratic process for pushing, vetting, and confirming changes. For all we know it took Cal several years of working on it to get it right and didn't want to say anything until it was done. It also could have been a lazy afternoon one day, we don't know.

The original code is known to be 'spaghetti' code and the current devs are not the ones that made it. Having my own work experience in detangling other people's code, I can tell you that they probably tried in the past and could not do it without breaking other things so they left it for when they ran through other higher priority items.

I think combining the Dev and Balance teams into one, getting that third person in, and forgoing entire especs for the expansions has allowed them the leeway in digging into old matters. Yeah, its an 12 yo fix that should have happened in year 1 when it was pointed out, but they didn't when the first devs were still fresh and could have done it more quickly. That is still a bad mark. But fixing it, even this late, is still good.

[draxynnic.3719]

7 hours ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

I think combining the Dev and Balance teams into one, getting that third person in, and forgoing entire especs for the expansions has allowed them the leeway in digging into old matters. Yeah, its an 12 yo fix that should have happened in year 1 when it was pointed out, but they didn't when the first devs were still fresh and could have done it more quickly. That is still a bad mark. But fixing it, even this late, is still good.

Worth noting too that Cal wasn't in the team from the beginning, so the decision to deprioritise it when it might have been easier probably wasn't his. He's only been in the specific role he's in now since the scandal with the previous guy shortly after the infamous post-EoD banner rework patch, so we probably shouldn't be blaming him for the actions of a predecessor who was removed precisely BECAUSE his favouritism was publicly exposed.

Credit where it's due - if it is fixed, then it won't really matter afterwards that it took a while. If there are still issues, then we can see how quickly they try again.

Edited February 19 by draxynnic.3719

[adammantium.8031]

I'd hazard a guess that it's been on a backlog for years and years, but has worked 'well enough' to never get prioritized.

However, since the staff #3 skill is built on top of it and there's attention on it now, there's justification to fix.

And I wouldn't be surprised if there's some internal politics that make it easier to fix rush, than adjust staff #3 to use bulls charge or some other model.

So, thanks staff #3.

[DanAlcedo.3281]

3 hours ago, adammantium.8031 said:

I'd hazard a guess that Warrior been on a backlog for years and years, but has worked 'well enough' to never get prioritized.

Thats more accurate. 

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

7 hours ago, draxynnic.3719 said:

Worth noting too that Cal wasn't in the team from the beginning, so the decision to deprioritise it when it might have been easier probably wasn't his. He's only been in the specific role he's in now since the scandal with the previous guy shortly after the infamous post-EoD banner rework patch, so we probably shouldn't be blaming him for the actions of a predecessor who was removed precisely BECAUSE his favouritism was publicly exposed.

Exactly. 

7 hours ago, draxynnic.3719 said:

Credit where it's due - if it is fixed, then it won't really matter afterwards that it took a while. If there are still issues, then we can see how quickly they try again.

This right here.  Credit where it is due.

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

Take the w where the w is given.  If they can fix a skill that's been bad for 11 years, they can fix another skill that's been bad for 11 years.

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

54 minutes ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

Take the w where the w is given.  If they can fix a skill that's been bad for 11 years, they can fix another skill that's been bad for 11 years.

Killshot?

[Vinny.7260]

8 minutes ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

Killshot?

Hundred Blades... They fixed Sw 3 on Guardian... A Defensive/Offensive skill... And allows it to move while casting now...

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

1 hour ago, Vinny.7260 said:

Hundred Blades... They fixed Sw 3 on Guardian... A Defensive/Offensive skill... And allows it to move while casting now...

Yes, I know. My comment went over your head.

[rainhelm.3827]

You take what you can get. Fingers crossed for some love to hundred blades next.

[draxynnic.3719]

Tbh, I was a little surprised (but only a little because warrior) that they didn't unroot Hundred Blades too. Might be an animation issue.

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

1 hour ago, draxynnic.3719 said:

Tbh, I was a little surprised (but only a little because warrior) that they didn't unroot Hundred Blades too. Might be an animation issue.

Maybe, but if so they should have realized that nobody stands in hundred blades, and instead focused on adding a reason to use it that wasnt damage that nobody is going to stand in. 

Especially the buff to the final hit of the cast. Nobody is getting hit by that.  It takes 3 seconds to cast the skill. 

There's a ton of things they could have done that wouldn't break the skill.  Maybe hitting someone with strikes recharges your other greatsword skills a bit per hit. Maybe channeling it gives you quickness. Maybe channeling it destroys projectiles in a cone in front of you.  Maybe each hit stacks a long lasting might or fury on you, or a discrete buff that refreshes if you hit with hb again in like 15/20 seconds.  Maybe each hit stacks tokens that last like a minute, and when you have 8-10 the skill flips over for like 7 secs and its just the last strike that does like 5-7k. Idk. They have options if they sit down and think about how it should be used. 

If i can sit here and come up with like 5 ideas in the spam of 30 seconds-

Idk I'm tired man

Edited February 20 by Azure The Heartless.3261

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

7 hours ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

Killshot?

No that's been bad for 10 years, it needs to marinate a bit more. 

[draxynnic.3719]

41 minutes ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

Maybe, but if so they should have realized that nobody stands in hundred blades, and instead focused on adding a reason to use it that wasnt damage that nobody is going to stand in. 

Especially the buff to the final hit of the cast. Nobody is getting hit by that.  It takes 3 seconds to cast the skill. 

There's a ton of things they could have done that wouldn't break the skill.  Maybe hitting someone with strikes recharges your other greatsword skills a bit per hit. Maybe channeling it gives you quickness. Maybe channeling it destroys projectiles in a cone in front of you.  Maybe each hit stacks a long lasting might or fury on you, or a discrete buff that refreshes if you hit with hb again in like 15/20 seconds.  Maybe each hit stacks tokens that last like a minute, and when you have 8-10 the skill flips over for like 7 secs and its just the last strike that does like 5-7k. Idk. They have options if they sit down and think about how it should be used. 

If i can sit here and come up with like 5 ideas in the spam of 30 seconds-

Idk I'm tired man

Or maybe it's an animation issue that they're working on but which isn't quite ready yet.

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

2 hours ago, draxynnic.3719 said:

Or maybe it's an animation issue that they're working on but which isn't quite ready yet.

They could take two seconds to say that if so, yeah?

I'm not a fan of fabricating a reason, they have the platform to explain that there's stuff being worked on if it exists. 

Edited February 20 by Azure The Heartless.3261

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

5 hours ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

They could take two seconds to say that if so, yeah?

I'm not a fan of fabricating a reason, they have the platform to explain that there's stuff being worked on if it exists. 

TBF, I wouldn't expect them to say anything unless they finished it. As for animations... 100B existed with its cast time when quickness reduced the speed by 50% rather than 33%, so reducing the current cast time to 2.5s will have roughly the same animation under quickness as 100B under the effects of the old quickness. Technically 2.7s would line up the best, but I'd rather it be 2.5 than 2.75.

[Vinny.7260]

15 hours ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

Yes, I know. My comment went over your head.

Nuh-uh! I just wanted to save the readers the confusion!

Make Killshot hit 25% harder! ✊😌

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

1 hour ago, Vinny.7260 said:

Nuh-uh! I just wanted to save the readers the confusion!

Make Killshot hit 25% harder! ✊😌

Unroot it first.

[KryTiKaL.3125]

17 hours ago, draxynnic.3719 said:

Tbh, I was a little surprised (but only a little because warrior) that they didn't unroot Hundred Blades too. Might be an animation issue.

It isn't. Literally Elementalist has the exact same animation attached to their Skill 2 on Hammer on Water Attunement and you can move while doing it. It isn't a rigging issue, its a "they are going to try everything else other than that" issue.

ANet, unfortunately, historically will try every single other solution other than the simplest one that would easily resolve the concern. Happened with passive Stances (thereby neutering an entire line for Warrior for too long), Full Counter activating Burst traits on trigger instead of on hit (took them 6 years to change this), happened with Mirage where they removed their second dodge rather than change Mirage Cloak so it can't be activated while CC'd (again took them years to change this), happened recently with Bladesworn where instead of addressing Unshakeable Mountain among other things they decided to remove the CC on Unyielding Dragon, and those are just a few.

Its...frustrating to watch it happen this consistently.

[Sobx.1758]

Yeah, time to unroot 100b 🤷‍♂️ 

[draxynnic.3719]

5 hours ago, KryTiKaL.3125 said:

It isn't. Literally Elementalist has the exact same animation attached to their Skill 2 on Hammer on Water Attunement and you can move while doing it. It isn't a rigging issue, its a "they are going to try everything else other than that" issue.

ANet, unfortunately, historically will try every single other solution other than the simplest one that would easily resolve the concern. Happened with passive Stances (thereby neutering an entire line for Warrior for too long), Full Counter activating Burst traits on trigger instead of on hit (took them 6 years to change this), happened with Mirage where they removed their second dodge rather than change Mirage Cloak so it can't be activated while CC'd (again took them years to change this), happened recently with Bladesworn where instead of addressing Unshakeable Mountain among other things they decided to remove the CC on Unyielding Dragon, and those are just a few.

Its...frustrating to watch it happen this consistently.

Pretty sure water hammer 2 doesn't have that jump at the end for extra damage.

17 hours ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

They could take two seconds to say that if so, yeah?

I'm not a fan of fabricating a reason, they have the platform to explain that there's stuff being worked on if it exists. 

Perhaps, but ArenaNet has been burned a few times by announcing that they were working on something before it was ready. It would be understandable if they chose to wait until they knew they had a fix rather than copping flak for saying they were going to fix something that proved to be harder than they thought.